Lincoln LS

gunnersmate · March 2004

I hear ya. I have to be honest my car did have over 12k dollars worth of warranty work completed on it but at 96k miles it is doing well other than the occasional window regulator failure which I might add I have gotten very good at replacing. Despite the depreciation and lack of power I do love the car and its curb appeal.

slunar · March 2004

It's not just the re-sale value of you LS that is sinking like a rock. Used car prices are down on virtually all cars. The primary causes are over capacity and incentives that have been used to move the inventory.

You can't have it both ways. You can't buy a car at below invoice plus a $4K rebate and not expect to see the used value to reflect that.

In the state I live in we have local property taxes on motor vehicles. The state law says that the assesed value is what KBB says. Many of the town govenments are crying the blues because the vehicle values have dropped so fast that they are loosing a lot of revenue that they were counting on.

ANT14 · March 2004

I usually recommend for someone to lease if they constantly change vehicles every few years, and are concerned about resale values. But many times it's justifiable. Granted, maybe the resale value was very low, but considering there was massive discounts or rebates available, what you gained in the beginning, you might displace it to the end part.

v8lincolnguy · March 2004

After I took a bath with the resale on my last car, I said never again to buying new. Okay, maybe if I win the lottery or something, but unless you plan to keep a vehicle for a long time, buying brand new just doesn't make good financial sense. Lincoln resale is probably about the worst for luxury brands, but it is no worse overall than alot of brands. My advise, if you like the LS but cringe at the thought of how it will depreciate in the first few years, look for a low mileage 1-2 year old trade in. I bought my 2001 LS V8 last September and it only had 26K and was fully loaded. The sticker on the car was probably $40K or more when new. For what I paid for my LS(with relatively little haggling) I would have been buying a mid-level Toyota Camry or Chevy Impala had I been buying new. Every time I pass a line of Camrys, Accords, Impalas, or Tauri coming toward me in the opposite lane, I smile and know I made the right decision. Better yet, when I put the hammer down on a freeway entrance and get that "LS grin" on my face, I KNOW I made the right decision.

cdnpinhead · March 2004

pumped regarding the concept of the LS and the details of the car itself that I ordered one almost exactly four years ago without ever having driven one. No dealer cash back, no manufacturers rebates. . .nothing beyond the typical negotiation that ends up a little above invoice – pretty much standard fare for those days. The bottom feeders (not that there’s anything wrong . . .) who get LS’s these days for 5K or more under invoice are coming at this from a different place.

I have not been disappointed. The car itself has mostly been a real pleasure -- a few hiccups, but nothing seriously off-putting (so far) -- the sorts of things one would expect in the first few years of a dedicated effort.

Turns out it's not a dedicated effort. What's happened over the past two or so years has taken much of the bloom off the rose, and helps to explain the miserable resale "value" of LS's.

What we've all learned is that the LS is just like all other Lincolns (but even more so) in terms of residual value. The dealers who are so happy to do whatever's necessary to move trucks and Town Cars aren't so interested in learning what's needed to deal with the intended customer base for the LS. Plus which, the factory seems to produce more than anyone wants. But wait . . . does anyone really want one?

Every weekend I glance over the car section in the paper to find that the LS is never (and I mean absolutely never) mentioned in any advertising. The people who place these local ads wish the car didn't exist. They will eventually be pleased, I'm thinking.

Oh, but wait, there's all that really effective national TV, radio & print advertising to combat the local dealer lack of interest. . .

lateralg · March 2004

How's this: My 2001 Lexus GS 430 cost me $54,000. When I moved up to a 2003 Lincoln LS, the best I could get for my like-new Lexus with 23,000 miles, (from a private buyer) was $32,000. The Lincoln dealer's best offer was $29,000, the Lexus dealer offered me $30,000.

$22,000 depreciation in two years and 23,000 miles. Thats over $30.00/DAY, or $0.96/ PER MILE. This for a car that had no idea where "straight-ahead" was. (In any amount of wind or road surface irregularity, it was all over the road)

Count your blessings; you get that LS Grin for less cost per mile than I paid for the Lexus frown.

rfdevil1 · March 2004

The way I see it is you either get it up front with large incentives and discounts but lower resale, or you get it later, pay more up front, get more later in resale. The ones who suffer are those like cdnpinhead (and I feel for you)who believed in the "get it later" philosophy on a new product only to find that the game changed. They get slammed up front and at the end. I knew going into this in 2003 that depreciation was an issue but I did fairly well up front when I bought, and I have a great car.

v8lincolnguy · March 2004

Well, as we speak my LS is "under the knife" as the valve cover gaskets were leaking so the seals have to be replaced. Also, I reported the delayed gear engagement when going from R to D or vice versa so they are going to reprogram the PCM. While my LS is in, they gave me a 2002 Town Car to drive. While it sure beats the crappy loaner cars I used to get when my Intrigue was in the shop(once I got a 95 LeSabre with 100K on the clock), the Town Car certainly ain't no LS. Now, I wasn't expecting the thing to drive anywhere near the way the LS does, but I was really shocked at how badly the big boat drives. And this one has the Touring Sedan option! Seriously, I know T-cars are supposed to be floaty, but the steering is downright scary. Make a quick manuever and it literally feel like the car is tripping over itself. And while the ride is super soft on smooth roads, hit a bump and the rear end dances all over the place. Worse yet, speed bumps and concrete patches yield a pretty harsh impact. Something that I did not expect in a Town Car. And the dash, I now wonder why we don't see more T-cars in accidents. The radio is at the top of the dash and it is set back so you literally have to lean forward to reach it. Combine that with the fact the seats are more like your dad's favorite recliner and it's a darn good thing the car has steering wheel radio controls. Now granted, there is something about the way it feels to be moving down the freeway in a big car like this as you look out over the long hood, but this certainly ain't something I would want to drive daily. And for about the same price as an LS V8 costs, I cannot understand why Lincoln isn't selling more LSs than Town Cars. Maybe the 03 update improved things a bit, but I think it's time Ford seriously updates their big sedans. While no Bimmer, Cadiilac's big Deville is a MUCH more nimble car and is nearly as spacious as the Town Car is.

heyjewel · March 2004

Coming from an LS, a Town Car is bound to feel floaty. I've driven several and they're not exactly my cup of tea either, but I don't agree with your assessment of how bad they are.
AS for why Lincoln sells more TCs than LSs, I'll take a stab at it.
First, that's where their bread n butter has always been. They have lots of repeat customers, not to mention the livery trade. When buyers think of Lincoln, they think Town Car. They don't even have to advertise the TCs, they sell themselves and the sales force knows the car and the customers.
The LS is a totally different story. The sales force doesn't really understand the car or who the customers are or how to sell it. In some cases, they refuse to sellit - at least the 5 speed manual. That's the biggest reason that died - the dealers wouldn't order them either for the lot or, in my case, for a paying customer.
And then there's the marketing. Oooh boy, where does one begin on that? Let me just say that Lincoln never - except for the original ad way back in 2000 showing the car going thru the twisties and shoing the driver shifting the 5 speed - they never marketed the car very well at all, IMHO. I never see, hear or read any marketing that speaks to the LS' handling prowess (OK, there was one which ran very briefly that claimed handling better than the 5-series.) But it was so brief, and it said nothing else. They just never created a buzz for the car even after it won COY and got very good reviews, even from CR. The only marketing I ver see for it is in the auto sales section of the paper, usually something like "2004 LS ONLY $24,999*"
Well, that's one man's opinion.

nvbanker · March 2004

I also think V8Lincolnguy is being a bit harsh on the old Town Car. Clearly, it's not what you like to drive, and that's why the LS exists, but it's interesting how you describe the driving experience as negatives, that I consider to be positives! The Cadillac does drive more like the LS, and perhaps that's why you like it more, but if you want just miles of steel and tons of space inside, like to really spread out, enjoy having that Titanic feeling, the Town Car is the ride for you, and is a bullet proof, reliable, great handling big car, IMO. YMMV.

dwp22 · March 2004

From my vantage point I think Heyjewel has it right. The TC's has a big market in the livery trade.

I'm from northern NJ; I park my LS in a park & ride lot every day and take a bus to New York. Once you're in the city you will see nearly as many TCs as taxi cabs. If you work late or are going somewhere on business you can call for car service.

v8lincolnguy · March 2004

Okay, maybe I was a bit harsh on the T-car. I will say as I drove it around today, you kind of feel isolated from the rest of world in this car. Unlike in the LS where you want to mash the gas and feel the surge of power, in the Town Car(which had pretty decent pick-up) you simply don't care if others are zooming by you. And on the freeway, you couldn't ask for a better ride. Just hope the road stays straight. Just for kicks I looked at some T-cars on ebaymotors and noticed that the 03s seem to have a better interior design. The radio and climate control are right together like they are in the LS. I'll stand by the older T-car's biggest interior flaw is you have to lean forward to reach the radio. I wonder if they have cured the rear axle hop on the newer ones as well as that seemed to be what alarmed me the most. Hit a bump in the road and the rear of the car feels like it's dancing. Anyway, I got my LS back today and it appears everything has been corrected. The first thing I noticed is the transmission shifts MUCH smoother than before. I thought the re-flash was just to correct the delayed reverse and drive engagements, but it changed the shift patterns a bit as well. The idle-air sensor was also replaced and the car now seems to idle the way it did when I bought it. So much for the guy at the other dealer telling me to use regular unleaded to try and correct that. After starting to get used to the Town Car, it felt different driving my LS. But I quickly adjusted. Well, it's looking like we are supposed to have nice weather this weekend so I think it's time wash and wax the LS. Nothing like that first wax of the season:)

nvbanker · March 2004

You get used to that Independent Rear Suspension pretty quickly, and then when you get back into a live axle, it's shocking how much rock & roll gets transmitted into the car. I have had the Mountaineer for 3 years, and the 03 Navigator a year now, and both have IRS. I went for a ride with my friend in his Jeep Grand Cherokee, which has a live axle, and a speed bump about put me into the windshield! We do forget! Personally, I hope to never own a live axle again.

sda · March 2004

Glad to hear your service experience was better than what you had with your Intrigue. I 100% agree with you in buying used vs new. You got a great car for a fraction of the cost of a new one. And yes I would much rather be driving a used Lincoln LS, Seville, Aurora, for the same money as a new Camry LE, Accord LX 4 cyl el cheapo. I bought my loaded 00 Intrigue GL with 19k in 4/02 for less than 50% of MSRP and had a lot of the original warranty remaining. In 11/03 I bought my 01 Aurora 4.0 that listed for over 39K for around 1/3 of the MSRP. It has all options including Bose, s/roof, chrome wheels, heated seats gold pkg and 12 disc changer. Even with the added cost of an extended warranty, I still feel I couldn't go wrong. I think a used LS V8 is next on my shopping list. Other than the vehicles that I buy for my wife, I don't think I'll buy new again.

nosho · March 2004

When I first heard the new BMW ad line "Happiness isn't around the corner, happiness IS the corner," I thought how appropriate that ad line is for the LS and how pathetic the "travel well" tag line is.

Wishing for an LS-V8 manual..., but will obviously be going for something else.

reneleblanc · March 2004

Wasn't it a wonderful time when Lincoln Manageument used to frequent this board? They were actually INTERESTED in what their customers thought about their car!

Now, I don't see any evidence that Lincoln management even realizes that the LS is one of their products....

I can hardly believe the almost complete absence of any sort of marketing for the Lincon LS :-(

I wonder if the current Lincoln managers all have "pointy hair"....

cdnpinhead · March 2004

for the "pointy hair" comment. I couldn't agree more.

I'm confident the LS development team (dispersed though it may be) could identify even more than I do every day with Dilbert similarities.

akirby · March 2004

would solve a multitude of Lincoln's problems. Not all of them, but a lot of them.

If the Lincoln Mark LT makes $$$ (and it should since it cost almost nothing to develop) then that will be good for the cars in the long run.

rfdevil1 · March 2004

...a glass is half full kind of person. We need more of that. We would all enjoy our cars a little more if we look at the bright side.

akirby · March 2004

I wouldn't go that far. I can get pretty pessimistic. But I do understand how businesses operate and how decisions are made (or not made). A lot of people think car companies have complete and total choice about what cars they build and what goes into them. And that's simply not the case. A lot of it is dictated by corporate mandates (platform sharing, budget cuts, corporate image) or simple economics (can't afford an all new platform). In the end it all comes down to $$$.

There's nothing inherently bad about a Lincoln pickup or Mazda6 platform based car or crossover. The more the merrier and the more $$$ the more investment in high end luxury and sport luxury vehicles. I bet the Mazda6 platform is as good if not better than the current 3 series platform (strictly from a platform point of view). It's not what you start with but what you end up with that counts.

I believe naysayers said the same negative things when BMW came out with the 3 series.

heyjewel · March 2004

rene brings up the good old days when Jim Rogers was VP marketing and he really supported the LS, even the LS manual, which he drove. Now, who is the VP marketing?

akirby i'm curious as to what motivates you to place this bet that the mazda 6 platform is 'better' then the 3-series? I dunno - I might take u up on the bet:>)

Personally a Lincoln on a mazda platform is less desirable to me than one on a Jag platform, eh? Maybe even less than a Ford platform. - the Navigator and Aviator are top-notch in their classes and they have modified Ford platforms. Mazda to me is a second -tier Japanese company. Now I could be totally off-base here. That remains to be seen. But if they just pop off the skin of the cheap mazda 6 and replace it with Lincoln-esque sheet metal and double the price - that wouldn't interest me. If they modify the platform I'd take a look.

Lastly, rene also harkened back to the days when Lincoln was throttling Cadilac. L has the Nav, Caddy was denying they'd ever build an SUV. L had the LS, Caddy had the second rate Catera. The rest of the lines were about equal. Now Lincoln has added one more vehicle- a great one - the Aviator (but which they're already redesigning??) and are adding a pick up truck fer gawds sake. (To replace the Blackwood, which might have been a decent vehicle if they hadn't put so many arrogant limitations on it - no 4WD, only black, no bench rear seat and a bed that was too small with a cover that didn't even allow you to access the whole area.)
Meanwhile Caddy now has 2 large SUVs, a versatile pick up truck, a smaller crossover, the CTS, the CTS-V ALL of which are new and they're releasing their new STS sedan soon which will be larger than the LS but will have 320hp Northstar, supposedly great handling and 0-60 in the low 6es.
Lincoln, to my knowledge, has nothing in the pipeline. Ah, for the good old days.

akirby · March 2004

George - my comment was based simply on the fact that the new platform is just that - new. Every time a new platform comes out it seems to be much stiffer than the older platforms. I'm sure the new 3 series platform will be better when it comes out. It's a leapfrog thing. The new mustang chassis is tons cheaper than the dew98 but actually much stiffer, allowing the mustang convertible to be built without the extra bracing required for the Tbird. Now I'm not saying the mazda6 is equal to a BMW - it's not. Then again, that's a FWD/AWD vs. RWD platform so maybe that's not a good analogy. But you get the point.

If you didn't know the LS and Stype shared a platform would you figure it out just by looking at or driving them? I think not. I expect the same thing from the Mazda6 based Lincoln. No resemblance to a Mazda. Lincoln engine, suspension, wheels/tires, sheet metal and interior.

Now if I'm wrong and they carry over Mazda parts that aren't up to Lincoln standards then I agree. But I don't think that will happen.

Look at what Ford did with the 500 built off the Volvo platform.

I think we'll get to see a sneak peak of the new Lincoln at the New York Auto show. We'll just have to wait and see.

ANT14 · March 2004

Yes that is true, the D2C platform is stronger than DEW98. I wouldn't say it's cheaper...in reality what makes it cheaper is much less use of aluminum pieces/items, whereas the DEW98 platform uses much more. So it's all about interpretation...

lolaj42 · March 2004

IMO, the Mazda 6 platform is too small for the Lincoln brand. If it isn't the smallest car Lincoln has ever had, it's got to be close. I just don't think the Mazda 6 platform is appropriate for Lincoln, nor do I think the market will accept it, but that's just my opinion. Heck, the Lincoln loyalists bemoaned the introduction of the LS because it was too small, and it seems to me Lincoln is still catering to this crowd. I just don't get the direction Lincoln is taking . . . more like a rudderless ship to me.

akirby · March 2004

I meant cheaper to manufacture (less aluminum and front struts). Not only was dew98 not stiff enough for a mustang convertible it was also too expensive for a $17K vehicle.

akirby · March 2004

Can't argue about the rudderless ship.........

Why is it too small? The platform can be made larger than the actual Mazda6 (lengthened and widened). It was designed that way from the beginning.

Is a 330i too small for BMW? Is the CTS too ugly....err...too small for Cadillac? Is the A4 too small for Audi?

This is NOT a replacement for the LS. It's just another car to give buyers a choice and it's a segment in which Ford does not currently compete. If done right it should be great competition for the A4, 330i, C class, etc. and will probably outsell the LS.

v8lincolnguy · March 2004

"Travel Well" is the perfect ad line for the Town Car. No doubt you travel well in that car, just as long as the road is straight and your in the passenger seat. Heck, I could almost imagine cruising down I-95 in the rear quarters of a T-car while sipping a martini:) Seriously, Travel Well may work for the T-car and Navigator, but it certainly doesn't do anything to promote the LS's real virtues. As for Lincoln using the Mazda 6 platform for an upcoming sedan, unless it is a true entry levek sedan(i.e. below the LS) I don't think it is a good idea. While I think the Mazda 6 is a great midsize sedan(better than the Camry, Accord, and Altima), a luxury sedan I'm not sure it can be. And it's FWD. I know I know, some folks want FWD and most don't really care, but if Lincoln truly wants to turn their image around the way Cadillac is doing, they need to build some serious performance sedans. Now a Mazda 6 based sedan would be great for Mercury.

Now, here is a thought for the LS. While most of us probably prefer our LSs having the sport suspension, I'm sure there are some that want a smoother ride while still having V8 power. Lincoln should offer the LS V8 with both the standard and sport suspension. Maybe with a non sport suspension, they could ween some buyers off the T-car and also satisfy former Continental owners. Personally, I think the LS sport is just fine, but I'm sure there are some that like a softer ride. A softer ride without all the float and still some decent handling might really give the LS some more appeal. Heck, they could even put a stand-up hood ornament on those non-sport models. Or maybe not:) Honestly, I'd have to see one with this in person to judge if it is too gaudy looking.

slunar · March 2004

About 3 years ago when there was supposed to be a "baby" Lincoln based on a shrunken D/EW98 platform, it seemed as if everyone here was clamoring for it. Now anything smaller that the LS is too small, what gives?

How come I didn't hear any complaints about the IS-300 runinging the Lexus brand?

Forget about the BMW 325, what about the new BMW 1 Series? Yet I know they will only sell it in Europe first, but BMW has already said the US will get a "2" series coupe based of it in a couple years. Anyone here care to start complaining about how a mini-sized $20K BMW is going to ruin the BMW brand?

lolaj42 · March 2004

role has already been filled by the LS! Lincoln has a long, storied history for building LARGE, LUXURIOUS cars, not mid-size or small cars. The LS is a mid-size car, and Lincoln heard plenty of complaints about it when it was first introduced. Now, I'm all in favor of Lincoln trying to change its colors somewhat in this regard, but, I also think it needs to be apart of an overall strategy that has a hope of being executed over a 10-year period (unlike the most recent 4-year period).

The difference with BMW, Lexus, and Cadillac is that they've always had smaller offerings. Cadillac had the disaster Cimmeron even before the Catera. BMW resumed life after WWII making small, affordable sedans, so, making large cars is the stretch end of the market for them. Lexus has no real heritage to live up to, so they can do pretty much anything they darn well please, and considering their reputation for quality, no one really cares.

akirby · March 2004

It's NOT a MAZDA. They're using the MAZDA platform as the starting point. Please withhold judgement until the New York Auto Show when we get a sneak peak.

It will be entry level (that's the whole point of using the cheaper Mazda6 platform) and it will not be just FWD but also AWD.

lolaj42 · March 2004

here just yet . . . I will gladly wait until I see and drive the new, small platform Lincoln before making any judgments. However, I'm simply voicing my skepticism about the market acceptance of the new, small Lincoln.

I can hear the faithful Lincoln customer now . . . "you mean ALL four wheels make the car go? What's wrong with 2?" as the salesman's eyes start rolling while using every last ounce of energy to keep themselves from shaking their head in disgust.

heyjewel · March 2004

Well, as usual, I don't agree with everbody about any one thing. Well, except that Lincoln is to the luxury car market as a rudderless boat is to the America's Cup.

Ford 500 on Volvo platform? Fine. Why not the Volvo for a Lincoln? A much better choice. My beef with Ford's new "American Family Car" - they're building it in MEXICO. (While Honda, Toyota, ... build theirs in the USA.)

Mercury could use this Mazda-based car? You bet. Mercury could use a lot of things. A car smaller than the next Ford clone they're getting would be great. Perhaps the new Cougar? 2 door coupe, then a 4dr sedan called the Monterey? Ooops they already named a minivan that :>( A FAR MORE useful place for a Mazda based sporty car. Instead what's Merc getting? Another practical twin of a Ford. BTW, speaking of the Monterey (and Freestar) minivans - has anyone seen these? sat in them? Geez, I saw and sat in a Monterey back in November when I was shopping. If this is their idea of an upscale minivan, they should fold up the tent and go home. It's an absolute joke when compared to the likes of the Chrysler or the Toyota or even the Kia. Even the new Nissan Quest is a far more interesting, luxurious vehicle. I sat in the drivers seat of the Merc, put my hands between the wheel and found that the trim piece in front of the dashboard plex has about 3 inches of free play, rocking back and forth. Gawd. What is going on at Ford? Are the bean counters so much in control that even the things right at the driver's fingertips are screwed up? Just pathetic.

I'm sorta riding the fence between Allen and Chris on the idea of a 'small' Lincoln. There are precedents for it - rmember the Versailles? That was small in it's day. How about this - Lincoln and Mercury share a 'small' platform that Ford does not get. The Merc is the sportier car, the Lincoln plusher, yet more BMW-ish? OK, fine, base it on a Mazda (Volvo would have been better) but tweak the heck out of it.

Caddy is going full-bore to RWD/AWD and now Lincoln is moving back towards FWD? I don't get that one.

A baby Lincoln based on DEW-98 would be *very* well received by those of us who've been around for a while. But Ford is just tossing away all that development work on the DEW-98 to low volume Jaguars. Poof - there goes Lincoln's performance image.

I love my Navigator and my LS just keeps magna-purring along. But I can't help but think Ford as a whole is in trouble. Even GM is releasing more and more interesting vehicles than Ford. They seem to have a plan, whereas Ford (Lincoln) is just releasing the next clone they can easily put together. Witness the LT pickup and the Mercury Mariner (an "upscale" Ford Escape?) It just boggles me why they'd waste engineering talent on releasing the LT P/U? Especially when:
a) The F150 top of the line is already a plush, luxurious vehicle. I know, I drove one.
b) Cadillac has a far more versatile truck in the ESV or whatever it's called. The midgate thing is great and the truck looks great. Though the Lincoln, even with the F-150 interior, is a far better environment inside.

Maybe I hit on something unintentionally in the previous paragraph. "Engineering talent". Maybe that's a scarce resource at Ford now. After the racist Nasser and his purges of that "sea of white faces" he didn't like. Maybe some good engineers were forced out or took early outs? I have inside information that there's some truth to that. Chew on this - Ford announced several years ago they were designing and building a hybrid Escape. All of a sudden, they hastily paid Toyota a large sum of money to buy their hybrid technology. I guess the engineering talent at Ford just couldn't get to Job 1 in this endeavor?

Finally, yeah, "Travel Well" suits the Town Car fine. Maybe the Nav too, though I might add "On and Off Road" But overall it's LAME with a capitol L and I've said that since it's inception. "American Luxury" they couldn't see fit to stick with? Or even "What a luxury ... Should Be" was much better.

Oh and another thing ... seems Daryl Hazel's idea of building up the Lincoln brand image is to run ads showing little snippets like a stack of wheels or a cushioned arm rest or whatever with cutesy tag lines. That's pathetic enough, but then where is he gonna run these ads? In the New York Times??? Does he really think any readers of that paper (besides perhaps our friend Artie) buys an American car? They're the first ones to trash American everything. They all drive Hondas, Daryl, get with it. This would be like John Kerry appearing before the Christian Coalition and expecting to convince them to vote for him. Or GW Bush before the NAACP. It ain't gonna work, Daryl. Get a clue.

Signing off.

gunnersmate · March 2004

is there any merit to this product?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&cate- gory=33574&item=2469042661

akirby · March 2004

Cmon, George - stop holding back!

Why the LT? A few gadgets even the F150 doesn't have. But mainly something for the Lincoln/Mercury only dealerships to sell. The pickin's are mighty slim these days.

lolaj42 · March 2004

George, there you go dating yourself again! :-P

I surely DO NOT remember this Lincoln, but even if it were "small" in its day, it was still probably one notch below Noah's Ark in size.

Now, back to the Mazda 6 platform . . . isn't it shared with Volvo also? I honestly don't know, but I thought I heard that. I know the Mazda 3 platform is shared by the Volvo S40.

I do agree with George, though, that the Mazda 6 platform Lincoln Mercury is soon to unveil would be far better suited to the Mercury brand than Lincoln. That is, only if Ford really is serious about salvaging the Mercury brand after decades of neglect.

m_yount · March 2004

I'm not sure if anyone here can help me, but I'll try. I recently purchased a 2000 LS V6. I know that it does not have the sport package, but I have 2 questions about that.

1. Would it be better to purchase the "offical" sport shocks or a set of high performance after market shocks

2. Can anyone tell me or post a link that gives some info on how to convert my standard automatic to the SST?

Thanks for any info.

gunnersmate · March 2004

Congrats on your recent procurement. I have a 00 LS V6 sport.

First the springs: If you are going to keep the current wheel and tire configuration I would stick with the oem springs but if you see yourself either buy 18" wheels or change to a tire size such as the 245/45/17 or 235 then get the eibach spring kit.

Now I have seen a spring kit on ebay made by spring tech but I do not know anyone that has them.

Now with the tranny deal. IIRC all you need to do is change the cover plate for your shifter and have the PCM flashed to the Sport code. If no one else chimes in on this here I would recommend that you take a free trial membership from the llsoc.com folks and poke around there or search this forum as it may be listed in the history section.

Another good mod is to swap out the airbox with one that is of the 2002 LS line up. Best price for that is at fordpartsonline.com. Set that up with a k&n and your are as mod'ed out as you can get.

Now if you want some good beams check out the sylania siler stars for the headlights. they are about 20 a bulb but i promise you; you won't be let down. I love mine merely for the improvement they make for night driving but the do add a nice bright look to the front.

Have a pleasant weekend.

nvbanker · March 2004

I bought a Monterey for my business to use a month ago. I got the base model. Unlike you, I have been surprised and delighted (although I never drive it) in that my driver of the car says it's flawless! For a new model, I am amazed! Styling, which I like, and I also still have a Caravan that I keep in Florida, is subjective - you may not like it, but I do. I think it's an improvement over the Windstar. Sure, could be better, but this one is amazingly good. 1800 miles so far, no defects found.

cdnpinhead · March 2004

that the core supporters of the LS can't stay away, never mind how superior the other site is.

It's also interesting, but disappointing, that most of us are talking about the same stuff that we were three (or 4, or 2) years ago: dealers, advertising, lack of cash.

This car had a really good shot when it was introduced. Now we're looking at Cadillac, which has several versions of their vehicle, most recently going "down" to a 2.8 with imitation "leather."

To me, it's not pleasant watching GM doing what Ford (Lincoln) said they were going to do.

WMMV

lolaj42 · March 2004

Steve, if you were to look at my edmunds profile, you may find an explanation to my more recent posts on this site. I believe you will find more honest and broad-based opinions regarding the Lincoln and the LS here. Further, since I recently acquired an Aviator, I'm interested to share experiences with others that have done the same.

rayainsw · March 2004

"It's also interesting, but disappointing, that most of us are talking about the same stuff that we were three (or 4, or 2) years ago: dealers, advertising, lack of cash." - cdpinhead

And yet - the '03 PRODUCT reflected improvements addressing so many of the requests of so many posts here - from drivers / owners of '00 / '01 / '02 models.

- Ray
Owner / driver of an '03 - ex-owner of an '00 . . .

carm11 · March 2004

iam new here, but thinking of buying a used 2001 or 02 LS, just wondering how this car drives in snow or wet weather, i live in the north east. thanks

lolaj42 · March 2004

I think, if you search this discussion board, you'll find that most people will praise the LS for it's ability to handle snow, or wet/sloppy weather . . . especially if equipped with the auxilary AdvanceTrac traction control option, and snow tires if the snow really gets deep.

bill42 · March 2004

What started out as a new car shopping expedition for me has turned into a new ride for my wife. We drove a 2004 LS v-6 with appearance package, sunroof, heat/cool seats, etc. Window sticker is about $38,500. With all the rebates, incentives, trade-in, etc. dealer has offered me the car for about $24,500 plus sales tax.

Never had a Lincoln before, never dealt with this particular dealership either.

My question is not the typical 'is this a good deal' but, if you had to do it all over again, would you get an LS?

Her trade-in is a Cadillac EdDorado. We don't need/want a coupe and she really does not need or want the V-8 in the LS.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

nvbanker · March 2004

I don't own an LS, but rent them every chance I get. I have never seen such loyalty to an individual car as seems to exist for the LS, since the Mustang. There must be a reason. Well, why do I rent them? Because I need a large car for home, but on the road when it's just me, or me & wife, the LS is the most fun car to drive I've ever seen.

lobsenza · March 2004

It is difficult to determine how good a deal this is without a lot more information. You give minimal details on the trade-in and that can have a big impact on the answer. You should be able to get a good deal on an LS. Check Edmunds TMV. Then evaluate what your trade is worth and decide.

The LS is a great car and is very reliable. You can't go wrong there.

akirby · March 2004

Unless your caddy is only worth $5K, it's too high. That car should sell for about $30K with incentives, maybe less.

cdnpinhead · March 2004

Ray. The '03's & subsequent models do indeed have many improvements that those of us with earlier models really wanted. If only it came with the manual . . . but it doesn't. I realize very few care much about the manual, but not offering one, and not competing more directly with what Cadillac is introducing is sad to watch.

Chris, I did note your profile a couple of months back -- was pleased to see you back here on a regular basis. Sounds like your Aviator & my Pathfinder are about the same age. Keep us posted.

ls8 · March 2004

thoughts on tires for my 2000 LS non-sport? I want quiet and smooth, I think the car handles plenty well and don't need even better handling. I currently have Michelin MXV4's and I have seen good reviews on Bridgestone Turanza's and Conti Contacts. Any experience out there to help me in my decision?

cdnpinhead · March 2004

have had really good experiences with Michelin Pilot Sport All Seasons, with or without the sports package (17 or 16 inch).

They're expensive, but generally wear well, are very quiet (even when worn) and provide excellent cornering performance without squealing.

I certainly like mine. Tire Rack & Costco normally have the best prices.

Lincoln LS

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