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My theory was that the "Mobil 1 GM" formula was the stuff, with an added friction modifier, that was used in the Corvette from the factory ... and possibly other cars as well. I talked to other car guys that felt Mobil was giving them the run around concerning this stuff when they called. It was a couple months ago and they acted like the 2nd formula didn't even exist.
I have NO IDEA what is in the store-brand synthetic oils. As one other person said, I'll pay the extra $0.50 - $1.00 per quart for a name brand so I know what I'm getting.
I used to see Mobil 1 for under $4 per quart once in a while but that seems awfully rare lately. Walmart had Mobil 1 and Valvoline in 5 gallon jugs for around $15-16 each last fall. Now THAT was a good deal!!
--- Bror Jace
But is that the same with synthetic oil ? If I have a car that I use for short trips, do I have to change the oil frequently even if I have synthetic oil in it ? It costs a lot to change out synthetic oil every 3k !
Therefore, if you have a car that sits a lot, I would recommend AGAINST using synthetic oil.
Some synthetic oils, like Redline, stress the additive package they add to their oil to deal with moisture and the acids that the moisture helps form but I still think leaving that stuff sit in there for several months is a bad idea.
So, for people who don't drive their cars frequently or on long drives, I suggest a less expensive, mineral oil and more frequent changes. The 15W40 oils designed for diesels and gas engines (Shell Rotella, Chevron Delo-400, Mobil Delvac) are all exceptional for fighting engine corrosion because they have to deal with diesel fuel fouling of the crankscase oil and extended drain intervals. I'd recommend those unless you live where the temperature is often at freezing or below.
--- Bror Jace
Two 3 mile trips per day. (9-13 minutes each)
max speed 35 MPH
No oil or filter change in 2 years.
TBM sat at end of test (total base #)
Oil consumption .8 quarts
4380 miles
Engine disassembled
Wear-very low
Cleanliness- excellent.
No sludge here!!
Granted 3.1 engine is an excellent engine.
This would be beyond my comfort level.
Doing a longer trip every now and then would be a better than this condition above. At least this gives you the worst. One change every 10-12months and a filter every 5 or 6 months should be more than adequate.
Brorjace : I agree that in a car that makes frequent short trips, frequent dino oil changes might be better than extended changes with expensive synthetic. But I still don't want to give up the benefits of using synthetic. So it's a dilemma.
Will it help if I make a long trip once every week ?
ADC100 : don't you think it is just that particular GM engine is simply better than others ? Or the old wisdom about changing oil more often for frequent short trips is no longer valid for modern engines ?
If your engine calls for a 5w30 WELL, If the oil is synthetic and SH rated give it a try
On the Corvette LS6 engine, the oem fill is 5-30W Mobil One. To date with 7.6k on the clock, this LS6 is far departed from break in (500 miles) and running flawlessly.
(the oil was changed at app 1600 miles,{still have some vestiges of listening to old wives tales})
jukeboxcarl2, I have a 1.5L Civic that I run at 75-80 mph for sometimes hours at a time. When I'm on long drives like this, I feel a LOT better knowing I have synthetic oil in my motor ... and as I pointed out, it doesn't cost much, if any, more money to use the stuff compared to the total expense of keeping a vehicle on the road these days.
--- Bror Jace
Bror Jace: thanks for the info on manhonda/Redline. I looked at the Redline site a little closer and one thing stuck out to me. They never compared their 10W-30 product to 10W-30 syn oil. Correct me if I am wrong. BTW I am still planning to try their 10W-30 product as you are.
Regards,
Al
driven 95% on freeway, oil level full at each change, very dark. Truck running flawlessly so far at 20,000 mi.
Have used Pennzoil Performax and the new PENNZANE in prior trucks with flawless results. Know friends and
neighbors that have used all types, Syn, Dino with great and not so great results. IMHO depends on vehicle.
Buying any new vehicle is a CRAP SHOOT, you never know if you will get a lemon, making high end oil changes
a futile gesture.....
If you plan to keep vehicle 10-100 years go SYN, if not, DINO should be fine unless you want the next purchaser of your
vehicle to have the best that you can give....
Bror Jace: thanks for the info on manhonda/Redline. I looked at the Redline site a little closer and one thing stuck out to me. They never compared their 10W-30 product to 10W-30 syn oil. Correct me if I am wrong. BTW I am still planning to try their 10W-30 product as you are.
Regards,
Al
adc100, I'll have to take a look at their site to see exactly what they're saying.
For the record, I thought their site was good ... not perfect. I wish they did more direct comparisons between their oils and the competition in the same grade. >;^)
--- Bror Jace
Al
Pepper, is Chevron synthetic isomerized/heavily hydrocracked mineral oil or is it real/traditional synthetic? I know Chevron is a pioneer in heavily processing petroleum oils (masquerading as 'synthetic'), that's why I ask.
--- Bror Jace
If we could get Armtdm to try it our data base could be bigger. But he's too in love with Amsoil (just kidding). Hey..anybody else out there use Redline???? No Redline dealers-please.
Al
Al
Compare the oil analysis results on the same car using different brands of oil?
I put RedLine 10W30 in my car at the 10,000 mile mark. Made the second change at 17,000.
BTW I bought a case of that oil (12 bottles) for something like $ 5.99 a quart at Eurasian.
As understand they increased their price a little since then. I guess it's now about $6.50
I also use RedLine gear oil.
After 7,000 miles the syntetic was quite dark. 70% of my driving is at the highway speeds. My next change is gonna be in 10,000 miles this time. I'll probably collect a sample and send it for analysis just to make sure that the engine has no defects. I'm perfectly comfortable with this schedule and planning to increase the intervals up to 15,000 miles. My OEM Ford filter has a Pure One filtering element. So no worries there.
All I can say that the reason I went with the synthetic is that I believe in its qualities after everything I red on the topic. I don't think that you'll be able to notice any differences in the engine behavior. In my opinion people claiming noticable differences in gas consumption/horse power output after switching have rich imagination.
Later,
Al
http://www.fumotovalve.com/
For a newer car or thsoe that change their oil frequently a defenite "buy"
Thanks.
Yea...How about that link for "Lubricating Engineers" ????
It may be better idea not to put any synthetic stuff in at all. When that motor came from the factory it didn't have no fake oil in it.
And, where does varnish and gunk go after being removed? If it go into the filter then it seems like oil will have to be changed more often. FWIW * If it ain't broke then don't fix it.
Synthetic stuff costs alot too. Much more than regular oil. Many say there is not no substantial documented proof that it works any better than petroleum oil. Toyota don't say anything about it in their owner book. Is it just a "cult" thing? What's the big deal about syntheytic?
Nobody wants to put something into their motor that will cause all it's joints to begin leaking oil all over the place. Leaks are awful.
This remind me of how Arm & Hammer Baking Soda recommended folk buy their box product and then go dump it down the sink drain...it didn't do a thing. "Money down the drain", they said.
I'm not sure about England, is synthetic brands used over there much??
fivespeed
I was very skeptical at first, 9 year's ago and started with 3000 mile changes with oil analysis and have worked my way up to different schedules based on the car. Two with 7000-10,000 miles I now do once a year, another 7500 and another at 12,000. I have reams of oil analysis print outs that show that there is basically no difference (in my cars) in wear metals, dirt, TBN, water and fuel as a % of volume etc. between 3000 mile changes and 12,000 mile changes. Over 12,000 miles I start to see some dirt build up as silicon over 32 ppm. I have become a convert but to each his own comfort level. I now go to extended drains on new cars and do not worry about any warranties.
Also, as to seepage, well, on a new car my experience is htat it will occur around 90,000 miles and on cars converted over later in life about one year from the conversion date. Usually valve covers or oil pan gaskets and simply tightening the bolts does the trick. Who knows if this would have occurred anyway?
As noted in multiple posts, there are no independent lab results on synthetics as there are none on petroleum oil comparisons and non on filters. So buyer beware and do what you can live with. With five cars 3000 mile changes are ridiculous, too much hassle.
I am not currently using synthetic oil. I ran across a post in the Camry Maintenance where this guy put synthetic oil in his car and the joints of the motor started to leak oil (he says).
Another poster said that it was normal for synthetic to start leaks in cars that normally used petroleum based oil.
You might kindly go back and read my original post (1193) more slower. Then you might know better where I was coming from. I just wanted to notify those people who were thinking about using fake oil that there may be some unpleasent side-effects occuring if they switch from their real oil. That being the "leak seepage" that was mentioned.
I have a used 1990 camry 4 cyl. with just over 160,000 mile on it and it has no leaks either. No motor failure. It use about a half a quart every 5,000-6,000 miles (change time). Of course, I take care of my car. I use valvoline motor oil. Synthetic oil couldn't do anything significant for it except maybe cause leaks..why chance it? Maybe some other day, some other car.
Thanks for your advises everyone.
Whoa, I just read the last poster number tc93. 386,000 miles on one car! Wow, I guess you call that getting your monies worth. I'd love to see what the seats looked like in that job.LOL