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Add the 2010 Fusion/Milan to that group too. All of them will have Ford's AdvanceTrac ESC and TC standard.
Thanks for your consideration,
Jonathan Wahl
Corporate Communications
Edmunds Inc.
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2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
1) I have no way of predicting what may happen in the future, and what kind of crazy/stupid/ill drivers I may find myself sharing the road with.
2) I know that people make mistakes, so I feel better knowing that these kinds of safety features are in the cars my family drives. My oldest son made a mistake while driving a couple of years ago, and was in an accident in which the airbags deployed. He walked away with a little scratch on his arm. Next time, it could be a feature like ABS or ESC that saves one of my loved ones, or perhaps someone they are sharing the road with, from serious injury. That is good enough for me.
On most cars with ESC, you can turn it off. Go ahead, push that button, and then maybe say a prayer that one of those "certain situations" doesn't happen to you.
The 2010 Fusion goes on sale in January. "Next year" is only 2 months away.
I agree (although for competitive reasons only). However ESC is offered on the '09 Fusion as a $495 option. Not standard like the rest, or the 2010 Fusion, but still offered.
it does require active involvement of the driver. they have to be willing and able to make the avoidance moves.
awd is higher up my list than ESC.
If you are trucking down the highway and start to skid because you are hydroplaning ESC will kick in to help. Or if you are skidding on ice and snow ESC will kick in to help.
It has nothing to do with avoidance manuevers. It's sole purpose is to keep the car from slipping and sliding and to go where the front wheels are pointed, before you know you are about to skid.
It has everything to do with avoidance manuevers. ESC counteracts understeer and oversteer (in Nascar terms understeer is when the front of the car hits the wall and oversteer is when the back of the car hits the wall). When you make an emergency avoidance maneuver (lane change) ESC keeps the vehicle under control and prevents it from spinning out. Just look at all the ESC demonstrations and this should be obvious.
That varies from vehicle to vehicle. I know my Explorer uses both engine retardation and individual wheel braking for its ESC but I'm pretty sure the Fusion only used brakes.
Or if you are skidding on ice and snow ESC will kick in to help.
It will kick in on ice and snow but its effectiveness is limited on those types of surfaces.
I agree with akirby in that it is most useful in emergency maneuvers. If you are depending on ESC to save you in spirited driving then you have other that ESC will not help. Like oncoming traffic, guide rails, and trees to name a few. You can still move off the beaten path somewhat even though ESC is doing its job.
It has nothing to do with avoidance maneuvers. If at any time the front or rear of the car is not going in the direction of the steering wheel ESC will kick in. There are various reasons skid could occur or could be about to occur that are not due to avoidance. Stupid driving in slick conditions is one example that comes to mind.
As noted, ESC can't manufacture traction or go beyond physics. It's another safety device, of which stupidity can negate it's effectiveness.
Go here and click on the 1.5 minute video on the right hand side. Almost every demonstration of ESC includes an emergency lane change.
I'll repeat, one does not have to make an emergency manuever to have ESC kick in. I have some knowledge about ESC systems as my former car had one. ESC would kick in to keep the car from sliding or to stop the wheels from spinning.
ESC, and all the other safety features have their value, and help reduce accidents. That's great! The question I have is, when is it too much. ESC, ABS, Airbags, Seatbelt tensioners, lane change sensors, crumple zones, etc, etc,. All these safety features are adding to the price of our cars, so where do we draw the line? When the safety features cost more than the rest of the car? We may be close to that point now.
But that aside, I'd rather pay more for all the latest safety features than for stuff I don't need like nav systems, 100 gigawatt sound systems with disk arrays, DVDs, etc. etc.
However, it doesn't stop wheelspin - that's traction control and while TC is almost always included with ESC you can get TC without ESC in some vehicles.
Used Acura's are also on the list and will be test driven this weekend. 2004/2005 TSX or TL.
oh yeah...I'll also throw in doubts about the first year of a new generation. Seems like a good idea to avoid them....no? Moves the Mazda6 down the list...
We'll that's true, but without TC ESC isn't effective. It's the TC which modulates the brakes. Do you have an example of a manufacturer that has ESC but not TC?
Just funnin'...These forums have been great for getting me to think more broadly.
And...the other half believes in 'brands" and "quality"..and is so luke warm on a Hyundai it becomes a dead-end conversation. Last thing I need is the "i told you so" at the first sign of trouble...and I want to be able to switch back and forth between the cars. I'll be stuck in the Hyundai with no escape if I go that route.
I could drag us out to drive one this weekend...and while it will surely be "fine"...i don't see it overcoming doubts or arrousing any passion...
I was, on the other hand, very impressed with a four-cylinder Milan I drove for a couple of weeks in the summer.
My apologies for the brief detour down Elantra Avenue.
I do...but would like to hear some opinions/facts on comparing safety in Mazda6, Accord and Civic.
To answer your request directly, all of the vehicles you mention are very safe, and MUCH safer than the average compact or midsize car was 5 or 6 years ago. It's actually hard to make a bad decision based on safety, these days.
Here are the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety's "Top Picks" for the vehicle categories you are looking at (compact and midsize, non-lux models) These sedans did exceptionally well in testing, and offer ESC.
MIDSIZE
Ford Fusion
2009 models with optional electronic stability control
Honda Accord
4-door models
Mercury Milan
2009 models with optional electronic stability control
Subaru Legacy
with optional electronic stability control
Volkswagen Jetta
2009 models
Volkswagen Passat
2009 models
************************************
COMPACT
Honda Civic
2009 4-door models with optional electronic stability control
Mitsubishi Lancer
2009 models with optional electronic stability control
Scion xB
2008-09 models
Subaru Impreza
with optional electronic stability control
Volkswagen Rabbit
2009 4-door models
****************************
You asked specifically about the Civic, Accord, and 6.
The Civic and the Accord received "Good" scores (the highest rating possible) for the frontal-offset test on each of the measures below. The Mazda 6 received a marginal rating (2nd lowest possible) for the Leg/foot-right portion, but received "Good" overall.
Injury measures: Restraints/dummy kinematics, Head/neck, Chest, Leg/foot-left Leg/foot-right
The IIHS had this to say about the Mazda 6's "Marginal" rating in that particular area:
**Forces on the right tibia indicate that injuries to the lower leg would be possible.**
For the side-impact test, the new Mazda 6 has not yet been tested. The Accord received "Good" scores across the board for risk of injury for the measures below. The Civic received "Good" scores on all measures except Driver Torso, in which it received "Acceptable" ratings, the second highest. As far as that goes, the IIHS had this to say about that particular Acceptable rating:
**Driver — Measures taken from the dummy indicate that rib fractures would be possible in a crash of this severity. The risk of significant injuries to other body regions is low.**
Injury Measures: Head/neck, Torso, Pelvis/leg, Head Protection
I hope this helps!
But of course a smaller, lighter, more maneuverable car in the hands of an alert driver may be able to avoid that collision completely. . .
One reason for the popularity of the midsize cars to which this particular forum is devoted: they are an excellent compromise between these two extremes.
for some anyway. :P
Realistically, both cars are very safe.
Interior:
http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2008/11/06_fusionsport2010.jpg
Exterior (Sport)
http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/images/gallery/12/2008/11/medium_3042372762_c3d- b79e048_o.jpg
Other things, not related to the quality of the car itself, might. . .
In a word, nice! I really like the interior, and if the materials are any better than in the current car, even better.