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Comments
When's it going to snow?
Only major problem was the cd changer needing replacement.
Still think its a great looking car, black is a tough color to maintain, wish I has a little more power, think there is too much vibration and roughness and I hate the split on the front bumper that makes it look like its falling apart. I do miss my Forester, too, though I think I would have tickets by now, the super responsiveness made me too aggressive.
Regard all, Vince 14
Enjoy the ride.
Craig
My latest nit to pick is the rocker panel aero cladding. Not sure I wouldn't like the car better without it. Anybody know how it is attached? Are they glued in addition to the fasteners? Also, if I add the Borla headers will I void any part of my warranty?
Thanks again... this is a great board.
Bitman
We now own a 2000 Legacy GT. We bought it with a stick not so much for power as for fun to drive. And it is. We love it.
Bitman
Unless you need or really want more power, you're just wasting money at the pump.
If you can, try a test drive like Bitman's--ideal.
Mary
Ed (a/k/a lark6)
-mike
Actually that would be going back to the past. Subarus throughout the 80's and into the early 90's had dual range trannies. They went away for North America but the rest of the world still has them. I imagine they'll come back to the US if there's demand and market.
-Colin
Bitman
bit
That Impreza wagon photo was too small to tell much, but it does look sporty rather than boxy and functional. Oh well, I can always pack light!
Ross - nice photos! Were you tempted NOT to wash it, to get comments from bystanders?
Brian - congrats and welcome to the Crew. You'll soon be praying for snow like the rest of us, and contemplating a move to Buffalo
Low range? I may have wished for that out loud. The ST-X had it, plus 8.5" of clearance, so to me that sent a subtle hint at where they could go. It would make sense for the Outback and Forester to distinguish them from the Legacy/Impreza models more.
Bitman: the fender flares are attached with a combination of two-side tape and a few bolts, so the rocker panel molding may mount in a similar fashion.
evernden1: if you find the Outback underpowered, don't forget to look at the GT. It has smaller diameter tires to give it a 7% edge in gearing, plus it's lighter. While Outbacks have been clocked at around 10 seconds to 60mph, the GT in Autoweek's fleet hit 60 in 8.7 seconds. That's faster than their Passat 4Motion V6!
-juice
The GT wagon is actually heavier than the OB wagon... The OB Wagon Ltd is 50 or 100 lbs heavier than the GT wagon, but those glass rooves kill the GT Wagon's weight.
-mike
Let's see, the brochure lists the Outbacks from 3415 to 3565. The GT is 3440 to 3505, so they overlap, with higher-end GTs having a slight advantage.
7% is plenty in gearing, though. It makes up for about 200 pounds.
-juice
I am a new forester owner from Australia. Our cars are different to yours. We can get the mother of all WRX's here too. If anybody is interested just say so.
It brought our first child home from the hospital in a foot of fresh January snow in Sandpoint, Idaho. When it was but a few months old it crawled down the walls of the Owyhee River Canyon in Eastern Oregon to go bass fishing. It pulled my full-sized father-in-law and me right up out of that canyon, nice and easy. It has traveled 400 miles in winter storms on mountain roads. It has faced down a cow moose and her calf on a deserted logging road in northern Idaho. It has taken me skiing all around the Northwest and pulled our little fishing boat out of Coeur D' Alene Lake, Hayden Lake, Lake Pend O'Reille, and Priest Lake countless times.
The most expensive shop bill was a little over $600 (twice). The majority were under $300, usually for the timing belts, which gave out religiously at 60,000-mile intervals. It only left us stranded once, in the middle of the night, on the Highway 95 shortcut outside of Grangeville, ID. (Thank you to the owners of the farmhouse in the middle of nowhere for being home and having a phone!)
I had been looking to replace it because my body (not hers) had deteriorated over the years and didn't fit like it used to when it was new and I was young. I don't imagine the extra fifty pounds (mine) helped much either! A little over a month ago I pulled the driver's seat out and drilled new holes for mounting the seat to the track. It gave me almost 2 more inches of travel. What an incredible difference!
But days later I found a beautiful ‘99 Bonneville that was too good to pass up. Very comfortable and befitting my daily commute from Vancouver, Washington through Portland, Oregon. It was too late. I had gone too far down the car-shopping path.
There was still some hope for hanging on to my beloved Subaru. You see, we then had three cars and we agreed to put two up for sale and see which one sold first. A ‘93 Aerostar and my 'ru. Both clean and well priced. We put an ad in the paper. Within days the Subaru sold to the first caller.
I think it went to a good home. I agreed to give it a fresh coat of wax if the new owner would let me keep it just for one more weekend. I am confident that it will have no trouble hitting 300K if they give it the same care.
During my car search, I found this forum to be by far the most helpful, and the community of Subie owners to be by far the most devoted to their cars. I learned several interesting things. My soob had the old 1.8L engine, which was the only other knock against it. It just wasn't conducive to entering the freeways on my daily commute. But it did have the dual transfer case which I absolutely loved and I understand is not currently available. I would love to see that come back. I also have been intrigued by the rumors I've seen here about a possible six-cylinder HO engine in the future, perhaps around a 3.0 L? Now if we could just get a little more travel in the driver’s seat for us 6 ft. and up types.
I must say that new Subarus carry a bit more relative sticker shock than they did when we had our first. It will be a while before we'll be ready for that again but I'm a true 'ru believer and I know the economy experienced over the years of ownership. (I don't think my Aerostar has had a repair bill UNDER $600.)
We do plan to replace the van soon and I am slowly working on my better half to try to get her to drive an Outback or a Forrester. I know we can't go new but we are also not in any particular hurry so I will keep lurking here and keep my eyes out for those first lease returns of 3.0L HO Sube's with the dual transfer case.
My apologies for the length but I knew that only Sube owners would understand the bittersweet (dare I say horizontally-opposed) feeling of a new car in the driveway, a wad of cash in your hand and watching your trusty ol' ru drive off in the arms of another.
May the road rise up to meet you and your 'ru.
DS.
I dread the time when I have to part with my 92'Loyale... it was my first ever brand new car, and it still (100k) runs great.
Strangely, acceleration improved over time, and now I have no trouble merging or going steep uphill with A/C at highest (4th) setting. No repairs to speak of, just maintenance.
Also strange, neither me or my hubby has developed ANY attachment to Accord EX that replaced 93'Loyale...
DS: great story. I'm sure in 5 years you're going to wonder why you ever got rid of ol' faithful.
Accords have no character. They work like a good fridge, but how many of us become attached to an appliance?
My cousin sold her '88 Loyale, but at least she replaced it with a '99 Outback. Plus, the loyal old friend was sold to her nephew.
Still runs great, BTW.
-juice
I really have loved the Forester for a while and like the facelift.
Never owned a subaru and would like comments on the long term reliability, initial impressions of other forester buyers, etc
thanks!
ps-looking through some of the posts, its nice to come across a civil message board!
Old Subarus are like family members that way.
You won't forget them. When you depend on
something this long......well, lets just say
we appreciate them.
So you too are enamoured by the S Premium, with that gargantuan moonroof. I can't blame you, I also like the monotone look and the face lift.
I have 29k miles and have only been to the dealer a single time, and that was for a recall. I've done only oil changes and tire rotations so far.
I compared it to:
Passat - fun but less utility
Accord - snoozer
CR-V - slow and tippy, pass the dramamine
RAV4 - too small to be useful, a bit slow
Durango - back breaker ride, gas guzzler
Outback - didn't seem as fun as Forester
So I chose the Forester and have no regrets. It's fun to drive, economical (26.4mpg since April), and offers plenty of utility (roof rack, trailer hitch just added, big cargo area).
We have one baby and a nanny, so the four of us have plenty of space. Big families are probably better off in the Outback.
Check out my home page directory for plenty of photos. You'll find that few people are as enthusiastic about there cars as the Crew.
-juice
Here is my trailer hitch and bike rack. I chose this because I can still use the roof for cargo, plus I could rent a small trailer if needed.
Hmm, how about a pair of jet skis to go with the hitch?
Also, here is my rear differential protector. This was the easier of the two to install, though I'm happy with both. The metal is impressively thick and sturdy.
The hitch and bike carrier are sold seperately, so it'll cost you more than the roof carrier, but it's also more versatile. The rear diffy skid plate is just $55 from Darlene and I'd recommend it to everyone.
-juice
I just got my 2001 Forester S auto two weeks ago. So far I love it! Shopped around and compared it with a lot of other vehicles and chose the Forester.
I have noticed the "click" when my auto trans shifts from second to third sometimes. I understand from reading some earlier posts that it is the transfer case changing the torque distribution front to rear?
I ordered the hitch mount bike rack and some other goodies from Darlene on Friday. I had the hitch installed at the dealer.
Anyway, just thought I'd drop a line and introduce myself. This is my first Subaru and I hope it proves to be a good vehicle.
manual (dual transmission) stop drooling fellahs we only have 2.0 litre engines and no LSD. no pics as yet.
#720 dzartman: Check out SoAus's website following. all models of available aussie soobs are here.
http://www.subaru.com.au
I didn't see where the hitch would differ, though. The mounting point are pretty far back. Who told you that, centavo?
So, you get the low range, but the 2.0l engine? Probably because fuel costs more there. That way you get good efficiency, but enough torque when you need it with the low range.
Mark: welcome to the Crew. You were smart to get the hitch from the dealer - I have scathed knuckles to prove it!
You'll like the bike rack. It folds out of the way nicely, so you can access the cargo hold. It secures the bikes better than I expected, too, and should not cause any wind noise. The only con is it blocks the rear view a bit.
If it's easier for you, just e-mail a photo to me and I'll put it up on my site for you.
-juice
Sales Month in 14 Years...(Subaru of America) Subaru of America, Inc. (SOA)
announced record sales figures for the month of July. Subaru recorded a
sales total of 15,041 units for the month, an increase of 14 percent from
the same period last year. Subaru continues to post strong sales increases,
with year-to-date totals of 98,392 units, up 15 percent from 1999
year-to-date totals of 85,478 units. This marks the company's best July
total sales month since 1986.
One of the interesting features of the magazine was an interview with three original Subaru engineers who were responsible for designing the Forester. A couple of interesting tidbits of info:
- The Forester development team came directly from the Impreza team (not suprisingly)
- The development of the Forester actually started before the RAV4 and CR-V hit the market (it wasn't a me-too concept as often perceived)
- Apparently, LOTS of thought went into the 7.5" (200mm) of ground clearance. The engineers felt that this was the optimum height to trade off on-road and off-road performance.
- The EJ20 turbo engine was the first choice of powerplants but it was tuned for mid-range torque to better match the Forester's softer suspension.
- The 2.0L N/A engine was offered primarily for the European market. The low-range was specifically added for this engine to allow the driver to be able to have access to torque at all speeds.
- The biggest challenge for the US market, according to the engineers, was to tune-down the exhaust note on the 2.5L engines. They apparently had to play around a bit with the exhaust to get the sound down (wonder what it did to performance?).
- The AT shift pattern for the US was detuned so there would be less up/down shifting. Again their market research indicated that US drivers dislike AT systems that change gears too often.
i didnt realize there was so much off-road optioning on it (diff. sikd plate,etc) and the price! what a steal!
i own an xterra also, and love it but i have to say this board is so much more open and friendly.
i'll give my test drive impressions soon!
thanks for all the info
Cool info, Ken. I remember the Streega concept that preceeded the Forester (anyone else?). Subaru often has ugly concepts that look much better in production, the opposite of most car companies. I like the ST-X right off the bat, but the Fleet-X and Forester Woody hurt my eyes.
I'll bet they looked at the Explorer and Blazer, which had the highest volume when the Forester was being created. They managed to match the higher SUV's ground clearance while maintaining a low center of gravity. The handling was what sold me on the Forester, especially compared to the RAV4 and CR-V. I'm glad they fought over that.
The 2.5l has tons of potential. Maybe that silencer box up front does subtract a couple of ponies. Remember Mitsubishi's variable exhaust noise on the 3000GT? Too bad it didn't help power any!
-juice
monotone -- any thoughts on other extras? Am working with a nice dealer in Omaha -- Stan Olsen Auto-- will let you know the price,etc.. mel
Premium package: YES, PLEASE! That moonroof is SWEEEEET! You'll be envied, trust me. The side air bags are a plus, and I really like the monotone (but not the gold accent wheels). For the price of the package, it's the best deal Subaru offers period.
-juice
juice: yes our juice is expensive by comparison with the us (as high as 60 cents us per litre) compared to europe we get ours at givaway prices. you would need three jobs over there to run a bicycle let alone a car
I think two-tone schema makes sense only of cladding/bumpers are unpainted (like on L), for practical reasons. I was in doubt about monotone schema myself but it grew on me, and now I'm happy I got S+ not S.
from what I've read here -- <<
I really love the premium sound system in my 2000 Legacy, but I've never had a high end car audio system before, either original or aftermarket.
maybe truthful in a sense... i would (am) actually only consider the forester. to me it makes sense practially, economically and yes, emotionally it is just cool!
seems like it is just as powerful as the outback- same engine? the forester is an even better deal then.
i did notice the back seats were pretty tight...any feedback on longer trips?
just love that car. We live in the mountains of Tennessee and I have already had a chance to test it out in the snow. I was amazed at how well the car performed in the snow. I have a 4wd truck and the GT felt more stable and handled better that my truck but the car has already developed chips in the paint on the hood. I do not know it is just real world driving or is it a problem with the paint.
Altogether I added:
-- cargo cover
-- security system
-- cargo net
-- air filter
-- armrest
-- exhaust pipe cover
-- autodimming mirror-compass
-- tweeters
btw, floor mats are included in standard price.
I did not care for faux wood trim, in fact, I hated it, so I passed on it. I'm not an audiophile (mostly listen to books on tapes), so I passed on premium sound, but added tweeters in case I listen to music.
I found cargo net VERY VERY useful, in fact, I don't know I lived w/o it before. No more Coke bottles rolling around on the back.
I don't know if tweeters made much difference. Sound is OK, but could be better, so if you're audiophile, go for premium sound.
Mirror-Compass was fun for a while, but novelty wears off quickly. I did not get a chance yet to test its autodimming quality.
Security system just came in the package, but it gives me a little bit of peace of mind (Subaru is no longer the least stolen car in US)
I ordered armrest because w/o it center console looks kind of unfinished, plus it gives me a nice little storage area.
As for leather seats, I wanted them but decided to pass on it for now. The reason: every single dealer told me that leather on S+ is not factory installed, but they (dealers) contract leather installation to some local shop. In fact, they get S+ with normal upholstery, rip it off and install leather. I felt bad about good upholstery going to waste.
I decided I will run the car with upholstery as is for a while, and if I later find fabric deteriorating, I'll replace it with leather from the same local shop that dealer uses. BTW, cheap upholstery on my Subaru Loyale'92 is still in great shape, although the car was never garaged, and fabric never got treated with any protecting coating.
Another and most important reason was that I did not trust local leather shop will install leather in a way that would not adversely affect side air-bags mounted inside the chair. Since side air-bags was important part of my decision to take S+ over L/S, I decided not to take the risk.
Hope this helps
--Kate
I'd be cautious about reviews. We bought Accord EX in 1997, lured by raving reviews, and we're not really happy with it. On the other hand, we bought cheap Subaru Loyale in 1992 which never got any good reviews in both handling and reliability areas. Guess what: 100K problem-free miles later, it handles great, and with puny 1.8L engine easily outruns many more powerful cars on the road.
personal likes and dislikes being the main focus.
If you look at several reviews from several sources, you will generally see a wide range of results. At best they give some ideas of what to look for on your test drives. If you don't find the minuses noted in the reviews that important, discount that part of the review. I wouldn't make a decision on any car based on someone else's likes or dislikes.
-Colin
I find the magazines' long-term testing to be the most useful -- finding out about quirks and long-term livability is really useful.
Randy