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Stories from the Sales Frontlines
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Just in case anyone asks I have four wheel chocks under that Series to keep it from rolling out into the street if both he parking break and reverse gear fail.
Incidentally, as I expect you know, that Land Rover's handbrake is actually a separate drum brake fitted between the output of the transfer case and the rear propshaft. It's even more effective if you engage four wheel drive.
For newer rovers they have stopped doing the prop shaft brake and have gone to electrically activated little drum brakes on the rear axle.
Very neat design activated by a small paddle by the gear shift and you can use the parking brake as a real emergency brake. If you pull on the paddle while driving a message will come up very quickly warning you that an emergency braking action is about to be taken. Then the computer will electrically activate the brakes without locking up the tires.
I did "get" it...no problem.
Of course I'm sure YOU are upright and honest and would never stoop to such tactics.Yeah...... :mad:
That was uncalled for..............and says far more about you than it does isell. Those of us that have been here a while probably have a better feel for the personalities of our fellow posters than those who've just arrived.
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2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
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I would like to say, that I will finally admit, to all the Edmunds masses. I am a CAR DEALERSHIP SNOB/ELITEST. I am so proud of my store, and my brand, and all the people I work for/with. I some how think that all stores are kind of like mine and that I do not understand how why other stores are not as great as mine. Well I had to do a delivery to a high profile restraunt owner in town and One of the title forms had the wrong lein holder info, so I stopped a Chevy House on the way to pick up a blank one....
Without all the boring details, I just felt as though I needed a shower after I left. It was depressing. The parking sucked. It smelled. I did not get into the front door with out being approached, and when they found out I was not there to buy a car I was dropped like a hot tamale.
But It was an example of you get what you pay for. If you want a dealer to "give away" every car (I wanted to use the term we use in-shop but not edmunds friendly) or let the dealer make profit on everyone except you.*ya right* That is what you get. A stinky store.
Many in these boards who say holdback is profit and dealers are sitting "phat" because of it. Dealers are sitting Phat because of the Service and Parts department. Holdback, mows lawns, cleans bathrooms, fills coke machines, and pays light bills.
A good example: I came home with a paycheck a little more than average, and unfourtantly my step-daughter saw it. (she is 8) and said "WoW thats the most money I have ever seen you're rich"
I said "Its only about $250"
She said "No it says $xxxx.00"
Then I told her "After rent, car note, electric bill, groceries, gas, lunch money, Car Insurance, Health Insurance....Its $250.00"
She was no longer impressed.
tidester, host
I said "Its only about $250"
She said "No it says $xxxx.00"
Then I told her "After rent, car note, electric bill, groceries, gas, lunch money, Car Insurance, Health Insurance....Its $250.00"
She was no longer impressed."
First of all, I wrote the post isell linked to above. AND I stand by every word of it as being true and factual, especially here in the Southern Calfornia new and used automobile marketplace.
On the other hand, I agree that the massive profits seen by the auto dealerships (by parts and service, etc.) are not funneled down to the people on the floor selling the cars. However, most people see a small dealership knocked down and a mufti-million dollar one constructed in it's place. It's hard to feel sorry when you see these beautiful "mega dealerships" constructed, or when you read about all the concessions cities make to lure them there, and the MASSIVE AMOUNT of tax revenue generated, and therefore you assume profits. After all, someone is paying the loan payments on these facilities!
You folks are a credit to your profession. But, and you knew there was a but, there are still a significant number of folks in your industry that I wouldn't trust as far as I could throw them. They'll do ANYTHING to make a buck. Those are the folks that form the public's opinion of car sales folks.
But I do thank you for coming here and discussing issues with us. You folks must have thick skin to survive in your profession.
I haven't seen any sellers do anything immoral, but it definately comes across how much pressure they're under to always be closing. The sellers are mostly young guys and they split them into teams and the mood almost seems like gang warfare.
On the flipside, you also see all sorts of customers trying to be $30,000 cars for $300 a month with no money down and a trade in that they're $5,000 upside down.
It's definately an interesting show, but doesn't show the dealership in the best light.
A couple of comments, I don't think many have the approach that a dealer should not make a profit on them. FWIW I have always said that dealer profit should never even be considered when negotiating for a car. Secondly profit doesn't mean being clean. I have seen places that have never turned a profit looking clean as can be, I have seen places making money hand over foot that were filthy.
Then I told her "After rent, car note, electric bill, groceries, gas, lunch money, Car Insurance, Health Insurance....Its $250.00"
If you have $250 after paying all your bills you are doing better than most people.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Unfortunately that is true, that industry is not known for honesty and ethics be it deserved or not. As long as there is a sizable number of dealers that play games such as tag team salesmen, losing keys, charging high fees for stuff that costs pennies and the like that perception will not change.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
the car salespros mention here ALL the time...........
Do you note that most of those folks buying the car
seem to ALWAYS focus on the payment???????
During the KOC marathon on A&E the other day very few
folks were worried about the OTD price or amount to be
financed!!!!!!!!!
I don't recall any of the payment buyers asking about
(on new cars) rebates, cash back, DOC fees, interest
rates or "GASP" holdback !!!!!!!!
Never see the salespeople push mop n glow, ex-warranties,
etc..etc.......
I DO note on the A&E discussion board the KOC threads got
SO HOT they took them down........ :P
In any case, I am not the least bit surprised they allow it. The show is edited in a way that you can never tell exactly what the deal is. They SOMETIMES show a final price on a good deal. And they SOMETIMES quote payments (yet they never say how MANY payments). But they never offer up all the numbers at once. Besides, the publicity is insane. Have you been to the website? They claim to have become the biggest dealer in the nation (thanks to the show), and I'm inclined to believe it. You can buy a car right there on their site and have them ship it to you.
Heck, I've been tempted by some things they show in an episode. But, of course, the real important facts like the number of miles, are not revealed.
Seems to me they highjack folks left and right, but the proof is just not there. For instance, they'll show someone buying a used PT Cruiser for $500/mo. That sounds insane. But, maybe it was only a 3-year note. Or maybe they've got the credit of a bankrupt 18-year-old. So, in the end, nothing is really revealed. And that kind of drives me nuts ... but, if they reveal too much, the dealer would stop doing the show, I'm sure.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I keep missing that show! When, exactly is it on?
would you fly Southwest?????????
That Tobin family has several dealers in the Vegas area
they sell many new highline cars also!
I have no clue. That's why I use the DVR.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Can you imagine competing with 50 (YES they have 50)
other salesguys on the lot for "ups"?
On the downside. There is no other sales Job I can think of that the Customer hates you, or has total distrust from the beginning, that you have knock down those walls, and establish trust. Just because of the torrid past of this industry, and the few dirtbags that still remain.
Some regions are worse than others. Southern California is Rough. I have worked there, but since I left there are so many laws to protect the consumer that are in place now.
But the business is changing for the better. Dealers are realizing that the consumers know more than we do in some cases, that the bait and switch does not work like it used too and they know that if they do not start treating people like they should be treated, someone else will.
I have had 3 Phil's in my lifetime who have done me wrong, should distrust EVERY Phil that crosses my path?
seem to ALWAYS focus on the payment???????
The majority of real world buyers are payment buyers...its not just the show or dealers who focus on bad credit cutomers...it's just the way most folk buy cars.
Alot of people live via payments...they live paycheck to paycheck which means everything revolves around payments.
I was born and raised in San Pedro and I know the market well. Slimy stores with constant turnover, full page screamer ads etc.
Still, there are some decent stores there.
A smart shopper will figure out what he can afford in payments work it backwards to determine what price he can afford in a car.
A poor shopper will fall into the trap of increasing the term or downpayment to get a better monthly payment.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Absolutely. There the only airline that would be confident enough that they could put cameras on their customer service people. 90% of the time, the CSR looks good and the passenger looks like a nut. And I fly them at least twice a month.
Back to cars. Most people don't care what the OTD cost of a vehicle is. They are not going to whip out their checkbook and write a check for the vehicle. They are concerned with the amounts they will pay. Terry has said that bout a million times ... . The guy at Carmax this weekend told me that les than 5% of his deals are cash. When he was at an upscale MB/Cadillac/Saab dealership (a good one that I have dealt with a lot), it was 80% cash deals ... and as much as $70k in currency on occasion.
(What I was about to say to him was that no savvy cash buyer would pay the Carmax price ... $10,8 for a 2001 Taurus with 48k miles, but that is another issue.
"Rich people do rich people things ... Poor people do poor people things ..."
Consider Northern California. Audis are almost like Camry's out here, to the point where the first time I thought about replacing my car, I looked into them and was surprised they're considered a luxury brand.
Or here in MA. Audis are everywhere and kind of specialized. There's a dealer in my town that is a Porsche/Audi and doesn't have any other brands other than those on the used lot.
Any other brand taken on trade is off to auction no matter how nice or how new.
Family owned and operated and been around for over a couple of decades. In fact, they had a wanted ad for a salesperson to replace a retiree. They specifically wanted someone who had sold luxury products and not specifically luxury cars.
Audis Marketing/Ad department is really focusing on the TX market because they are realizing that this is a diamond in the rough. But they need a specific marketing strategy to maximize advertizing.
Is it me or is everyones JULY starting off a little slow?
June was Phat gross month. July is big Phat nothing we have one car out. And its the one I sold and have to split the deal.
If we keep this pace it will be good cause we are a little fat on inventory with the exeption of Range Rover Sports where we only have five units.
Yeah we have people looking for big deals too but what they do not know is Rover traditionaly does not launch next MY cars till november/december. We are not yet in crunch mode for 2006 MY cars.
My town is upper middle class - in fact we had a new home in my neighborhood crack the 7 figure mark. But it's a high tech mecca so lots of folks that work in town, shop in town and the Porsche/Audi dealer does a good business.
Herb Chambers - one of the big New England based dealers - is going to open a luxury dealership in town if they can ever finish the environmental cleanup of the disaster of a building he bought.
ONE car sold? For the entire store???
But with all the concierge services that we provide that we do not have people to do for us (like in higher volume high end stores) I can keep really busy. Yesterday I made 2 trips to Dallas, I deliver plates, pick up people from DFW airport. I can get hectic. Okay not really....hee hee
I have NEVER delivered plates or picked anybody up at the airport. That is what taxis are for!
If they are buying a car, I'll deduct the cabfare from the ticket. I am MUCH too busy for any of that stuff!
I will also pick up or drop off one of my clients vehicles if I have a free morning. One of my clients is a semi-retired lawyer who lives in Longmeadow Mass. That is about 45 minutes to an hour away from our dealership. If he needs his car brought in for service and I have a free morning I will normally pick it up for him. He is a big time car and rover nut so we will sit at his house have a cup of tea/coffee for 20 minutes or so and talk vehicles. Then I will drive his car back for the service work.
That was the one major snag in getting my car. After 30 days (I had a 60 day temporary tag), my plates still weren't at the clerk's office. They say they don't have the title. About three weeks of back-and-forth between the dealership and the clerk's office. Dealer won't send the title until [some event I don't recall] occurs, clerk won't issue a plate until they have the title. I have to take the car to be registered and have the VIN inspected by a state official. It was obvious they had never sold a car in my state before. I'm sure I made at least one snarky comment to the dealer about their charging a doc fee while I was running around doing all the work...
It's hard to disagree with you on that one.........
I have NEVER delivered plates or picked anybody up at the airport. That is what taxis are for!
If they are buying a car, I'll deduct the cabfare from the ticket. I am MUCH too busy for any of that stuff!
But don't forget Craig - you're in a high volume, low margin environment. Rover and Veedubgirl are in low volume, high margin environments. There's much more relationship building involved.
In my industry, it's the same thing. You can buy a faucet at Home Depot or go to a high end showroom to buy my brand. People expect handholding when they are spending $5K to outfit one bathroom with faucetry.
I'm not against training or change for that matter, however it seems that these so called experts with "all the answers" usually don't have any experience doing the actual job.
So anyway, a couple of weeks ago at our Internet Mgr meeting, this guy was invited for a talk. The emphasis of "his plan" is to not give the customer a price on what they ask for, but to 'generalize" with pricing ranges and barrage you with emails and phone calls.
This is from his site "The two week period after you receive a lead from an Internet prospect, what Mr. X calls “The Two Week Press”, is the most critical for closing the sale. During this period, you should contact your prospect daily, alternating with emails and phone calls. The following email templates can increase your odds of getting your customer in for that test drive. "
I really don't buy into this program and have 6 years of trial and effort to bring to my customers exactly what they want and expect.
Experts....argggggh