Hello to all. I've had my OBSport for two years now, and love it. A few weeks ago, as I was making a corner that was going down hill, the red airbag light came on...and wouldn't go off. Randomly it would come on once I'd started off on a trip. Now it stays on all the time. I'm hoping that it's a sensor that's wacked out. I have to make an appointment to have Subaru plug my car into their computer to figure out what the problem might be. Has anyone else seen this sort of problem??
Amy: have that checked out ASAP. Please don't take chances with safety equipment, no matter how unlikely the risk.
There was a recall to remove the front tow hooks on your model, I believe, since it could hit a curb and set off the air bag. I'd have both the recall and that fix done at the same visit.
It's probably nothing, but it's better to make sure.
Thanx all for your comments. I am fairly certain it's not the brakes. The sound is not as pronounced as a worn brake pad and occurs under throttle (braking actually usually makes it go away). Also, I had the pads replaced and the rotors machined at around 30,000 miles.
It's not the A/C because I also hear the sound when the A/C isn't on. It may be one of the fans, I was wondering about that myself.
As for the speedo - could be. Although I haven't noticed any connection to higher temperatures (not that we've had too much of them here in NY lately) or any reduced fuel efficiency; in fact, the sound tends to go away at higher speeds.
Thanx for all your suggestions. It may be time to bring the Outback in to a mechanic although I'm sure that once I do the sound will disappear.
The guy who carried out my groceries said "Niiiice looking car" twice when he saw my Outback. My 16 year old (!) niece asked her mom why she doesn't "get a station wagon like Aunt Kathy's?" Suddenly I'm cool.
I also think owning one of these could be a good cure for anyone with empty nest syndrome! I spent yesterday washing and scotchguarding the car. It seems to invite fanatical spiffing.
After reading all your good advice re: tire pressure I increased mine from the 30psi I had deflated them to, to 35psi. Seems to give a good ride.
I have 403 miles on it now and tomorrow I take it in to get the alignment checked (still drifts to left), window motor looked at, and front washers activated. The PDI on this car was apparently negligable...while washing it I noticed the rear crossbar on the roof rack was mounted with the arrow that says "front" pointing to the rear, and it is placed much farther forward on the car than the manual instuctions say.
I am really hoping all goes well at the service dept. I want this car the way it should be. I love driving it.
One more thing, I can't find a hood deflector (E2310LS000) anywhere. Its on backorder or will be special ordered everywhere I've checked. Does this mean they're still in Japan? Or is there an online source that might carry them? I live on a gravel road and also do a lot of interstate driving and want to get the front protected as soon as possible.
Thank you so much, the Subaru forums are outstanding!
I have a 1997 Outback with 78000 miles. Lately I have been experiencing problems starting it. I'll turn the key to start it and nothing happens. The dash lights come on but the engine won't turn over. After I turn the key several times eventually the engine will crank. I had been putting up with this problem because it wouldn't always consistently happen. Many times it would start first try.
Today I was experiencing the problem and the starter motor kept cranking after I got the engine started. Even if I turned the key off the starter motor kept running! The only way I could make it stop was to disconnect the battery. When I reconnected the battery the starter motor would automatically start cranking on its own. The engine wouldn't start however until I turned the key on. After I let the car set for 1/2 hour, I reconnected the battery, the starter motor started cranking automatically on its own I turned the key on, the engine started and then the starter automatically shut off. Now its behaving normally.
If anyone has ever experienced this problem or knows what the solution might be I sure would appreciate any feedback. I think it might be difficult to describe or demonstrate this problem to my mechanic since it seems to be so intermittent.
Fanatical spiffing is one of the better terms I have read around here. Most of us understand and will encourage you to remain a Fanatic with all reasonableness.
Oh yes, the Outback gets many compliments.
No one should know your car better than you. IMHO Owners can find the Atom issues with greater detail. I have a Atom masher handy at all times when it comes to my Outback. So mount those roof racks on right. Someone mentioned taking them off all together until needed. I followed that suggestion because I like the way it looks, not to mention the Atom masher gas saving that will result.
Kathy - wagons are making a comeback, and Subaru makes some of the best!
There's a tool that looks a bit like a screw driver that should be in your glove box. Removing the cross bars is easy, though you may as well let the dealer do it, if only to point out their error.
You can check with QSubaru@aol.com on the deflector, but Darlene is out this week, so she won't get back to you until Monday.
Jan: wow, could be bad starter, ECU, electrical gremlins, what else? I'd get that to a dealer and just tell them the same story. Ask if there was a TSB (technical service bulletin, kind of like a silent recall) along those lines.
>>The PDI on this car was apparently negligable...while washing it I noticed the rear crossbar on the roof rack was mounted with the arrow that says "front" pointing to the rear, and it is placed much farther forward on the car than the manual instuctions say.<<
Wow, they must have had a new prep person learning the job the day your car arrived at the dealership. If I were you, I'd talk to the boss and make sure he knows how much you've been inconvenienced by this, and how important first impressions are etc. They need to train their people better, and have someone double check that stuff.
Putting on crossbars is a cinch. I too keep them off unless I'm actually using them. I've got two bike racks mounted on mine. Rather than disassemble the whole thing each time I take it off, I leave the bike racks attached to the cross bars, loosen the four Torx™ bolts, and remove the whole thing as one piece. Then just plop the whole thing back on when I need it again, four bolts back in and I'm ready to go. Saves mucho time. In a couple weeks we'll be going on vacation though, and I'll have to take the bike racks off to put a luggage carrier up there. I keep my bolts and Torx tool under the cargo floor in the storage tray. I love that thing!
Has anyone tried to assemble a radiator flush kit to their Forester. I'm talking about the flush and fill kits like Prestone has. If so which heater hose on the forester is the one that you attach the flushing tee to. Any input is appreciated. Also has anyone switched to the long life anti-freeze Dex-Cool that has no silicates.
I just met a guy with an identical 2000 OB wagon with the 4EAT Auto. Trivial Fact: The AUTO version has a special fuse that, if you remove it, the electronics in the auto tranny go stupid, and you have a FWD car. That is, only the front "axle" is powered, the rear wheels are free. I think this is for towing and other "unusual" circumstances. OK. This guy pulls his breaker routinely in the summer unless he's driving on scree-covered light 4WD trails. Says his gas mileage jumps from 25 to 28 instantly.
QUESTION: Doesn't that sound like it would be a bad idea to disengage the rear torque for a long period of time? Use it or lose it? Or do you suppose it doesn't matter, and he's got a good trick? -------------- BABA O'RILEY (good name. Trivia: what do many people incorrectly think the name of BABA O'RILEY really is?) Hey, I had that same damn rattle. Drove me mad. Turns out, it was my dark glasses in the upper glasses holder. No glasses, no rattle. I hope that works for you.
nvy: tell me, what does Atom issues mean -- is it the same as nitpicky??? ) Cause I am.
Picked my car up at the service dept. Wheels were aligned ever so slightly according to the numbers sheet (if I interpreted it right)...I thought it acted better on drive home but need to get out in it a little more. Tell me any other Outback owners, if you let go of the wheel on the straightaway where does your car tend to drift??
They , of course, hooked up the washers and mounted the crossbar correctly. I had asked if the brake pedal could be "snugged" up a bit and they did it "according to the bulletin from Subaru". Apparently that long play is common?
At first the manager told me the technician had not felt the window motor noise was unusual. But after I seemed concerned with that answer the mngr. listened to 2 other Outbacks and agreed it was louder than those. He's ordered a new regulator, he said that way it will be on hand if an adjustment will not fix it. I take the car back in next week (!) when the part will be in.
When I expressed concern over these "glitches", the mngr said the "regular tech was off last Fri and that this was probably the first Sube for the guy who did it". Don't know what to make of the serv dept yet. I did notice several of the detailers looked like high school kids.
None of the 3 subaru dealers in my area deal only in Subarus and their service depts do other cars too. This mngr did not seem like a Subaru expert... but I will give it more time and see how it goes.
Thanks for the number to call Brett, I'll contact them tomorrow. My OB is wintergreen too, I really like it.
Thanks again, you guys are sure helping me act confident when I go in there!
Our ob2000 is only 3 months old. We also bought a hood deflector and rear gate bar from tacoma. the hood deflector was easy to install. Don't know if it helps with the bug since we only have 1200 miles and haven't driven the too much. The rear gate bar was installed last week. My husband was very skeptical. the car was too young to have surgery. instructions were included but you do have to be careful. The templates if placed properly noted where the holes should be drilled but they were off slightly by 1/4" on each side. Measure carefully and place the bar before drilling. It looks great! good luck babaoreily on your installation.
Our OB still has that burning "new smell". It is slowly dissipating.
Yep..Atom masher or smasher or "nitpicky" or nitpicker,whatever floats your boat. It's all the same. Ani't (There's) nothing wrong w/ (with) being detailed.
I am not a mechanic, but from the description I would say it has almost *got* to be a bad starter solenoid. (The other obvious possibility is a bad connection at the key-switch, but typically that would either never start, or always start, ie, not get fixed by disconnecting the battery.)
Of course these days the entire starting system is a bit different from when I replaced one on a 1968 Oldsmobile wagon,
Thanks for the tip. I'll pass it along to my mechanic. He thinks it's either a bad switch or a bad starter. I'm taking it in Monday. The problem has now partially cleared itself up. It seems to be starting somewhat reliably now. I wish it was totally broken. It would make it easier for him to diagnose the problem. I don't think he will be able to fix it if it doesn't appear to be broken.
The fuse for fwd is also on the manual transmission OB's, and no, it probably is not a good idea to use it on a regular basis. On an automatic trans, 90% of the torque is usually applied to the front wheels anyway (so it is already essentially FWD already). So I wonder why he would bother...
On a manual trans, I suspect the damage would be greater, since the torque is split 50/50, and the viscous coupling unit is not computer controlled.
The impression I got from the manual, is that you should only disengage the AWD in an emergency situation. I don't think gaining 3 mpg is really worth the cost of repairs in the long run.
Had my 00 OB into the dealer for oil, filtre and lube and for correction of some other probs as follows:
1. Clunking coming from front suspension area when going over bumps at low speed (ie. 10 mph going over curb when leaving parking lot etc.)
Resolution: replaced front stabilizer links with new design from Subaru. Seems to have solved 90% of the problem, but too early to tell. Will need to drive it another week or so.
2. Very minor vibration in steering wheel at 80 mph Resolution: re-balanced front wheels...vibration gone. However, not sure they used teflon coated weights to re-balance. Will have to confirm.
3. Rattle from driver door area. Resolution: removed door panel, checked for loose parts and lubricated all panel contact points. Noise still occurs intermitently. Will have to go back.
4. Fans cycling on and off immediately after starting car that has been parked overnight. Resolution: None. Was told it is normal. Has to do with the system automatically turning on and off the A/C to rid condensation in system. A/C functions automatically in two defrost settings.
5. Passenger rear wheel spun freely even when handbrake was engaged. Resolution: Removed tires and checked brakes. Also checked handbrake components. Found a part had been installed incorrectly resulting in only one side engaging. Now both work. Note: When I dropped off car, Service advisor told me that a number of people had complained about this prob.
psycho Thanks for the dash advise. I left a pair of sunglasses in there once and it drove me nuts for a while. My new noise is another sound in the center console area. I only know Baba O'riley as a Who song, thought it was in deference to Meher Baba by Pete Townsend but I hope you will enlighten me.
Kathy, My car pulled to the left when I first bought, had it aligned at dealer, didn't really change anything. Balanced front tires' PSI (they were about 1 PSI off) and that helped a lot more. My OB just seems to want to drift according to road conditions. I've gotten used to it now.
benjo, Thanks for advise on rear gate bar. I'll probably spend an hour or so measuring and rechecking and such. Did you paint or primer drill holes?
luck11, Glad you found a dealer to deal w/ front suspension noise. One of those things I'd gotten used to, but will ask my dealer to replace links.
You can't disengage AWD with the manual tranny Subarus. The system used in the manuals are, as you wrote, based on a viscous coupling so the drivetrain is always connected. That's why the owner's manual tell you that you can only tow a 5-speed with all 4 wheels on the ground -or- on a flat bed.
The AT AWD systems, on the other hand, use an electonically controlled clutch pack so pulling a fuse will do the trick.
I do agree that pulling the fuse on an AT AWD system won't save you much more gas under normal driving conditions. Since the system is normally 90:10 in 3rd and 4th gear, you probably don't gain much by disengaging the rear wheels. More of the fuel penalty probably comes from the added weight of the AWD components.
we did buy bottle of paint and painted the drill holes. In addition, before we placed the bar, we added clear silicone on the ends and opening of the bar and let it dry before installing; therefore preventing any rust problems if any water went into the bars. As we installed the bar, we added silicone between the pad and washer on the outside.
Believe, the rear gate comes in handy. when your short and the hatch is heavy, the bar comes in handy in relieving some of the weight.
Thanks gents. I decided anyway to not play that game. Defeats the whole purpose of all wheel drive.
Ash, I believe it's only on the AUTO since the Manual is a mechanical viscous coupling (bullet-proof and better in my opinion) there are no electronics to defeat, and it only applies to the AUTO.
Now I'm going to buy the headlight protection film and the tailgate handle. Report to follow.
WHO trivia: doesn't belong in here I know. Well, Brett, you knew more than I did till just recently. Baba was the last name of the Indian "muse" who taught Pete Townsend some Eastern string techniques, and O'Riley was the producer for Who's Next (one of the 5 best alltime rock albums). Most people think the name of the song is Teenage Wasteland (a slam on the Woodstock crowd). But I can tell you already knew that. Don't know which is the most supreme, Baba or Won't get fooled again. What an album. But I digress.
Back to Subarus before the Wicked Witch of the Chat Group turns me into a Banana Slug. Or worse, a Ford Expedition.
I wrote a while back and asked whether I could expect Subaru to honor the warranty on the used '97 Legacy L wagon I wanted to buy, which still had theoretically 22k miles or two years left on it. Someone helpfully responded with the number of SoA, and I called and found out: if you buy from a private person, it's possible to do a warranty transfer, but if you buy from a dealer, you're out of luck.
My parents are looking into Subarus to pull behind their motor home. The word they got from the dealer is that no Subie can be flat-towed, which I know is wrong; the manual transmission cars can be towed. My question is, does using the fuse to disengage AWD on the automatic make the car able to be safely flat-towed for long distances at highway speeds? Also, I thought you had to put the fuse IN to make the car FWD-only. That makes more sense to me; having your AWD go out because of a blown fuse would not be a good thing.
As for the starter, your mechanic sounds like a good one. It's either the ignition switch or the starter solenoid, probably the latter. Ask him/her to check if it is just a matter of something associated with the solenoid being dirty or in need of lubrication; my son and I took the starter out of his '80 Subie wagon, cleaned up the solenoid contacts, put a new set of brushes in the motor, and it was good to go. A whole lot cheaper than buying a new/rebuilt starter!
I'm very interested in a 99 Forester w/17K miles that my local dealer took in trade. Seems to have been well maintained (saw the records) and balance of warranty remains. However on testdrive, while downshifting into 2nd there was a noticeable vibration... almost like I was going over a series of small bumps. It wasn't the road, and I was able to repeat it only once more in a 20 minute ride on and off highway.
Dealer said it might ghave been clutch wear from previous owner... I was more concerned about a problem with 2nd gear or drivetrain.
Anyone experience anything like this? Dealer said he'd have the service department look at it and warranty would certainly cover problem... I just want to know if this might be representative of prior abuse. Otherwise car is very clean and runs well.
BTW... dealer is asking $16,900 for a 99 L. Any thoughts on this price?
I finally installed this oil change valve in my 2001 Forester. I thought I'd report that the version with a hose extension fits just fine, with plenty of room to spare above the plastic engine shield.
Sorry about the incorrect info on the AWD --> FWD fuse on the 5-speeds. I should have checked the manual first. Instead, I had seen the fuse slot in (engine compartment fuse box) on my 5-speed (I guess it's just there because the only difference is the transmission, probably not enough to warrant two different types of fuse boxes), so had just extrapolated that to mean that it was supported on the 5-speeds.
Interstingly enough though, the description for that fuse in the engine compartment says (FWD) and (VDC OFF). Looks like Subaru had VDC planned in the Outbacks last year before they even released the new 2000s. (My OB was bought in August 1999).
Norm- Hey. Glad to hear there's plenty of clearance. Two questions: 1. What diameter tubing will the drain take? I'm guessing it's pencil diameter, but not as big as my little finger? 2. I don't suppose you've drained it with the tubing yet. Prob'ly have to wait for another few months to hear your answer, but how long does it take to drain the sump? 20 minutes instead of 3? It sure would be nice to drain right into my old milk jug, skipping the "oil catch pan" step entirely.
Norman: how about a photo of your fumoto? I'll put it up on my site.
Dave: in some states (MD, for one), you get a 30 day warranty from the dealer. I find it odd that the warranty will not transfer when a dealer is involved. I guess SoA's position is that the car will be inspected prior to sale?
Kathy: glad you're on the way to resolving the dealer issues. I'd say if they can fix the window motor, they've earned back your business. Oh, and make sure you get appointments on days where the regular mechanic is on duty!
Shadowman1: whatever it is, have them fix it first. If it's under warranty, all the better, they'll get reimbursed.
Could be alignment, worn tires, tire pressure, abused suspension, etc.
$16,900 sounds like a pretty decent price to me on a '99 with 17K if it's truly in good shape. At least in the area where I live, it's extremely hard to find late-model used Subarus -- I had to drive back and forth across Central Texas in search of a really good used Forester that I could afford -- so they can command a bit of a premium around here if they're in really good shape.
The limiting diameter is the width of the internals of the valve opening itself, not the connected tube. This width looks to be about a 1/4 ". Can't say how long it will take to drain 4 1/2 l. of oil, but if the oil is warm I am going to guess about 3-4 minutes. The original Subaru opening is so large it drains to just the last residual drops in less than 30 seconds.
I'll try to get a pix of this valve installed. Should have thought of that before replacing the plastic engine shield...
Hi! I've been looking at all of the post and, unfortunately, I can't get to all of them tonight. TexSubaru - sounds like a good deal. Check out CARFAX.Com if you're concerned. They offer a good service about branded titles, salvage vehicles,etc. We even use them!
Pulling the fuse (for FWD) bad idea for the long term - lack of lubrication could cause problems.
Steering rack noise when turning over bumps - normal, and I have a lengthy explanation. If you want it, contact me directly. It's too long to post hear, but no long term problems will result.
Brake Pedal travel - the service bulletin changes the "illusion" but it does not change the "normal" braking. More to follow if you need or want it.
Patti--I would be interested in hearing more about the brake pedal adjustment and to understand better about the diff between "illusion" and "normal braking".
babaoreiilly (I think): Thanks for the recommendation of subaruparts.com in Tacoma. I called today and ordered the hood deflector, rear gate bar, filter system, and lighted mirror visors. I also asked for the rubber floor mats and was told not to get them as they really didn't work to keep wet off the floor...this is the kind of advice you have to appreciate. Order is expected to arrive UPS in 3-4 days.
My 2001 Forester (S Premium) has just reached 3K miles, and the manual suggests that I change its oil/filter. My question is can I just go to Jiffy Lube or should I go to the dealer at least for the first oil change? Or maybe the oil change is not needed at all?
Thank you for addressing this issue - I would be very interested in hearing the explanation. I believe it would benefit the group if you have the time to post it here, otherwise, my email address is:
First of all, welcome Patti to the Crew. It's great to have someone from Subaru with us, so let's make her feel welcome.
I have a suggestion for the longer explanations you may have, which I think are very valuable to many Crew members.
Go ahead and post the explanation, then click on the number of the post, and make it hidden. That way, it doesn't take up space, but those who want to can read it.
Just make sure the title says something like "Steering rack noise" or "Brake Pedal Adjustment". I think this is where you can add the most value, actually. The brakes are definitely an FAQ.
Simon: I change the oil myself and have posted instructions here. You can order Subaru OE oil filters from Darlene for just $4, shipping included. That includes a filter and a new drain plug gasket.
You can always use Jiffy Lube, though. They may not replace the gasket (ask), but I haven't myself and have not had a problem. I will in the future, though.
The dealership will surely use OE parts and so you'll get the best service and the new gasket, plus they can address any other minor issues you have under warranty. It may cost a bit more, so it's worth checking first.
A problem with hiding messages is that you can't select See All Responses (at top) and use your browser's Find to search all posts (within a given topic). Edmund's has no search function (topics only.. not very useful unless you're creating a new topic) so hiding messages would prevent searching through previously-covered material.
I just use the Page Down key, the scroll bar page down function, or an IntelliMouse thumbwheel to skip past the stuff that doesn't interest me.
Okay I confess: I read it all, I just can't help it!
Patti I welcome you to this site as your a much need rep for these types of questions. Mine is about the brake pedal. After having the ABS recall done to our 99 Forester L our brake pedal his very spongy and in some instances it has gone down past the service limit as recommended in the service manual. I asked the dealer to check this out last time in for service but he said its normal. Can you explain what you mean in your posting by illusion and normal and what is the brake pedal TSB so I can refer my dealer to it. Thanks for your response.
I asked when the same recall was performed on my Forester, and in fact the mechanic did bleed the brakes. I wonder if they can be adjusted though.
Mike - as long as the title is descriptive, I think it's better to have it hidden vs. not posted here at all. Though I don't mind weeding though the long message myself (yup, I read it all too...).
So post it and hide it or just post is all, so long as you post!
I've had seriously mixed experiences with Jiffy Lube/Quik Lube places in the past. With my old Mazda 626, about half the time, I had no problem, but the other half, I ended up going back at least once (and sometimes twice) to get them to replace the gasket -- they'd either tear the gasket, misposition it or use a wrong-sized one, leaving me with a small but annoying as heck oil leak. Don't know if this is an absolutely consistent fast-lube place kinda problem or if there was somehow something weirdly tricky about a '91 626 gasket. I've had much better luck with dealerships, and the price really isn't much different -- but the dealerships just take sooo much longer to get such a small task done that, simply to save time and hassle, I've kept being tempted to gamble that, this time, Jiffy Lube wouldn't blow it this time, a gamble I've lost the roughly 50% of the times I had to make a return trip.
Hello everyone, It's been a while since I have written. I have been lurking but, waiting for the right time to write. After receiving and driving my New 2001 Forester for a week, I can honestly say that now I know what all of you were bragging about! I am in love again! The new 01 has not hesitated nor do I have any rear hatch wind noise or rattles. The brakes are much better but in my opinion still on the low side. Which I was told before is normal?????? Needless to say, I am happy that I took the chance and asked for a replacement vehicle at my hearing. I guess it's true what they say "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" The dealer has been treating me so well,I know we will have a great relationship in the future. Anyway, The new baby is just sooooooo nice, I have to go out and shine her up now.
As for the Brake problems that you have been discussing. I too had the same complaint with my 99 forester, I had several cleanings and the recall work done. I still thought they were way to low for comfort. My pedal, when fully depressed would be like a little womans thumb nail away from the floor! Normal???????? I don't thinks so! Karen
tex: scary, man. I once put an oil filter on the wife's Mazda, and mistakenly left the old oil filter's gasket on. So the two didn't mesh, and I had a slow leak too. Caught it early, and never made that mistake again.
Karen: I'm jealous. I forget, did you get the moonroof? Motorweek compared it to the Texas sky!
I believe the brakes have a dual stage booster. Tap lightly, and it stops slowly but smoothly. This is for smooth stops, but it takes getting used to. You have to step on it to brake hard, though it's effective once you do.
Car & Driver's early test of a Forester S actually yielded the shortest stopping distance of any SUV they've tested. It was in the 160's, where most SUVs have trouble braking (pun intended) 200 feet!
Still, the problem is the feel of the pedal. A firmer pedal would be more reassuring.
I observed an increase in pedal firmness changing out the stock brake lines for a set of Goodridge stainless steel braided lines. Took about an hour, including bleeding the brakes. This is also a good time to install a higher spec brake fluid, I use Castrol SynPower, very high wet and dry boiling point and it's only $5 per 16oz at Wal-Mart or Autozone.
If anyone does this, make sure the lines are bleed thoroughly. You really don't want to mix two kinds of brake fluid. Is it colored different so you can tell the old fluid is out?
Probably, but it's glycerine-based and exceeds DOT3 & 4. It's not a silicone-based DOT5 fluid.
It's bright lime green. The old stuff is kinda yellow. You can get it all out by opening a bleeder and stomping the pedal and then manually moving it when it won't return on it's own. Fill up the reservoir and do it again. Now it's purged enough for a street car.
BTW, you can mix DOT3&4 fluids. Mixing silicone fluids with glycerin ones is the big no-no.
We have a new 2001 S-Plus Forester, White, and love it except for a being annoyed by something "loose" in the rear interior of the car.
I've emptied the trunk, etc. and satisfied myself that it's not in the driveline or suspension.
My guess is either (1) the overhead seat belt reel (for the 5th rider) or (2) the hatch itself have a loose fixture of some kind. It sounds like a coin in an empty box, if we hit the slightest bump.
I saw nothing resembling this noise "surface" yet on these boards. We are taking it back to the dealer, looking for any group advice before tearing things apart.
Comments
Has anyone else seen this sort of problem??
There was a recall to remove the front tow hooks on your model, I believe, since it could hit a curb and set off the air bag. I'd have both the recall and that fix done at the same visit.
It's probably nothing, but it's better to make sure.
-juice
It's not the A/C because I also hear the sound when the A/C isn't on. It may be one of the fans, I was wondering about that myself.
As for the speedo - could be. Although I haven't noticed any connection to higher temperatures (not that we've had too much of them here in NY lately) or any reduced fuel efficiency; in fact, the sound tends to go away at higher speeds.
Thanx for all your suggestions. It may be time to bring the Outback in to a mechanic although I'm sure that once I do the sound will disappear.
David
when the A/C isn't on. It may be one of the fans,
I was wondering about that myself.<<
Maybe one of the belts is a little loose or worn?
Dave
Older belts will develop small cracks as they lose their ability to flex. They dry up and can squeek when in use.
Usually the belts are changed at 60k miles or later, but it's worth a shot if it annoys you.
-juice
The guy who carried out my groceries said "Niiiice looking car" twice when he saw my Outback. My 16 year old (!) niece asked her mom why she doesn't "get a station wagon like Aunt Kathy's?" Suddenly I'm cool.
I also think owning one of these could be a good cure for anyone with empty nest syndrome! I spent yesterday washing and scotchguarding the car. It seems to invite fanatical spiffing.
After reading all your good advice re: tire pressure I increased mine from the 30psi I had deflated them to, to 35psi. Seems to give a good ride.
I have 403 miles on it now and tomorrow I take it in to get the alignment checked (still drifts to left), window motor looked at, and front washers activated. The PDI on this car was apparently negligable...while washing it I noticed the rear crossbar on the roof rack was mounted with the arrow that says "front" pointing to the rear, and it is placed much farther forward on the car than the manual instuctions say.
I am really hoping all goes well at the service dept. I want this car the way it should be. I love driving it.
One more thing, I can't find a hood deflector (E2310LS000) anywhere. Its on backorder or will be special ordered everywhere I've checked. Does this mean they're still in Japan? Or is there an online source that might carry them? I live on a gravel road and also do a lot of interstate driving and want to get the front protected as soon as possible.
Thank you so much, the Subaru forums are outstanding!
--Kathy
Today I was experiencing the problem and the starter motor kept cranking after I got the engine started. Even if I turned the key off the starter motor kept running! The only way I could make it stop was to disconnect the battery. When I reconnected the battery the starter motor would automatically start cranking on its own. The engine wouldn't start however until I turned the key on. After I let the car set for 1/2 hour, I reconnected the battery, the starter motor started cranking automatically on its own I turned the key on, the engine started and then the starter automatically shut off. Now its behaving normally.
If anyone has ever experienced this problem or knows what the solution might be I sure would appreciate any feedback. I think it might be difficult to describe or demonstrate this problem to my mechanic since it seems to be so intermittent.
I have read around here. Most of us understand
and will encourage you to remain a Fanatic with
all reasonableness.
Oh yes, the Outback gets many compliments.
No one should know your car better than you.
IMHO Owners can find the Atom issues with greater
detail. I have a Atom masher handy at all
times when it comes to my Outback. So mount
those roof racks on right. Someone mentioned
taking them off all together until needed.
I followed that suggestion because I like the
way it looks, not to mention the Atom masher gas
saving that will result.
The Best to you and your new Outback!
later... and Ya'll come back now.
There's a tool that looks a bit like a screw driver that should be in your glove box. Removing the cross bars is easy, though you may as well let the dealer do it, if only to point out their error.
You can check with QSubaru@aol.com on the deflector, but Darlene is out this week, so she won't get back to you until Monday.
Jan: wow, could be bad starter, ECU, electrical gremlins, what else? I'd get that to a dealer and just tell them the same story. Ask if there was a TSB (technical service bulletin, kind of like a silent recall) along those lines.
-juice
negligable...while washing it I noticed the rear
crossbar on the roof rack was mounted with the
arrow that says "front" pointing to the rear, and
it is placed much farther forward on the car than
the manual instuctions say.<<
Wow, they must have had a new prep person learning the job the day your car arrived at the dealership. If I were you, I'd talk to the boss and make sure he knows how much you've been inconvenienced by this, and how important first impressions are etc. They need to train their people better, and have someone double check that stuff.
Putting on crossbars is a cinch. I too keep them off unless I'm actually using them. I've got two bike racks mounted on mine. Rather than disassemble the whole thing each time I take it off, I leave the bike racks attached to the cross bars, loosen the four Torx™ bolts, and remove the whole thing as one piece. Then just plop the whole thing back on when I need it again, four bolts back in and I'm ready to go. Saves mucho time. In a couple weeks we'll be going on vacation though, and I'll have to take the bike racks off to put a luggage carrier up there. I keep my bolts and Torx tool under the cargo floor in the storage tray. I love that thing!
Dave
I just met a guy with an identical 2000 OB wagon with the 4EAT Auto. Trivial Fact: The AUTO version has a special fuse that, if you remove it, the electronics in the auto tranny go stupid, and you have a FWD car. That is, only the front "axle" is powered, the rear wheels are free. I think this is for towing and other "unusual" circumstances. OK. This guy pulls his breaker routinely in the summer unless he's driving on scree-covered light 4WD trails. Says his gas mileage jumps from 25 to 28 instantly.
QUESTION: Doesn't that sound like it would be a bad idea to disengage the rear torque for a long period of time? Use it or lose it? Or do you suppose it doesn't matter, and he's got a good trick?
--------------
BABA O'RILEY (good name. Trivia: what do many people incorrectly think the name of BABA O'RILEY really is?) Hey, I had that same damn rattle. Drove me mad. Turns out, it was my dark glasses in the upper glasses holder. No glasses, no rattle. I hope that works for you.
-psycho
Picked my car up at the service dept. Wheels were aligned ever so slightly according to the numbers sheet (if I interpreted it right)...I thought it acted better on drive home but need to get out in it a little more. Tell me any other Outback owners, if you let go of the wheel on the straightaway where does your car tend to drift??
They , of course, hooked up the washers and mounted the crossbar correctly. I had asked if the brake pedal could be "snugged" up a bit and they did it "according to the bulletin from Subaru". Apparently that long play is common?
At first the manager told me the technician had not felt the window motor noise was unusual. But after I seemed concerned with that answer the mngr. listened to 2 other Outbacks and agreed it was louder than those. He's ordered a new regulator, he said that way it will be on hand if an adjustment will not fix it. I take the car back in next week (!) when the part will be in.
When I expressed concern over these "glitches", the mngr said the "regular tech was off last Fri and that this was probably the first Sube for the guy who did it". Don't know what to make of the serv dept yet. I did notice several of the detailers looked like high school kids.
None of the 3 subaru dealers in my area deal only in Subarus and their service depts do other cars too. This mngr did not seem like a Subaru expert... but I will give it more time and see how it goes.
Thanks for the number to call Brett, I'll contact them tomorrow. My OB is wintergreen too, I really like it.
Thanks again, you guys are sure helping me act confident when I go in there!
--Kathy
good luck babaoreily on your installation.
Our OB still has that burning "new smell". It is slowly dissipating.
benjo
nitpicker,whatever floats your boat. It's all
the same. Ani't (There's) nothing wrong w/ (with)
being detailed.
later..
Of course these days the entire starting system is a bit different from when I replaced one on a 1968 Oldsmobile wagon,
Chris
The fuse for fwd is also on the manual transmission OB's, and no, it probably is not a good idea to use it on a regular basis. On an automatic trans, 90% of the torque is usually applied to the front wheels anyway (so it is already essentially FWD already). So I wonder why he would bother...
On a manual trans, I suspect the damage would be greater, since the torque is split 50/50, and the viscous coupling unit is not computer controlled.
The impression I got from the manual, is that you should only disengage the AWD in an emergency situation. I don't think gaining 3 mpg is really worth the cost of repairs in the long run.
-- ash
1. Clunking coming from front suspension area when going over bumps at low speed (ie. 10 mph going over curb when leaving parking lot etc.)
Resolution: replaced front stabilizer links with new design from Subaru. Seems to have solved 90% of the problem, but too early to tell. Will need to drive it another week or so.
2. Very minor vibration in steering wheel at 80 mph
Resolution: re-balanced front wheels...vibration gone. However, not sure they used teflon coated weights to re-balance. Will have to confirm.
3. Rattle from driver door area.
Resolution: removed door panel, checked for loose parts and lubricated all panel contact points. Noise still occurs intermitently. Will have to go back.
4. Fans cycling on and off immediately after starting car that has been parked overnight.
Resolution: None. Was told it is normal. Has to do with the system automatically turning on and off the A/C to rid condensation in system. A/C functions automatically in two defrost settings.
5. Passenger rear wheel spun freely even when handbrake was engaged.
Resolution: Removed tires and checked brakes. Also checked handbrake components. Found a part had been installed incorrectly resulting in only one side engaging. Now both work. Note: When I dropped off car, Service advisor told me that a number of people had complained about this prob.
Thanks for the dash advise. I left a pair of sunglasses in there once and it drove me nuts for a while. My new noise is another sound in the center console area.
I only know Baba O'riley as a Who song, thought it was in deference to Meher Baba by Pete Townsend but I hope you will enlighten me.
Kathy,
My car pulled to the left when I first bought, had it aligned at dealer, didn't really change anything. Balanced front tires' PSI (they were about 1 PSI off) and that helped a lot more. My OB just seems to want to drift according to road conditions. I've gotten used to it now.
benjo,
Thanks for advise on rear gate bar. I'll probably spend an hour or so measuring and rechecking and such. Did you paint or primer drill holes?
luck11,
Glad you found a dealer to deal w/ front suspension noise. One of those things I'd gotten used to, but will ask my dealer to replace links.
Brett
You can't disengage AWD with the manual tranny Subarus. The system used in the manuals are, as you wrote, based on a viscous coupling so the drivetrain is always connected. That's why the owner's manual tell you that you can only tow a 5-speed with all 4 wheels on the ground -or- on a flat bed.
The AT AWD systems, on the other hand, use an electonically controlled clutch pack so pulling a fuse will do the trick.
I do agree that pulling the fuse on an AT AWD system won't save you much more gas under normal driving conditions. Since the system is normally 90:10 in 3rd and 4th gear, you probably don't gain much by disengaging the rear wheels. More of the fuel penalty probably comes from the added weight of the AWD components.
we did buy bottle of paint and painted the drill holes. In addition, before we placed the bar, we added clear silicone on the ends and opening of the bar and let it dry before installing; therefore preventing any rust problems if any water went into the bars. As we installed the bar, we added silicone between the pad and washer on the outside.
Believe, the rear gate comes in handy. when your short and the hatch is heavy, the bar comes in handy in relieving some of the weight.
benjo
Ash, I believe it's only on the AUTO since the Manual is a mechanical viscous coupling (bullet-proof and better in my opinion) there are no electronics to defeat, and it only applies to the AUTO.
Now I'm going to buy the headlight protection film and the tailgate handle. Report to follow.
WHO trivia: doesn't belong in here I know. Well, Brett, you knew more than I did till just recently. Baba was the last name of the Indian "muse" who taught Pete Townsend some Eastern string techniques, and O'Riley was the producer for Who's Next (one of the 5 best alltime rock albums). Most people think the name of the song is Teenage Wasteland (a slam on the Woodstock crowd). But I can tell you already knew that. Don't know which is the most supreme, Baba or Won't get fooled again. What an album. But I digress.
Back to Subarus before the Wicked Witch of the Chat Group turns me into a Banana Slug. Or worse, a Ford Expedition.
-psycho
could expect Subaru to honor the warranty on
the used '97 Legacy L wagon I wanted to buy,
which still had theoretically 22k miles or two
years left on it. Someone helpfully responded
with the number of SoA, and I called and found
out: if you buy from a private person, it's
possible to do a warranty transfer, but if you
buy from a dealer, you're out of luck.
I'm out of luck, but I bought the car anyway :-)
Dave
As for the starter, your mechanic sounds like a good one. It's either the ignition switch or the starter solenoid, probably the latter. Ask him/her to check if it is just a matter of something associated with the solenoid being dirty or in need of lubrication; my son and I took the starter out of his '80 Subie wagon, cleaned up the solenoid contacts, put a new set of brushes in the motor, and it was good to go. A whole lot cheaper than buying a new/rebuilt starter!
Cheers,
WDB
Dealer said it might ghave been clutch wear from previous owner... I was more concerned about a problem with 2nd gear or drivetrain.
Anyone experience anything like this? Dealer said he'd have the service department look at it and warranty would certainly cover problem... I just want to know if this might be representative of prior abuse. Otherwise car is very clean and runs well.
BTW... dealer is asking $16,900 for a 99 L. Any thoughts on this price?
Thanks, in advance.
Norman
Sorry about the incorrect info on the AWD --> FWD fuse on the 5-speeds. I should have checked the manual first. Instead, I had seen the fuse slot in (engine compartment fuse box) on my 5-speed (I guess it's just there because the only difference is the transmission, probably not enough to warrant two different types of fuse boxes), so had just extrapolated that to mean that it was supported on the 5-speeds.
Interstingly enough though, the description for that fuse in the engine compartment says (FWD) and (VDC OFF). Looks like Subaru had VDC planned in the Outbacks last year before they even released the new 2000s. (My OB was bought in August 1999).
-- ash
1. What diameter tubing will the drain take? I'm guessing it's pencil diameter, but not as big as my little finger?
2. I don't suppose you've drained it with the tubing yet. Prob'ly have to wait for another few months to hear your answer, but how long does it take to drain the sump? 20 minutes instead of 3? It sure would be nice to drain right into my old milk jug, skipping the "oil catch pan" step entirely.
Thanks.
-psycho
Dave: in some states (MD, for one), you get a 30 day warranty from the dealer. I find it odd that the warranty will not transfer when a dealer is involved. I guess SoA's position is that the car will be inspected prior to sale?
Kathy: glad you're on the way to resolving the dealer issues. I'd say if they can fix the window motor, they've earned back your business. Oh, and make sure you get appointments on days where the regular mechanic is on duty!
Shadowman1: whatever it is, have them fix it first. If it's under warranty, all the better, they'll get reimbursed.
Could be alignment, worn tires, tire pressure, abused suspension, etc.
-juice
I'll try to get a pix of this valve installed. Should have thought of that before replacing the plastic engine shield...
Norman
is the 99 L a AT or MT.
If it is an Autotrans I may have some info
regarding acceleration from stop vibration
in 2nd gear ....
Pulling the fuse (for FWD) bad idea for the long term - lack of lubrication could cause problems.
Steering rack noise when turning over bumps - normal, and I have a lengthy explanation. If you want it, contact me directly. It's too long to post hear, but no long term problems will result.
Brake Pedal travel - the service bulletin changes the "illusion" but it does not change the "normal" braking. More to follow if you need or want it.
Be back tomorrow!
Patti
Subaru Team
babaoreiilly (I think): Thanks for the recommendation of subaruparts.com in Tacoma. I called today and ordered the hood deflector, rear gate bar, filter system, and lighted mirror visors. I also asked for the rubber floor mats and was told not to get them as they really didn't work to keep wet off the floor...this is the kind of advice you have to appreciate. Order is expected to arrive UPS in 3-4 days.
--Kathy
thanks!
-Simon
Thank you for addressing this issue - I would be very interested in hearing the explanation. I believe it would benefit the group if you have the time to post it here, otherwise, my email address is:
fudd2be@frontiernet.net
and I will post it.
Thanks,
Howard
I have a suggestion for the longer explanations you may have, which I think are very valuable to many Crew members.
Go ahead and post the explanation, then click on the number of the post, and make it hidden. That way, it doesn't take up space, but those who want to can read it.
Just make sure the title says something like "Steering rack noise" or "Brake Pedal Adjustment". I think this is where you can add the most value, actually. The brakes are definitely an FAQ.
Simon: I change the oil myself and have posted instructions here. You can order Subaru OE oil filters from Darlene for just $4, shipping included. That includes a filter and a new drain plug gasket.
You can always use Jiffy Lube, though. They may not replace the gasket (ask), but I haven't myself and have not had a problem. I will in the future, though.
The dealership will surely use OE parts and so you'll get the best service and the new gasket, plus they can address any other minor issues you have under warranty. It may cost a bit more, so it's worth checking first.
-juice
I just use the Page Down key, the scroll bar page down function, or an IntelliMouse thumbwheel to skip past the stuff that doesn't interest me.
Okay I confess: I read it all, I just can't help it!
..Mike
..Mike
-Colin
Mike - as long as the title is descriptive, I think it's better to have it hidden vs. not posted here at all. Though I don't mind weeding though the long message myself (yup, I read it all too...).
So post it and hide it or just post is all, so long as you post!
-juice
I've had much better luck with dealerships, and the price really isn't much different -- but the dealerships just take sooo much longer to get such a small task done that, simply to save time and hassle, I've kept being tempted to gamble that, this time, Jiffy Lube wouldn't blow it this time, a gamble I've lost the roughly 50% of the times I had to make a return trip.
It's been a while since I have written. I have been lurking but, waiting for the right time to write. After receiving and driving my New 2001 Forester for a week, I can honestly say that now I know what all of you were bragging about! I am in love again! The new 01 has not hesitated nor do I have any rear hatch wind noise or rattles. The brakes are much better but in my opinion still on the low side. Which I was told before is normal?????? Needless to say, I am happy that I took the chance and asked for a replacement vehicle at my hearing. I guess it's true what they say "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" The dealer has been treating me so well,I know we will have a great relationship in the future. Anyway, The new baby is just sooooooo nice, I have to go out and shine her up now.
As for the Brake problems that you have been discussing. I too had the same complaint with my 99 forester, I had several cleanings and the recall work done. I still thought they were way to low for comfort. My pedal, when fully depressed would be like a little womans thumb nail away from the floor! Normal???????? I don't thinks so!
Karen
Karen: I'm jealous. I forget, did you get the moonroof? Motorweek compared it to the Texas sky!
I believe the brakes have a dual stage booster. Tap lightly, and it stops slowly but smoothly. This is for smooth stops, but it takes getting used to. You have to step on it to brake hard, though it's effective once you do.
Car & Driver's early test of a Forester S actually yielded the shortest stopping distance of any SUV they've tested. It was in the 160's, where most SUVs have trouble braking (pun intended) 200 feet!
Still, the problem is the feel of the pedal. A firmer pedal would be more reassuring.
-juice
-Colin
If anyone does this, make sure the lines are bleed thoroughly. You really don't want to mix two kinds of brake fluid. Is it colored different so you can tell the old fluid is out?
-juice
It's bright lime green. The old stuff is kinda yellow. You can get it all out by opening a bleeder and stomping the pedal and then manually moving it when it won't return on it's own. Fill up the reservoir and do it again. Now it's purged enough for a street car.
BTW, you can mix DOT3&4 fluids. Mixing silicone fluids with glycerin ones is the big no-no.
-Colin
We have a new 2001 S-Plus Forester, White, and love it except for a being annoyed by something "loose" in the rear interior of the car.
I've emptied the trunk, etc. and satisfied myself that it's not in the driveline or suspension.
My guess is either (1) the overhead seat belt reel (for the 5th rider) or (2) the hatch itself have a loose fixture of some kind. It sounds like a coin in an empty box, if we hit the slightest bump.
I saw nothing resembling this noise "surface" yet
on these boards. We are taking it back to the dealer, looking for any group advice before tearing things apart.
Bill & Terri Kok