I'm sure this has been discussed here before, however, in another forum we're having a discussion regarding these two vehicles. So, a few questions, if you don't mind:
• One poster mentioned that the middle seat of the MPV can be slid while there is a passenger occupying it, and that to move the Honda's middle seat the seat must be unoccupied. Is that true?
• And, if that is true, has anyone found that to be an inconvenience in any way?
• I know the Odyssey is larger and more powerful than the MPV, but would you share some other observations between the two vehicles?
• Besides the sliding middle seat, the MPV supporter also mentioned that the MPV has roll-down rear door windows, and a rear seat that can fold out for a tailgate party. Also mentioned was the fact that because it is smaller, it is more nimble and more fun to drive.
Could you pick the color? Any other advice you can give me. I am on the waiting list. willing to wait the year for this savings but need advice from others who have dealt with UBS.
For the center seat to move there can NOT be someone sitting on them since you need to lift rear of seat, move seat over and drop rear down. But really hasn't been an inconvenience in any way.
Ody does not have any windows that roll down other than the two front windows. But the rear seat does fold back for tailgate party.
Here are some additional things to take back:
Honda has 240hp engine Mazda 160 Honda is 14 inches longer and 700 lbs heavier yet gets better gas mileage than the Mazda.
And lastly the Honda is safer and has been rated as the best minivan by every magazine and consumer group.
I haven't driven the MPV but have owned a 2000 Ody EX for 2 years and I am in the process of trading in for the 2002 EX-L Navi.
The Honda is a much better vehicle. See the two vehicles compared (please put the following 3 lines of the address end to end with no space on your browser).
There is a 3.0 MPV forum here on Edmunds. I have read that the 3.0L V6 in the new MPV will be similar to that in the Tribute (200HP, 206 Lb-Ft). The new MPV will also have a 5-speed automatic tranny, traction control, and you can get power rear door openers. The new engine with the 5-speed tranny should produce an improvement on fuel economy over the current 2.5 V6. The 2WD Tribute is rated a 18 city, 24 highway and that is with a 4-speed auto tranny. If the 5-speed is geared a little taller in overdrive, the fuel economy may be better than the 18/24.
I cross-shoped the MPV and ODY a couple years ago but decided not to go with either because I can't carry my family of 5 plus all the gear we need for an extended road trip because the 2nd row of seats is limited to 2 passengers. We currently have a lease on a 2000 Caravan (short wheel-base). I am able to remove the 2-seat bench and roll the 3-seat bench up into the 2nd row. This gives me seating for 5 plus a lot of cargo room behind the middle row. The big drawback is that I can only seat 5 when I get to where I am going. I like the seating lay-out for the new Chevy Venture - seating for 8, fold away 3rd row bench . . . unfortunately, the crash worthiness of the Venture is a bit suspect.
I read another post here on the Ody board about someone wanting to do a conversion to get a 3-seat 2nd row of seats in the Ody . . . if that person finds someone that could do it, post it here on this board because I would be interested in that as well.
The thing I liked better about the MPV than the Ody was the size. The Ody was a bit too big for my tastes. The MPV suited my needs better.
The dimensions of the van have not changed in the past 2 years at all. I think the Ody has a great deal of space behind the third row especially since it has that deep well for the folding seat, but if that wasn't enough two years ago when you initially looked at it it certainly hasn't changed any. But in all sincerity if space is your concern you certainly should not be looking at the Mazda. If anything look at the Windstar, I think that is the largest of the minivans now.
$1300 for the Leather and $350 for the heaters I was sitting there why he talked with the Classic guy and was getting the prices. That is what he wrote as he talked and said since this was the first they had done business with Classic I could have it at cost.
I'm looking at new vans for my wife and have pretty much decided on the Odyssey (Looked at Sienna, but invoice +$700 was equal to Odyssey MSRP!)Anyway, to my point. I was wondering what the forums thoughts were on this. I cringe at paying $27,190 for an EX, but was thinking instead of getting an LX for $24,690 and have the dealer install the remote entry for approx. $300. Then, I've seen out on H & A acces. you can buy 02 EX alloys for about $130/ea, set of 4 installed would be about $600. Also at H & A you can get the Honda in-dash 6 disk CD changer, which I could install myself for $299. When I total all this up it comes to about $25,900, about $1300 less than the EX. What I don't get is Pwr. Drivers seat, lumbar support, Auto. A/C control, 2 addn. speakers, Steering wheel audio controls, Homelink garage opener, cargo net, Pwr. sliding doors (Odysseys only apparent maint. problem), Security system and Auto-off headlights. What does everyone think of this idea? Would an LX be easier to find than an EX. What are the groups thoughts. I ran some trade-in values on KBB (dealers favorite reference)and for 99's the LX-EX gap is about $1300 and when you add the CD changer and Alloys to the LX it closes to about $600. So what are everyone's thoughts. 4Lubes
I am also trying to decide between the 2001 MPV and the 2002 Ody. The MPV can be found at huge discounts, in Columbus, OH all MPVs are advertised $5000 below MSRP. An MPV comparable to the Ody LX (The MPV is without traction control, but with heated mirrors, a CD player, an alarm system and remote entry) can be had for $20,000.
I've found the Ody LX for 24,000 ($660 under MSRP) in Cleveland. I test drove the MPV before hearing about the underpowered engine and imperfect trans. I thought it felt ok but I didn't drive it on the highway. Clearly the Ody is a bigger, better vehicle but I'm just not sure it's worth $4000 more. What is a reasonble amout to pay for 80 HP, a 5th gear, and a 14 inch longer van? I'd also like to know what people think about:
1. the value of traction control. 2. reliabilty and availability of parts for the two vans. 3. The extra resale value I can expect by buying a 2002 rather than a 2001 (even if the total miles when I sell will be the same.)
Also, Where is the other discussion comparing the two vans?
I was looking at buying the LX and adding the in-dash cd changer ($300), and the roof rack($225)and doing the labor myself. Then I was going to pay the dealer $400 for the keyless entry. Total cost of options = $925. The net difference between the EX and LX = approx $1575. After taking into account the time and effort to install the CD changer and roof rack, both of which didn't look TOO easy, I decided on the EX. I also wanted the alloys, but wouldn't pay to add them to an LX. In addition to all the extras you list, the factory cloth in the LX is much nicer and this supposedly has heat rejecting glass, which could make a big comfort difference if it works. I also wasn't crazy about the speed of the power sliding doors but reading many posts on this and other boards convinced me they might be a nice convenience in the long run. (as long as they don't break)I'm picking up my Silver EX today at msrp and I got the dealer to include the cross bars and mud guards at no extra charge. I'm in the Wash DC area. As far as availability, there are fewer LX's available as the EX has a higher profit margin and Honda is making a great deal more of them. Good luck and if you can swing it, I'd go with the EX. I plan on keeping the vehicle 10 years, as I do with most of my vehicles and if you look at it that way, it's only and extra $157 per year over the 10 years.
I am surprised that there are people who are willing to pay thousands more than MSRP and there are suckers (opps, i meant dealers) who are willing to ask more on a Minivan. Don't deal with the dealers that ask more than MSRP. I suggest black list those guys who are willing to rob you to make more than fair share of profit already provided by manfucaturer in MSRP. No service or future sale business to them ever - tell all your friends and relatives to keep away from those suckers.
A Minivan is just a family hauler, not a fancy custom designed limited edition must have sports car. Odyssey is a fine vehicle - reliable (like Toyota) and spacious (but unlike Toyota), but kind of very boring to look at. Reminds of a big hiking shoe box on four wheels (that is a personal opinion so no debate).
I have a loaded 1999 GC sports, and is very satisfied till now, kids like it, drives great and sound of infinity stereo is awesome. It does the job for which it was baught thank fully with no problems till now (touchwood!). It was baught at much lower cost than a Honda so it will be sold at somewhat lower price at the end of its life with me so no big deal. As I already have Accord, buying yet another Honda was somewhat out of question more so my son didn't like Odyssey looks, and there was a wait list, and Toyota didn't have luggage space and was expensive.
In short, don't pay premiun - its not worth it. I can't believe people will wait for years or drive miles to pick up an appliance of a family vehicle. Look at alternatives, and like thousands of other families with Minivans other than Honda, you are likely to be greatly satisfied.
Having had a presonal experience with a Windstall and watching my brother suffer through 3 Chrysler vans before moving on to GM (oy!) I had no problem waiting for an Ody. Of course I didn't wait long and didn't pay over list. I did comparison shop and the Ody at list is still a good value vs a Chrysler discounted and will hold a great deal more value even years down the road (barring some strange change in the market). If you are going to hold the van for 200,000 miles (my neighbor does indeed have a 94 Voyager with 180,000 miles on it and is doing OK other than transmissions) it won't matter.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Well to answer your question I'll have to ask some questions in return:
1. Do you think your added safety as well as your passenger's is worth extra $4K?*
2. Do you need the extra space? Because no matter how good the deal, if you don't get the space you need, it's a moot point.
3. How long do you think that 2.5L Duratech engine's going to last doing family hualing duty? Sure it's great for the Ford Contour and lighter cars, but at 160 hp in a near 2 ton vehicle, it becomes a safety risk, IMHO.
The only disadvantage I see with the Ody are for those that have 5 people families, (you can't split the 3rd rows). As for MSRP, that's all relative, I can argue that Honda priced their MSRP lower than most manufacturers while others have inflated theirs. I'd rather be the one who decides how much a vehicle is worth to me, not some bean counting accountant!
* Not too sound cynical, but stuff does happen, just got into a little side fender bender with a Chevy full size van. The bumper's ripped off and the driver's quarter panel is damaged, but that's about it, van still drove fine.
Well the Odyssey holds 7 but maybe not in great comfort, and not 7 adults. You can put a lot of your stuff on top of the car or pull a small trailer. I knew a guy that had a larger family then 5 and he bought a used Chev. Suburban. You can also buy a large van. Some families have two cars with the wife driving one and the husband driving the other on trips. It also lets you seperate the kids you have that don't get along.
I think the Odyssey is going to be very cost effective over its life cycle. That is the amount of money you have to put into it over the period you have it, taking what you get back in resale value.
I live in an area that has about 3 times the auto accidents that Los Angeles has. The way I know this is I use to live in LA and I can count the accidents I see here and in LA. Also drivers love to tail gate me and I drive above the speed limit usually. I did not need a car as big as the Odyssey, but I wanted safety. Sure enough I got hit after living here 4 years, as I told everybody in LA that I would, with two other near misses. After $4,200 plus $750 in auto rental fees from the other guys insurance company, my Odyssey is like new. The dealer had trouble getting the power doors to work right but they do now.
I spent about 3 months researching what kind of car to buy. I filled about 10 3 ring binders with information and came up with the Odyssey. The proof that I have made the right decision is I have had no regrets like I have had with other cars I have bought.
Sorry, I had to get my kick in on this dog. 2 (of many) things to consider if for some insane reason someone would consider the MPV over the Odyssey.......
1. Um, thats a Ford engine in that MPV. (don't make me spell out what F.O.R.D. means, please.)
2. Re-sell value (PERIOD)
Lumanksi 2001 EX 6 Disc in-dash changer Steel Horse Video system
No data here. I will say that where the 02 benefits from the extra ponies is more once it's up to speed - passing and things like that. As minivans go it is rather nimble but I wouldn't be signing up at the track just yet.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
My husband and I also had the Ody and MPV as our finalists. We were comparing a reasonably equipped MPV LX vs. a Ody LX, so the price differential was only $1200-1500 (MPV at TMV, Ody at MSRP). The main reasons we ordered an Ody LX last week: 1. Size, size, size. The rear well alone would be enough, plus overall interior room. 2. The quality of interior materials. For instance the rear air (important here in AZ) -- each passenger has their own vent and it really kicks out the cool! 3. Honda reliability and number of dealerships/places to repair cross-country. 4. Bigger engine, although MPV's was enough for the type of driving I do. When it came down to it, the percentage we would have saved wouldn't have been worth it in the long run. All that said, if you need a great smaller van and can't spend quite as much or wait as long, the MPV is it. Also, if you really want the "high-end" stuff like the RES, leather, etc., the MPV does have it at a lower entry price. My .02, vikki26
My dealer just informed me that my van was built and its VIN # is JHKRL18902H523334. They do not know if van was built in Canada or US plant. I thought there was a way to tell from VIN #? Which location was this van built at? Thanks.
Now I am not a Ford fan and both me and my wife have been burned by Ford products in the past. But as far as engines go, the Ford Duratec is one of the more reliable engines out there. The majority of problems I have read regarding Ford products do not involve the engine . . . AC, electrical, transmissions, tires, build quality and such, are common but not much in the way of compliants regarding the engine (at least no more so than other brand engines).
I realize that the Ody is probably the best minivan available right now (my father owns a White 2000 Ody EX Nav) and I have driven his on an extended trip . . . but with only 2 of my 3 kids on that trip. This made it possible to carry 4 people plus all of our gear on the trip. If Honda could develop a 3 seat second row it would make for an even better minivan (at least for my needs). If I am not mistaken, Honda had originally considered offering the Ody with a 3 seat second row bench. Is that right?
It is obviously an option that could be implemented very easily. You could keep the floor brackets in the same spaces and just make the bucket behind the driver into a 2 seat bench. Remove the armrests between the two seats to make a continous seating surface and use the existing floor brackets to hold everything in place. It would be easy enough to flip the single bucket forward to allow access into the third row (my father does this on his Ody because he has put a clutter catcher between the 2nd row bucket seats). It is a simple fix that would add value to the vehicle and they could offer it as an option (after all, they have already done this type of thing with the MDX). For a family transport vehicle, Honda has limited themselves by keeping the 2nd row a 2 passenger space.
your van was built in Canada, the 'H' before the last six digit (serial number).
Breakdown of your VIN from left to right: JHK - Honda of Canada (MultiPurpose Pass. Vehicle) RL1 - Line and engine type Odyssey/J35A1 8 - Body and transmission types 9 - Trim level 0 - Check digit 2 - Model year 2002
The suspect engine is teh 3.8. The Duratech is a 3.0 and a pretty good engine. The 3.8 is prone to all sorts of gasket problems that are insanely expensive to fix. Add that to a Ford tranny and teh electrical glitches and you have a might unpleasant experience.
I learned the hard way.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
But then the kids would have to climb over the 2nd row to get to the 3rd, rather than walk through the space between the two bucket seats that scoot together to form a bench, which also allows room on the right for passage.
I have read on this BB a number of times that Honda did make a Odyssey with a bench seat for three in the middle seat. That Odyssey has different model letters then the LE and LX. It was not popular so they discontinued it. They probably only made it in 1999.
I think you could perhaps be able to find that seat somewhere and install it however. You could ask through the Honda web site http://www.honda.com or your dealer or call Honda.
For the 0-60 sec, check the last issue of Car & Driver, I think it was 8.1 sec. For the MPV, check the current issue of Car & Driver, it reports the long term results of driving that van, not a very positive one. Or you can go to caranddriver.com
Let's try and put this thing to rest once and for all. I have one of the first '99's and the manual contains a picture and info on the available second row bench. It clearly only seats two, NOT three people. Honda changed their minds on the option at the last minute because of it's obvious redundancy. I still don't understand why they didn't carry over the design of the pre 99 second row that seats three people as an option.
Actually the Odyssey with the middle row bench was designated as LX-B, and was to be $400 less than the LX. The normal LX model wax introduced first, in about October of 1998. The EX and LX-B models were supposed to both become available about January of 1999. To the best of my knowledge only the EX appeared as scheduled. It was already apparent that production capacity would not meet demand. The bench described in the brochures was only a 2 passenger bench with a pass through on the right, like everybody else's middle row bench. I have never seen one, never heard form anybody on this board or any other that claimed to have one. One person claimed to have seen one, but I'm not inclined to believe it. I think Honda decided not to bother with a discounted bench seat model when it was already selling all it could build.
By the way, when we travel with 5, it's with one middle seat removed and a cooler strapped down. A huge amount of luggage fits behind the rear seat because of the deep well, and no two kids have to sit in adjacent seats...plenty of room for everybody equals less fighting. We have also use the middle seats spread apart and then the back seat becomes the prized sleeping position.
FWIW Odyssey is bigger inside than Suburban. You want bigger? You've got six choices: Eurovan, Astro/Safari, Excursion, Econoline, Express/Savana, Ram Van.
Thanks everyone for clearing up the 2nd bench seat matter.
Interesting that the Odyssey is bigger then the Suburban, but I can certainly understand it as it has a more efficient design. Looking at my AAA Auto rating book it says that the Suburban seats 9 whereas the Odyssey seats 7. Also for cargo space the S is listed at 45.7 ft cubed and the O at 25.1. But perhaps if you measure total interior space the O comes out ahead or maybe AAA is wrong with their numbers.
Of course the S is going to be much more expensive to buy or to operate. I for one would not want an S. Also if you have a really big family you might consider buying a bus.
I am not at all interested in getting a bigger van. The Ody is the biggest I would consider going with a van (acually, for my tastes, the Ody is TOO big). I would like the option of seating for eight.
Diploid, when I am doing extended traveling with the kids, the 3rd row would be folded away and the kids would all be in the 2nd row. That would eliminate the need to have the kids "climbing over the 2nd row to get to the 3rd row." Also, I do not let my kids get up and move around in the car when it is moving. Also, I like to have a vehicle that is pretty economical to drive. The bigger vehicles (SUV's and full size vans) are gas hogs.
Sub is 18" longer than an Odyssey, wheelbase alone is 12" longer and about 4" wider. Suburban is significantly larger, believe me I've owned both. Its 3 bench seats easily fit 3 people across, each one. My Odyssey fits 3 children w/o car seats in the last bench seat, but adults, no way. The Odyssey (with 3rd seat down) does have a slightly larger cargo capacity (7 more cubic feet) than the Sub. This is a small detail to Sub owners because they can tow downright huge amounts, roughly to a max. of 10,000 lbs. more than the Odyssey. They both have their own strong points.
I think it would be neat if Honda could make a split 30/70 second row that can allow the 30% portion to fold flat into the floor, allowing passage into the 3rd row, and then folding back up to seat the 3 people. But then they'd have to hide the spare somewhere else.
Has anyone noticed that Edmunds TMV - True Market Value for the Odyssey is $2,000 MORE than MSRP? I looked at some of the other van makes and I did not see any others that have a TMV of more than their MSRP. MVP - $1-2,000 less; Toyota - $2,000 less; Chrysler/Dodge - $1-2,000 less; only Kia Sedona had the exact same MSRP and TMV... again I did not look at EVERY van, but what does this TMV mean? Should those who paid MSRP feel OK about paying it since the van is worth more? Those other van buyers are getting their discounts but are actually paying what the van is worth? Maybe Honda uses an MSRP that is more realistic than other van manufacturers...
Took our new van to a football game a couple weeks ago. 7 adults (3 men, 4 women). We comfortably fit everyone, including one of the men in the back row. He was so comfortable, he fell asleep on the way to the game! Now I wouldn't want to drive 7 adults from LA to SF, but a one hour drive to the ball game was no problem. The reason we chose the ODy over the MPV was so we could take 7 to a football game (our usual group of tailgaters)
My '99 Odyssey just had it's third transmission installed. First replacement was after just 5 months. Second replacement at 24K miles. To add insult to injury, the dealer kept it for 5 weeks while we waited for the new transmission. Apparently there were 350 people on a wait list to get this part. The hopeful news is that this time they replaced it with the "updated" transmission -- a redesign vs. the '99 version.
Did my post not read "the Odyssey is bigger inside that the Suburban"?
I realize the Suburban can be had with three bench seats, so It can carry 9, while the Odyssey cannot. For 5, 6 or 7 passengers, and especially for third row passengers who's legs extend more than 8" below the knee, the Odyssey is a more comfortable, easier to enter and exit way to go. I've done time in the third rows of Suburbans, and I'll take the back row of the Odyssey any time.
To tell the truth, I would prefer a Suburban, and tried to talk my wife into one. She told me that I could have one instead of my pickup, but she wanted a minivan. She had been driving a sport sedan and was intimidated by the (exterior) size of the Suburban when she did consent to test drive one. Since that was in 1998 it was the earlier, even bulkier, body style. Back row comfort wouldn't have been all that important to me, because I would have been in the front row!
Somebody pretty smart once told me, "If Momma ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy.". If "Momma" want's a minivan, she's gonna have the best dogone minivan I can find. "Momma" likes her Odyssey, so I like it too!
Has anyone purchased a 2002 dvd for your nav system. I be most interested in any system software improvements you noticed. I'm still using the original 2000 dvd that my van came with.
Image you have to tolerate the annoying and greedy salesman, spend a MSRP on a vehicle, wait for three months to get it and finnaly find out it has some major problems. It is just too difficult for those unlucky owners. I can not think myself being in that position. That is why I am still pondering whether to order an Ody or not. The preparation and expectation of it is just too huge to fail, not to mention the 30K expense.
has anyone been able to buy a 02 ody any model at below msrp? Our dealer says we could get one at a few hundred below, was wondering if anyone got anything better.
It really depends on which part of country you are in. I heard that people in CA consider paying MSRP is a very good deal while people in midwest are looking for under MSRP. NO matter what the dealers offer, always insist on the final drive-out price. Some dealers will write down the selling price for hundreds under MSRP, you thought you've got a good price and go home with a written selling price as promised, so you wait for months and finally the dealer think that you have been waiting long enough and decide it is time for you to purchase the vehicle. You'll be ended up paying even higher than your neighbor who paid MSRP. Why? you'll asked. Simple, that dealer had you to buy a lot of extra add-on, dealer prep...etc. Even if you are not overwhelmed with your dream van in front of you, and you noticed all this, they hope you do not want to go to another dealer and go through the ordeal again to wait for another month or so. My point is, compare the 'drive-out' price instead of the deceiving offered selling price.
I posted this problem here about a week ago but have not seen a reply. I think this is a problem with the Odyssey, and perhaps a serious problem. I would think others have had this problem or is it something with my Odyssey.
I have a 2000 EX Odyssey and when I park it, if I am not very careful I hit something underneath the car with the front parking stop or the front curb, instead of my front tire which was the case with all my other cars.
I took a look at a parking lot and noticed that most of the cars were parked with their front wheel resting against the parking stop. So that is how most drivers know when to stop going forward. With my Odyssey I knew when I hear the bad noise as I hit the parking stop with some part of the car.
I saw a post here where with the wheel well liner, that it can break it, get wrapped around the wheel at high speed and be a serious problem. One person here had this problem so far and posted it.
I don't have the wheel well liner but do have the mud guards.
Since most drivers park their cars till it stops up against something, the tires, I would think this is a problem with a lot of you out there.
If others are not having this problem then maybe it is something wrong with my Odyssey.
I recall hitting something on a bumper in a parking lot once. As I was leaving I heard someone else in a different vehicle also do the same thing. Then I noticed what was wrong. Before your tires hit the stop, part of the under neath connected with the side walk. The tire stops were not far enough back from the sidewalk.
Comments
• One poster mentioned that the middle seat of the MPV can be slid while there is a passenger occupying it, and that to move the Honda's middle seat the seat must be unoccupied. Is that true?
• And, if that is true, has anyone found that to be an inconvenience in any way?
• I know the Odyssey is larger and more powerful than the MPV, but would you share some other observations between the two vehicles?
• Besides the sliding middle seat, the MPV supporter also mentioned that the MPV has roll-down rear door windows, and a rear seat that can fold out for a tailgate party. Also mentioned was the fact that because it is smaller, it is more nimble and more fun to drive.
Comments?
Bob
Ody does not have any windows that roll down other than the two front windows. But the rear seat does fold back for tailgate party.
Here are some additional things to take back:
Honda has 240hp engine Mazda 160
Honda is 14 inches longer and 700 lbs heavier yet gets better gas mileage than the Mazda.
And lastly the Honda is safer and has been rated as the best minivan by every magazine and consumer group.
Have you driven both? And if so, how would you compare them?
Bob
The Honda is a much better vehicle. See the two vehicles compared (please put the following 3 lines of the address end to end with no space on your browser).
http://www.comp.autosite.com/honweb/Compdata.asp?
VehMod=2805&VehTrim=9555&otherMake=35&otherModel=2
554&otherTrim=8411&model=undefined&AdvOnly=No
The only real advantages that the Mazda has are price and not having to wait to get one.
I cross-shoped the MPV and ODY a couple years ago but decided not to go with either because I can't carry my family of 5 plus all the gear we need for an extended road trip because the 2nd row of seats is limited to 2 passengers. We currently have a lease on a 2000 Caravan (short wheel-base). I am able to remove the 2-seat bench and roll the 3-seat bench up into the 2nd row. This gives me seating for 5 plus a lot of cargo room behind the middle row. The big drawback is that I can only seat 5 when I get to where I am going. I like the seating lay-out for the new Chevy Venture - seating for 8, fold away 3rd row bench . . . unfortunately, the crash worthiness of the Venture is a bit suspect.
I read another post here on the Ody board about someone wanting to do a conversion to get a 3-seat 2nd row of seats in the Ody . . . if that person finds someone that could do it, post it here on this board because I would be interested in that as well.
The thing I liked better about the MPV than the Ody was the size. The Ody was a bit too big for my tastes. The MPV suited my needs better.
Good luck
I've found the Ody LX for 24,000 ($660 under MSRP) in Cleveland. I test drove the MPV before hearing about the underpowered engine and imperfect trans. I thought it felt ok but I didn't drive it on the highway. Clearly the Ody is a bigger, better vehicle but I'm just not sure it's worth $4000 more. What is a reasonble amout to pay for 80 HP, a 5th gear, and a 14 inch longer van? I'd also like to know what people think about:
1. the value of traction control.
2. reliabilty and availability of parts for the two vans.
3. The extra resale value I can expect by buying a 2002 rather than a 2001 (even if the total miles when I sell will be the same.)
Also, Where is the other discussion comparing the two vans?
As far as availability, there are fewer LX's available as the EX has a higher profit margin and Honda is making a great deal more of them.
Good luck and if you can swing it, I'd go with the EX. I plan on keeping the vehicle 10 years, as I do with most of my vehicles and if you look at it that way, it's only and extra $157 per year over the 10 years.
There was too much on the EX I didn't need. I went in thinking EX and came out thinking LX.
Got the Silver LX a couple of weeks ago.
A Minivan is just a family hauler, not a fancy custom designed limited edition must have sports car. Odyssey is a fine vehicle - reliable (like Toyota) and spacious (but unlike Toyota), but kind of very boring to look at. Reminds of a big hiking shoe box on four wheels (that is a personal opinion so no debate).
I have a loaded 1999 GC sports, and is very satisfied till now, kids like it, drives great and sound of infinity stereo is awesome. It does the job for which it was baught thank fully with no problems till now (touchwood!). It was baught at much lower cost than a Honda so it will be sold at somewhat lower price at the end of its life with me so no big deal. As I already have Accord, buying yet another Honda was somewhat out of question more so my son didn't like Odyssey looks, and there was a wait list, and Toyota didn't have luggage space and was expensive.
In short, don't pay premiun - its not worth it. I can't believe people will wait for years or drive miles to pick up an appliance of a family vehicle. Look at alternatives, and like thousands of other families with Minivans other than Honda, you are likely to be greatly satisfied.
1. Do you think your added safety as well as your passenger's is worth extra $4K?*
2. Do you need the extra space? Because no matter how good the deal, if you don't get the space you need, it's a moot point.
3. How long do you think that 2.5L Duratech engine's going to last doing family hualing duty? Sure it's great for the Ford Contour and lighter cars, but at 160 hp in a near 2 ton vehicle, it becomes a safety risk, IMHO.
The only disadvantage I see with the Ody are for those that have 5 people families, (you can't split the 3rd rows). As for MSRP, that's all relative, I can argue that Honda priced their MSRP lower than most manufacturers while others have inflated theirs. I'd rather be the one who decides how much a vehicle is worth to me, not some bean counting accountant!
* Not too sound cynical, but stuff does happen, just got into a little side fender bender with a Chevy full size van. The bumper's ripped off and the driver's quarter panel is damaged, but that's about it, van still drove fine.
I think the Odyssey is going to be very cost effective over its life cycle. That is the amount of money you have to put into it over the period you have it, taking what you get back in resale value.
I live in an area that has about 3 times the auto accidents that Los Angeles has. The way I know this is I use to live in LA and I can count the accidents I see here and in LA. Also drivers love to tail gate me and I drive above the speed limit usually. I did not need a car as big as the Odyssey, but I wanted safety. Sure enough I got hit after living here 4 years, as I told everybody in LA that I would, with two other near misses. After $4,200 plus $750 in auto rental fees from the other guys insurance company, my Odyssey is like new. The dealer had trouble getting the power doors to work right but they do now.
I spent about 3 months researching what kind of car to buy. I filled about 10 3 ring binders with information and came up with the Odyssey. The proof that I have made the right decision is I have had no regrets like I have had with other cars I have bought.
1. Um, thats a Ford engine in that MPV. (don't make me spell out what F.O.R.D. means, please.)
2. Re-sell value (PERIOD)
Lumanksi
2001 EX
6 Disc in-dash changer
Steel Horse Video system
Thanks,
Parker
The main reasons we ordered an Ody LX last week:
1. Size, size, size. The rear well alone would be enough, plus overall interior room.
2. The quality of interior materials. For instance the rear air (important here in AZ) -- each passenger has their own vent and it really kicks out the cool!
3. Honda reliability and number of dealerships/places to repair cross-country.
4. Bigger engine, although MPV's was enough for the type of driving I do.
When it came down to it, the percentage we would have saved wouldn't have been worth it in the long run.
All that said, if you need a great smaller van and can't spend quite as much or wait as long, the MPV is it. Also, if you really want the "high-end" stuff like the RES, leather, etc., the MPV does have it at a lower entry price.
My .02,
vikki26
I realize that the Ody is probably the best minivan available right now (my father owns a White 2000 Ody EX Nav) and I have driven his on an extended trip . . . but with only 2 of my 3 kids on that trip. This made it possible to carry 4 people plus all of our gear on the trip. If Honda could develop a 3 seat second row it would make for an even better minivan (at least for my needs). If I am not mistaken, Honda had originally considered offering the Ody with a 3 seat second row bench. Is that right?
It is obviously an option that could be implemented very easily. You could keep the floor brackets in the same spaces and just make the bucket behind the driver into a 2 seat bench. Remove the armrests between the two seats to make a continous seating surface and use the existing floor brackets to hold everything in place. It would be easy enough to flip the single bucket forward to allow access into the third row (my father does this on his Ody because he has put a clutter catcher between the 2nd row bucket seats). It is a simple fix that would add value to the vehicle and they could offer it as an option (after all, they have already done this type of thing with the MDX). For a family transport vehicle, Honda has limited themselves by keeping the 2nd row a 2 passenger space.
Of course, this is just my biased opinion . . .
Breakdown of your VIN from left to right:
JHK - Honda of Canada (MultiPurpose Pass. Vehicle)
RL1 - Line and engine type Odyssey/J35A1
8 - Body and transmission types
9 - Trim level
0 - Check digit
2 - Model year 2002
I learned the hard way.
I think you could perhaps be able to find that seat somewhere and install it however. You could ask through the Honda web site http://www.honda.com or your dealer or call Honda.
For the MPV, check the current issue of Car & Driver, it reports the long term results of driving that van, not a very positive one.
Or you can go to caranddriver.com
By the way, when we travel with 5, it's with one middle seat removed and a cooler strapped down. A huge amount of luggage fits behind the rear seat because of the deep well, and no two kids have to sit in adjacent seats...plenty of room for everybody equals less fighting. We have also use the middle seats spread apart and then the back seat becomes the prized sleeping position.
FWIW Odyssey is bigger inside than Suburban. You want bigger? You've got six choices: Eurovan, Astro/Safari, Excursion, Econoline, Express/Savana, Ram Van.
Interesting that the Odyssey is bigger then the Suburban, but I can certainly understand it as it has a more efficient design. Looking at my AAA Auto rating book it says that the Suburban seats 9 whereas the Odyssey seats 7. Also for cargo space the S is listed at 45.7 ft cubed and the O at 25.1. But perhaps if you measure total interior space the O comes out ahead or maybe AAA is wrong with their numbers.
Of course the S is going to be much more expensive to buy or to operate. I for one would not want an S. Also if you have a really big family you might consider buying a bus.
Diploid, when I am doing extended traveling with the kids, the 3rd row would be folded away and the kids would all be in the 2nd row. That would eliminate the need to have the kids "climbing over the 2nd row to get to the 3rd row." Also, I do not let my kids get up and move around in the car when it is moving. Also, I like to have a vehicle that is pretty economical to drive. The bigger vehicles (SUV's and full size vans) are gas hogs.
Just my $.02
The J indicates a vehicle built in Japan.
parveentexas, your dealer gave you the wrong VIN#.
Good points and thanks for clarifying that the Odyssey IS larger than the Suburban...7 more cubic feet to be exact.
I realize the Suburban can be had with three bench seats, so It can carry 9, while the Odyssey cannot. For 5, 6 or 7 passengers, and especially for third row passengers who's legs extend more than 8" below the knee, the Odyssey is a more comfortable, easier to enter and exit way to go. I've done time in the third rows of Suburbans, and I'll take the back row of the Odyssey any time.
To tell the truth, I would prefer a Suburban, and tried to talk my wife into one. She told me that I could have one instead of my pickup, but she wanted a minivan. She had been driving a sport sedan and was intimidated by the (exterior) size of the Suburban when she did consent to test drive one. Since that was in 1998 it was the earlier, even bulkier, body style. Back row comfort wouldn't have been all that important to me, because I would have been in the front row!
Somebody pretty smart once told me, "If Momma ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy.". If "Momma" want's a minivan, she's gonna have the best dogone minivan I can find. "Momma" likes her Odyssey, so I like it too!
Bob
thanks for your help
NO matter what the dealers offer, always insist on the final drive-out price. Some dealers will write down the selling price for hundreds under MSRP, you thought you've got a good price and go home with a written selling price as promised, so you wait for months and finally the dealer think that you have been waiting long enough and decide it is time for you to purchase the vehicle. You'll be ended up paying even higher than your neighbor who paid MSRP.
Why? you'll asked. Simple, that dealer had you to buy a lot of extra add-on, dealer prep...etc. Even if you are not overwhelmed with your dream van in front of you, and you noticed all this, they hope you do not want to go to another dealer and go through the ordeal again to wait for another month or so.
My point is, compare the 'drive-out' price instead of the deceiving offered selling price.
I have a 2000 EX Odyssey and when I park it, if I am not very careful I hit something underneath the car with the front parking stop or the front curb, instead of my front tire which was the case with all my other cars.
I took a look at a parking lot and noticed that most of the cars were parked with their front wheel resting against the parking stop. So that is how most drivers know when to stop going forward. With my Odyssey I knew when I hear the bad noise as I hit the parking stop with some part of the car.
I saw a post here where with the wheel well liner, that it can break it, get wrapped around the wheel at high speed and be a serious problem. One person here had this problem so far and posted it.
I don't have the wheel well liner but do have the mud guards.
Since most drivers park their cars till it stops up against something, the tires, I would think this is a problem with a lot of you out there.
If others are not having this problem then maybe it is something wrong with my Odyssey.