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Comments
It is their business because they are providing the money.
:P
I don't want to put useless miles on a nice new car unless I know they will accept my offer.
If the CU didn't do an add for miles and options, then they were wrong. They can be good at trying to "protect" their clients too.
Oh really? I'd bet MOST customers trying to trade in a Trailblazer would love to hear that one... It's routine for us to be SIGNIFICANTLY back of book in any domestic these days.
It's that wonderful job GM/Ford/Dodge have done of begging people to take the new ones. Frankly I'm surprised we haven't seen NEGATIVE financing from them yet.
"And why, oh why, are you giving "snake" grief for not wanting an extended test drive before he strikes a deal? He walks in. Knows as much about the car as he wants to know. Wants to get right down to the "nitty gritty". Seems to me, snake is offering you a quick and easy deal. What's not to like? I'd say if you're going to try to force him into a test drive before he strikes a deal will irritate him. Then he walks....goes to another dealership. How does that help the salesperson if that happens?"
Question for you? If you owned the dealership, would you cave in to every "informed shopper"? Or would you want your employees to TRY to build some value in your product first???
Of COURSE from your perspective you'd like us to just drop drawer and take it...
But what about the customers that DO bump in price??? It happens every day in negotiations. Excuse me for wanting to make sure that if I go through all the brain damage of negotiating with an "informed" buyer (and it IS brain damage, let me tell ya...), I don't have them backpedal over mileage or tire type.
Snake implies he knows everything about the car without seeing it, just because he drove it "umpteen" times somewhere else...
I'm sorry, but driving the car first isn't too much to ask. The whiners of the world just can't be bothered to do it any way but the way they want to.
T
Thank you, thank you and thank you again. Someone understands where I am coming from. When I was in sales the whole thing was do what was right for the customer not forcing them into a hole where we do the exact same thing regardless of the customers wants or needs. Sure it backfired on us at times but we blew away all our projections.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Please don't put words in my mouth as I dislike the taste of other peoples words. I do not imply that, I state that I know all I need to know by doing my research first with includes reading up on the cars, reading reviews, technical information, owners manuals, talking to owners on these boards and in person, going to look at the cars and driving them prior to talking to a salesman.
I'm sorry, but driving the car first isn't too much to ask.
Nope its not and I suggest people do drive a car before buying. That being said repeated test drives are a waste of time. FWIW I never buy a car the day I test drive it.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Internet inquiry comes in on a 2003 Honda accord 4 cylinder with nav that we have on the used lot.
We don't deal directly with internet traffic anymore as it goes through a internet specialist...
Anyway they set up an appointment for this evening and it gets handed off to me.
The woman comes in and she has an Audi A4 for trade.
Unfortunately it is in very poor condition. She drove all the way down from Mass and I don't think it could make it back.
Power steering rack is nearly shot and vibrates the steering wheel when you turn it. Engine shakes badly and ticks loudly. Sounds like the timing belt is about to go. Check engine light is on. Check oil light is on. Rust bubbles are forming on the passenger side doors.
There is more as well but I don't feel like going into all of it.
She owes 5,500 dollars on it and it is worth about 2,000 dollars. Some Honda dealer up in mass offered her 6,500 dollars for it sight unseen over the internet. She came down to see us because we had the car she wanted with navigation for less money. There car was more expensive but did not have nav.
She had no idea that they were completly pulling the wool over her eyes trying to get her to come in. She had a payment she wanted to hit but even if we could give her 6,500 for her car we would need to sell our car for 14,500. Thats not going to happen as it is about 1,500 dollars less then what we own it for.
I am sure she sees us as the big bad car dealer trying to scare her into buying our car but I am truly concerned that her Audi will never make it back to Boston.
I am going to call her tomorrow and make sure she made it back ok.
I would love to be paying 4.9% on my car.
By you stating time and time again that you don't need to drive the car you are buying first, before you negotiate on it, and that the test drive on the day you buy is worthless, you ARE implying that you know things that you don't about the car. Don't accuse me of putting words in your mouth when they're already there :P
If you don't see the value in spending 10-20 minutes to make sure of all the things we mentioned ad nauseum here, fine, it's your perogative.
It's an unreasonable one, but hey, if you want to come by, I bet I can waste more of your time than you can mine
T
No I stated time and time again I don't need to if I have done so before. Big difference. Read back and what I wrote and please try to understand what I an writing. That way you won't make these mistakes again.
Again you put words in my mouth that I never said.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Not yet but in the meantime you can use the scroll wheel on your mouse.
tidester, host
I would also take a test drive even if I drove the same model at another dealership...while some consider the salespeople as ordertakers, I like to interact with the salesperson, basically seeing how they treat me...after all, if something needs repair and the shop is full, I have noticed how a salesperson who treated me well during the sale can sometimes get things done quicker...is it a guarantee???...no, of course not...but if a SP treats me like trash, I have no desire to work with them on sales or anything else, and certainly would not be back for another car in the future...
While I know that the SP may not be my best buddy, interacting with them on a respectful basis tells me how much they know about their product, and a cordial relationship, to me, is better then a hostile one...
While some SP do not know a V6 from a V8, some know their product inside and out, and I want that knowledge...it really does concern me if I know more about the product than they do, and I would directly ask the manager for a more knowledgeable SP...
Somthing else I do, and I feel it is helpful...if you see the same service techs all the time, giving them a bottle of decent wine at Xmas is a nice gesture...they do remember you, just like servers learn who the big tippers are, and almost nobody thinks of them at the holidays...
After buying my truck, while the SP and I were adversaries while negotiating price, once we struck a deal, it was done...I bought him a bottle of decent Scotch a month later at Xmas, and I am warmly greeted whenever I enter the dealership...no ulterior motives here, just treat some folks nice who are rarely treated nice by their customers, and the response is sometimes amazing...
After all, if you agreed to a price, even if you feel that you could have hammered it lower, a deal is a deal...then be nice after that, or do not buy the car from them...
Random thoughts, I guess...
If I am at a dealer looking at a car then I clearly have an interest in it. I cannot know whether I want the car until I have test driven it. Reading other people's reviews and testimony of their experiences may help but I won't know whether the car "fits" until I get to kick the tires and sit behind the wheel.
tidester, host
Sorry snake, but that's EXACTLY what I meant. Are you going to accuse me of putting THOSE words in your mouth too? :P
You say "done so before" as if there isn't any possibility that the car could have slightly different equipment, high miles, the wrong tires, or a myriad of other deal breaking items that you'd just whine to me about AFTER you wasted my time negotiating.
Believe it or not, I personally love dealing with customers like you. It's hillarious. Especially when you get upset over something as minimal as a test drive and demand to speak to someone else because of it. Do you realize how childish that sounds??? There's nothing more satisfying than getting management approval to tell someone "if you're looking for a good buy, GOODBYE!"
T
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Seriously you two, I really think you have both made your points, Can we get back on topic here?
I'm sure there are people who will take your money despite being that way. Just because SOMEONE will, doesn't mean that you aren't being unreasonable... It just means you found someone willing to be your doormat. I'm not, nor are MOST respectable salespeople.
And with that I'll let it die... will you? lol...
T
*waits patiently and sees if snakeweasel really does have to have the last word...*
I don't know. I am seriously considering claiming that distinction for myself.
Can we move on, now?
tidester, host
I think it all lies in the mindset, priorities and hard numbers. Are three quick sales at lower profit point better than one grinding sale with all tricks in your book and hope of higher unit outcome that can be easily crushed by the aggravated customer walking and never coming again? Only owner can answer that and he/she will structure their store accordingly. If you see "informed buyer" (whatever that means) it may be (not saying it is - just a possibility) your best interest to turn them quickly. Everything is about return. From your perspective, it probably is worth to try to bump him/her up just once to see the reaction, but the tactics afterwards need to be adjusted to them.
If you really think that you HAVE TO try everything on everybody, otherwise you lose, I would ecourage you to take a little harder look. You may be right - it all depends what your store is, where it is, who are your customers, etc. I would suspect though, you may be losing some potential customers. Just one's man opinion.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I can narrate it, I present an offer, he basically refuses the offer, I leave, he posts about the guy who wouldn't test drive, someone else gets his commission. Simple and short.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I like that bit, it's like the moral of the story.
It is a very valid opinion and one that people really should ponder.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
So before certain people ruin this thread whey don't you go ruin this thread or this one instead.
NEXT!!
But you never win against snakeweasel. He will ALWAYS have a REBUTTAL!!!!!
Give it up tjw1308...you will not win!!!
so rover, what happened with that lady? did she get back ok?
its funny - every time i see a rover around, i check to see if its from your dealership (i dont know if you remember, but im in CT and worked at a nissan dealership not too far from you)
-thene
;b
seriously, though, I'm curious exactly what the term means. I assume he is releasing the loaner for sale. Why "punch" though? Where did that come from? Any reasoning behind it? Or just some random term?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
moo....it must be halloween. We agree! I like the part of the test drive not being "rapture for the soul".
My late father was fond of Lincolns. Every 2-3 years, he'd trade for a new one. Forget for a moment there wasn't much, if any difference in model years with Lincolns. He just wanted a new one.
I can't ever remember him taking one on a test drive. When the salesperson used to want to get him behind the wheel, he'd always respond.....
"You just told me this is a great car. You just told me how wonderful the dealership is and that if there was any problem, it would be resolved in short order. Is there going to be some sort of surprise with this car that you aren't telling me about? If not, I don't need a test drive. Let's get to the numbers".
My father owned his own business. He used to buy 5-6 trucks every year. He bought them the same way. Sales person would want him to drive the truck first. Again, my father would always respond with...."is there any reason I can't use this truck and reasonably expect it to last 100,000 miles?". Sales person would respond..."no, we make good sturdy trucks". Then, all that was needed was to get to the numbers.
My father knew the payloads of the the trucks by heart, as well as their projected service costs. He knew exactly what options he wanted on his Lincolns. He drug me to every "car show" within a 50 mile radius of us. He sat in every car he ever considered purchasing, played with all the dials, looked under every hood, inspected every undercarriage.
In short, he knew exactly what he wanted before he set foot in the dealership. Now, I'm the same way. I read all the test data here and in the car rags. Unless I'm considering a vehicle from a manufacturer I've never bought from before, I've got a good idea of how the car will perform, whether I fit in it, am comfortable in it, etc. And, the test drive comes 2nd after negotiations are done.
The mere fact that most of us are here tells me we want to be an informed buyer. We want to know the MSRP, Invoice, holdback, incentives, etc. I'd say most of us represent a quick sale to the dealership since we know what we're looking for....and the price we want to pay for what we're looking for.
I still can't understand why this is an issue. Doesn't matter, though. We all buy the way we feel comfortable buying.
Some of us need a test drive. Some of us don't.
To be clear: no more = zilch, none, zippo, zero, the big donut.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
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2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
What did he use, Graphics - blow, weed, or something harder
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I remember which nissan dealership you worked at. Our current F&I/Used car manager used to work there. Not sure if it was the same time as you though.
As for what punching a car means. Basicly it means starting the warranty clock on the car with the manufacturer. You would do this when putting the car into official demo status, reporting it sold to a customer or when putting it into service loaner status.
Not sure where the term came from but I would guess years ago an actualy punch card was used to record this information. The VINs of each car were printed out on a punch card and holes were punched through certain slots depending on what kind of status the car was going into.
These cards were sent to the manufacturer who ran them through a mainframe and recorded the start of the warranty clock.
Don't get me wrong because I'm not arguing with you here but I would have thought that "the most well-established most credit-worthy buyers" wouldn't be financing as little as 20% of any car. For that very same reason I would have thought that is how people become a "most credit-worthy person".
I'm a buyer that has never financed more than 50% of any car that I ever purchased. I always thought it was a poor decision to finance more than 50% of anything that was going to depreciate, especially cars.
No, I'm not well-to-do but I'd like to be and borrowing too much for anything that depreciates ain't the way to get there.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
you never really know who you are getting into the car with on a test drive, and it's especially harrowing for female salespeople. any other females out there (ahem, bigvdub...) have any similar stories about "interesting" test drives?
i was fortunate enough not to have a jerk like that guy on any of my test drives...
-thene
audia8q....don't have any issues with any sales person using any HONEST tactic to close a deal.
carhagg...I think those that go "outside the box" would have more sales success in the car business than those who follow the "ritual" down to the letter. Kudos to you for finding different ways of getting the deal done....and making the buying experience a little less heavy handed.
Yikes! Do you remember the story I told awhile back about the 2 guys from New Orleans? Scary stuff happens. I mentioned a couple posts back that a lady became angry about me needing to get a copy of her driver's license. Now this lady didn't really pose a threat to me, but there are a couple of reasons for making this happen. What if they do want to steal the car, harm the salesperson, sexually harass or they just don't have a driver's license? One simple thing makes sure that you have a little bit of evidence against someone.
Since I do this day in and day out, I become callous to riding around with everyone. Every now and again someone will mention that it must be weird doing that. It was at first.
Here are 3 quick stories about times I've had to pull people over on the test drive.
#1 Customer wants to drive a 6spd Maxima. Demands to drive it, it's the only vehicle he's interested in. Sure, Mr. Customer! We head out onto the highway and he proceeds to shift from 5th into 2nd. :sick: Test drive over.
#2 Customer driving an Armada. 305hp 3.5 liter v8. Big engine. Big truck. Lady is going 65 in a 35 around a bend. I urge her to slow down. She laughs and speeds right into a motorcycle cop who writes her up. (Okay, I didn't pull this one over.)
#3 On a personal level, this one had me laughing for a long time. Customer pulls up in an older model BMW. He is VERY friendly. He wants to test drive a manual transmission Civic. Sure, Mr. Customer!
Quick sidenote, we've discussed cherry-picking, prequalifying, strokes and when someone wants a joyride. Let me add one thing into this mix, when someone is VERY friendly, I see red flags. BIG giant red flags. I knew immediately that this gentleman was here to tear up one of our cars. On with the story -
We get in car and he peels out of the parking lot. I say, "Woah brother, you need to take it easy. This isn't your car yet."
"Well how am I supposed to know how it drives?"
"I suggest going slower."
Not a block from the dealership he angrily tells me that he isn't going to drive at all and I can just drive him back to the dealership. Okay....
Talk about the some of the most awkward 2 minutes of my life. Noone said anything as we drove back to the dealership, but when we stopped he demanded to get the copy of his driver's license back and my business card. He also instructed me not to call someone 'brother' because I don't know who I'm dealing with. At this point I'm barely able to hold back laughter. I give him my card, tell him his driver's license copy is on file and not available for him to get back and if he wants to talk with a manager, he's more than welcome. He just leaves.
I couldn't stop laughing after he left. What a nutcase.
You just never know who you're going to get in this business.
I'm more than a little disturbed by this predicament. It must be the demons of Halloween at work as you said. :shades:
Good example about your Dad though. Here's something to include for the Frontline Stories. In addition to the salesguys, let's also have some of the buyers tell us some of their funniest test drives. Surely something odd has happened out there.
At the Nissan dealer I used to work at, there was a salesman with narcolepsy who regularly fell asleep on test drives. :surprise:
Of course it's tough to top something like that, but tell us the strange and amusing things that have happened. Thanks all.
In any sales position you would do better thinking outside the box. You have to tailor your pitch to the customer not force your customer into your pitch.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
you get all kinds of crazies coming in. people here sometimes don't understand what salespeople face everyday. there are some wackos out there.
one of my colleagues had a guy that came in like every other week to buy his girlfriend of the week a used car. he had terrible credit, and we kept telling him we couldn't sell him a car, but he'd keep coming in anyways. we'd go through the song and dance, then tell him the financing company denied him. 2 weeks later, he was back with his girl of the week to buy her a car, and the same thing would happen...
weird stuff...
-thene
I have been so busy this past week and now....the last day of the month, I only have one delivery and one lady on the fence and my phone has not even rang.
Funny, test drive story.
I get car sick (which is great in the car biz) So I cannot ride in the backseat for more than 5 minutes. I let this couple take an A4 cab alone so I did not have to sit in the back (they were a larger couple so they could not sit in the back) Well, dumb me Forgot to check the fuel, and they ran out of gas. TEE HEE. OOPS. Oh ya the owner happend to take the call when they were on the side of road. no bueno.
i have a story to tell about crashing a $32k on the way to bringing it to the front of the store to show a customer...but i'll type that a little later...
-thene