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Comments
Do you have a winch? I can't remember.
As for the lemon jeep, contact the BBB. Have pictures of before and after if you have them. Let the dealer know you are contacting the BBB and they way want to consider having somebody fix it right before the BBB gets involved, as well as your lawyers. They may fix it rather than have to deal with the lawsuits and a reputation hit with the BBB, especially if what you said about their bodyshop prep and painting is accurate. There is NO reason for them not to fix it. You are not being unreasonable in requesting that any damage done to your Jeep while in their service be repaird to the same state. As the GM if you could take a new Grand Cherokee out on a test drive and scratch it up real good. You can 'fix' it by getting a crayon the same color and coloring in the scratches. Be sure to color outside the lines. Sounds like their paint job is about the same quality. Their GM would say that is unacceptable. Your response - "Well if you wouldn't tolerate that, why should I?"
As for the check engine light, that is usually an emissions thing. There are 2 O2 sensors on the Wranglers, right mac? Perhaps replacing them yourself or go to a 4x4 mechanic familiar with Jeeps. Are there any codes being set? Autozone has a code scan tool and will often do it for free. Before you go though, go through the code reset procedure and clear any old codes. I think you can disconnect the battery or there is some process you can do to reset it.
Check the Lemon Laws in your state. You may be able to claim this one as a lemon and end up with a brand new one - preferably from another dealer.
-Paul
Isn't the most common problem with check engine lights on the Wranglers the O2 sensor as Paul suggested? While it isn't a general problem with Wranglers, other model cars have check engine lights come on frequently if the owner doesn't tighten the gas cap correctly. There was once when I didn't get the Unlimited's gas cap on right and it fell off (love the tether that attaches the gas cap to the vehicle!) - the check engine light came on right away. If the problem isn't the O2 sensor, you might take a look at your gas cap - there may be something wrong with it.
I don't get it either. One of the things I love most about my Jeep is the dual tops. I've had my hard top on since October and I'm ready to go back to the soft top. I'm going to wait just a couple of more weeks and then slap her back on. I try to run each six months a year. It's nice too becauase it feels and looks like a different vehicle for a while...and here in Memphis it is way too hot in the summer to drive topless all the time.
That's funny, guys, as I'm posting this a Camp Jeep email popped into my inbox...
http://www.ewylie.com/house/week1/P2190017.html
go forward from that picture and you can see the stuff on the opposite side. I possibly could have fit a sheet of paper between my tire and the underside of the flare, nothing more...
-twylie
M's stop climbing too. A fuel injector problem maybe?
Anyway, if the simple doesn't work soon, I am going to just bite the bullet and spend the money to have a dealer plug a computer into it.
Till next time,
Sean
Glenn
My commute is 150 miles daily with 300 mile weekend trips being common (like at least once a month). The house is at 5800 feet, and we work at sea level, so we have significant elevation changes. In the winter we can go from several inches of snow and 20s to 60 degree weather at work. Part of the trip is slow-n-go SoCal freeways, and part 70 plus mph mountain climb. And part of the trip goes through an area that is one of those "Santa Ana wind-prone" areas, so it is always at least a little windy and occasionally very windy (gusts 40 mph). Is our commute crazy or what?!
My personal opinion is that the Unlimited is far easier to live with as a daily driver. It's added stability makes it far more relaxing to drive at higher speeds - the Sport is skittish. The longer wheelbase is also closer to cars, so it doesn't rock on parts of the I-405 where the expansion joints are spaced such that the Sport feels like it has a flat. The Unlimited's seats are fine, though I wish they were higher (now that my other half has had his dental work done, perhaps next month I'll be able to do something about blocks for the seats). It doesn't bother me much driving on the freeways, but it is a problem off-roading.
The Sport is more fun - don't know if that is the difference between the auto and manual, or if it is more reflective of the longer wheelbase and smoother, more stable ride. But for day-in, day-out grind, I'll take the Unlimited any day.
The Unlimited seems to be holding up very well - it already has over 25,000 miles on it. The Sport has over 130,000 miles on the odo and hasn't had all that many problems (the dreaded exhaust manifold and the dash gauges were the main issues it's had).
You mentioned the seats being low in the unlimited. I feel the exact same way in my Unlimited. Im 6' and it just feels like im sitting way lower than i should. The comfort of the seats are ok, could be better, with my wish being a moveable headrest and height adjustable seats....My wife is 5' and she is having a tough time seeing out the front, i guess im getting some phone books for her to sit on...LOL.....
I like the sounds of that tranny. I must admit, on the test drives, I've been very impressed with it.
Mtngal - now THAT is a commute (glad I don't have to do that - our gas just went to 83 cents per litre)!!! LOL OK, I'm convinced. Do the '04's have the manifold cracking problem too, and if so, is Chrysler good about replacing them under warranty?
Thanks!!
Glenn
Thanks again,
Glenn
And I can say that from lots of experience - we've certainly had LOTS of rain this year!
LOL - glad I've never done that (believe me? Wanna buy some "land" ??).
Sounds very good. Guess I gotta go see my Jeep dealer again this week. Thanks VERY much for all the info! This has really helped a lot.
Glenn
I ordered a set of 1 inch Buchannan seat risers for $55. They are solid aircraft grade aluminum blocks complete with grade 8 hardware. Takes about 30 minutes to install. I highly recommend them. Before I installed them I could barely see the front of my hood.
Buchannan also makes them ini 1 1/2 and 2 inch sizes. Definitely one of the best mods I never think about...If you do a search on here, I think you'll find his contact information. Just about everyone I know on the Rubicon Owner's Forum runs them as well.
By the by, one other question I have about TJ's in general, and keep forgetting to ask, is about the resale value and ability of these. I'm thinking if in 4 years I decide I don't want a jeep any longer (i.e. if the sun starts to rise in the west ), how well do these machines hold their value, and how easy is it to sell a specialized vehicle such as these? Even for a trade-in for another (new) TJ, will you get good value for the trade-in?
Thanks - appreciate this!
Glenn
Glenn
tidester, host
Appreciate the heads-up.
Glenn
JeepHead
Two N Glenn, death wobble occurs on Jeeps that have had suspension lifts and larger tires installed. From all of my reading, it appears that there can be a number of causes for it. A loose trac bar can cause it. Getting the drag link and trac bar too far from parallel can cause it. Control arms too short for the lift can cause it.
One of my good Jeep Buds had it on his 04 Rubicon after he installed a lift and 33" tires. A friend of his was driving right behind him and said the front wheels were sawing back and forth so bad that he could see the entire wheel as the tire made its swing to each side! In his case, it took adjustable control arms to correct the problem.
The castor of his front wheels was thrown off by the lift. Castor is the position of the wheels front to back. The axle is connected to the frame by control arms. As the frame is lifted with the installation of a suspension lift, the attachment point of the axle to the frame is raised. This has the effect of pulling the front wheels toward the back of the Jeep, and, depending on how high the lift raises the frame, it is sometimes necessary to correct this with longer control arms, or adjustable control arms.
I guess to sum it up, death wobble is caused by bad steering geometry or by something loose in the steering/suspension system. It is sometimes not at all an easy task to find out the cause. You can think you have it, and then you hit a bump out on the highway just right, and there you go. The steering wheel saws back and forth and all you can do is ride it out.
The good news is that DC produces our Jeeps with the proper steering geometry and everything properly tightened, so no need to be concerned about death wobble, as long as you are stock.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Original speedo erro 0f 1.75 mph is now zero. I can still get 5th gear at only 45 mph. I notice a slight acceleration loss on 3rd gear. Other gears no noticeable difference. Ride slightly stiffer on bumps. The overall look is much improved, it looks even tougher than the 30 x 9.50 GSA on the sahara's because the Revo have a more agressive look and somehow are 1/2 inch taller. also standard gear ratio is 3.07 only.
Thanks as always Tom .
Glenn
The Death Wobble thing I posted about above is a good example of complications from a lift.
Thelma Jane has just a two inch suspension lift, and this keeps things close enough to stock that I don't have any problems. But, just that little lift has improved her capability immensely.
I see youngsters get Jeeps and start throwing mods at them without long term plans and without thought as to what works together and what doesn't. Before they know it, they have spent a small fortune and have a messed up Jeep that needs a lot more spent on it to "do it right."
There's nothing wrong with bigger lifts, when they are done properly and all the related mods are installed. But, what you gain with a four inch lift compared to a two inch lift is not going to be nearly as dramatic as what you get in going from stock height to a two inch lift, and you have to ask yourself if it is really worth it.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Perhaps, but if I'm driving along at 60+mph and my Jeep starts to vibrate, shimmy and shake I'm not going to speed up and make the situation worse. Common sense dictates slowing down and getting the problem resolved. "Death Wobble" is clearly overstated!
In any case, thanks for the clarifications and additional info.
tidester, host
This isn't just a shaking of the steering wheel. It's such a violent shaking of the whole vehicle that's so bad you think the vehicle is going to leave the road, maybe into the ditch, maybe across the median and into oncoming traffic.
It sounds unlikely unless you experience it, and you probably won't unless you do a poor modification of the suspension and/or steering, and/or let the components wear or loosen. It's a combination of those factors and the short wheelbase.
If you don't think you're going to die when it happens, it wasn't death wobble. Those that don't understand, often describe a steering shimmy as death wobble..........the two being as alike as chalk and cheese.
2: Wranglers hold their value better than most other vehicles on the road.
Thanks for the update.
Glenn
Glenn
On the resale front, Mac is right, but very right. There are very few vehicles on the road that hold their value as well as Wranglers do. I read in Money Magazine last year, I think, that Wranglers have a 95 percent resale value in their first year alone--rivaling some model of Mercedes for best resale...of course, that's here in the US, and I'm sure it matters where you live here as well...
Tom, good information on the death wobble. I think you have the right idea. If I lift my Rubi it will only be a 2 inch and I'll stay with 31 inch tires, thank you very much.
Many thanks!
Glenn
The keyword there is "think." To my knowledge there haven't been any reports of actual fatalities as a result of DW.
tidester, host
Thanks for letting me know how much the 1" blocks are - it gives me something to shoot for next month. I'll probably get the 1 1/2" blocks.
Seriously, Tom and Mac were pretty reassuring about this being a problem with mod'd jeeps rather than the stock. I doubt Transport Canada and whatever the equivalent is in the States would allow these vehicles on the road if they had this problem "off the shelf". There would be safety recalls if that were the case, I'm sure. I just heard the term in another forum and thought I should get more info on it before jumping to conclusions about anything. I'm confident from what I've read here that in my case, I won't have anything to worry about in my purchase.
Thanks for pointing this fact out though. That too is reassuring.
Glenn
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The main point though, is that it does exist, but likely not as often as is reported..........and it's unheard of in an unmodified vehicle (to my knowledge).
Thanks
Glenn
I had a 1974 Ford F100 (back then they were F100's, not F150's). I don't remember what year it was when this happened, but it must have been around 1975 or 1976.
The truck had no power steering, and they didn't come with the steering stabilizer shock absorber.
I was coming home from work and doing about 70 MPH, when an unmarked police car came up behind me and put his flashing light on. I was in a 55 MPH zone, so I was about 15 MPH over the speed limit.
I sort of panicked and hit my brakes pretty hard, and WHAM! The truck did something it had never done before. The steering wheel was just about ripped out of my hands as it rotated back and forth on its own.
I had absolutely no steering control while that was going on, and the truck was shaking violently. It felt like the truck would just shake itself to pieces while traveling at 70 MPH.
Yeah, I thought I was gonna die!
I found out later that this was a problem that other folks were having too on their trucks that did not have power steering. I guess the power steering absorbed some of the shock and kept the shimmy from getting started. The solution was to mount a shock absorber to serve as a steering stabilizer.
So, my friends, Death Wobble is truly a very serious thing. Some people may be having minor problems and mistakenly calling the occurrences "Death Wobble," but there really is such a thing as "Death Wobble" that will make you think you have bought the farm.
Tom
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
So glad I did! Can't wait for Spring to break so I can put the soft top back on!!!!
-Dan
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