One of the things I like about my TLX 2.4 is the big 17.2 gallon gas tank. 17.2 seems like it was chosen to be large enough for the models with the optional V-6 and optional AWD, but for me it means fewer fill-ups and a highway range of over 600 miles.
"2023 Acura Integra Will Be a Swoopy Four-Door Hatchback The new model's body style harks back to the original, but those hoping for a two-door sports coupe may be disappointed."
Somehow I think the new Integra will start at a price higher than that.
Yeah, it looks expensive, doesn't it?
But my guess is that it will start at about $32k, in part because the TLX starts at $38.5k with destination, in part because the outgoing ILX starts at $27.5k with destination, and in part because Acura has said (perhaps unrealistically) that the new Integra is going to be a volume car for them.
The Integra will likely use a high-end version of the 1.5T that is already used in the CR-V, Civic and Accord. May not be ideal, but using the 1.5T will keep the price low and the mpg high. I feel like keeping the K-series engine like I have in my TLX 2.4 would actually be cool, and keep with the high revving naturally-aspirated roots of the car, but that's probably unlikely.
Although Mercedes has said that it wants to move away from selling affordable cars, for now theoretically you can "build your own" A-class with a price including destination of $34,700. I've never seen an A-class equipped that way at that price, but supposedly it's possible, and I don't think Acura can charge as much as Mercedes for their entry-level vehicle.
Here's my guess for the pricing of the new Acura Integra....
Integra base c. $32k Integra Tech 34k Integra A-spec 36k Integra Advance 38k SH-AWD add 2k
If I'm guessing more or less right a loaded Integra with the the 1.5T and SH-AWD will top out at around 40K, which is just past where the TLX starts. Acura has hinted they'll offer an Integra Type S at some point (although probably not the first year), which I assume would use the 2.0T, and which would probably cost c. $42k.
I somewhat agree with stickguy that a stylish 4-door hatchback isn't likely to sell that well in this market that's dominated by trucks and SUVs.
One way to make it sell better might be to give it the 2.0T as standard, and make it a powerful sleeper sports car right from the get-go. After all, the entry-level Mercedes A-class gets a 2.0T, and so it seems like it should be possible. But goals for mpg and price would seem to make the 1.5T more likely, plus if they gave away the 2.0T as standard what would they do for the type S? I guess they could put a more powerful version of the 2.0T in the type S.
Again, I don't think Acura is going to do this, but one way to get enthusiasm from the automotive press, and sales, would be to put the 2.0T in the Integra as standard equipment. After all, the msrp on the Accord Sport 2.0T is $33,000. If the Integra has the 1.5T and has a price almost as high, fairly or unfairly some might say why bother with the Integra. But the 2.0T in a vehicle a bit smaller and lighter than the Accord would be fast and might be better for sales. That would mean leaving the high mpg vehicles to Honda, but in what are seemingly the twilight years of gas cars why not? Maybe go out with a sleek and fast vehicle in the last five years or so before EVs start to take over?
If that back view of the new Integra is what the production model is actually going to be like, then it seems like maybe the rear quarter window treatment might be similar to what's found in the VW Arteon. The Arteon has an elegant pillarless design in the rear, which as shown in the pics below is also functional in that it makes for better rear visibility.
If the new Integra has the 1.5T, in some ways it's going to be a sleeker and fancier version of the Civic Hatchback Touring, which is (theoretically) available with a 6-speed manual.
For the auto versions of the Integra, my guess is that Acura is going with the 8-speed DCT that they developed for the last generation of the TLX. Probably Acura will give the new Integra a double-wishbone front suspension too. And if my guess is right that the new Integra is going to start at c. 32,000, it will be well worth it imho to pay 2k or so more than a Civic Touring for the styling, transmission, longer warranty, greater refinement, nicer seats with lumbar support, etc. But at the same time the Civic hatchback touring might be considered almost a discount Acura.
A leaked internal Acura document, which has now been taken down, confirms that the upcoming 2023 Integra will have the more powerful version of the 1.5T. The last version of the Civic Si with this engine was rated at 205 hp. The document even suggested that a 6-speed manual A-spec Integra might be sold for an msrp of c. $33.5 k + destination, which seems optimistic, and my guess still stands that this model would be 36k, or 35k+ 1k destination fee. Interesting that they might offer a manual on a few models.
The frameless rear window in the artistic rendering of the new Integra is probably a false tease. Acura did something similar with the artistic renderings of the TLX, but as we know that didn't pan out. I think there are structural and cost reasons why that isn't practical, even though VW was able to do it with their Arteon.
That's another thing I like about my TSX -- it was built in Japan. That, and its relatively small size. It was sold in Europe as an Accord, while in NA the Accords were substantially larger.
That's another thing I like about my TSX -- it was built in Japan. That, and its relatively small size. It was sold in Europe as an Accord, while in NA the Accords were substantially larger.
Yes, the TSX is a compact and nimble vehicle. I did a test drive of a 6-speed manual TSX around 2008 iirc, and I really liked it. Quite fun with the manual. Here are the dimensions of the 1st generation TSX.
Wheelbase 105.1 in (2,670 mm) Length 183.3 in (4,656 mm) Width 69.4 in (1,763 mm) Height 57.3 in (1,455 mm) Curb weight 3,318 lb (1,505 kg)
The new Integra is likely to mirror the dimensions of the new Civic Hatchback, which is actually not far off from the TSX in terms of size.
In terms of build quality, my guess is that the US-built Acuras are probably similar to those made in Japan, but I don't really know for sure. All of my Hondas and Acuras have been built in the USA or Canada. Our CR-V was built in Canada, and seems perfect as far as I can tell. My Ohio-built TLX seems flawless as well.
Interestingly, for this generation the Civic sedan is longer than the hatchback. Last generation they were the same iirc. The new Civic sedan is 183.3 inches long, while the Civic hb is 179.9. So yes, the Civic sedan is now the exact length of the first generation TSX.
Back in 2008 when I did the test drive of the TSX the price was the msrp, which I think was about 30k, and strangely the salesman didn't seems very flexible. He was a young guy who seemed to assume that if I was shopping for an Acura I must be really well off. Anyway, the larger and all-new 2008 Accord was about 4k less, even with navi, which in that era before smart phones was a useful feature, and so I went with that. But, looking back on it, I might have been happier in some ways with the TSX. As much as I wanted to tell myself that a top-line Accord was almost like an Acura, there was a significant difference in terms of refinement, road noise, handling etc. But with two kids back then, and sometimes taking trips with lots of luggage, really the Accord was the more practical choice. But these days I think the new Integra would probably be just right for me.
For now, I am betting against the CVT for the new Integra. A CVT just doesn't seem like the right transmission for a sport-luxury vehicle. I don't think BMW, Audi, MB, Lexus, etc. use CVTs on their non-hybrid vehicles, but are there exceptions to that?
The 8-speed DCT seems like it might be good paired with the 1.5T. I read somewhere that Acura's DCT couldn't take the power of the 2.0T, but my guess is that the 1.5T might work well with it.
Acura set a goal a couple of years ago of getting to a volume of 200,000 vehicles in the US. Clearly the chip shortage makes that impossible for the near future, but to try to get there at some point they need to have credibility in the market that I don't think a cvt would give them.
After all, your 28k Maverick has an 8-speed transmission. Why can't a 32k Integra?
Acura wants to sell more than 30,000 Integras a year, which for them would make it a high volume car.
The new Integra is likely to mirror the dimensions of the new Civic Hatchback, which is actually not far off from the TSX in terms of size.
Thanks for providing this comparison data. I wondered about the dimensional data, but not enough to look it up. There's no doubt that the new Civic with a six-speed is about the only car currently made that I could replace the TSX with, if the need arises.
The new Integra is likely to mirror the dimensions of the new Civic Hatchback, which is actually not far off from the TSX in terms of size.
Thanks for providing this comparison data. I wondered about the dimensional data, but not enough to look it up. There's no doubt that the new Civic with a six-speed is about the only car currently made that I could replace the TSX with, if the need arises.
And in six months or so there will be the choice of the new 2023 Acura Integra, which apparently will also be offered with a 6-speed manual.
Well, stickguy, maybe you should consider driving more! Sounds like your new Maverick with the 2.0T is going to be fun to drive.
And for something different, from French speaking Canada here's a 1-minute explanation in French of the advantages of owning a hatchback. I'm glad I love my TLX, otherwise I might be tempted by the new Integra hatchback.
Yes, I really liked the Mazda 626 of the 1980s and 1990s, esp. the 5-door hatchback. What year was yours?
Here's another high-mileage Acura, a 2013 1-owner RDX with 201,000 miles on it. According to the carfax only regular maintenance was needed to keep it going for those miles. The price seems way high to me for a vehicle with these kind of miles, but it does seem to be in nice condition, plus they've put some new tires on it. One significant thing they didn't bother to do, however, was the 200k tune-up. Almost as soon as someone buys it that'll need to be done. The 100k tune-up was done at 109k, and so I supposed there's a bit of time. The Acura/Honda 3.5 V-6 still needs a timing belt, and I'm glad that my 2.4 has a life-of-the-motor chain.
A tour of the Civic Hatchback. No test drives until Oct. 12. But this shows why a pillarless design would be great for the Acura Integra, because rear visibility doesn't look that good in the Honda hatchback.
Projected look of the future Integra 5-door. The renderings show an imagined S-type with the 2.0T and quad exhaust, but apparently that won't be available until model year 2024. The Integra coming in about 6-months will have the 1.5T and dual exhaust.
If the 2023 Integra looks like this, which seems quite likely, then it looks good to me. If I wasn't still in love with my TLX I might get one.
Compact size. Hatchback. Probably about the same room inside as a TLX. Available 6-speed manual. Starting at probably about $32k. Good mpg too.
If the chip shortage eases, then there's a good chance Acura will sell 30,000 or more of the new Integra, which might get Acura to their long-held goal of 200k sales in the US.
If the Integra follows what Acura did with the refreshed base 2022 RDX, the new Integra should have standard wireless CarPlay/AA, plus standard blind-spot monitoring. Although the ELS sound systems on the higher-level Acura's are really good, the base sound system is basically a top-end Honda system, and good enough imho.
If the 2023 Integra looks like this, which seems quite likely, then it looks good to me. If I wasn't still in love with my TLX I might get one.
Compact size. Hatchback. Probably about the same room inside as a TLX. Available 6-speed manual. Starting at probably about $32k. Good mpg too.
If the chip shortage eases, then there's a good chance Acura will sell 30,000 or more of the new Integra, which might get Acura to their long-held goal of 200k sales in the US.
If the Integra follows what Acura did with the refreshed base 2022 RDX, the new Integra should have standard wireless CarPlay/AA, plus standard blind-spot monitoring. Although the ELS sound systems on the higher-level Acura's are really good, the base sound system is basically a top-end Honda system, and good enough imho.
Lots of guesses in that post, my friend.
I woildn't assume it will have the same amount of interior room as the TLX - does the Civic have the same amount as the Accord?
I, too, like the looks of it - but, since it's a rendering, I'll wait for an actual mock-up to be released by Acura.
I think the Civic actually has slightly more interior room than the bigger TLX. The TLX has a really long hood, like luxury sport cars in the old days. The hood was also made long enough to fit the 6-cylinder for the Type S, although c. 95% of the TLXs sold have a 4-cylinder turbo. There's some empty space under the hood of the TLX with the 2.0T.
Anyway, even though the Integra is based on the Civic, it's possible that the Integra will get a long hood too. That artistic rendering kind of shows that. But yeah, we'll need to wait for several months to get an actual look a the real car and also get all the info about it. I'm looking forward to it!
This mechanic does a detailed disassembly of a Honda K-series engine from an Accord from the early 2000s. I've always assumed that almost all of the parts in an Acura engine were the same as in a Honda engine, but he says that the crankshaft, pistons, and some other parts are substantially upgraded in an Acura TSX K-series engine—and, I'm guessing, my TLX K-series. He talks about the TSX upgrades a bit starting at around 15:20 in this video.
Very interesting -- thanks for posting. My first Honda was a 150 cc motorcycle that I bought in Snowflake, AZ, in August of 1965. It's been said that Honda is an engine manufacturer that does the various vehicles/platforms as a sideline. A review of the early Honda motorcycles when they first came out said "the engine was built like a watch and wasn't a copy of anything." Certainly makes me happy to have the engine I've got in the TSX.
Here's a teardown of an Acura TSX K24 engine. You can see the Acura crankshaft in this video starting at c. 13:50. It does seem like the crankshaft is maybe a bit more heavy duty than in the Accord? And the Acura connecting rods do look a bit different than what's found in the Honda.
An 11-minute overview of the first generation TSX by a previous long-term owner of a 2006 with the 6-speed manual. At the end of the video he seems to regret selling it.
Someone said that the new Civic hatchback Touring with the 6-speed manual is almost like the Acura of Civics. I wonder what things Acura will bring to the new Integra that the Civic doesn't have?
bolder styling. The Si level (200) of HP. More upscale interior with family Acura design. Upgrade rear suspension maybe (not sure what they have stuck under the Civic).
The biggest difference I think is going to be the tranny. Same 6 speed, but even the Integra will not sell a lot of those. I just can't see Acura sticking a CVT in the Integra, and I don't think the corporate 9/10 speed has been used with the 1.5t (it is used with the 2.0t so certainly could). I would be interested if they resurrected the DSG gearbox to use with it. That could be fun, and a unique feature to make the Integra stand out. I don't expect it to happen though.
Comments
To clarify, the PS pump issue was fixed under warranty, but the rack replacement was on my nickel.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
"2023 Acura Integra Will Be a Swoopy Four-Door Hatchback
The new model's body style harks back to the original, but those hoping for a two-door sports coupe may be disappointed."
hopefully they have a CUV/tall hatch version ready to go too!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Somehow I think the new Integra will start at a price higher than that.
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But my guess is that it will start at about $32k, in part because the TLX starts at $38.5k with destination, in part because the outgoing ILX starts at $27.5k with destination, and in part because Acura has said (perhaps unrealistically) that the new Integra is going to be a volume car for them.
The Integra will likely use a high-end version of the 1.5T that is already used in the CR-V, Civic and Accord. May not be ideal, but using the 1.5T will keep the price low and the mpg high. I feel like keeping the K-series engine like I have in my TLX 2.4 would actually be cool, and keep with the high revving naturally-aspirated roots of the car, but that's probably unlikely.
Although Mercedes has said that it wants to move away from selling affordable cars, for now theoretically you can "build your own" A-class with a price including destination of $34,700. I've never seen an A-class equipped that way at that price, but supposedly it's possible, and I don't think Acura can charge as much as Mercedes for their entry-level vehicle.
Here's my guess for the pricing of the new Acura Integra....
Integra base c. $32k
Integra Tech 34k
Integra A-spec 36k
Integra Advance 38k
SH-AWD add 2k
If I'm guessing more or less right a loaded Integra with the the 1.5T and SH-AWD will top out at around 40K, which is just past where the TLX starts. Acura has hinted they'll offer an Integra Type S at some point (although probably not the first year), which I assume would use the 2.0T, and which would probably cost c. $42k.
I somewhat agree with stickguy that a stylish 4-door hatchback isn't likely to sell that well in this market that's dominated by trucks and SUVs.
One way to make it sell better might be to give it the 2.0T as standard, and make it a powerful sleeper sports car right from the get-go. After all, the entry-level Mercedes A-class gets a 2.0T, and so it seems like it should be possible. But goals for mpg and price would seem to make the 1.5T more likely, plus if they gave away the 2.0T as standard what would they do for the type S? I guess they could put a more powerful version of the 2.0T in the type S.
For the auto versions of the Integra, my guess is that Acura is going with the 8-speed DCT that they developed for the last generation of the TLX. Probably Acura will give the new Integra a double-wishbone front suspension too. And if my guess is right that the new Integra is going to start at c. 32,000, it will be well worth it imho to pay 2k or so more than a Civic Touring for the styling, transmission, longer warranty, greater refinement, nicer seats with lumbar support, etc. But at the same time the Civic hatchback touring might be considered almost a discount Acura.
The frameless rear window in the artistic rendering of the new Integra is probably a false tease. Acura did something similar with the artistic renderings of the TLX, but as we know that didn't pan out. I think there are structural and cost reasons why that isn't practical, even though VW was able to do it with their Arteon.
Wheelbase 105.1 in (2,670 mm)
Length 183.3 in (4,656 mm)
Width 69.4 in (1,763 mm)
Height 57.3 in (1,455 mm)
Curb weight 3,318 lb (1,505 kg)
The new Integra is likely to mirror the dimensions of the new Civic Hatchback, which is actually not far off from the TSX in terms of size.
Length 179 inches
width: 70.8 inches
height: 56.5 inches
weight: 3012
In terms of build quality, my guess is that the US-built Acuras are probably similar to those made in Japan, but I don't really know for sure. All of my Hondas and Acuras have been built in the USA or Canada. Our CR-V was built in Canada, and seems perfect as far as I can tell. My Ohio-built TLX seems flawless as well.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
28 / 37 / 31 (6MT)
The auto transmission for the Integra unknown, but I'm guessing the 8-speed DCT.
Sadly, nice as it is, I think the DCT is DED.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
The 8-speed DCT seems like it might be good paired with the 1.5T. I read somewhere that Acura's DCT couldn't take the power of the 2.0T, but my guess is that the 1.5T might work well with it.
Acura set a goal a couple of years ago of getting to a volume of 200,000 vehicles in the US. Clearly the chip shortage makes that impossible for the near future, but to try to get there at some point they need to have credibility in the market that I don't think a cvt would give them.
After all, your 28k Maverick has an 8-speed transmission. Why can't a 32k Integra?
Acura wants to sell more than 30,000 Integras a year, which for them would make it a high volume car.
"My 2012 TSX Tech Wagon just hit 250K! My son drives it now as I bought a 2019 RDX. It's been a great car!"
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
And for something different, from French speaking Canada here's a 1-minute explanation in French of the advantages of owning a hatchback. I'm glad I love my TLX, otherwise I might be tempted by the new Integra hatchback.
Not sure my local Honda dealer will ever have one to look at though. Makes it hard to consider something when it doesn't exist.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Here's another high-mileage Acura, a 2013 1-owner RDX with 201,000 miles on it. According to the carfax only regular maintenance was needed to keep it going for those miles. The price seems way high to me for a vehicle with these kind of miles, but it does seem to be in nice condition, plus they've put some new tires on it. One significant thing they didn't bother to do, however, was the 200k tune-up. Almost as soon as someone buys it that'll need to be done. The 100k tune-up was done at 109k, and so I supposed there's a bit of time. The Acura/Honda 3.5 V-6 still needs a timing belt, and I'm glad that my 2.4 has a life-of-the-motor chain.
https://www.acuraatoxmoor.com/searchused.aspx?Make=Acura&st=Price+asc
Mine was a 1991 LX Stick of course. Dark green over taupe. Fantastic seats. And moved along just fine with a whopping IIRC 110 HP
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https://www.motor1.com/news/538939/new-acura-integra-design-renderings/
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Compact size. Hatchback. Probably about the same room inside as a TLX. Available 6-speed manual. Starting at probably about $32k. Good mpg too.
If the chip shortage eases, then there's a good chance Acura will sell 30,000 or more of the new Integra, which might get Acura to their long-held goal of 200k sales in the US.
If the Integra follows what Acura did with the refreshed base 2022 RDX, the new Integra should have standard wireless CarPlay/AA, plus standard blind-spot monitoring. Although the ELS sound systems on the higher-level Acura's are really good, the base sound system is basically a top-end Honda system, and good enough imho.
I woildn't assume it will have the same amount of interior room as the TLX - does the Civic have the same amount as the Accord?
I, too, like the looks of it - but, since it's a rendering, I'll wait for an actual mock-up to be released by Acura.
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This model checks a lot of my boxes for a car. Basically a civic sport touring hatch with more styling and nicer seats and appointments.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Anyway, even though the Integra is based on the Civic, it's possible that the Integra will get a long hood too. That artistic rendering kind of shows that. But yeah, we'll need to wait for several months to get an actual look a the real car and also get all the info about it. I'm looking forward to it!
wonder when this is actually supposed to arrive? Because a compact hatch with a manual, is right up my alley!
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$9500.
A comment on the video said:
"So far I have 310k on my tsx . the best car JDM"
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The biggest difference I think is going to be the tranny. Same 6 speed, but even the Integra will not sell a lot of those. I just can't see Acura sticking a CVT in the Integra, and I don't think the corporate 9/10 speed has been used with the 1.5t (it is used with the 2.0t so certainly could). I would be interested if they resurrected the DSG gearbox to use with it. That could be fun, and a unique feature to make the Integra stand out. I don't expect it to happen though.
and of course, it will be $5k more expensive!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.