General Intake / Exhaust Mods

zueslewis

I have a better one - "depends".

zueslewis

your wife kicks your butt for cleaning and oiling the K&N in the kitchen sink!

americanflag

K&N, and I can understand that. I have seen posts on Bob's site lauding the filter and others saying it is not as effective as paper. Well, maybe, maybe not. Maybe I will do an oil analysis.

But I love the way my engine sounds with the K&N on and the silencer removed, it is awesome. And whether or not there is a real hp gain, which I don't know because I haven't dynoed the car before and after, there is no doubt the car "feels" like the engine breathes better. So I really like the K&N and don't want to give it up.

Have you heard of pre-starters for engines to oil them before starting? I read about them on Blackstone Laboratories site...
as if I don't have enough problems figuring this stuff out already

zueslewis

They're used on some exotics and some race cars, but through normal maintenance, they aren't needed, in my opinion.

Just another "look what I've got" gadget to occupy money that could be used on tires & wheels or a new exhaust system.

americanflag

I asked them about the K&N Air Filter and they said it is the best air filter on the market. Just thought that was interesting given that they work with oil and oil filters. Pretty strong endorsement for the K&N IMO.

bigorange30

Maybe I'm OK with the one I have.

SPYDER98

Cleaning these air filters is a pain in the ###!
First of all, you have to remove them, spray them with that god awful smelling chemical, let it sit and then run it under hot water which when blended with that chemical smells even worse, to clean the sucker out! Then you have let it sit for at least 12-24 hours to dry thourougly. All while your car sits with out an air filter, making it undrivable. (at least for mine as I have a performance intake system, but overnight drying is convenient enough) Then comes the process of re-oiling the filter, which really isn't too bad and actually fun in someways for me. Re-installing is a cinch.

I definitely did not by this filter because it lasts a lifetime. I bought it strictly for performance. I would much rather prefer just replacing the K&N. But at $60 a pop, I think I'll gladly stick to cleaning it every 30k.

144k miles and still counting on my spyder

cheers!
spyder98

zueslewis

After you're done driving for the day, clean it and let it sit (preferably in the sink or dish drainer so your lady gets mad), then spray it and install it in the morning. No car downtime.

ramforceone

I saved my original filter and put it in while the K&N is being cleaned, or one could just thow a cheap Fram in and save it to use while cleaning. These also let you see why you bought the K&N in the first place.

americanflag

Are you a K&N fan? What about filtering ability on the K&N?

joeindenver

I bought a K&N for my '89 Toyota SR5 V6 ExtraCab PU to see if it would help in the power compartment. I live south of Denver and I used to drive C-470 every day here and there's a hill near Santa Fe Ave. that going up, if I was going 70 I'd drop to 64 or so by the top. After the filter change out I would stay about 70 - without downshifting (5-spd). Not exactly scientific but well worth the money in my opinion. I'd also suggest them to anyone who lives in a dusty area (like me) as they trap WAY more dirt and dust than any paper filter ever has from my experience I wonder if they have them yet for the new ML350...

Joe

americanflag

of people out there who think they do not filter as much dirt as a paper filter.

zr2rando

I use them on my Chevy trucks.
Y'all should check out the local NAPA store, I went in there the other day and they have a K&N air filter demo. Fan sucks air in thru the K&N and exhausts the air out a stack that has a ping-pong ball in it (like those lottery machines!)
You can put in a normal air filter and the air flow drops down and the ball sinks in the exhaust tube...you can hold your hand in front of the K&N and it still flows better than the paper filter.
Pretty much proves it increases air flow. Normally this will only help at higher rpm where higher air flow is really required. I would say that these filters really should be left on for a while before cleaning so that some additional filtrate (dust) can accumulate on the filter and aid the filter efficiency (they obviously have plenty of flow normally at the expense of efficiency...)...
I agree that one should not over-oil them, but oil IS critical to proper filtration for this type filter.
You know an IC engine is like an air pump...more air in means more air out...there is a certain amount of fuel for a given amount of air...more air means more fuel...and that means less fuel economy.
Those K&N air filters are not intended for any fuel economy gains, and they should not give any according to their function...most people should only see some SLIGHT performance increase only at HIGH rpms, which most of us don't do anyway...

but that display IS COOL!!!
Y'all check it out...
Rando

kirbstoy

I've been using K&N Air filters for about 15 years now on several vehicles. Currently, I have K&N's on a 2001 Focus ZTS (5-speed) and a 2000 Camry (automatic). I didn't notice much of difference in performance with the Camry because its extremely rare for the engine to be run at the upper end of the RPM range. The Focus is a different story, however. The Z-Tec engine loves the upper RPM range (4-6.5K)and the K&N makes a significant difference in throttle response and how quickly the engine accelerates to the higher RPM ranges. Where it is really noticable is when the A/C is on. The Focus A/C will "freeze you out" in the summer, but it has a noticeable drag on the engine. That drag is decreased and the engine remains very responsive with the K&N. Well, that's my two cents worth!

highender

I have a supercharged (Whipple) 5.7 L V-8 in my Suburban, and it came with a K&N filter. The Stillen people are adamant that it helps the engine breath better. I have two questions: 1- When should you clean the filter? at 10K or 50K ? 2- Does anyone know if they make a K&N filter for the Porsche Cayenne Turbo ? I emailed K&N but they still have not replied.

zueslewis

you should clean the K&N MUCH more frequently than that to maintain perfect operation. I clean and re-oil mine at every other oil change.

the_big_h

couple weeks ago. It was only 20k miles since when I bought it new, and it was already dirty as heck.

so yeah, for max performance, 10-15k washing interval should be good :-)

highender

The K&N filter is good, but how about the blue colored one ,air raid or something? They claim to have 5 layers of cloth ? Any suggestions? I saw ads in the TruckTRend and numerous other magazines.

bottgers

I truely believe K&N filters are good for 1-2 hp, but I also think they allow more particles in your engine, decreasing engine life. I have always been religous about changing all the fluids and filters in my vehicles when, or before the manufacturers call for it. Our current vehicle, a '98 Intrepid, started consuming oil at about 60K miles. Because I've changed the oil and filters every 3K since we bought the car new, the only things that would cause this is either the K&N filter, or the Dodge 2.7 engine is junk. Either way, I do think the K&N has contributed to this problem. 1-2 hp isn't worth the decreased engine life.

ksuwildcat001

I'd believe it was a problem with the engine.

I've never heard of an oil filter causing an engine to leak oil. Seems like a huge reach if you ask me.

zueslewis

They make oil filters, too.

I've seen (in my position, I see a lot) many 2.7s with internal problems and premature failures.

bottgers

My engine isn't leaking oil, it's burning it. I wouldn't be surprised if it's just a poorly built engine either. Chrysler isn't exactly known for building Honda-like engines.

zueslewis

I see 60-70 DCC cases per month, mostly major stuff like engines and transmissions.

bottgers

Oh well, the car is a lease and we're turning it in next month anyway. Gues I won't be buying anymore DC products any time soon.

zueslewis

I will be keeping the PT for a while, though (2 years or so), so I need to buy a K&N air filter for it!

bottgers

I wouldn't. It's a known fact K&N's don't filter as well as OEM filters. No need to aggrivate an already questionable engine.

bigorange30

I have been a little concerned about the extra dirt the K&N is letting through. I am running a test right now to prove it. I will get my oil changed next week and have the oil tested. I suspect the Si will be at least slightly elevated because of the K&N. Just to be sure it is the K&N, I will change back to paper and run until the next change and test it and compare. If it is as I fear, I will never buy another K&N.

zueslewis

I'm a hard-core K&N guy. Life it too short to worry about a few microns on a vehicle I'm only keeping another year or two.

I like the sound and the reuseable nature.

customvan

I recently acquired a 1990 Chevy G20 Conversion Van with a 350 TBI. It's been in the family since new and it has 35,000 miles on the odo. I had a complete preventive maintenance done which included a new air filter. My dad suggested using a K&N filter vs. the OEM type. I did so. It's the round dognut type situated over the TBI unit.

I now can hear the intimate details of a running 350 engine while I drive. I had the service shop double check that they had correctly re-installed the engine cover (the hump) since I first thought there must be a gaping hole. It is installed correctly.

My question to the public: Can the low restriction filter allow that much noise to escape the induction system? It's rather unpleasant and reminds me of my old small block chevys with bad valves and holes in the firewall!

Has anyone had a similar experience with a van or pickup?

Thanks in advance for your help.

zueslewis

allows more intake noise to escape. It's just the way they are. Doesn't hurt anything, as long as you don't mind a little "air gooshing" noise.

I like it. I like to hear things run.

bottgers

You've got a point there. If you're the type of person who doesn't keep a vehicle for more than 3-5 years at a time, you probably won't have a problem using K&N's. If you're like me and like to put 200K+ miles on a vehicle, K&N's aren't a good idea.

bigorange30

I expect to keep a car 10-15 years.

zueslewis

I've ever kept a car was 5 years - that was because I was a stupid young man and got into a 60 month lease.

I'm sure I'll get a car in the next year or so that I'll keep "forever". I need another autocross car, I'm thinking Honda, and it'll stay with me.

oldharry

changing air filters in a modern car *could* possibly give a little more power at WOT, but should not make any difference for normal driving. The computer has air flow sensors, exhaust oxygen sensors, throttle position sensors, and a whole bunch more. It regulates fuel injection to the amount of air the engine is taking in, and runs in the most efficient way in can. I keep cars about ten years, so I stay with factory type filters to keep out the dirt, Zues who trades every couple years may never have a problem with a car, but he would never buy enough paper elements to pay for the custom job.

Besides, when I worked for car dealers in the sixties, one job I hated was washing and re-oiling foam filter elements. I love disposable paper.

Harry

boaz47

if you are just replacing your existing filter in your stock air box it would make little or any difference if you got a K&N or not. But when you are adding a longer intake tube to help cool some of the air a K&N can help. Face it a flat filter or Doughnut looking filter in an air box will only allow you the advantage of not having to change the filter as often. But if you add a tube that bends away from the engine and the heat from that engine the air should be a bit cooler and denser. It just may be why just about every single race engine you will ever see has some kind of fresh air intake like the K&N filter charger. Some of us change our oil every 3,000 to 5,000 miles and always get a quality oil filter. Some of us change the air filter every time we change oil. Some of us will only use synthetic oil. But very few of us would do anything to intentionally harm our engines.

Racing engines may not last as long as our commuter car engines but they wouldn't do anything to make them fail any faster than they already do. You have to ask yourself why would these proformance people use K&N type of filters if the Didn't work? 96 to 99 percent filtration for both Stock and K&N filters are about as close as you can get. If the K&N will continue to filter longer all the better. If I can get 99 percent filtration with an increase in CFM and the air is more dense to boot it would seem once again to be better. Then when a exhaust is added that is less restrictive so there is more air in and more air out it has to be a bit better as well.

None of this will sway anyone but it must be remembered that there are a whole lot of people out there that run their cars a bit now and them that will swear by a K&N filter charger.

I would have to feel that if there was any evidence that K&N caused premature engine wear there would have to be a few Lawyers out there that would be more than happy to help a client get into the pockets of a company like K&N.

If nothing else the K&N sticker looks good on the back window. *S*

ksuwildcat001

Also, several car companies are installing K&N filters stock. The new Viper is just one of several cars that come stock with K&N filters.

I highly doubt the car companies would install them OEM if they weren't a good product.

alpine325i

Hi I have an 02' C5 Coupe, I was wondering if anyone here has or had any experience with the Donaldson Blackwing air filter. They supposedly increase the air intake by 90%, whereas the K&N filter allows only 47% intake. I've always used K%N for my Vettes. I was just wondering if anyone here has tried the Donaldson air filter, Thanks.

kidevo1

Does anyone know of a OEM K&N filter on a turbocharged vehicle?

I only say this because turbos will consume much more incoming air due to the vacuum effect of course. Also...the air in-coming is flowing directly into the turbocharger. Which if not filtered properly, could definitely degrade the life of a turbo.

I only say this because my eclipse turbo is on its 3rd turbo charger in 5yrs and I used an open element K&N type of filter. I did keep up on the maintenance as well. I also noticed my oil was becoming darker quicker when I did the switch over initially. But not enough to cause a concern.

mainsail2

I have a 1992 and would like to eke out a little more performance. Will the K&N give it a boost in the higher rpm ranges (like 3500-5500rpm)?

acelink

I have installed a K&N filter (stock replacement) for '99 Sonata about 10,000 miles ago (2 years ago). A few days ago, I took the filter out to see how well it is holding up. I noticed a slight deformation close to the center of the filter; I am not sure what might have cause the deformation. Any ideas? Anyway, I rotated it before putting it back into the air filter box.

Lastly, K&N recommends servicing every 50,000 to 100,000 miles of driving. At the rate I am driving, I will never have to wash it. How often do you do the cleanings?

zueslewis

I've seen mine deform slightly as well - the screen pulled up towards the direction the air is being sucked into the intake.

bottgers

.....just because racers use K&N's, or because some manufacturers use them in their vehicles. It's a known fact they don't filter as well as OEM filters. I'm not saying they aren't a good product. K&N's offer a good compromise between more air flow and good filteration. I am saying if the want the best filteration, stay away from the K&N's.

zueslewis

that they don't filter as well as OEM filters. I guess if we stuffed some socks in our air intake, no dirt would get in, but very little air would get in, as well.

I've been in place for dyno and contaminate testing on K&Ns, as well as many other performance and OEM filters, and I'll draw my own conclusions.

I had the luxury of working for a huge high-performance parts and service chain and we tested everything, right along with the product manufacturers.

And, no I don't work for K&N or Fram - I just know which product I prefer for my particluar vehicle.

If someone is going to buy a K&N, then never service it, it's a bad choice. The same could be said for forgetting your paper air filter - it's very common to see 40-50K or more on a paper filter - these people should be drawn and quartered.

kidevo1

A viper equipped with a K&N filter would make sense.

But lets also not forget, a typical viper owner is probably not going to be taking his car out when the roads are infested with sand/dust/dirt type of conditions. I personally have never seen or heard of anyone driving a viper all-season here in New England. I always noticed my K&N filter became dirty the quickest during the winter time and required much more frequent cleaning compared to the summer when the roads were cleaned up.

zueslewis

K&Ns, just like any filter, do not like winter mud and snow.

I just put one in my PT GT - cool sound...removed the air intake silencer, too. You can hear the turbo spool up now - cool.

bottgers

If you've seen the contaminant testing, why not share the info with us. I'm sure everyone in here would love to see it.

zueslewis

I didn't own a computer then, so I didn't have e-mail or other filing system, Super Shops is bankrupt, and I don't feel like dicussing/arguing with someone who is disrespectful.

In other words, don't believe me, do your own research.

bottgers

....and everything I've seen shows that K&N's don't filter as well as OEM filters. They flow better, but they also allow more crud into your engine.

zueslewis

based on your opinion.

bottgers

.....it won't be based on my opinion, it'll be based on fact.