Subaru Crew - Modifications II

bonnie_rick

your discussions from Subaru Crew - Modifications
(Topic #16) here!

Bonnie Rick
Conferences Manager, Edmunds.com Town Hall

aussieroo

first

gus

miksmi

hehe, Gus, you're cheatin with the time zone difference! ;-p

..Mike

paisan

I will have to check on the weight, thought the manual said 2500, but I'll check it. Yes the XT6 was expensive. (Sticker of 19,500 in '88!!!) It's only 145 horses though so the impreza should be speedier...

-mike

paisan

Well carpoint has something screwy on their pages... In 1988 they have 4 cars listed:

XT coupe
XT 4wd coupe
XT6 4wd
XT6 4wd turbo

The XT6 4wd is 2795lbs, the XT6 4wd Turbo is 2865lbs.

Now in '88 there were:
XT Fwd
XT Turbo (1.8l turbo) Fwd
XT Turbo 4wd

XT6 Fwd
XT6 4wd

The XT6 never came in a turbo model.

I shall research some more and find out my results.

-mike

lucien2

19mm is a good place to start. I am running a Whiteline18-20-22 bar set to 20mm on an otherwise stock OB, and am very happy with it. It did very well at the track. IF I had a GT with lower sidewalls, better COG, stiffer suspension, etc., I would consider bumping it to the 22mm setting, but I don't so I won't. 20mm is just about perfect for what the rest of the OB setup can handle, given it came with 18mm stock. Start with the 19"; it won't be a radical change, but you'll feel it. After you take a driving course or two you may want to adjust up...just make sure your significant other knows, or there could be a nasty surprise on a slick exit ramp one day!

ateixeira

You mean 19mm, not 19". You don't even have enough clearance for a 19" bar! )

XT6 4wd Turbo? Best kept secret?

-juice

paisan

Maybe I should do that, slap a TT on the XT6, then it would really have some zig! My mechanic and I are actually trying to find some rear performance shocks for it right now for when we do the air-suspension conversion, we are not having much luck

-mike

ateixeira

I guess that's the catch with a fairly rare car. Few are familiar with it, plus aftermarket parts are hard to come by.

Bummer.

-juice

ramon

I didn't know the XT6 has all those luxo crap too. heheheh.... I guess it ain't that light after all huh?

paisan

It's a very mis-understood car! Even @ 2800lbs, an H6 under the hood, and a slush box, it's pretty speedy. I gave the Impreza guys who had sticks, rear bars and upgraded tires a run for their money @ auto-x. After I complete the suspension conversion, and put Juice's 15" rims with some good tires on and a K&N filter it should be in much better shape! Did I mention I love that car? I really need to take a pick of the front or back with my AWD 4ME NY plates on it and send it into Drive mag.

-mike

originalbitman

Thanks for all the input.

Lucien - I think the rear bar on my GT is either 15 or 16mm. Is the OB 19mm?


bit

lucien2

Stock OB is 18mm. I guess 'cause of the height.

ateixeira

Really? That surprises me. Not bad for OE.

-juice

PS You ought to play with the settings in a snowy parking lot, to see at what point oversteer appears

gedwards

I am interested in knowing which companies are producing anti-roll bars, strut tower braces, and other suspension and go-fast goodies for Subarus (in particular the Legacy GT). I already know quite a few, including STi of course, but am always interested who else is out there.

You can post names (and websites if you have 'em), or email to me directly at [email protected]

Thanks!

Greg

originalbitman

Greg -

Cobb Tuning just started carrying the Whiteline adjustable rear sway bar for 00+ Legacys:

http://www.cobbtuning.com/main.html

bit

ramon

We have a spy here guys. Don't tell 'em. He'll tell Subaru to not honour the warranty on out sway bars. ;-)

I notive you're from Subu of Canada. Mississauga branch?
Anyways companies that makes 'em : FHI, JC Sport, MRT, Cusco, is whiteline adjustables from MRT? anyhow those are the ones I know...
errr.... I've been doing my routine oil change at a Subaru dealership sir yes sir!!!

ateixeira

Here is the bible:

http://home.earthlink.net/~gndiamant/subaru.htm

Look under parts & service, then americas. There are dozens of vendors.

SPT sells sway bars for the Impreza/Forester, but I'm not sure about the GT.

-juice

lucien2

Oh, we got oversteer, but only in a turn with throttle lift and/or brake input. The car feels very controlled and communicative right now, very stable, with less oversteer. I think going to 22mm without additional upgrades elsewhere will make the car too tail happy. It really feels very good right now.

Sway bar suppliers:

www.spdusa.com
www.cobbtuning.com
www.rallispec.com

to name a few.

dzartman

One thing I've seen at Cobb's site but have heard no feedback on are the Borla headers. Anybody heard results on this mod? What kind of power gains?

Dave

locke2c

The Borla headers definitely boost torque in the mid rpm ranges and taper off a bit at high rpm (probably because of the design).

However, there are several folks on the iclub that have gotten check engine lights related to the first oxygen sensor after installing the new Borla header.

I can't recall anyone getting this with the original design, and honestly I haven't followed the threads too closely because I'm not going to buy one.

-Colin

dzartman

Thanks, Colin. Just curious...since you do Auto-X, why aren't you in the market for the headers, if you don't mind me asking? Not enough gain for the buck?

Dave

originalbitman

I found Trey Cobb to be very generous and straight forward with information. If you haven't done so you might email him regarding his experiences with the new Borla header.

bit

locke2c

I'll second Bit's appraisal of Trey...

Dave-- that's exactly the problem, not enough gain for the buck FOR ME. I presume you've seen the pictures of the new Borla header, and have seen the factory setup up close and evaluated them. I could probably find pictures of both if necessary, but for now I'm just going to describe the problem.

Neither the original nor the new Borla header has equal length tubes. This is important because it keeps exhaust pulses evenly spaced, allowing better flow and low turbulence. (That's an overly simple explanation but oh well.)

The header is designed to mate to the stock catalysts, which means it terminates facing directly towards the right side of the car, and then the catalysts are curved to not-so-gently bend towards the rear of the car.

To me this is an unacceptable performance loss, and if I'm going to bother to replace the stock header, I'm going to get one that does it right even if I have to replace my defective stock catalysts. (Federal law says you can't replace a working one, therefore mine are failing.) MRT in Australia sells an equal length header that also utilizes a single straight high-flow catalyst, and thanks to the strong US dollar / weak AUD, I can get it cheap.

I wouldn't dare attempt this in California, it would surely fail a competent visual inspection. It's perfectly fine in Kansas though.

Anyway, the fact is that the Borla header does offer an improvement over the stock header and it probably does the best it can while connecting to the stock catalysts. If those things are important to you, which they would be for most normal people, then I'd say the Borla header is a good product.

-Colin

dzartman

With a few deletions and additions, plus dammit I don't have Juice's page.

MANUFACTURERS and RETAILERS
------------------------------------------

JAPAN

http://jprova.co.jp/index.html
One word: Sweet.

http://www.syms.co.jp
SYMS parts--site needs updating

http://www.zerosports.co.jp
Excellent Japanese Subaru parts

http://www.rd-tanabe.com
Tanabe exhausts homepage--great Outback wagon exhausts here!
U.S. distributor listed below

http://www.poweraxel.com/sti/catalogue/legacy/index.html
Japanese-parts importer

http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/contents.html
STi homepage

http://www.axa-int.com/link.html
Importer of Japanese performance parts. Get your Japan-spec parts here
-----------------------------------------------------------
U.S.A.

http://www.qsubaru.homepage.com/
DARLENE! DARLENE! DARLENE! Best prices and customer service!

http://www.writerguy.com/primitive
Oregon-based fabricator of high quality parts,
mostly for Impreza/WRX/RS, some Legacy/Forester

http://www.spdusa.com
Good 2.5RS/WRX parts source

http://www.spomotorsports.com
SYMS reseller and aftermarket

http://www.cobbtuning.com
Texas-based with nice tech pages and good products--upcoming cold air intake TBA

http://www.challengerdeep.com
Japan Subaru parts reseller and aftermarket

http://www.mackinindustries.com
U.S. distributor of Tanabe

http://www.quicklink.net/bham/paeco/home.html
Paeco makes flywheels, camshafts, pulleys for Subaru and other makes

http://www.subaruparts.com
Discount Subaru parts from Tacoma, WA

http://home.cdsnet.net/~zastava/products.html
Oregon-based performance Subaru fabricator

http://www.stromung.com
Very nice mufflers w/chrome tips designed for Impreza and OB

http://www.flatlinemotorsports.com
Subaru performance in Irvine, CA

http://www.eliteone.com/
Various performance parts, tires, etc

http://home.att.net/~teaguesauto/
STI, Cusco and genuine Subaru parts and gear, updated regularly

http://autocaresubaru.com/
Scorpion lift kits(!) for Forester, STI, Cusco, more

http://www.bpmsports.com
Subaru performance

http://www.rallispec.com
Loads of cool Subaru performance parts

http://www.junusa.com/products.htm#SUBARU
Impreza parts

http://www.subysports.com/
Recent newcomer to Subaru performance, has SYMS

http://www.jcsports.net/
strut bars, nice exhausts, decent prices
-------------------------------------------------------
OTHERS

http://www.minnamracing.com
Canadian shop--turbo specialists and other perf. parts
Still in business?

http://www.whiteline.com.au
Performance suspension products for Subaru

http://www.mrtrally.com.au/
Aussie-based, rally oriented, good parts

http://www.japaneseparts.com
Japan-only parts? Find them here

-----------------------------------------------------
U.K. based Subaru shops

http://www.powerengineering.co.uk/index.htm
U.K.-based tuning and products for WRX Impreza

http://www.blitz-uk.co.uk/subaru.htm
Blitz product specialists

http://www.grahamgoode.com/
Subaru performance for Impreza

http://www.tdi-plc.com/Subaru_home.html
Subaru products for Legacy, Impreza

http://www.sleeze.co.uk/subaru.htm
Another UK-based shop-WRX and Impreza

-------------------------------------------------------------
LINKS and OWNERS PAGES

http://www.impreza-rs.com/
Hell of an Impreza site

http://www.imprezawrx.org/
More Impreza fanatics

http://www.cars101.com/subaru_links.html
Many many links--SVX, XT, all Subaru models!

http://www.new-impreza.com/
Impreza madness

http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/m.hunt/subaru/subaru_main.htm
U.K. owners page

http://www.ifeng.demon.co.uk/scooby/index.html
Read this for excellent Impreza/WRX info from a U.K. owner

http://www.toad.net/~rrubel/outback.html
Outback page by an owner

http://members.aol.com/Emily23PG/index.html
Murasame's page on the 2.5RS

http://importcars.net/subaru/
An owners Impreza RS site, with a great section
of pics showing how to install parts

http://www.trunkmonkey.com
Interesting

francophile

Dave, AWESOME compilation. Thanks for sharing it.

Cheers,
-wdb

ramon

Ever thought of compiling this entire list to a webpage and then post the link to that page? Great job however for collecting all the infos.
Check out : http://home.earthlink.net/~gndiamant/subaru.htm

I thinkit has EVERYTHING Subaru related pretty much. It's my Subaru directory really.

originalbitman

I did a quick post of Dave's links to my web site. Dave - if you object please let me know an I will pull it. Thanks for the great list regardless.

Dave's Links:
http://bitman.com/sooblinks/


bit

e_l_green

Well, I finally got my first add-ons for my Subaru Forester: the front air deflector and the rear window dust deflector. The front air deflector is the one that was on backorder while they came in on a slow boat from Australia.

Anyhow, the front one goes on pretty easily, using a couple of clips and some bolt-on clips that come out from under the hood. No drilling required. The rear dust deflector is a different story. It requires drilling, and also requires being able to shove some inserts into the rear hatch with a special tool. You're also supposed to slather the holes with rust inhibiter. I'm going to let a dealership do the install, I'm not up to the hassle.

Question: How much should a dealer charge me to install this thing? Has anybody else had one installed on their Subaru Forester? How much did the dealer charge? I know the install would take me several hours, but most of that would be because I've never done it before and would spend half my time rummaging through the toolbox trying to find the right sized drill bits etc. as well as running out to the local AutoShack for some rust inhibiter. I'd suppose that somebody who's done it before could probably do the install in less than an hour...

-E

locke2c

Wow, I killed that header discussion quite nicely.

;-)

-Colin

ateixeira

Eric - I'd figure about 1 to 1.5 hours of labor. Your dealer's rates should be available, maybe even posted.

Headers would be a pain to install. You're talking about working in a tight spot with likely rusty components that are rigid and may be hard to line up. All that work and $400 or more for 3 or so horses?

I'd try the pulley first. Then a cat-back and/or intake. Just seems more cost effective.

-juice

ateixeira

Dave - the latest URL for my directory of directories:

http://subarucrew.homepage.com/juice4/page4.htm

-juice

locke2c

Juice, I believe the Borla headers are worth a lot more than 3HP. In fact, CobbTuning's "Cobb Tuned" 2.5RS claims some 192HP with an underdrive pulley and Borla header. Having installed one, I doubt the pulley is a significant amount of that claimed gain.

-Colin

ateixeira

Holy Cow, the stock exhaust must be pretty restrictive. You sure they didn't also swap out the rest of the exhaust?

Now that I think about it - you have to get two of them, right, one for each bank of cylinders? I'm sure the price is much more than I thought.

-juice

dzartman

No problem at all on posting that list to any web pages, the more the better! Heck I need to add it to MY Subaru page--click on it for some offroad action. You'll need Flash 4. Thanks Juice for your URL, and Ramon and everyone else too. They're all added in!

Dave

http://www.wave.net/diveguy/Dave

gedwards

Thanks for all the links and information.

I am not a spy. I know you all do nothing to void your warranties and have all your maintenance completed at Subaru approved facilities. If you would like to provide your VIN's I can confirm all this.

Thanks for the info!

Greg

ramon

hahahaha.... say I heard there's currently 2 WRXes in Subaru of Canada. One for autoshows the other for tech training. Would you mind giving a fellow Impreza lover and a Town Hall buddy a tour of the new WRX? I live in Mississauga too. C'mon!!! :-(

ateixeira

Yeah, the Crew could benefit from such, ah, "training"!

-juice

ramon

since i am in mississauga the same town as the HQ for Subaru of Canada, I guess I will have to sacrifice my time and effort to go for the "training" or seat time. and then relate to my fellow Crews what the new WRX is like. Ahh the things I do for my cyber friends....

ateixeira

That's a highly rated tire, too. There's one option.

-juice

ateixeira

Glad to hear you're willing to make that sacrifice for us...

-juice

amishra

well if Ramon gets to go, I should be in line next .. seeing as how I [used to] work down the street at GE Capital (across from the purolator building) from Subaru Canada's HQ on falbourne st.

(I used to prowl the Subaru parking lot during some lunch hours hoping to spot a 2K Legacy/Outback back in March-July of 2000. And finally after many trips I saw the new Legacy there, well before they arrived in the dealerships.)

-- ash

ramon

I already know that there's a blue sedan and a silver wagon at SCI. heheheh.... and a 360 in display.

ateixeira

Thanks Drew, Ken, and paisan. Finally ordered the E-codes for the Miata.

Had to shop around, but Ken Beard has the best prices by a long shot. $88 for the pair of E-codes with Xenon 55/60 bulbs, shipping included.

The stock lighting is PITIFUL. He said the new lamp assembly along give off nearly twice the light, so the new bulbs ought to help even more (it needs it!).

Prices were all over the map. I was quoted $130 just for the E-codes from one place! They had generic brands for $80 (no bulbs though). R speed was asking $95 plus $35 for bulbs.

It's good to shop around!

-juice

paisan

I've found Ken to be outstanding. Although I'm not sure if i'm gonna get my aux lighting from him. I've found some really nice lights @ overlander.com that incorporate an H4 90/110w bulb with an H3 85w spot when you put the High Beam on. Of course they are $350 for the pair with wiring harness...

-mike

aling

Glad to be of any help! I'm curious to know how much better (or similar) the E-codes are to your Forester's headlamps, especially since both will have similar (H4) bulbs.

Mike, that's interesting. I've very rarely heard of H3 spots when the high bemas are on. Are they supposed to be driving lamps to supplement the brights?

Drew/aling
Edmunds.com Townhall host

ateixeira

I'll get photos side-by-side. Ken said 3 business days, so that would be Tuesday or so. I'll try to get them on before I head off to Brazil.

The Forester got a small improvement, but the Miata desperately needs a BIG one. The OE lamps are just plain awful. Dim and scattered, is the best way to descrive them.

-juice

bg18947

With the ugly chrome grille on the US Legacies, I think they need either aluminum, chromed plastic, or black grill inserts. Does anyone know if they are available? I also think the radiator is quite exposed to damage by 65mph debris that will go right into the open grille. A polished aluminum mesh would probably enhanced the chrome grille you think?

ateixeira

paisan: those aren't lights, they're LIGHTS! Holy cow, you joining a search and rescue force or something?

BG: I bet you could make your own grille. People on Miata.net do that all the time.

-juice

ateixeira

Clarification: I mean for the lower opening, not the top grille.

-juice

francophile

For the '00 and '01 models:

Challenger Deep B4 parts

Challenger Deep Blitzen parts (dunno if you can get that grille separately)

Cobb Tuning's STI offering (again, dunno if the grille can be had separately)

Prova Parts front mask

There's gotta be more out there but I'd better get back to work!

Cheers,
-wdb