Don't know what to say except that the Sequoia has skid control, traction control, front and side airbags, side curtain airbags and the list goes on and on. I'm not saying these are exclusive to Toyota but there are lots of safety features built into this truck. Coupled with its size, I'd say you're fairly safe. One of the car magazines reported the Sequoia "has a sports car feel with very little body roll in high-speed cornering". I think safety is pretty top of mind with all car makers right now- especially with their SUV's. Hope this helps.
P.S. You are posting to Acura MDX, Honda Pilot and looking for an MDX. Why the postings about Sequoia (just curious:)? The Sequoia really is a different animal than the other two.
A few weeks back I posted about my frustrations about these two items. I kind of "solved" or at least improved the "staying ability" of the rear cargo cover just by stretching the two snap-on locks on the cover. You just have to be very careful not to break the locks (and sign a liability waiver from me). It hadn't fallen since I did that.
I am still hoping about some ideas about what to do with the antenna. I really would like to replace it with a shorter one because it keeps on scraping my garage door. It's already bent now and before long the antenna motor will probably go.
It's my second choice. I am curious about the Sequoia since it has more safety features than the MDX. The MDX looks better and more easy to park (IMO) after a test drive but the Sequoia has more room. Still researching...
You should take a Sequoia out for a test drive! While it may not end up being your choice, I think you will notice the build quality, incredibly smooth and powerful engine and the feeling of sitting in a quality vehicle. I've never been in an MDX but it would be my choice for a mid-ute and has had rave reviews. It is a little pricey, but so is the Sequoia! Sometimes real value costs a little more.
'02 Explorer EB w/ v8 and most of the other options or an '02 Sequoia LTD with most of the options. Both are truck-based unlike the mdx and both have true 4wd systems rather than awd. the sequoia wins in almost every category but I am trying ot justify the price differential. Also, I am purchasing the truck outright and it appears that I can get the ford for dealer cost or just a bit over. The toyota dealers are not discounting much and add on every conceivable aftermarket/upmarket charge they can find. I'm in North Houston and can't find a Toyota dealer with much negotiating room. How did others in this group fare when negotiating? It's a piece of cake with the ford dealers.
Sorry for this note if it's been covered before; I'm somewhat new to this list and with 4000+ posts, finding info has been tough.
Try REI or LL Bean on-line for thought starters on racks. I use a ski rack and cargo carrier attached to my roof rack cross beams and for bikes, I've got a yakima folding carrier that inserts into the 2" receiver of the trailer hitch. Lately, I would recommend yakima even though I used to use thule exclusivly.
Sounds like you should try other dealers outside your immediate area. I purchased an 01 early last year and eventually found a dealer willing to sell a little under 'invoice' for a custom-ordered SR5. I found that many dealers were not willing to negotiate any at all, while others were. I travel frequently and looked in the Dallas area and it seemed like they were the ones who did not want to negotiate any at all. I also visited dealerships in Kentucky, Michigan, Alabama, Florida, & Tennessee. Most would negotiate a little, but only 2 dealers (1 in AL, 1 in TN) were really serious about earning my business. I finally bought in TN. Try to custom-order, instead of buying what's sitting on their lot. It worked for me. This way, you don't have to buy the 'extra add-ons'. Basically, the way I view it, the dealer has 2 choices when a customer walks in and wants to custom-order. They can negotiate a lower price and make a few hundred dollars off a sale (much less $ than they prefer to make), or let the customer walk and make zero. My dealer told me the reason he wanted to order for me and sell at below invoice was because once he sold me my vehicle, he would be allowed to get more Sequoias the following month. Yes he made money on my sale. The dealership made the $199 standard fee for paperwork/doc, plus he made a few hundred from the holdback and increased his sales. But his biggest payoff was to get more vehicles in the next month that he could sell for much higher. Bottom line, shop around until you find someone willing to negotiate down near what you think is a fair deal. Beware of dealers who tell you they can't custom-order for you. I had several try to tell me that Toyota doesn't allow this on any of their vehicles. I simply marked them off my list and never communicated w/ them again. Hope this helps some. Good luck.
---------------------------- The toyota dealers are not discounting much and add on every conceivable aftermarket/upmarket charge they can find. I'm in North Houston and can't find a Toyota dealer with much negotiating room. How did others in this group fare when negotiating?
i am out of the us and in japan on business. when i get back home i will check the glove compartment for the new alignment specs on my '01 sr5 2wd. that won't be until early next week tho'. 714cut is correct, the alignment specs are different for 2wd and 4wd, and both were posted to tundrasolutions.com a while ago. i did post about the my specs here on this board - say about mid-December last year.... i do not have the time to search for it, but if you can you'll find parts of my new specs already posted here....
sorry i cannot help more for now; when i get back home i'll find the numbers and re-post here for you....
Hi all, I have been watching this discussion since I purchased me SR5 in May 01. I have a black 2wd sr5. the truck has been a very dependable vehicle so far. But I have a question about the noise that comes out of the enngine compartment when the wheels begin to spin, you see I live in ohio and we do get some snow (: but it seems like the motor is going to explode whenever i drive it in the snow or any slick surface. Is there something that can be done, besides being extremely annoying, it just seems like I am tearing the engine apart.
Don't take offense to this but the noises are explained quite clearly in the owners manual and are normal. The issue may be the "sensitivity" of your skid control. If it happens too frequently complain to your dealer. I have heard of '02 chips being installed to help this problem. The new chips have been recalibrated to be less sensitive. Another thing to consider is Blizzak type ice and snow tires for the winter. Obviously the better your tires grip the less the VSC goes off. I have the winter dueller DMZ2's and they make a huge difference.
pemarsh: jmho, you are asking the wrong crowd to convince you of what is best for you. methinks, that is yours to do - doing your dd and good research, but most importantly, what do YOU think is best for you, under your own circumstances ?? Only YOU can answer that.
7am friday in Yokohama. What you all already knows: Japan is truly a great country. Just yesterday I was driven through the underwater tunnel across Tokyo Bay from Yokohama to Chiba Prefecture. It is a marvel to see you go under the sea and out over land travelling east to west. Bringing this back to vehicles, of course, this is Toyota's home country, and I personally would like to see some of the vehicles here in Japan marketed and sold in the US. One in particular I love is the Nissan Skyline. A somewhat distant comparison to it, in looks, may be the Chevy Monte Carlo. It looks great with its distinctive twin tail lights and twin head lights. The Toyota camry here is a different looking brand. The Japanese version is, imo, a much better looking version than the NA model.
Just a feedback to you on the Japanese trip. Hope someone finds this useful tid-bit.
Of course, there is no place like home, and it won't come any sooner for me to be back to good ol' USA.
I see from your profile that you own a 95 Explorer. If you are satisfied with the performance of that vehicle, why not save the extra cash and go with the Ford? I, on the other hand, am getting out of my 97 Ford Explorer (EB all options) and vow never to purchase another Ford product. My Explorer was my first, and last, domestic car purchase. All of my previous vehicles performed exceptionally well (Nissans and Hondas). I literally rebuilt my Explorer from bumper to bumper. Moreover, the materials did not wear as well as my other vehicles (I meticulously maintain my vehicles - - appearance (Zaino products) and mechanics). It is possible that I got a bad sample; however, I have heard similar horror stories. I am quite certain that I will end up with a Sequoia. I have received no hassle quotes from several dealers (and one run around and hide the figures deal with many misrepresentations - - Oxmoor Toyota). If you are willing to leave your city, if necessary, you should have no problem getting a Sequoia at $500 over invoice or less. Whatever way you go, best of luck with your purchase.
It's not about convincing you. You need to decide yourself which is the best vehicle for you. There are over 4000 posts about Sequoias here and most of us are qualified to give detailed information about Sequoias not Yukons. Both are excellent vehicles. Both have strengths and weaknesses. Neither are perfect. One will be better for you than the other. Take them out for a long test drive, decide which features and strengths are most important to you and then make your decision.
714cut: I suppose you might have been wondering why I didn't respond to pemarsh on the merits of the Yukon. I didn't for a simple reason. You did a fine job speaking for both of us!
I recd a quote from a dealer in Houston, Texas for a fully optioned Sequoia Limited. The quote included $2060 MSRP for "port instl prices" and $535 for "deliv/proc/hand". I was told that all dealers in Texas have these extra charges because they have to go thru "GST" or Gulf States Toyota distributor. As I see no mention of this in the Edmund's TMV for this region, am I being duped or are these charges legitimate? Any help appreciated.
714cut: Here's some info on the new model <http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=1616>. Rumor has it that it will include the 750hp v12 NorthStar. Won't that be a kick in the pants!!
My wife and I are about to pull the trigger on a 2001 SR5 tonight from a Toyota dealer. The truck has 42,000 miles and needs a rack and pinion job (my mechanic says it is leaking and probably needs to be replaced). The dealer wants $28,500. Edmunds puts the value about $29,000 but I'm really wondering why the dealer didn't know about the problem before he put it up for sale. We would also like a moonroof and want to know how much to expect to pay to put one in. Would it be okay or would it leak? Any thoughts on this? Dusty
Love my 01 Sequoia. One major problem is that on long medium or steep grades the whole vehicle starts to shake quite violently on pressing the brakes even lightly.
I brought up the issue at the recently completed 7,500 service and the service manager insists that I'm riding the brakes and that they heat and warp, basically pushing the issue back onto me. I don't think he gets it! I took his service technician out on a test drive and now he gets it! I have to take the truck back in for them to look at again but they seem clue less
Anyone experienced any similar problems (with the brakes not the dealer)?
Somehow my wife convinced me to go against my grain and buy a 2001 SR5. I didn't have time to check "mcmatt" or "andyb" messages because I was signing the papers. Here is what happened. We found a bunch of paint chipping away under the car, marks on interior trim, leaking rack and pinion. The Toyota dealer agreed to repaint, remove all marks, fix everything on the car that our mechanic found. They asked for 28, 560. My wife and I said no deal, we wanted to add a moonroof plus extended warranty and stay near $30,000. All of that would have pushed us way over $31.5 K. We agreed on a price of 27,750 and they took a a couple hundred off the moonroof installation. We then agreed on buying the car with moonroof and everything fixed for 29,010. We opted for toyota certification because we wanted the 4.9 % loan which was only allowed if we got the toyota certification. The certifcation adds another $700 to the $29,010. I'm looking for a wrap warranty that "sits" on top of the certification that extends coverage to 100,000 miles. My options aren't good. Toyota wants to charge me another $1,100 to extend the coverage to 100,000. Don't you think I could get a better deal after certifying the darn thing? I will be looking at $30,8010 before taxes and tags. Oh well, it is only........!!!!!!
Rear (left): Camber 0.0; Toe -0.18 Rear (right): Camber -0.1; Toe -0.13
Rear: Total toe: -0.31 Thrust angle: -0.05
For more reference, below is shown a set of specs posted recently on the sequoiasolutions:
----------reproduced from sequoiasolutions---
Before the database crash DJ noted that we can get the latest updated alingment specs from Hunter Engineering @ 888-450-7200 which will slove poor stability in the wind or drifting caused by highway rain groves.
Here are those specs, 2001 to 2002 Toyota SUV Sequoia 4x2 Limited
Spec / Neg. Tolerance / Pos. Tolerance Left Camber 0.12 / 0.75 / 0.75 Right Camber 0.12 / 0.75 / 0.75 Cross Camber --- / --- / 0.50 Left Caster 3.03 / 0.75 / 0.75 Right Caster 3.03 / 0.75 / 0.75 Cross Caster --- / ----- / 0.50 Total Toe 0.08 / 0.15 / 0.15 Left SAI 10.65 / 0.75 / 0.75 Right SAI 10.65 / 0.75 / 0.75 ----------end----------------------
Anyone had any experience mapping the TMV pricing anywhere close to what the dealer will agree to? Last time I bought a car the dealer had a million excuses why these types of services aren't accurate.
I'm into the email negotiation process with 2 dealers in Seattle, WA and once again I can't match their version of the invoice and what I get from TMV. Thoughts?
Started looking for a new '02 Ltd. yesterday in NW Ohio. Found only 2 new Sequoias on 5 dealer lots. Also, only 2 or 3 Tundras and 1 lone Land Cruiser. What goes? Sales not good right now and everybody cutting inventory, or sales so good no one can keep them on the lots? Just started looking, but it struck me as very odd.
It depends on your dealership. I used to work at a country store where we NEVER would have an LC in stock and rarely ever sold anything more than $25K. The store I am now in is very large and very urban. Inventory comes in cycles. I know the Limited is hard to get right now and I don't recall seeing too many Tundras around either.
Was considering an '03 4Runner but have been reading conflicting info. on another board about when that vehicle will be available, and I'm a little worried that the '91 Pathfinder I have won't hold out. Will probably go with the purchase of an '02 Sequoia, but also interested in used '01. Doesn't seem to be too many used ones available here in the central OH area though. I'm assuming dealers will be a little more motivated at the end of the month to cut a deal so I'm probably going to wait till the last week of Mar. to do something. The vehicle will definitely see occasional off road use. I'm interested in any insight any readers can offer on the purchase of a Sequoia or any problems that they have encountered with the vehicle. Thanks in advance for your help.
In a 14" heavy snowfall a large pine branch came down smack-dab on top of the hood of my wife's Sequoia. The branch left several dents and scratches across the top of the hood and one small ding in the front driver quarter panel. We were able to make a claim under the comprehensive on our insurance. The total estimate to fix the minor damage was real close to $2,000. Not sure if that is because it is a Toyota and parts are expensive or the bill may have been that high with any vehicle.
Also of interest is that the black plastic cover on the rear of our roof rack is missing. Just plain gone. I inspected the matching cover on the other side and I can't see how it would have come off. I am guessing either is was just loose and we lost it while driving down the highway or perhaps someone stold it??? I really don't know.
I really hope that with only 11,000 miles that our Sequoia is not rattling away to nothing. So far I will rate our Toyota owner experience as a 4 on a 10 scale.
Has anyone on the list traded in a Sequoia SR5 4x4? What was the trade-in value? Was it fair?
a month after i bought my seq. a black rubber glued on the roof rack had come unglued one day while driving on the freeway. i heard this loud clanging on the roof and had to stop. took it in to the dealer and it was re-glued back on. it's never happened again in over 1 year of ownership. i am not sure it is same thing as yours tho'...
wrt what would a sr5 4x4 worth in trade-in. i do not know for sure, but for reference, last december i entertained the idea of trading up to the '02 sr5 4x2 and had my '01 sr5 4x2 appraised by the dealer. i was offered $30k for it. it had base stuff with a couple extras - leather seats and trim and chrome wheels (both were dealer-installed). i paid $34k + ttl in Dec 2000 when i bought it. i changed my mind on the deal. however, i checked kbb and found it worth ca. $31.5K in excellent condition and with 20k miles (as of december 2001)...
I bought my 02 SEQ (SR5 4x4) with all the options for $800 over invoice. It's my asking price and dealer said ok immediately without blicking eyes. My gut feeling is I can get the truck for only $500 over, maybe even lower. We offered the price because my wife really loves the truck and she is afried dealer might walk if the offer is too low. My suggestion is: if the dealer has a truck in the lot, start with low ball offer ($300-500) and see what she/he says. For further detail, check my past postings.
I think I remember posts about the roof rack covers waaaaay back in time. As I recall, they were just falling off and dealers were replacing them free of charge at the time. You might want to dig through the old posts to see what you can find. It might be worth your time.
Thanks for the pricing info. Your $500 over invoice estimate seems in line with what I was thinking. I recently got some on-line quotes back from some dealers in central and southern OH ranging from $1700 - 2100 over invoice which seemed pretty high. This gives me some more ammunition to work with in my negotiations.
I think your wife may be confused, when she said: "...is afried dealer might walk if the offer is too low." Where is the 'dealer' going to walk to? It's always the customer who has the option to 'walk'. Yes, the dealer has the option to not sell at a price he doesn't like, but the dealer will always be there for the customer to come back and make other offers. It's the salesman that should be afraid of the customer 'walking' away if the price is not right. The customer always holds the option of not coming back to any particular dealership.
I have trouble keeping my Sequoia on the road. It seems to want to drift either left or right even thou I've had it realigned to the VIN specs. The sensation is similiar to that of a small vehicle being passed by a larger truck on the highway, and in my case, no other vehicle around. Does anyone else have the same problem, always adjusting to keep the vehicle moving straight. This can be a real workout on a long trip.
I've had my 02 SR5 since November and after 3500 miles of only highway driving on weekends/trips, the steering and handling are outstanding. i have not experienced the problems you state. in fact, the sequoia handles like a much smaller car and much. much better than my 94 Grand Cherokee and not far from my 00 Maxima.
My experience on the hgy is like borsyst's. Very easy to handle, almost like a sports car. You should check out your tire pressure and your tires. Make sure the tires on the front are at equal pressure. Make sure the backs are at equal pressure and not too much more than the fronts. Also, max psi on the Dunlop Grand Treks is 50, so if you run those at 30 they are likely not to handle well.
My 2002 is 3 months old and has about 3000 miles on it.We use it for weekend trips to ski county at mostly interstate speeds (65-75 mph).I have Dunlop tires. I agree with borsyst and gpm5 that the Sequoia drives like a much smaller vehicle. For me, the ease of steering is one of the high points of ownership. I follow Toyota's recommendtion on tire pressure which is 32 psi (if fully loaded you might bump it up to 35 psi) and stability is fine. I would not inflate the tires any where near the maximum of 50 psi. If I was having your problem and tire inflations are correct, I would have the dealer check it out again.
I too have the same steering problem as frabet. In fact I posted a message on this site last year regarding it. When at highway speeds on a calm day without much traffic, it handles well. On an even slightly breezy day or in a lot of big vehicle traffic, I have to constantly try to correct the tendency to drift. The dealer checked this out 3 times and couldn't find any problem. Tire pressures are correct. Ours is a 2001 4x4 Limited. I can deal with it but is annoying and somewhat tiring on long trips.
As I read all of the posts on this site, many of you refer to paying a certain amount "over invoice". I am curious if the "invoice" you mention includes TDA and other fees, or is it the invoice price shown on Edmund's TMV? As you can tell from my screen name, I soon hope to be a proud owner of a sequoia, and I want to make sure that I am understanding what people are really paying. Any advice for this greenhorn would be appreciated!
nutrehugr, The invoice that I am referring to is what I calculated on Yahoo Autos. You choose the vehicle and all the options you are looking for and it will calculate the invoice and MSRP. If you want to find out what the dealer's cost of the vehicle is, subtract the holdback percentage from the invoice that you calculate. According to Edmunds, Toyota's holback is 2% of the base MSRP. You can use this information as a reference point to see how good the offers are that dealers are giving you. Don't be surprised if a salesman tells you that their actual invoice price is more than what you calculate. Don't believe it! Initial quotes that I have gotten back from dealers in OH are ranging between $1,000 - $2,100 over invoice. Figuring in the holdback that works out to a dealer profit of $1,700 - $2,800. With some negotiation and as we get closer to the end of the month, I think I can get the price well under the $1,000 over invoice figure. I'll let you know if I'm successful.
I am trying to work a deal on a new Sequoia. I was shooting for $800 over invoice, but the dealer wants $1400 but will split the difference. So I am thinking $1100 over invoice that I found on KBB and Edmunds. But for some reason it is more like $1850 over that ivoice, well surprise that is TDA, about $750, that every Toyo dealer pays and it is not included in the invoice. Is this correct or am I having smoke blown up my you know where?
Comments
P.S. You are posting to Acura MDX, Honda Pilot and looking for an MDX. Why the postings about Sequoia (just curious:)? The Sequoia really is a different animal than the other two.
Where & What are the improved alignment specs? is there a service bulletin available?
Thanks.
NL
I am still hoping about some ideas about what to do with the antenna. I really would like to replace it with a shorter one because it keeps on scraping my garage door. It's already bent now and before long the antenna motor will probably go.
Horsepower = 550(ft)(lb)/s
(Torque)(RPM)=Power
Horsepower = (Torque)(RPM)/5252
You will notice that most horsepower ratings indicate the engine RPM during the test.
Different vehicle horsepower ratings can be compared if the engines RPM were the same or you compensate yourself.
Horsepower ratings are not apples to apples and can be very deceptive.
I never got a test drive on the Sequoia.
Sorry for this note if it's been covered before; I'm somewhat new to this list and with 4000+ posts, finding info has been tough.
Bottom line, shop around until you find someone willing to negotiate down near what you think is a fair deal. Beware of dealers who tell you they can't custom-order for you. I had several try to tell me that Toyota doesn't allow this on any of their vehicles. I simply marked them off my list and never communicated w/ them again. Hope this helps some. Good luck.
----------------------------
The toyota dealers are not discounting much and add on every conceivable aftermarket/upmarket charge they can find. I'm in North Houston and can't find a Toyota dealer with much negotiating room. How did others in this group fare when negotiating?
sorry i cannot help more for now; when i get back home i'll find the numbers and re-post here for you....
The issue may be the "sensitivity" of your skid control. If it happens too frequently complain to your dealer. I have heard of '02 chips being installed to help this problem. The new chips have been recalibrated to be less sensitive.
Another thing to consider is Blizzak type ice and snow tires for the winter. Obviously the better your tires grip the less the VSC goes off. I have the winter dueller DMZ2's and they make a huge difference.
Here is everyones chance to tell me what is great about the Sequoia, and not so great about the Yukon. I am torn between the two.
Have you'll been paying above MSRP or below and by how much?
The dealers don't have any available most of the time.
7am friday in Yokohama. What you all already knows: Japan is truly a great country. Just yesterday I was driven through the underwater tunnel across Tokyo Bay from Yokohama to Chiba Prefecture. It is a marvel to see you go under the sea and out over land travelling east to west. Bringing this back to vehicles, of course, this is Toyota's home country, and I personally would like to see some of the vehicles here in Japan marketed and sold in the US. One in particular I love is the Nissan Skyline. A somewhat distant comparison to it, in looks, may be the Chevy Monte Carlo. It looks great with its distinctive twin tail lights and twin head lights. The Toyota camry here is a different looking brand. The Japanese version is, imo, a much better looking version than the NA model.
Just a feedback to you on the Japanese trip. Hope someone finds this useful tid-bit.
Of course, there is no place like home, and it won't come any sooner for me to be back to good ol' USA.
I brought up the issue at the recently completed 7,500 service and the service manager insists that I'm riding the brakes and that they heat and warp, basically pushing the issue back onto me. I don't think he gets it! I took his service technician out on a test drive and now he gets it! I have to take the truck back in for them to look at again but they seem clue less
Anyone experienced any similar problems (with the brakes not the dealer)?
a good ,fair deal on sr5 4x4
As requested, here are the alignment specs for my '01 SR5 4x2 265/70R16 (performed 11/05/01):
Camber / Caster / Toe
Left: 0.1 / 2.5 / 0.05
Right: 0.0 / 2.3 / 0.05
Front: 0.1 /0.2 / 0.1 (set back = 0.6 deg)
Rear (left): Camber 0.0; Toe -0.18
Rear (right): Camber -0.1; Toe -0.13
Rear:
Total toe: -0.31
Thrust angle: -0.05
For more reference, below is shown a set of specs posted recently on the sequoiasolutions:
----------reproduced from sequoiasolutions---
Before the database crash DJ noted that we can get the latest updated alingment specs from Hunter Engineering @ 888-450-7200 which will slove poor stability in the wind or drifting caused by highway rain groves.
Here are those specs,
2001 to 2002 Toyota SUV Sequoia 4x2 Limited
Spec / Neg. Tolerance / Pos. Tolerance
Left Camber 0.12 / 0.75 / 0.75
Right Camber 0.12 / 0.75 / 0.75
Cross Camber --- / --- / 0.50
Left Caster 3.03 / 0.75 / 0.75
Right Caster 3.03 / 0.75 / 0.75
Cross Caster --- / ----- / 0.50
Total Toe 0.08 / 0.15 / 0.15
Left SAI 10.65 / 0.75 / 0.75
Right SAI 10.65 / 0.75 / 0.75
----------end----------------------
Hope the above helps
I'm into the email negotiation process with 2 dealers in Seattle, WA and once again I can't match their version of the invoice and what I get from TMV. Thoughts?
Thanks,
Mike
sjb223 - I'm in houston too. What dealer are you talking with? Those charges sound bogus to me.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Also of interest is that the black plastic cover on the rear of our roof rack is missing. Just plain gone. I inspected the matching cover on the other side and I can't see how it would have come off. I am guessing either is was just loose and we lost it while driving down the highway or perhaps someone stold it??? I really don't know.
I really hope that with only 11,000 miles that our Sequoia is not rattling away to nothing. So far I will rate our Toyota owner experience as a 4 on a 10 scale.
Has anyone on the list traded in a Sequoia SR5 4x4? What was the trade-in value? Was it fair?
wrt what would a sr5 4x4 worth in trade-in. i do not know for sure, but for reference, last december i entertained the idea of trading up to the '02 sr5 4x2 and had my '01 sr5 4x2 appraised by the dealer. i was offered $30k for it. it had base stuff with a couple extras - leather seats and trim and chrome wheels (both were dealer-installed). i paid $34k + ttl in Dec 2000 when i bought it. i changed my mind on the deal. however, i checked kbb and found it worth ca. $31.5K in excellent condition and with 20k miles (as of december 2001)...
hope the above helps
Where is the 'dealer' going to walk to? It's always the customer who has the option to 'walk'. Yes, the dealer has the option to not sell at a price he doesn't like, but the dealer will always be there for the customer to come back and make other offers. It's the salesman that should be afraid of the customer 'walking' away if the price is not right. The customer always holds the option of not coming back to any particular dealership.
The invoice that I am referring to is what I calculated on Yahoo Autos. You choose the vehicle and all the options you are looking for and it will calculate the invoice and MSRP. If you want to find out what the dealer's cost of the vehicle is, subtract the holdback percentage from the invoice that you calculate. According to Edmunds, Toyota's holback is 2% of the base MSRP. You can use this information as a reference point to see how good the offers are that dealers are giving you. Don't be surprised if a salesman tells you that their actual invoice price is more than what you calculate. Don't believe it! Initial quotes that I have gotten back from dealers in OH are ranging between $1,000 - $2,100 over invoice. Figuring in the holdback that works out to a dealer profit of $1,700 - $2,800. With some negotiation and as we get closer to the end of the month, I think I can get the price well under the $1,000 over invoice figure. I'll let you know if I'm successful.
Good luck, hope this helps.