For a Scion? no one in their right mind is going to pay 30 grand for a Scion.
I wasn't speaking of Scion in particular but cars in general, but lets run the numbers. A TC with an automatic transmission runs about $18,470 with destination charges. Add on a Doc fee of say $65 and you are at $18,535, sales tax at 6.75% comes to $1,251.11 and license, lets say $78.00, and we are talking $19,864.11.
Now lets say someone comes in with little money and bad (but not horrible) credit. Say they qualify for 10% interest rate, they put a grand down and finance the rest for 72 months (I did say "over up to 6 years") to keep they payments low, which means their payment is $349.47/month. 349.47 times 72 is $25,162.09 and add the grand down payment and you have $26,162.09.
In the above example an interest rate of 15.37% would bring that total cost of payments to be $30K.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
j....thanks. But hey.....it's called living. We all go through tough stuff. It's not like we're all alone in this debacle. Yeah, a little tough right now, but it could be worse.
So, after the last few months, I've come out with a scar on my lower stomach (minus one un-needed internal organ) . I've got a rebuilt home. And, I've had to find a new way to make a living. So what? I'm no worse for the wear.
Just filled up the Tahoe for $40 yesterday (about 1/3 of what it took in July). That's a small blessing.
I've got a warm bed to sleep in. I've got a fridge full of leftovers. All my extremities work the way they're supposed to work. I've got good friends and family who surround me. I'm not living outside in a box. Things ain't so bad.
We all have good days/weeks/months/years. Sometimes they aren't so good. Just remember, the only constant is change. Stick around and eventually things will get better. It all starts with today, though.
snake...I was just thinking about the guy who sells Scions. To me, it's easy. You either like the cars, or you don't. If you do, the price is what it is...no negotiations. If financing is in order, either you do, or you don't qualify.
If someone's nervous about buying, so be it. IMHO, telling them not to be nervous probably isn't going to change that. End up on the wrong lot? Point them in the right direction to buy a new one, and go about your business. Easy-peazy!
I've noticed this in my past careers. Some sales people are afraid to "close the deal". You learn closing real quickly when you're depending on your ability to do so, when you're self-employed.
While I could be off base when it comes to closing a car deal, dealing with the nervous customer, as it was laid out, should go something like this....
Customer....."I'm nervous". Sales...."sit in the driver's seat (let'em take in the new car smell...play with the dials). Do you like it? Customer...."I'm not sure, I'm still nervous". Sales....."If you like the car, I'm going to help you buy it. I'll be there every step of the way, start to finish. And, in a short while, you're going to be driving it home, happy that YOU made the right choice".
If that doesn't do it, cut'em loose. Don't feed their insecurities. This is Scion. There's no shopping around on them for price. I would imagine that, as a Scion sales person, you don't have time to mess with someone else's insecurities. Let some other dealership do that, if they want.
Only those of you who have been married a few years can appreciate this little story. While making the three hour trip home from my sister's last night, the wife brings up the topic of new cars---very unusual for her. She says, "I forgot to tell you that while I was out shopping the other day, I stopped by the Honda dealer to look at the new CRV's." You have to keep in mind that this is a lady who knows zero about cars or what they cost or how to approach the buying process, etc. I nearly ran off the road as she spoke. I asked her if she talked with a salesman. She says," I wasn't going to but one of them walked along the side of my car as I was slowly going down the CRV rows. He motioned for me to roll down my window and then asked me to stop and look." I then asked her if she got out of the car. She says, "Oh, yes. I wanted to get a better look." I replied by asking her to tell me what was said.
She said that the salesman was very knowledgeable. He told her that all of the CRV's were 4 cyl. and got around 28mpg. He told her the price range was from $24k-$28k. He told her that the alloy wheels stayed cleaner than any other car on the market and how much the customers liked that feature. Now, that is a new marketing twist if ever I heard one. Naturally, she liked the one with the moonroof, leather, etc. With fear in my heart, I asked her if she took a test drive. She said that he suggested it, but she declined the offer. Then she said the famous one liner to him: "I'm really just looking." I asked her if he looked a little disappointed, but she said no. She went on to say how nice he was to answer all of her questions. I asked her how long she was there. She said, "Oh, about 30 minutes." I think that I had better go by there and thank the young man for his patience.
My next remark turned to the Grand Marquis---you know, the car that she said to go ahead and buy. I said, "Honey, I thought that we were leaning toward the Grand Marquis." She says, "No, you're the one who wants that big car. I told you that I wanted another CRV." I guess that I am back to stage one. You see, that is what makes marriage interesting. The wife may finally give in to your wishes, but she doesn't really have her heart in the process. I guess that is why I have hesitated on the GM. I was a bit afraid that if I purchased it, I might spend years hearing her say, "Why did you ever buy this big old car."
I then suggested to her that she drive both cars and see what she thought. I also suggested that she look at the rebates, employee pricing, mpg of both, etc. I'm using psychology on her because I know that price wise, the GM is the better deal. Also, if she drives the GM she will like the comfort. This is a lady who likes the comfort factor. We'll see how things work out. I'm not buying any car unless we both enjoy it. That way, neither person complains or blames the other. It's too big a purchase for one person not to be happy and, after all, the money belongs to both of us.
Hope all of you enjoyed Turkey Day. I have a few more pounds around the belt, but what a wonderful way to gain it.
For those of you that are worried that I would be chased away....don't. I belong to a loosely moderated political forum that I've been posting on for years and the responses over there are vicious compared to the tame retorts we get here.
The only problem here is that I can't really dig my nails into some of the responses the way I'd like to. Some of these guys posting about the car business who have never worked in it need to be verbally filleted for some of their "insights".
Hey, moo! Have a great time in China. Yeah, when I was there back in 02 they drove within millimeters of each other. Incredibally I didn't see an accident the whole time.
Came back with a daughter - the one think made in China that's not cheap!
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Yes, they are. Some people think they know quite a bit without ever having walked in our shoes. You may have sold something before, but you haven't sold cars. It's a different world.
Now I'm not going to beat up on any one particuliar poster here but these guys who keep yammering on about putting a smile on your face and motoring through a littany of horrific customers really don't know the brain damage involved in doing that.
The sales managers who haven't shagged ups on the lot for over 20 years are the biggest hindrance in this business...in my opinion. If it wasn't for the SM's the whole sales process would be different. These guys are the true culprits in the whole buying process. These are the clowns who drag out the process and wear the customer down.
a guy drove onto my farm and came out to the field where I was tending thousands of containers of a particular nursery stock item. Without the least bit of shame he said "I just bought 50 of these at Wal-Mart and I was hoping you could tell me how to grow them".
You should have charged him for the advice.
My dad is a contractor and when I was young I worked some summers with him. Sometimes he'd have a whole family gathered around him when doing his work at their home, just staring, and making him feel uncomfortable.
He got ticked off and told them if they keep staring, he'll charge them for training, and make their renovation bill more. :P They quickly scattered away.....
Not everyone's an expert. Certainly not me. Truth told, I've learned a lot from the sales vets here.
Bought and sold my fair share of cars that have graced my humble "estate", too.
I've managed a sales staff, although not in the automotive end of things. Done some selling myself. But, same rules apply.
I used to ask my sales force all the time about their forecasts (probably similar to the a.m. sales meetings at the dealerships). My biggest challenge was getting my staff (even the managers) to recognize when a prospect wasn't really a prospect, at all. They'd waste time and energy, week after week, telling me how these prospects were on the verge of closing. Yet, time after time, they lingered, no movement at all. Finally, the edict had to be made...."close'em or get them out of the funnel".
Relating this back to the Scion, the price is the price posted. There's no negotiation. A prospect can't get a "better deal" at another dealership. They can try to shop your deal, but anyone who's done just a little homework will know, Scion is a one price dealership. So, it's a matter of "do you, or don't you like the car?" If they don't, there's nothing you're going to do or say to change that. You might want to find out why they don't like the car, just to gain a little knowledge.
If they say they want to shop around, you might ask "for what?" A Corolla? A Camry? Step right next door....got those, too.
No use making your job any more difficult than it is. As long as you can generate some excitement about the Scion, get the customer to see why it's a good choice, you're 9/10ths there. Just got to get them financed at that point.
Do you really want to spend 2 hours with someone trying to soothe their nervousness? Or, if they are terminally undecided? Is that really a good prospect? Or, would you be better served cutting them loose and moving on to the next person that happens upon the lot?
I'm trying to learn here. So, no offense intended.
For the record, I've been filleted before....sometimes in these threads.
Now I'm not going to beat up on any one particular poster here but these guys who keep yammering on about putting a smile on your face
Some of those "guys" are auto salesmen themselves.
The sales managers who haven't shagged ups on the lot for over 20 years are the biggest hindrance in this business...in my opinion. If it wasn't for the SM's the whole sales process would be different. These guys are the true culprits in the whole buying process. These are the clowns who drag out the process and wear the customer down.
Examples or stories???
Care to rebuttal joel, you're a sales manager. :surprise:
Do you really want to spend 2 hours with someone trying to soothe their nervousness? Or, if they are terminally undecided? Is that really a good prospect? Or, would you be better served cutting them loose and moving on to the next person that happens upon the lot?
Once I figure out that the customer is a flake (as the guy I wrote about yesterday), I'll drop them right away, nicely of course, and wilkl tell my SM about it. Our management team is pretty decent, as they don't am ek you "wear the customer down".and so on.
However I have abouyt 2 full binders will past prospects that I haven't closed. Some said htye'll buyu in 6 months (so I put them in the appropraite follow up month section), some are undecided, some were nice to deal with but I can't reach them.
I go through the binders once every couple weeks and keep the customers in there unless they tell me they bought, or don't want to be called anymore, at which point then I'll dump them (shred their info).
I have gotten deals before from unsold customers I followed up with 6 months to even a year later.
Al wrote: The sales managers who haven't shagged ups on the lot for over 20 years are the biggest hindrance in this business...in my opinion. Jip asked: Examples or stories???
I agree with you Al on that one, that at some dealerships the managers are thinking old school 70s and 80s selling techniques.
At my old Honda place I had a sales manager who gave everyone on the spot training about selling, when in the middle of a deal. Everyone got tired of his crap as it was almost impossbile to deal with him. One time a salesman had a deal on a car, with a commitment, and went to get payments. The SM asked the salesman if the customer had driven the car yet. He said no, he didn't want to. The manager wouldn't give him payments unless he drive the car. The customer got ticked off and left without buying.
Another time we received lists ofcustomers to call for our "private sales". The list was generated from the service dept, and wasn't seperated based on which salesperson the customer belonged to, it was just of recent customers in service within the last 6 months to a year.
Well some people on that list were customers who bought new cars less then 6 months before who were there for their 1st oil change. Boy did they get ticked off when they received a few calls in one year to come in and trade thier new car in a "private sale". The managers didn't care, neither did the owner. The lists barely got anyone in the door, it was the unsold prospects that came back for "the sale" that bought.
The owners and managers didn't want to hear it and the General Manager flipped out on me once for only having called 40 people out of the 500 on my list, when I alreayd had about 14 appointments booked from my unsold list (which were very likely to buy). Needless to say, I moved on shortly after that. That place is still a grindhouse, wehre everyone works for flats as over they years the management have been cutting into their payplans little by little.
When it's slow at the dealership our GM hands out lists of service customers that have recently been through the service lanes. Cold call them and try and get them to trade their car in.
Well, I don't proclaim to knowing more about the car selling process or the skunkworks of a dealership than the folks that work there. However, in my experience, I have more knowledge of the car itself that I'm interested in than the salesfolks.
I can give examples from some of my earliest purchases (Mazda saleswoman: "Sorry, there is no such thing as a turbo with a 5speed stick. It's not possible, all of our MX6 tubos are automatics. Like all turbos..." Well, besides the three 5 speeds I had already reviewed on her lot. Or the Mitsu Turbo I ended up buying...) to the current (Me to Acura salesman: And I'd like to apply for the AHFC 2.9% financing on my new '05 TL. 2.9? No such thing, these are flying off the shelves, no need to special finance 'em! SM/FM: Sorry, no such financing, let's fill out an app at the current rate. Educated Consumer: Could you check the Honda website, highly trained professionals while I wait? Yes, I knew that I was right, thank you. And just about have paid off my '05 TL @ 2.9%...).
Now, these might be the exception to the rule in the rest of the world. But not in mine. Not to say I haven't had experienced, knowledgeable sales pros. Just not often...
And, no offense to the pros here. I'm sure I'd enjoy not only buying a car from y'all but just talkin' too! I'm easy to spot, I like to wear a baby seal costume when I car shop...!
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
Every taxi I was in in China was a Jetta diesel. I noticed that the front seats had seat belts while the back did not. The driver had his belt on and invariably our translator grabbed that other seat with the seat belt!
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Thanks GP! I hope I can get into a little trouble. The first thing I do when I get there is kiss my wife and hug my boy. I miss them badly. They have been there for 3 weeks already.
Now you're making sense. I've ready that on many occasions that at a classic "superstore" salesperson has very little, if any authority when it comes to price. Yet, they are the ones having to take all that crap from customers and put straight face on those "first pencil" steal-deals.
There is nothing much you can do about a stupid customer - it really comes with territory. I'd dare to say your industry (automotive retail) groomed a special kind through decades of its practices - you know, those rampant fees, mop&glo, "sticker means nothing" approach, insulting screamer ads, etc. Those who don't have time and inclination to put some real time into learning the way of your business, take from this that "anything and everything is possible" - if so making $15K offer on $25K Sienna is not as outrageous in their mind, as you think (especially that I'm sure your Used Car Manager made some similar bids being on the other side, hasn't he?).
Why is it they come to Best Buy and pick up that new iPod or Bluray never asking what is invoice on it, or what the markup is? Most don't question the price because they know it's a real one. It's printed in the paper, posted on the merchandise and when you go to register "beep" - yes you guessed, it's one on your receipt. You guys in the business chose to go different way - for hope of a "whale" home run customer, you decided it's better to approach every single transaction from top profit. In exchange you have to cope with those wild shots. They think "Sticker is $25K for that Sienna. Let me try $15K - last week Best Buy had 50% off on couple of TVs, so 20% off isn't probably big deal". Best Buy and Sears are their point of reference. Those more educated (but not thoroughly) may actually have read about the invoices. However, they also read about holdbacks, bonuses and what not, so they go and shoot for tripple net and expect you to take it, even if you just sold fifteen of those last month for five hundred under sticker. For them, you making one dollar profit is one dollar too much. Then you have a former domestic customer. Last deal he/she got five thousand cash back and zero percent loan. They don't understand concept of demand and price adjustment. All they know is before it was this and now you want that. The only way you can do is say "I believe my product is worth more and the market did not force us to make such deals - if you can't live with that go and buy that Impala again".
One more thing - surveys show again and again that worst buying experience comes from stores like yours, i.e. large volume import superstores (Nissan, Toyota, Mitsubishi, Honda tend to be lowest customer satisfaction from purchasing process). The culprits must be the ones in charge - the owners and managers. You have superior product and lower margins, being surrounded by guys having exact opposite. That must be a toxic combination when it comes to creating customer experience. They want your product, but those other guys offer them "deals", so they want "deals" from you, too. You offer none (today it's more like you offer less), on top of which your owners tell you "we want more from each purchase". That must be a killer. Now, in worsening economy even you guys may have to watch it. Tables may turn, at least for short while, as it takes time to adjust production levels to lowered demands. If anything, you may experience even more spite, more people waiting "everything" from you and you may have to accept it more often than before. At least for now...
Thanks, Boom. I took a ride in one in Shenzhen. It was fairly uneventful. My jaw dropped when we got downtown though. Masses of people everywhere on any imaginable piece of transportation.
If a service customer wanders into the showroom we have to try and get their information, sit them down, and try and get them to trade their car in.
How dumb is that? That will gaurantee that I look for another place to get my car serviced. And from what I read hear, the service dept. is a big profit center for a dealer.
And I withdraw my troll comment about you. You seem like a decent guy who is working at an old school dealership and is kind of down now. Follow the advice of other sales folks here that have been in your shoes, find a shop that fits your style.
Also, you'll find that the folks here not in the biz like myself are more of the customers you'd like, educated about the process and price, courteous and professional. You wouldn't make a killing on the sale with us but we won't waste your time and you'd get a perfect CSI.
Then you have a former domestic customer. Lat deal he/she got five thousand cash back and zero percent loan. They don't understand concept of demand and price adjustment
So true when I worked at Honda.
The markups were tiny to begin with, so we had about $1200 to play with on a Civic.
When we came back with first pencil, it was about $240 off. Wow Mr Customer, what a deal!! we yelled!
Customers who were used to getting thousands off their domestics were almost insulted.
Then there were those who were looking for huige 0% financing, and as somebody metnioned earlier, I'd say: "Are you buying a car or an interest rate? Cause if you want a deal I heard the Cavaliers were being blown out for chump change!!"
The best one I heard from a customer when we did have 0%: Customer: Can you do any better than that?
Me: ummm, what's better than 0%? You want me to pay you to finance the Honda? :confuse:
Everyone likes to think they are. Now when I was in sales I can attest to the fact that a lot of my fellow sales professionals were sadly lacking in product knowledge. Not most but a decent percentage of them were, I would presume not much has changed in that respect, I also do remembering the occasional customer whose knowledge of my product surpassed mine (and I studied my a** off on ours and our competitors product). That being said I know that there are times when the customers product knowledge outweighs the salesman.
Now what I was saying is that Just because someone doesn't work at something doesn't me they don't know what goes on, I was also saying that for anyone it is important that they get feedback from people in order to grow. The same is true for any salesman, listen to what the customers are saying and you can learn something.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I must say the local Subaru store I bought my STI last week must be really exceptional where it comes to product knowledge. The sales guy was a former part guy and he sold a lot of over the counter performance stuff, so he knew way more than I did about that STI and anything that was mechanical. And I'm an engineer and Subaru fan . Their other saleguys were probably a bit more average, but they sell mostly those Foresters and Outbacks anyway, which are completely different kind of customer, too. Generally - Subaru being a niche itself, may also have a niche sales force. I must say all but one dealerships in my area were "nice guy-low pressure" types that I like buying from. To see the difference, it's enough to show up at one of those "other guys" places. Yuk... :sick:
How dumb is that? That will gaurantee that I look for another place to get my car serviced.
I know I would. If I can't walk around the showroom floor without being bothered then I'm going somewhere else. But that's what they want us to do.
If someone walks on the lot and god forbid they say..."we really aren't buying anything...we are just kicking tires" you have to go get a manger to talk to them.
All you are trying to do is get an oil change and you have to be pestered by a salesman.
You're right, that is annoying and very embarrassing. Out of curiosity, why do you still work there? Is there a better dealer you could go work for nearby? Even if you made less money, you'd be a great deal better off working with like-minded people. It's really too bad that businesses still try to do deals the way you describe. As a customer, I wouldn't spend two minutes there, and the sad thing is, only the pushy sales person will know why (and probably get reamed out for letting a customer go, too!)
I tend to be a patient person, but during car negotiations, I've been known to bring a timer, set it for 30 minutes and put it on the sales person's desk to get the deal done. If we can't agree in that time, I leave. If the sales person wastes that time disappearing to the back, that's too bad - I don't stop the timer unless I have to interrupt (which so far has never happened).
Good luck, I hope you find a great environment to work in!
"...You may have sold something before, but you havn't sold cars. It's a different world..."
So you think you've got it tough 'eh?
This morning at a Spring Valley, NY Wal-Mart a sales associate was killed by a mob of bargain hunters bursting through the door at opening. They also trampled a pregnant woman but she'll survive.
What's next, beating the car salesman with a bat until he comes down another $100?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Yeah that's tough.... I feel for the worker and their family and the preganant woman... do these people have no respent for fellow human beings in the quest for saving the mighty buck? These would be the same people who'll drive all day across town to save $50 on a car deal. :confuse:
Poor guy getting killed for what, $6/hour... not sure what minimum wage is now here or US.
"...These would be the same people who'll drive all day across town to save $50 on a car deal..."
Well in this case I blame Wal-Mart too. They probably ran a big ad with a few below cost loss-leaders to get the bargain hunters all ramped up. So they attracted the very cheap selfish bastards that would step on granny's head to get in the door to save a buck.
You car guys must have to deal with this also. Do your dealerships run screamer ads that only a fool would believe? So who comes knuckle-dragging in looking for that $99 a month payment, probably not the guy with sterling credit.
One local dealer near me is running ads called "Steal A Deal". As part of the commercial they say: "You can drive away our cars without paying anything and we won't even call the cops!".
I can't wait to see the nut jobs that brings out. :sick:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Came back with a daughter - the one think made in China that's not cheap!
That's funny. We were there in September and there were 6 new babies coming back on that flight, that I saw. Almost made me want to have another one......for about 5 seconds.
The driving millimeters apart is true too. We cringed as the bus just missed cars and bikes by a small stream of air. They have traffic lights but not everyone obeys. Somehow there are few accidents and we didn't see any dented or rusted cars.
No joke...this just happened about 30 minutes ago.
Me: "Welcome to Toyota of XYZ...my name is Alejandro. How can I assist you today?"
Customer: "How many miles does that Lexus have on it?" (Points to the Lexus right outside the showroom).
Me: "39,000 sir"
Customer: "That's to many miles for that price..."(walks away from me and leaves the showroom). And the best part is that he kinda waved me off with his hand too.
I can't tell you how much I wanted to drop that guy.
I was in a group of four families back then. I didn't think for five seconds. That's how I got so many kids....
When we started the adoption process - not for fertility reasons; just seemed like a good thing to do - we got about halfway through and my wife got pregnant. We ended up going through with things and since my wife had to stay home with a nine month old I took my oldest daughter, then 13, along to help. So my youngest bio and my adopted daughter are actually born the same day. We'll never know which one is older. They're both 7 now. The older ones are 19 and 16.
I lay low....
Moo -have some real fun - get a bike for your travels!...
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
I tend to be a patient person, but during car negotiations, I've been known to bring a timer, set it for 30 minutes and put it on the sales person's desk to get the deal done.
I did the same thing but as a salesman. I would tell the customer it would only take so many minutes and I would set the timer for that many minutes and when it went off I stopped and tried to close the deal. It worked very well.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I don't think he's a troll either. However, it would be nice if he actually POSTED some sales stories and entertained us. That's the best therapy he can get. Talking about what happened with certain customers, etc. etc. Bitching and moaning gets old soon. How about some stories Alex?
Well, perhaps it was too high for that price. You didn't tell us the model, trim and price. I could very easily see myself doing exactly what he did if I it were say 2006 ES350 (or was it 330 then?) with MSRP of 35K and your sticker on your floor in proximity of 30K. It would be completely pointless to even test drive or talk any kind of numbers, unless you were ready to drop five grand right away. Are you? Sometimes walking away like this saves time and frustration to everybody. You never walked away from anything if asking price was too high?
Comments
I wasn't speaking of Scion in particular but cars in general, but lets run the numbers. A TC with an automatic transmission runs about $18,470 with destination charges. Add on a Doc fee of say $65 and you are at $18,535, sales tax at 6.75% comes to $1,251.11 and license, lets say $78.00, and we are talking $19,864.11.
Now lets say someone comes in with little money and bad (but not horrible) credit. Say they qualify for 10% interest rate, they put a grand down and finance the rest for 72 months (I did say "over up to 6 years") to keep they payments low, which means their payment is $349.47/month. 349.47 times 72 is $25,162.09 and add the grand down payment and you have $26,162.09.
In the above example an interest rate of 15.37% would bring that total cost of payments to be $30K.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
So, after the last few months, I've come out with a scar on my lower stomach (minus one un-needed internal organ) . I've got a rebuilt home. And, I've had to find a new way to make a living. So what? I'm no worse for the wear.
Just filled up the Tahoe for $40 yesterday (about 1/3 of what it took in July). That's a small blessing.
I've got a warm bed to sleep in. I've got a fridge full of leftovers. All my extremities work the way they're supposed to work. I've got good friends and family who surround me. I'm not living outside in a box. Things ain't so bad.
We all have good days/weeks/months/years. Sometimes they aren't so good. Just remember, the only constant is change. Stick around and eventually things will get better. It all starts with today, though.
If someone's nervous about buying, so be it. IMHO, telling them not to be nervous probably isn't going to change that. End up on the wrong lot? Point them in the right direction to buy a new one, and go about your business. Easy-peazy!
I've noticed this in my past careers. Some sales people are afraid to "close the deal". You learn closing real quickly when you're depending on your ability to do so, when you're self-employed.
While I could be off base when it comes to closing a car deal, dealing with the nervous customer, as it was laid out, should go something like this....
Customer....."I'm nervous".
Sales...."sit in the driver's seat (let'em take in the new car smell...play with the dials). Do you like it?
Customer...."I'm not sure, I'm still nervous".
Sales....."If you like the car, I'm going to help you buy it. I'll be there every step of the way, start to finish. And, in a short while, you're going to be driving it home, happy that YOU made the right choice".
If that doesn't do it, cut'em loose. Don't feed their insecurities. This is Scion. There's no shopping around on them for price. I would imagine that, as a Scion sales person, you don't have time to mess with someone else's insecurities. Let some other dealership do that, if they want.
She said that the salesman was very knowledgeable. He told her that all of the CRV's were 4 cyl. and got around 28mpg. He told her the price range was from $24k-$28k. He told her that the alloy wheels stayed cleaner than any other car on the market and how much the customers liked that feature. Now, that is a new marketing twist if ever I heard one. Naturally, she liked the one with the moonroof, leather, etc. With fear in my heart, I asked her if she took a test drive. She said that he suggested it, but she declined the offer. Then she said the famous one liner to him: "I'm really just looking." I asked her if he looked a little disappointed, but she said no. She went on to say how nice he was to answer all of her questions. I asked her how long she was there. She said, "Oh, about 30 minutes." I think that I had better go by there and thank the young man for his patience.
My next remark turned to the Grand Marquis---you know, the car that she said to go ahead and buy. I said, "Honey, I thought that we were leaning toward the Grand Marquis." She says, "No, you're the one who wants that big car. I told you that I wanted another CRV." I guess that I am back to stage one. You see, that is what makes marriage interesting. The wife may finally give in to your wishes, but she doesn't really have her heart in the process. I guess that is why I have hesitated on the GM. I was a bit afraid that if I purchased it, I might spend years hearing her say, "Why did you ever buy this big old car."
I then suggested to her that she drive both cars and see what she thought. I also suggested that she look at the rebates, employee pricing, mpg of both, etc. I'm using psychology on her because I know that price wise, the GM is the better deal. Also, if she drives the GM she will like the comfort. This is a lady who likes the comfort factor. We'll see how things work out. I'm not buying any car unless we both enjoy it. That way, neither person complains or blames the other. It's too big a purchase for one person not to be happy and, after all, the money belongs to both of us.
Hope all of you enjoyed Turkey Day. I have a few more pounds around the belt, but what a wonderful way to gain it.
Richard
For those of you that are worried that I would be chased away....don't. I belong to a loosely moderated political forum that I've been posting on for years and the responses over there are vicious compared to the tame retorts we get here.
The only problem here is that I can't really dig my nails into some of the responses the way I'd like to. Some of these guys posting about the car business who have never worked in it need to be verbally filleted for some of their "insights".
I'll be back later...it's kinda busy right now.
Came back with a daughter - the one think made in China that's not cheap!
A few things to consider:
A.) You don't need to have worked in a field to have some knowledge of that field.
B.) There may be some ex-car salespeople here who for whatever reason don't let that fact be known,
C.) While relatively few people sell cars almost everyone buys cars and therefore have some insight to the process.
D.) In relation to 'C' getting feedback from the other side of the desk would help any salesperson in their job.
E.) There are those here that have other types of sales jobs and I would bet you that some of them make car sales look like childs play.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I've never been in a business where the customers think that they know more then the sales staff.
Now everyone here is going to regale us with their stories about that time they went into dealership xyz and the salesmen didn't know anyhting.
Yes, they are. Some people think they know quite a bit without ever having walked in our shoes. You may have sold something before, but you haven't sold cars. It's a different world.
The sales managers who haven't shagged ups on the lot for over 20 years are the biggest hindrance in this business...in my opinion. If it wasn't for the SM's the whole sales process would be different. These guys are the true culprits in the whole buying process. These are the clowns who drag out the process and wear the customer down.
Trust me.
You should have charged him for the advice.
My dad is a contractor and when I was young I worked some summers with him. Sometimes he'd have a whole family gathered around him when doing his work at their home, just staring, and making him feel uncomfortable.
He got ticked off and told them if they keep staring, he'll charge them for training, and make their renovation bill more. :P They quickly scattered away.....
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Bought and sold my fair share of cars that have graced my humble "estate", too.
I've managed a sales staff, although not in the automotive end of things. Done some selling myself. But, same rules apply.
I used to ask my sales force all the time about their forecasts (probably similar to the a.m. sales meetings at the dealerships). My biggest challenge was getting my staff (even the managers) to recognize when a prospect wasn't really a prospect, at all. They'd waste time and energy, week after week, telling me how these prospects were on the verge of closing. Yet, time after time, they lingered, no movement at all. Finally, the edict had to be made...."close'em or get them out of the funnel".
Relating this back to the Scion, the price is the price posted. There's no negotiation. A prospect can't get a "better deal" at another dealership. They can try to shop your deal, but anyone who's done just a little homework will know, Scion is a one price dealership. So, it's a matter of "do you, or don't you like the car?" If they don't, there's nothing you're going to do or say to change that. You might want to find out why they don't like the car, just to gain a little knowledge.
If they say they want to shop around, you might ask "for what?" A Corolla? A Camry? Step right next door....got those, too.
No use making your job any more difficult than it is. As long as you can generate some excitement about the Scion, get the customer to see why it's a good choice, you're 9/10ths there. Just got to get them financed at that point.
Do you really want to spend 2 hours with someone trying to soothe their nervousness? Or, if they are terminally undecided? Is that really a good prospect? Or, would you be better served cutting them loose and moving on to the next person that happens upon the lot?
I'm trying to learn here. So, no offense intended.
For the record, I've been filleted before....sometimes in these threads.
Some of those "guys" are auto salesmen themselves.
The sales managers who haven't shagged ups on the lot for over 20 years are the biggest hindrance in this business...in my opinion. If it wasn't for the SM's the whole sales process would be different. These guys are the true culprits in the whole buying process. These are the clowns who drag out the process and wear the customer down.
Examples or stories???
Care to rebuttal joel, you're a sales manager. :surprise:
Once I figure out that the customer is a flake (as the guy I wrote about yesterday), I'll drop them right away, nicely of course, and wilkl tell my SM about it. Our management team is pretty decent, as they don't am ek you "wear the customer down".and so on.
However I have abouyt 2 full binders will past prospects that I haven't closed. Some said htye'll buyu in 6 months (so I put them in the appropraite follow up month section), some are undecided, some were nice to deal with but I can't reach them.
I go through the binders once every couple weeks and keep the customers in there unless they tell me they bought, or don't want to be called anymore, at which point then I'll dump them (shred their info).
I have gotten deals before from unsold customers I followed up with 6 months to even a year later.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Have a good trip Moo!
GP
:shades:
Jip asked: Examples or stories???
I agree with you Al on that one, that at some dealerships the managers are thinking old school 70s and 80s selling techniques.
At my old Honda place I had a sales manager who gave everyone on the spot training about selling, when in the middle of a deal. Everyone got tired of his crap as it was almost impossbile to deal with him. One time a salesman had a deal on a car, with a commitment, and went to get payments. The SM asked the salesman if the customer had driven the car yet. He said no, he didn't want to. The manager wouldn't give him payments unless he drive the car. The customer got ticked off and left without buying.
Another time we received lists ofcustomers to call for our "private sales". The list was generated from the service dept, and wasn't seperated based on which salesperson the customer belonged to, it was just of recent customers in service within the last 6 months to a year.
Well some people on that list were customers who bought new cars less then 6 months before who were there for their 1st oil change. Boy did they get ticked off when they received a few calls in one year to come in and trade thier new car in a "private sale". The managers didn't care, neither did the owner. The lists barely got anyone in the door, it was the unsold prospects that came back for "the sale" that bought.
The owners and managers didn't want to hear it and the General Manager flipped out on me once for only having called 40 people out of the 500 on my list, when I alreayd had about 14 appointments booked from my unsold list (which were very likely to buy). Needless to say, I moved on shortly after that. That place is still a grindhouse, wehre everyone works for flats as over they years the management have been cutting into their payplans little by little.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
When it's slow at the dealership our GM hands out lists of service customers that have recently been through the service lanes. Cold call them and try and get them to trade their car in.
Absolute. Nonsense. Full stop.
How annoying is that?
All you are trying to do is get an oil change and you have to be pestered by a salesman.
It's truly embarassing.
I can give examples from some of my earliest purchases (Mazda saleswoman: "Sorry, there is no such thing as a turbo with a 5speed stick. It's not possible, all of our MX6 tubos are automatics. Like all turbos..." Well, besides the three 5 speeds I had already reviewed on her lot. Or the Mitsu Turbo I ended up buying...) to the current (Me to Acura salesman: And I'd like to apply for the AHFC 2.9% financing on my new '05 TL. 2.9? No such thing, these are flying off the shelves, no need to special finance 'em! SM/FM: Sorry, no such financing, let's fill out an app at the current rate. Educated Consumer: Could you check the Honda website, highly trained professionals while I wait? Yes, I knew that I was right, thank you. And just about have paid off my '05 TL @ 2.9%...).
Now, these might be the exception to the rule in the rest of the world. But not in mine. Not to say I haven't had experienced, knowledgeable sales pros. Just not often...
And, no offense to the pros here. I'm sure I'd enjoy not only buying a car from y'all but just talkin' too! I'm easy to spot, I like to wear a baby seal costume when I car shop...!
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
There is nothing much you can do about a stupid customer - it really comes with territory. I'd dare to say your industry (automotive retail) groomed a special kind through decades of its practices - you know, those rampant fees, mop&glo, "sticker means nothing" approach, insulting screamer ads, etc. Those who don't have time and inclination to put some real time into learning the way of your business, take from this that "anything and everything is possible" - if so making $15K offer on $25K Sienna is not as outrageous in their mind, as you think (especially that I'm sure your Used Car Manager made some similar bids being on the other side, hasn't he?).
Why is it they come to Best Buy and pick up that new iPod or Bluray never asking what is invoice on it, or what the markup is? Most don't question the price because they know it's a real one. It's printed in the paper, posted on the merchandise and when you go to register "beep" - yes you guessed, it's one on your receipt. You guys in the business chose to go different way - for hope of a "whale" home run customer, you decided it's better to approach every single transaction from top profit. In exchange you have to cope with those wild shots. They think "Sticker is $25K for that Sienna. Let me try $15K - last week Best Buy had 50% off on couple of TVs, so 20% off isn't probably big deal". Best Buy and Sears are their point of reference. Those more educated (but not thoroughly) may actually have read about the invoices. However, they also read about holdbacks, bonuses and what not, so they go and shoot for tripple net and expect you to take it, even if you just sold fifteen of those last month for five hundred under sticker. For them, you making one dollar profit is one dollar too much. Then you have a former domestic customer. Last deal he/she got five thousand cash back and zero percent loan. They don't understand concept of demand and price adjustment. All they know is before it was this and now you want that. The only way you can do is say "I believe my product is worth more and the market did not force us to make such deals - if you can't live with that go and buy that Impala again".
One more thing - surveys show again and again that worst buying experience comes from stores like yours, i.e. large volume import superstores (Nissan, Toyota, Mitsubishi, Honda tend to be lowest customer satisfaction from purchasing process). The culprits must be the ones in charge - the owners and managers. You have superior product and lower margins, being surrounded by guys having exact opposite. That must be a toxic combination when it comes to creating customer experience. They want your product, but those other guys offer them "deals", so they want "deals" from you, too. You offer none (today it's more like you offer less), on top of which your owners tell you "we want more from each purchase". That must be a killer. Now, in worsening economy even you guys may have to watch it. Tables may turn, at least for short while, as it takes time to adjust production levels to lowered demands. If anything, you may experience even more spite, more people waiting "everything" from you and you may have to accept it more often than before. At least for now...
2018 430i Gran Coupe
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
How dumb is that? That will gaurantee that I look for another place to get my car serviced. And from what I read hear, the service dept. is a big profit center for a dealer.
And I withdraw my troll comment about you. You seem like a decent guy who is working at an old school dealership and is kind of down now. Follow the advice of other sales folks here that have been in your shoes, find a shop that fits your style.
Also, you'll find that the folks here not in the biz like myself are more of the customers you'd like, educated about the process and price, courteous and professional. You wouldn't make a killing on the sale with us but we won't waste your time and you'd get a perfect CSI.
So true when I worked at Honda.
The markups were tiny to begin with, so we had about $1200 to play with on a Civic.
When we came back with first pencil, it was about $240 off. Wow Mr Customer, what a deal!! we yelled!
Customers who were used to getting thousands off their domestics were almost insulted.
Then there were those who were looking for huige 0% financing, and as somebody metnioned earlier, I'd say: "Are you buying a car or an interest rate? Cause if you want a deal I heard the Cavaliers were being blown out for chump change!!"
The best one I heard from a customer when we did have 0%:
Customer: Can you do any better than that?
Me: ummm, what's better than 0%? You want me to pay you to finance the Honda? :confuse:
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Everyone likes to think they are. Now when I was in sales I can attest to the fact that a lot of my fellow sales professionals were sadly lacking in product knowledge. Not most but a decent percentage of them were, I would presume not much has changed in that respect, I also do remembering the occasional customer whose knowledge of my product surpassed mine (and I studied my a** off on ours and our competitors product). That being said I know that there are times when the customers product knowledge outweighs the salesman.
Now what I was saying is that Just because someone doesn't work at something doesn't me they don't know what goes on, I was also saying that for anyone it is important that they get feedback from people in order to grow. The same is true for any salesman, listen to what the customers are saying and you can learn something.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Customer: Can you do any better than that?
ROTFLMAO......That one takes home the trophy.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I know I would. If I can't walk around the showroom floor without being bothered then I'm going somewhere else. But that's what they want us to do.
If someone walks on the lot and god forbid they say..."we really aren't buying anything...we are just kicking tires" you have to go get a manger to talk to them.
You're right, that is annoying and very embarrassing. Out of curiosity, why do you still work there? Is there a better dealer you could go work for nearby? Even if you made less money, you'd be a great deal better off working with like-minded people. It's really too bad that businesses still try to do deals the way you describe. As a customer, I wouldn't spend two minutes there, and the sad thing is, only the pushy sales person will know why (and probably get reamed out for letting a customer go, too!)
I tend to be a patient person, but during car negotiations, I've been known to bring a timer, set it for 30 minutes and put it on the sales person's desk to get the deal done. If we can't agree in that time, I leave. If the sales person wastes that time disappearing to the back, that's too bad - I don't stop the timer unless I have to interrupt (which so far has never happened).
Good luck, I hope you find a great environment to work in!
So you think you've got it tough 'eh?
This morning at a Spring Valley, NY Wal-Mart a sales associate was killed by a mob of bargain hunters bursting through the door at opening. They also trampled a pregnant woman but she'll survive.
What's next, beating the car salesman with a bat until he comes down another $100?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Poor guy getting killed for what, $6/hour... not sure what minimum wage is now here or US.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Well in this case I blame Wal-Mart too. They probably ran a big ad with a few below cost loss-leaders to get the bargain hunters all ramped up. So they attracted the very cheap selfish bastards that would step on granny's head to get in the door to save a buck.
You car guys must have to deal with this also. Do your dealerships run screamer ads that only a fool would believe? So who comes knuckle-dragging in looking for that $99 a month payment, probably not the guy with sterling credit.
One local dealer near me is running ads called "Steal A Deal". As part of the commercial they say: "You can drive away our cars without paying anything and we won't even call the cops!".
I can't wait to see the nut jobs that brings out. :sick:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
That's funny. We were there in September and there were 6 new babies coming back on that flight, that I saw. Almost made me want to have another one......for about 5 seconds.
The driving millimeters apart is true too. We cringed as the bus just missed cars and bikes by a small stream of air. They have traffic lights but not everyone obeys. Somehow there are few accidents and we didn't see any dented or rusted cars.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Right on!And same with Points ABCD.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
But how many forums out there are set up so the customers can rag on what you do and how poorly you do it?
Maybe there needs to be a forum where people can go an critique other sales professions and pick apart everything they do.
Sounds good...maybe I'll start one up.
Me: "Welcome to Toyota of XYZ...my name is Alejandro. How can I assist you today?"
Customer: "How many miles does that Lexus have on it?" (Points to the Lexus right outside the showroom).
Me: "39,000 sir"
Customer: "That's to many miles for that price..."(walks away from me and leaves the showroom). And the best part is that he kinda waved me off with his hand too.
I can't tell you how much I wanted to drop that guy.
When we started the adoption process - not for fertility reasons; just seemed like a good thing to do - we got about halfway through and my wife got pregnant. We ended up going through with things and since my wife had to stay home with a nine month old I took my oldest daughter, then 13, along to help. So my youngest bio and my adopted daughter are actually born the same day. We'll never know which one is older. They're both 7 now. The older ones are 19 and 16.
I lay low....
Moo -have some real fun - get a bike for your travels!...
I stayed in my seat and pretended I was emailing a customer....
Another salesmen just got him. Sounds like a pure stroke. Customer doesn't know a thing about Toyotas.....I can see the sticker shock setting in.
I did the same thing but as a salesman. I would tell the customer it would only take so many minutes and I would set the timer for that many minutes and when it went off I stopped and tried to close the deal. It worked very well.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Classic. I can spot the strokes a mile away.
Probably went home to get a grocery bag to hold the 100K he just spent on the 3 Camarys he bought.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Its probably out there, Just have to look.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
2018 430i Gran Coupe