Honda Civic Si Sedan

eldaino

i belive so. Granted, since its a naturally aspirated engine, i'm pretty sure that its just to bump performance, and not a real big deal like it would be for a car like a gti, in which to keep the turbo running properly, it needs premium.

aaronr121

Freakin' awesome. I love the car so far. Wife loves it (she's driving a little too fast tho), and is already comfortable with it.

Honda does a great job with the owners manual. Wow, step by step instructions for changing the headlight bulbs, oil... even the alignment specs! Seems very DIY friendly. Her VW was horrible in that respect. Looking up anything, such as replacing blown headlight bulbs, pretty much recommends visitng the dealer.

Anyway. Very happy with the car. Got a decent deal ($20,433 before T&T), Hab Red, base SI sedan from Piazza Honda. Great sales person, Pete. A Honda enthusiast, seems to know what he's doing. If you are in the area, try calling him.

barretthead

hello all, i am currently in discussions with the two credible honda dealers here in va beach, the si sedans seem to stay on lots for less than a week max. i want a nighthawk black with navi, so i will have to order it, no other way. initial qoute for si with navi is $23,500. anybody having any better luck or advice on pricing for this area?

pat

Hi, welcome to CarSpace! Check out this discussion: Honda Civic: Prices Paid & Buying Experience. Good luck! Let us know how it goes.

barretthead

do you guys think the navi is worth it, dealer over here is charging 1500 for it, a little less than most other places.

tseosh

You can buy a unit for a couple hundred dollars that will sit very nicely in the console are in front of the shifter. Figuring out a nice cushioned, secure mount isn't that difficult. I prefer the non-navi stereo controls... and the in-dash unit is pricey now (about 8% of the cost of the entire car???) and could be expensive to fix later on. Plus, a few years from now it might seem outdated. Just a few thoughts...

eldaino

i would do the same; cheaper and it allows you to upgrade your stereo with MUCH less of a fuss.

tslbmw

Can any of you owners pass along your real world gas mileage for your Si Sedan?

Thanks!

vviley

Right now I'm getting 24-26 mpg for 75%+ (occasionally aggressive), non-highway driving on the all-weather tires. Best tank so far is 31.

tslbmw

Thank you. I'm really struggling deciding between the Si or EX sedan. The inner me really wants the Si...the practical me wants the EX with its 30/40 regular fuel gas mileage; but, I feel as though the EX would get old/boring fast; whereas the Si would be more satisfying.

Any thoughts? Did any of you go through the same delimma?

vviley

Personally, the EX was never on my list. It didn't have the minimum get-up-and-go factor. Plus, if it makes any difference for you - if you look at the new EPA mpg estimates, the standard civic's combined mpg is only 6 mpg more than the Si. But I can understand the dilemna. I had the same struggle over siding w/ the Si or the Mazdaspeed3 - speed, ride, fuel economy, etc... (not to make your decisions any more complicated)

a10thunder

Go with the EX if you want an automatic transmission and a more compliant ride. The Si is for car enthusiasts. The tuned intake and exhaust are loud (relatively speaking). The stiff suspension will let you feel every bump on the road. Personally, I love the experience, but it's not for everyone.

I get about 26 mpg with mixed city/highway driving. The Si will get over 30 mpg on highway alone.

BTW, I love the anonymity of the Si sedan. It's hard even for enthusiasts to spot the Si sedan because Honda made very subtle changes to the exterior. I got more attention with my WRX wagon.

eldaino

i don't think the ex is a 'boring' drive, for a non performance version, it is a very good handler, and you get great mileage to boot.

I can spot and si sedan a mile away, but then again i'm an enthusiast for hondas. with regards to mileage, the new epa numbers for the si are not anything to write home about, and 6mpg is a lot for someone more interested in fuel economy, plus the ex does not require premium, like the si does. The difference in fuel economy is even more evident, if you frequent freeways, in which the ex will trump the si.(in pretty much the only thing it can! )

as far as peppiness goes, what i'm about to say applies to the si sedan and not the coupe, although the numbers are close; car and driver did a recent comparo for the fastest cars for under 20k; a regular manual transmission civic did a zero to 60 run in 7.7 seconds. A lot of the numbers for the si sedan put it at about 7.1. Something to think about eh? I understand its a lot more high end power...but still, i would have expected more.

tslbmw

I'm not a fan on the Mazdaspeed3's interior and wanted to stay closer to $20K, so the MS3 is out. I'm paying cash for the vehicle and the extra $4K just isn't worth it to me.
The EPA mpg site you sent is great. Thanks! Hmmmmm....only 6 mpg combined difference....I think that might do it for me. The Si is the car for me.
I'm going to hit my local dealerships right after Memorial Day and offer $20,500 for a base white Si sedan.
I'll report back to you guys and let you know how it goes.

tslbmw

Wow, good numbers on the "peppiness" of the two cars. I have driven the Si, but not the EX yet. I guess the right thing to do will be to drive them back to back and decide. I've pretty much slimmed down my options to these two cars b/c I really like the look of the new Civic and love Honda's reliability and slow depreciation.

Thanks for your input.

palmbchsooner

Just purchased the '07 Si Sedan last week in Galaxy Gray with the Nav system. To say this car is fun would truly be an understatement! She begs to be pushed but is content with easy driving. I also recommend the Navigation feature which only adds to the party. Thus far the only complaint I have with this car is that I have to get out of it once I get to where I'm going. If you are contemplating it, go for it and I assure you you'll be happy you did.

NW North Palm Beach, FL

pat

Congrats! And welcome to CarSpace.

eldaino

hey no problem...white on the si sedan is awesome! i think the new civics look great in white, but would never get one becasue they only come with the beige interior, unless you get an si.

As far as the car and driver numbers go, i think they tested an lx sedan...which does weigh less than an ex, but has less features and doesn't handle as well.

I'm sure that even though the si is only slightly faster...its has more fun doing it in general. But as exciting as it is, i still wouldn't call the ex 'boring'.

Good luck with your purchase!

barretthead

well, i pick up my 2007 Civic Si sedan with navi in Nighthawk Black Pearl tomorrow morning. after extensive research, i must say that these posts helped to sway my decision to the Si from the ex 5-speed with navi. i will be sure to post my driving and navigation user reviews and experiences here shortly.

eldaino

congrats man, enjoy your car...its seems the sedan is getting all the attention now...unless you stress a two door car(or hate the way the sedan looks and/or don't like people to ask to come with you), there seems to be no reason for the coupe!

kork13

I'm a college junior about 2 weeks away from going home to buy an Si of my own... I started looking at it about a month ago, and based on everything I've heard and read about it between then and now, I've already fallen in love and haven't even gotten behind the wheel yet. I'm looking very heavily at the Navi system, so anybody's comments on the pro/con/value of having it would be appreciated.

Also, for those with the Navi in their Si, what should I be starting at as far as negotiating for a reasonable price? What should I shoot for? Barrett, I'd love to hear what you have to say about the navi system before I actually buy so i know what i'm in for. Biggest concern: ease of use, esp. while driving? Also does it interfere with using the stereo system?

For everyone, thanks for all of your input, it's been extremely useful for me, this will be the first car I'll have bought on my own. Tschues...

tslbmw

Well, my wife and I test drove the EX and Si back to back this afternoon and decided that the Si was the way to go. After a lot of negotiation, MSRP $22,143 (only added options were wheel locks and stripe); final price, $20,550 + 3% tax + $189 processing fee. Edmunds invoice without the wheel locks and stripe is $20,182, so I felt pretty good about the price. I will pick up the car a week from Tues (the day after Memorial day). I can't wait!

Thanks for the help.

barretthead

so its been 2 days with the new si sedan, and i must say the while it was definitely on my short list, its amazes me now that i even was considering anything else at all. i smile every time i get behind the wheel and look foward to any drive. i suppose this could be still the stages of first date excitement jitters, but i think its true love, shes the one for me. shifts like no car i have ever driven, a joy to work through the gears, seats are the most comfortable of any, and shifter placement is perfect. as far as navi goes, i am glad i got it, ease of use is second to none, once i got an idea of how to best use the voice commands, distractions while driving were a non issue. the stereo even quiets up front and shifts to the rear speakers when giving or receiving a voice prompt. love the operating system, user friendly and accurate, and it just looks phenomenal in the dash. that said it is a pricey add on for sure, i am glad i splurged and got it, but pricey nonetheless. price paid for me was just over 23K, but the market here is really hot for the Si, and only one dealer could even get them on the lot, no other dealer could get navi, or match the price. you could probably swing 22500-ish or even a little less, but i am happy with my price as the blue book national average is 24300 or so. feel free to ask any and all questions about the Si or the navi. it a beautiful sunny sunday. and crisp 60 degree day here, so i think i will hot the road for a drive while everyone else sleeps in, have a great day all, i will be sure to post follow ups as they are necessary. no doubt in my mind that every dollar of every payment i make on this car is money well spent.

zero1210

i was wondering if the gauge layout of the si's are easier for performance driving. im more into cornering than seeing how fast i can go in a straightline. i love the new si's design but the gauge layout doesnt seem to convince me to get one. im so used to the traditional style that having the speed and odometer seperate seems more of a hassle to look at; there are 3 focal points that i would have to look at instead of the usual 2. id get a rsx-s but the functionality of a coupe just doesnt cut it for me. i would have gotten a mazda3 sedan but its underpowered compared to the engine in the rsx-s and si (since theyre the same engine). when the si sedan came out, i was excited but the gauge layout put me at a stop. so i was wondering, is the layout that useful in performance driving?

ezpilze

I'm not quite getting how having your speedometer and odometer seperated would affect your driving. Most people, or atleast I don't really look at how far I've traveled WHILE driving. I normally use the tach more for maintenance, shopping, and what not. Did you mean the tachometer? :confuse: If so, then don't worry too much about it the older civic hatchies had NO tachometer, so most were installed seperately via aftermarket parts, and are normally to placed away from the speedometer anyways.

zero1210

lol oops. i meant tachometer

a10thunder

I'm definitely not a big fan of the 2-tiered dash, but the rest of the car was just too good of a package. The problem is that the speedo and tach are at different distances from your eyes. When you are doing performance driving, it gets hard to monitor both because your eyes need a little time to adjust focus between the two. Edmunds has mentioned this in their long-term blog as well.

As you get used to the car, you'll know in your mind what speed you are at based on the gear you're in and the tach reading. So the speedo location won't be a problem. However, what I can't figure is why Honda engineers put the shift light next to the speedo?! It should be by the tach.

cz75

If it was by the tach, couldn't you just watch the needle instead?

tayl0rd

Some people don't watch the tach. They just watch the speedo to make sure they're not speeding, and having the shift light next to the speedo lets them know to shift. We tach watchers don't look at the speedo to regularly unless we're cruising through the city limits.

eldaino

...of the dash, it actually works. LIke epilze said, most performance civics have had aftermarket tachs put on and they are not done in the same ergonomical manner that honda decided to do the si's dash.

Come on its not like they mounted the tach on the backrest of the front passenger seat!

Get to know your car, learn when to shift.

I'm suprsied more peeps arent complaining about the drive by wire.

vviley

well.. yes, DBW isn't the most spectacular thing in the world; but for the most part, I've gotten used to it and I just learned to accept that's how the car revs.

iomatic

curb rash on the wheels; not major. Who has a resource for touch-up paint?

thanks.

aaronr121

I went through the same dilemma! Premium fuel, lower milage figures... But so far I'm satisfied with what I'm getting for milage. A couple tanks got a 26.4 for the low and I just got a 32.5 driving just highway miles for 4 round trips to the philly airport (over 200 miles for all 4 trips). For the most part I can get 27-28 in combined driving. I do drive frugally (when I'm not free and clear of traffic for a little WOT fun) and without AC most of the time.

Very glad we went with the SI over an automatic EX. I read enough compliants about those owners only getting 28 mpg combined.

With the 3.25 price of premium... It's really not a big difference, like you have to buy an extra gallon of gas. (10 gallon fillups, about an extra $2.50 per fill-up.)

Fuel wise, I just wish it had a 15 gallon tank instead of 13.

eldaino

read enough compliants about those owners only getting 28 mpg combined.

theres reasons for it; but it doesn't seem to matter, since you are happy with that kind of mileage; plus with an ex, you don't need to use premium.

no worries man i'm just give ya a hard time!

tslbmw

Well, I picked up my 07 White Si Sedan this morning and ended up agreeing with you that the mileage just wasn't that big of a difference, but the difference in the "fun factor" was huge. Not that the EX isn't a great vehicle, but man is the Si a hoot to drive.....now, if I can just fast forward through the break in period.

aaronr121

NP. I can see why EX owners would complain. Aren't they rated 30-40? Averaging only 28 mpg combined... that's not even in the EPAs reported range.

We really considered an automatic EX, but the wife was willing to have another manual trans, plus the SI package really is not that much more than an EX. But, if I had bought an EX and found out the milage was no better than an SI... I just wouldn't be happy.

How have you made out milage wise with yours?

aaronr121

Dude, it is a fun car to drive. I haven't been bored in mine yet.

I really thought the 600 mile break-in period would take a long, long time. Turns out I did it in a week.

It's such a fun car to drive... and I love the undersized steering wheel. That was another selling point.

My buddy at work just doesn't get why I like this car so much. I told him the other week I was going to get the family and take a long Sunday drive, he asked me if I was taking my '66 mustang fastback, or '84 5.0. When I told him I was taking the SI, he looked at me like I was nuts.

But he is of the opinion that all cars built after '72 are junk. But then he was complaining the other day how much money it was costing him to drive to work. It sucks when you only get 17 mpg and have an 80 mile roundtrip commute!

thegraduate

My buddy at work just doesn't get why I like this car so much. I told him the other week I was going to get the family and take a long Sunday drive, he asked me if I was taking my '66 mustang fastback, or '84 5.0. When I told him I was taking the SI, he looked at me like I was nuts.

Not to mention, you are taking the family in the car with 5-star safety, 4-channel ABS, 6 Airbags, and an advanced crash structure, relative to your 20 + year old Fords!

eldaino

i pretty much got 28 mpg in the city and averaged 38 on the highway.

The old epa claims 30/40, but that number is now 25/36. Either way, my numbers were always on par.

You gotta remember sites like this are prone to a lot of people who get crappy mileage, because they want to complain. Very few of them actually stick around. There are TONS of 'i get horrible mileage in my civic' posts and the respective poster posts a couple more times before being heard of again.

I don't blame you though man; if my wife was willing for a manual, i'd get the si as well, since my rabbit give me roughly the same mileage and i know we can afford it. (but then again our bunny does not take premium, which still isn't a tremendous difference.)

Enjoy your si man, its a great little car!

aaronr121

Thanks Eldaino. Enjoying every minute.

I find most of the people that complain about not getting lousy milage, either can't do the math correctly or have poor driving habits.

28 mpg in the city with an automatic car is actually really, really good milage. Unless you are spending the extra dollars for a hybrid (and it still doesn't seem like that's the best way to save money, if that is your goal), a diesel or a car with less than 100 hp or 3 cylinders.

You're other car is a VW too? We still have the wifes '98 Beetle. Reliability and fuel milage wise, it's great. But it's not much fun to drive (for me anyway) and not exactly the most comfortable car in the world.

eldaino

yeah, theres a lot of posting of numbers in the mpg forums, and lots of people who have crazy drives and don't realize what the new epa adjustments are. (i don't think many people read at least the most recent pages in a forum before they post!)

i actually don't own the civic anymore; i had her for a year (purchased in oct of 2005) and let her go in oct of 06 when my wife and i traded her in for a 07 vw rabbit. We were looking for a fit, but there were only decked out civics and no fits at all, so we went to vw as an afterthought and found a nice rabbit pretty cheap. Hes been good to us so far, but my stint in the civic (and civic before that) was long enough for me to give some views/advice. I drove A LOT of highway miles (visiting my now wife) and plenty of city back home.

kork13

I just test-drove two cars yesterday, a VW GTI hatchback and (of course) an Si sedan. Both were incredible to drive, ALOT of fun. They compare very well, at least from my inexperienced viewpoint, but in the end I ended up going for the Si. Here's my perspective for anyone still trying to decide on what to go with.

The GTI has a good engine, carrying alot of nice power, with the 200-ish horses backed up by 190-ish ft-lbs torque. This (and how light it is) made for a great feeling on the acceleration, and the car responded real well to me. I tested an auto trans, but this is the first car that I have actually considered that a good thing. VW has designed a double-clutch auto tranny that is very smooth, and allows you to choose between sport driving, with the tach allowed to go up into the 5000+ range for performance, or you can have it shift like a sane person and get better economy (which both the GTI and Si are great for... fun performance with fairly good fuel economy). Best, and by far the funnest feature: what my dealer called "Launch mode". In the Auto trans, at a stop, take it to 'Park', then 'Sport', hold the brake with the left foot, gas with the right. Floor the gas, it'll hold right at 3000 revs, then let go of the brake and hold on. Guaranteed 0-60 in 5-ish sec, every time, and it keeps on going until you tell it to stop. VW calls it a 'safety feature' for some reason... I call it fun. Overall a great car, and were it not for the Si, I would have gone for it in a heartbeat.

What I loved most about the Si was a) sound of it's exhaust when the dealer first started it up; b) easy transmission, comfortable clutch and short, easy throws on the stick; c) pure acceleration, taking it from a stop up to 70 in just a moment (revving up to ~6000 and still just getting started... love that 8k red line) and feeling/listening to the engine respond to everything I did; d) those seats wrap around you, and feel great as soon as you sit down. it's very comfortable in front, and decent in the back; e) the trunk (in both the Si and GTI) was actually larger than I expected, which was nice to find out.
I thought the split-level gauges would be hard to adjust to, but they were actually really nice, and the layout from the driver's seat makes complete sense... inside the wheel, you see the tach (flying up and down at a whim... :shades: ), and above the wheel and just below your line of sight with the road is the digital speedo, which also is new to me, but nice. Overall, performance sold me, features reassured me. I loved this car, and can't wait to get my own.

So I'm currently in the process of buying a silver Si Sedan w/Nav for $22,288, which will probably round out around $23k with all of the other rando fees. Not the color I want, but at least a good deal. Unfortunately it's not a local dealer (since my local dealers were shady, greasy, and dishonest... the stereotype), so I have to travel 150 miles to get the deal I want, but TOTALLY worth it. I may decide to post again with more on my new Si once I get it and get some time with it. Later, everybody...

barretthead

still adore my Si sedan, blast to drive, bu it makes a clunking noise when driven over bumps at a low to medium speed. noticed alot of like complaints in the 2006+ issues forum. taking it to the dealer today, i hope it is an easy fix, kinda angry that a brand new car is displaying issues. still love the car though.

eldaino

good write up man! the si and gti are great cars, and they have a varied audience. As much as i like the si, i think i like torque a little more, and its hard going from a hatch to a sedan. ( i drive a rabbit now).

Plus the lady doesn't do manual transmissions, so if the bunny succumbs to another car, if its not a civic ex, it'll be a gti.

Good review though!

If you are driving that far though, i would shoot for a different color especially since its not your favorite. Plus, i personally have never really liked the regular civic colors on si models, with the exception of white and black. They have a really nice blue that was only available on the prev. gen coupes, and 2 really nice reds.

aaronr121

I actually hear something similar. It's a very light clunk at slow speeds. Took it in the other week, they moved the heat shield. Haven't really noticed anything yet. I'm paying attention to it, but nothing yet. I was more concerned that something may be loose. It really sounds like the kind of noise you get when you tighten suspension pieces with no load on them. A slight bushing pop.

My sound seems to eminate from the Left Rear corner, what about yours?

If you don't mind follow up on the post and let me know what happens.

aaronr121

That's a very good price for a Navi model! If I had found a Hab. red car with Navi for that price, i'd have jumped on that for that price!

Since the GTI is a turbo car, turbos typicall work better with automatic cars. If you want the best performance, that's the way to go. Unless, of course, the auto is a real dog and sucks up all the power.

cz75

I get that bushing "pop" sound from the left front of my FA5. I haven't taken it back yet because it doesn't seem to affect anything and because it appears dealers don't have a clue about fixing it. My experience is that Honda service sucks in years past, and I'm not inclined to change my opinion from the limited experience I've had with them on this car. Otherwise, the car seems pretty solid.

eldaino

turbos typicall work better with automatic cars. If you want the best performance, that's the way to go. Unless, of course, the auto is a real dog and sucks up all the power.

i agree and disagre with this statement. Turbos work good with autos in the sense that they usually produce enough power to mitigate the performance penalty usually associated with an automatic; but if the car's turbo has a knack for turbo lag, it will emphasize it to no end.

Since the gti is a dsg, which is an automated manual and not just an automatic, it works like a lazy man's manual; and since the 2.0fsi in the gti is virtually lag free it makes the stick and dsg versions all the more nice.

barretthead

after much ado in and out of the dealership about the bushing pop sound, which it still makes with intermittent regularity, if that is possible, the dealer has no clue. they acknowledge the noise exists and have heard it several times. they inspected all the possible safety components, they say, and they claim that all is in sound working order. i am not pleased with the noise at all, but she still drives and operates fine except for the noise over bumps. they want to keep it overnight on my first oil change, in 2000 miles. i dont know what else to do.

aaronr121

Well, I don't know about Honda service to say if it sucks (like cz75 comments). But I just don't like people monkeying around with my car and possibly screwing up something else in the process.

As long as it's safe, i'm happy. I haven't noticed it since the dealer repositioned a heat shield (said they didn't find anything else). But, I pushed this to the back of my mind and am willing to just ignore it. The car's safe and nothings going to fall apart and it doesn't affect the ride or handling.

If they find a definitive fix, I want them to fix it. So, I'll watch the boards and see.

At the same time I don't want to turn into a lunatic that complains about every sqweak and rattle a car makes and then condems it to POS status.