Stories from the Sales Frontlines

robr2

My wife went to Northeastern and absolutely loved it. Their Co-Op program is truly amazing, giving students real world experience while paying them too. Again, while it is far from cheap, compared to BU at what, $50K per it is a bargain.

No so much anymore:

Northeastern: $55K
BU: $58K
BC: $52K
Harvard: $58K
MIT: $57K

My son has looked at two schools thus far:

Dartmouth: $58K
UVM: $50K

28firefighter

I don't know if it is true anymore, but I applied to Northeastern and it seems like they gave away scholarship money like candy. It seems no one paid full price.

stickguy

Having just finished college for 1 kid and starting with #2, I am well atuned to how the process (more like a "game") works.

those #s (rack rate) are mostly fantasy. Only the really rich folk pay full price. Normal (as in middle class) people get major discounts. I think of the published amounts like those room rates on the card on the hotel door. Just something they made up to make you feel better about what you paid.

If a private rate school doesn't pony up a nice package, she won't be going there!

explorerx4

Richard,
Your wife doesn't want to drive a car anymore?
The Escape is kind of a sporty, high tech choice among small CUV's.
My wife drives a 2013 max'ed out Titanium model.
It has a self parallel parking feature.

explorerx4

Richard,
When you were away from here it was like a puzzle that was missing a piece.
Can't find that JMonroe piece lately.

tifighter

Yes, Sales Frontlines and Therapy Sessions should be allowed to wander a bit....Besides, how many new cars can we buy in a year?

The CCBA thread is on pace for over 30 cars this year. Sounds like there is some slacking going on around here...

verdugo

"To repeat, from a strictly economic perspective, leasing is always more expensive than buying. "

Maybe, maybe not, but sometimes leasing makes more sense, and not just from a financial sense.

I recently leased a car and it made more sense than buying it. I know, I know, I will write up the story very soon.

verdugo

"Beginning in 2004, I found an outright purchase less expensive because I wanted a new car more often than a lease would permit me. The way I change cars would be impossible if I were to lease. "

That cracks me up. You are not a good candidate for leasing because you change cars to often!

:-)

driver100

I recently leased a car and it made more sense than buying it. I know, I know, I will write up the story very soon.

I want to hear about that one.....don't forget.

Is it even better than my using leasing as a way to keep your car if you have to go into bankrupcy?

snakeweasel

Is it even better than my using leasing as a way to keep your car if you have to go into bankrupcy?

Unless you have a high end luxury car or an antique car it is highly unlikely that you would lose your car in an bankruptcy. A chapter 13 simply reorganizes your debt and you would never lose your car unless you want to give it up. With a chapter 7 a certain amount in assets is exempt from the bankruptcy and with most people having little equity in a car it rarely gets taken away.

Now depending on the state you are in and how long you have had the car, what you owe and what it's worth you may be able to restructure your car loan under bankruptcy and pay less than you owe. You cannot do that with a lease. In other words you can put your car loan into a debt repayment plan, you cannot do that with a lease.

driver100

bankruptcy and with most people having little equity in a car it rarely gets taken away

True, you can usually keep your car if you go bankrupt - the government would prefer that you can still get to work so you can continue to pay your obligations including taxes - but, this "friend" did not want to take the chance that his slightly upmarket vehicle could be siezed.

Are you still saying there is NEVER a time when it may be better to lease? Even after Mike's example of wanting a new car every few years (before he found he could buy them at deep discounts) and my example of not getting my business started if I used my money to buy a car instead of using it to invest in my business, and then my friend who just wants to simplify his life.

Do you really think one rule suits all?

snakeweasel

Even with a slight upmarket car you are highly unlikely to lose it in bankruptcy. Now if you have a Bugatti considerate it gone.

Now what I am saying is that if you have a perfectly good reliable car that does what you need it to do then it is not financially prudent to swap out cars and get a new one. With leasing you are forced into that situation.

driver100

t is not financially prudent to swap out cars and get a new one.

"Financially prudent"!. It isn't financially prudent to buy almost anything unless it actually breaks down. Sometimes people like to get new furniture, a flat sdreen TV, a larger home, a new car .....not necessarily "financially prudent", just fulfills an emotional need or makes our life a little more enjoyable.

I know someone who always does the "financially prudent" thing. He'll look at 10 cameras, 10 air conditioners, 10 cars before he buys, and then always buy yhe cheapest one. That's being "financially prudent". So this time he got a great deal on a Hyundai Accent....but, he has to put cushions on the seat so he can see out of it, and he doesn't feel it is safe to drive it on the highway. But, he was "financially prudent".

sb55

My father-in-law was "financially prudent" all of his life. He was also the most unhappy guy you could meet. He had money and never spent it. He complained about the price of gas daily, even though he barely drove.
I am frugal on certain stuff. I'll keep a tee shirt until the holes are more apparent than the fabric, but will spend on other stuff to keep life interesting. Cars make me happy, so why not indulge sometimes, if you can. If you absolutely can't, then don't. I'm not planning to die with much money in the bank.

driver100

ather-in-law was "financially prudent" all of his life. He was also the most unhappy guy you could meet.

I am glad you wrote sb. I have seen too many "financially prudent" people who don't know how to spend money to make themselves enjoy life a little more. I am not talking about buying a new csar when you still owe money on the one you are driving, or buying things you cannot afford. There is a balance, you have to spend wisely and not get into financial trouble or strain, but, you also have to learn to enjoy your money too - or, what's the point in earning it?

fezo

driver - personally I'd run from that. The fact that you don't have claims should tell them you're a good driver rate. They are essentially telling you they are giving you the bad driver rate.

I'd have real privacy issues. I'm crazy enough about that with my EZPass.

ohenryx

I drove around with an EZPass (or EZTag as it is called here) for several years without really thinking about the invasion of privacy. Watching police-procedural-shows (Law & Order, etc), where they nail the bad guy by tracking his movements with an EZTag gave me a different perspective. I don't think there is much you can do about the EZTag (necessary evil), but I'll be damned if I'll voluntarily give the insurance company even more information.

fezo

Agreed completely. I like my insurance company but I'll be damned if I'm giving them something like that!

Actually the first time I even heard of EZPass was when an old prominent politician (he was once the Republican candidate for governor of the state) was murdered and his car stolen. The cops were able to follow the EZPass and track down the criminals. This was before it had even been offered to the general public.

BTW, having missed a lot I'd see these references about what Richard said and had to track it down. Bravo!

My car costs have gone down now that I have a free mechanic. He's 3 hours away but we have a ball. If he can't do it (he's an FDNY paramedic whose broke his back on 9/11 when someone landed on him so he can't bend much) his son, who was a certified Toyota mechanic for years (Though is now in something completely different) will come over and while he does charge it isn't much.

I pay less even when you factor in gas and tolls, am treated like a king and eat wonderfully. A week from Sunday we'll bring my wife's Camry up there just for a look see. Only known issue is a tire pressure sensor that's been on the blink for years.

robr2

Here in MA, in order for law enforcement to access EZ Pass records they have to get a warrant.

If EZ Pass scares you, wait until you start seeing these around:

http://enr.construction.com/images2/2013/07/ENR07082013_tech_sign.jpg

Many states have installed bluetooth receivers along the highway to capture a device in your vehicle and then measures your speed along other receivers to advise estimated time to other routes.

verdugo

"Leasing was right for you at that time in your life. That's my only point - in most cases it is better to buy, but, there are times when leasing has advantages. "

The government shut down has turned things upside down even here. Not only am I agreeing with him, but he's also being the voice of reason.

Luckily it's not December 2012, or I would've thought the Mayans might have been right.

:-)

snakeweasel

What we have here is a failure to communicate. Prudent means to use good judgement and common sense. It does not mean to make every nickel to as far as possible.

Is your friend using common sense and good judgement when he buys a car he needs a cousin to sit on to drive it and is afraid to drive at high speed? No he is not, he is being a miser by getting the cheapest car around. I am in no way advocating that.

I'll use cell phones as an example. It is not prudent to rush out and get a new iphone 5 when you have a perfectly good iPhone 4S simply because it's new and you want one. It is also not prudent to have a $10 prepaid trac phone when you can afford better.

imidazol97

>It is also not prudent to have a $10 prepaid trac phone when you can afford better.

Why should a person who wants a phone to talk and text buy a higher-priced, monthly-billed service just to spend more if they are perfectly happy with a basic phone.

Unless the government wants to give them free an Android phone, of course.

abacomike

I drove around with an EZPass (or EZTag as it is called here) for several years without really thinking about the invasion of privacy.

You know, I never thought about that! We have SUNPASS down here in Florida which is used on all state turnpikes and toll roads as well as at all airports for parking fees. So the state knows where I am at any time in airports and on toll roads.

It's like having location services turned on on you cell phone. Can't wait until the government or private industries call me when I'm in the bathroom asking me if I have enough bathroom tissue!

snakeweasel

Here in Illinois for anyone to get information on I-pass usage you would need a court order.

snakeweasel

Hey if they want the $10 prepaid phone fine but it is pretty cheap with iffy reception and poor sound quality. Better to spend a little more and get a better working prepaid phone, and it still would be way less expensive than a smart phone.

snakeweasel

Not to far from that happening. I read somewhere that the are working on a system where a stores security camera will use face recognition software and will use that to find your Facebook page. It will then read your page to see wha you have done and what you have liked. It will then use that info to decide what offers and/or coupons to text you while you are shopping.

Be afraid, be very afraid.

imidazol97

>with iffy reception

Are you saying Sprint, T-Mobile, ATT, Verizon are giving poor reception?

Indeed, my son's $10 Walmart phone is now in his car as a backup phone to his Android. The sound quality when he was using that one was good. It had replaced a flip phone that broke, so it was purchased in a hurry and the number switched. So all those phones that Verizon, ATT, T-Mobile, Sprint used a few years ago were bad? --because most of the offerings are just phones no longer popular with the contract carriers. Of course TracFone et al offer Galaxy S4 and IPhones.

Tracfone keeps offering a cheap way to buy reception time for the old Samsung candy bar phone without adding many minutes, so I keep it was a security phone if his Android dies since junior doesn't have a landline.

driver100

They are essentially telling you they are giving you the bad driver rate.

That is a good point. We are in a top category for safe driving now, so I can probably only lose by going with this program.

I have nothing to hide, even taught driving to high school students, but, this seems to be the foot in the door for worse invasions of privacy down the road, and I just know, I will be the loser.

driver100

The government shut down has turned things upside down even here. Not only am I agreeing with him, but he's also being the voice of reason.

Yes, I thought the same when you said you had a positive leasing story to tell.

driver100

. Prudent means to use good judgement and common sense.

It all started with the phrase, "Buying is ALWAYS better than leasing".

I was only trying to show that there could be a case where leasing is a good option.

It may be "prudent" to lease a car and not buy it......not very often, but once in awhile. Hopefully, we can agree on that!

robr2

You know, I never thought about that! We have SUNPASS down here in Florida which is used on all state turnpikes and toll roads as well as at all airports for parking fees. So the state knows where I am at any time in airports and on toll roads.

It just means it knows where your SUNPASS is - unless of course you carry it in your pocket!!

abacomike

It just means it knows where your SUNPASS is - unless of course you carry it in your pocket!!

Of course it know where my SUNPASS is when it goes through a toll gate or when I use it to pay for airport parking! The SUNPASS is attached to my car on which I drive. So if it knows where the SUNPASS is, it knows where I am.

Let's assume an employee of SUNPASS or the Turnpike System is a scouter looking for a car to steal. He/she passes information to a car thief that my car is parked at HOLLYWOOD/FT.LAUDERDALE airport on the Palms parking facility. Many people use that facility for long term parking. I come back from a trip and my car is gone.

SUNPASS knows the make, year, model and color of my car and my license plate number. SUNPASS cameras take a digital picture of my car whenever I pass through a toll station or enter a parking facility run by a municipality that I use my SUNPASS to pay parking fees.

So of SUNPASS knows where my car is, they pretty much know where I am or where I am going while using my SUNPASS.

All I am trying to say is that there are now many methods to track an individual including SUNPASS and smart phones.

As for my comment about being tracked in my bathroom, it was a JOKE! GET IT! A JOKE!!!

robr2

...it was a JOKE! GET IT! A JOKE!!!

Same here Sir, same here.

fezo

MY buddy has a SUNPASS because he's in Florida a lot. It's hardly bigger or thicker than a postage stamp. Makes an EZPass look like a brick.

verdugo

"leasing is like going to the ATM at a mini mart to take out $20. The fees kill you, especially in relation to what you are getting. "

But sometimes you want/have to do that.

Like Driver said, the article didn't say that leasing was cheaper. The article said buying was ALWAYS better than leasing.

jayrider

Running the numbers for leasing vs buying will result in a conclusion that will favor buying. If you feel more comfortable leasing, than the numbers aren't important . We all make choices that suit our needs and budget. Sometimes I buy name brands and sometimes I buy store brands. I never use coupons and I am not concerned even though I know they save money.

snakeweasel

Are you saying Sprint, T-Mobile, ATT, Verizon are giving poor reception?

No I am saying that cheap phones have bad reception.

I do have one of those Tacphones as a back up phone and a phone that I can give away to people that I don't want to give my main phone to. The quality of reception is much less than that of my last two main phones.

abacomike

Running the numbers for leasing vs buying will result in a conclusion that will favor buying.

Jayrider, what you are saying then is that buying is most always less expensive for the average person than leasing. Further that circumstances, situations and and individual preferences help determine the best course of action.

I agree with your comments - however in the case where leasing costs can be tax deductible for an individual, it may be of benefit to lease. But leases get quite expensive when purchased mileage exceeds 15,000 per year.

As I mentioned before, there are times when leasing is a preferred option to purchase and, at times, purchasing might be more preferable.

oldfarmer50

"...what do you think?..."

Don't do it! The Illuminati will own you soul and the government will be able to read your thoughts!

Seriously, if money is more important that your privacy go for it. Otherwise, don't trust em'.

oldfarmer50

Regarding schools:

Retired guy at work who drives a bus for kicks sent his daughter to Pace in NYC ($50k/year) Found out the dorm motto was "turn you gay by May". Sent his kid to State U this year.

I was taking the varsity girls team to a meet and overheard one girl mention that she applied to Marist because it was the college with the highest rate of STDs. Huh?

oldfarmer50

"...some slacking going on around here..."

Hey, I did my part with that Lincoln. I realized how big that "small" Lincoln is when I parked it next to my Eclipse today. Both 2 doors but one is 28" longer.

The guys at work are now calling me "Pimp Daddy" because of it.

stickguy

well, there is a solution. don't leave the tag on the window when you don't need it. I know my EZpass came with a foil bag to "hide" it, so no reason you couldn't do that when you aren't going through a toll booth.

tifighter

The guys at work are now calling me "Pimp Daddy" because of it.

You'd look good in a purple suit, don't be shy.

stickguy

beating the lease horse, that is IMO the common good reason. Just depends on circumstances (what you need in a car at the time, and cash for DP and $/mo for cash flow). So someone just starting out in a job say, that has enough income to pay the lease, and needs a reliable car, could be a good candidate to lease to get them established.

and there are plenty of people that know nothing about cars, certainly not enough to know what they are doing buying an older, cheap car and not getting a nightmare.

oldfarmer50

"...I'm crazy enough about that with EZ pass..."

Just google the name Christopher Porco if you have any doubts. Or watch the movie.

oldfarmer50

"...a$10 Trac phone..."

Where can you get that deal? Mine cost $20.

oldfarmer50

"...foot in the door for invasion of privacy..."

Do you have any of the "advantage" cards at the super market or drug store? Do you think there isn't a privacy cost for the discounts you get?

All your purchases are tracked and analyzed and the data is sold to the highest bidder. I refuse to shop at one local supermarket chain because unless you submit to their "bargains" you pay substantially more.

snakeweasel

They had those cards at our local grocery store. But there were two easy ways around it, one was just telling the clerk you forgot yours and they would use a store account. They other way was to input a phone number and some clown always uses the number from that jenny song.

snakeweasel

Mine cost about $10, but I gotta spend $20 to put any time on it.

bolivar

I've kinda lost track here, but I think the thread is about insurance company offering a discount if they can track your car usage.

State Farm has a deal with OnStar to get the OnStar data. I already have the 'less than 7500 miles/year' discount but thought this might give me more. So I signed up the wife's Deville, hoping for lower insurance. I did not sign up my Corvette which at times is run up to 100+mph.

If OnStar can continuously track braking data, I've never know of it. What I understand the Progressive Ins little box that plugs into the diagnostic can log braking data.