Saw in the paper that there is questions being raised as to whether the Vibe will be built due to energy shortages in California. Is it really that bad down there?
Sham, shame, whatever! I am bitter! After reading previous posts and reviewing Pontiac's web page, it does not appear that the AWD version can be mated with the 180hp engine. Leave it to GM to screw up a good thing. You've heard it before, "if it sound's to good to be true....."
How long is the vibe from front to back? I can't seem to get an idea of the size from pictures. Is it like a VW Golf? Or more like the Focus wagon? I was hoping for like Legacy size. I would have also jumped on a 180HP AWD Auto tranny...
I, too, was hoping for an AWD GT model. The DVD navigation system is a nice touch though. The base model lacks power locks and windows, which means it should compete price-wise with the Jeep Liberty. Gas mileage should be very good--the Corolla's numbers are 32/41 with a manual tranny.
Update: I just got a gas mileage number from Cardesignnews.com. The base FWD model with an automatic gets 27 city, 32 highway. Sorry if this has already been posted.
I am really upset about this. I'm 33 years old and drive a VW Passat that I love, really. But I'm really looking for an "active lifestyle" vehicle to haul the bikes around, yadda-yadda-yadda and don't want to spend a fortune.
Then, I see the Pontiac Vibe and I have to say, I fell in love. I think it is simply beautiful. It is the first time in my LIFE I would EVER consider a GM vehicle, honestly. The promise of a great looking, small, wagon-like vehicle with AWD, 6-speed, 180hp, Toyota quality and a Pontiac Price has been making me drool for months now.
NOW I read the AWD only comes with the 130hp motor and Automatic!?!?!?!?! Can ANYONE explain to me why ANYONE would buy that model? I mean, lets face it, (particularly for Toyota) it's a joke. I might as well go out today and buy a Rav-4 right? After all, that's what a Vibe/Matrix AWD is right? A 130ish HP tall wagon. What's the point of this vehicle then?
I just don't understand GM, really. I give up. You would THINK that after the whole Aztek MESS they would hire some new marketing folks. The Subaru WRX Wagon is selling faster than they can build them but Pontiac thinks nobody want's a Vibe GT with AWD?!?!?! That's the main reason I was considering the thing! I am SO upset about this, really. I'm really upset. What the heck is WRONG with this company? I just want a White 2002 Pontiac Vibe GT with DVD and AWD. I can't believe I have to scratch this off the list. Very stupid move Pontiac. Apparently the Aztek marketing folks were transfered to the Vibe department.
squiredogs: I just got a Vibe brochure in the mail today. The information they list is 172" length, 70" width, and 62" height. Cargo capacity is 57 cubic feet with the seatbacks folded, 20 with them up.
I think it's strange that the Jetta wagon has 70 cubic feet of cargo room, but the dimensions are similar to the Vibe's. What does everyone else think?
The brochure layout seems eerily similar to another Ford model's debut... the Escort ZX2. They are touting the Vibe GT as the "hot Vibe" and the base/AWD models as the "cool Vibe." Uh-huh. I still remember the "ZX2 hot" and the "ZX2 cool." The power outlet appears to be a first factory feature for a production vehicle. I envision people complaining to their dealers when their hair dryer/space heater pops the overload circuitry. LOL! One more thing - kudos to Pontiac on the amber signal lights in the rear.
Funny how when you cross reference both Matrix and Vibe discussions you read what each thinks about the sheetmetal. Personally, I like the Matrix better in styling. The Vibe LOOKS like a Pontiac with the Aztec front facia and bottom plastic trim pieces protruding out.
This discussion is now linked across three different boards. As indicated in the title, you'll now be able to access this discussion through our Hatchbacks, SUV's, and Station Wagons Message Boards. Hope you enjoy discussing this new cross over vehicle with participants from these different message boards.
Is that with the passenger seat up, or does that number count the passenger seat folded forward? I ask because I am between an Aztek and a Vibe for my next car. I currently have a pathfinder, and I stick a 10' surfboard in with the liftglass open, so I don't have to climb up on top. a foot or two hangs out the window. I was hoping I could do that in the Vibe, but I was curious about the cargo capacity figures. I would wait until January if I could see the Vibe soon. Maybe I'll get out to one of the showings to get a better idea of the dimensions. I was let down about the 130 hp/AWD since I have to have AWD. Will the Toyota 130/AWD design at least move the Vibe as well as the 185 hp GM 6 will move the heavier Aztek? I don't know tech stuff like torque and weight ratio's, sorry...
57 cubic feet is with the front passenger seat up but the rear seats down. The 130 hp should move just as well (if not better) as a 185hp Aztec because it will be much lighter. I don't know if the rear glass pops open seperately in the matrix for the board to hang out. 10' fully enclosed may be tight.
That's pretty good. About the size of a Rodeo Sport with it's seats down. Yeah, I figured I wouldn't get the whole 10' board in with the hatch down. I can't even do that in the pathfinder. But if I can slide it in enough to drive 5-10 miles with a few feet hanging out the back, I may just have to pass on the Aztek and go for a loaded AWD Vibe. I think most of my GM points will still be fine by January. I was thinking that 130 hp for a vehicle a thousand pounds lighter might feel the same. Is there something to the Toyota technology ( the vvi or whatever) that would make the 130 hp feel like more? Thanks for psyching me up...
Something to think about for the Vibe hauling a surfboard, or kayak, or whatever. Because of its lower height, mounting this on a roof rack would be a heck of a lot easier than doing so on a Pathfinder.
has anyone been on the vibe site lately? pontiac is asking people to name each one of the colors of the car as part of a contest... cool prizes for the winners... worth checking out!
Is the Vibe about the size of a Forester? Or that Mazda Protege5 or the PT cruiser? I'm trying to get an idea of the 5 passenger seating. One website reviewer said "room enough for 5 REAL people" That would be sweet too. I occasionally (once a week) cart around 4 other people for 2-5 miles, and about once a month for 100+ miles trips. The rest of the time it's front seats only.
Gloom...not a bad name. Thanks for the link... I just checked out the Vibe contest and they've got some sweet prizes. What do you think of Arctic Ice for white or Eclipse for black? 56" TV for me if I win!
The Vibe and Matrix will be a little smaller than the Escape/Santa Fe/CRV, but larger than the Tracker/Sportage/RAV4. The drivetrain specs are the same on both. While they share some components with the RAV4 and Celica, the drivetrain (and platform) is actually taken from the new Japanese market Corolla (which adds a 1.5 and a 2.2l diesel). Only the standard 1ZZ-FE and the 1NZ-FE 1.5 with auto is available with awd, while only the 2ZZ-GE (180hp) has the 6speed (and only the 6-speed). The Jetta adds cargo space, but at the expense of people space. The sedan is one of the smallest cars available at the moment. I think only the Chevy Metro is more cramped. The Vibe and Matrix are more like the Mazda Protege5, more of a hatchback than a full wagon (there is a longer Corolla wagon in Japan). If you want more cargo space get a Focus, or wait for the Saturn Vue.
In the preview article on the Vibe, it says that the glass opens seperatly from the gate. It also will hold an 8 foot ladder (not a 10 foot surf board). They compare its overall size to the PT Cruiser. The article dosen't mention it but I believe it is not a reskin but a new platform for Toyota/GM.
I can live with 2 ft of board sticking out the liftglass. And my 7"6" board would actually fit all the way in - I'm pretty much sold! Hope the AWD is available right away - not the the Aztek launch... Anyone else able to confirm rear passenger space for three?
Maybe someone can explain to me the need for an all wheel drive Vibe?? Some people posted earlier saying that they'd only buy a Vibe if it had the 180hp engine and AWD. Why?? AWD vehicles are known to get lower gas mileage and are more expensive to repair. I don't think the Vibe has enough ground clearance for any kind of off roading, so that can't be it.
Maybe for winter?? I live in Southern Ontario, fairly close to Buffalo and I've never had any trouble with snow or ice. Granted, I don't try and take my vehicle (currently a 96 Cavalier) out when I see two feet of snow on the ground...
I really like the in-dash 6 CD that comes in the Aztek. I guess it will be the same in the Vibe. The GPS navigation system is new to me. Is it a video screen in the dash? Does it get covered when not in use? Can you actually play DVD movies or video games on it? Anyone who has a DVD GPS in their car know?
The person at Pontiac information line couldn't provide any information about pricing for the Vibe, even as far as comparing it to any existing car. She couldn't say when more information would be available. I'm hoping the 130 hp Vibe will be less than the Mazda Protege5, which I think is overpriced. Does anyone out there have any better information or guesses?
We are also very interested in the Pontiac Vibe as a likely candidate to replace my wife's '97 Mercury Tracer LS. All we know is the the car is scheduled to hit the showrooms on Jan 1st, 2002 or just about 6 months from now.
The Protege5 is another likely runner-up but the $16K to $18K asking price is a bit steep for s small 'economy' wagon. The first time I saw the Protege5 was while we were on vacation in Europe a couple of months ago and we really liked it but taught that the P5 will never make it to the US market...little did we know that Mazda was ready to launch it here at the time we were in Europe!
Based on the positive reliability experience we have had with her '97 Tracer (Which is based on the previous generation Mazda protege)we would not hesitate in getting the P5.
However, the Vibe seems to be a much more substantial and all around more practical vehicle. We also like the Toyota powertrain which is an added plus in our book but without the hefty Toyota surcharge.
I have read reports that the Vibe will be priced between $16K and $21K depending on configuration and equipment. Not a bad price if the Vibe is indeed a bigger or at least more versatile vehicle than the P5.
Anyway is nice to see that the local market is opening up more to 'Hot' sportwagon crossovers and possible to new hatchbacks from Europe and Japan.
We are current GM owners and so far have also been happy with our GM ownership experience (new 2001 Impala LS) so we are eagerly looking forward to the Vibe.
The Matrix sibling is nice but we prefer the styling cues of the Vibe better. The Toyota possibly will be much more expensive just because of the 'T' on the hood.
$16K - $18K would match or exceed Protege5 prices, unfortunately. Base MSRP for the Protege5 is $16,335; adding on destination, automatic transmission, tax and license pushes the car to over $19K. Even using Edmunds TMV, the price is close to $19K, and in any case, at the present time most dealers are not willing to cut much of a deal.
The Edmunds review of the Matrix, which should be more expensive than the Vibe, said "And, best of all, it's affordable, costing little more than your average subcompact sedan." The Toyota Corolla LE MSRP is a little over $14K. So maybe there's room for hope?
It may turn out that as is the case with the current Corolla vs. the Prizm, that the prices between the Vibe and Matrix are close. In fact, when you factor in what's likely to be better resale value for the Toyota version vs. the Pontiac and the better warranty on the Toyota, the Matrix might turn out to be the better buy.
Used Prizms may be better buys than used Corollas because of the lower resale, but when you buy new, the Toyota nameplate will likely be worth more at resale time than the Pontiac one.
I was anxiously awaiting the arrival of the Vibe GT, until I read it was going to be 6-speed manual only. No automatic in the GT? Very disappointing. The base model has an auto, but only 130hp. I may test drive it, but I have serious power concerns...
As an individual who commutes 60 miles per day round trip in mixed driving, a manual is not something I want to deal with.
Well, I suppose I could always look at the Hyundai Elantra GT and Mazda Protege5.
Please Pontiac...think about a 5-speed auto for the Vibe GT...
I commute 122 miles a day and I would love to drive the 6-speed. I currently drive a 5-speed and never get tired of shifting. If it's any consolation, I hear that you can get a automatic in any minivan or station wagon.
In an article titled "Will 'tuners' tune in the Vibe", the Vibe Brand Manager was quoted that Pontiac will have aftermarket options arriving in the six months following the launch. They include a supercharger: sound sytem upgrades, such as an MP3 player; and exterior packages offering a new hood, spoiler, ground effects and front fascia.
That option will be popular for the intended market demographic. If Delco makes an MP3 player, it should be easy enough for them to offer it as a factory option on the Vibe and every other GM product. Mazda has the right idea with the MP3 Protege.
I think it's disappointing to not be able to get the GT with automatic too. I also think it's very boorish to tell people to stop "whinnin" because their idea of fun driving is not yanking a standard transmission around every few seconds in heavy traffic. I drive around Boston. Traffic here is either crawling in gridlock conditions or going 85 miles an hour on the bypasses. Try getting on Rte. 1 where there are no 'ease in' lanes. You either get out of the way fast, or you get flattened. I did my years of driving a stick. Now I want an automatic but with the power. Maybe Pontiac is listening -- I can only hope.
Who would want a GT with an auto? Add me to the list. Dislocated my right elbow in the past and repeated shifting causes pain. Many other people simply prefer an automatic. Should an automatic be in a sports oriented automobile? It is offered in Corvette, Mustang GT, Porsche 911, VW GTI, etc.. The auto is required to have enough purchases to sustain the models in many cases. Camaro and TransAm are soon to be discontinued, RX7 and Supra rest in peace. Without an auto maybe the GT will be dropped a few years after it's introduction.
Hope you two are not looking forward to careers in marketing or automotive design.
Hmmm, I think the main reason why there have been the proliferation of automatics in sports cars is that basically as a society we are just plain lazy and more than happy to turn over the decisions of when to shift to a computer so that we can spend more time on the cell phone.
I like a manual tranmission because the decision process belongs to me. If I want to skip a gear I can or if I want to run it up to 6000 RPM in 1st and dump it hard into 2nd I can do that to. To me driving is not some passive activity that simply requires you pointing the vehicle in the general direction you want to go.
Driving is a interaction between me and the machine that I am piloting. I drive 122 miles a day and I never get tired of shifting. I mean come on, with hydraulic clutches, it takes a whopping 10 pounds pressure to depress the clutch and shift. In my mega commute I don't listen to the radio, cd's or talk on the phone, I just drive.
Sorry to hear about your elbow but I'll stick with my original thought. Pontiac is on the right track with the GT. Now only if Pontiac would supercharge the GT for 230 HP.....
While I like driving stick, my wife cannot and will not. Therefore, unless they have a decent engine with the auto tranny, the Vibe will likely be off our shopping list. The good news: We're not buying for two years. Plenty of time for Pontiac to broaden their offerings.
I like the Vibe, but without driving it can't say whether the 130 will be underpowered or not, I'm definitely NOT interested in a manual, I did enough of that growing up on a farm.
Wifes Grand Am has a 4banger in it, and it goes along quick enough for me...maybe 130 horsies is enough.
Power to weight iks the key. A suburban weighs twice as much as a matrix, but back a few years ago it only had 200 hp - and on top of that it had twice as much air to move (worse drag and more frontal area) Not too many people complained about that because 200 sounds like a big number - people don't go around memorizing the weight of their vehicles so many are not aware of this.
Years ago I had a Volare (Volaaaareeee)wagon with a 225 slant six. This was a heavy car and only had 110 hp. The Ford Taurus up until only two years ago had a 140 hp standard engine, and it is much heavier than a Vibe/ Matrix.
Bottom line - drive one first then decide if it is quick enough.
Remember the 180 hp engine barely has more torque than the 130 hp engine, and that is what really motivates the vehicle.
I think this article is worth reading. Apparently in preliminary testing, at 8200 RPM the Vibe makes 0 to 60 MPH in 8.2 sec compare to 8.6 for the PT Cruiser. http://www.gmtoday.com/news/auto/topnews22.htm
well, I'm not sure how reliable ANY information is anymore. Also according to that article: a speedy GT model will have all-wheel-drive, a six-speed manual transmission and a 180-horsepower, variable-valve-timing version of the 1.8-liter four.
That is in contrast to the promotional materials some of us have received in the mail, from Chrysler, showing that the GT would not be available with AWD.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
1. Drive on traffic problem 2. Wife need to ride sometime and she can not ride stick shift 3. Prevent from fixing clutch very often 4. Transmission die out sooner than A/T 5. However, Manual are cheaper than A/T....
I was thinking of driving the hour or so to Philly next week to check out the X Games. From the Pontiac web site, it seems that the Vibe would be shown there and on the "warped" tour of some bands. But I could be reading it wrong. (I hate the Vibe site & marketing so far). Does anyone know if the Vibe will be on display for the entire run of the X Games in Philly? I think they're like Aug 17-22.
Don't know about the X Games, but I attended the Warped Tour, and they had two silver preproduction models on display, both with automatic transmissions. They were unlocked and I was able to sit in them.
Comments
Update: I just got a gas mileage number from Cardesignnews.com. The base FWD model with an automatic gets 27 city, 32 highway. Sorry if this has already been posted.
Then, I see the Pontiac Vibe and I have to say, I fell in love. I think it is simply beautiful. It is the first time in my LIFE I would EVER consider a GM vehicle, honestly. The promise of a great looking, small, wagon-like vehicle with AWD, 6-speed, 180hp, Toyota quality and a Pontiac Price has been making me drool for months now.
NOW I read the AWD only comes with the 130hp motor and Automatic!?!?!?!?! Can ANYONE explain to me why ANYONE would buy that model? I mean, lets face it, (particularly for Toyota) it's a joke. I might as well go out today and buy a Rav-4 right? After all, that's what a Vibe/Matrix AWD is right? A 130ish HP tall wagon. What's the point of this vehicle then?
I just don't understand GM, really. I give up. You would THINK that after the whole Aztek MESS they would hire some new marketing folks. The Subaru WRX Wagon is selling faster than they can build them but Pontiac thinks nobody want's a Vibe GT with AWD?!?!?! That's the main reason I was considering the thing! I am SO upset about this, really. I'm really upset. What the heck is WRONG with this company? I just want a White 2002 Pontiac Vibe GT with DVD and AWD. I can't believe I have to scratch this off the list. Very stupid move Pontiac. Apparently the Aztek marketing folks were transfered to the Vibe department.
Maybe Toyota Matrix will have the HOT model? {fingers crossed}
I just got a Vibe brochure in the mail today. The information they list is 172" length, 70" width, and 62" height. Cargo capacity is 57 cubic feet with the seatbacks folded, 20 with them up.
I think it's strange that the Jetta wagon has 70 cubic feet of cargo room, but the dimensions are similar to the Vibe's. What does everyone else think?
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Maybe for winter?? I live in Southern Ontario, fairly close to Buffalo and I've never had any trouble with snow or ice. Granted, I don't try and take my vehicle (currently a 96 Cavalier) out when I see two feet of snow on the ground...
Dan
Here's the complete article: First Look: 2003 Pontiac Vibe, by Warren Clarke.
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The Protege5 is another likely runner-up but the $16K to $18K asking price is a bit steep for s small 'economy' wagon. The first time I saw the Protege5 was while we were on vacation in Europe a couple of months ago and we really liked it but taught that the P5 will never make it to the US market...little did we know that Mazda was ready to launch it here at the time we were in Europe!
Based on the positive reliability experience we have had with her '97 Tracer (Which is based on the previous generation Mazda protege)we would not hesitate in getting the P5.
However, the Vibe seems to be a much more substantial and all around more practical vehicle. We also like the Toyota powertrain which is an added plus in our book but without the hefty Toyota surcharge.
I have read reports that the Vibe will be priced between $16K and $21K depending on configuration and equipment. Not a bad price if the Vibe is indeed a bigger or at least more versatile vehicle than the P5.
Anyway is nice to see that the local market is opening up more to 'Hot' sportwagon crossovers and possible to new hatchbacks from Europe and Japan.
We are current GM owners and so far have also been happy with our GM ownership experience (new 2001 Impala LS) so we are eagerly looking forward to the Vibe.
The Matrix sibling is nice but we prefer the styling cues of the Vibe better. The Toyota possibly will be much more expensive just because of the 'T' on the hood.
The Edmunds review of the Matrix, which should be more expensive than the Vibe, said "And, best of all, it's affordable, costing little more than your average subcompact sedan." The Toyota Corolla LE MSRP is a little over $14K. So maybe there's room for hope?
Used Prizms may be better buys than used Corollas because of the lower resale, but when you buy new, the Toyota nameplate will likely be worth more at resale time than the Pontiac one.
As an individual who commutes 60 miles per day round trip in mixed driving, a manual is not something I want to deal with.
Well, I suppose I could always look at the Hyundai Elantra GT and Mazda Protege5.
Please Pontiac...think about a 5-speed auto for the Vibe GT...
Add me to the list. Dislocated my right elbow in the past and repeated shifting causes pain. Many other people simply prefer an automatic. Should an automatic be in a sports oriented automobile? It is offered in Corvette, Mustang GT, Porsche 911, VW GTI, etc.. The auto is required to have enough purchases to sustain the models in many cases. Camaro and TransAm are soon to be discontinued, RX7 and Supra rest in peace.
Without an auto maybe the GT will be dropped a few years after it's introduction.
Hope you two are not looking forward to careers in marketing or automotive design.
I like a manual tranmission because the decision process belongs to me. If I want to skip a gear I can or if I want to run it up to 6000 RPM in 1st and dump it hard into 2nd I can do that to. To me driving is not some passive activity that simply requires you pointing the vehicle in the general direction you want to go.
Driving is a interaction between me and the machine that I am piloting. I drive 122 miles a day and I never get tired of shifting. I mean come on, with hydraulic clutches, it takes a whopping 10 pounds pressure to depress the clutch and shift. In my mega commute I don't listen to the radio, cd's or talk on the phone, I just drive.
Sorry to hear about your elbow but I'll stick with my original thought. Pontiac is on the right track with the GT. Now only if Pontiac would supercharge the GT for 230 HP.....
Wifes Grand Am has a 4banger in it, and it goes along quick enough for me...maybe 130 horsies is enough.
Years ago I had a Volare (Volaaaareeee)wagon with a 225 slant six. This was a heavy car and only had 110 hp. The Ford Taurus up until only two years ago had a 140 hp standard engine, and it is much heavier than a Vibe/ Matrix.
Bottom line - drive one first then decide if it is quick enough.
Remember the 180 hp engine barely has more torque than the 130 hp engine, and that is what really motivates the vehicle.
http://www.gmtoday.com/news/auto/topnews22.htm
Damax07
That is in contrast to the promotional materials some of us have received in the mail, from Chrysler, showing that the GT would not be available with AWD.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
1. Drive on traffic problem
2. Wife need to ride sometime and she can not ride stick shift
3. Prevent from fixing clutch very often
4. Transmission die out sooner than A/T
5. However, Manual are cheaper than A/T....
Dan