Luxury Lounge

brightness04

The rear seats are quite useable as trunk space in convertibles, thanks to the easy loading :-) The poor crash test result of the new 3 series convertible however is quite troubling indeed.

lexusguy

Thanks for the test results, LG!

Sure, here's a link to review. $35,000 Sport Sedans

brightness04

that's why all the work on an IS500 or something to that effect. But, sorry to say, it still will never be a 3-Series.

IS500 offers a better alternative to the new V8 M3 not the regular 3-series :-)

jlbl

"If the diesel varieties offer something like 220~240hp, is that an alternative to the 230hp 328i/528i or the 300hp 335i/535i??"

From extensive use of diesel/gas engines in recent times, consensus has grown among drivers and automotive journalists here that turbocharged diesel engines with less hp are comparable with more powerful gas engines for daily road use. Diesel varieties offering something like 220~240hp are a real alternative to the 300hp 335i/535i. I can say something similar from my own experience. When I bought my 530d (2004), I compared it to the 535i. I drove both on the road and chose d. (I also drove the 545i.) Torque, lower revs and speed-limits (both legal and electronic) are enough to level the equation with hp not in theoretical but in everyday use.

Anyhow, if hp is a must, BMW has now the 745d, with 4.4 V8 330 hp. And the cavalry race is to be continued…

Regards,
Jose

hpowders

Thanks again, this time for the link. I do remember reading this comparo, back in the day.

Another C&D comparo for this segment is overdue.

hpowders

Correct. Nobody should be interested in any vehicle that doesn't finish tied for first in a reputable crash test.

BMW should make an effort to rectify the problem quickly.

hpowders

"Turbocharged diesel engines with less hp are comparable with more powerful gas engines for daily road use."

This is why when BMW releases a 535id here, it should put a squeeze on 550i sales. The only people going for the 550i should be those folks who are having a hard time finding diesel fuel. That problem, unfortunately, is real as I can attest.

hpowders

"Hopefully" is right, my friend!

I'll easily "settle" for an X3 diesel or a 535id without asking too many questions.

I care more about putting less money in our enemy's pockets than any noticeable increase in power diesel may provide. It's all about the fuel efficiency.

If the vehicles are not ready by 08/2008, I'll try again in 08/2010, so I won't have to wait too long.

By that time the number of posts in Luxury Lounge should exceed the number in HELC. :surprise:

We are, I believe, at the very beginning of a major energy revolution in this country and its full implementation will go a long way to insuring a strong America down the road for future generations.

tagman

I think that forum will become "read only"
TM

hpowders

I believe you are correct.

blkhemi

Sorry HP, but the single-frame Audi/VW grille is here to stay. For quite a while. They believe that has something to do with their record-sales and newly found appeal for the cars. Quite possibly so.

The new and/or upcoming BMW, Jaguar, even MB grille design language speaks volumes of the Audi cars.

It's not really all that bad on the bigger cars, such as the A8. And they will freshen it up on the smaller cars.

lexusguy

Another C&D comparo for this segment is overdue.

They should wait until '09. That way they can include BMW, Audi, MB, Lexus, Infiniti, and whatever Volvo does with the S60. I think the next one is supposed to be based on the next gen Mazda6.

hpowders

It may be here to stay, but I find it an eyesore.

Thankfully, there's quite a bit of diversity among the upscale manufacturers.

I'll stick to the good old double kidneys. Surprise!

hpowders

The last comparo was for $35k vehicles. I guess the next one will be $45k minimum.

dewey

link title

A simpler and lighter BMW 1 series whose driving dynamics will be based on how light it is (about the weight of an E36). A lighter 1 series with a twin turbo 3.0L or a M series version is exactly my idea of a dream car. But in my situation we will still be needing our family BMW 5 series touring wagon.

This car would also look good as a cabrio.

dewey

Howard you want to save fuel.

Well your opportunity will soon arrive in the form of a 1 series. A twin turbo diesel should be quite a hoot to drive.

houdini1

Back in the early 70's a friend of mine had a brand new BMW 2002. He could really drive that car and nearly scared me to death a couple of times. This car sort of reminds me of that car. This one is much better looking but about the right size as I remember.

hpowders

Yes. I want to save fuel, Dewey. But I'm also 6'2"!

I'd need a chiropractor to get me out of that thing!

I must say though, that one Series looks pretty handsome from the front.

tagman

Yes. I want to save fuel, Dewey. But I'm also 6'2"!

I'd need a chiropractor to get me out of that thing!

In that case, if you don't go with an SUV, I'd recommend the 335i or 535i with the twin turbo!... only , of course, if the diesel version isn't available.

TagMan

hpowders

My prime choices for the summer of 2008, assuming diesel fuel is available, are the X3 diesel and the 535id. Tough choice for me between these two.

However if at that time the only BMW diesels available will be the X5 and 335id, I will lease the 335id, again assuming the fuel is available. This one should be one of the world's great driving experiences.

And if it comes down to the 535id vs the 335id, I would go with the 535id for its roominess, outstanding seats and spacious trunk.

dewey

Well I guess there's an advantage to being 5 '10. I can save gas and I dont need a chiropracter at the same time.

dewey

I still remember the BMW 2002 when I was 7 years old. My dad drove a 67 Ford Custom and his friend drove a 2002.
Ever since that day I had a bias towards BMWs.

bristol2

I still remember the BMW 2002 when I was 7 years old.

Are you now 12?

hpowders

True.

hpowders

Dewey, I remember when I was fresh out of college going to my first BMW dealer.
I had a bad case of BMW fever which was a rather serious case of "2002 on the brain"! Then I saw the price and I decided I wasn't ready yet!

But the virus lay dormant until 1993 when I finally got my first BMW, a beautiful dark green 325i. The only car I actually bought at lease termination. My stepson is still driving it.

drfill

The Lexus IS is intended to be a 3-Series competitor, but in reality it doesn't really stack up.

Lexus top brass?... they know it... that's why all the work on an IS500 or something to that effect. But, sorry to say, it still will never be a 3-Series.

We agree on one thing. The IS will not be a 3-series.

I also believe it is safe to presume that it was not Lexus' intention to mimic the 3-series to cull favor.

Lexus has shown that they have a different intent for this market. Mercedes has walked this line as well.

I don't agree with it, but the IS is moderately, if not typically, successful.

Lexus knows where the line is, and they refuse to cross over it. Too bad. :sick:

DrFill

tagman

Ahh... what's up Doc?

Seriously though, we've already gone rounds on this issue. I still believe the IS targets the 3-Series, and I also believe that it doesn't stack up. It could be better, darn it.

And, I do believe that there are some, but not most, that think to acquire it over the 3-Series. (In the same sort of way that ljflx acquired his G35 over the 3-Series.)

BTW, where've you been, Doc?

TagMan

tagman

The article headlines to "watch out Lexus LS600hL", but quite frankly, I don't see on the surface how this 204hp S-Class diesel hybrid could compare to the 438hp LS600hL, unless it somehow delivers surprisingly very good performance and gets outstanding mileage. THAT would certainly offer a reasonable alternative.

Here's the link:

link title

TagMan

tagman

blkhemi - This link is for you, my friend.

link title

TagMan

dewey

dewey

For now we are only going to see hybrid diesels in expensive cars like the MB S Class. A diesel premium together with hybrid premium is a hefty cost to pay for fuel efficiency. For the Lux market it may make sense. But not for the frugal mainstream market that is influenced mainly by dollars and sense.

The best news I heard from Honda is that they're discontinuing the hybrid Accord and replacing it with a very fuel efficient 2.2L diesel Accord that can sell in all USA without a urea pack.

dewey

Then I saw the price and I decided I wasn't ready yet!

The first brand new car I wanted was a BMW 325i but had to settle for a less costly manual Acura Integra instead. I had not a clue how to drive with a stick so I had to go with someone to pick up my car

hpowders

Yes, The Integra was popular in the day.

I bought a 1983 Mazda 626 which was the year when it had its first major redesign and the car magazines were raving about it. It may have made car of the year in one of them. Only they didn't say anything about how that car shook and felt totally unstable whenever you took it over 70 mph!

No problems in that regard with any of the 3 BMWs.

tagman

The best news I heard from Honda is that they're discontinuing the hybrid Accord and replacing it with a very fuel efficient 2.2L diesel Accord that can sell in all USA without a urea pack.

Yes... here's the link to an article about this wonderful news:

link title

TagMan

lexusguy

I bought a 1983 Mazda 626 which was the year when it had its first major redesign and the car magazines were raving about it. It may have made car of the year in one of them. Only they didn't say anything about how that car shook and felt totally unstable whenever you took it over 70 mph!

I never take Motortrend COTY awards very seriously. They have given the award to some downright terrible cars (in exchange for rumored ad dollars). While some losers occasionally make the C&D 10-best, they generally don't return the next year.

hpowders

Thanks for the research in finding it was actually Motor Trend.

Yes. The Mazda 626 of 1983 vintage was never heard from again after all those raves. I learned from that point on: you want a car, drive it for yourself after reading about it.

hpowders

I was looking over the consumer ratings for the 3 Series and I noticed one guy complaining about some turbo lag with his 335i sedan.

Do you notice any with yours?

Another negative mentioned was the large amount of brake dust, but I believe this has always been a BMW thing. My 3 BMWs sure had/have a lot!

hpowders

The hybrid Accord was a huge mistake. Hardly any fuel efficiency over the gasoline version. There was little justification for it.

Glad to see they will be pulling it and going with diesel.

Sowing the seeds of the upcoming diesel revolution.

dewey

The only lags I feel is in that very very rare instance of improperly shifting gears (only happens when my kids distract me about the music on my stereo). So yes turbo lag is a non-issue with my car.

Brake dust? I have brake dust galore. Every BMW has two distinguishing trademarks: a blue propellor logo and brake dust.

dewey

Honda publicly acknowledged that hybrid buyers favor fuel efficiency over performance. That is why the Camry hybrid and Prius are good sellers and the RX400H and hybrid Lexus GS and Toyota Highlander models are not selling so well. Also the demand for the hybrid LS in the USA is not strong relative to LS600h demand in Japan and Europe. As a result LS600h's sales are primarily allocated outside the USA.

I read many years ago that Toyota planned a hyrid Sienna shortly after a hyrbrid Highlander. My suspicion is that such a vehicle is non-existent because Toyota cannot make a heavy fuel efficeint hybrid minivan at this point of time.

And who in the world wants a performance hybrid minivan :sick:

laurasdada

Memory Lane: I was on the "waiting list" in '84 for the new Mazda 626, a handsome devil. If I remember, the early '80s were the time of self-imposed Japaneese import quotas to the US. Hot Japaneese models were sometimes tough to come by and MSRP (+) was likely. I gave up on the 626 and instead bought my first new car: '84 (or '85?) Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo, Very Red! Two words: Ya Hoo! Primitive fun with a big honkin' sun roof! That was replaced by the ubiquitous Acura Integra in '88. Which still may be the best screwed together car I've yet owned.

BTW: That two year old C & D comparo reminds of what a nice, well balanced piece of work the current TL is. It does compete with the contenders there and it's King of the FWDs! Yeah, yeah go ahead and sneer at being the King of FWDs. Still makes me happy...

2001gs430

About to pull the trigger on a brand new silver LX 470. I am getting huge saving bringing it from a US to Canada now that the USD is so weak. :surprise:

lexusguy

The hybrid Accord was a huge mistake. Hardly any fuel efficiency over the gasoline version. There was little justification for it.

The other problem was that the HAH was just too expensive. Why would you buy one when a TL was basically the same money? Toyota (I'm sure after carefully watching what happened to the Accord) was smart to keep the Camry hybrid out of ES price territory.

The diesel is definitely the best way for Honda to go. A Rabbit or Jetta diesel just can't change the negative stereotype that diesel has here the way a huge seller like the Accord can.

lexusguy

About to pull the trigger on a brand new silver LX 470. I am getting huge saving bringing it from a US to Canada now that the USD is so weak.

Sure you don't want to wait for the 570?

hpowders

The guy who said he feels turbo lag must be trying to stir the pot a bit. I haven't heard that from anybody else regarding the 335i.

Thanks, Dewey!

hpowders

"Honda publicly acknowledged that hybrid buyers favor fuel efficiency over performance."

Welcome Honda to planet earth!

"A performance hybrid minivan."

Uhh...who wants ANY minivan?

tagman

About to pull the trigger on a brand new silver LX 470. I am getting huge saving bringing it from a US to Canada now that the USD is so weak.

"Sure you don't want to wait for the 570?"

That shouldn't even be a question... WAIT for the 570!

TagMan

tagman

The diesel is definitely the best way for Honda to go. A Rabbit or Jetta diesel just can't change the negative stereotype that diesel has here the way a huge seller like the Accord can.

Yes, the Accord will give excellent credibility to the diesel alternative, but I doubt it will sell in giant numbers right out of the gate.

But I do expect it to ramp up as time goes on, and as other manufacturers start to market their diesels, and before you know it the public sees diesels everywhere, many delivering 50% - 100% improved mileage.

TagMan

dewey

About to pull the trigger on a brand new silver LX 470.

I dont mean to sound like a parrot but what I will repeat the same words of both Tagman and Lexusguy anyways:

WAIT FOR THE NEW LX MODEL!

I love deals myself. But a substantially dicounted deal on an obsolete asset like the LX470 is not necessarily a good deal at all. Do you find it mainly a good deal because of the US$ exchange rate? If you are worried that the Canadian $ may drop in the future then convert to US$ today or use the forward foreign exchange markets and buy the new LX at a future date.

Patience is a virtue and spending more money on the latest Lexus technology in the form of a LX570 versus an old LX maybe the best investment there is in the auto industry.

dewey

A Rabbit or Jetta diesel just can't change the negative stereotype that diesel has here the way a huge seller like the Accord can.

VW diesels are hot stuff especially here in Canada. Nothing negative about them at all. The new VW Jetta wagon is expected to achieve 60 US MPG HWY and 40 MPG City. And based on test drives in Europe those numbers aren't as bogus as those hybrid EPA numbers.