I am very impressed with what I've seen so far of the 350Z. But, you have to wonder with the price of a loaded 350Z around 35K, what corners did they cut and what did they sacrifice to keep the price down?? I am thinking about getting one, but I need to see what everyone says after they've been out for at least 6 months.
... there's no cruise control on the base model Z. Nissan seems to have a lot of options and accessories for the Z; it's not like buying a Prelude, where everything is standard equipment. Honda-Acura does a good job on that note.
I'm also curious to see what the Z looks like, holistically. The current edmunds long-term review of the new Altima has been less than glowing when it comes to the little things - complaints like distorted front windshield glass that only strengthen the "80% engine 20% car" image that Nissan seems to be developing for itself in my mind. Moreover I usually react badly to mass advertising, and the 350Z ads on the internet have done more to ruin my web-surfing experience than any other single internet event of the last three years. If I see another "it's fast, it's sexy, buy one now" 350Z zipping across my screen, I'm going to take a bat to the first one I see in a parking lot and render it less fast and less sexy.
That's not to say that it won't be a home run - it might well be. However, while I'm seeing neat things from Nissan I'm still waiting for that home run.
... but like Honda and the Prelude, you're gonna have a difficult time finding a Z at the nearest Nissan dealer.
At least those Altimas at the dealer give a favorable impression of the Nissan line overall. The front is stylish and so is the rear. Completely unlike the last generation!
There's a Sentra SE-R, blue, automatic transmission, sunroof package at Ann Arbor Nissan. Been sitting on the lot for a month... $18,000 sticker. Very nice, why doesn't anyone buy it? If I was on the market for a car this year (I bought the Integra in May 2001), I would jump at it.
Home run? You're talking about Nissan bringing over the Silvia and the GTR? Yes, I'm waiting for that too!
What a spectacular looking car in person! I've been impressed by the pictures, but in person, the new Z is beautiful.
I saw the G35 as well (a few on the street and a few on display). I'm not too keen on the looks (especially the rear end).
But alas a z is not available with a sunroof (yeah, yeah I know the sunroof adds weight and reduces bending resistance, but I never track my cars and almost always drive with the dunroof open), so it is out of contention and off my shortlist. I still can't wait to drive one though.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
The HP figures on the Z and G35 coupe have not been finalized. Nissan continues to tell people a HP number with a + for both vehicles.
BTW, someone mentioned the seat controls being under the right driver's thigh in the G. Maybe under a large person's thigh. I've driven the same G several times now and not once have I even brushed the controls with my leg. It's the edge of the cushion...an area my thigh never touches.
Can the new Z and the G35 coupe look any more alike? They are a direct knock-off, except for the rear end styling (much better on the Z)! I'd take the G35 with the better warranty! The Z will command an over sticker price for months, while Infiniti will ALWAYS negotiate! They both look good. Nissan's doing some things.....I heard things.....
The 350z has a shorter wheelbase than the G35 and it's only a 2 seater. They look somewhat alike, but in terms of design focus, one is a GT and the other a sports car.
The g35 coupe is 4 inches shorter than the G35 sedan, but still has a longer wheelbase than the 350Z. The G35 Coupe is 2+2, has a trunk and its engine is rated at 275+ HP, while the G35 sedan gets only 260 HP. The G35 coupe's several inches lower and over two inches wider than the G35 Sedan.
All three cars share the same platform, but obviously it's used differently for each vehicle.
anyone heard prices yet? Am I wrong to assume that the coupe will be a little cheaper than the sedan? Maybe it'll start under $26 grand! That's the same price as a 2001 Prelude, and look how much more you get!
if the new 350Z will accomodate tall (6'2") drivers? I know the designers of the original Z cars were adamant that their product accomodate two tall adults. Hopefully, this will still be a consideration!
Also, does anybody have information on how much the convertible version may sticker for? According to Edmunds, a convertible will be available this summer.
At the Cleveland Auto Show, I had an opportunity to sit in the silver 350z show car. I am 6' even. I specifically checked for headroom with respect to my own liking. I can only say that my feeling was "okay, there is not a lot of extra headroom here, but I can live with it". There was probably two inches from the top of my head to the roof.
I admittedly have a relatively long torso and short legs. However, based on what I remember if I were 6'2", I would definitely wait to sit in one before committing.
The reason they have not set horsepower and torque numbers I have been told, is that Nissan is considering releasing this car with direct gas-injection. They have been experimenting with it for about 5 years. If this car comes to market with it, it will produce a 10% increase in horsepower and gas mileage. Hence an easy 300 ponies. Even at 280 ponies this car has a better power to weight ratio than the old 5 speed twin turbo in 1996. This car also will have a 25000 lower base sticker than a porshe 3.2l boxter. While we all know that porshe is an incredible car from an engineering point. This Z represents the best performance for the buck on the market. I sell Nissans for a living. I have personally ordered 3 for my customers. Nissan has told us that this car will deliver on performance. This is not going to look fast. It is going to set a new standard in the sports car market. With the addition of Nismos this fall, there will be hop up parts over the counter at the dealer that will be backed by the warranty. We are set to receive our first batch of presold cars in Aug. There was even a hint that it may be july. In any case, we have seen a huge amount of interest in this car. I can't wait to read about all the shoot outs that is going to happen this fall in the car magazines against the Z. I really pity the poor fella that buys a boxter right now for the purpose of performance. He will get eaten at the stop light.
When I hear something reguarding the the wholesale release date, I will post it here. We are usually told 1 to 3 days before the media. When I know more about anything, I will put it here for all to enjoy. I can say this, of the original allocation of 15 Z's for our dealership, we have sold 9 so far. As we get ever so closer, I too am waiting patiently. I think this car may be a sellout after the press gets their hands on one. My manager has sat in the car at the New York auto show. He says it looks soo much better in person.
The Porsche Boxster S and Nissan 350Z are totally different cars, and most likely aren't cross-shopped at all.
I doubt the 350z will handle like the Porsche, and the Porsche weighs 400+lbs less, negating the hp difference. I would be shocked to see the Z outrace it on a track.
Bottom line is that someone who wants a convertible buys the Porsche. Z doesn't even have a sunroof, and thus isn't even a consideration for me or some others i know.
Jeckels: I'm not so sure that the 350Z will set a new standard for the sports car market, other than price. There are plenty of cars on the market with equal or better performance. Plus, whatever price standard is set by the 350Z will pretty much be matched by the RX8. However, I can understand your enthusiasm since you sell Nissans.
That being said, I saw the 350Z (Fairlady) at the Houston autoshow and I LIKE IT! 280+ hp and sharp handling for around $30K. Plus, I like the fact that the power is obtained from a V6 rather than a 4 banger. Yes, it's impressive that cars like the S2000 can squeeze 100 hp/liter, but I want torque and I don't want to have to flog the engine.
The practicality of the RX8's four doors and rear seats is appealing, but I just don't trust rotary engines.
The following is not clear to me. (a) costs $970 to upgrade from a 6-speed manual to an automatic in the Enthusiast trim (b) costs $1590 to change an automatic to a 6-speed manual in the Touring trim
If it is more expensive than an automatic, shouldn't it save $1590 in getting an automatic in the Enthusiast trim?
I for one would like to get the touring trim with a 6-speed and find the above puzzling.
At 9am this morning Nissan announced the release date of 8-15-02 to the dealers. This means they will ship on this date. The first cars should hit lots one to two days later.
will appear within 6 months of introduction, if Nissan is going to come close to achieving their aggressive high volume sales goals for the 350Z. As I recall, they intend to sell something like 30,000+ 350Z's in the first year. That equates to roughly double the entire cummulative number of S2000's sold in the nearly three years since it was introduced in late 1999. So, no matter how desireable the product is, it's still a mass production car that will likely be discounted in order to achieve volume goals.
In addition, Infiniti/ Nissan has a reputation for being relatively quick to begin discounting. I was tempted to replace my 1995 Maxima with a 2002 SE 6-speed. When they first came out last fall, they were "hot" and selling close to MSRP. Within 3 months, I could have gotten one for a couple of hundred over invoice (or less with dealer incentives). I have even heard of $1,500 discounts on the G35, and I've only seen a couple on the road.
As much as I love my S2000, I'm glad I got a 2002 model last fall with it's modest improvements and refinements for slightly under MSRP. I probably would not be as happy had I got a 2000/2001 at $3-5k over MSRP, even though that's still a bargain compared to the $55k Boxster S I also considered.
For anyone considering paying over MSRP for a 350Z, my only advice is to make sure you are comfortable with paying that premium for a relatively short period of exclusivity. If Nissan meets their sales objectives, within 6 months there will be more on the road than S2000's and within a year and a half they will be more common than anyone who paid over list will want to imagine.
Absolute sales numbers don't quite guarantee discounts, as one might notice from comparatively high volume vehicles such as, oh, say a Honda Odyssey. There also needs to be a relatively tepid demand, and I suspect that in spite of Nissan's marketing efforts that will prove to be the case. The 350Z is fairly expensive - it pretty much starts at $30k with fees, taxes, etc., and with interest the typical purchase cost is going to be over $30k and possibly as high as $40k with some trims, typical state tax and loan interest. We usually don't factor things like tax and interest into our debates, but they are a real-world issue for buyers who are actually trying to decide if they should sign on the bottom line.
No matter how good the car is, there isn't a huge market for $30k+ two-seaters with no roof window or convertible top. Personally I am skeptical that Nissan can sell 30k units per year... maybe worldwide, definitely not in the U.S. - that said, this is a car I would be very interested in owning a year or two from now. If you could get one lightly used or around invoice, it'd be an absolute steal. At sticker or above, it becomes a more polished Mustang SVT Cobra. (Another car that would be hard to sell 30k copies of per annum.)
A few people here mentioned this, but does anyone know how these two will compare in terms of handling?
From what I've heard it will be premature to dismiss the Z, but I really don't know much...
Also, isn't the Z related to the skyline (sp?) platform? Again, I don't know how closely related they are, but I hear the skyline car in Japan is quite impressive...
The new Nissan Skyline sedan (Infiniti G35) will spawn the new Skyline R35 GT-R coupe as well as the Infiniti G35 coupe, it seems. The 350Z is also the same platform.
Between them all, I would go for the G35 coupe... great interior! The R35 GT-R pics shown at freshalloy.com ... yawn! The R34 GT-R is ashamed of the new concept. Yeech.
the Z and the skyline used to be completely different and in fact, highly competitive platforms. now that Ghosn is in charge, that's all changed as verozahl has elaborated. I believe the G35 / R35 is just a slightly longer wheelbase Z.
Why should the G/Sky/Z be on different platforms? Because you don't like the idea of the Z sharing components with a sedan?
It's basic economics. If you can build a platform that translates well to several niches, you can keep costs down. The Z's a low number car, as is the G, but combined their numbers nearly equal the sales of a major production. Build one able platform and share it.
Look at the length of both the G35 coupe and 350Z. You will see that the Z is significantly shorter than the G. In addition, the Z is a two seater hatchback and the G is a 2+2 coupe.
The R35 GT-R concept looks ready-made to be badged as an Infiniti. I don't know if it will really work as a NSX competitor if they make it on the Z-platform. To me, "GT-R" should induce pissing-in-pants. The idea would be for me to win the lottery and drive one here around Detroit and make all the GT40 people (all half dozen of them that could afford it) piss in their pants too.
I like the Z, but the Z is affordable. I'm an Economics-Political Science student, but if we got into Economics or Politics here, we'd talk about why we should all be buying Pontiacs and not Japanese cars. Nope... Nissan needs to crash onto the scene with the hottest import sports monster. It's gotta be bigger than life. It can't be just an oversized Z-car on an oversized Z-car platform. In short, it can't be logical.
You could have said the same thing about previous GT-Rs. They were based on the Skyline platform, which is a family sedan in Japan. They added the twin-turbocharged the inline-6 engine (descended from the original 240Z, by the way) and a really advanced AWD system, and voila!, a supercar.
I think part of the reason we're all so crazy about the GT-R in the US is that we're not allowed to have them here. That's part of the allure.
Let's revist a bit of economics real quick. In 1990 Nissan introduced the last iteration of the Z to North America and the full-bore version was $35,000 and rose to over $40,000 by the end of its life.
The price niche it was in was only survived by two cars really: the Corvette and the M3. The NSX doesn't count because in my opinion the only way it survived was because Honda had a big enough ego and wallet to keep it around while horribly unprofitable and hasn't improved it meaningfully.
Nissan does not need any more unprofitable, expensive high-end sports cars right now. IF those are to ever come, they must come AFTER a few hundred thousand 350Zs are moved and the brand is respected again as a sportscar manufacturer.
Regarding the R32-34 Skyline fantasies, they have some topics here dedicated to that. Might do some research, a number of folks that bought Motorex conversions are surprised that their car is no more reliable than any other beat-upon used sportscar.
Um, if Infiniti does release a GT-R here, you can bet your bottom dollar it won't be some over-priced vanity car like the 90k MSRP NSX.
I'm willing to bet the GT-R, based on the same platform as the G35c will be much more like BMW's M3...take the coupe, beef it up with a hot engine, some body tweaks, a suspension mod (possibly an AWD system - yuck) and give it a price that's competitive with the M3.
A 90k NSX fighter is an exercise in corporate stupidity. Go for the M's, the true leaders in the sport sedan market. At 45k a GT-R with 400 ponies and a modded G35c body will offer a nice counter-punch to the M3.
My neighbor wants to order a 350Z. He wants to know if you can get the car with the same size tires all round or if the rear and front tires have to be different. He worries about tire rotation and price of new tires. Any answers will be appreciated. Thanks.
Then maybe he shouldn't be considering the car. There is a definate reason for the two sizes and I don't think anyone would want to have the same sized tires on all four corners of this car.
Comments
Am I being overly skeptical or what?
That's not to say that it won't be a home run - it might well be. However, while I'm seeing neat things from Nissan I'm still waiting for that home run.
At least those Altimas at the dealer give a favorable impression of the Nissan line overall. The front is stylish and so is the rear. Completely unlike the last generation!
There's a Sentra SE-R, blue, automatic transmission, sunroof package at Ann Arbor Nissan. Been sitting on the lot for a month... $18,000 sticker. Very nice, why doesn't anyone buy it? If I was on the market for a car this year (I bought the Integra in May 2001), I would jump at it.
Home run? You're talking about Nissan bringing over the Silvia and the GTR? Yes, I'm waiting for that too!
I saw the G35 as well (a few on the street and a few on display). I'm not too keen on the looks (especially the rear end).
But alas a z is not available with a sunroof (yeah, yeah I know the sunroof adds weight and reduces bending resistance, but I never track my cars and almost always drive with the dunroof open), so it is out of contention and off my shortlist. I still can't wait to drive one though.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
-Colin
it looks like the G35 coupe will almost match the horsepower at 275hp?!?
BTW, someone mentioned the seat controls being under the right driver's thigh in the G. Maybe under a large person's thigh. I've driven the same G several times now and not once have I even brushed the controls with my leg. It's the edge of the cushion...an area my thigh never touches.
The coupe will have a more powerful engine, I think I heard.
All three cars share the same platform, but obviously it's used differently for each vehicle.
Also, does anybody have information on how much the convertible version may sticker for? According to Edmunds, a convertible will be available this summer.
At the Cleveland Auto Show, I had an opportunity to sit in the silver 350z show car. I am 6' even. I specifically checked for headroom with respect to my own liking. I can only say that my feeling was "okay, there is not a lot of extra headroom here, but I can live with it". There was probably two inches from the top of my head to the roof.
I admittedly have a relatively long torso and short legs. However, based on what I remember if I were 6'2", I would definitely wait to sit in one before committing.
Hope this helps.
Road course that is, not the dragstrip.
-Colin
I doubt the 350z will handle like the Porsche, and the Porsche weighs 400+lbs less, negating the hp difference. I would be shocked to see the Z outrace it on a track.
Bottom line is that someone who wants a convertible buys the Porsche. Z doesn't even have a sunroof, and thus isn't even a consideration for me or some others i know.
That said, it looks like a great value.
That being said, I saw the 350Z (Fairlady) at the Houston autoshow and I LIKE IT! 280+ hp and sharp handling for around $30K. Plus, I like the fact that the power is obtained from a V6 rather than a 4 banger. Yes, it's impressive that cars like the S2000 can squeeze 100 hp/liter, but I want torque and I don't want to have to flog the engine.
The practicality of the RX8's four doors and rear seats is appealing, but I just don't trust rotary engines.
(a) costs $970 to upgrade from a 6-speed manual to an automatic in the Enthusiast trim
(b) costs $1590 to change an automatic to a 6-speed manual in the Touring trim
If it is more expensive than an automatic, shouldn't it save $1590 in getting an automatic in the Enthusiast trim?
I for one would like to get the touring trim with a 6-speed and find the above puzzling.
Best
Reddy
2. Is there a pic w/aero package?
3. Is there a pic w/splash guards, kick plate?
4. Carsdirect already has it for $750 over MSRP!
In addition, Infiniti/ Nissan has a reputation for being relatively quick to begin discounting. I was tempted to replace my 1995 Maxima with a 2002 SE 6-speed. When they first came out last fall, they were "hot" and selling close to MSRP. Within 3 months, I could have gotten one for a couple of hundred over invoice (or less with dealer incentives). I have even heard of $1,500 discounts on the G35, and I've only seen a couple on the road.
As much as I love my S2000, I'm glad I got a 2002 model last fall with it's modest improvements and refinements for slightly under MSRP. I probably would not be as happy had I got a 2000/2001 at $3-5k over MSRP, even though that's still a bargain compared to the $55k Boxster S I also considered.
For anyone considering paying over MSRP for a 350Z, my only advice is to make sure you are comfortable with paying that premium for a relatively short period of exclusivity. If Nissan meets their sales objectives, within 6 months there will be more on the road than S2000's and within a year and a half they will be more common than anyone who paid over list will want to imagine.
No matter how good the car is, there isn't a huge market for $30k+ two-seaters with no roof window or convertible top. Personally I am skeptical that Nissan can sell 30k units per year... maybe worldwide, definitely not in the U.S. - that said, this is a car I would be very interested in owning a year or two from now. If you could get one lightly used or around invoice, it'd be an absolute steal. At sticker or above, it becomes a more polished Mustang SVT Cobra. (Another car that would be hard to sell 30k copies of per annum.)
From what I've heard it will be premature to dismiss the Z, but I really don't know much...
Also, isn't the Z related to the skyline (sp?) platform? Again, I don't know how closely related they are, but I hear the skyline car in Japan is quite impressive...
Between them all, I would go for the G35 coupe... great interior! The R35 GT-R pics shown at freshalloy.com ... yawn! The R34 GT-R is ashamed of the new concept. Yeech.
the Z and the skyline used to be completely different and in fact, highly competitive platforms. now that Ghosn is in charge, that's all changed as verozahl has elaborated. I believe the G35 / R35 is just a slightly longer wheelbase Z.
-Colin
It's basic economics. If you can build a platform that translates well to several niches, you can keep costs down. The Z's a low number car, as is the G, but combined their numbers nearly equal the sales of a major production. Build one able platform and share it.
Look at the length of both the G35 coupe and 350Z. You will see that the Z is significantly shorter than the G. In addition, the Z is a two seater hatchback and the G is a 2+2 coupe.
I like the Z, but the Z is affordable. I'm an Economics-Political Science student, but if we got into Economics or Politics here, we'd talk about why we should all be buying Pontiacs and not Japanese cars. Nope... Nissan needs to crash onto the scene with the hottest import sports monster. It's gotta be bigger than life. It can't be just an oversized Z-car on an oversized Z-car platform. In short, it can't be logical.
I think part of the reason we're all so crazy about the GT-R in the US is that we're not allowed to have them here. That's part of the allure.
Let's revist a bit of economics real quick. In 1990 Nissan introduced the last iteration of the Z to North America and the full-bore version was $35,000 and rose to over $40,000 by the end of its life.
The price niche it was in was only survived by two cars really: the Corvette and the M3. The NSX doesn't count because in my opinion the only way it survived was because Honda had a big enough ego and wallet to keep it around while horribly unprofitable and hasn't improved it meaningfully.
Nissan does not need any more unprofitable, expensive high-end sports cars right now. IF those are to ever come, they must come AFTER a few hundred thousand 350Zs are moved and the brand is respected again as a sportscar manufacturer.
Regarding the R32-34 Skyline fantasies, they have some topics here dedicated to that. Might do some research, a number of folks that bought Motorex conversions are surprised that their car is no more reliable than any other beat-upon used sportscar.
-Colin
I'm willing to bet the GT-R, based on the same platform as the G35c will be much more like BMW's M3...take the coupe, beef it up with a hot engine, some body tweaks, a suspension mod (possibly an AWD system - yuck) and give it a price that's competitive with the M3.
A 90k NSX fighter is an exercise in corporate stupidity. Go for the M's, the true leaders in the sport sedan market. At 45k a GT-R with 400 ponies and a modded G35c body will offer a nice counter-punch to the M3.
= some don't wear out first
= longer interval before replacing all 4 tires as a set
= lower cost Q.E.D.