Scene from a municipal court somewhere in Colorado:
Judge (to court): Let's proceed next to Case #151392-302, where Mrs. lrguy has petitioned the Court to begin divorce proceedings from Mr. lrguy.
Judge (to Mrs. lrguy): I presume you are filing this petition under the grounds of "irreconcilable differences"?
Mrs. lrguy: No, sir. Actually, Mr. lrguy is a great husband, and we get along just fine. So, sir. I am requesting this divorce because of the Range Rover! He won't quit his job, and so my only logical option is to ask for a divorce!
------- I think that would be quite a show for daytime TV!
Are you saying that cotmc has a coworker who is a pinhead? :confuse:
lr - couldn't possibly burden your wife like that. I'll take care of that Range Rover test for you....
Actually, from the pictures that looks like the sort of thing I'd look at, check the manual to make sure it says what I think it says and never worry about it again. Might take a couple of minutes.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
GP: I think I recall when that incident happened with you. At first, I didn't know what to make of it, either
By the way, I do believe cdnpinhead is located in the same metro area as me. I doubt it is the same provider, though, as I am now at my corporate office. (I need to occasionally take breaks from the monotony of all my documentation work.)
I just saw an article from AP titled, "Auto Sales Fall Across Industry in July" Here are some excerpts:
--------
Auto sales took a dive across the industry in July thanks to high gas prices and reluctant consumers, with General Motors reporting a 22.3 percent decline and Ford sales down 19.1 percent...
Toyota's truck sales were flat thanks in part to heavy incentives, but its car sales fell 11.8 percent.
Nissan Motor Co. was the only major automaker to report a sales increase for the month, of 1.7 percent...
Wasn't it last year that GM had the employee pricing deals? (Or, was that the year before?).. That alone would make last July a tough comparable month..
Usually those numbers are declines from the same month last year, not from the previous month..
Which "edge" would that be? Looking to the left is a dropoff on the console. Looking to the right, there is no gear shift, and if there was, that would mean the handle isn't directly BEHIND the gear shift, wouldn't it?? And I'm sure the shifter isn't way up on the dash board, which would also mean the handle isn't mounted DIRECTLY behind the gear shift since that knob is there.
I guess I'm just dumb or my spatial referencing is off. :confuse: Read more carefully before trying to be a smartass.
The gear shift is just out of view at the top of the picture.
You can see it in this picture just an inch or so ahead of the TR knob.
Now I can't remember if the article I was complaining about was a review of the Range Rover or the Range Rover Sport.
The Sport does have the park brake release only an inch or so behind the gear shift and an inch or so in front of the TR knob.
On the Range Rover those positions are reversed with the TR knob an inch or so behind the shifter and the park brake release an inch or so behind the knob.
GP: I think I recall when that incident happened with you. At first, I didn't know what to make of it, either
Yeah it was just a lot of hello's in my name ( GP ). My buddy called me when it happened and said look on edmunds I'm under your name. I went on edmunds and we were both on at the same time typing in hello.
The hosts got upset deleted the posts and sent me a email about moching the forum. I replied back to them to let them know what was going on.
Back in the day we were entitled (if there is such a thing these days) to two 15-minute breaks a day, and most of us went to the cafeteria to make it a somewhat social event.
Those days are long gone. Now I do such things in snatches during the day anonymously on the 'net. You lot have now become my coffee-break buddies, whether you knew it or not.
Well I just finished my worst July month ever in the business. 13.5 cars. Got two yesterday which got me to a 12 car bonus. The thought for my post here is that yesterday I ran around all day busier than a whore in China Town and today there is tumble weeds blowing around. In the next hour I have two deliveries and that it'll keep me busy till at 7:30 - 8:00 tonight. Then it will be time to watch the Sox stomp the Orioles :shades: :P
well, it had obviously cooled enough not to melt the tires. What he was saying, is it was not lava that had been laid down a long time ago, it was - to use a term - new construction.
"...And that commercial was on recently cooled lava not hot lava..."
Not so fast! I distinctly remember seeing red hot lava flowing and then a quick cut to the car driving. Are you trying to tell me that the folks at Rover would mislead me into thinking their product could handle 2000 degrees? I'm shocked! cancel my order...or give me another $100 off and a free T-shirt. And it better be a MANS' T-shirt!
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
The gear shift is just out of view at the top of the picture.
You can see it in this picture just an inch or so ahead of the TR knob...
Nice pictures but seriously what percentage of Land Rover owners or any average driver needs all those gizmos and what percentage of all those Land Rovers ever see off road conditions other than on your test track.
Back in the late 80's I had a friend, of sorts, who had a top of the line Land Rover and when I asked him how his SUV did in 6 inches of snow he said, "I don't know I've never even driven it when it snowed. There are too many crazy drivers out there, do you know how much it would cost to fix if I tried to avoid one of them and went into a ditch, those things are unbelievably expensive to fix. Thats why I have a beater for snow days".
Seems to me if you can't put it through its paces what good is it; but what do I know, I'm just the owner of 'throw-aways".
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I'm glad July is over! I didn't get home until 11:00pm on Monday. 9:30pm last night. And today was my day off but had to go in to deliver a RAV4 and to follow up on an install of running boards and keyless remote entry to a Sequoia. FADE TO MONDAY EVENING..... :shades:
It was around 6:30pm, the whole day was quieter than the local cemetery at midnight. An older woman (around late 60's) pulls up in an Avalon XLS Diamond white pearl, 2001 vintage. Car looks really clean so I'm thinking "this would make a really nice used car" She gets out of her car and I greet her but she begins walking towards our BMW lot. "Where are you going? The Toyotas are over here.!" I exclaim. "I don't want a Toyota, I'm going to look at a BMW." she says. "What do you want to do that for?" I ask, "look at this beautiful Highlander." I tell her. Just happens that an 08 Ltd is sitting a few spaces down from where she parked and she comes over to look at it. "Wow, this is nice!" She tells me. "Yep, just got them in last week. This one has everything." I remark. "Pretty green." she says. "You like it?" I ask. "Yes." she replies. The vehicle is unlocked so I open the driver's door and invite her to sit in. She does and begins touching the dash and runs her hand over the leather seats. "Looks like it has navigation." she remarks. "And DVD entertainment too!" I respond. "I don't need that. My children are all grown up and I don't have any grandkids, what else you got that I can test drive?" she asks. "I believe there's a few more over here." We start walking towards the other two Highlanders and she begins telling me she wanted to buy the original Highlander but it was too small. She is a tall woman so I can see why she passed on it before. We come up to a silver and a pearl white and she wants to look at the silver one. I open it up and move it out away from the others and she asks if I need to make a copy of her license. "Yes, please." I respond. "It's in my purse in my car." So we drive up to her car and while she gets her license I go in to make a copy and grab my dealer tag..... TO BE CONTINUED....
Well Land Rover's own data show that about 20% of land Rover owners regularly take their vehicles off-road.
And this article backs that claim up.
Land Rovers have the highest off-road penetration among luxury SUVs, with 26 percent of all LR3 owners engaging in “real” off-roading, and 22.2 percent of all Range Rovers and 14.8 percent of Range Rover Sport drivers occasionally leaving the pavement. By contrast, the study found that no Cadillac Escalade EXT, Infiniti QX56 and Volvo XC90 owners ever venture off-road. (See the chart below for more data.)
Well...that guy I knew must have been a real scaredy-cat. :confuse: Buying expensive things never seemed to bother him but he sure did baby that Land Rover. I guess he wasn't a real Land Rover owner afterall, huh?
I saw those statistics but I'd like to know if your personal experience with Land Rover owners supports those statistics.
I've always been skeptical of stats that I haven't been able to support from my own experiences and those of others I know and respect. Because of this I tend to believe in the old saying, "figures don't lie but liars figure".
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Denver is the home to the largest Land Rover Owners club in America. Many of our owners are members and regularly take the cars off roading. The also do trips to Moab, etc. When we have our dealer off road trips, they fill up fast. one of our most popular is our annual Ice Bowl racing in January. A large percentage of our customers actually use the cars. Don't knock what you have not experienced. It can be a lifestyle.
Hell, if we only sold trucks and SUV's to people who needed them they would be stacked up like cord wood around here. But the buying public wants more bells and whistles now days which is fine with me. I think technology is cool.
I remember when we used to offer a Bronco and a Bronco II. They rode rough as could be and people never said a word, same with our trucks. People did not buy them for the smooth ride, they bought them for what they were intended for. Then Ford started the SUV revolution when they came out with the nicer Explorer as an alternative to the station wagon. Now if someone is driving a 4X4 DRW diesel F-350 and there is a little vibration at 75 MPH when they have a 15000 pound trailer hooked to it you would think you had shot there dog.
I remember as a kid my dad saying, "by god the day a damn pickup truck cost more then $10K is the day I start walking" He is one of the old school guys who used a truck on his cattle ranch and could have cared less about bells and whistles.
I'm sure your post is very interesting, but I don't know because I have not read it. "Why haven't you read it?" I hear you ask. The answer is three little words TO BE CONTINUED...
We do a couple of off-road events a year and normally have between 25 and 30 people show up.
Now that doesn't sound like much but we only sold around 114 new cars in 2005 and I think 124 new cars in 2006.
The last off-road event we had was a good mixture of new owners(bought their car within the last six months or less), long time owners who have been our events before and fairly new used car buyers(bought there CPO Land Rover within the last six months or less).
The highest mileage car there was a 1999 Range Rover 4.0 SE with 120,000 miles on it. The oldest car there, and the second most expensive, was a 1997 Defender 90 with 20,000 miles I think. It also had about 15,000 dollars worth of modifications done to it. The two most expensive cars there were Supercharged Range Rover Sports that had 75,000 dollar MSRPs and were less then a year old.
Yeah, it is looking to us like you're co-workers and happened to be on the same server yesterday. Our tech folks are still looking into this.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
"Hell, if we only sold trucks and SUV's to people who needed them they would be stacked up like cord wood around here"
they are fantasy vehicles, most guys who buy trucks like to pretend they are construction workers on their daily commute to the office and most guys who buy large SUV's like to pretend they are gangsters or movie stars, not that there is anything wrong with that
Denver is the home to the largest Land Rover Owners club in America.
That’s what I mean “DENVER” “DENVER” is not representative of all Land Rover owners in America, it is by your account, the largest in America (please note, I’m not saying you are not correct about this. I believe you). By the same token the guy who says his area is the smallest in America that use theirs off road, can’t be the basis for how ALL Land Rover owners use their SUV’s in America.
Maybe we should take a little pole of our Land Rover posters here to see how they use theirs. Since I imagine that poll would be very small , lets include all posters and ask them if they owned an expensive piece of machinery like that, would they use it off-road? But then that poll would only apply to posters here at Edmunds and still would not be representative of a much larger pole from across America. Then for a larger poll across America (that might be meaningful) we would have to know in what areas the poll was taken (country or city). Then we would have to know how many people were polled in those areas compared to a random poling across America at different times of the year. Then we would do ya see where I’m going here. Comes right back to what I said about guys who figure. Like I’ve always said, “tell me who sponsored the poll and I’ll tell you the results before they’re published”. :surprise:
Don't knock what you have not experienced.
I’m not knocking it, I merely asked a question.
It can be a lifestyle.
Right again. Like I’ve said before, ain’t this why they make chocolate and vanilla (of course I like chocolate so there must be somethin wrong with people who like vanilla).
Edit: corrected the spelling of poll (was pole) I have lots of friends like that, no offense meant.
2nd Edit: I was editing my original post as Rover jumed on me, geesh!
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Maybe we should take a little poll of our Land Rover posters here to see how they use theirs. Since I imagine that poll would be very small , lets include all posters and ask them if they owned an expensive piece of machinery like that, would they use it off-road? But then that poll would only apply to posters here at Edmunds and still would not be representative of a much larger poll from across America. Then for a larger poll across America (that might be meaningful) we would have to know in what areas the poll was taken (country or city). Then we would have to know how many people were poll in those areas compared to a random polling across America at different times of the year. Then we would do ya see where I’m going here. Comes right back to what I said about guys who figure. Like I’ve always said, “tell me who sponsored the poll and I’ll tell you the results before they’re published”.
I am not one of the spelling posters I swear but man that bothered me.
Now if you go back and read the Forbes article again they actually do explain some of their methodology and their concerns about what is considered off-roading.
Also what kind of bias can Forbes possibly have? They aren't even an automotive magazine nor do they support any particular brand. Sure they get advertising from automotive companies but I am sure Land Rover is about the smallest of those companies.
If you just want to argue for arguments sake fine but I have addressed most of your concerns.
I am not one of the spelling posters I swear but man that bothered me.
Boy, do I know what you mean about your spelling but I never jumped you about it or your grammar.
Now if you go back and read the Forbes article again they actually do explain some of their methodology and their concerns about what is considered off-roading.
I read it. I just wanted some empirical data from people I know, like guys here.
If you just want to argue for arguments sake fine but I have addressed most of your concerns
I thought you knew me better than that.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Comments
Yikes! I'll pass this on to our IT people.
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
Scene from a municipal court somewhere in Colorado:
Judge (to court): Let's proceed next to Case #151392-302, where Mrs. lrguy has petitioned the Court to begin divorce proceedings from Mr. lrguy.
Judge (to Mrs. lrguy): I presume you are filing this petition under the grounds of "irreconcilable differences"?
Mrs. lrguy: No, sir. Actually, Mr. lrguy is a great husband, and we get along just fine. So, sir. I am requesting this divorce because of the Range Rover! He won't quit his job, and so my only logical option is to ask for a divorce!
-------
I think that would be quite a show for daytime TV!
lr - couldn't possibly burden your wife like that. I'll take care of that Range Rover test for you....
Actually, from the pictures that looks like the sort of thing I'd look at, check the manual to make sure it says what I think it says and never worry about it again. Might take a couple of minutes.
By the way, I do believe cdnpinhead is located in the same metro area as me. I doubt it is the same provider, though, as I am now at my corporate office. (I need to occasionally take breaks from the monotony of all my documentation work.)
--------
Auto sales took a dive across the industry in July thanks to high gas prices and reluctant consumers, with General Motors reporting a 22.3 percent decline and Ford sales down 19.1 percent...
Toyota's truck sales were flat thanks in part to heavy incentives, but its car sales fell 11.8 percent.
Nissan Motor Co. was the only major automaker to report a sales increase for the month, of 1.7 percent...
Usually those numbers are declines from the same month last year, not from the previous month..
July '07 vs. July '06
not
July '07 vs. June '07
regards,
kyfdx
visiting host
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
I guess I'm just dumb or my spatial referencing is off. :confuse: Read more carefully before trying to be a smartass.
You can see it in this picture just an inch or so ahead of the TR knob.
Now I can't remember if the article I was complaining about was a review of the Range Rover or the Range Rover Sport.
The Sport does have the park brake release only an inch or so behind the gear shift and an inch or so in front of the TR knob.
On the Range Rover those positions are reversed with the TR knob an inch or so behind the shifter and the park brake release an inch or so behind the knob.
No just saying that is what happened to me. Couldn't remember the whole cdnpinhead name.
Yeah it was just a lot of hello's in my name ( GP ). My buddy called me when it happened and said look on edmunds I'm under your name. I went on edmunds and we were both on at the same time typing in hello.
The hosts got upset deleted the posts and sent me a email about moching the forum. I replied back to them to let them know what was going on.
Pretty weird stuff :confuse:
Funny name to give one's self...
What's up?
Honeywell?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Edmunds Price Checker
Edmunds Lease Calculator
Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!
Edmunds Moderator
Back in the day we were entitled (if there is such a thing these days) to two 15-minute breaks a day, and most of us went to the cafeteria to make it a somewhat social event.
Those days are long gone. Now I do such things in snatches during the day anonymously on the 'net. You lot have now become my coffee-break buddies, whether you knew it or not.
And that commercial was on recently cooled lava not hot lava.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Fallllinnggggg
Land Rover on the rack
This actually happened no CGI involved.
So did this one...
LR3 faster then a BMW M6
Not so fast! I distinctly remember seeing red hot lava flowing and then a quick cut to the car driving. Are you trying to tell me that the folks at Rover would mislead me into thinking their product could handle 2000 degrees? I'm shocked! cancel my order...or give me another $100 off and a free T-shirt. And it better be a MANS' T-shirt!
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
And I gave the guy a Polo shirt not a t-shirt. Not my fault he didn't read the fine print.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
You can see it in this picture just an inch or so ahead of the TR knob...
Nice pictures but seriously what percentage of Land Rover owners or any average driver needs all those gizmos and what percentage of all those Land Rovers ever see off road conditions other than on your test track.
Back in the late 80's I had a friend, of sorts, who had a top of the line Land Rover and when I asked him how his SUV did in 6 inches of snow he said, "I don't know I've never even driven it when it snowed. There are too many crazy drivers out there, do you know how much it would cost to fix if I tried to avoid one of them and went into a ditch, those things are unbelievably expensive to fix. Thats why I have a beater for snow days".
Seems to me if you can't put it through its paces what good is it; but what do I know, I'm just the owner of 'throw-aways".
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Well you can show off your wealth with it and show how much better you are than those of use with throw aways.
But then Sam Walton drove a beat up pickup truck.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Mackabee
It was around 6:30pm, the whole day was quieter than the local cemetery at midnight.
She gets out of her car and I greet her but she begins walking towards our BMW lot. "Where are you going? The Toyotas are over here.!" I exclaim. "I don't want a Toyota, I'm going to look at a BMW." she says. "What do you want to do that for?" I ask, "look at this beautiful Highlander." I tell her. Just happens that an 08 Ltd is sitting a few spaces down from where she parked and she comes over to look at it. "Wow, this is nice!" She tells me. "Yep, just got them in last week. This one has everything." I remark. "Pretty green." she says. "You like it?" I ask. "Yes." she replies. The vehicle is unlocked so I open the driver's door and invite her to sit in. She does and begins touching the dash and runs her hand over the leather seats. "Looks like it has navigation." she remarks. "And DVD entertainment too!" I respond. "I don't need that. My children are all grown up and I don't have any grandkids, what else you got that I can test drive?" she asks. "I believe there's a few more over here."
We start walking towards the other two Highlanders and she begins telling me she wanted to buy the original Highlander but it was too small. She is a tall woman so I can see why she passed on it before. We come up to a silver and a pearl white and she wants to look at the silver one. I open it up and move it out away from the others and she asks if I need to make a copy of her license. "Yes, please." I respond. "It's in my purse in my car." So we drive up to her car and while she gets her license I go in to make a copy and grab my dealer tag.....
TO BE CONTINUED....
And this article backs that claim up.
Land Rovers have the highest off-road penetration among luxury SUVs, with 26 percent of all LR3 owners engaging in “real” off-roading, and 22.2 percent of all Range Rovers and 14.8 percent of Range Rover Sport drivers occasionally leaving the pavement. By contrast, the study found that no Cadillac Escalade EXT, Infiniti QX56 and Volvo XC90 owners ever venture off-road. (See the chart below for more data.)
Luxry SUV off-road Forbes
To Land Rover drivers "off-road" means their driveways.
Mackabee
Well...that guy I knew must have been a real scaredy-cat. :confuse: Buying expensive things never seemed to bother him but he sure did baby that Land Rover. I guess he wasn't a real Land Rover owner afterall, huh?
I saw those statistics but I'd like to know if your personal experience with Land Rover owners supports those statistics.
I've always been skeptical of stats that I haven't been able to support from my own experiences and those of others I know and respect. Because of this I tend to believe in the old saying, "figures don't lie but liars figure".
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Some folks just didn't know how to live.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Some folks just didn't know how to live.
jmonroe
You never know, he may have been the one to beat it up, and had a blast doing it!
I remember when we used to offer a Bronco and a Bronco II. They rode rough as could be and people never said a word, same with our trucks. People did not buy them for the smooth ride, they bought them for what they were intended for. Then Ford started the SUV revolution when they came out with the nicer Explorer as an alternative to the station wagon. Now if someone is driving a 4X4 DRW diesel F-350 and there is a little vibration at 75 MPH when they have a 15000 pound trailer hooked to it you would think you had shot there dog.
I remember as a kid my dad saying, "by god the day a damn pickup truck cost more then $10K is the day I start walking" He is one of the old school guys who used a truck on his cattle ranch and could have cared less about bells and whistles.
TO BE CONTINUED...
Now that doesn't sound like much but we only sold around 114 new cars in 2005 and I think 124 new cars in 2006.
The last off-road event we had was a good mixture of new owners(bought their car within the last six months or less), long time owners who have been our events before and fairly new used car buyers(bought there CPO Land Rover within the last six months or less).
The highest mileage car there was a 1999 Range Rover 4.0 SE with 120,000 miles on it. The oldest car there, and the second most expensive, was a 1997 Defender 90 with 20,000 miles I think. It also had about 15,000 dollars worth of modifications done to it. The two most expensive cars there were Supercharged Range Rover Sports that had 75,000 dollar MSRPs and were less then a year old.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
they are fantasy vehicles, most guys who buy trucks like to pretend they are construction workers on their daily commute to the office and most guys who buy large SUV's like to pretend they are gangsters or movie stars, not that there is anything wrong with that
That’s what I mean “DENVER” “DENVER” is not representative of all Land Rover owners in America, it is by your account, the largest in America (please note, I’m not saying you are not correct about this. I believe you). By the same token the guy who says his area is the smallest in America that use theirs off road, can’t be the basis for how ALL Land Rover owners use their SUV’s in America.
Maybe we should take a little pole of our Land Rover posters here to see how they use theirs. Since I imagine that poll would be very small , lets include all posters and ask them if they owned an expensive piece of machinery like that, would they use it off-road? But then that poll would only apply to posters here at Edmunds and still would not be representative of a much larger pole from across America. Then for a larger poll across America (that might be meaningful) we would have to know in what areas the poll was taken (country or city). Then we would have to know how many people were polled in those areas compared to a random poling across America at different times of the year. Then we would do ya see where I’m going here. Comes right back to what I said about guys who figure. Like I’ve always said, “tell me who sponsored the poll and I’ll tell you the results before they’re published”. :surprise:
Don't knock what you have not experienced.
I’m not knocking it, I merely asked a question.
It can be a lifestyle.
Right again. Like I’ve said before, ain’t this why they make chocolate and vanilla (of course I like chocolate so there must be somethin wrong with people who like vanilla).
Edit: corrected the spelling of poll (was pole) I have lots of friends like that, no offense meant.
2nd Edit: I was editing my original post as Rover jumed on me, geesh!
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I am not one of the spelling posters I swear but man that bothered me.
Now if you go back and read the Forbes article again they actually do explain some of their methodology and their concerns about what is considered off-roading.
Also what kind of bias can Forbes possibly have? They aren't even an automotive magazine nor do they support any particular brand. Sure they get advertising from automotive companies but I am sure Land Rover is about the smallest of those companies.
If you just want to argue for arguments sake fine but I have addressed most of your concerns.
Boy, do I know what you mean about your spelling but I never jumped you about it or your grammar.
Now if you go back and read the Forbes article again they actually do explain some of their methodology and their concerns about what is considered off-roading.
I read it. I just wanted some empirical data from people I know, like guys here.
If you just want to argue for arguments sake fine but I have addressed most of your concerns
I thought you knew me better than that.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I thought you knew me better than that.
jmonroe
It felt like you were channeling a few other posters on this board.
The whole once I take a position I never move from it no matter how ridiculous I look way of debating.
Lets call it the Dubya Debate Method. :P