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Comments
"At this time, there are no dealers with "Elite of Lexus" status in your area. However, you will experience exceptional service at all our Lexus dealerships."
I really don't understand the hype about being an "Elite" Lexus dealer. I imagine that one dissatisfied customer can get a dealer off the "Elite" list (my assumption). My local dealer is no longer "Elite", but the sales and service have not changed in the six years that I have been dealing with them, always superior in all areas. If I have an unsatisfactory experience, I'll not hesitate to notify the owner and Lexus USA.
In particular I was interested in your comment that the 8-gear shifting is not noticeable. I was a bit worried about that because in the 6-speed going up a hill the shifting is definitely noticeable.
One thing that wasn't clear to me: Do the doors close themselves from a wide open position, or just from the last quarter inch. The latter was also in the '04 LS430, but the former would be a nice enhancement when parked on a sloping roadway.
Renny
Link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/08/automobiles/08auto.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1&ref=- - - - - - - business
Snippet from story re Lexus with Edmunds exec comment included:
In recent years, Lexus has been updating its bland image, most notably with the IS, a sports sedan aimed at younger, well-heeled buyers who otherwise would gravitate to the BMW 3-series or Audi A4.
Now IS is going to gain power and speed. On Monday, Lexus will show the IS-F, as well as a new version of the LF-A, a two-seater sports car it showed in Detroit two years ago. That car startled the industry but Lexus was silent about plans to build it. Now, it will, say Toyota officials, with an F-series designation.
Lately, Lexus has been looking at both ends of the market, from premium small cars to stratospheric luxury cars, to see where else it can go, said Bob Carter, its general manager. Officials have been intrigued to see the IS draw customers from Toyota’s Scion brand, which is aimed at young trend-setting buyers.
That suggests some young consumers might skip entirely the mainstream Toyota brand and head to Lexus, or other luxury car brands. In order to keep them, Toyota has no choice but to become more bold, Mr. Brauer of Edmunds.com said.
“There is an element within Toyota that says, ‘Let’s go beyond pure sales success and look at statements and positioning and what we want people to think about Toyota.’ They’re going to start playing a little more to that element than they have in the past.”
So the LF-A is a done deal as part of the image change and the IS gets more agressive. I'd expect the GS is next and the LS gets greater sport availabilty plus a tuned version. They should keep the tuned cars limited rather than go MB's route of tuning everything - including SUV's. I'd also expect that this will lock in the super (stretched version) of the LS initially dubbed as the L650 which may go to 600 horses.
Answer to your question : No , the doors do not close themselves from a wide open position .
the doors close themselves in the last fraction .
( no more door slamming )
however , there is a mechanism , that holds the doors open on an incline or recline , so they ( the doors ) don't bruise your legs ) .
Transmission : truly is a work of art
Seats : Very Comfortable to me . Flat Bottoms , and the lumbar is not near any pressure points .
Myself have returned cars from Lexus because of discomfort in the driver's seat . NOT IN THE LS 460 . ( seems as though someone was actually finally listening . )
FACT IS : THE VEHICLE IS A COMFORT MACHINE , WITH SOME ENGINE NOISE TO REMIND ONE IT IS A CAR , AND ULTIMATE
LUXURY .
I AM COMPLETELY SATISFIED WITH THE LS 460 , AND HAVE NO NEED FOR THE LS 460 LONG . ONE OF MY CLIENTS HAS ONE , AND HE DRIVES IT . IF SOMEONE DROVE HIM AROUND , HE MIGHT ENJOY THE REAR SEAT AND IT'S TOYS .
THE STD WHEELBASE MODEL ( ls 460 ) , ALLOWS CONTROL OF THE HOT SEATS IN THE REAR , ETC ... SO , THERE IS SOME TOYS IN THE STD TOO .
THE SATELLITE RADIO , BUILT INTO THE STANDARD RADIO IS WORLD UNTO ITSELF . NO WIRES , NO SPECIAL TRAINING TO OPERATE IT , JUST ALOT OF PRESETS FOR THE SATELLITE , AM , AND FM BANDS .
EVERY DAY WITH THIS AUTOMOBILE , IS A NEW EXPERIENCE .
THE PRICE WAS FULL LIST , $ 67,200 , NO DISCOUNT TO ME .
I NEVER PURCHASED A CAR AT FULL PRICE BEFORE .
mitchell rowe
Can you describe the mechanism that holds the doors open on an incline or recline any more? It sounds very helpful. How do you engage or release it?
It sure sounds like I am going to have to get one of these. Still hoping they will begin to deal a bit in a few months.
Renny
I have no knowledge of the mechanics of the doors ability to hold themselves . I do know the door opens WIDER . when the door is fully extended open , from the driver's seating position , I have to reach for the door to start the pull shut . On the LS 430 , the reach is arms length , and easy for me ( 5' 7" ) to grad the cut out and pull the door shut . Not so on the LS 460 .
Waiting a few months : takes you closer to to the 2008 model . This brings you closer to standard yearly depreciation , and my guess is the price of the std model WILL GO UP ( ALOT ) . ( on the 2007 model ) . The car is too cheap in price compared to the other manufacturers with similar offerings in germany . Compared to itself , ( the std vs. the long ) is $ 15 k . ( the long version is about $ 82.3 K ) ...
Further comment on " Deal a Bit " : If a few thousand $
will change one's life , this is the wrong price point car for that person . The dealer is going to sell it someone else .
-----------------
SIGNING OFF , REMOVING MYSELF FROM THE EDMOND'S SITE .
-----------------
mitchell rowe
Hmmm, you mean like that found in my 2004 Acura TL?
Well there's a surprise! Did ya think it would be GM or Ford???
In LA the out the door price is now in the vicinity of 100K
Would you explain how the LS 460 is priced at $ 100 k
in california , when in the east the vehicle is $ 67.2
for a loaded standard , and $ 81.8 for a loaded long ?
mitchell rowe
$ 92 k . If you have the time , would you reprint the "build" that comes to $ 92 k .
I have seen several $ 82k ( + or _ ) , with the optional packages that do not overlap .
Best Regards ,
mitchellrowe
As time passes there will be further discounts and then nothing beyond a point. But that point will be hard to predict during the model year. This is a great car and I turned down several discounted LS 430 demo's to wait on inventory buildup and a discount from the 70k MSRP.
Any guesses on how high the discounts might go on the SWB model during the 2007 sales year..? Thanks.....
Started looking around for something w/air suspension and concluded my best bet would be the Touring Suspension package which did not include all of the backseat amenities I would never use. It was a discouraging experience since most dealerships did not know what I was talking about..."we would have to make a special order, wait 3-4 months,etc. etc." Finally I connected with a dealership that understood my desire and they explained why nobody had any...Lexus was not allocating many of these in Southern California. But, they said "lets give it a whirl" and 5 weeks later they snagged a model with a pleasing color combination which they were willing to sell at MSRP w/o loading it with LoJack etc.
The car is silver with a gray interior, and with the (standard) 5 spoke wheels has outstanding curb appeal. I have driven it just a few miles but everything seems to work ok and it is indeed quieter than my 430 in spite of earlier comments to the contrary by the undersigned. Note the 460L model includes laminated side glass which is probably very effective in reducing noise. The hill-holder feature is neat, and I don't have the courage, yet, to try the park-o-matic, but stay tuned!
I'm curious to hear your impressions comparing the 460L to the 430 after driving it for a while. Does it "feel" like a bigger car? Does the Touring Suspension limit body sway noticeably more in hard cornering? I have zero interest in getting a larger car than my 430 or any more back seat amenities, but I don't want less rear leg room, and I wouldn't mind flatter cornering as long as the ride isn't any more harsh.
The key is the adaptive air suspension (also available in the standard version) which can be modified to three different settings. My default setting is "sport" for normal driving but for bad roads or speed bumps you can quickly soften the suspension. The Touring adds, in addition to the adaptive suspension, the larger wheels, tires and brakes, variable gear ratio steering and is a bit lower to the ground. I find that it handles great and without any resulting harshness. Brakes are excellent.
"I have posted several comments asking others for a comparison of the 460 vs 430. A short test drive in a 460L having air suspension etc.(MSRP~$86K) seemed to be more pleasing to this geezer than the '06 430 I was currently driving."
However, a 460L with air suspension and variable ratio steering has always been a different matter for me. I was able to test 3 different vehicles and they all seemed more pleasing than my '06. None of the 3 had the Touring Package. I also drove the 460 SWB and it definitely was nothing special compared to the '06 LS430. Let me reiterate the LS 430 is a wonderful automobile, and purchasers of the 460 should, at best, expect refinements rather than revolutionary improvements over the 4XX predecessors.
I notice the treadwear rating of the 19" Bridgestones is 140 which implies the Lexus disclaimer on tread life is perhaps true. However, since I am approaching 80 years I do not hotdog a car and perhaps they will satisfy my needs just fine. In closing it is well to recognize the Touring Package is the only wheel alternative to those (IMO) hideous wheels on all other 460 vehicles. And, aftermarket wheels may not be a very good solution...refer to the AUDI A8 forum and read the nightmares encountered when trying to get the tire pressure sensors to work properly on another wheel!
Lexus gets this car to $1500 or so less than the $82.495 in my desired car by susbstituting Lexus link, the rear seat upgrade package and the advanced parking guidance system for the air suspension and pre collision options. I much rather have the latter and don't need or want Lexus link, rear seat upgrade or parking guidance (but at $500 the latter doesn't matter much either way).
Trunk size - in the way I configured it I end up with an 18' trunk which is fine. But if you take the rear seat upgrade or the exec chair upgrade you lose a third of that and get to a 12' trunk. That's too small even though I could live with it as I use my SUV for vacation travelling. But I'd much prefer a car with an 18' trunk, an air suspension and the pre copllision technology than the link, fancy rear seat controls for my kids and a parking gizmo I'll never use. Don't know why Lexus doesn't configure the cars the way I did rather than lump options that are not all that necessary into their bigger packages. Car arrives in 60-90 days and I may need to extend my lease one more month as a result.
I remember from my '04 that sometimes the fuel gage needle would not reset after a top-off, so in a session with Vaughn at Lexus chat, he confirmed one must add a MINIMUM of 3 gallons for the afore mentioned parameters to become resettable.
Thanks for the well wishes.
I do have a question. Does the pre-collision system also include the dynamic cruise control, or is the latter included in the base model? I studied the Lexus website but all it says is "cruise control", without specifying "dynamic" like they used to. I've gotten very used to the car by itself maintaining a safe distance to the car in front of me and wouldn't want to give that up.
Again, congratulations!
Renny
Fortunately, you influenced me to advance to the 2004 LS and then advised me to go for the LS600---what changed your mind for your preference?
Anyway, having put a $2000 deposit down on a LS600 in November of 2005, I should be first in line at the dealer when they finally arrive this spring. You helped to get me to that point. Maybe I'll take it and maybe not. It has to be vastly superior to my '04.
Just wondering about your change of position.
They all bundle their options now into packages, but the Japanese did it first. Of course, 20 years ago, options on a Japanese car were few.
Congratulations!! What are you trading in?
I wouldn't want you to ever think I'm not paying attention to you. That's terrific news! I remember suggesting the LS460L to you a ways back, so I must admit I am glad to see it finally come down this way. I truly believe the LS460L is the absolute best choice of ALL the LS variants. Good move, indeed.
BTW, ever get that FJ? New biz deal must be going OK!!
Congratulations again!
TagMan
Looks like the LS600HL is going to be a June car and I don't want to wait and as it is I'm going to run 10K miles over my lease mileage because I've been doing a lot of business driving. By the time June rolls around who knows where I'll be in mileage if I waited that long. I also need to up my lease miles to 20K a year and that will hurt the residual of the LS600HL a lot more than the LS460L. We are going to buy an AWD for my son so that'll serve as an emergency AWD 2nd vehicle in the house. My guy here says that there's a lot of interest in LS600HL and it may go $10-20K over list (scary).
Re the 600HL - note my post to Cyclone.
Rennybosch - I'm not sure to be honest. I know the Dynamic laser cruise is part of the pre-collision but I thought it was also part of certain lux packages or a stand-alone.
Obviously you thought the LS was superior to the S, but I see where you kept an S for 24 hours, what did you think of it?
M
Business deal - yes I will get it done, have lined up the financing and am very excited about it. I'm also lining up a second deal for late summer. Busy business year for me.
S550- styling really grew on me and I gave it serious consideration. Great car to say the least but MB's going to have to prove they've really gotten their reliabiity back before I pull the trigger there. I've heard some bad stories locally - again electronics not automotive. MB dealer let me have the car for the better part of a day and IMO they've become as courteous as the Lexus dealer here. I loved the car. In a real change of events it's MB that is dealing as I could have gotten an S550 4-matic at $6K under list and on a lease deal it was only about $240 more than the LS460L because of that discounting.
FJ cruiser - love it. I had more people looking at me in the FJ cruiser than in the S-class and LS460L combined when I drove it. I almost want it for myself. That's an autumn issue.
Thanks to all for the well wishes.
I still dream of an AWD with air suspension and pre-collision, but in a short body (I still don't see the need for a bigger car than the LS I have now). The earliest I would be looking is 2008 or '09 (unless I can pass my current '05 on to my wife sooner), so maybe by then Lexus will come through - but I'm worried that they will keep all the good stuff out of the SWB model.
Coming from you and put that way, it really is!
M
The S-Class styling has grown on me too, and like you I'll give it serious consideration when the time comes.
The other thing I relaized for the first time is that the cars are not shipped here the way Lexus wants. They are shipped the way dealers order them in bulk. So if a sport tuned air suspension is not readily available at your dealership (base car or touring package) it's because of the dealer. At my place they only get 1 or 2 air suspensions a month at their choosing. After I configured the car the manager noted that the packages I wanted may be a better way to bulk order the LS460L in the future. Until now I thought this was a Lexus production issue, not a dealer ordering issue. Also the L is a lot more popular than Lexus expected so I would think they are going to go that route with future flexibility.
BTW - I don't know what the heck C&D tested but they are out in left field on their take on this car. You can feel the power of this car immediately vs the LS430 (as you can feel the difference in the S550 vs the S500) and the brakes are excellent. The car has stepped up a level and C&D stepped it down, got the weight wrong, the acceleration wrong and the braking wrong. This I can now say from first hand experience after driving it for a day and pushing the car to over 80mph several times. The biggest drawback to the car IMO is the small trunk if you get the exec chair or rear seat upgrades.