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http://baby.boom.com.hk/portfolio/research/Korea/KR_000270_050811.pdf
http://www.babez.de/kia/kia-magentis-optima.php (text comes straight from Kia press release.)
http://www1.autotrader.com.au/Mellor/Mellor.Nsf/story2/204DCEE055220C8FCA2571C50- 00AC6CE
https://shop.sae.org/automag/globalvehicles/11-2005/1-113-11-8.pdf (you'll have to scroll down a bit to find the info on Kia)
Maybe any further discussion on this topic should go to the Optima forum?
I believe interest in the SE manual trans will increase in the future now that gasoline keeps going up in price. If you drive them correctly manual trans cars usually can exceed the mileage that you get from auto trans (you don't have to be in gear when coasting or going down hills). A good reason why most Europeans prefer manual trans over automatic - their gasoline prices have been above $5 per gallon for many years now.
I am getting 40 miles per gallon combined city/hwy in my 2000 Mazda. Of course, I try not to exceed the speed limit by more than 5 miles per hour.
No, that's not going to happen. Automatics today are extremely efficient and in most cases equal (or beat) the manual version of the same car. The days of there being a big gas mileage advantage to manual transmission cars is long over. Couple the lack of mileage advantage with the fact 99% of us (including me now, sigh...) have to deal with the horrible mess known as rush hour traffic, and no one other than a sadist wants to drive in that with a manual transmission.
Manual transmission is a dying beast, and I think in 10 years it will be gone. Just not practical in this country. Too much road construction and traffic everywhere you go to drive manual. Plus hardly anyone knows how to drive a manual transmission in America. Driving schools don't teach on anything but automatic. I know the few manual transmission die-hards keeping hoping and praying for a comeback, but it's time to face the facts, they are never going to be popular here. Either move to Europe or get with the program and learn to enjoy driving an auto, because soon that's going to be your only choice.
I love the auto on my 09 Limited V6. It's so smooth, just like everything with the car. Three months and 3,300 miles into ownership and the car is still a treat to drive. It makes my new 20 mile commute in heavy traffic each way much easier to deal with. Especially enjoying my free XM trial (which ends at the end of the month). I will probably sign up for it when it ends.
For most American drivers (i.e., too preoccupied with the cell phone, the coffee, the makeup and/or the electric shaver during the daily commute), the automatic is easier, safer, and just as economical.
As a skilled and attentive driver, I prefer to have the choice. But I realize that you'd prefer that I and others of my type simply die off or "move to Europe." Someday you might win, but I would prefer not to have everything reduced to its lowest common denominator.
I don't think the act of driving an auto transmission automatically(excuse the pun) means someone is not a skilled or attentive driver. I grew up driving sticks but prefer automatics now. There are plenty of people out there that drive sticks that aren't skilled drivers and vice versa. Modern automatic tranny drivers are probably getting better mpg than a lot of manual tranny drivers and I think the fact that some EPA automatic mpg ratings are higher than the manual proves this out.
My point is that just because someone drives a stick doesn't make them a skilled, more attentive or frugal mpg driver automatically(there I go again
(1) Is there any way to make (or should) the interior lights come on when I use the remote to open the car doors at night? It seems unusual that when opening the car at night, no interior lights come on.
(2) What does the "Auto" selection mean on the headlight selector? (When and what lights does this cause to operate?)
Thanks.
There's some extremely nice ergonomics on the lighting and functions to make it automatic.
The auto function handles your standard headlights and turns them on and off automatically based on amount of ambient light. I always leave it in auto..which will be bad if I ever drive a crappy car without auto headlights
I like the idea of the "auto"function, but prefer to have the headlights "on" during the day, like daylight running lamps (for safety), so that's probably not the choice for me.
Thanks for the info.
Here is a link to a download of the 09 manual pdf:
http://www.hyundaiusa.com/images/owners/service/manual/2009_Sonata_Manual.zip
http://hmaservice.com/
does any one know if it has a timeing chain or belt. Do not see any thing in the mant.scheld. to check if its a belt.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Theta_engine
I did find the full-length international version of the 09 brochure if anyone's interested:
http://worldwide.hyundai-motor.com/dataPDF/e-brochure/sonatafl.pdf
Price wise don't think you can beat these cars. How do you like it?
I am about to pull the trigger on a 2009 Sonata limited 4 cycl and am looking at an msrp of 24,735, but will get for 20,745 plus TT&L. Is that not a good deal? I'm a little confused zbout what you said earlier because the invoice on edmunds is 22,589, and KBB is 23,284. I'm estimating TT&L to be about 1600 for my total cost to be $22,345. The dealer is making the hold back 680 on the car. Should I try to go lower, can I go lower? thanks.
Some dealers are offering more below invoice than that on Sonatas, so you can try to go lower. The dealer may say "No". But they may say "OK". Can't hurt to try.
any regrets on the car?
also, I'm not getting the nav system.
Most nondurables are marked up ~100% while durables at least 50%. Why should cars be any different?
1. Navigation System can be unreadable from sun glare, routing not very sophisticated, and can't add additional POI files.
2. Because of the large cabin size it has a big car feel when driving (cause I had a Grand Am)
3. Cannot see end when backing up (all cars seem to have this problem since the rear is higher than the front these days). Add a backup camera with the NAV system.
4. Would like trip computer to report current gas usage (does average). This could show good driving habits (and point out bad).
Piggybacking on the conversation regarding fuel economy differences between manual and automatic transmissions, I've noticed that it's becoming quite common for automatic versions of numerous models have EPA ratings higher than their manual counterparts. The Honda Civic with automatic gets 2mpg more on the highway than models with the manual transmission.
In reality, despite the EPA ratings, conventional wisdom still seems prove true. All other things being the same, a manual transmission will use less fuel than an automatic. I find Consumer Reports' fuel economy data to be far more reliable and useful than the EPA numbers. CR always manages to achieve superior numbers with a manual tranny.
I think that some auto trannies computers are just getting so darn good at shifting at the absolutely best rpm that is almost impossible for a human being to match it. Even considering the power needed for the auto and the extra weight.
I really hope that it is just not a difference in the testing as that would make it hard to really compare different vehicles using the EPA numbers.
Aside from that I love the car.
link title
The transmission is also shifting better as the mileage increases, and it is a fun to drive vehicle. Acceleration feels stronger compared to when the car was in its first 1500 miles (waiting to see what it does by the 15,000 mile mark). The Solus KH16 tires are doing better with age with regards to response and the wet traction is very good consisdering all the rainfall here lately.
The service department has been very friendly and professional except for one incident; they used 6 quarts of oil for my last oil change even though the owner's manual specifies 5.49 quarts ( approximately 5.5 quarts). I have been going back and forth with them and they are insisting that the 3.3L V6 holds 6 quarts of oil ( even though the reading on the dipstick is past the Full mark). I will be calling Hyundai corporate to get a definite answer because I know over-filling the oil is not good for any engine.
I am looking for a 2009 Sonata GLS automatic with no options. I have gotten some quotes in the $18663 OTD prices. Mostly it is in the $16500 to $17000 range before TTL.
Has anyone have any good prices quotes in the Twin Cities area and any experiences with any dealers around town?
Please let me know. Thanks.
it has to be very dark it seems for the lights to come on when you have them set to auto.
The trip computer buttons should be on the steering wheel controls, where they have them looks kind of cheap, but they are functional.