I will be in the market for replacement tires soon also. On my previous Intrigue I used Michelin Pilot XGT H4's. I've read reports that these tires don't wear well. Maybe the folks that had them didn't keep them properly inflated because I had mine 40,000 miles and they were still good. I live in the Mid-Atlantic states and it handled snow like a polar bear. Wet weather? I guess Accu-weather forgot to tell the car it was wet since it drove like the ground was dry.
The ride was a little firmer coming from the standard shoes. However, IMO, ride quality improved; handling and control were much better and steering inputs more precise. But then again, for what you pay it just out to handle better.
Overall I liked them but I too have been considering the X-One and SportA2. I'd sacrifice a smoother ride to have the handling and confidence in rain and wet weather I experienced with the Pilots.
For those that went with Sport A2's and Yokohama: Is there a good mix of wet weather "confidence" and ride comfort?
I'm driving an '03 Regal as a rental car this week, Brand new, fully loaded, leather etc. Quiet, smooth, well-controlled. Just like you'd expect a new Buick to be. The looks, however, scream "rental car".
As for the Impala, had one for a couple of days a few weeks ago - another rental. Typical Chevy, dependable and boring (except for the 'Vette!). Weird instrument panel with cheap materials, big gaps and exposed screw-heads. Very Chevy. Noone turned their heads as I pulled into the parking lots. I get to drive a lot of Hertz Taurus's, and frankly they are better handling, more nimble cars than the Impala, neither one turns heads, though. The Impala's brakes are a serious weak point, too. I noticed a lot more distance and effort required than in the Intrigue.
Oldsman - I seriously hope you consider ditching your car before the warranty expires, unless you've got an extended one. Any car, even a Kia, that has to go in the shop 3 times for a transmission problem, is a dog. Again, my '98 has been flawless except for the one-time ISS issue. Maybe you just got one built on a Friday afternoon!
I like the performance of the Maxima, too. But the looks are obviously Japanese to me. Nice driver, though.
I agree with you on the Impala, it really needs an upgraded interior and driving package. The LS models are a little better. The Regal is fine, I like it a lot. My big beef with it is the suspension which is too soft. I really hope the next Regal is Intrigue like as I know Buick could produce a hit if they tried. The 04 Malibu should be good and the 04 Grand Prix is promised to be good also. Who knows. It's a shame I can't just get another Intrigue next car because I would.
Given the 03 Saab 9-5 is priced only a few thousand more than my Intrigue was, I'd be tempted to pick up one of those if I was looking today. There are also great deals on leftover Aurora 3.5's in the local paper.
So I challenge you to get one Dindak. The only drawback is that it's not as quick with the added weight. The interior is sumptuous, the exterior is eye catching and handsome and if I remember right, the cabin was very very quiet. Plus, you get to stay in the Oldsmobile family.
If my car was stolen or totalled, I mite. Unfortunately selling almost any car (and more so a GM) after only 2 1/2 years is financial suicide these days. I will continue to enjoy my Intrigue for many years I think.
As car enthusiasts, I think we all kick the tires on a continual basis. So many new models on the way and only room/ money for 2 cars in the garage. Probably why I collect model cars.
You hit the nail on the head - the Regal does have noticeable "float". But it is comfortable and nicely detailed inside, although the console is a little disfunctional. And maybe it's the "Vanilla White" color that makes it seem so anonymous. I have a feeling GM will leave the float in the Buick, and focus on the GP as the choice for those who would have gone for an Intrigue.
Fortunately, (or maybe not) I rent a car almost every week, so I am getting to drive some of the '03's , so far, the Regal, Maxima, Altima, Taurus, Town Car, Camry, Grand Marquis (with a new independent front suspension that makes the steering feel tighter and the whole car surprisingly more agile than before) and the Chrysler 300. As well as some pretty hard-driven '02's - including my share of Intrigue's and GP's. Driving some of those can sure show you a lot about how they'll hold up under heavy use.
Watch what you guys say about my Impaler.LOL. Impala has 12" brake rotors on the front. The only wbody to have those. They are bigger than the Intrigue's with the Autobahn package.
noticeable difference in handling between base impala and LS Also 3800 has more torque and power than 3400.
i get all kinds of looks with my LS of course it is Navy blue metallic and has the 5 spoke aluminum wheels.
Just read in detroitnews that olds has greatly reduced the wholesale prices charged to dealers. Evidently a 36K Aurora can be had for 26K. So there is 3-4K in reductions given to the dealer that we can't verify from the regular invoice.
If they replace the entire transmission(as should have been done last time it was in)I won't worry as much, otherwise I'm with you about getting rid of the car before the warranty is up. Mine is covered until 60K so I figure I'll be ready for a new car by then anyway. I'm still looking closely at the 9-3 and CTS.
One of the things I learned in school is that statistics are relative, particularly depending on perspective. Here's one paragraph from that article as an example:
"Toyota, Honda and Nissan have led the industry in long-term dependability for years, and U.S. automakers have failed to close the gap, Brian Walters, director of product research, told Reuters in an interview."
Based just on this, buying a Nissan or Toyota will be problem free compared to a GM car. My sister-n-law had 2 Nissans that were pure junk. My brother-n-law has a Sentra that Nissan can't seem to fix. My sister-n-law's coworker had a Max with the same problems she had. My Toyota Camry was far from trouble-free. The engine mounts cracked, the car vibrated at stops for no reason, the door seals were a problem-- when it rained, I could hear the water from the tires like the window was cracked. My neighbor across the street had/has so many problems with her late 90's Camry that they hired a lawyer to try to get the dealer to buy it back thru the lemon law.
Remember, I said perspective is the key. I had a Lumina in '92 that was great except for one problem. Dindak hasn't had any major problems with his Intrigue so that he got another GM car. My problems with the Intrigue were minor and repaired early and never saw them again. So much so that I purchased another "problem" Intrigue. However, jgriff, b4z, and other have had problems that caused them not to go back to Olds or GM. So if I were writing an editorial, based on what I've just stated, my slant would be toward domestics--GM in particular.
Personally, I take surveys like JD Powers with a grain of salt; I use it as a reference but not as a guide. I think that those who have come to this forum and the other's on Edmunds before making a purchase are the wisest. Talk to people who own the cars you like (foreign or domestic) to find out what problems to expect. I bet most Toyota owners don't know that their V-6 engines have a sludge problem. If you can deal with it, buy the car. But people who make purchaes based solely on Consumer Reports, JD Powers and Edmunds run the risk of being greatly disappointed.
For nearly a decade now I've read so many conflicting reports about the quality of autos. US cars and closing the gap, Japanese cars are not as good as they used to be, now US cars have failed to close the gap, and so on. To me, anyone can write a review and skew the data to fit their agenda or side. Just look at the media during elections. As my Intrigue sits in a service bay while I write this, I do wonder that if Japanese cars are so flawless, why do their dealers have service departments. And why are those service departments every bit as full of cars as a GM service department? After reading so many different reports on cars and quality, I just don't take too much stock in any of them. One brand will claim they won somebody's initial quality award and another claims they won someone elses. To me, they are missing the whole point. If your trying to sell a car on what "quality" awards it has won, your not selling a very good(dynamically) product as a great driving car will sell itself. BMW certainly doesn't have to resort to advertising what quality awards they have won(if they have even won any) to sell 3 series in record numbers.
Well, my baby is under the knife as we speak. Took her in for the transmission problem this morning and gave them a very detailed explanation of the problem. The second item I had was the "flicker" and as I told the service advisor about it, he said it was probably the alternator. Wow, I was impressed. Hopefully it will come back with that problem corrected. Remember, this is a different dealer than the one I had it to last May which turned into a nightmare. When the service advisor saw what problems I had with the tranmission, he pulled a report from a GM database which had all the work done by the previous dealer and told me upfront that it will probably be several days for the car to be repaired. So he called Enterprise and had them bring me a rental car which will be paid for under the warranty since he didn't want one of their courtesy loaners out for several days. I haven't heard any diagnosis from them yet, but appreciate him telling me up front about the time frame. So thus far, I'm much more impressed with this dealer's service department than the last. If the car comes back to me with the problems resolved, then I will be pleased.
The rental I got from Enterprise is a Buick Century. It is CERTAINLY not an Intrigue in the performance and looks department, but it's alot better than the 95 LeSabre with 100K that I had for 2 weeks when the previous dealer was servicing the car. There is certainly some float, although it is not a wallow. The biggest problem seems to be the 15" wheels as they do not allow you to corner with any speed at all. The dash layout is very yesteryear as well. My old 1989 Oldsmobile Touring Sedan had a better designed interior than the Century does. But hey, for a rental it is not bad. Buick should really consider dropping the Century though and moving Century customers into a Regal LS as the Century screams AARP:) One drive in the Century and one really has to wonder why GM is dropping Olds.
We had a Century rental not too long ago. Very disappointing car, but it sells because it's a cheap Buick for older folks I guess. They just can't get rid of that car too soon though, it's very dated and embarrassing for Buick IMO. I would pay for a Regal upgrade anyday.
My baby is injured (99 GL 3.5). She got hit last nice, twice (you can tell), by a bunch of joyriders who put her rear end up on the sidewalk. Dislodged a rear tire, bended both my wheels and pretty much messed up the whole left rear side, including the passenger door. Turns out, they had broken in to or damaged about 4 cars in my general area last night, with 6 cars being broken into the night before; likely the same people.
Well, I'm waiting for the claims adjuster and for the rental car "of comparable type" (Insurance co's words). My guess is I'm gonna get a Buick or a Chevy Impala or Malibu. I am interested in trying out the new Maxima or Altima, but when do those ever make it into a rental fleet? Well, I'll get back to you with my thoughts on whatever I end up with.
One last thing, my next-door neighbor saw the 7 or 8 teens exit one property, cross the street and enter another property, exit the property and saw the direction they ran (I stepped into the house for a sec). The cops showed up 30 seconds later, were given directions and STILL did not catch one person. Not ONE. They took their time going down the block. So much for serving and protecting.
One problem with all the information provided by J.D. Power & similar publications is that they do not do a well enough job of describing and discriminating the types of defects they have in cars. For example, a Camry may have squeaks and rattles in the interior (a minor but irritating problem) whereas a Focus may have a design defect which may cause it to spontaneously combust. Are these simply counted as equal problems on a tally, or are the problems weighted appropriatly against their possible consequences?? It seems there's a lot a room to fudge between the two types of problems-- minor vs. major.
Incidently, my 3800 powered 98 Intrigue now has 101K miles, & is still going strong. The only problem I have had is to replace a fan motor in the dashboard for the AC/heater. Not bad for so many miles. My headlights do flicker a bit during nighttime startups, but once you get rolling everything is fine-- low beams, high beams, and everything inbetween. As long as everthing functions, I am happy. I especially love pulling away from my supervisor in his puny little 1998 323ci Bimmer when we are at stoplights. His car has 35K miles and practically lives at the shop-- related to various electrical problems. I digress----
Anyway, my workday is over-- everyone have a great weekend!
Thats pretty good to hear that your at over 100K now without too many problems. And weren't those 98 models the ones that were supposed to have so many problems.
I'm interested in getting a used 98' or 99' Intrigue in the next year or so, based on the terrific experience I've had with my grandmother's 99' GX with the 3.8. Going used, and in the first two model years is because of price, and thus, a low mileage car isn't always that easy to spot with the right price. With you having 101k on the clock, what's it like to drive? Looser? Feel or hear any clunks? The interior materials worn? What about rattles?
You mentioned things that have gone on issue wise, but I'd be curious to hear about a few other things.
I had a Malibu a few weeks back for a rental. It was not a good experience. I did not want to crack the hood open to see what motor in it, it was so disappointing.
Disappointing because when I returned it, Aleros were being returned by the minute (mostly bright red and blue-green) that I probably would have appreciated more. I would say 60% of the lot I could see was Alero or Malibu.
Just want to jump in here and say that my '98 Intrigue (with Autobahn package) is at 65K and running great! Only problems ever were warped rotors (replaced under warranty) and ISS rattle (lubed and no further problems). Only parts replaced for wear and tear have been front brake pads, tires and power takeoff belt. The car is absolutely rattle free. What I like best about the car is the front seat room, auto temp control and 3.8 engine/transmission performance/reliability.
...is an '02 Aurora 3.5. I flew from Oklahoma City to Dallas earlier this week, and then from there to Tulsa. The only way back to OKC was to rent a car and drive, and when I showed up at Avis to get my "full-size" sedan, there was the Aurora sitting in my space. I'm keeping it throuigh Saturday night, so I'll be back later with a 300 mile test-dirve report.
Initial impression is that the Aurora carries a bit too much weight for the 3.5. It does seem to strain it a bit compared to the Intrigue. I can only imagine what the 8 would be like...
Thanks everyone here for the intelligent conversation. These folks over at the Maxima board are jumping down my throat for saying it's dumb that the Maxima doesn't have illuminated steering wheel buttons. I gotta say that it sure seems like most people that post here really know their stuff and I sure appreciate being able to have an intelligent discussion.
For all the problems my Intrigue had, I still miss her. LOL. And guess what? My Maxima is going to the dealer sooner than my Intrigue ever did. The Check Engine Soon light has come on!
I installed some splash guards and that was easy. Replacing the "In-Cabin Microfilter" wasn't. You have to remove the entire glove box to do it. LOL. I think now that I've done it though, it'll be easier. This one is supposed to be washable and thank goodness! It's $49 to replace!
OKC? I live near Arcadia (east of Edmond). The 3.5 Aurora I drove seemed okay, but, as you say, you can tell it's in a heavier vehicle than the Intrigue. The V-8 Aurora I drove was great. Power is intoxicating! That's why I bought a 01 LS1 Formula... imagine a car the size and weight of an Intrigue with 100 more horsepower! WooHoo. Now on the to bad news...... Lights starting flickering again (alternator last replaced by dealer in Feb. of 01) on our 99 GL 3.5 about a week ago. Went to have dinner with Mom last night, and it got REALLY BAD on the way back. So bad that just having to go up a slight hill caused the headlights to dim dramatically until we topped the hill and let off the accelerator. The first one (alternator) took 3 or 4 months to get this bad. This one (3rd alternator in 4 years) went from fine to very bad in only about 2 weeks. Called O'Reilly's auto parts this morning... $228 for a lifetime warranty replacement and they can have it by 2:15 this afternoon. I definitely want a lifetime warranty on this particular part. It's going to be a real pain to install, though. You have to remove the fans, drain the radiator, remove the lower radiator hose, remove the lower idler pulley and only then can you remove the alternator. When the dealer fixed it, they had to keep the car an extra day because their moron tech damaged the radiator pulling off the old alternator! I guess this is going to be an every-other-year event for an Intrigue owner. Of course, in 72,000 miles, I have only spent $235 in repairs... even replacing the alternator myself, I'll still be under $500 for the first 75,000 miles. Glad I didn't pony up that $1,100 to extend the warranty to 75,000 miles. I'd still be out $600 and would be at the mercy of the "professional" mechanics that seem to be all thumbs when they work on MY vehicles. I wonder if this alternator will be any different than the first three that it had. We'll see.
My 3800 Intrigue was manufactured in April 1998. I bought it in May 1999 as a program car with 32K miles. I had a RF radio frequency 6 disk CD changer installed in the trunk after I bought it. At the time, I had a long comute to work, which racked up the miles. When I got married two years ago, I moved closer to my job, which has reduced my yearly mileage considerably. I intentionally bought the 3800 over the newer shortstar because my typically GM buying family has cars with different versions of the 3800 from over the past 11 years-- all with virtually trouble free high mileage. My parents have a 91 Park Avenue with 160k miles. The Buick's interior is cheap as sin, but MECHANICALLY she is sound and shows no sign of stopping anytime soon. I knew the 3800 was proven. It also has pretty darn good performance capability say from 0-70. Above 80, it does start to run out of steam, as the 3800 is not a high reving motor. Its forte is low speed, kick you in the butt--- beat the other guy to the next stop light--- torque. I love it !
On the Intrigue, I have had brake jobs done on the front & rear end within the last year and a half. I have had the transmission fluid changed a couple months ago, even though the maintenance schedule technically did not call for it. The spark plugs were replaced at 90K, as I was concerned about siezure if they remained until 100K. As a matter of fact, today I had the engine/ radiator cooling system flushed. While they were at it, they replaced the main upper & lower radiator hoses and installed a new thermostat and a new set up wiper blades. My philosophy is that if you do not maintain your car with good preventative maintenance, you are asking for it. I will most likely stick in a new battery in January. I change my own oil & filter every 3K. I put in new air filters every 20K, as pollen in NC in spring can clog it up. I also install my own belt every 60K miles. I get my tires balanced and rotated every other oil change at a local warehouse club. I last got a nice set of 85K Uniroyal tires (s=rated) for around $270 back in January. They ride and handle quite nicely and quietly. My wife refers to the passenger side grab handle as her "Grip of Death," as I tend to attack corners with much ferocity.
Fact is, the 3800 is obscenely cheap to maintain. If you take steps to service it regularly, it will run quite a long time. Although I get 30 mpg on the highway, I bounce around 18-23 mpg city depending upon how heavy my lead foot is (i.e. most of the time.)
Problems have been few. The climate control fan motor in the dashboard died at 70K and was replaced. I had the inside driver door panel tightened after some incredibly stupid kid at church decided to hang-- legs up--- from the driver door near the tweeter assembly. That incident was clearly not the car's fault. The fog lamps to me are for style only, as they really do not put out that much light. The car does have some minor squeaks and rattles which become aparent mostly in cold weather. (Show me a car with a 100K miles that doesn't have this and I'll sell you beach front property in Idaho.) My car has had no problems with the steering. Brakes too, except for usual wear & tear.
I do love the outlay of the dashboard. It is made of nicely padded materials and is easy to read. The automatic dual zone climate control was a bit fussy at first, but is easy to use once you learn how. To my wife, the dual zone temps are a Godsend, as she likes it warmer than I do. However, I hate the cupholders, as they are too shallow. The single cupholder that pops out in front of the console is one of the few things about my car I utterly despise. It feels just plain dinky. The fixed cupholder which is on the far end of the consule in front of the shifter is OK, but still too shallow. Aggressive cornering results in rolling pop bottles. GM did some obvious cost cutting in the plastics used on the doors. The doors "breath" when opening and closing a window. They are not loose, nor do they rattle. It's nothing bad, mind you, but it does feel somewhat less than as substantial as it could be. The plastic around the power window buttons is also a little cheap. But, the control stalks around the steering wheel feel solid and substantial. To me, these minor issues are just that-- minor. My car rides quite nicely, yet can tackle corners with great eagerness. It has every bell and whistle I would want, except for a sunroof and maybe leather interior. I wish I had the tan interior instead of the light grey. The white exterior is also a major pain in the butt to keep clean. The car's alloy wheels still look great.
I love the style of my car, with its clean, sculpted flanks. (To me, Japanese and even some German cars look too generic. ) I love the fact that my Intrigue offers a great balance of space and utility, performance, highway fuel efficiency, ride, handling, inexpensive maintainance, and high equipment levels for the money.
Do I regret this purchase? Absolutely not. Do I love my car? That's a definate YES! Are there things that GM could have done better? Obviously, yes.
Am I dissapointed that GM killed Olds? Yes. Given this fact, my car will depreciate at a faster rate than normal. Hence, I am motivated to keep her running for a very... long... time... as I will never be able to trade her in for very much, so I may as well drive it until it drops... I think I can get 200K out of her... then, we'll prolly get an Accord, as the wife seems enamoured with new redesign.
When my supervisor's BMW 323ci automatic starts beating me between stoplights, then I'll worry
Sorry this post was so long, but I was in the mood to type...
Just a quick note to all who have cooresponded here with me and been so great a help over these last three years. Two weeks ago I was laid off from my Telecommunications company (rhimes with "loose" and "cent"), after 23 years. Our plan is to relocate to Las Vegas, Nevada near family within the next several weeks. Looks like I get to use the many great freeways out there, like the 215, to really open the Intrigue up (non rush hour of course), as its those type of roads where the 3.5 LX5 really comes alive. Should be eaiser to keep the car clean out there too, as opposed to Chi-town. I alos hope to shift to non-all season tire eventually, picking up some improvement there it's hoped. Obviously out there the traction control will find less use, except perhaps when going up to Mt. Charleston in the snow it gets. Anyways, I'll stay involved here form there, ...."Viva Las Vegas!"-ketch
Sorry to hear about your job, I am very familiar with your company as my company(also based in Chi-town) uses some of their switches. Aside from the actual telecoms that have gone belly up, I think their suppliers are really feeling the crunch the worst as many of our vendors are not in good shape right now. I hope things go well for you in Vegas. I know you'll enjoy the drive there:)
I've been driving the Century now for 2 days and I know why I typically just drive my own personal vehicle when I travel. Simply put, I would not want to drive this car on a long trip. I attempted a quick passing move last night that I wouldn't have though twice about with the Intrigue and I soon remembered I was not driving my Intrigue. I had to floor the accelerator to get some serious passing power and even then, it still was lacking. Off the line it has decent power, but above 70 mph it is dead. Reminds me of my old 89 Olds Touring Sedan which had the old series I 3800 V6. Make a quick lane change at 70 and unlike the Intrigue, the Century starts to feel queasy. And the seats are more like lounge chairs. My girlfriend thought they were comfy, but she's one of these people that likes to recline a car seat back pretty far whereas I'm one who likes the seat more upright with good support. Now, there are some good qualities to this car. First off, it is very quiet inside. Other than when I had the gas floored, you hardly hear the engine although I guess that is intentional as unlike the Intrigue, you DON'T want to hear the Century's engine. The ride is also smooth, although that is at the cost of handling. The Buick does have a couple of nice extras the Intrigue does not. One is a 90 second headlights out delay. Pull into a dark driveway at night and turn the car off and lights stay on for 90 seconds, just like they do on a Cadillac. Simply turning the headlamp switch on and off will immediately shut the lights off. Another neat things is the automatic door locks will relock if the doors are unlocked while in gear. Say if you drop the misses off in front of the mall, if she uses the power unlock switch to unlock and get out, the doors will immediately lock when the door is closed. On the Intrigue, you would have to manually hit the lock switch again. Also, the Century has a dome light in the center of the car. This in addition to the other courtesy/reading lights makes the interior much more visible at night. On the minus side is the trunk release switch is a yellow button in the glove box(just like my 89 Olds had) and the graphics on the instrumentation are very low rent looking. For the price, the Century offers alot of neat features, driving enjoyment just isn't on of them. With cars like the Century, Taurus, and Camry selling in such large numbers, I guess the bulk of the driving public isn't interested in driving pleasure.
bravedave- Thanks so much for the very detailed response, it only further makes my point. I actually am quite familiar with the "breathing" door panels and terrific 3.8, both of which are from the 99' GX I'm used to driving. It's been quite trouble-free too from what I've asked, the only problems ever being a leaking oil pan (3 tries, but now fixed) and a single chrome window molding that came unglued. When I last drove it back in August, it still had the stock GY Eagle LS's, and they were almost bare with 30k miles. Last month, he said he put 4 new Michelins on the car, so I can't wait to see what it's like now.
oldsman- Detailed a 00' Century with 50k miles back in June. Not a bad car, but really not great. Of course, the one I cleaned was beige metallic over beige cloth (yuck!), and a "Century 2000" model. Rode well and was very quiet, and quite comfortable, but even at low speeds I could feel the lack of much cornering grip and power. Overall, I liked it somewhat, but nowhere near as much as the Intrigue. That, and it was horribly filthy, because the owner (a lady in her mid-late 30's) said she never liked the car, so she just ran it through the car wash once or twice a year.
My Intrigue was a 2000 GX, Forest Green, Mocha interior. Still brings a tear to me eye to talk about her and I still miss her.
The Nissan service advisor said "the Intrigue is a nice car but nothing like the Maxima." I didn't have the energy to get into an argument plus I want a good relationship but I sure hate it when people get all foreign elitist about automobiles. At least he knew what Intrigue was.
I replaced the ugly racer boy taillights with red ones and it looks amazingly better. Also installed some splash guards and replaced the cabin air filter (a job that requires removing the entire glove box). The interior definitely has a more solid feel than my Intrigue and higher quality plastics but it has one or two minor rattles. They even have TSBs for em which really made me feel like they care a lot about the little things (can you imagine if GM had TSBs for rattles? LOL).
All the controls on the Intrigue were much more intuitive. But I don't miss the cruise button on the dash. I do have to say that I don't think the new Intrigue radios are as intuitive as the old ones (though they look better) and the auto climate controls are not at all intuitive. Give me a plain GX HVAC control anyday.
LOVE the trip computer on the Max (outside temp display, distance to empty, mpg [24mpg if you can believe it!] and trip timer) but hate that the steering wheel buttons are not illuminated at night.
I sure miss the perfect in your hands feel of the Intrigue steering wheel (again I'm talking of the non-leather wrapped GX). It just felt right... perfect heft, beefy. The Maxima doesn't feel like that and the steering is overboosted.
It's odd that Edmunds complains about the SE suspension being harsh. It's sure a lot softer and nicer ride than the Intrigue was.
We had our first snow this evening, didn't accumulate but was enough to find out these tires are really crappy. They are Potenza RE92s. Now I dunno why the Potenza RE950s are so much better but they are. Unfortunately since these are 17 inch rims, it costs a minor fortune to replace them. The Dunlop Sport SP A2s are a lot cheaper so I'm going to try and find a dealer that carries them. Don't think they come in my OEM size though (225-50-17). Relish that you can get cheaper tires with the Intrigue's OEM size (225-60-16). Aquatreds aren't even available in 17 inch sizes.
jg28 : Hope the Max gets fixed up ok. I love the illuminated steering controls. I was so happy that our new Alero had them also as I was not expecting them in a lower end Olds.
vcjumper : I tested a Malibu when we bought our Alero as they were about the same price. The Malibu is ok, but the suspension is soft and the interior is strange to me. Although the Alero's Ecotec has 30 less hp, it doesn't seem any less peppy, especially on the highway. The new 04 Malibu loos good though!
brave dave : Wow, 100K. thats great. We plan on keeping our Intrigue for about 5-6 more years and I am confident it will still be running well then. We have about 54K kms on the car now.
Yeah, the "import attitude" gets on my nerves. I'd of probably tested the service advisor's knowledge of the car, but I'm always up for a good debate:) I'm surprised the Maxi doesn't have illuminated steering wheel buttons, afterall the Japanese cars are supposed to be so ergonomically superior according to all the reviews. After driving a Century for a couple of days, I've come to appreciate the Intrigue's "proper" ergonomics.
Nope , no job yet in Vegas, but have been looking there for some time (they do not like if your out of state) and have many contacts. Sold the house here in 6 hours for asking price, and flew into Vegas 2 days later, found a house there (Henderson NV, green valley ranch area). We move mid December. The Intrigue goes in the truck, and I drive the minivan, 2 kids, wife, and 4 pets to Vegas in 4 days, 9 hours each day. Ugh! DO check your limo driver folks if your ever out there, it could be me, ask for ketch (and tip big).
Got a call about noon today that my car was ready. Transmission problem was the line pressure solenoid. They also replaced the alternator and lubed the steering shaft. Thus far, the tranmission has shifted properly but the test will be tomorrow morning when it is cold. Time will only tell if the flicker is cured once and for all with the new alternator. As for my squeak in the steering column area, it is not as bad but I can still hear it when I turn the wheel very sharply in one direction. So I may have to take it back for that, but hopefully the transmission problem and flicker are history. I was impressed with the fact that they did all of that in just a day and half. I'll be even more impressed if everything is corrected. Will keep everyone posted.
Ok, so here we are at 948 miles, and two (very) minor problems have started to crop up. Yet to have a new car where something hasn't happened in the first couple of thousand. Anyway, I figured I'd see if they are familiar to anyone...
-Some sort of rattle in the rear right pillar, seems like its coming from where the roof meets the rear window or something like that. It only happens over bumps and rough roads, and its more of a vibration. Annoying because 1 (I'm obsessive) and 2 (it sounds like it would be SO easy to fix if I could just figure out where its coming from)
-the button that advances or reverses what track you are on for the CD (aka the seek/scan button) stopped reversing...you can advance a track but you can't go back a track. Odd. Its the same unit I had in the Alero and I didn't have any problems.
So, if these sound familiar to anyone, do tell. I figure when I go home for Xmas I will have the local dealer take a look, nothing urgent. Everything else is great, gas mileage went from 13.9 to 16 and this tank looks like another improvement (I drive HARD city only, as I said before) brakes feel broken in and have better grip. Seems like everyone is down on the tirs, mine has the PCS package Eagle RSA's--whats wrong with them? Is it only the LS's that people are complaining about? They seem to be quite good to me, certainly one of the higher end tires Goodyear sells.
ketch : Vegas is a very interesting town. I was there a couple of years ago and enjoyed it a lot (and I'm not a gambler). I hope things work out for you there.
oldsman : Hope you are all fixed up now and can enjoy your car. I still have to get my alternator fixed this winter before the warranty runs out. I'm waiting till the very end.
My GL just got towed Monday morning, and I've got my rental, a Pontiac Sunfire. Enterprise didn't even have a "comparable size" vehicle for me to borrow. I'll just say that the thing sounds like it would die on me if I push it too hard. The engine is underpowered (pre-ecotec), sounds rough and I swear it hits 2000 rpm before it starts to move. The tires are in bad need of a rotation. There is the standard cheap plastic interior, but it does have a CD player with the volume able to change with road noise, something my GL does not have (but it's a 99). This disparity in the two interiors is amusing in a way. Trust me, I will upgrade when I get the chance.
Haven't heard that complaint in about 2 years. If the sound you are describing is a vibration then I think I know what it is. There is a thin piece of plastic that is used for the transistion between the headliner and the door ring. It basically hides the ends of the headliner. This piece of plastic wraps around the door ring. mine vibrated at the top. I finally figured it out when I went over a steel deck bridge and reached over and put pressure on it. The noise stopped. I am very tall. So you may not be able to do it while you are driving.
Replaced the alternator on my 99 GL 3.5 Saturday afternoon. Took me about 3-1/2 hours to complete the operation. Had to remove the air intake box, electric fan assembly, battery and tray, overflow tank, belt, idler pulley, upper engine support strut, both reinforcing struts, under-nose trim and spoiler, and front upper wiring harness. All that just to GET to the alternator. It then comes out with about 1/8 inch to spare. Not a fun operation, but I figure I probably saved at least $200 by doing it myself. Plus, I didn't damage the radiator like the Olds tech did (!!!). I think we better plan on replacing these alternators every 30,000 miles or so on the 3.5 cars. Whatever is causing them to deteriorate has never been addressed; just replace the affected part until the warranty expires then it's not GM's problem anymore. Not that uncommon a technique in this business. BTW, heard that GM is going to continue to build the current Malibu after debuting the new one. It will be sold to fleets and rental agencies only; will be called Chevrolet Classic. Same thing they did when the new Impala came out; continued to build the Lumina for fleet sales for a while.
What brand of alternator did you buy? What kind of warranty does it carry?
Malibu Classic is indeed what the car will become. They should just discontinue it, but I think they want maximum volume for consumers when the new Malibu arrives.
I agree, they're some fine tires. Not too expensive either, which is a good reason to replace the original ones with another set of the same tires. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.;^)
Popped the hood today to take a look and sure enough, there is a new alternator in there. No flicker last night, but as we all know, the flicker comes and goes. Time will tell. It does look like that removed alot of things to replace it. Transmission is shiting better not as well. I was looking at the service invoice and when they checked for codes, they found a P1811 which relates to the pressure control solenoid. Looking in the service manual, this code will set if the solenoid senses they the tranmission does not shift from 1-2, 2-3, or 3-4 within the specified time two times in one trip. Mine certainly wasn't shifting properly. Anyway, when looking at the service papers from my nightmare last summer at the other dealer(where they rebuilt the transmission) their diagnosis also listed this code, HOWEVER, no where in the work completed did it lost the pressure control solenoid was replaced. Maybe part of the rebuild included it, but I'm wondering if that has been the problem all along and the other dealer did all that work on the car when the solenoid was all that needed replacement. I'm still keeping my fingers crossed and I think that if I do have anymore transmission problems, I'm going to pursue the lemon law as I think that after three repairs, this would qualify as a lemon.
akitadog, what did yours have to be towed for? Knock on wood, but mine has never left me stranded. BTW, even my 01 doesn't have the speed compensated volume on the radio.
Comments
every 30K miles - fuel filter
every 50K miles - transmission fluid
every 5 years or 100K miles - coolant change
The ride was a little firmer coming from the standard shoes. However, IMO, ride quality improved; handling and control were much better and steering inputs more precise. But then again, for what you pay it just out to handle better.
Overall I liked them but I too have been considering the X-One and SportA2. I'd sacrifice a smoother ride to have the handling and confidence in rain and wet weather I experienced with the Pilots.
For those that went with Sport A2's and Yokohama: Is there a good mix of wet weather "confidence" and ride comfort?
As for the Impala, had one for a couple of days a few weeks ago - another rental. Typical Chevy, dependable and boring (except for the 'Vette!). Weird instrument panel with cheap materials, big gaps and exposed screw-heads. Very Chevy. Noone turned their heads as I pulled into the parking lots. I get to drive a lot of Hertz Taurus's, and frankly they are better handling, more nimble cars than the Impala, neither one turns heads, though. The Impala's brakes are a serious weak point, too. I noticed a lot more distance and effort required than in the Intrigue.
Oldsman - I seriously hope you consider ditching your car before the warranty expires, unless you've got an extended one. Any car, even a Kia, that has to go in the shop 3 times for a transmission problem, is a dog. Again, my '98 has been flawless except for the one-time ISS issue. Maybe you just got one built on a Friday afternoon!
I like the performance of the Maxima, too. But the looks are obviously Japanese to me. Nice driver, though.
Given the 03 Saab 9-5 is priced only a few thousand more than my Intrigue was, I'd be tempted to pick up one of those if I was looking today. There are also great deals on leftover Aurora 3.5's in the local paper.
As car enthusiasts, I think we all kick the tires on a continual basis. So many new models on the way and only room/ money for 2 cars in the garage. Probably why I collect model cars.
;-)
Fortunately, (or maybe not) I rent a car almost every week, so I am getting to drive some of the '03's , so far, the Regal, Maxima, Altima, Taurus, Town Car, Camry, Grand Marquis (with a new independent front suspension that makes the steering feel tighter and the whole car surprisingly more agile than before) and the Chrysler 300. As well as some pretty hard-driven '02's - including my share of Intrigue's and GP's. Driving some of those can sure show you a lot about how they'll hold up under heavy use.
because if you buy a 3rd car you are guaranteed to have one in the shop. It's Murphy's Law.
Impala has 12" brake rotors on the front. The only wbody to have those. They are bigger than the Intrigue's with the Autobahn package.
noticeable difference in handling between base impala and LS
Also 3800 has more torque and power than 3400.
i get all kinds of looks with my LS of course it is Navy blue metallic and has the 5 spoke aluminum wheels.
Evidently a 36K Aurora can be had for 26K.
So there is 3-4K in reductions given to the dealer that we can't verify from the regular invoice.
But for those prices (if one could get it at the new invoice) I'd try to squeeze into one.
JD Powers Results
"Toyota, Honda and Nissan have led the industry in long-term dependability for years, and U.S. automakers have failed to close the gap, Brian Walters, director of product research, told Reuters in an interview."
Based just on this, buying a Nissan or Toyota will be problem free compared to a GM car. My sister-n-law had 2 Nissans that were pure junk. My brother-n-law has a Sentra that Nissan can't seem to fix. My sister-n-law's coworker had a Max with the same problems she had. My Toyota Camry was far from trouble-free. The engine mounts cracked, the car vibrated at stops for no reason, the door seals were a problem-- when it rained, I could hear the water from the tires like the window was cracked. My neighbor across the street had/has so many problems with her late 90's Camry that they hired a lawyer to try to get the dealer to buy it back thru the lemon law.
Remember, I said perspective is the key. I had a Lumina in '92 that was great except for one problem. Dindak hasn't had any major problems with his Intrigue so that he got another GM car. My problems with the Intrigue were minor and repaired early and never saw them again. So much so that I purchased another "problem" Intrigue. However, jgriff, b4z, and other have had problems that caused them not to go back to Olds or GM. So if I were writing an editorial, based on what I've just stated, my slant would be toward domestics--GM in particular.
Personally, I take surveys like JD Powers with a grain of salt; I use it as a reference but not as a guide. I think that those who have come to this forum and the other's on Edmunds before making a purchase are the wisest. Talk to people who own the cars you like (foreign or domestic) to find out what problems to expect. I bet most Toyota owners don't know that their V-6 engines have a sludge problem. If you can deal with it, buy the car. But people who make purchaes based solely on Consumer Reports, JD Powers and Edmunds run the risk of being greatly disappointed.
Just my two cents :-)
No pun intended, right?
Both Buick and Cadillac did very well, clearly the better two divisions.
Well, I'm waiting for the claims adjuster and for the rental car "of comparable type" (Insurance co's words). My guess is I'm gonna get a Buick or a Chevy Impala or Malibu. I am interested in trying out the new Maxima or Altima, but when do those ever make it into a rental fleet? Well, I'll get back to you with my thoughts on whatever I end up with.
One last thing, my next-door neighbor saw the 7 or 8 teens exit one property, cross the street and enter another property, exit the property and saw the direction they ran (I stepped into the house for a sec). The cops showed up 30 seconds later, were given directions and STILL did not catch one person. Not ONE. They took their time going down the block. So much for serving and protecting.
Incidently, my 3800 powered 98 Intrigue now has 101K miles, & is still going strong. The only problem I have had is to replace a fan motor in the dashboard for the AC/heater. Not bad for so many miles. My headlights do flicker a bit during nighttime startups, but once you get rolling everything is fine-- low beams, high beams, and everything inbetween. As long as everthing functions, I am happy. I especially love pulling away from my supervisor in his puny little 1998 323ci Bimmer when we are at stoplights. His car has 35K miles and practically lives at the shop-- related to various electrical problems. I digress----
Anyway, my workday is over-- everyone have a great weekend!
You mentioned things that have gone on issue wise, but I'd be curious to hear about a few other things.
Disappointing because when I returned it, Aleros were being returned by the minute (mostly bright red and blue-green) that I probably would have appreciated more. I would say 60% of the lot I could see was Alero or Malibu.
Initial impression is that the Aurora carries a bit too much weight for the 3.5. It does seem to strain it a bit compared to the Intrigue. I can only imagine what the 8 would be like...
For all the problems my Intrigue had, I still miss her. LOL. And guess what? My Maxima is going to the dealer sooner than my Intrigue ever did. The Check Engine Soon light has come on!
I installed some splash guards and that was easy. Replacing the "In-Cabin Microfilter" wasn't. You have to remove the entire glove box to do it. LOL. I think now that I've done it though, it'll be easier. This one is supposed to be washable and thank goodness! It's $49 to replace!
Lights starting flickering again (alternator last replaced by dealer in Feb. of 01) on our 99 GL 3.5 about a week ago. Went to have dinner with Mom last night, and it got REALLY BAD on the way back. So bad that just having to go up a slight hill caused the headlights to dim dramatically until we topped the hill and let off the accelerator. The first one (alternator) took 3 or 4 months to get this bad. This one (3rd alternator in 4 years) went from fine to very bad in only about 2 weeks. Called O'Reilly's auto parts this morning... $228 for a lifetime warranty replacement and they can have it by 2:15 this afternoon. I definitely want a lifetime warranty on this particular part. It's going to be a real pain to install, though. You have to remove the fans, drain the radiator, remove the lower radiator hose, remove the lower idler pulley and only then can you remove the alternator. When the dealer fixed it, they had to keep the car an extra day because their moron tech damaged the radiator pulling off the old alternator! I guess this is going to be an every-other-year event for an Intrigue owner. Of course, in 72,000 miles, I have only spent $235 in repairs... even replacing the alternator myself, I'll still be under $500 for the first 75,000 miles. Glad I didn't pony up that $1,100 to extend the warranty to 75,000 miles. I'd still be out $600 and would be at the mercy of the "professional" mechanics that seem to be all thumbs when they work on MY vehicles. I wonder if this alternator will be any different than the first three that it had. We'll see.
On the Intrigue, I have had brake jobs done on the front & rear end within the last year and a half. I have had the transmission fluid changed a couple months ago, even though the maintenance schedule technically did not call for it. The spark plugs were replaced at 90K, as I was concerned about siezure if they remained until 100K. As a matter of fact, today I had the engine/ radiator cooling system flushed. While they were at it, they replaced the main upper & lower radiator hoses and installed a new thermostat and a new set up wiper blades. My philosophy is that if you do not maintain your car with good preventative maintenance, you are asking for it. I will most likely stick in a new battery in January. I change my own oil & filter every 3K. I put in new air filters every 20K, as pollen in NC in spring can clog it up. I also install my own belt every 60K miles. I get my tires balanced and rotated every other oil change at a local warehouse club. I last got a nice set of 85K Uniroyal tires (s=rated) for around $270 back in January. They ride and handle quite nicely and quietly. My wife refers to the passenger side grab handle as her "Grip of Death," as I tend to attack corners with much ferocity.
Fact is, the 3800 is obscenely cheap to maintain. If you take steps to service it regularly, it will run quite a long time. Although I get 30 mpg on the highway, I bounce around 18-23 mpg city depending upon how heavy my lead foot is (i.e. most of the time.)
Problems have been few. The climate control fan motor in the dashboard died at 70K and was replaced. I had the inside driver door panel tightened after some incredibly stupid kid at church decided to hang-- legs up--- from the driver door near the tweeter assembly. That incident was clearly not the car's fault. The fog lamps to me are for style only, as they really do not put out that much light. The car does have some minor squeaks and rattles which become aparent mostly in cold weather. (Show me a car with a 100K miles that doesn't have this and I'll sell you beach front property in Idaho.) My car has had no problems with the steering. Brakes too, except for usual wear & tear.
I do love the outlay of the dashboard. It is made of nicely padded materials and is easy to read. The automatic dual zone climate control was a bit fussy at first, but is easy to use once you learn how. To my wife, the dual zone temps are a Godsend, as she likes it warmer than I do. However, I hate the cupholders, as they are too shallow. The single cupholder that pops out in front of the console is one of the few things about my car I utterly despise. It feels just plain dinky. The fixed cupholder which is on the far end of the consule in front of the shifter is OK, but still too shallow. Aggressive cornering results in rolling pop bottles. GM did some obvious cost cutting in the plastics used on the doors. The doors "breath" when opening and closing a window. They are not loose, nor do they rattle. It's nothing bad, mind you, but it does feel somewhat less than as substantial as it could be. The plastic around the power window buttons is also a little cheap. But, the control stalks around the steering wheel feel solid and substantial. To me, these minor issues are just that-- minor. My car rides quite nicely, yet can tackle corners with great eagerness. It has every bell and whistle I would want, except for a sunroof and maybe leather interior. I wish I had the tan interior instead of the light grey. The white exterior is also a major pain in the butt to keep clean. The car's alloy wheels still look great.
I love the style of my car, with its clean, sculpted flanks. (To me, Japanese and even some German cars look too generic. ) I love the fact that my Intrigue offers a great balance of space and utility, performance, highway fuel efficiency, ride, handling, inexpensive maintainance, and high equipment levels for the money.
Do I regret this purchase? Absolutely not. Do I love my car? That's a definate YES! Are there things that GM could have done better? Obviously, yes.
Am I dissapointed that GM killed Olds? Yes. Given this fact, my car will depreciate at a faster rate than normal. Hence, I am motivated to keep her running for a very... long... time... as I will never be able to trade her in for very much, so I may as well drive it until it drops... I think I can get 200K out of her... then, we'll prolly get an Accord, as the wife seems enamoured with new redesign.
When my supervisor's BMW 323ci automatic starts beating me between stoplights, then I'll worry
Sorry this post was so long, but I was in the mood to type...
D.
Have you found another job?
Hope you have a good trip. The intrigue is the consummate road car.
jg28, what year and model was your Intrigue?
oldsman- Detailed a 00' Century with 50k miles back in June. Not a bad car, but really not great. Of course, the one I cleaned was beige metallic over beige cloth (yuck!), and a "Century 2000" model. Rode well and was very quiet, and quite comfortable, but even at low speeds I could feel the lack of much cornering grip and power. Overall, I liked it somewhat, but nowhere near as much as the Intrigue. That, and it was horribly filthy, because the owner (a lady in her mid-late 30's) said she never liked the car, so she just ran it through the car wash once or twice a year.
The Nissan service advisor said "the Intrigue is a nice car but nothing like the Maxima." I didn't have the energy to get into an argument plus I want a good relationship but I sure hate it when people get all foreign elitist about automobiles. At least he knew what Intrigue was.
I replaced the ugly racer boy taillights with red ones and it looks amazingly better. Also installed some splash guards and replaced the cabin air filter (a job that requires removing the entire glove box). The interior definitely has a more solid feel than my Intrigue and higher quality plastics but it has one or two minor rattles. They even have TSBs for em which really made me feel like they care a lot about the little things (can you imagine if GM had TSBs for rattles? LOL).
All the controls on the Intrigue were much more intuitive. But I don't miss the cruise button on the dash. I do have to say that I don't think the new Intrigue radios are as intuitive as the old ones (though they look better) and the auto climate controls are not at all intuitive. Give me a plain GX HVAC control anyday.
LOVE the trip computer on the Max (outside temp display, distance to empty, mpg [24mpg if you can believe it!] and trip timer) but hate that the steering wheel buttons are not illuminated at night.
I sure miss the perfect in your hands feel of the Intrigue steering wheel (again I'm talking of the non-leather wrapped GX). It just felt right... perfect heft, beefy. The Maxima doesn't feel like that and the steering is overboosted.
It's odd that Edmunds complains about the SE suspension being harsh. It's sure a lot softer and nicer ride than the Intrigue was.
We had our first snow this evening, didn't accumulate but was enough to find out these tires are really crappy. They are Potenza RE92s. Now I dunno why the Potenza RE950s are so much better but they are. Unfortunately since these are 17 inch rims, it costs a minor fortune to replace them. The Dunlop Sport SP A2s are a lot cheaper so I'm going to try and find a dealer that carries them. Don't think they come in my OEM size though (225-50-17). Relish that you can get cheaper tires with the Intrigue's OEM size (225-60-16). Aquatreds aren't even available in 17 inch sizes.
vcjumper : I tested a Malibu when we bought our Alero as they were about the same price. The Malibu is ok, but the suspension is soft and the interior is strange to me. Although the Alero's Ecotec has 30 less hp, it doesn't seem any less peppy, especially on the highway. The new 04 Malibu loos good though!
brave dave : Wow, 100K. thats great. We plan on keeping our Intrigue for about 5-6 more years and I am confident it will still be running well then. We have about 54K kms on the car now.
DO check your limo driver folks if your ever out there, it could be me, ask for ketch (and tip big).
-Some sort of rattle in the rear right pillar, seems like its coming from where the roof meets the rear window or something like that. It only happens over bumps and rough roads, and its more of a vibration. Annoying because 1 (I'm obsessive) and 2 (it sounds like it would be SO easy to fix if I could just figure out where its coming from)
-the button that advances or reverses what track you are on for the CD (aka the seek/scan button) stopped reversing...you can advance a track but you can't go back a track. Odd. Its the same unit I had in the Alero and I didn't have any problems.
So, if these sound familiar to anyone, do tell. I figure when I go home for Xmas I will have the local dealer take a look, nothing urgent. Everything else is great, gas mileage went from 13.9 to 16 and this tank looks like another improvement (I drive HARD city only, as I said before) brakes feel broken in and have better grip. Seems like everyone is down on the tirs, mine has the PCS package Eagle RSA's--whats wrong with them? Is it only the LS's that people are complaining about? They seem to be quite good to me, certainly one of the higher end tires Goodyear sells.
Thanks...
oldsman : Hope you are all fixed up now and can enjoy your car. I still have to get my alternator fixed this winter before the warranty runs out. I'm waiting till the very end.
My GL just got towed Monday morning, and I've got my rental, a Pontiac Sunfire.
Enterprise didn't even have a "comparable size" vehicle for me to borrow. I'll just say that the thing sounds like it would die on me if I push it too hard. The engine is underpowered (pre-ecotec), sounds rough and I swear it hits 2000 rpm before it starts to move. The tires are in bad need of a rotation. There is the standard cheap plastic interior, but it does have a CD player with the volume able to change with road noise, something my GL does not have (but it's a 99). This disparity in the two interiors is amusing in a way. Trust me, I will upgrade when I get the chance.
If the sound you are describing is a vibration then I think I know what it is.
There is a thin piece of plastic that is used for the transistion between the headliner and the door ring. It basically hides the ends of the headliner.
This piece of plastic wraps around the door ring.
mine vibrated at the top.
I finally figured it out when I went over a steel deck bridge and reached over and put pressure on it. The noise stopped.
I am very tall. So you may not be able to do it while you are driving.
BTW, heard that GM is going to continue to build the current Malibu after debuting the new one. It will be sold to fleets and rental agencies only; will be called Chevrolet Classic. Same thing they did when the new Impala came out; continued to build the Lumina for fleet sales for a while.
Malibu Classic is indeed what the car will become. They should just discontinue it, but I think they want maximum volume for consumers when the new Malibu arrives.
;^)akitadog, what did yours have to be towed for? Knock on wood, but mine has never left me stranded. BTW, even my 01 doesn't have the speed compensated volume on the radio.