That "mentality" is going away lots of places, even here in Michigan I think. Alaska may be the last bastion after it's all said and done. The real fun will begin when the Koch's start funding the efforts to decertify the UAW in the Detroit shops.
What's really funny is that the political power of the unions boils down to their phone banks. I think it's legal to call cell phones but it's easy to block calls with a smartphone (only us old guys who may need a pacemaker have landlines anymore). The pols use data and don't need old fashioned organizing like they used to rely on. But encouraging the right-wing to grind down the unions plays right into the left-wing's hands. Who will protect the workers?
Why, the government of course. Wheels within wheels.
@Stever@Edmunds said: ...to grind down the unions plays right into the left-wing's hands. Who will protect the workers?
Why, the government of course. Wheels within wheels.
With OPM of course, to do the "protecting." "What can you give me?"
But this begs the huge amount of value in money and time given by the unions to support "the party" in elections these days. Money that can't be given in one way from a campaign or their PACs can be given from Union funds or even personal donations from individuals within locals. Such was done around Columbus for the previous election.
So unions still play a huge role in the ground campaign to take over the power. The real slap in the face to union folks in Dayton area was the liberals ignoring the IBEW from the Moraine Assembly, who had put so many feet and dollars on the ground in the campaigns, and giving everything to the UAW in the auto bailout.
the Koch's start funding the efforts to decertify the UAW in the Detroit shops.
That will be matched by the many huge sources of funds from the liberals including Soros and other puppets under the control of the likes of him. One to watch is the Secretary of State projects to take over the SOS positions, where the control is in who gets to vote and over what period of time and how often.
The UAW is closely aligned with the liberals and Dems. Did the UAW require ID to vote? Did the UAW vote allow voting over a month? Or was it just one day (three days). The NAACP requires picture ID and only allows one day for getting your vote in for Cincinnati and other chapters. Secretary of State projects want to allow weeks and no ID. Hmmmm.
What happened to just signing cards to do the vote for unionization? Card check?
My understanding was that IDs were required in order to vote (likely "employee" IDs). Three days to vote.
My guess is that the vote would have come down about the same way if no one had politicked or spent any money. A lot of capital (not just political) got expended to fight a brick wall.
The UAW hasn't helped their cause by appearing to support drug use on employee lunch hours, overpaying the people running the locals, having more VPs on the payroll than GM and not coming up with any good reasons why they are still relevant.
And to top it off, they announced a dues increase a month before the VW election. Talk about being tone deaf.
@Stever@Edmunds said: My guess is that the vote would have come down about the same way if no one had politicked or spent any money. A lot of capital (not just political) got expended to fight a brick wall.
100% right on that in my opinion as well.
Also I caught a list of the top money people donating to causes.
The Koch brothers are #58. Lots of unions ahead of them which matches the knowledge I have from the Columbus area over the recent years. It's best the UAW is going to have to claw to get to spend OPM on their causes.
My thinking is this is the highest percentage of the votes the UAW will get in that plant in that state even for repeat elections. This is based on experiences around the Smyrna Nissan plant and their employees and attitudes of the employees and other working folk.
Heaven forbid the Examiner looks beyond the names and digs into the funding and ownership of the organizations and PACs out there. Search for "dark funding".
On the bright side, all that money pouring in was good for the Chattanooga economy. Be curious to see what the dollar per worker spent number was. Probably enough to outright buy each worker at VW a Passat outright - the heck with leasing.
@Stever@Edmunds said:
On the bright side, all that money pouring in was good for the Chattanooga economy. Be curious to see what the dollar per worker spent number was. Probably enough to outright buy each worker at VW a Passat outright - the heck with leasing.
I wonder if Nissan does a similar benefit for their cars for workers. There are an awful lot of Nissan products around Smyrna--sort of like Leaf(s) on trees.
The Big 3 have discount programs for purchase. Many of the salary and hourly workers bought cars, held them the requisite time before they could turn them, and then sold them at a profit to the general public.
That is interesting on the giving. I think the Koch boys have been targets for a very long time. Their philanthropic giving far outweighs the political contributions. I find it interesting the liberals and progressives think it is fine for Unions and Soros to donate huge amounts to candidates but not Koch or any other GOP source.
I also think the UAW's total support for all things liberal Democrat was a big negative in TN. They have one of the most progressive governors in the USA. Offering 2 years of college or trade school to HS graduates may be one of the best things going. I bet they could work with VW to set up a similar trade school like the one VW has in Puebla.
All that "hidden" money influencing public opinion should be outted. Too bad the Supremes don't agree.
My guess is that the libs would like to dump the UAW too. I noticed that POTUS's comments about supporting "German shareholders" came in a "closed" door session with other Dems and pretty late in the voting period.
If memory serves it was a closed door session that killed Romney's bid for President. Telling the truth even behind closed doors can get you in trouble.
@gagrice said:
If memory serves it was a closed door session that killed Romney's bid for President. Telling the truth even behind closed doors can get you in trouble.
Only if the media is "compliant" for your opponents and won't doggedly report any negatives about your opponent but will work to the death to Palinize you--to wit, Chris Christy.
I didn't really see the media falling for the UAW side. If anything, they gave more press to Corker's comments, probably hoping to show how awful the Republicans are against unions.
I think the important thing being ignored is that the workers were given the opportunity to vote on whether or not they wanted to be represented by the UAW - just like the system is supposed to be.
It's unfortunate that most of the news was made by outsiders who would had no direct stake in the process or outcome. Just like most things in our society today, it was becoming political.
@robr2 said:
I think the important thing being ignored is that the workers were given the opportunity to vote on whether or not they wanted to be represented by the UAW - just like the system is supposed to be.
It's unfortunate that most of the news was made by outsiders who would had no direct stake in the process or outcome. Just like most things in our society today, it was becoming political.
It was very political the last week or so. I can understand Republicans not wanting a Democrat machine in a state they have finally won over. I would say the UAW got a very fair shake and all those that wanted the Union got a good chance to vote for it. It was likely the best shot the UAW will ever get at a foreign auto maker. I look for Fiat to be the first to bust the UAW. I don't see them tolerating a strike when it is too easy to just up and move to another state or country.
Union leaders say they will review all legal options and that they're "not leaving Chattanooga."Union leaders say they will review all legal options and that they're "not leaving Chattanooga."Union leaders say they will review all legal options and that they're "not leaving Chattanooga."
CHATTANOOGA, TENN. — UAW leaders on Friday said they will review all of their legal options and consider challenging the results of a devastating defeat in an election for union representation at Volkswagen's plant in Chattanooga, Tenn.
Workers at the German automakers plant voted against the UAW in a three-day election that ended Friday in a margin of 712-626.
MORE: VW's Tennessee workers reject union
UAW President Bob King sharply criticized Tennessee politicians who he said scared workers away from voting in favor of union representation. Going into the election, the UAW thought it had support from a majority of the more than 1,500 workers who had an opportunity to vote.
That support began to decline in recent days, mostly because of news conferences held by the state's political leaders who warned that a vote in favor of the UAW would make the state less attractive to other manufacturers and could jeopardize Volkswagen's plans to expand its factory there.
"We also are outraged by the outside interference in this election. It's never happened before that a U.S. senator, a governor and a leader of the House of Representatives threatened the company and threatened the workers" during a union election, King said Friday night shortly after the votes.
I'm not a Corker fan by a long shot but this is just pot calling kettle black. The UAW would be better off going home and regrouping at this point. That's basically what they promised VW they'd do if they lost. They had easy access to the employees to counter the TV ads, the talking heads, the billboards and convince the workers to go union and they weren't able to. They should pull a graceful Peyton Manning and go play some golf and let their head clear out of the limelight for a bit.
I have to say I think they have facts on their side in that the big names helped sway people against the UAW. But I think they would have lost anyhow. I see irony in that it's usually the liberal groups using the media and its favoritism in reporting in the MSM to sway things in their favor. However, this time the movement went the other way.
I think they're wasting their time and money. I don't see the good-ol'-boys switching now that they have voted once and see the lay of the land.
Personally, I see this Democrat v. Republican stuff regarding the VW UAW vote as a bunch of palaver. I think the actual workers voted their personal opinions, not those of politicians and their party and lobbyist positions. The thing that is relevant though is how surprisingly close the election results were. Southerners are no different than northerners when it comes to getting sick of top management versus employee pay and benefits. There may someday be an actual union movement in the transplants, but it will be a new union organization if it happens. I'm not sure their issues are necessarily all the same as in the D3 plants. Unions are like companies; some good, some not so much.
Yeah, Mittens was such a good truth teller. Would have been an awesome leader, a real self-made success.
So VW didn't go UAW. Maybe the German factories in the US should form their own union, and make it German style.
@gagrice said:
If memory serves it was a closed door session that killed Romney's bid for President. Telling the truth even behind closed doors can get you in trouble.
@Stever@Edmunds said:
I'm not a Corker fan by a long shot but this is just pot calling kettle black. The UAW would be better off going home and regrouping at this point. That's basically what they promised VW they'd do if they lost. They had easy access to the employees to counter the TV ads, the talking heads, the billboards and convince the workers to go union and they weren't able to. They should pull a graceful Peyton Manning and go play some golf and let their head clear out of the limelight for a bit.
No kidding. And who were the outsiders? The UAW was for sure. Corker is from there, and has seen the disruptiveness of UAW strikes on other communities. When the UAW decides to strike they impact all the businesses in the area and beyond. If US bailing out GM saved 3 million jobs, I guess it is fair to say when the UAW goes on strike against GM those few workers disrupt the lives of several million people associated with that automaker. I would not want to live in a community that allows a union to have that much impact. The UAW went down as Carpet Baggers and got sent home with their tail between their legs.
The UAW has another problem now. VW still wants a "Works Council" and so do many of those same workers who voted against the UAW.
If VW figures out how to get their co-determination system going in Chattanooga without running into labor law problems, the UAW will really have a hard time coming up with reasons for workers to join. And the UAW would lobby against labor law changes to allow the work councils without requiring union involvement, so they'd be with fighting with VW over that and the goodwill they built up would vanish.
(buzzwords swiped from this Wall St. Journal story this morning.)
@fintail said:
Yeah, Mittens was such a good truth teller. Would have been an awesome leader, a real self-made success.
You mean he would have been less truthful and had actually had less real world private business experience than the current self-made success? :grin
As for the UAW, I think they will give it another shot at Chattanooga. I don't know what the parameters are for another election attempt, but I would suggest Corker may have bought himself lots of "dark money" from the dark group in politics against his next reelection. When is it term over in the House of Lords? He may find himself McConnell'd with all kinds of negatives in the next campaign. The folks in TN that I saw tended to be more liberal in terms of not caring or caring toward the gimme side of politics. So a Republican, might be open to a good fight next time.
Not sure it would work out of the Duck hunters or whatever their name is when he brags about his stance against UAW. I noticed the Duck group had a whole rack of greeting cards about 28 inches wide at the local Kroger Marketplace superstore. A lady was reading through them and smiling and laughing. I'll have to check them out on my next visit.
@Stever@Edmunds said:
The UAW has another problem now. VW still wants a "Works Council" and so do many of those same workers who voted against the UAW.
I think the workers should look long and hard at any kind of workers council tied to a Union. Just reading about the Workers Council and IG Metall hiding things from the workers concerning GM shutting down the Opel factory. Unions can be as sleazy as their corporate counterparts. I think the current contracts with the UAW and D3 are great examples of a two faced Union. Teamsters are not that way of course.
The phrase “political strike” was chosen deliberately by Einenkel to emphasise an action that is prohibited by law and to create the impression that his hands were tied. For years, it has been Einenkel who has blocked strikes and protests against many thousands of job cuts. Since he took over as works council chair in 2005, 70 percent of jobs have been eliminated.
As the top representative of the works council in the plant, Einenkel was involved in all of the discussions and agreements between the union and Opel management. He knew early on about the planned shutdown, but concealed this from the workforce and spread the story that nothing had yet been decided. Even when the union and management announced the closure of the Bochum plant at the end of last year, it was Einenkel who vehemently attacked those calling for protests and measures to fight back.
The MLPD and its works group also slavishly defend IG Metall, and provide their foot soldiers in the plant. In the court proceedings initiated by the MLPD, they did not focus on the obvious conspiracy between IG Metall and company management.
Restarting that process will take a good while. Bob King retires in June, which the rank and file are glad to see him go. Will the new President want to spend the big bucks on such a venture? My guess is the UAW would lose by a much bigger margin second time around. They may not even get 51% of the workers to sign cards again. The anti union forces have been empowered and won't be intimidated by the UAW plants in the factory. Maybe they should join the TVA Union with over 2000 workers above $100k. And people wonder why the nation is in trouble.
According to TVA salary information provided to the Chattanooga Times Free Press in response to a Freedom on Information Act request, the median base pay for TVA workers rose last year to $74,465, excluding overtime and bonus payments.
TVA’s compensation levels were nearly twice the average for all Chattanooga workers, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. But TVA officials insist the utility’s pay levels are designed to be comparable to similar private sector jobs in the Tennessee Valley.
Last year, 74 TVA employees were paid a base salary more than the $174,000 annual congressional salary. Among those, 37 top TVA managers were paid more than the $400,000 annual salary for the president of the United States.
Last week, Congress moved to cap the pay for the top executives of the federally sponsored mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to no more than $500,000 a year. In fiscal 2011, TVA had 25 executives with base salaries of more than $500,000.
U.S. Rep. John Duncan, R-Knoxville, has opposed TVA’s top executive pay, claiming that no federal employee should be paid more than the president.
Apparently, per a WSJ commentator, this is the fourth union loss at the big Vallourec Star pipe mill. This vote went down 2 to 1 against, in an area with "dense" UAW membership.
It's going to be interesting to see how this all pans out--it's possible there could be a backlash because of all the outside political money and backroom arm twisting (and threats) being made--such as allegations of state officials threatening automakers will loss of their tax breaks if they allow unions. Of course, official denials are flying.
Some of the anti-union arguments were pretty cogent, but some of them were patently absurd as well. The bit about turning KY into a "Detroit Wasteland" was over the top.
As I mentioned the other day, Chattanooga's industrial sector was pretty bombed out looking when I lived there in the mid-70s. Not sure what affect the unions had locally but lots of people quit the foundry and textile mill jobs to go to work in Detroit, Chicago and other union towns up north. Less overt racism and better pay. About twenty years ago, lots of those northern transplants started moving back South, but it's hard to say that they brought their union cards with them.
@Stever@Edmunds said:
Strange bedfellows? ['Joe the Plumber' lands job at Jeep, joins UAW
Rocky's liberal buddies are having a heyday with that turn of events. He is working on the line with a friend of his. So far no big deal. I am surprised he failed to turn his celebrity into a profitable venture. Like getting a truck and plastering Joe the Plumber on the side and making a lot better than he will ever get in a factory job. Figure though when he hit the limelight he was a plumber's apprentice. Hoping to buy the business. He may not be very motivated. Which is a perfect fit for a UAW member.
Well, if he wanted the job, it's not like he had a choice. Ohio isn't a right to work state. Not yet anyway. It was defeated in 2011 (and back in 1958). And one in eight Ohioans belong to a union. (Toledo Blade)
Yeah, I had to argue that with one of Rocky's Liberal Friends. He was under the impression the 1947 Taft Hartley Act gave everyone the right to join or not join a Union. It took awhile to get through to him. On RTW and Union Shop rules in the rest of the states.
"Mexico has roughly 580,000 auto workers, whose numbers have risen by 100,000 since 2008. They are paid about $16 a day, more than $4 less than what the average U.S. autoworker is paid every hour. More than half of all Mexican workers earn less than $15 a day, according to Mexico's census agency.
Many car factories in Mexico operate with pro-company unions and some workers have fought without success to form independent unions that could bargain for higher pay and better pensions."
And the UAW is appealing the VW election to the NLRB. The deadline to appeal was midnight tonight.
“It’s an outrage that politically motivated third parties threatened the economic future of this facility,” said UAW President Bob King. “It is extraordinary interference in the private decision of workers to have a U.S. senator, a governor and leaders of the state legislature threaten the company with the denial of economic incentives and workers with a loss of product.”
Corker — who was mayor of Chattanooga before his election to the Senate in 2006 — responded less than two hours later.
“Unfortunately, I have to assume that today’s action may slow down Volkswagen’s final discussions on the new SUV line,” Corker said in a statement. “The UAW is only interested in its own survival and not the interests of the great employees at Chattanooga’s Volkswagen facility nor the company for which they work.”
Lots of blurbs are getting printed about the appeal right now. One site said that if VW "agreed" with the principles in the appeal, they could unilaterally call for another election without waiting for the NLRB's decision. The other interesting wrinkle is that the NLRB has recently been stacked with Democratic appointees. Few labor experts think that the UAW has much of a case, since it wasn't VW or the union making the comments about the new SUV line going to Mexico if the UAW won. It's a stretch to say that Corker represents VW.
Good point about Springhill and the other union plants in the Deep South. I know a father/son over in Decatur Alabama. Dad's UAW at the GM engine plant and his son over at the Toyota engine plant isn't union.
Have to quibble about him wondering why Norquist's billboard said "The UAW Wants Your Guns, Pt. 1.”. Norquist was tying the Democratic party to loss of gun rights, and pointing out that the UAW almost exclusively supports Democrats.
...and to add fuel to the fire, SC governor says union jobs are not welcome in here state.
So if a union company came to SC and wanted to bring 5,000 or even 100 union jobs to one of the poorest states in the county, she would fight tooth and nail to prevent it.
I am sure she's a hardworking bootstrapping capitalist who built it all herself and just wants others to learn the value of hard work, too. Another do-as-I-say type.
What I find very ironic is now you have the republicans doing the very same thing they criticize the democrats for - government sticking it's nose in and interfering with private sector and personal matters. Both of these political parties seem to think they have the right to dictate to business and individuals how to live their personal lives and what decisions to make. Just brings George Orwell back to mind Big Brothers.
" The South invaded the North first in the Civil War"...actually, you realize that the war is mis-named as the Civil War...it is more correctly the War Between the States, or, if you come from the South, the War of Northern Aggression...a civil war is when 2 factions are fighting to control one government...since the South seceded and set up their own government, they were not fighting to take control of Wash, DC...they wanted to be a separate nation with a totally separate government...so it was not really a "civil war" even though every history book calls it that...:)
Civil war, the ultimate oxymoron. I was 12 before I realized that "damnyankee" was two words.
Some would say that this is another oxymoron:
"Detroit's three automakers ... worry that the 382,000-member UAW could be absorbed by a more hostile union.
A weaker UAW is worrisome for American automakers who only recently reached a labor peace with the union after decades of fighting. The peace resulted in lower wages for new hires and in health care concessions that nearly erased a $1,500 difference in production costs per car between U.S. and Japanese automakers. #A more radical union could bring a return to strife-filled days, when UAW strikes cost automakers dearly. The last major strike, in 1998 at a GM factory in Flint, Mich., cost the company about $2 billion in profits."
" The South invaded the North first in the Civil War"...actually, you realize that the war is mis-named as the Civil War...it is more correctly the War Between the States, or, if you come from the South, the War of Northern Aggression..
I am glad you corrected that. Being a Yankee is embarrassing for me when I look at the History. I guess the North paid dearly for their aggression having over 100,000 more soldiers killed than did the Southern States. What a waste of American lives.
The Civil War (or whatever you want to call it) always seemed to me to be poorly taught in American history courses. Seems to me it really boiled down to states' rights v. a large central federal government, and the rest of the issues were really secondary or consequential. However, be that as it may, local and state level, or federal; neither should be sticking their noses into the VW UAW matter, or other similar matters. I don't believe in government insertion at this level, but I also think politicians and their citizens need to tread carefully, because these kind of actions can often lead to unintended consequences down the road.
Comments
That "mentality" is going away lots of places, even here in Michigan I think. Alaska may be the last bastion after it's all said and done. The real fun will begin when the Koch's start funding the efforts to decertify the UAW in the Detroit shops.
What's really funny is that the political power of the unions boils down to their phone banks. I think it's legal to call cell phones but it's easy to block calls with a smartphone (only us old guys who may need a pacemaker have landlines anymore). The pols use data and don't need old fashioned organizing like they used to rely on. But encouraging the right-wing to grind down the unions plays right into the left-wing's hands. Who will protect the workers?
Why, the government of course. Wheels within wheels.
With OPM of course, to do the "protecting." "What can you give me?"
But this begs the huge amount of value in money and time given by the unions to support "the party" in elections these days. Money that can't be given in one way from a campaign or their PACs can be given from Union funds or even personal donations from individuals within locals. Such was done around Columbus for the previous election.
So unions still play a huge role in the ground campaign to take over the power. The real slap in the face to union folks in Dayton area was the liberals ignoring the IBEW from the Moraine Assembly, who had put so many feet and dollars on the ground in the campaigns, and giving everything to the UAW in the auto bailout.
That will be matched by the many huge sources of funds from the liberals including Soros and other puppets under the control of the likes of him. One to watch is the Secretary of State projects to take over the SOS positions, where the control is in who gets to vote and over what period of time and how often.
The UAW is closely aligned with the liberals and Dems. Did the UAW require ID to vote? Did the UAW vote allow voting over a month? Or was it just one day (three days). The NAACP requires picture ID and only allows one day for getting your vote in for Cincinnati and other chapters. Secretary of State projects want to allow weeks and no ID. Hmmmm.
What happened to just signing cards to do the vote for unionization? Card check?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
My understanding was that IDs were required in order to vote (likely "employee" IDs). Three days to vote.
My guess is that the vote would have come down about the same way if no one had politicked or spent any money. A lot of capital (not just political) got expended to fight a brick wall.
The UAW hasn't helped their cause by appearing to support drug use on employee lunch hours, overpaying the people running the locals, having more VPs on the payroll than GM and not coming up with any good reasons why they are still relevant.
And to top it off, they announced a dues increase a month before the VW election. Talk about being tone deaf.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/02/15/think-the-koch-brothers-are-among-the-top-10-all-time-political-donors-sorry-you-are-wrong-very-wrong/
My thinking is this is the highest percentage of the votes the UAW will get in that plant in that state even for repeat elections. This is based on experiences around the Smyrna Nissan plant and their employees and attitudes of the employees and other working folk.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Heaven forbid the Examiner looks beyond the names and digs into the funding and ownership of the organizations and PACs out there. Search for "dark funding".
On the bright side, all that money pouring in was good for the Chattanooga economy. Be curious to see what the dollar per worker spent number was. Probably enough to outright buy each worker at VW a Passat outright - the heck with leasing.
I wonder if Nissan does a similar benefit for their cars for workers. There are an awful lot of Nissan products around Smyrna--sort of like Leaf(s) on trees.
The Big 3 have discount programs for purchase. Many of the salary and hourly workers bought cars, held them the requisite time before they could turn them, and then sold them at a profit to the general public.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
That is interesting on the giving. I think the Koch boys have been targets for a very long time. Their philanthropic giving far outweighs the political contributions. I find it interesting the liberals and progressives think it is fine for Unions and Soros to donate huge amounts to candidates but not Koch or any other GOP source.
I also think the UAW's total support for all things liberal Democrat was a big negative in TN. They have one of the most progressive governors in the USA. Offering 2 years of college or trade school to HS graduates may be one of the best things going. I bet they could work with VW to set up a similar trade school like the one VW has in Puebla.
All that "hidden" money influencing public opinion should be outted. Too bad the Supremes don't agree.
My guess is that the libs would like to dump the UAW too. I noticed that POTUS's comments about supporting "German shareholders" came in a "closed" door session with other Dems and pretty late in the voting period.
If memory serves it was a closed door session that killed Romney's bid for President. Telling the truth even behind closed doors can get you in trouble.
Only if the media is "compliant" for your opponents and won't doggedly report any negatives about your opponent but will work to the death to Palinize you--to wit, Chris Christy.
I didn't really see the media falling for the UAW side. If anything, they gave more press to Corker's comments, probably hoping to show how awful the Republicans are against unions.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I think the important thing being ignored is that the workers were given the opportunity to vote on whether or not they wanted to be represented by the UAW - just like the system is supposed to be.
It's unfortunate that most of the news was made by outsiders who would had no direct stake in the process or outcome. Just like most things in our society today, it was becoming political.
It's unfortunate that most of the news was made by outsiders who would had no direct stake in the process or outcome. Just like most things in our society today, it was becoming political.
It was very political the last week or so. I can understand Republicans not wanting a Democrat machine in a state they have finally won over. I would say the UAW got a very fair shake and all those that wanted the Union got a good chance to vote for it. It was likely the best shot the UAW will ever get at a foreign auto maker. I look for Fiat to be the first to bust the UAW. I don't see them tolerating a strike when it is too easy to just up and move to another state or country.
Corker made a mistake.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I'm not a Corker fan by a long shot but this is just pot calling kettle black. The UAW would be better off going home and regrouping at this point. That's basically what they promised VW they'd do if they lost. They had easy access to the employees to counter the TV ads, the talking heads, the billboards and convince the workers to go union and they weren't able to. They should pull a graceful Peyton Manning and go play some golf and let their head clear out of the limelight for a bit.
UAW vote at Chattanooga VW plant drawn along partisan lines (timesfreepress.com)
I have to say I think they have facts on their side in that the big names helped sway people against the UAW. But I think they would have lost anyhow. I see irony in that it's usually the liberal groups using the media and its favoritism in reporting in the MSM to sway things in their favor. However, this time the movement went the other way.
I think they're wasting their time and money. I don't see the good-ol'-boys switching now that they have voted once and see the lay of the land.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Personally, I see this Democrat v. Republican stuff regarding the VW UAW vote as a bunch of palaver. I think the actual workers voted their personal opinions, not those of politicians and their party and lobbyist positions. The thing that is relevant though is how surprisingly close the election results were. Southerners are no different than northerners when it comes to getting sick of top management versus employee pay and benefits. There may someday be an actual union movement in the transplants, but it will be a new union organization if it happens. I'm not sure their issues are necessarily all the same as in the D3 plants. Unions are like companies; some good, some not so much.
Yeah, Mittens was such a good truth teller. Would have been an awesome leader, a real self-made success.
So VW didn't go UAW. Maybe the German factories in the US should form their own union, and make it German style.
No kidding. And who were the outsiders? The UAW was for sure. Corker is from there, and has seen the disruptiveness of UAW strikes on other communities. When the UAW decides to strike they impact all the businesses in the area and beyond. If US bailing out GM saved 3 million jobs, I guess it is fair to say when the UAW goes on strike against GM those few workers disrupt the lives of several million people associated with that automaker. I would not want to live in a community that allows a union to have that much impact. The UAW went down as Carpet Baggers and got sent home with their tail between their legs.
The UAW has another problem now. VW still wants a "Works Council" and so do many of those same workers who voted against the UAW.
If VW figures out how to get their co-determination system going in Chattanooga without running into labor law problems, the UAW will really have a hard time coming up with reasons for workers to join. And the UAW would lobby against labor law changes to allow the work councils without requiring union involvement, so they'd be with fighting with VW over that and the goodwill they built up would vanish.
(buzzwords swiped from this Wall St. Journal story this morning.)
You mean he would have been less truthful and had actually had less real world private business experience than the current self-made success? :grin
As for the UAW, I think they will give it another shot at Chattanooga. I don't know what the parameters are for another election attempt, but I would suggest Corker may have bought himself lots of "dark money" from the dark group in politics against his next reelection. When is it term over in the House of Lords? He may find himself McConnell'd with all kinds of negatives in the next campaign. The folks in TN that I saw tended to be more liberal in terms of not caring or caring toward the gimme side of politics. So a Republican, might be open to a good fight next time.
Not sure it would work out of the Duck hunters or whatever their name is when he brags about his stance against UAW. I noticed the Duck group had a whole rack of greeting cards about 28 inches wide at the local Kroger Marketplace superstore. A lady was reading through them and smiling and laughing. I'll have to check them out on my next visit.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I think the workers should look long and hard at any kind of workers council tied to a Union. Just reading about the Workers Council and IG Metall hiding things from the workers concerning GM shutting down the Opel factory. Unions can be as sleazy as their corporate counterparts. I think the current contracts with the UAW and D3 are great examples of a two faced Union. Teamsters are not that way of course.
The phrase “political strike” was chosen deliberately by Einenkel to emphasise an action that is prohibited by law and to create the impression that his hands were tied. For years, it has been Einenkel who has blocked strikes and protests against many thousands of job cuts. Since he took over as works council chair in 2005, 70 percent of jobs have been eliminated.
As the top representative of the works council in the plant, Einenkel was involved in all of the discussions and agreements between the union and Opel management. He knew early on about the planned shutdown, but concealed this from the workforce and spread the story that nothing had yet been decided. Even when the union and management announced the closure of the Bochum plant at the end of last year, it was Einenkel who vehemently attacked those calling for protests and measures to fight back.
The MLPD and its works group also slavishly defend IG Metall, and provide their foot soldiers in the plant. In the court proceedings initiated by the MLPD, they did not focus on the obvious conspiracy between IG Metall and company management.
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/12/28/opel-d28.html
Now try privatizing TVA.
But you're right; the UAW can't simply walk away from Chattanooga.
Restarting that process will take a good while. Bob King retires in June, which the rank and file are glad to see him go. Will the new President want to spend the big bucks on such a venture? My guess is the UAW would lose by a much bigger margin second time around. They may not even get 51% of the workers to sign cards again. The anti union forces have been empowered and won't be intimidated by the UAW plants in the factory. Maybe they should join the TVA Union with over 2000 workers above $100k. And people wonder why the nation is in trouble.
According to TVA salary information provided to the Chattanooga Times Free Press in response to a Freedom on Information Act request, the median base pay for TVA workers rose last year to $74,465, excluding overtime and bonus payments.
TVA’s compensation levels were nearly twice the average for all Chattanooga workers, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. But TVA officials insist the utility’s pay levels are designed to be comparable to similar private sector jobs in the Tennessee Valley.
Last year, 74 TVA employees were paid a base salary more than the $174,000 annual congressional salary. Among those, 37 top TVA managers were paid more than the $400,000 annual salary for the president of the United States.
Last week, Congress moved to cap the pay for the top executives of the federally sponsored mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to no more than $500,000 a year. In fiscal 2011, TVA had 25 executives with base salaries of more than $500,000.
U.S. Rep. John Duncan, R-Knoxville, has opposed TVA’s top executive pay, claiming that no federal employee should be paid more than the president.
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2012/mar/15/union-workers-thaw-tva-pay-freeze/
I swear, unions just can't get a break.
National clown shortage may be approaching, trade organizations fear (NY Daily News)
Can't blame them. Kids love to play "Kill the Clown".
Good. Clowns scare me and they can go extinct for all I care.
Different union, but even Ohio is getting in the act.
Labor’s pain (tribtoday.com)
Apparently, per a WSJ commentator, this is the fourth union loss at the big Vallourec Star pipe mill. This vote went down 2 to 1 against, in an area with "dense" UAW membership.
It's going to be interesting to see how this all pans out--it's possible there could be a backlash because of all the outside political money and backroom arm twisting (and threats) being made--such as allegations of state officials threatening automakers will loss of their tax breaks if they allow unions. Of course, official denials are flying.
Some of the anti-union arguments were pretty cogent, but some of them were patently absurd as well. The bit about turning KY into a "Detroit Wasteland" was over the top.
As I mentioned the other day, Chattanooga's industrial sector was pretty bombed out looking when I lived there in the mid-70s. Not sure what affect the unions had locally but lots of people quit the foundry and textile mill jobs to go to work in Detroit, Chicago and other union towns up north. Less overt racism and better pay. About twenty years ago, lots of those northern transplants started moving back South, but it's hard to say that they brought their union cards with them.
Does this pretty much say it all?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Not exactly...the vote was actually very close. He should be at least hanging off the back door.
Strange bedfellows? 'Joe the Plumber' lands job at Jeep, joins UAW (Detroit Free Press)
Rocky's liberal buddies are having a heyday with that turn of events. He is working on the line with a friend of his. So far no big deal. I am surprised he failed to turn his celebrity into a profitable venture. Like getting a truck and plastering Joe the Plumber on the side and making a lot better than he will ever get in a factory job. Figure though when he hit the limelight he was a plumber's apprentice. Hoping to buy the business. He may not be very motivated. Which is a perfect fit for a UAW member.
Well, if he wanted the job, it's not like he had a choice. Ohio isn't a right to work state. Not yet anyway. It was defeated in 2011 (and back in 1958). And one in eight Ohioans belong to a union. (Toledo Blade)
Yeah, I had to argue that with one of Rocky's Liberal Friends. He was under the impression the 1947 Taft Hartley Act gave everyone the right to join or not join a Union. It took awhile to get through to him. On RTW and Union Shop rules in the rest of the states.
UAW aftermath.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"Mexico has roughly 580,000 auto workers, whose numbers have risen by 100,000 since 2008. They are paid about $16 a day, more than $4 less than what the average U.S. autoworker is paid every hour. More than half of all Mexican workers earn less than $15 a day, according to Mexico's census agency.
Many car factories in Mexico operate with pro-company unions and some workers have fought without success to form independent unions that could bargain for higher pay and better pensions."
Mexico to trump Japan as No. 2 car exporter to US (adn.com)
And the UAW is appealing the VW election to the NLRB. The deadline to appeal was midnight tonight.
“It’s an outrage that politically motivated third parties threatened the economic future of this facility,” said UAW President Bob King. “It is extraordinary interference in the private decision of workers to have a U.S. senator, a governor and leaders of the state legislature threaten the company with the denial of economic incentives and workers with a loss of product.”
Corker — who was mayor of Chattanooga before his election to the Senate in 2006 — responded less than two hours later.
“Unfortunately, I have to assume that today’s action may slow down Volkswagen’s final discussions on the new SUV line,” Corker said in a statement. “The UAW is only interested in its own survival and not the interests of the great employees at Chattanooga’s Volkswagen facility nor the company for which they work.”
UAW asks labor board for new vote at Volkswagen (Detroit Free Press)
Lots of blurbs are getting printed about the appeal right now. One site said that if VW "agreed" with the principles in the appeal, they could unilaterally call for another election without waiting for the NLRB's decision. The other interesting wrinkle is that the NLRB has recently been stacked with Democratic appointees. Few labor experts think that the UAW has much of a case, since it wasn't VW or the union making the comments about the new SUV line going to Mexico if the UAW won. It's a stretch to say that Corker represents VW.
Maybe the UAW should have gone further South to organize in Mexico.
Just got done reading Ed Wallace's Star-Telegram editorial linked from his insideautomotive site
http://www.star-telegram.com/2014/02/21/5587441/northern-union-invades-again.html
Good point about Springhill and the other union plants in the Deep South. I know a father/son over in Decatur Alabama. Dad's UAW at the GM engine plant and his son over at the Toyota engine plant isn't union.
Have to quibble about him wondering why Norquist's billboard said "The UAW Wants Your Guns, Pt. 1.”. Norquist was tying the Democratic party to loss of gun rights, and pointing out that the UAW almost exclusively supports Democrats.
...and to add fuel to the fire, SC governor says union jobs are not welcome in here state.
So if a union company came to SC and wanted to bring 5,000 or even 100 union jobs to one of the poorest states in the county, she would fight tooth and nail to prevent it.
More good points in the article:
TN subsidized the building of a stadium for a billionaire so a bunch of millionaires could play a game there 8 times a year
TN gave GM new incentives recently to bring a new product to a UAW plant in Spring Hill
and best of all, that the UAW had already agreed to NOT negotiate wages and benefits if VW workers voted for the union.
He has his history wrong. The South invaded the North first in the Civil War (neener, neener).
I am sure she's a hardworking bootstrapping capitalist who built it all herself and just wants others to learn the value of hard work, too. Another do-as-I-say type.
What I find very ironic is now you have the republicans doing the very same thing they criticize the democrats for - government sticking it's nose in and interfering with private sector and personal matters. Both of these political parties seem to think they have the right to dictate to business and individuals how to live their personal lives and what decisions to make. Just brings George Orwell back to mind Big Brothers.
" The South invaded the North first in the Civil War"...actually, you realize that the war is mis-named as the Civil War...it is more correctly the War Between the States, or, if you come from the South, the War of Northern Aggression...a civil war is when 2 factions are fighting to control one government...since the South seceded and set up their own government, they were not fighting to take control of Wash, DC...they wanted to be a separate nation with a totally separate government...so it was not really a "civil war" even though every history book calls it that...:)
Civil war, the ultimate oxymoron. I was 12 before I realized that "damnyankee" was two words.
Some would say that this is another oxymoron:
"Detroit's three automakers ... worry that the 382,000-member UAW could be absorbed by a more hostile union.
A weaker UAW is worrisome for American automakers who only recently reached a labor peace with the union after decades of fighting. The peace resulted in lower wages for new hires and in health care concessions that nearly erased a $1,500 difference in production costs per car between U.S. and Japanese automakers. #A more radical union could bring a return to strife-filled days, when UAW strikes cost automakers dearly. The last major strike, in 1998 at a GM factory in Flint, Mich., cost the company about $2 billion in profits."
Detroit Automakers Worry About UAW Money Struggles
(monroenews.com)
@marsha7 said:
I am glad you corrected that. Being a Yankee is embarrassing for me when I look at the History. I guess the North paid dearly for their aggression having over 100,000 more soldiers killed than did the Southern States. What a waste of American lives.
The Civil War (or whatever you want to call it) always seemed to me to be poorly taught in American history courses. Seems to me it really boiled down to states' rights v. a large central federal government, and the rest of the issues were really secondary or consequential. However, be that as it may, local and state level, or federal; neither should be sticking their noses into the VW UAW matter, or other similar matters. I don't believe in government insertion at this level, but I also think politicians and their citizens need to tread carefully, because these kind of actions can often lead to unintended consequences down the road.