Pretty much. I have no intention of allowing some guy who treated me poorly to earn a commission on a sale, when i can go to another dealership and work with a salesperson who treats me well.
I'd want a good price, but I'd rather pay a little bit extra and work with someone who is helpful and courteous.
sense...yes, the product was there for the taking, but there are times one would like to be treated with some semblance of respect, and to give the jerk the sale only reinforces him to be a jerk, whereas letting him or the dealer know why they lost a sale does give one some satisfaction, esp if the product is available at other dealers as well...
We may drool when we see the car we want, but when the dealer acts like an idiot, it is the wise person who does not succumb to the car and wakes up to flip the bird at the dealer...no car is worth be treated like trash, and a simple opening of the door (forget sexism, it is simple courtesy to open the door for a man or a woman, and ask them to sit in the car to get the feel of it), if not performed, and treated like trash, ain't worth the aggravation...after all, then she would have to negotiate with the jerk, and who wants to move to step 2 when step 1 was a disaster???
Maybe you've never had a customer "wrap up" the deal without driving the car, only to have him/her gripe about it having 30 miles on it, or the wrong tires, or whatever, but I have.
I've also made up my mind long ago that customers unwilling to do REASONABLE things (like driving the car first, or filling out name, address, and phone number) are ANYTHING but easy deals... There are basic fundamentals that just don't take very long, or involve any teeth pulling, that you just shouldn't skip. If you do, you're costing yourself money, and that's not just the manager in me talking. I did it (the motions) today on a mini. If NOTHING else, it gave me an opportunity to make a friend and ensure the survey. A wham, bam, thank you ma'am deal is a recipe for DISASTER with regards to the survey... not to mention they never really go that way anyway.
You do work in the car business right? Seriously, have you EVER had a "I'll pay this and not a penny more" deal go SMOOTHLY? The grinder thinks it would if we'd just do it their way, but in reality, it's ALWAYS something with them isn't it?
how were you car sales after 9-11? it seems to me that we kind of owe gm some credit for kick starting auto sales(and maybe a lot of other industries) with their 0% financing after that. it may have hurt their company in the longer run, but they had the courage to try it.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
We had people buying cars just to drive home (flights cancelled and all)...
It was eerie, and I think everyone was in shock everywhere (even in Colorado). I remember our boss wanted us to make cold calls and I told him to "go blank yourself" and walked out :mad: . I couldn't get over the nerve of him wanting us to cold call people on such a day of tragedy.
He called me 2 hours later to apologize. I still lost a lot of respect for him after that though.
Strangely enough, Honda (who I was working for at the time), didn't offer 0% or huge rebates post-911 and still posted record months. I really don't think GM had too, even though it boosted them temporarily.
Didnt know what interest rate these people would ( or wouldnt) qualify for. Payment was going to be vastly different then anything we told them probably.
When I think back to the last car we purchased, I am pretty sure the salesman did not open the door for me but I still let him earn an enormoue commission from the sale. Now I feel like I was cheated.
I tell you, it won't happen again. I will dive through an open window before I will open a car door by myself. A man has to have a little dignity.
So if someone walks in says i will buy this car for X amount of dollars and you knew that you couldn't sell the car you would still go through the motions? Why?
Maybe you've never had a customer "wrap up" the deal without driving the car, only to have him/her gripe about it having 30 miles on it, or the wrong tires, or whatever, but I have.
But doesn't that also happen if you went through all the motions.
I've also made up my mind long ago that customers unwilling to do REASONABLE things (like driving the car first, or filling out name, address, and phone number) are ANYTHING but easy deals...
Here is the thing, if I have already test driven the car then another test drive is meaningless and a waste of time. Is it unreasonable for me to refuse another test drive?
The grinder thinks it would .....
Who is talking about grinders? I am talking about someone who states that they are willing to pay a certain amount for a car. Say your lowest price for that 2007 sludgemobile LX is $20,000 and someone comes in saying "I will buy it for $18,000 and no more" then why go through all the motions?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
"So if someone walks in says i will buy this car for X amount of dollars and you knew that you couldn't sell the car you would still go through the motions? Why?"
Because maybe I'd be able to convince him/her to pay more. I know you probably find it hard to believe, but I consider myself a SALESMAN and not an order taker. I pride myself on persuading people to buy things they weren't originally planning on. It's Sales 101.
If I can't (which happens a lot in sales), then I don't lose any sleep. But sometimes, it really pays off.
"But doesn't that also happen if you went through all the motions."
Nope. I've never had a customer stop the deal cold because of the 30 miles on the car AFTER we test drive it. Why? Because by test driving it, it ISN'T a surprise anymore. The customer loses that "I wanted one that hasn't been test driven, because it isn't really "new" if it has been" objection. Same for features and options. If you drive it first, you'd be amazed how many things can't come back to bite you.
"Here is the thing, if I have already test driven the car then another test drive is meaningless and a waste of time. Is it unreasonable for me to refuse another test drive?"
Yes. Because if you won't even take it around the block with me if I ask, it can open up a big can of worms later. It's not THAT hard for you to spend 10 minutes of your precious time to drive the car you are supposedly going to BUY around the block to make sure it's exactly what you want. If it is, you aren't that serious. Are there exceptions to that? Sure... occasionally. Is it overwhelmingly true though??? Yup.
"Who is talking about grinders? I am talking about someone who states that they are willing to pay a certain amount for a car. Say your lowest price for that 2007 sludgemobile LX is $20,000 and someone comes in saying "I will buy it for $18,000 and no more" then why go through all the motions?"
I suppose it's how you define grinder. Again, I go through the motions because I am a SALESPERSON not an order taker. If the customer gets mad because I won't write them up without a test drive, my general manager/owner stands behind ME 100%.
We don't cave in just because people might get upset. We aren't loser parents here
If we end up not being able to come to terms, no biggie. I had a customer today who offered $20000.00 as a difference figure on a vehicle (which we couldn't do). I guess I should have just said no and let him on his way eh?
Funny thing is, he's driving his new truck tonight, and he paid a difference of $21534.00.
I didn't get high fives or pats on the back from my bosses. It ended up only being a $454.00 gross profit in the end. But I did my JOB, he's a happy customer, and we have one less truck.
Excellent post, T. That's actually a good refresher for us sales guys to remember.
I had a customer come in on an ad deal on a Frontier. He picks it out and doesn't want to test drive. I bring him inside and put him at my desk. I show him numbers and he agrees to do business. The front is definitely a mini, but the back end is around a 4 pounder. That deal helped to put me into another bonus level.
He gets out of finance and he drives the vehicle home. The next day he is in service because the tires are worn wrong. That particular vehicle had been sitting on the lot for a long time and needed new tires because of the flat spots. The deal eventually blows out because of a fumble by service.
All of that could have been avoided if I just took a couple minutes to test drive. No, you're not going to have something like that happen every time. But a professional salesperson needs to do his job and not shortcut. Just remind the customer, you may have driven a Yugo before, but you haven't driven THIS Yugo.
As far as the grinder comment, there is no way for us to know that an offer will not be raised without trying.
I had a lady offer 17k drive-out on a Civic Lx auto Sedan today. At our dealership, that is about a 2k bracket deal on the vehicle. I still tried to see if she would bump. Granted, that's a big bump. But I tried, I want to make sure that I've exhausted all possibilities with my customers before I let them roll off the lot without a new car.
What other methods are there to present figures other than four-square or the Grant Cardon ePencil? Someone mentioned a purchase order, how does that work? At what term and rate do you present the purchse order form? Just curious, its good to learn about other techniques used around the country...here's what we use http://www.cardonegroup.com/cardone/inhousenine.htm
I guess I must go about this in the opposite direction. I ASSUME (which can be dangerous) that the car I'm interested in doesn't have bad tires, and that everything works the way it's supposed to work. I've usually got a pretty good idea about the performance of any vehicle before I walk in, too.
So, before I waste everyone's time, I want to be sure that we've got the numbers I'm looking for before I get behind the wheel for a test drive. If the numbers don't work, the test drive isn't going to change my mind. If the numbers work, and the car performs to my expectations, it ends up to be a pretty easy deal, on both ends.
Plus, I don't want that "new car smell" to get in the way of getting to a deal. I don't usually get caught up in the "oohh....ahhh" of that shiny new car.
I don't need an order taker, either. Today's cars have enough "gee-gaws" that I need the salesperson to demonstrate them to me...as well as to make sure the test drive goes smoothly. Past that, the numbers are still going to be what makes me break out my checkbook or not. If I'm walking into the dealership, it already means I think enough about your product to walk through your door.
These aren't rules set in stone, but they are excellent guidelines. The test drive is one way to get the customer's interest piqued again and a way to make sure all is well with the vehicle.
If someone is adamant in not test driving, you move on and sell a car the best way you can. A good salesperson adapts to each customer. They won't ALL play by the rules.
That doesn't look like a very good setup for your numbers. It looks like an orderly mess to me. Our dealership just writes out what all the fees are and bottom it down on a buyer's order. I don't think the Cardone group ever heard of K.I.S.S.
I agree, I am flexible and will move with the customer accordingly. A new car comes with warranty, both powertrain and bumper-to-bumper, so if a customer will not test drive, I know that everything will be taken care of.
Now a used car (I deal with both) is a different story. 2 months ago a guy bought a Taurus from me and then called me 1 1/2 later saying the rear driver window didnt work and that the car jerked while running. Now this guy did NOT want to test drive the car by any means, even after I tried a manager intervention to cover my [non-permissible content removed] (in retrospect I'm glad I did). I of course get his record info and even though I know he bought the car as-is and even though I offered warranty and of course F&I also offered warranty, I still politely asked if he bought the warranty. OF course he said no, and that its our responsibility and that he would get a lawyer. I told him that I would do him the favor of looking at the car and finding out what was wrong. He tells me he hasn't driven the car because of x-y-z reason and that it was like that when he bought it. Of course, no test drive... :-D .Anyways, I still generously tell him to bring it down and we'll look at it. Even after all that he keeps flapping his mouth about the lemon law and a lawyer that I had enough. First off, he didn't test drive and declined warranty several times even though he was made aware of the as-is condition. Second, it took him a month and a half to decide to give me a call. Third, lemon laws as far as I'm conscerned in Texas only apply to new vehicles after 3 attempts have been unsuccesssfully made to repair/fix a vehicle problem.
That's why I feel test drives are important, because you want to test everything and make sure everything is fine. Last thing a customer and salesperson want is someone who did not test drive a vehile to come back because 'it drives funny' or 'it feels like it pulls to one side' and to make matters worse have absolute no warranty or extention of the warranty on the vehicle...
I pride myself on persuading people to buy things they weren't originally planning on. It's Sales 101.
Trust me I used to be in sales so I know that. Thats one of the reasons I avoid salespeople like the plague when I am in a decision making process. People like me when we start talking price have done everything we need to do to figure out what we want. All that we need to do is set a price and have our order taken.
Nope. I've never had a customer stop the deal cold because of the 30 miles on the car AFTER we test drive it. Why? Because by test driving it, it ISN'T a surprise anymore.
I would think anyone who is surprised that there is 30 miles on a car isn't an informed buyer.
Same for features and options. If you drive it first, you'd be amazed how many things can't come back to bite you.
Again this is a hypothetical situation where the customer has test driven the car previously.
Yes. Because if you won't even take it around the block with me if I ask, it can open up a big can of worms later. It's not THAT hard for you to spend 10 minutes of your precious time to drive the car you are supposedly going to BUY around the block to make sure it's exactly what you want.
But I already have test driven the car, I already have spent 10 minutes in the car and then some. Did they make any changes in the car between the time they made this particular one and the one I just test drove a week ago?
I suppose it's how you define grinder.
True but I would not expect that someone who uses the Bobst method would be a grinder. I would think that label would go to someone who does an extra ordinary amount od negotiations to save very little money.
Again, I go through the motions because I am a SALESPERSON not an order taker.
Granted, but when I go and start talking price the sale has been done. I am going to buy that new Sludgemobile LX with a certain option package in a certain range of colors. The only question is at what price and from who. And to be honest if I have decided thats the car I want and ask for negotiations to start and you insist on the test drive I will look for another salesman.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
In a perfect world, everything would indeed work the way it was supposed to, and the car would be equipped exactly like you THOUGHT it was, before you so much as looked at it.
The problem is, obviously, we don't live in a perfect world
Cars have such a myriad of differences these days that if you don't actually put your hands on the one you want, you'd better not complain.
I mentioned tires as one of the issues because in my earlier career I had a customer FREAK out because there were Firestone tires on a truck. We of course just skipped the test drive to save time because he had "already driven one", and it ended up making me look like an idiot to my desk manager. Some people ASSUME because one the test drove down the street had Goodyears that they just ALL do. Interior color is another that comes to mind...
What if it had a big scratch on it, or even a little damage? Personally, I don't want a "new" car that has damage, even if you repair it. Paint/Body work has a funny way of never being done 100% right...
What if instead of 30 miles, it had 260? Do you still consider that new? Honestly, were it my money, I probably would see if there was another one FIRST.
What if the person that test drove it before you smelled like cat pee mixed with cigarette smoke? It happened once, and it took one of you "I don't need a test drive" folks to buy it (I have to admit, in that case it kinda worked out :P ).
I suppose if they're so lazy they can't spend 10 minutes inspecting a car they are going to spend thousands of dollars on it's their perogative.
I will continue to test drive and walk-around EVERY car I sell. I really don't encounter much resistance, and if I do, it becomes comedy hour at my desk :P
T
PS: ANOTHER reason why I will show/test drive a car again, even if another dealer just did, is that is that I SEE the quality of the "average" salesperson these days.
It's a competitve world. I'm better than average. If you got a walk-around for Joe-Schmo at ABC, I may just blow your mind with mine. I won't trust my paycheck to the possible work of a guy that thinks it's "got a V-4".
Just a good thing to remember if you're in sales and encounter a "grinder" or a "I don't need to"...
I personally like it because there is less travel back and forth to the desk. In other words, with the worksheet, I can roll down the term, work on the downpayment, show them the price on the car/truck, their trade value, taxes, trade balance and bottom line. The only reason I would go back to the desk is with a credit app or repencil on a model down/different model.
Now if they just want 'monthly payment' and dont care about anything else, then the 4square comes handy.
I'll normally ask the desk to start me at their current payment regardless of how much downpayment is needed to reach their payment (they pay $320 on their 03/ need $9K for same payment). Then the customer gets off the "keep payments the same" and I keep my word of keeping their payments the same. Of course I never ask "how much down?" Then the customer knows to either move to a model down (Lariat to an XLT) or will pay more for what they want.
Bingo you got it. You put it into the words I couldn't.
Plus, I don't want that "new car smell" to get in the way of getting to a deal. I don't usually get caught up in the "oohh....ahhh" of that shiny new car.
Thats why I never buy a car the day I test drive it. You have to let the euphoria of the test drive fade and look at it in a more rational light. Don't let the salesperson strike while the iron is hot.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
And to be honest if I have decided thats the car I want and ask for negotiations to start and you insist on the test drive I will look for another salesman.
And we would all breathe a collective sigh of relief. Snake reminds me of a woman who came into our dealership with her boyfriend and accused the dealership of manufacturing Monroney labels. :confuse: He'd start an argument with a tree stump and somehow he'd still find a way not to make his point.
You're one customer that perhaps this doesn't apply to, we'd find a way around your not wanting to take a test drive. I have NEVER had anyone leave because I asked them to test drive though. We either politely did it or didn't do it. It IS your choice in the end.
"Trust me I used to be in sales so I know that. Thats one of the reasons I avoid salespeople like the plague when I am in a decision making process. People like me when we start talking price have done everything we need to do to figure out what we want. All that we need to do is set a price and have our order taken."
I am the Internet Manager for my store. Please tell me how to tell if you're an "informed buyer" or just someone pretending. You can't. And if you claim that you can, you're wrong. Just because you come up with a price does not make you informed. Sorry.
"I would think anyone who is surprised that there is 30 miles on a car isn't an informed buyer."
You'd think wrong. A lot of people freak out at more than 6 miles on a "new" car. There are forums with people who whine about it... lol.
"But I already have test driven the car, I already have spent 10 minutes in the car and then some. Did they make any changes in the car between the time they made this particular one and the one I just test drove a week ago?"
Yes. Read my reply to the guy above.
"True but I would not expect that someone who uses the Bobst method would be a grinder. I would think that label would go to someone who does an extra ordinary amount od negotiations to save very little money."
So you try and bypass it by not doing the song and dance? I'm still going to try and get all the $$$. You're still going to want to pay X. Let the grind begin. And don't act like it's our responsibility just to take an offer if we can... we are a BUSINESS.
"Granted, but when I go and start talking price the sale has been done. I am going to buy that new Sludgemobile LX with a certain option package in a certain range of colors. The only question is at what price and from who. And to be honest if I have decided thats the car I want and ask for negotiations to start and you insist on the test drive I will look for another salesman."
And I won't lose any sleep. They are in no danger of buying a car. And even if they were, I'd just irritate them more anyway.
If they want to take their ball and go home because I won't play by their rules (when mine involve 10 minutes or less to protect BOTH of us), then fine. I'm going to stand up at the tower and make sure the salesman that gets them ends up wasting way more of their time though (because I'm going to metaphorically chase them and pop their ball, without them knowing it, just because they irritated ME lol :P).
I suppose if they're so lazy they can't spend 10 minutes inspecting a car they are going to spend thousands of dollars on it's their perogative.
Now don't get me wrong I am not saying don't inspect the vehicle (including driving it) before accepting delivery. All I am saying is that I am not going to do it unless I know I have a deal.
Would you accept this then "I will buy this 2007 Sludgemobile LX for $18,000.00 provided the vehicle I am taking delivery on passes a basic visual and driven inspection for mechanical defects"?
To be honest at this point in time the only reason I would reject the car if it had a defect, such as pulling to one side, a shimmy, broken window, dent or something like that. Then if they had another of an acceptable color we can try that.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I am the Internet Manager for my store. Please tell me how to tell if you're an "informed buyer" or just someone pretending. You can't.
I know you can't but some things you have to take on faith until evidence of the contrary comes to light. On the other side of the coin how do I know that you can tell me anything about the car that isn't on the sticker? To be honest ever since that subaru salesman started looking for the other two spark plug wires after I pointed out that the engine he was saying was a V-6 only had 4 spark plug wires I never listened to a thing a salesman has told me. That is except for the price.
You'd think wrong. A lot of people freak out at more than 6 miles on a "new" car. There are forums with people who whine about it... lol.
Again they are not informed, the key word is informed.
So you try and bypass it by not doing the song and dance? I'm still going to try and get all the $$$. You're still going to want to pay X. Let the grind begin. And don't act like it's our responsibility just to take an offer if we can... we are a BUSINESS.
Granted but its not my business to pay more than I think its worth. Salespeople say it all the time they are not charities, so if your not one I am not going to just give you money. So if I make an offer you have three options, accept it (and we have a deal), counter offer (and we negotiate) or refuse it (in which case I rescind my offer and be on my merry way).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
You'd think wrong. A lot of people freak out at more than 6 miles on a "new" car. There are forums with people who whine about it... lol.
This is the truth. If you haven't been in the business you are missing out on all the 'quirks' that otherwise normal people have. Miles on a car? How about 'I will never buy a vehicle that someone else f**ted in. It's got to have less than 3 miles on it.'
Actually, that is an interesting question. What do you guys do when someone wants a test drive, but you know they have no interest in buying, or won't qualify for a loan.
I get very creative. If its a specialty piece like an S-2000 I just say that we dont test drive until we have agreed on numbers and gotten an approval for financing. If its a run of the mill car I will put off enough negative vibes that they usually dont want to test drive. And sometimes I have to just come out and say " are you really planning on purchasing this car or were you just wanting a joyride?"
Before we bought our Acura, I read about the many problems these cars have had in recent years. I made a list of these problems.
After they accepted our offers, we went on a test drive. Since I easily get distracted, I told the sales person to say absolutely nothing as we were driving. He complied.
I checked my list to make sure the car did not have the problems others had mentioned. Then we bought the car and we have been enjoying it ever since.
We had the same experience when we bought our Honda last year, except the sales person did not come along on the test drive.
Why would you work out the numbers first and then drive the car?
Seems backwards to me. Why make an offer on a car you might not even like?
And, I'm sorry, but telling your salesperson to say absolutely nothing is just plain rude. Most smart salespeople can sense it when the driver wants a quiet salesperson and will adjust accordingly.
Even if your salesperson wasn't that perceptive, telling him to keep his mouth shot was beyond rude. Sorry.
As a sales person, I could see why the test drive goes first so as to get the customer to fall in love with the car and hopefully pay more. But as a customer, it doesn't matter what goes first, the negotiation or the test drive, as I can understand both arguments. Why bother with the test drive if we can't agree on price? Why bother negotiating if I don't like the car during the test drive.
Now a used car (I deal with both) is a different story. 2 months ago a guy bought a Taurus from me and then called me 1 1/2 later saying the rear driver window didnt work and that the car jerked while running. Now this guy did NOT want to test drive the car by any means, even after I tried a manager intervention to cover my [non-permissible content removed] (in retrospect I'm glad I did).
To not want to take a test drive when buying a used car is insane. Not that you could have done anything about it but right then and there you should have known that this guy was not put together right. 'You can lead a horse to water but you can't get them to drink', would certainly apply here.
Thinking of that incident still upsets me now
This tells me that you are a pretty conscientious person. You tried but failed to reason with this dope but you can't do anything about it now.
It's nice to know that there is another good guy in the biz.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
It's a win-win for both customer and salesperson. I guess a customer might feel that they are going to become attached and pay more, but you've already done your research and know what you're supposed to pay, right?!
This almost seems like much ado about nothing. In these situations, I've even had them drive around the parking lot, just to make sure we're okay. Simple and painless.
Why would you work out the numbers first and then drive the car?
Seems backwards to me. Why make an offer on a car you might not even like?
The thing I am trying to present is when someone already has test driven the car. Maybe not that day, maybe not at that dealership, but some time in the recent past has test driven it.
Case in point last Labor day weekend me and she who must be obeyed test drove the Lincoln MKX at a lincoln sponsored event. We drove the car a considerable time on the regular roads in the area. My wife loved the car (I didn't think it to shabby either). Now if we decide to buy one and stop by a Lincoln dealership why test drive it again if we don't have a deal? We already like the car, the only thing we would do on a test drive is inspect it. Now why do that if there might not be a deal?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Before I was ever in this business, I bought at least two new cars that I didn't drive. I knew they would be just fine.
I don't care if a customer has no interest in driving the car. I always ask several times. If they flat refuse, no problem. I just don't like it when we reach an agreement, shake hands, and THEN, they want to drive it to make sure they like it!
isell...it may be backwards, but I've got a pretty good idea of how the car is going to be before I walk into the dealership. Unless I'm shocked or surprised about something during the test drive, the only thing I really need is someone to show me how the features work on the car.
If we can't agree on the numbers, the test drive isn't going to matter, anyway. I would think that it would save the sales person and myself time, without doing a test drive if we aren't going to agree on the numbers. Honda makes fine cars. I'm going to assume that nothing is going to be amiss during the test drive anyway.
I think most of us read the car reviews. I think we are the types that go to car shows, sit in the vehicles, touch everything before we've even made a trip to the dealership.
I will admit, I'm a stickler on color and options. I'm not so much of sa stickler on whether the car has 6 or 60 demo miles on it, though.
I mentioned in an earlier post about one of the great salesmen at our dealership. He's small and unassuming and sells a ton of cars. He sold 12 cars between Saturday and Sunday and has 3-4 more going out today.
Sick. Just sick. Apparently the special financing is helping.
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during negotiations? Maybe 50%
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during the test drive? Maybe 10%
So if you do the math, both the customer and salesman's time can be saved if negotiations happen first. Of course it depends on how long each process takes as well.
I just don't like it when we reach an agreement, shake hands, and THEN, they want to drive it to make sure they like it!
That's the point really isn't it? YOU don't like it. However being the consumate professional that you are I imagine you mentally shake your head. I hope you are not rude enough to show your dislike.
As I said with me its a case of the fact that somewhere recently I drove that car so its not a case of testing it to make sure I like it. I will test it to make sure there is nothing obviously wrong with the car, but only after we agree on a deal (its really of no use if we don't have a deal).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during negotiations? Maybe 50%
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during the test drive? Maybe 10%
HUH? I think you need to look at these numbers again. This means that, if you've test driven 10 cars in your life, you've bought 9 of them. This also means you are 90% certain you are buying a car before you even sit inside. There is NO WAY these numbers apply to me. On average, I probably try out 5-6 cars before deciding on one, then, at the most, 3 dealers to make a deal. So that means: fell apart during test drive = 83% fell apart during negotiations = 66%
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
"The thing I am trying to present is when someone already has test driven the car. Maybe not that day, maybe not at that dealership, but some time in the recent past has test driven it."
True, but you are also forgetting what may be DIFFERENT about even the same car from dealership to dealership. And even if you are on the EXACT same car at the EXACT same dealership, what if the last person who test drove it curbed the car? Or put an extra 100 miles on it because he wanted to show it to his relatives first, and then the deal fell through?
You can tell me "those things don't matter to an informed person", but do you really think that's true?
What's the big deal? You drive it around (heck I'd even settle for the parking lot), and that's that...
Are you THAT worried you'll fall head over heels and lose all control??? We aren't selling Claudia Schiffer If you're really as informed as you think you are, you'll be ok, I promise...
The reason WHY it matters is because if we do it AFTER we agree on everything (or make it subject to your approval), we end up wasting a lot of unnecessary time if, after ALL the negotiations are over, it's ends up failing your approval.
Instead, if whatever may be wrong with the car is found out FIRST, we can see if we have a different one, or at worst, see if we can trade for one.
If we do it your way, all that really changes is you might save a whopping ten minutes...
If I get a customer that I feel they have no interest in buying or is just wasting my time with a joyride, I'll close them even harder for fun and make them feel they shouldn't have stopped by with me. Before the testdrive, I'll ask for ids, proof of insurance and fill out information on them, where they work and how long they have worked there. Then after the ride, I'll tell them to park in the very front and away from THEIR car and tell them I gotta show them something inside the dealership that won't take long and be very quick. And then I go to work! I start filling out a credit app with the info I got and I already have their insurance and license copied so some paperwork partly done. If they really aren't serious they usually start asking questions on what I am doing and why I'm filling out a credit app to which I respond, "So you can take the car home today buddy! You don't mean to tell me you drove all the way to my dealership to not be able to take it home, right?" Then I go back to filling out the app. Then that's when they start fidgeting and making excuses of having to go back to work, on lunch, pickup dog at vet, pickup sister/brother/grandpa at bingo, etc. I listen, tell them I understand and tell them I will finish running their credit info and will take the paperwork to their home that night since I have their address from their id AND if they are not home I will wait for them outside. I do keep all the paperwork in case they call the next day and ask where I was (none have done that). Heck, I don't even think they went home that night or got home very late!
When it comes to consumables, its a completely different story because beer won't last more than a night, is replaced almost instantly (hell you can drink two beers at once!) and the cost is not much.
A car you will see and feel everyday you go to work, pickup the kids, take the wife out shopping, etc. Of course, like mentioned early, you can't force someone to do something, so it comes down to flexibility
What if the salespersons job has already been done? Then I would do it with MORE determination and MORE positive energy because you didn't buy from THAT salesperson for a reason...hmmm
what if the last person who test drove it curbed the car?
Please notice I am not saying take delivery on the car without inspecting it (which would include a test drive), but to get the deal first before hand. Otherwise there is no point in doing the inspection. If the deal falls through there won't be another deal at the dealership. If the car fails inspection in most cases there is a good chance of a subsitute car on the lot (i.e same make model and options and either the same color or an acceptable color subsitute).
What's the big deal? You drive it around (heck I'd even settle for the parking lot), and that's that...
I would never buy a car if all my driving of it were in a parking lot.
The reason WHY it matters is because if we do it AFTER we agree on everything (or make it subject to your approval), we end up wasting a lot of unnecessary time if, after ALL the negotiations are over, it's ends up failing your approval.
The converse is also true. we could do the test drive (remember I am there after test driving it before) find that everything meets my approval and it all falls apart because of the deal? As I said if the deal falls there is no deal, if the car fails there could be other cars to replace it.
If we do it your way, all that really changes is you might save a whopping ten minutes...
First of all ten minutes can be a lot of time depending on circumstances. Secondly it takes longer than that to test drive a car, I mean how long does it take to even bring the car out front?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Comments
Makes sense to me.
I'd want a good price, but I'd rather pay a little bit extra and work with someone who is helpful and courteous.
We may drool when we see the car we want, but when the dealer acts like an idiot, it is the wise person who does not succumb to the car and wakes up to flip the bird at the dealer...no car is worth be treated like trash, and a simple opening of the door (forget sexism, it is simple courtesy to open the door for a man or a woman, and ask them to sit in the car to get the feel of it), if not performed, and treated like trash, ain't worth the aggravation...after all, then she would have to negotiate with the jerk, and who wants to move to step 2 when step 1 was a disaster???
Maybe you've never had a customer "wrap up" the deal without driving the car, only to have him/her gripe about it having 30 miles on it, or the wrong tires, or whatever, but I have.
I've also made up my mind long ago that customers unwilling to do REASONABLE things (like driving the car first, or filling out name, address, and phone number) are ANYTHING but easy deals... There are basic fundamentals that just don't take very long, or involve any teeth pulling, that you just shouldn't skip. If you do, you're costing yourself money, and that's not just the manager in me talking. I did it (the motions) today on a mini. If NOTHING else, it gave me an opportunity to make a friend and ensure the survey. A wham, bam, thank you ma'am deal is a recipe for DISASTER with regards to the survey... not to mention they never really go that way anyway.
You do work in the car business right? Seriously, have you EVER had a "I'll pay this and not a penny more" deal go SMOOTHLY? The grinder thinks it would if we'd just do it their way, but in reality, it's ALWAYS something with them isn't it?
T
It created an environment where traditional financing is spat at when 0% isn't available. Suddenly even dirt-bag credit thinks 6% is "way too high".
Great at first, but it sealed GM's fate.
T
It was eerie, and I think everyone was in shock everywhere (even in Colorado). I remember our boss wanted us to make cold calls and I told him to "go blank yourself" and walked out :mad: . I couldn't get over the nerve of him wanting us to cold call people on such a day of tragedy.
He called me 2 hours later to apologize. I still lost a lot of respect for him after that though.
Strangely enough, Honda (who I was working for at the time), didn't offer 0% or huge rebates post-911 and still posted record months. I really don't think GM had too, even though it boosted them temporarily.
So sad regardless
T
Gotcha, thanks for the reply!
Everything went very well and all of the guests were truly happy to see two such nice young people get married. That is what life is all about.
When I think back to the last car we purchased, I am pretty sure the salesman did not open the door for me but I still let him earn an enormoue commission from the sale. Now I feel like I was cheated.
I tell you, it won't happen again. I will dive through an open window before I will open a car door by myself. A man has to have a little dignity.
So if someone walks in says i will buy this car for X amount of dollars and you knew that you couldn't sell the car you would still go through the motions? Why?
Maybe you've never had a customer "wrap up" the deal without driving the car, only to have him/her gripe about it having 30 miles on it, or the wrong tires, or whatever, but I have.
But doesn't that also happen if you went through all the motions.
I've also made up my mind long ago that customers unwilling to do REASONABLE things (like driving the car first, or filling out name, address, and phone number) are ANYTHING but easy deals...
Here is the thing, if I have already test driven the car then another test drive is meaningless and a waste of time. Is it unreasonable for me to refuse another test drive?
The grinder thinks it would .....
Who is talking about grinders? I am talking about someone who states that they are willing to pay a certain amount for a car. Say your lowest price for that 2007 sludgemobile LX is $20,000 and someone comes in saying "I will buy it for $18,000 and no more" then why go through all the motions?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Because maybe I'd be able to convince him/her to pay more. I know you probably find it hard to believe, but I consider myself a SALESMAN and not an order taker. I pride myself on persuading people to buy things they weren't originally planning on. It's Sales 101.
If I can't (which happens a lot in sales), then I don't lose any sleep. But sometimes, it really pays off.
"But doesn't that also happen if you went through all the motions."
Nope. I've never had a customer stop the deal cold because of the 30 miles on the car AFTER we test drive it. Why? Because by test driving it, it ISN'T a surprise anymore. The customer loses that "I wanted one that hasn't been test driven, because it isn't really "new" if it has been" objection. Same for features and options. If you drive it first, you'd be amazed how many things can't come back to bite you.
"Here is the thing, if I have already test driven the car then another test drive is meaningless and a waste of time. Is it unreasonable for me to refuse another test drive?"
Yes. Because if you won't even take it around the block with me if I ask, it can open up a big can of worms later. It's not THAT hard for you to spend 10 minutes of your precious time to drive the car you are supposedly going to BUY around the block to make sure it's exactly what you want. If it is, you aren't that serious. Are there exceptions to that? Sure... occasionally. Is it overwhelmingly true though??? Yup.
"Who is talking about grinders? I am talking about someone who states that they are willing to pay a certain amount for a car. Say your lowest price for that 2007 sludgemobile LX is $20,000 and someone comes in saying "I will buy it for $18,000 and no more" then why go through all the motions?"
I suppose it's how you define grinder. Again, I go through the motions because I am a SALESPERSON not an order taker. If the customer gets mad because I won't write them up without a test drive, my general manager/owner stands behind ME 100%.
We don't cave in just because people might get upset. We aren't loser parents here
If we end up not being able to come to terms, no biggie. I had a customer today who offered $20000.00 as a difference figure on a vehicle (which we couldn't do). I guess I should have just said no and let him on his way eh?
Funny thing is, he's driving his new truck tonight, and he paid a difference of $21534.00.
I didn't get high fives or pats on the back from my bosses. It ended up only being a $454.00 gross profit in the end. But I did my JOB, he's a happy customer, and we have one less truck.
T
I had a customer come in on an ad deal on a Frontier. He picks it out and doesn't want to test drive. I bring him inside and put him at my desk. I show him numbers and he agrees to do business. The front is definitely a mini, but the back end is around a 4 pounder. That deal helped to put me into another bonus level.
He gets out of finance and he drives the vehicle home. The next day he is in service because the tires are worn wrong. That particular vehicle had been sitting on the lot for a long time and needed new tires because of the flat spots. The deal eventually blows out because of a fumble by service.
All of that could have been avoided if I just took a couple minutes to test drive. No, you're not going to have something like that happen every time. But a professional salesperson needs to do his job and not shortcut. Just remind the customer, you may have driven a Yugo before, but you haven't driven THIS Yugo.
As far as the grinder comment, there is no way for us to know that an offer will not be raised without trying.
I had a lady offer 17k drive-out on a Civic Lx auto Sedan today. At our dealership, that is about a 2k bracket deal on the vehicle. I still tried to see if she would bump. Granted, that's a big bump.
There's my ramblings. I can't sleep tonight.
http://www.cardonegroup.com/cardone/inhousenine.htm
So, before I waste everyone's time, I want to be sure that we've got the numbers I'm looking for before I get behind the wheel for a test drive. If the numbers don't work, the test drive isn't going to change my mind. If the numbers work, and the car performs to my expectations, it ends up to be a pretty easy deal, on both ends.
Plus, I don't want that "new car smell" to get in the way of getting to a deal. I don't usually get caught up in the "oohh....ahhh" of that shiny new car.
I don't need an order taker, either. Today's cars have enough "gee-gaws" that I need the salesperson to demonstrate them to me...as well as to make sure the test drive goes smoothly. Past that, the numbers are still going to be what makes me break out my checkbook or not. If I'm walking into the dealership, it already means I think enough about your product to walk through your door.
If someone is adamant in not test driving, you move on and sell a car the best way you can. A good salesperson adapts to each customer. They won't ALL play by the rules.
That doesn't look like a very good setup for your numbers. It looks like an orderly mess to me. Our dealership just writes out what all the fees are and bottom it down on a buyer's order. I don't think the Cardone group ever heard of K.I.S.S.
Now a used car (I deal with both) is a different story. 2 months ago a guy bought a Taurus from me and then called me 1 1/2 later saying the rear driver window didnt work and that the car jerked while running. Now this guy did NOT want to test drive the car by any means, even after I tried a manager intervention to cover my [non-permissible content removed] (in retrospect I'm glad I did). I of course get his record info and even though I know he bought the car as-is and even though I offered warranty and of course F&I also offered warranty, I still politely asked if he bought the warranty. OF course he said no, and that its our responsibility and that he would get a lawyer. I told him that I would do him the favor of looking at the car and finding out what was wrong. He tells me he hasn't driven the car because of x-y-z reason and that it was like that when he bought it. Of course, no test drive... :-D .Anyways, I still generously tell him to bring it down and we'll look at it. Even after all that he keeps flapping his mouth about the lemon law and a lawyer that I had enough. First off, he didn't test drive and declined warranty several times even though he was made aware of the as-is condition. Second, it took him a month and a half to decide to give me a call. Third, lemon laws as far as I'm conscerned in Texas only apply to new vehicles after 3 attempts have been unsuccesssfully made to repair/fix a vehicle problem.
That's why I feel test drives are important, because you want to test everything and make sure everything is fine. Last thing a customer and salesperson want is someone who did not test drive a vehile to come back because 'it drives funny' or 'it feels like it pulls to one side' and to make matters worse have absolute no warranty or extention of the warranty on the vehicle...
Thinking of that incident still upsets me now
Trust me I used to be in sales so I know that. Thats one of the reasons I avoid salespeople like the plague when I am in a decision making process. People like me when we start talking price have done everything we need to do to figure out what we want. All that we need to do is set a price and have our order taken.
Nope. I've never had a customer stop the deal cold because of the 30 miles on the car AFTER we test drive it. Why? Because by test driving it, it ISN'T a surprise anymore.
I would think anyone who is surprised that there is 30 miles on a car isn't an informed buyer.
Same for features and options. If you drive it first, you'd be amazed how many things can't come back to bite you.
Again this is a hypothetical situation where the customer has test driven the car previously.
Yes. Because if you won't even take it around the block with me if I ask, it can open up a big can of worms later. It's not THAT hard for you to spend 10 minutes of your precious time to drive the car you are supposedly going to BUY around the block to make sure it's exactly what you want.
But I already have test driven the car, I already have spent 10 minutes in the car and then some. Did they make any changes in the car between the time they made this particular one and the one I just test drove a week ago?
I suppose it's how you define grinder.
True but I would not expect that someone who uses the Bobst method would be a grinder. I would think that label would go to someone who does an extra ordinary amount od negotiations to save very little money.
Again, I go through the motions because I am a SALESPERSON not an order taker.
Granted, but when I go and start talking price the sale has been done. I am going to buy that new Sludgemobile LX with a certain option package in a certain range of colors. The only question is at what price and from who. And to be honest if I have decided thats the car I want and ask for negotiations to start and you insist on the test drive I will look for another salesman.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
The problem is, obviously, we don't live in a perfect world
Cars have such a myriad of differences these days that if you don't actually put your hands on the one you want, you'd better not complain.
I mentioned tires as one of the issues because in my earlier career I had a customer FREAK out because there were Firestone tires on a truck. We of course just skipped the test drive to save time because he had "already driven one", and it ended up making me look like an idiot to my desk manager. Some people ASSUME because one the test drove down the street had Goodyears that they just ALL do. Interior color is another that comes to mind...
What if it had a big scratch on it, or even a little damage? Personally, I don't want a "new" car that has damage, even if you repair it. Paint/Body work has a funny way of never being done 100% right...
What if instead of 30 miles, it had 260? Do you still consider that new? Honestly, were it my money, I probably would see if there was another one FIRST.
What if the person that test drove it before you smelled like cat pee mixed with cigarette smoke? It happened once, and it took one of you "I don't need a test drive" folks to buy it (I have to admit, in that case it kinda worked out :P ).
I suppose if they're so lazy they can't spend 10 minutes inspecting a car they are going to spend thousands of dollars on it's their perogative.
I will continue to test drive and walk-around EVERY car I sell. I really don't encounter much resistance, and if I do, it becomes comedy hour at my desk :P
T
PS: ANOTHER reason why I will show/test drive a car again, even if another dealer just did, is that is that I SEE the quality of the "average" salesperson these days.
It's a competitve world. I'm better than average. If you got a walk-around for Joe-Schmo at ABC, I may just blow your mind with mine. I won't trust my paycheck to the possible work of a guy that thinks it's "got a V-4".
Just a good thing to remember if you're in sales and encounter a "grinder" or a "I don't need to"...
Now if they just want 'monthly payment' and dont care about anything else, then the 4square comes handy.
I'll normally ask the desk to start me at their current payment regardless of how much downpayment is needed to reach their payment (they pay $320 on their 03/ need $9K for same payment). Then the customer gets off the "keep payments the same" and I keep my word of keeping their payments the same. Of course I never ask "how much down?" Then the customer knows to either move to a model down (Lariat to an XLT) or will pay more for what they want.
Plus, I don't want that "new car smell" to get in the way of getting to a deal. I don't usually get caught up in the "oohh....ahhh" of that shiny new car.
Thats why I never buy a car the day I test drive it. You have to let the euphoria of the test drive fade and look at it in a more rational light. Don't let the salesperson strike while the iron is hot.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
And we would all breathe a collective sigh of relief. Snake reminds me of a woman who came into our dealership with her boyfriend and accused the dealership of manufacturing Monroney labels. :confuse: He'd start an argument with a tree stump and somehow he'd still find a way not to make his point.
You're one customer that perhaps this doesn't apply to, we'd find a way around your not wanting to take a test drive. I have NEVER had anyone leave because I asked them to test drive though. We either politely did it or didn't do it. It IS your choice in the end.
And he calls me a 'troll'.
I am the Internet Manager for my store. Please tell me how to tell if you're an "informed buyer" or just someone pretending. You can't. And if you claim that you can, you're wrong. Just because you come up with a price does not make you informed. Sorry.
"I would think anyone who is surprised that there is 30 miles on a car isn't an informed buyer."
You'd think wrong. A lot of people freak out at more than 6 miles on a "new" car. There are forums with people who whine about it... lol.
"But I already have test driven the car, I already have spent 10 minutes in the car and then some. Did they make any changes in the car between the time they made this particular one and the one I just test drove a week ago?"
Yes. Read my reply to the guy above.
"True but I would not expect that someone who uses the Bobst method would be a grinder. I would think that label would go to someone who does an extra ordinary amount od negotiations to save very little money."
So you try and bypass it by not doing the song and dance? I'm still going to try and get all the $$$. You're still going to want to pay X. Let the grind begin. And don't act like it's our responsibility just to take an offer if we can... we are a BUSINESS.
"Granted, but when I go and start talking price the sale has been done. I am going to buy that new Sludgemobile LX with a certain option package in a certain range of colors. The only question is at what price and from who. And to be honest if I have decided thats the car I want and ask for negotiations to start and you insist on the test drive I will look for another salesman."
And I won't lose any sleep. They are in no danger of buying a car. And even if they were, I'd just irritate them more anyway.
If they want to take their ball and go home because I won't play by their rules (when mine involve 10 minutes or less to protect BOTH of us), then fine. I'm going to stand up at the tower and make sure the salesman that gets them ends up wasting way more of their time though (because I'm going to metaphorically chase them and pop their ball, without them knowing it, just because they irritated ME lol :P).
T
Now don't get me wrong I am not saying don't inspect the vehicle (including driving it) before accepting delivery. All I am saying is that I am not going to do it unless I know I have a deal.
Would you accept this then "I will buy this 2007 Sludgemobile LX for $18,000.00 provided the vehicle I am taking delivery on passes a basic visual and driven inspection for mechanical defects"?
To be honest at this point in time the only reason I would reject the car if it had a defect, such as pulling to one side, a shimmy, broken window, dent or something like that. Then if they had another of an acceptable color we can try that.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I know you can't but some things you have to take on faith until evidence of the contrary comes to light. On the other side of the coin how do I know that you can tell me anything about the car that isn't on the sticker? To be honest ever since that subaru salesman started looking for the other two spark plug wires after I pointed out that the engine he was saying was a V-6 only had 4 spark plug wires I never listened to a thing a salesman has told me. That is except for the price.
You'd think wrong. A lot of people freak out at more than 6 miles on a "new" car. There are forums with people who whine about it... lol.
Again they are not informed, the key word is informed.
So you try and bypass it by not doing the song and dance? I'm still going to try and get all the $$$. You're still going to want to pay X. Let the grind begin. And don't act like it's our responsibility just to take an offer if we can... we are a BUSINESS.
Granted but its not my business to pay more than I think its worth. Salespeople say it all the time they are not charities, so if your not one I am not going to just give you money. So if I make an offer you have three options, accept it (and we have a deal), counter offer (and we negotiate) or refuse it (in which case I rescind my offer and be on my merry way).
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
This is the truth. If you haven't been in the business you are missing out on all the 'quirks' that otherwise normal people have. Miles on a car? How about 'I will never buy a vehicle that someone else f**ted in. It's got to have less than 3 miles on it.'
I get very creative. If its a specialty piece like an S-2000 I just say that we dont test drive until we have agreed on numbers and gotten an approval for financing. If its a run of the mill car I will put off enough negative vibes that they usually dont want to test drive. And sometimes I have to just come out and say " are you really planning on purchasing this car or were you just wanting a joyride?"
After they accepted our offers, we went on a test drive.
Since I easily get distracted, I told the sales person to say absolutely nothing as we were driving. He complied.
I checked my list to make sure the car did not have the problems others had mentioned. Then we bought the car and we have been enjoying it ever since.
We had the same experience when we bought our Honda last year, except the sales person did not come along on the test drive.
Seems backwards to me. Why make an offer on a car you might not even like?
And, I'm sorry, but telling your salesperson to say absolutely nothing is just plain rude. Most smart salespeople can sense it when the driver wants a quiet salesperson and will adjust accordingly.
Even if your salesperson wasn't that perceptive, telling him to keep his mouth shot was beyond rude. Sorry.
To not want to take a test drive when buying a used car is insane. Not that you could have done anything about it but right then and there you should have known that this guy was not put together right. 'You can lead a horse to water but you can't get them to drink', would certainly apply here.
Thinking of that incident still upsets me now
This tells me that you are a pretty conscientious person. You tried but failed to reason with this dope but you can't do anything about it now.
It's nice to know that there is another good guy in the biz.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
This almost seems like much ado about nothing. In these situations, I've even had them drive around the parking lot, just to make sure we're okay. Simple and painless.
Seems backwards to me. Why make an offer on a car you might not even like?
The thing I am trying to present is when someone already has test driven the car. Maybe not that day, maybe not at that dealership, but some time in the recent past has test driven it.
Case in point last Labor day weekend me and she who must be obeyed test drove the Lincoln MKX at a lincoln sponsored event. We drove the car a considerable time on the regular roads in the area. My wife loved the car (I didn't think it to shabby either). Now if we decide to buy one and stop by a Lincoln dealership why test drive it again if we don't have a deal? We already like the car, the only thing we would do on a test drive is inspect it. Now why do that if there might not be a deal?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I don't care if a customer has no interest in driving the car. I always ask several times. If they flat refuse, no problem. I just don't like it when we reach an agreement, shake hands, and THEN, they want to drive it to make sure they like it!
Makes no sense.
If we can't agree on the numbers, the test drive isn't going to matter, anyway. I would think that it would save the sales person and myself time, without doing a test drive if we aren't going to agree on the numbers. Honda makes fine cars. I'm going to assume that nothing is going to be amiss during the test drive anyway.
I think most of us read the car reviews. I think we are the types that go to car shows, sit in the vehicles, touch everything before we've even made a trip to the dealership.
I will admit, I'm a stickler on color and options. I'm not so much of sa stickler on whether the car has 6 or 60 demo miles on it, though.
Sick. Just sick. Apparently the special financing is helping.
It is only avaliable on a couple of models and if you sell one of them you have a chance of getting some extra money directly from Land Rover.
It is neat they have a GUI roulette type wheel thing on the Land rover Intranet and you "spin" the wheel to see how much money you get.
I just hit the top price of $2,500 dollars. :shades: :shades:
Totally made my day.
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during the test drive? Maybe 10%
So if you do the math, both the customer and salesman's time can be saved if negotiations happen first.
Of course it depends on how long each process takes as well.
That's the point really isn't it? YOU don't like it. However being the consumate professional that you are I imagine you mentally shake your head. I hope you are not rude enough to show your dislike.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
What are the chances the deal may fall apart during the test drive? Maybe 10%
HUH? I think you need to look at these numbers again. This means that, if you've test driven 10 cars in your life, you've bought 9 of them. This also means you are 90% certain you are buying a car before you even sit inside. There is NO WAY these numbers apply to me. On average, I probably try out 5-6 cars before deciding on one, then, at the most, 3 dealers to make a deal. So that means:
fell apart during test drive = 83%
fell apart during negotiations = 66%
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
True, but you are also forgetting what may be DIFFERENT about even the same car from dealership to dealership. And even if you are on the EXACT same car at the EXACT same dealership, what if the last person who test drove it curbed the car? Or put an extra 100 miles on it because he wanted to show it to his relatives first, and then the deal fell through?
You can tell me "those things don't matter to an informed person", but do you really think that's true?
What's the big deal? You drive it around (heck I'd even settle for the parking lot), and that's that...
Are you THAT worried you'll fall head over heels and lose all control??? We aren't selling Claudia Schiffer
The reason WHY it matters is because if we do it AFTER we agree on everything (or make it subject to your approval), we end up wasting a lot of unnecessary time if, after ALL the negotiations are over, it's ends up failing your approval.
Instead, if whatever may be wrong with the car is found out FIRST, we can see if we have a different one, or at worst, see if we can trade for one.
If we do it your way, all that really changes is you might save a whopping ten minutes...
Bravo!
T
When it comes to consumables, its a completely different story because beer won't last more than a night, is replaced almost instantly (hell you can drink two beers at once!) and the cost is not much.
A car you will see and feel everyday you go to work, pickup the kids, take the wife out shopping, etc. Of course, like mentioned early, you can't force someone to do something, so it comes down to flexibility
What if the salespersons job has already been done?
Then I would do it with MORE determination and MORE positive energy because you didn't buy from THAT salesperson for a reason...hmmm
Please notice I am not saying take delivery on the car without inspecting it (which would include a test drive), but to get the deal first before hand. Otherwise there is no point in doing the inspection. If the deal falls through there won't be another deal at the dealership. If the car fails inspection in most cases there is a good chance of a subsitute car on the lot (i.e same make model and options and either the same color or an acceptable color subsitute).
What's the big deal? You drive it around (heck I'd even settle for the parking lot), and that's that...
I would never buy a car if all my driving of it were in a parking lot.
The reason WHY it matters is because if we do it AFTER we agree on everything (or make it subject to your approval), we end up wasting a lot of unnecessary time if, after ALL the negotiations are over, it's ends up failing your approval.
The converse is also true. we could do the test drive (remember I am there after test driving it before) find that everything meets my approval and it all falls apart because of the deal? As I said if the deal falls there is no deal, if the car fails there could be other cars to replace it.
If we do it your way, all that really changes is you might save a whopping ten minutes...
First of all ten minutes can be a lot of time depending on circumstances. Secondly it takes longer than that to test drive a car, I mean how long does it take to even bring the car out front?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D