Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

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Comments

  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I think they're now fabric, instead of plastic.

    If you're not interested in the turbo, I'd say get an '03 while there are still some around, and save a few bucks.

    Bob
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Bob says, about the '04 XS sunvisors: "I think they're now fabric, instead of plastic."

    They definitely are now fabric, so if they were plastic in '03, that would be another change.

    Speaking of visors, what's the best, least-damaging way to get those hideous yellow adhesive warning stickers off?

    jb
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    This comes up now and then and one person claimed success with that goof-off stuff. Everyone else has said it's impossible, and the easiest solution (besides learning to ignore them) is to recover the visor with new fabric.

    Steve, Host
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    Ken: I have no idea why Subaru recommends that particular rotation scheme, but my guess is that it must have something to do with AWD. I've always done cross rotation on my FWD cars.

    Bob: visors in our 03 XS are fabric (matches the headliner), so I don't think that's a new feature. Maybe onthe X model?

    Craig
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The 2004 also got collapseable pedals, to further improve the already "Best Pick" IIHS score, i.e. more safety.

    -juice
  • ken_from_njken_from_nj Member Posts: 105
    i was wondering that exact same thing ken, i recently did my 1st rotation following the manual recommended same-side rotation (not cross)but it was discussed here to do the cross. not really sure which way to do it for future rotations. - ken
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    "The 2004 also got collapseable pedals"

    Yup, forgot about those. I'm not sure I like that idea, though. In a panic stop situation, the driver might apply the brakes really hard. It would be horrible if the pedal collapsed. I'd like to know how much force is necessary for the pedal to break away, and by how much that differs from the maximum effort a strong driver might apply in an emergency.

    jb
  • nygregnygreg Member Posts: 1,936
    Outside of the noise, how do you like the Avid H4s? They are on my list for the OB. My current noisey Sport A2s are on their last leg.

    Greg
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    I personally don't think the front-to-back only rotation pattern applies to tires that are not directional. There's nothing about AWD that I can think about that would limit the rotation pattern.

    A local tire alignment/suspension speciality shop mechanic told me that the proper way to rotate tire is based on it's wear pattern. If you're getting even wear with front-to-back, then stick with it. If you are getting a little more wear on one side than the other, then cross-rotation is probably better (again, assuming you're not on directional tires).

    Ken
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    Still shopping (highlander, tundra, 4runner) but keep coming back to Forester. I'd like to get a feel for how the Forester handles off-pavement duties, especially rocky roads. (You Eastern guys/gals have documented snow ability well). Not talking real off-roading but rather fairly gnarly access roads (rock - not dirt) to desert trailheads and the like. I live on the edge of the Mojave Desert (eg, Eastern Sierras, Death Valley) in California. Although I'm not out in the boonies everyday or even every week - I don't want to have to worry about the Forester when I do head out.
    Sure would appreciate hearing your 'off-pavement' experiences...

    thanks again,
    -srp
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Hmm, my experience off pavement has been mostly the opposite, i.e. soft sand, dirt, grass, mud, etc. No rocks besides some steep gravel trails, stuff like that.

    Angles of approach and departure are not that steep, I'd be concerned about scraping bottom. Primitive can take care of that with skid plates:

    http://www.writerguy.com/primitive/skid.htm

    But I'd still be concerned about clearance, because you could bottom out. Existing lift kits have not yet been successfully fitted to 2003+ Foresters.

    Cross shopping a Tundra? Wow. That's a first.

    4Runner, Pathfinder, and Liberty would be better suited, but none are car-like and efficient like the Forester is. Those are the trade-offs you have to consider.

    -juice
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    are fine. They're a little more slippery in the snow, however. The H4s are "car" tires, whereas the stock Geolanders are borderline "truck/SUV" tires, and may be able to withstand a bit more abuse. I'm going to the tire dealer tomorrow to see what the scoop is with the noise.

    Bob
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Juice says to akasrp: "Cross shopping a Tundra? Wow. That's a first. 4Runner, Pathfinder, and Liberty would be better suited, but none are car-like and efficient like the Forester is. Those are the trade-offs you have to consider."

    Not that I'd want one (definitely not!) but shouldn't the Xterra also be high on the list for the usage srp described? Maybe also the Suzuki Grand Vitara. All of these have low-range transfer cases, making rock-crawling more feasible.

    jb
  • kajkokajko Member Posts: 70
    srp

    my experience in rocky terrain w/Forester is this: as long as there are no large boulders and big dips in the roads (crossover angle), you'll be fine on "high-clearance required" roads. 1st gear is pretty low (in MT) but AT will be even better for crawling. nice thing is that you'll be able to clear 7" rocks without worrying about the diffy (the bottom of the Forester is relatively flat). the bad part is, as juice mentioned, entry and exit angles. there were a couple of times i scratched the hitch receiver, but i also attribute that to the load, which makes the back sag quite a bit.

    to remedy that and for better clearance, i am crossing my fingers for receiving sturdier springs in the next couple of months from Australia. this will greatly improve my Forester's Utility part of the SUV!

    i have the Primitive skid plate and it is as sturdy as can be. my next project is protecting the gas tanks. to reduce body flex on and off road, i just installed a front strut tower bar. will have to report after some time...

    one more thing: the center differential is very nice and IMHO actually makes the Forester better than many std 4x4 trucks (which have both front and rear open diffs and constant 50:50). oh, did i mention that on my last outing mpg was 30.6 ?

    ;-)

    cheers, kajko
  • laker64laker64 Member Posts: 9
    I would like to upgrade the stereo a bit. Would it be better to just get the upgraded speakers &/or tweeter kit from Subaru or do I also need to upgrade the stereo tuner itself? BTW, we are VERY satisfied with the vehicle. I think it's the top mini SUV.
  • grugrugrugru Member Posts: 20
    Any shortcuts to identifying the "best" (quietest M+S rated) replacement tires for my 2001S? We're at aboot 40k mi and one (a replacement due to a 2" hole in an original) is going down fast. I don't mind buying a new set since in another four months the NW will start getting wet again - and the tires are the things on your car that make contact with the road, to paraphrase....
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    Just took my wife's Forester off road this weekend on a rutted dirt trail with lots of small rocks and gravel. Put the auto trans in "1" and it was perfect going uphill and downhill. Driven sensibly, the car does great, you just need to know your limits. If the ground clearance and approach/departure angles are sufficient for the kind of off road travel you anticipate (which I would call casual or light offroading) then the car is probably OK.

    For reference, I have driven a 4x4 Ford pickup on the same trail, and I'd say the Forester was far easier to navigate. Being small and nimble has payoffs sometimes.

    Craig
  • akasrpakasrp Member Posts: 170
    Thanks all, I really appreciate the off-road tales. Happy to hear all this. Primitive skid plate and a (PIO) diff'rential protector (and a watchful eye) and I ought to be able to go where I want with minimal to no worries. fwiw, I have piloted my old trusty (now sold) '87 honda accord 5peed MT hatch over many of these same oil-pan killer roads (albeit white-knuckin' ) and lived to tell the tale. I'm no off-road maniac and have no aspirations to be - just hoping the Forester can take me just a bit farther & with a tad less fraying of the nerves.

    Best of all, I won't have to drive a (cough) truck day-to-day!

    thx x2!
    -srp
  • ducktapeguyducktapeguy Member Posts: 115
    You should be fine. Weak point of the forester is the low ground clearance (and angles), but if you're careful and slow, then you should be fine. I've been through a lot of the off road trails in Joshua Tree and San Gabriels, the forester does fine. And I don't even have the front skid plate, yet. Just be careful of some of the larger rocks and steeper ditches. My friend was following in his Tacoma TRD and he was pretty impressed with the car. If I had the front skid plate, I wouldn't be worried at all. I'd say it would easily handle whatever a highlander could do, but probably not as much as the Tundra or 4runner. If you find that you still have problems, there's always the lift kit that will take care of everything.
  • maverick1017maverick1017 Member Posts: 212
    can someone help clear the fog in my head on this subject? I can't remember if its a regular impreza or the 2.5RS front strut bar that would fit a 98 Forester. Anyone know?

    Thanks
    Mike
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Yes, you could add XTerra and Grand Vitara XL7 to the list, but I don't think those are nearly as refined, so I purposely left them off.

    Hop from a Forester to one of those, and you'll feel like a time machine sent you back 2 decades. At least. Not so with the Pathfinder or Liberty.

    Frank: you can find an in-dash 6CD changer out of a WRX on E-bay, they go for about $150 nowadays, and they plug right in easily.

    -juice
  • maverick1017maverick1017 Member Posts: 212
    went to the dealer the other day, the mechanics said the black stuff on the inside of the antifreez overflow reservoir is dust from the accessory belts as they wear down. They said nothing to worry about. Well, got that mystery solved.

    Mike
  • dcdouglasdcdouglas Member Posts: 28
    One of the simplest (and cheapest) things to do to improve any stereo is to improve the speakers. Pick out a good pair (or two) of 3-ways and install them. Try to get the ones with tweeters you can aim to produce the best sound image.

    Better yet, get the aftermarket tweeter kit and sink a subwoofer under the passenger seat (or place it in the rear). You'll be able to squeeze out more pronounced high and low range sounds from the factory receiver.

    Two places I've had success with online shopping for car stereo parts are J&R Music World and Crutchfield. You get these nifty kits and great instructions from Crutchfield.

    --dcdouglas
  • jdemmersjdemmers Member Posts: 2
    This has probably been covered before but if so, I missed it, so.... My '03 Forester is at ~7500 miles and I was wondering what folks have found to be the usual list of maintenance services that are performed by the dealer at this point (and cost). So far I've changed my own oil at 1000 and 3,500 miles but want to cover all of the bases regarding service on this car (something I haven't done very well with my previous vehicles). The one call I made to the closest dealer to me gave me a price of $67 for oil change, tire rotation, brake check/adjustment, fluid and bulb checks, lubrication, and a host of other minor checks. Is this high, low or average in your experience?

    Thanks in advance to everyone who responds - I find this message board highly informative and well worth the daily read.

    - jim
  • leo2633leo2633 Member Posts: 589
    I got 60K miles from the original Geolandars on my 2001 Forester S. I rotated them in a cross pattern every 5K, and kept them inflated to 32 PSI all around. I called Yokohama before the first rotation, and they said they recommend a cross rotation pattern, but added a disclaimer that I should follow the vehicle manufacturer's recommendation.

    I replaced them with a set of Continental ContiExtremeContacts and have been very pleased so far after 6K miles. They're about as quiet as the Geos were, but have much better grip both wet and dry. The Contis MUST be rotated front to rear on the same side because of their directional tread pattern, so I'm hoping for long life despite this factor.

    Len
    Len
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    juice says, "Hop from a Forester to one of those, and you'll feel like a time machine sent you back 2 decades. At least. Not so with the Pathfinder or Liberty."

    I never drove a Liberty, but the Pathfinder was on my short list for quite awhile - one of the few V-6 compact SUVs available with a 5-speed manual. Quite good looking, and about the right overall size. Too heavy, though, and the gas mileage was poor.

    jb
  • grugrugrugru Member Posts: 20
    Len - you've hit 60k on your 2001? That's alotta driving. How much were the Contis? I'm thinking Les Schwab owes me a steak if I get a set.

    jp
  • casecom2casecom2 Member Posts: 72
    jb sez: "In a panic stop situation, the driver might apply the brakes really hard. It would be horrible if the pedal collapsed. I'd like to know how much force is necessary for the pedal to break away, and by how much that differs from the maximum effort a strong driver might apply in an emergency."

    My understanding is that the collapsible pedals are triggered not by the driver's foot pressure but rather when the car's sensors detect a frontal impact -- similar to how air bags work.
  • bsvollerbsvoller Member Posts: 528
    OK all you technical wizards...

    Could someone explain to me exactly why a 4-channel ABS is superior to a 3-channel system (other than "more is better" <g>) ? I've puzzled over this for a while now, and with the acquisition of a 3-channel ABS equipped minivan, I'd like to know.

    Is it strictly a matter of how the system senses wheel locking/traction loss, or does it also involve how the system acts to modulate the brakes ?

    Differences in ABS systems aside, what generally happens when an ABS system engages ? Is the brake pressure modulated on all 4 wheels (all on or all off) or are only the wheels that have lost traction modulated (selective on/off) ? If only the locking wheel is modulated, how is the braking effort on the remaining wheels determined ?

    Since all ABS systems have 4 sensors to detect locking, it seems to me that if all wheels are always modulated whenever the ABS engages, then a "single-channel" system would suffice. "Detect locking anywhere, modulate the brake pressure everywhere", so to speak. In that case, why bother with 3 or 4 channels ? I'm therefore inclined to believe that only those wheels that are locking get modulated. If so, that would answer my question regarding the benefits of a 4-channel system.

    Am I making sense yet?

    Thanks in advance,

    -brianV
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    jb: the VQ in the Pathy also burns premium. So does the XT, but it'll go a lot farther per gallon.

    Brian: Subaru uses 4 sensors, so you have one at each wheel. It can then modulate braking at each wheel independently.

    A 3 channel system has just one sensor for both rear wheels. So you could have one rear tire lock up all day long and the ABS would do exactly nothing, it wouldn't even be aware of the skidding.

    $67 for oil change, tire rotation, brake check/adjustment, fluid and bulb checks, lubrication

    That's not a lot of money, but you could easily do all that yourself. Change the oil, rotate the tires, spray some brake cleaner on the brakes while the wheels are off. Also lube the sway bar bushings, those are also in plain sight when the wheels are off (which they are, you're rotating them anyway).

    Fluid checks are easy, they're all marked clearly in yellow. Top those off if you need to (doubtful).

    Bulb checks? Sure, why not. But I think you'd already know if those were bad. But at 7500 miles?

    -juice
  • bsvollerbsvoller Member Posts: 528
    -juice: Thanks for the info.

    I'm seeing more and more of the "4 sensor, 3-channel" ABS variety. That's what our new MPV has.

    I assume that they can detect locking on any wheel, and if either rear wheel locks, they modulate both rears. The fronts are handled independently.

    So if you're modulating the rears or in a 4-channel system, any one wheel, what are the other wheels doing, since the driver effectively looses the feedback through the pedal ?

    -brianV
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    4 channel, if one wheel locks the brake for that wheel is modulated while braking on the other three are applied with constant pressure until lock-up, then modulation.

    -Dave
  • gmginsfogmginsfo Member Posts: 116
    Laker, See me earlier post of about ten days ago for a detailed progress report on my ongoing tunes upgrade.

    The ONLY thing I'd buy OEM is the tweeter kit, and that only because it fits so nicely and easily into the spot set for it; it's a simple plug in with no tools required. The OEM speaker upgrade is overpriced and not the greatest around. Much better deals are better online or at any of the local or franchised stereo stores. Look for closeouts and speaker/amp combos to get the best value. Subwoofer isn't needed from my perspective, but to each his own according to his taste. Pace, Comrade Karl!

    Don't rely totally on Crutchfield's compatibility chart; they show my Polk EX365s (F) and GX4s (R) as not fitting, but all four fit in the door grilles perfectly. What you will want is an amp to deliver more power so you can get those speakers to deliver more of that improved sound. I went with a Power Acoustik PA4-600 4 channel amp, which provides 600 w peak power, 300 RMS. Split among all six speakers - and don't worry about tweeter overkill; the OEM ones deliver an added boost of highs without taking away from the 2-ways in the doors - that roughly 75w RMS per channel, which is right where the Polk specs say the power should be.

    I decided to keep the CDplayer/cassette/radio because it's hard to find that combination these days without spending a lot of money. I'm hoping once the new amp is installed later this week it'll bring out the best in both the new speakers and a basically good, albeit underpowered, in-dash unit. I'll report further later this week.
  • joseph50joseph50 Member Posts: 235
    2001 S A/T. Spent the day going across the Pa. turnpike, 315 miles west to east. Lots of geographical ups and downs, of course. Had a healthy tailwind to help, but used the AC all the way, as temps averaged in mid to high 80's:
    29.5 mpg. I'll take it, with a smile.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Good to go. I've hit 30.4mpg once, someone reported over 33mpg!

    -juice
  • joseph50joseph50 Member Posts: 235
    In this morning's edition, in an article about car quality rankings, 2000 to present:

    "Subaru shows the least degradation of quality from its IQS score, slipping just 34%. That suggests early glitches in Subarus are resolved quickly."
  • dstch82dstch82 Member Posts: 8
    Car: 2003 Subaru Forester 2.5X AT

    When: July 3, 2003
    Where: PA Turnpike from PA to OH
    Speed: 65-75 MPH
    AC: 80% on
    Miles: 414 miles(with one tank of gas)
    Gas used: 12.42 gallons
    Mileage: 33.3 MPG

    When I came back -

    When: July 6, 2003
    Where: PA Turnpike from OH to PA
    Speed: 65-75 MPH sometimes almost 0 MPH -
               there was a big traffic jam for
               around 2 hours
    AC: 60% on
    Miles: 378 miles(with one tank of gas)
    Gas used: 11.906 gallons
    Mileage: 31.75 MPG

    Driver: Happy
  • subkidsubkid Member Posts: 94
    Hi,

    anybody knows for how long current financing on Forester 03 will be in place in Canada? When are Foresters 04 (not XT, but the rest of the bunch) due to appear in show rooms?

    Kid
  • kajkokajko Member Posts: 70
    33.3mpg! <<<<---------SWEET!

    Highest i achieved so far (~14000 miles) was
    32.6mpg with a bit of tail wind, going about 70-75mph at high altitude 7000-5200ft (Flagstaff to Albuquerque on I-40). And this was with a Yakima rocketbox on the roof!

    cheers
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    33.3 mpg in an AUTOMATIC?! :-)

    That USA Today article compares JD Power IQ scores with longer-term dependability scores. Subaru and GMC moved up in the ranks in the long-term.

    You'll recall I said just that when the IQ scores came out and Subaru had not done so well. Who cares about the first 90 days? I care more about the period after the warranty.

    My high was 30.4 mpg on a trip. Low was 17.3 mpg but I was towing the entire time. Other than that, my low was 20.7 mpg when driving on the sand every day in the Outer Banks.

    OK: who else broke 30? I know Frank has.

    -juice
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    juice asks, "OK: who else broke 30?"

    I did.

    29 years ago.

    jb
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    LOL
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    There's a joke in there somewhere about going downhill....

    Steve, Host
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    I've never broken 30 mpg in my '00S AT. Best was 29.4 on I-95 heading north from Dillon, SC to Petersburg, VA in September 2000. Used A/C about 3/4 of the time and averaged speeds in the 75 mph range. Worst was 15.5 after resetting the ECU once. Typical mileage is a consistent 23.2 with my normal 75:25 city:highway commute, highway mileage usually 26.9-27.1. Last tankful was a sorry 20.2, but I have excuses: put my summer tires on, used A/C all the time, stuck in traffic more than half the time, and driving, um, "spiritedly" the rest of the time.

    As for breaking 30 years of age, yeah, I remember that, I think.

    Ed
  • rshollandrsholland Member Posts: 19,788
    I did.

    29 years ago.


    Ya beat me by a year gramps! ;)

    Bob
  • once_for_allonce_for_all Member Posts: 1,640
    best tank 90% highway, no AC, 65 mph, was 31.0 mpg. That was at 2,000 miles.

    John
  • p0926p0926 Member Posts: 4,423
    Yep. I've done it on a couple of occasions (but just barely). My next goal will be to see by how much I can exceed the XT's EPA hwy estimate (once I buy one of course). I would like to avg 25 mpg.

    -Frank P.
  • laker64laker64 Member Posts: 9
    Thanks to gmginsfo for your experience to date. Where can I get a hold of the Polk speakers you mentioned? Would K-mart or Wal-Mart be a good bet? (Sorry - I'm cheap)
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Steve says, "There's a joke in there somewhere about going downhill...."

    Let me be the first to tell you: It's no joke. Only good thing that can be said about getting old is, it's a little better than the alternative.

    jb
  • ballisticballistic Member Posts: 1,687
    Frank says, "My next goal will be to see by how much I can exceed the XT's EPA hwy estimate (once I buy one of course). I would like to avg 25 mpg."

    Average? I don't want to rain too hard, but based on what I'm seeing so far, even in highway driving my XT will never come close to averaging 25.

    jb
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