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Comments
Don
While I don't own a Forester, I can tell you my mileage drops horrendously during the winter months. My car's EPA ratings are 20/29 and I never even come close in the winter.
- Lou
Greg
IE is View|Text Size|Large etc. (or similar depending on your version).
Ddunbar, I think you need to give it a few more miles - at least a thousand or two. And XC is right about the winter formulated gas hurting mileage. Even if the gas is the same, winter hurts mpg.
Steve, Host
tidester, host
I just tried to install the Google toolbar on Netscape 6.2 and it wouldn't take it.
I'm not convinced that winter should make that much of a difference here in the SF Bay Area. The weather is pretty mild year-round and the gas has MBTE or ethanol added throughout the year here.
Don
I am looking at the Bridgstone Turanza LS - T, a new design that is said to be better than most all-seasons in snow and rain, and has a design that is claimed to maintain original traction as the tire wears. Reports by a small number (24) of users rate it as the best in snow of any all-season in the Tire Rack survey. It also rates very high in most other categories. The H-rated version is rated much lower in snow traction. Does anyone have any experience with this tire?
I'm just glad Bill Gates didn't decide to go into the SUV business.
tidester, host
More on topic, Japan's Subaru sees 2003 global sales rise 2.4% and the Forester is going to India.
Steve, Host
Cheers
Pat
Snowing every day!
This is a prescription for dedicated snow tires, no? Expensive and a hassle for sure, but it might save you from an accident.
rochcom: The Turanzas are quite pricey for an all-season tire, no? If it does snow a lot where you are, it might be cheaper in the end to get dedicated winter tires.
Ken
As for dedicated winter tires, that is a good suggestion also. My past experience with them (Nokian Hakka 10's at the time) though, is that they were absolutely great in snow, but compromised normal wet and dry handling. And in a typical winter, I spent much more time on wet roads (thanks to the heavy use of salt) than snowy ones. After using them for 2 seasons, I didn't bother the next few years.
The daily snow here has been an inch or two at a time and it is cleared fairly quickly. We normally have about 13 snows a winter, but in the past few years we have been spoiled with much less. After reviewing the recent tire tests in Comsumer Reports, I find that some dedicated snow tires have no better traction in snow than some of the all seasons, at least when new. So, I am looking for an all season that has superior snow capabilities. The Turanza LS seems to fill the bill. Consumer Reports promitsed to test it, but who knows when. Any other suggestions are welcome.
This does not solve the problem of the fluid frozen in the lines but perhaps the engine heat would take care of that.
Since no one seems to be checking....you also better look into what your radiator is protected to.
Yikes
After a lengthy absence interstate and one replaced tyre (tree fell over in front of me and only safe route was over it as a guy was tail gating me - sidewall slashed and alignment not perfect afterwards - not sure whether the torn ligaments in the lower back were the tree removal, the tyre changing or lifting the boat off the trailer of a friendly law enforcement officer who came to help us drag the rest of the tree off the road) I can confirm that Geolandars last safely about 50,000 km or about 30,000miles.
They are a Mud and Snow tyre and hence softer than straight highway tyres. Minimum tread depth is about 3/16 inch and they go off noticably below this. You should not compare a 4wd tyre for mud/snow with a straight highway tyre.
If you are buying a Forester you are buying a far superior vehicle for poor conditions. You should not expect the tyres to stick to the road as you would a vehicle with less adhesion. Do you want tyre economy or to stay on the road?
Cheers
Graham
I need to say that I live in the WNY snowbelt and we have had an extrordinary series of significant lake effect snows this year. If you know what a snow fence is....mine is completely under snow. Also note that the ski area I teach at has a historical snowfall average of 291"
OK...enough background....the SP5000s have performed excellently in every condition I have exosed them to....dry/wet/slushy/light snow/deep snow. Have not tested them on black ice....but I expect they would be WORTHLESS as is every street tire I've ever heard about including CHAINS.
I suppose dedicated snow tires would be a good choice ...but at this point given the HARSH conditions I routinely drive.....the SP 5000s were a great choice for me!
Thats my story....and I'm sticking to it : )
For the record I got 41K out of the Geolandars, and I've had my Forester for three years as of Saturday (49K miles).
Ed
My 2002 Forester has been doing this lately. I believe that I have a bad gas cap. Gassed up on a Wednesday; light on Friday; off following Tuesday. Gassed up on again on next Wednesday; light on again on a Friday. Still on as of today.
I tighten and re-tighten the darn thing and it just doesn't feel and sound right when it's "clicking".
Talked to dealer after first episode. Of course they think it should be no problem for me to drive 185 miles one-way for them to check it out. Tried to convince them to send me a new gas cap, but got nowhere with that.
Any ideas what to do until such time that I happen to be in neighborhood of the dealer?
Jack Frost and Big Boulder in the Poconos? :-)
tidester, host
I wanted to put in a really strong plug for Santa Cruz Subaru. From my initial contact with Sandy Charney and his no-nonsense competitive pricing and straightforward way of doing business, through my interactions with various others at SC Subaru as they found and prepped our car, every interaction was a pleasure. For any of you over the hill in San Jose, I recommend driving the extra miles!
Cheers,
Steve
Btw, we have a '02 Forester S+ with leather. Bought it in Dec'01. Already put on 29K on it !! Got very excited an took too many road trips in Summer '02. Also, my wife had to serve as a construction site supervising engineer and the car picked up a lot of mileage that way. The car has been great for her especially while reaching off-road construction sites.
We also love the zippy city driving it affords. The huge sun-roof is a huge hit with friends. And the cold weather package is really serving well in the continuous freezing temperatures up here in Upstate NY (tomorrow its supposed to be in single digits !!).
Apart from the CEL, we have had problems with a rear seat belt buckle being defective, and the seams coming off the driver side seat leather cover. Once last month we also had the vibrations associated with ice accumulating in the wheel wells overnight. My wife was really scared by severe vibrations on the steering wheel as well the car as soon as she went above 40mph on the highway. The problem went away as the day progressed. Subaru should really do something about this -- I have seen it mentioned on this board before.
In spite of all that, essentially we just love the car -- this has been our only car till now and we need another one -- something much cheaper and used. None of the Subarus are within our affordable limits and none of the other car we have test driven so far measures up to our Forester. Realistically, of course, we should not expect a 99 Civic EX or a 98 Accord to be have the same driving charactersitics as a Forester. But is seems our little Subie has more or less spoilt us....let's see what happens.
Sorry for all the rambling. We have just sort of regained that first love we had with our Subaru while car shopping again, and thought it would be nice to share with people who share the passion.
I usually check before I exit my garage ...but often forget.
I also agree that Subaru could engineer this issue away.
John
thorsett: so, you worked with Sandy? was Nick (another sales guy) around? how much over invoice did you end up paying, if no secret?
Lou- You're kidding right? I thought is was amazing enough that MSN bothered to respond. I'd probably die of a heart attack if Mr Heraud were to respond to negative criticism.
-Frank P.
Bad gas mileage- Extremely hard to diagnose due to all the variables. Winter fuel mix, colder weather, change in driving behavior or commute, tire pressure, octane rating, ad nauseum... can all effect your MPG. And here I was feeling sorry for myself because my last few tanks have dipped below 25 MPG.
CEL- I had it twice in rapid succession on my 01 Forester when it had approx 8k. Both times it was the same bad oxygen sensor (there was apparently a bad batch from the manufacturer). Then nothing until a couple of weeks ago when it came on again (43k). Odd thing is that it turned itself off after a couple of days (not gas cap related either). FWIW, my guess is that something like 90% of all CELs (across all makes and models) are gas cap related.
Windshield- Still haven't figured out if the Forester's windshield is more prone to cracking or not. And if so why? It's certainly no more vertical that many other SUVs/trucks that are on the road. Regardless, I don't buy the softer glass argument since I'm sure that Subaru doesn't have a exclusive arrangement with their windshield supplier.
-Frank P.
Sandy called after my initial inquiry. He did the basic work, but when he was out Morgan looked after us. (She gets great reviews from colleagues who have dealt with her.) I believe it was Nick who prepped the car and went over it with us; he was also good to deal with. So you probably can't go wrong with anyone there. The first offer they made on the car was a hundred over; we didn't try to haggle it further. In exchange, they made no attempts to sell us on expensive extras or unwanted options. --steve
As for pricing and no-haggling, however, that is the norm with many Bay Area Subie dealers. Carlsen, Diablo and Marin all have similar up-front, no-nonsense sales. Most will show you invoice price and add their several hundred $$ margin. Santa Cruz just has nicer folks to deal with. ;-)
Ken
We do go there in the summer for the Blues Festival.
tidester, host
Overall, I have had my 2002 Gold Forester S for seven months and have 8,600 miles on it. No problems what so ever. I live in a very hilly area with narrow curving roads. The Forester handles very, very well, especially on slippery surfaces.
the only document i was ever able to find is one from australia. i hope this link works. If not try searching for messages i posted or at the australian subaru site. the document includes this:
one dubious thing though is that 165hp = ~124kW, so australian foresters might be tuned a bit differently to get better mileage (or should it be kilometreage??!!)
cheers
Did you talk to them about putting a Forester in there? (there ... back on topic
17mpg does seem really low after just getting 24mpg. Try to "clone" the behaviors from when you got that 24mpg tank, meaning take the same commute at the same time, if possible, driven in the same manner. Eliminate as many variables as possible to try to duplicate that mileage.
If your windshield washer fluid froze, it may be that the alcohol from the fluid evaporated. You might try adding rubbing alcohol to see if that helps, but I'm not sure it'll melt what's already frozen. Disclaimer: I'm not sure if the alcohol will do any harm, so try this at your own risk.
Another idea is to add a fluid that can withstand cooler temps, prestone makes stuff that claims to work up to -40 degrees, something like that. I've seen stuff that is purple or yellow instead of blue, maybe try some of that.
CEL: try the gas cap first, but you have to reset the ECU to clear the light. Disconnect the negative battery terminal, wait 20 minutes, reconnect, start her up and let her idle til warm.
Ice on the wheels? Try cleaning the wheels, even waxing them. If they are slippery, the ice won't stick. Works like a charm and keeps your wheels looking clean as a bonus.
For those splash guards, yes, I'd paint them black. Subaru sells touch-up paint but I don't think spray cans are sold.
The windshield supplier for the Forester is Carlex, who supplies them for many Japanese-brand vehicles, including Mazda, for instance.
-juice
-mike
Cool, that makes the 4th time I'm quoted or mentioned in a car-related article.
-juice
Forester prices have remained remarkably flat, I think my 1998 actually would cost you more than a 2003 X model if you added all the extra content to mine.
-juice