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Jeep Wrangler



  • I have a 2001 Sport with the 4.0 and 5 spd. and I am quite happy with it. One of my co-workers is trying to decide on automatic or manual. Any suggestions? Does the auto take much power away?
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    tsjay, congratulations. The $200 over invoice is the best deal I've found as well...even after adding in the $377 "advertising" add-on. What do the rest of you guys think about that...the advertising add-on, that is? Is that something that can be negotiated away?

    I also am in the process of negotiating for a Wrangler Sport. As a matter of fact, I am selling my Ferrari (and trading UP...ha ha). Actually, the Ferraris are so tempermental that a Jeep would be like getting a good night sleep after a hard day. I'm also getting rid of my Pathfinder (my foul weather vehicle) and deciding that all I really need is one versatile vehicle...enter, 2001 Jeep Wrangler Sport (p.s. why does everyone refer to it as a "TJ").

    OK...the crux of my questions: I am undecided among a couple options and features.

    A lot of people have the 30" wheels -- the trade-off being ABS. I was going to go with the ABS and the Grizzlys. What size are the Grizzlys? How important is ABS? And is it worth the tradeoff?

    As for color, I test drove the yellow. It made me dizzy. My Ferrari is yellow...and it should be the only car that boast that color. Therefore, I'm inclined to go with a Silverstone Jeep. Black only looks good when it's just washed...and boy does it look good then. And white is too common.

    Question #2. Does the new 4-ply soft top really make that much of a difference? I'm only getting the soft top...I live is the terperate Washington DC area. Neither the Winters nor the Summers are [too] extreme. Any input?

    Lastly, how do you experienced Jeeps feel about the automatic versus manual. I've always had stick shift vehicles and find them very fun to drive -- although my automatic Pathfinder is a dream in DC's rush hour traffic. What's the reliability of the transmissions?

    Your input is, as always, greatly appreciated.
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    Me again. Talk to me about the "Dana rear". I know a Dana, and her rear is nothing to get excited about. Is the TJ Dana rear a worthwhile investment?

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Thanks for the kind words.

    I still haven't fully made up my mind about the white, but I would say that I am around 95% certain that that's what it will be. You said they were common, but not really around here. I hardly ever see a white one. There's all kinds of red ones, black ones, and even a lot of the yellow ones around here.

    I like your silverstone idea. It is a very close second in my book, and the steel blue is gorgeous also.

    The reason I'm so hung up on white is because I saw I white one at a dealership I had to drive past every week, and I almost always stopped and drooled over it. She was beautiful. The black top and deep tinted windows really set off the white sheet metal.

    I will let others answer your questions about options- I just plain don't know about that stuff.

    Catch you later

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Ok, everyone that has followed the tsjay epoch must be wondering about financing, knowing how far upside down I am on the GP.

    It's called a home equity loan. I am borrowing a few thousand to take care of most of the deficit on the GP between the trade-in allowance and the payoff.

    People, this Jeep is going to have to be mine for a long, long time. I hope I will finally be satisfied (I'll HAVE to be).

    I still have the opportunity to sell my Grand Prix before the Jeep comes in, and I will have an ad in the paper starting tomorrow. If I can get a thousand or fifteen hundred more than the trade-in allowance, so much the better.

  • well, i'll admit it. After all these months I didn't think you were ever going to do it. :) I read about your wanting a jeep when i first started looking for jeeps a while back. I've had my jeep for a month now (after ordering it) and love it!

    Though a little late... I have 2 cars - one my jeep, the other a honda civic. Since i got my jeep my honda's been sitting in the drive, but i don't want to get rid of it. I kept it for a couple reasons - gas mileage, quieter, was an auto (learning manual still...), _very_ reliable, jeep will be worked on for days on end, and i can luckly afford both. Even though my jeeps a manual i still drive it everywhere. I took it on a 2 hour trip (2 hours there, 2 hours back) a couple weeks back and didn't have any problems. Noise wasn't bad at all (much better then 2000), mileage sucked but it was funner. As i said, i currently use the jeep as my commuter car (about 10-15 miles each way) and don't have any problems. I'll pry switch to my civic once i really become comfortable with manual, just to save somewhat on gas (ya, ya...could save more by selling civic =)...)

    Anyways, you'll enjoy your jeep!

  • are you getting the full doors?
  • tsjay
    Congratulations. Glad to hear you going through with it.
    I have heard real good things about selling in autotrader. You may want to consider it.
    You should of asked for more on your trade-in. It never hurts to ask. Who cares though, your getting a JEEP!

    I have heard the pro comp is rough on the pavement. I would look at Rubicon and Teraflex.

    I have heard the advertising fee can be negotiated.
    TJ is the model name for 97'-01', YJ 86.5'-95'
    I don't know much about ABS. I don't have it and don't want it. I can stop my Jeep without any problems. I would consider it if I had to drive on that white stuff northerners talk about.
    Silverstone sounds good. Mine is black and love it.
    The new soft tops make a big difference from what I hear. I only have the soft top and like it.
    There are some complaints on the manual. Sticky shifting, noisy in neutral, and pops out of gear. My manual was a little noisy at first but not anymore, Shifting is still sticky but not bad. Has never popped out of gear. I have not heard anything bad about automatics. The auto may lack power depending on how you drive. I would test drive both and go with the one you think is best.
    The Dana 44 rear end is a stronger axle. I think it is worth the money.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Yes, I am getting the full metal doors, since I am going with the hard top rather than the soft top.

    I really don't think I'll be going topless very much, and I can still take the hard top off once in a while if I want to. I just think for my purposes the hard top makes more sense.

    Catch you later

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Thanks, Bro.

    I guess I should have haggled, but I was in a state of shock after what the other dealers had offered and the attitude they demonstrated.

    Thanks for the tip on Autotrader. I'm not going to aggressively try to sell the GP. If I can't get at least a thousand or fifteen hundred more than the good trade-in offer, it isn't worth the hassle of selling it and then renting a vehicle until the Wrangler comes in.

    In about four or five weeks, you can go drink a few in celebration. It looks like we will get to have that party after all. I sure hope she gets here by Christmas.

  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    Does anyone have any opinion about Grizzlys versus the 30"? Is there a big difference?

    Is there a lot of wind noise with the 2001 soft top (with the full doors)?

    Any strong feelings about ABS?

  • The full doors are super cool. I got em and I only have a soft top. It beats trying to unzip. I know how it is not being able to wait. You better post a pic a soon as you have one.

    Check out this green one (mine)
  • I think it was explained what the TJ is for but not where it originated. Back when the Jeep was born it was the GP for "General Purpose" vehicle. The term Jeep was coined from "GP". They started to become popular with civilians and so the CJ was created for "Civilian Jeep". After the sad end of the CJ's in 86 the 87-95 Wranglers were called YJ's and so they decided to call the new Wrangler the TJ.

    Also Dana is the manufacturer of many axles. All Jeep vehicles use Dana products. Except for the not so great AMC 20 in 82-86 CJ's. The Dana 44 now offered in the Wrangler is a good axle and you will have to work at breaking it. Many people run them in Chevy 350 powered Jeeps with lockers and they hold up fine.

    On another note I've heard good things about the a 4" lift from a company called Full Traction. They run 33" tires on there Jeep. The excellent Magazine JP did a article on it and it impressed them. They claim it gives the most wheel travel on the market with the sway bar disconected right out of the box. When I finally Get my TJ I'm slapping one on. Keep on Jeepin'
    Brendon Cooper
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    Nice jeep...are those stock tires/wheels?

  • definitely congrats.

    the floor matts are a rip off ....

    make sure that you get the HD electrical.

    i know that you will enjoy it.

    Gil --- if you are not going to get bigger tires then get the 30"

    if going bigger get the cheaper ones now
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    Thanks for the historical evolution of the TJ badge...interesting stuff.
  • yep, stock tires & wheels I got the 30in wheel package.

    My allowance hinders me from buying any major mods.

    Just to avoid being called a spoiled brat. I don't get allowance from parental units, my wife controls my allowance from my own check, married guys know about this arrangement.

    In other news, I have heard two different stories as to where the "Jeep" name came from. The GP theory sounds the most plausible, but I am sure you guys remember the little cartoon character that hassled popeye long ago.
    Well, he was Eugene the jeep. Named "jeep" because of the only sound he uttered. He first came out in 1936, I think that was a few years before the Army got the vehicles we love today. 4 years to be exact. To back this up, I heard that them army guys didn't call them General purpose vehicles back then. I like to think this is the correct origin. Just because I love cartoons. See website, Eugene is standing next to me!

    If anyone has proof, please post it here. I really would like to know the correct story.
  • here are two websites that support my favorite theory... but they could be bogus

    so if anyone has real proof, please post.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Hey guys and gals, if I drive my new Wrangler Sport with the 30" tires and a 5-speed tranny at 65 to 70 mph on the highway, what kind of gas mileage can I expect? It'll be a hard top, if that makes any difference in wind drag.

  • I think the grizzley's look so much better, moving or standing still compared to any other Jeep wheel made in the last 3.5 years. They have a great shine and clean up real easy. I have em on a black sahara with a tan top, I haven't seen one on the road like it yet!
    ps- gilbus what is a Silverstone Jeep?!?
    Just wondering
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591

    I test drove a soft top and took it up to 75 mph. The top noise was not bad at all in my opinion, and the one I was driving had the half metal doors. I would expect the noise to have been even less with full metal doors.

    I am getting a hard top because I am almost sure that I would want the top off very rarely. I will be using the Jeep as my only transportation, and I like the idea of being able to lock the doors and have a little security when I am traveling.

    The hard tops come off too, so on those rare occasions that I really want to do so, I can still take the top off.

    They had a silverstone Sport in the showroom when I was at the dealership Tuesday evening to make the deal on my Jeep. It was beautiful! I have seen a couple of them on the road too, and they are definitely sharp. That was a very, very close second color choice in my opinion. I could have almost flipped a coin between white and silverstone.

  • tsjay since your here everyday you wanna fill me in on the silverstone? is it just silver or gray?
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    The "silverstone" is a shiney gray...I guess...silver. But it's not the metalic silver you may be used to seeing on cars like the Honda S2000 or Audi TT. It's more of a rugged silver...if that makes any sense.

  • Congrads tsjay! Well, it has been a great first week with the Sport! In fact, tsjay, after a week of commuting, I would like to change my vote to in the middle on the "Jeep as commuter" question. (recount?) Here are just a few road notes on the commuter issue to consider:

    Handle's great, love the nimble size. Great around the city streets and parking.
    Noisy inside, but not too bad with hardtop. I don't mind it at all. Can still hear stereo.
    Sensitive steering. Overcorrected too much at first, getting used to it, but doesn't wander.
    Hops, skips, and jumps. The 30" package is great, but it makes for a jumpy and jarring ride on rough pavement. This to me takes more getting used to then the noise.

    But overall, it is just plain fun to drive, and the sacrifices are not overwhelming. I think the issue is it suffers in comparison as a commuter if you are coming from a luxo box like me. But once I get used to it, it will be a great overall ride, and no other vehicle can touch the perks.

    BTW, tsjay, I had to take the hardtop off on Sunday to remove the softtop (dual top option). I did not find it an easy task. Hardtop is bulky and weighs a good bit. Two of us got it off and on, but I would never attempt it alone and would recommend a lift. I am planning to get one when I need to take it off again this spring. Anyone have any recommendations/tips ?

  • I Did it once with a couple ropes around a tree limb. It worked but not that well. I have done it myself by wiggling it on to my back and I put it back on that way to. For this method having a small hill or loading dock type of arragement works well. This was on my CJ I'd immagine the TJ's top is heavier. I know it can be done quite easily with a couple of those ratcheting tiedown straps and a couple rafters or something overhead. I haven't tried or seen one of those $120 things. I guess if your going to be a Jeep person for life it might be worth while. The easiest way I have experienced is to get a a couple of friends together and lift it off. Hope any of this is helpful and not just me rambling.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    The silverstone is a medium gray, I guess you'd say, but it is shiny enough to call it silver. It does have some metallic in it, but the metallic is kind of subdued, and not overdone.

    Maybe pewter is the best way to descrive the color???

    However you describe it or whatever you call it, it is really pretty. The black top goes real nicely with the silverstone sheet metal. I am sure that's what I would have gotten if I hadn't seen that white Jeep with the black top this past summer and fallen head over heels in love.

    Hope this helps, but it probably doesn't.

  • I can remove/replace the hardtop by myself by centering it on my back and walking onto the Jeep. Though this is no fun, it'll do in a pinch. The other option is the tie down strap/hoist method. This spring/summer, I removed the top by attaching a couple of tie downs to the roof of my garage. They lift the top off easily and double as storage. Much better than paying $100+ for a hoist.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Glad to hear you're enjoying your new Wrangler!

    So, I will put you in the "undecided" column on having a Jeep for all-purpose driving. Fortunately, this will have no bearing on the outcome of the vote: it is now 6 to 1, with one undecided.


    They said it would be four to five weeks, but that puts it right up to Christmas, and if there are any delays, it could be the end of January before I see my Jeep. They shut the line down for a couple weeks during the holidays.

    Keep having fun with that new Jeep.

  • Tsjay:
    I ordered mine the last week of october. I called Jeep and they said its not scheduled to be built till the 2nd week of December. I have heard it can take 2 to 3 more weeks from final assembly to get shipped to your destination. I hope I have mine by Xmas and I hope you have yours too..
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Man, I hope we do both get our Jeeps by Christmas!

    Like I said, there is a shutdown for a couple weeks over the holidays, so if our Jeeps aren't made and shipped by the shutdown, there will be another two-week delay. Bummer!!!

    My dealer said he has been getting his Jeeps within four to five weeks after the order is placed. I don't know if he was talking about Jeeps for his inventory or for individuals, if that makes any difference. He did say that if you talk to the people at Jeep, they cover their butts and give you a longer time than they actually think it will take, so maybe we will both luck out.

    Good luck to both of us!

  • Mine has been on order for the past month. I'm flying in to pick it up on the 25th (I am relocating from S.America to MN in Jan). I went with the Sport Silverstone, 5spd, Dana44, 30in tire pkg w/Canyons, and Black Hardtop. I have been going back and forth since then, debating as to the color as well (one day its AmberFire, the next SteelBlue, the next White or Sienna). Finally I just decided to stick with my first choice...after all, I am finally getting the Jeep I've always wanted!!!
  • I ordered my TJ on August 29th and took it home October 3rd. It was exactly 5 weeks for me, but with the Holidays, that time will probably be longer now....
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    We who have Jeeps on order sound like a bunch of expectant fathers in a maternity ward, don't we?

  • vubsvubs Posts: 14
    $25k (drive out) for an auto sahara w/abs, traclok, hardtop, cruise, and sentry key! man, that's a lot for what is possibly the crudest vehicle on the market. i still want this jeep to be my first car, but can't seem to get myself to put down a deposit for one. would a similarly equipped sport be much less? if only these dealers can be more like Lexus or Infiniti (half of 'em aren't even replying to my inquiries). then maybe i wouldn't be having second thoughts. somebody please tell me this will be worth it...
  • FYI: I have been to 3 jeep dealers in the Northern Virginia area and could not find a wrangler I wanted. Thought I was going to have to order one and pray it got here by Christmas. Not any more found a dealer 20 min from work that has over 70 wranglers sitting on the lot. It was like I had died and gone to jeep heaven. Wranglers in every color and option scheme you could think of. Dealer is Dulles jeep in Leesburg.
  • Someone out there can answer this as soon as it gets dark. On a 95 Wrangler, is the headlight switch and dimmer control supposed to be illuminated like the rest of the dash switches & gauges?
  • I had a 1994 YJ Sahara and the head lighg switch was NOT illuminated. It also didn't have a buzzer to notify you that the lights were on when the engine was off and door was open. I found this weird because it would buzz when you left the key in the ignition and open the door. ( A reminder that you were locking your keys in the Jeep). But why would you want to have a key reminder? If you lock your keys in the Jeep, UNZIP the windows and open the door. I couldn't tell you the times I left my lights on (Driving durring the day in rain) and had to pop the clutch or get a jump start because I left my lights on. I guess what I'm babbling about is that I wish at the time it had a reminder that your lights were on..
    Well....Giddy up....
  • I have a question. I want to replace my Mini console in my 2001 TJ (which is on order)with the larger console. I didnt order the package that came with the large console and all those lights. So I found a place that will sell me the Large console for under $100. What I was wondering is how hard is it to replace the mini console with the larger one. I have a 5 speed. If anyone knows please give me a heads up....

    Giddy Up....
  • I don't think the switch is supposed to be lit up considering the switch in my 2000 Sahara doesn't light up either.
  • I originally wanted a Wrangler when they changed the body style in 96/97. Back then, they were in so much demand (especially with the 6 cyl) that the dealer wasn't willing to bend on sticker price. I bought a new Explorer instead. Last December, it was time to replace my wheels and I started looking at Jeeps. I was willing to buy a Sport (loaded like the Sahara) instead of the Sahara because it was a little bit cheaper. I wanted the ABS as well as the 30" wheels. DC stopped offering this soon after. Anyway, I thought I would have to order it since no dealers stock Jeeps with ABS. Well, I lucked out...I found a dealer in Delaware that had 3 Saharas with ABS on the lot. He gave me the Jeep below invoice AND gave me an awesome trade in for my Explorer.

    What I am saying, I guess, is that sticker price means nothing. My Sahara is fully loaded and I got it way closer to 20k.
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    Two weeks ago, I was convinced that I was ready for a Jeep with ABS (instead of the 30" wheels) and 5-speed (instead of automatic). Now, after reading nearly every one of the last 100 posts to this message board (most of which from "tsjay"...ha ha) I'm unsure if a 5-speed is a good thing because many of you are concerned with reliability and popping out of gear; and unsure about the ABS because many of you love the 30" wheels.

    Any thoughts?
  • goducks1goducks1 Posts: 432
    I have the 5-speed and ABS and I think both are good choices. I didn't get the 30" wheels because I think that package is way overpriced. You can fit 30" tires on the stock 15"x7" steel wheels just fine and get better tires than the Goodyears. Put the money into the ABS, it's worth it.

    Someone in an earlier post said that I was too rough on the automatic tranny. For the record, I think both transmissions suck. I have a '98 5-speed and the first to second throw is frequently a struggle. Chysler "upgraded" the 5-speed in '99 and I hear the new one is worse. I still think a 3-speed automatic is completely unacceptable though. No overdrive? What is this, 1975? Consider the long-term ramifications of your engine spinning at 3500 RPMS on the highway (vs 2500 with 5th gear on the manual) and I think the choice is clear. The automatic will put more stress on the engine and get terrible mileage. Stick with the 5-speed.
  • gilbusgilbus Posts: 13
    I appreciate the insight. You are so right about the long term impact of highway RMP's on the automatic. 5-speed it is! I guess I'm also convinced about the ABS too...kind of.

  • goducks1goducks1 Posts: 432
    Holy smokes...I bought my '98 Sport (5-speed, hardtop w/defroster, cloth seats, quick-order convenience package thing with the console and lights, full spare, soundbar, ABS and tracloc differential) for $19100. I later bought an aftermarket Bestop soft-top for $500 and had it retrofitted with factory a/c for another $1000, but if I had gotten them as options it would still have only been around $20000. Oregon doesn't have a sales tax though.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Hi Gilbus!

    Unless you are going to put bigger tires and wheels on your Jeep after you buy it, GO WITH THE 30" TIRES! The Wranglers look SO much better with the 30" tires!!!

    Can't you still get ABS if you get the 30" tires?

    If you can't, then I still say go with the 30" tires.

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Any real benefit for mostly on-road driving and only occasional light off-road duty?

    I'm getting the canyon wheels and 30" tires with the Dana 44. (If I understand the options correctly.) Unless I'm mistaken you get the Dana 44 with the 30" tires and 5-speed combination for $850.00 list price, but you don't get trac lok unless you pay another $595.00. Do I have this right?

    If so, should I have forked out the extra lettuce for the trac lok rear end, considering that my Jeep will be off-road only under pretty "tame" circumstances?

  • Reading off my sticker here, the 30" package was indeed $850, but the trac lok was $285. I swear by the Trac Lok myself. It was a requirement for my Jeep, and that made it hard to find on the lot (along with the dual top). I had a similar limited slip axle in my Tahoe, and it was great for towing and in slippery conditions (snow/rain). I found I actually needed to engage the 4WD less often due to better rear end traction. As for off-road, I can't say from experience. I assume it would improve traction, and there have been posts here to support that. But again, I bought it for the on road benefits even more.

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    I will have to check with my dealer, but if I can get the trac lok for only an extra $285, then I'll ask them to add it to my order. This other dealer I was working with had something in the package for $595 that sounded like trac lok.

    I wonder if that $595 was for the Dana 44 AND trac lok, for people who weren't already getting the Dana 44 anyway???? If so, the idiot was trying to charge me twice for the Dana 44, once as part of the canyon wheel and 30" tire option, and again as part of the trac lok option.

    Can someone help us here?

  • For all those noisy transmissions out there, I heard an interesting tid-bit about them the other day. On the 2000 wranglers the dowel pins on the engine apparently were drilled wrong. This puts the transmission in a cock-eyed stance, putting side pressure on the input shaft...thus the noise while in neut. Push in clutch and surprise noise all gone. DC knows about the problem and this particular dealer has repaired quite a few I guess. As for the JEEP itself, tsjay, you should not involve your home for this vehicle they are not that nice. Mine is going out the door asap and I,m getting a Tahoe. But good luck to ya, you sure as hell sound like you need one. The abs is really nice though and 30 inch tires look good on the grizzly wheels. I have had a best of 20.7 mpg and a low of 15.9 with an average of 18 so it is not terrible for what it is. Again good luck to ya all.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Thanks for the info.

    I'm sorry you had bad luck with your Jeep. Hopefully, I will get a good one.

    That gas mileage doesn't sound too bad.

    It will be hard to give up my Grand Prix GT. It has been an absolutely perfect car.

    I just have this thing for a Wrangler. They seem like they would be such a fun vehicle to have.

    Good luck with your Tahoe.

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