Isuzu Trooper

dielectric7bb

hey, we've got big problems don't we

:-)

paisan

That is our biggest complaint wipers!

-mike

tetonman

The complaints are about wipers... When I was looking at the Trooper way back when in '99 there were a lot of people discussing their older Troopers with 150k or 200k miles on them with only maintenance repairs and tires. This is one great truck. BTW- with the Trooper being replaced by a new model (next year?), what are the chances that dealers will really discount their inventory towards the end of the year? That's when I'll be back in market, although I am leaning towards a sports car. Mid-life crisis a little early...lol

paisan

Well the Assender is gonna be late in arriving to market due to crash test problems. So since most dealers haven't stock a lot of the 2002 Troopers they are likely going to scarce at the end of the year, heck they are scarce now in the Northeast

-mike

dielectric7bb

Out here in the SW the local Isuzu dealer has a few Troopers. I assume that they are 2002s, but I could be wrong. A few weeks back I went to Ohio, don't ask why. I was hard pressed to find any Isuzu whatsoever. I saw two rodeos and one vehicross (go figure) in 4 days of Ohio gloom. Never saw an Isuzu dealer although every other dealer was present.

paisan

http://planetisuzoo.com/articles.html/58

Looks like a rodeo.

-mike

dielectric7bb

404 error

http://planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm/58

there was an l in your htm

sbcooke

Looks like a cross between a forester and a xterra. At least the square window in the rear looks xterra'ish.

boxtrooper

I had replaced my original shocks with the Tokico gas shocks and they are much more form than original... big handling improvement.

I later installed a complete set of OME shocks and rear springs. The OME shocks are actually a little softer initially than the gas Tokicos. I went with all OME so the suspension would be "matched" the way OME had designed and tested it.

The OME springs are also a big handling improvement despite the extra 1.5 inches of height. They are great on road and off.

If Isuzu had been installing OME suspensions as original they might have sold a lot more Troopers in the USA. Of course, they could also have offered the 3L half Duramax diesel in the USA for lots more sales.

savvas_e

I think it looks good! Definitely better than the Mitsubishi Pajero (Montero for you guys - there's a story about why they don't use the name Pajero in the US and Europe - something about how it translates in Spanish).

Take a close look at the front guard. The press release says it will have the 4.2 inline six (Vortec?). There is a little V8 badge on the guard. Is Isuzu keeping a suprise for you guys?

There is absolutely no news in Oz about what will replace Jackaroo. I believe Holden is having problems finding a suitably sized right hand drive vehicle in the GM world. They'll probably stick it out with the current model until its last breath. I will definitely be mourning the loss of that brilliant 3.5L V6.

tetonman

Okay, who thought of this name? The [non-permissible content removed] -- Ender? Yikes, this could be a PR joke for a long time, especially given the crash test issues. Also, it will be built in US on a GM Platform? That would worry me on the quality issues. Maybe I should get the 2002 Trooper now...

paisan

1) Is based and built by GM for GM, so reliability will be iffy at best.

2) V8 will be optional 4.6l out of the base yukon, a pretty pathetic engine, the I6 will probably be better.

3) Did I mention reliability of GM products?

4) Small moonroof, and a host of other non-trooper-like things (no more upright seats either)

It is a dark day for the Isuzu world...

-mike

bluedevils

I'm pretty sure we started calling it "Assender" because that's a negative term that reflects our negative feelings about this vehicle replacing the beloved Trooper.

boxtrooper

I heard about GM replacing the S-10 line with an Isuzu designed line of small trucks several years ago. I think the AssEnder and the new S-10 replacement Isuzu / GM small pickup are actually a joint design with Isuzu and GM.

GM desperately needed reliability and better use of space inside and better chassis under their small SUVs and Isuzu needed sales and marketing to sell more SUVs. So I think this combined effort AssEnder/GM SUVs product line is a result that made sense to a lot of powerful people in both companies.

Unfortunately Isuzu with poor sales got the short end of the stick in the design decisions and product release sequence. If Isuzu was allowed to build something closer to the GBX and release the Isuzu version first, then sell rebadged models as a GM product, they would have been percieved as rebadged Isuzu's and GM would not sell as many.

Isuzu still has the 10/120 warrantee on the AssEnder, so they must have designed in the Isuzu reliability. I think GM made out like a bandit on this deal, the new vehicles appear as a GM first and they get the benefit of Isuzu input to make them more practical to use and more durable than a regular GM design would have been.
I think Isuzu will be out of the SUV brand name business very soon unless they come up with an Isuzu only vehicle that is really great. I think Isuzu Troopers are the next orphaned SUV like the International Scout and Travelall of the 1970's. International is alive and well in trucks and so will Isuzu be for a long time.

boxtrooper

I still think Isuzu would find a decent nitch with a van / utility chassis about the size of the soon to be extinct Astro/Safari or slightly larger. This would compete with the Freightliner Sprinter and be a favorite for fleets and camper chassis and plumbers. It would need to use a diesel and with good performance still get 22 to 27 MPG. It would differ from the conventioanl full size in smaller turning circle and greater emphasis on utilitarian practicality instead of luxery.

keepontroopin

It looks like this thing should have remote power sliding rear doors.

keepontroopin

Maybe we should have Edmunds add an Assender room to the isuzu room so we don't have to deal with it in the Trooper room.

arktrooper1

I think that paisan will confirm that I coined the name "Assender". I was on this website reading about it for the first time and thought that, being basically a GM product, the name was appropriate.

I don't want to start anything, but I think it's a legitimate concern. Is the Assender going to be allowed in the Isuzu Owner's Club. I'm not saying that it shouldn't be. Just wondering what everyone else thought.

As for myself, the last "real" Isuzu...for me, is the Axiom! The more I read about it in the Owners Club, the more I wish I could afford one to compliment my Trooper. What a great truck! If they make them long enough, maybe I'll buy one when the Trooper's paid off in another three years. I will keep the Trooper, of course. By then it should have only about 120K miles on it and a lot of good years ahead!

arktrooper1

I think it looks like an Xterra/Rodeo/Forester combo. A very undistinctive, non-upscale looking truck compared to the classic looks of the Trooper. The Trooper looks like a flagship vehicle. I'm really not sure what this is trying to be. What a joke! A friend of mine who is a mechanic at a local GM dealer says they have already replaced the engine that "got rave reviews" in a new Bravada and a new Trailblazer. Looks like people who buy the Assender may get to use their long warranty way before it expires!

paisan

The qualities of the Assender were at least that of what it was replacing AND built by Isuzu in an ISUZU plant AND had TOD or similar advanced 4wd system I'd consider it. Its the GM execution that drops the ball. In general US companies have great designs and gadgets, it is the acutal building of the vehicles that is the problem QC and other such elements drop the ball and the cars fall apart after 2 or 3 years.

-mike

PS: I don't think it will be part of the Owner's forum, it will be in the GM/Chevy section with the Trailblazer/Envoy stuff, if I have any say in the matter.

tkevinblanc

I understood from some press release or report or another that Isuzu was actually building its own replacement for the Rodeo in 2004... maybe there is still some hope.

paisan

My guess is that it will likely be a small SUV platform probably based on the Isuzu-desined S-10 pickup. If it isn't that Isuzu will likely make a ford escape competitor for Chevy. Whatever it is it will likely be Isuzu designed, GM built and at the least it will be GM re-badged.

-mike

sdc2

I'm gonna save my nickels so I can get a Gelaendewagen when my Trooper dies. ;-)

tetonman

BTW- I think you and BlueDevil (Erin?) bought your Troopers around the same time as me (late '99). Obviously you love your truck as much as we love ours, but any issues so far? What are your thoughts now that you've been driving it for a couple of years?

Tetonman

scoobyax

Your right with the Assender, looks like a combination of parts bin leftovers. You can add Bravada and Highlander to the mix as well. Can anyone explain why that thing looks so low to the ground? There goes GM screwing up another good thing.

paisan

Is that it will be the only one of the Trio-Envoy/Trailblazer/Assender to have the 5.3l V8 and 7800lb towing. It's beginning to grow on me already. But I'm not selling the Trooper anytime soon.

-mike

dielectric7bb

It has a low range too. Isuzu has a little deal for it on their page now. Only 100 ft^3 of room with the seats folded, I thought they were bigger than that.

tidester

Think about how the newbie will react to the more plebeian form of the name used here. Now, we don't want to scare off the newbies do we? :-)

tidester
Host
SUVs

sdc2

I bought my Troop in November 99 also. It was hands down the best value in an SUV at the time, probably still is. And more importantly for me, it has enough headroom, which is the main reason I ditched my old Blazer for the Trooper.

I have had the intake manifold gasket replaced twice (under warranty of course), otherwise no problems through 35K miles. The rear doors are chirping when I hit a pothole, I need to get back there and lube everything.

All in all very happy with my Darth (cuz it's monotone black) Trooper.

dcmoore

I check this discussion site now and again for talk about Troopers. I'm not very mechanically-inclined, so when I was looking at SUVs in 1999, I wanted something reliable.

Bought my '99 in 10/99. It now has 35+K miles. Got a nice deal and consider it to be a terrific value. It's been very reliable. I've had minor problems with the rear window wiper and the CD player. Dealer took care of both as well as some other minor glitches. Experiences with the dealer have surprisingly been quite good (knock on wood). I have a few other minor complaints -- the driver's seat squeaks a bit; the buttons for the horn are way too small; the horn is wimpy; the lights and wipers are mediocre. But the engine purrs and it's been a very reliable vehicle with lots of room and character. For the money, I don't think there's another "midsize" SUV with true offroad capability and a sophisticated 4WD system that can top it.

I enjoy reading the posts of those who are more mechanically-adept, esp. Paisan, who strikes me as the best cheerleader Isuzu could possibly have for the Trooper. I may even get up the nerve one of these days to try some of the modifications that have been bandied about on this board. Until then, I just change the oil regularly and otherwise try to generally maintain it in accordance with Isuzu's recommendations. I'm sure it'll run for quite a while.

arktrooper1

mike..after thinking about it, its good to hear (see?) you say what has needed to be said, but everyone else (including myself) hasnt...the ASCender (ok, tidester?) needs to be with the bravada/envoy/trailblazer...sorry if this offends anyone, but this vehicle neither looks nor quacks like a "duck" (an isuzu), mainly because it ISN'T

tidester...its only an opinion but im entitled to mine, although i do think my opinion likely reflects the majority of the people currently board...are we snobs?...i dont think so...again, this is an ISUZU owners club...as far a scaring off any newbies?...there are plenty of current ISUZU owners out there who will discover this board over time so i dont think the death of the ISUZU owners club is imminent...GM (unfortunately) builds crap (and everyone here knows it), they killed the Trooper for no good reason (except to them) and i really dont feel like being "politically correct" on this one...you know well that the Trooper has one of the most loyal followings of any vehicle on this site and expecting us to hide our distaste for its replacement is unrealistic at the least

tetonman...my CD changer was replaced within one week after it broke (4 business days!)...1 qt oil consumption every 3500 mi and 15 mpg which is fine with me...the headlights were somewhat corrected with Hella Optilux bulbs, i can get a Hella horn later...the wipers were fixed with better aftermarket blades...the air conditioner could be stronger but ill get a tint job soon...no vehicle is perfect, but overall i cant think of anything even close at the actual selling price and very few at the full list price that can compete...love the ride...the smoothness...the engine...the TOD...i could go on, but you own one...you know!:)...Dave (arktrooper)

bluedevils

I don't care where Edmunds puts it - with the Trailblazer/Envoy/Bravada, or with the Isuzus. Either way, I won't talk about it very much because it's not a real Isuzu.

I saw an extended-length Trailblazer the other day (mfr's plate) and I thought, 'ya know, that thing just looks too long.' It looks stretched-out, which it is. Visually, it doesn't work for me. I'll have to take a look at the Ascender pics to see how much different it is.

The only thing that makes me feel a little better is it sounds like GM will differentiate the Ascender a little bit from the GM and Chevy-badged versions. E.g. 5.3L V8, etc. Still, it's a GM vehicle, not an Isuzu.

arktrooper1

for the most part, nobody here cares about or for the Ascender and that will ultimately dictate whether its accepted here...not whether its shoved down our throats just 'cause it says Isuzu on its nameplate...its not only GM parts, but GM DESIGNED...if Isuzu had any part in this at all , its probably the name badge and thats it, sadly...Dave

paisan

The Trailblazer/Envoy/Bravada/ASSender were designed >50% by Isuzu just like the redesigned S10 pickup. Problem I have with them is that they will be mass produced in a GM plant. If they were coming out of Japan or SIA I'd probably jump ont he bandwagon a bit. But coming out of a GM plant, it will not be reliable, and will have the usual GM plasticy interior and sub-part parts. Biggest advantages:

1) GM parts bin so when it breaks, you'll have plenty of parts to fix it, unlike real Isuzus that just don't break for the most part

2) Aftermarket. They'll be able to get all kinds of turbos, superchargers, etc. etc. for them

3) Power/Engines, the 5.3 and 4.2 engines are probably some of the best on the market right now.

4) Possibility of the 5.0l Duramax Diesel

Other than that it's just another GM clone.

-mike

arktrooper1

i had thought that although they were GM designs, the Isuzu versions WERE coming out of SIA...my problem with them wasn's SIA, thats obviously a good plant, but the cheap GM parts and my assumption (apparantly wrong) that Isuzu had virtually nothing to do with their design...i wonder, with 50% design input, why Isuzu couldnt get the TOD/TurboHydramatic transmission combo in the all the clones, since it is largely a GM product and GM has used B/W components in the past?...if i had to pick among the top two or three Trooper attributes, TOD would certainly be in the running for the top spot...as far as the 6 cyl. engine goes, im not sold...the design is very good, but theyve had problems with them and not just what i know of at the GM dealership where my friend is a mechanic...my friend, btw, is not the stereotype mechanic, believing that 3K oil changes are rip-offs and having nearly 20 years experience with both diesel and gas engines (he likes the Duramax!) and being a Honda owner himself...

ramblinon

are they a straight replacement for the original bulbs? Any modification needed? Any real increased useable light? Actually, the thought of a more powerful headlight is enough to get me to the store ASAP.

Also, I saw the tri-horn arrangement on paisan's truck. I wouldn't mind having a real tooter. Does anyone have the Hella horn installed?

Best regards,

Ed

paisan

They are the triple trumpet Hellas from Ken @ Susquehanna Motorsports. The Hella bulbs are also a direct replacement for the 9004s just higher wattage 80/100 instead of 45/65

-mike

paisan

The Envoy/Trailblazer/Ascendor uses the 4L60 GM tranny instead of the 4L30 one that the Isuzus currently use. The 4L60 can handle up to 350ft-lbs of torque instead of the max of 250ft-lbs that the 4L30 can take. That is why they had to go with the other Tranny. As for the TOD, it's probably a result of the TOD costing more $ from B&W cause they would need a beefier TOD unit to handle the additional torque. Most GM buyers wouldn't care either way Auto-4wd v. TOD to them it's all the same thing, and would cost GM more $ to produce. Remember now that it's a mass-market vehicle, every penny they save is multiplied by a ton of vehicles which translates to a lot of $ in the end.

Links for the Tranny's below:

http://www.gm.com/automotive/gmpowertrain/transmissions/4l60_main.htm

http://www.gm.com/automotive/gmpowertrain/transmissions/4l30_main.htm

-mike

http://isuzu-suvs.com

savvas_e

Mike,

I emailed the 3rd row seat photos to you yesterday.

I also assumed that the Ascender will be out of SIA. The rhd Suburbans we received in Australia were out of a GM plant in Mexico and weren't too good.

Well, I'm planning on keeping Monty at least another 7 - 8 years. I hope Isuzu comes up with the real goods during that period.

Savvas

beer47

Happy Easter to all!
Second......Will the Ascender get the 10/120 that the trooper has? Will it be "priced right"? I can not see Joe Average paying more for an Isuzu nameplate than he would a Chevy unless there was a finacial incentive to do so. Remember, us Trooper lovers are in the minority of total consumers. The fact that GM builds it may actually be a selling point to numerous people. I just hope my 2000S runs for a quater mil.

bluedevils

I read the Isuzu press release last night. I think there's a little more in the "New Models" board. Offering that warranty should be a little scary for Isuzu/GM, if you ask me! GM would go bankrupt if it offered this warranty on all its vehicles.

beer, I agree that most people will need some sort of reason, probably a STRONG reason, to buy an Isuzu instead of a GM. With Trooper, it used to be that the assembly point (Japan) was the difference-maker for many folks, including me. Now that the Isuzu flagship SUV will be basically identical to the GM units, I don't see many people buying the Isuzu unless price, warranty, or other factors can distinguish the Isuzu.

paisan

From the info I have available to me here is my take:

o 10/120 warranty and 3/50 BtoB
o v8 5.3l engine, 7800lb towing (not available n the Chevy/GMC versions)
o Price point between the Chevy and GMC. The Envoy will be more the Trailblazer less
o Possible 4.0 or 5.0 Duramax Diesel Engine option down the road

My guess is that the v8 will win most of the buyers that would otherwise get the GMC/Chevy versions of the vehicle That currently is it's strong suit IMHO.

-mike

paisan

They'll be up tonight sometime.

-mike

99trooper

Hi all..
Someone (not sure who, they won't admit it) spilled coke in the center console of my 99trooper and the coke syrup found its way under the 4-way switch that controls the mirrors and the two click switches for the fold in mirrors etc. Does anyone know if I can just pop up the plate around those switches to clean underneath them..or if the whole console has to be disassembled?...thanks!

savvas_e

Hi all,

The Isuzu business plan through to 2004 states that -

1. Heavy truck production will be relocated to Fujisawa, the current Trooper plant.

2. SUV production will be relocated to North America

3. Engines for SUV/RVs will continue to be produced in Fujisawa

4. Reduce their current 7 platforms to 3 core platforms, which are all trucks. No mention of SUVs.

Here's the freaky bit - In Japan they will supply Isuzu SUVs built at SIA, with Chevy badging.

Here's the link - http://www.isuzu.co.jp/world/b_press/b_20.htm

paisan

You might try using rubbing alchol to clean out the switches then you don't need to dissasemble anything just douse it with rubbing alchol and allow to dry.

-mike

99trooper

I may end up giving that a shot..!

paisan

<- is a computer tech and whenever we get a keyboard that has been gooked up, we use rubbing alchol on it, we pour it all over it and shake it up, then when the alchol evaporates the electronics are clean and dry, don't attempt to turn on the car until the alchol has dried. A nice warm day is best to do it.

-mike

dielectric7bb

You can pop up the center switches. Just use your fingernails, or a screwdriver to get under it and work it around. Once it's out, you can take them all out if need be. It pops right back in with ease. Just be careful not to scratch anything up when you're prying :-)

99trooper

for the tip! thats exactly what I needed to know!