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Comments
I'm not saying that the two persons who experienced fire with their Siennas were that stupid to put gas tanks on top of the engine, but it could be that, for example, dealership when prepping the vehicle didn't remove (or put inside) some PVC foil or paper or anything from the engine compartment.
I think that we just should wait to see what the investigation reveals. No need for panic until then. So, drive and enjoy your Siennas as much as I do with my MPV :-)
I am prepared to replace the tires but I'm wondering if this is a symptom of some known problem with this model that I should be aware of.
Any help would be appreciated. I only bought the car yesterday so I think I have 3 days to get back to the dealer in case this is a serious problem.
Thanks.
I enjoy doing this kind of work myself - anyone else do their own brakes - is it pretty standard? Were new pads/shoes and rotor turn the ticket?
mine is 1999 model with 50,100+kms and pads/shoes are still good. i had to take off the wheels and drums to check and used a wet/dry vacuum to clean the brake dust. got rid of the whine, squeak, squeal or whatever u want to call it when u step on the brakes - just before u make a full stop/slowing down.
Only other Jpn car I owned was a '94 Honda Accord, which needed new brake parts at only 39K mi. Terrible... Hope the Toyo goes much longer.
i basically just check and blow out the dust every 6 months. sorry, can't tell you the exact specs. the wear also varies depending on how you drive your car/use the brakes.
is it shaking, vibrating, pulls to left or right, etc.?
Wait-maybe not:
http://www.autosafety.org/GM-CK/AttA.pdf
http://www.autosafety.org/GM-CK/intro.htm
That kind of tactic speaks far more to alarmist propaganda than a sincere desire to inform.
Cars (all of them) are all potential fireballs: full of gasoline/diesel fuel, extremely hot metal surfaces and honey-combed with wires with up to 80 amps of current running through them.
NHTSA has asked Toyota to investigate these two incidents. I have every confidence that Toyota will find and correct the problem. How did GM respond to NHTSA requests?
In the case of the GM CK (73-87) trucks, when the trucks were struck on either vehicle side where a gas tank was mounted outside the frame of the vehicle, the tank ruptured and spilled fuel was ignited, incinerating the occupants. In April of '93 NHTSA asked GM to voluntarily recall and correct the trucks, placing the gas tank inside the rails. GM refused. A cost benefit analysis (by Edward Ivey) showed that GM could save $2.20 per vehicle by not doing this. When Mr Ivey was asked if he could identify if there were a MORE dangerous location for the tank, his reply was, "well yes... you could put it on the front bumper".
GM was aware of the problem as early as '73, the first year of the change in the gas tank location. As of the year 2000, more than 1,800 people have died in fire crashes involving this truck, and thousands more were injured. "It is the worst auto crash fire defect in the history of the U.S. Department of Transportation". As late as 1991 GM was still placing fuel tanks outside the rails of some GM trucks.
Bottom line is not what the problem is but how the manufacturer responds to the problem. I've seen GMs response to problems; I'll wait for Toyota's response.
For a very interesting story on this, soup to nuts, you can go to:
http://www.autosafety.org/GM-CK/background.htm
And I thought the risk factors were only in the 2001 DC vans built up to July 2002. They have a propensity to leak after a collision from the top of the gas tank where the gauge is mounted.
The term 'ask' is what I selected. It's not a quote from anyone else. I don't know who at NHTSA contacted Toyota, but I would assume that the proper business protocol would be to "ask" a company to investigate 2 complaints. I don't think that NHTSA:
demanded
cajoled
ordered
commanded or anything else. The normal business process is to 'ask' someone to do something.
I have tried to follow your links for these incidents and I have searched the NHTSA site for them. They aren't under 'HOT' items. I know that the problem exists from other links that you provided, and that Toyota is looking into it. I also know that it is with a total of 2 vehicles out of thousands. Whatever the problem is I'm sure that Toyota will do what is necessary.
(If you can find the article at NHTSA again please post the correct link or the sequence that you use to find it. I would like to read the entire article for each incident.)
One of the two incidents that you posted said that the 'dealership was aware of the problem'. The dealership is not Toyota, and is not connected to the manufacturer, only the sales company, and even then only by association. Toyota dealerships are independent from Toyota Manufacturing. Investigations will be done by engineering at the plant. Replacing the van would be the dealership's concern, not the investigation of the cause, unless the dealership modified the van in some way. And how do you know that Toyota hadn't begun their own investigation? I don't see that mentioned anywhere in either incident report.
NHTSA may be conducting their own investigation, but I doubt that they will go to the plant to investigate. They will most likely look for additional complaints of Sienna fires (if any). Since NHTSA was established before the GM fires in their trucks, and couldn't do anything to force GM to stop putting the tanks outside the protective rails, my assumption is that they are pretty toothless. Looking at their own web site I see nothing that allows them to cause much grief for any auto manufacturer. http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/nhtsa/whatis/overview/
With Ford's Pintos and GM's CK pickups and nothing resolved, I don't think that any automaufacturer has much to fear from NHTSA beyond bad publicity. Given that consumers continued to buy these GM and Ford death traps for many years indicates to me that even bad publicity isn't necessarily a bad thing.
Curious, but of everything that I posted, the only item that you chose to challenge was the word 'ask'. I guess that you're OK with GM's handling of its own vehicle fires.
I choose to challenge your use of the word 'investigatory'. Is that anything like "strategery"?
I might have missed this but I assume you are an owner of a Sienna since you have posted all the Sienna links.
Your major concern over these two fires (that's the number I've read from this chat) is a little unrealistic if you think this will happen to you.
Let's say 2000 Sienna's are on the road (conservative estimate). These two fires represent 0.1% of the total of that number. Your chances of being in a car accident are probably much higher. Then again, your chances of being injured, depending on the circumstances, are lower in a Sienna according to crash safety data/reports.
Sounds to me you have to make a choice here. Sell the Sienna - avoid fires - or purchase another vehicle - chance an injury.
That's the extent of my "fire" comments - unless I drop a cigarette in my lap....
Bob - selling the Sienna is a great suggestion but you're assuming these turkeys actually own one. I have my doubts.
Also my last word for sure as I don't smoke (LOL).
No fires
No sludge
No rattles
No power door problems
No wheel alignment problems
No tire complaints
No clicking noises
But,
The turn signal/headlight switch was replaced
The clock was replaced (dealer chose to do this)
The right power window switch was replaced
CD skips on personally created CDs
I'm happy with it, particulary on long trips. Took 3 guys to Canada this year (1,000 miles each way) and all they did was talk about how quiet it was, the great ride and the excellent stereo. It held all of our gear and plenty of room left over.
no fires
few rattles, no big deal
new tires
no cd player
had a flat tire once
No fires.
No sludge.
No automatic door problems.
No window problems.
No rattles.
No wheel, tire, steering, or alignment problems.
CD player jammed and was replaced by dealer.
At highway speeds in strong crosswinds, there is a really annoying whistle around the bottom of the windshield. Dealer has tried twice and hasn't been able to correct it. That's the only thing that bugs me. (And sometimes it bugs me quite a bit.)No other warranty repairs.
Took four visiting Europeans (adult and not midgets) on a 2400 mile road trip this fall. Pulled out one of the middle row seats to make room for the cooler. Even as the inside of the van gradually filled with cubic yard after cubic yard of souvenirs, there continued to be enough room for everyone and everything. Very comfortable even on the 700-mile days.
no sludge
no fires
no door problems
no window problems
no rattles
no alignment problems
CD skips sometimes. Brakes squeek a lot.Dealer says cd and brakes are fine
Seems like a great family mover to me
sludge at 47,000 miles
no fire
inside door push buttons stick sometimes on sliding doors
no window problems
some minor interior rattles
wears tires quicker than any other vehicle I have ever owned.
no CD
brakes squeek but work fine
rear ac fan only works when on high
10,000 miles
NO fires
NO sludge
NO automatic door problems
NO window problems
NO rattles (dealer took care of it)
NO tire or alignment problems
Would not trade it for "any" other van out there except for the new Sienna model coming out....maybe?....maybe not!
- dings and scratches!
3 days to go - merry christmas!
37000 miles
No sludge
No rattles
No fires
Quiet as a church
Rides nicely with 4 adults and 2 kids
As comfortable as any car
Everything works the way it should
She'd buy another in a New York minute
in my area, XLE's start around C$34,000 and up.
CE's start around C$30,000 and up
LE's start around C$32,000 and up
Yes, Engine sludge at 17,000 miles.
Yes, many rattles, creaks and groans.
Yes to automatic door problem (open and closes on its own).
No to window problems.
Yes to tire and alignment problems.
Yes to moldy, mildewy smell from AC unit.
No to brake problems, but they are noisy and make a loud clunking noise when car is in reverse.
Brent
Cliffy1, you have any insight? Anyone ever do this job on their Sienna? Mine's a '99 XLE w/painted bumper.
I bet the EOM part is expensive, so is there an aftermarket part? Think I could find one in a salvage yard? Thanks!
yep, door can open beyond 90 degree, has front fender marks on the door now.
???? Anyone have these door stops break on your vans, Would this be covered under the warranty?
He did mention to the service rep that the top of the door didn't line up right, his reply, you probably opened the door too wide (let it swing). Guess that surely will happen if the stop was broken.
Had the van since new, if I remember, warranty work as follows:
Replaced wiring harness- headlight/tail/dash - lights out - intermittent - @6,000 mile
Front rotors and brakes replaced @15,000
After reading this board I better check the van to see if it has your problems.
My wife and I are owners of a Sienna 2000 LE minivan that was built in - you guessed it - July 2000. Along with the check engine light/torque converter problem, we have had a variety of other problems that the dealer has been unable/unwilling to fix.
- After torque converter replacement on the Sienna, the trans shifts funny on the 1-2 shift
- Steering wheel was tilted to the left after torque converter replacement and inside edges of each of the front tires is completely bald after 18K miles
- Loud click or clunk when backing up vehicle (my wife thought she ran over the kids bike)
- Rear window washer leaks continually onto back window
- Squeaky seats and sliding doors stick when trying to open them
- Noticable whine when engine idles (I think this could be normal)
Has anyone else had any of these problems? If so, has anyone had a dealer successfully resolve any of these issues? We are at wits end and ABSOLUTELY SICK OF THE DEALER TELLING US ALL THIS STUFF IS NORMAL!!!!! We have had 0 success with the service department. The regional guy came out (Mike Fleisher) in IL and told us that the car did shift funny and the alignment was off and the tires were bald but it wasn't Toyotas fault! It was beyond belief he could stand there and be ashamed of what he was telling me!!!!
Can anyone offer any ideas or assistance in solving these problems? Thank you in advance for any help that can be offered...
Steve
steveparavola@erealtorheaven.com
- The clunk noise when backing up may be your AC compressor. I know this doesn't sound right, but if you are backing up immediately after starting up you may be associating the AC kicking in with the act of backing up. The AC will do this right at start up.
- There is a TSB on the window washer and your dealer should be able to fix this very quickly.
- The engine whine is the alternator and as you guessed, it is normal.
As for the others, I can't help but I hope this is a start.
also i had a whining problem. dealer is going to replace alternator.
also had a/c musty odor. dealer said use air freshener spray!
drivers side manual door sticking. dealer adjusted it
also a/c does not seem very cold. dealer said bring it back in the summer and they will test it
the last problem is power steering pump whines when it is first started on very cold days. it acts like it is low on fluid (it is not) this goes away after first 3-4 minutes. can anyone help me with this? dealer said its within normal specs!
other than above its been smooth sailing for 30K...
Regarding the musty AC odor. I have it, too. Dealer has "fixed" it twice by cleaning it out and deodorizing, but it comes back. I recall hearing about a TSB on this, but can't find it anywhere. The dealer claims he is doing what he is supposed to (and getting reimbursed from Toyota under warranty repairs each time), but I will be out of warranty in about 8,000 miles and want this fixed. Moisture is accumulating somewhere and becoming moldy and mildewy. It needs a way to drain or dry out or else it is just going to keep coming back (I live in the south, so this is a year-round problem)
JJ35 - 2000 Sienna XLE, engine sludge at 17,000 miles.
If anyone has the factory toyota part number for the factory wiring harness I'd appreciate that as well, sounds like a more expensive but cleaner solution.
Thanks,
dfh.
Harry
My '99 XLE has 52K-plus miles and has been excellent! I downplay minor things like whining brakes and some squeaks and rattles (although mine has always been noise-free)! Only noise I get is squeak when rear seats are folded forward. I've owned many different cars, and I'm 110% sold on Toyota build quality and reliability. My next purchase will be a Tundra!
No fires
No sludge (Changed at 1,000 then 4,000 to Mobil synth)
Some rattles come and go. No big deal.
Yes, power door problems ( see post 1221, 1248, 1376) All fixed
No wheel alignment problems
No tire complaints
No clicking noises
No to moldy, mildew smell from AC unit. But, I do crack the window and run the heater with outside air (not on recurclate) to vent out the moist air. Summer time will vent when the day is not to hot.
No break problems.
Like the van a lot. Great on trips and in the city.