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Comments
Not so sure I want to talk to people like this anymore.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Okay 1) They gave me a great price with taxes, title, etc. I have a trade in car. Can I ask them to fax me the out the door cost of the car with added prepartion fees, and all fees they will add to my buyers order then when I get to the lot they can subtract the price for the car? We're going through our credit union and everything is established, so how do I do that with a long distance internet sale? DO I fax jacksonville the information from the credit union? Sorry I know this is a lot of questions, but I just need to know the process of the internet sale. I have a good price with taxes, and etc. But I don't want to drive 2 hours to jacksonville and find out they are charging me 600 for dealer prepartion and other non-sense. Please let me know. GOd Bless
Yeah, I noticed that, and I think he was arguing with himself as well. I couldn't tell who won.
Until they can't see you car in the flesh, I doubt they will give you an exact price for your trade-in.
I doubt there really is anything like an 'internet sale'. The internet is just one more way for us to communicate.
You can communicate with a car dealer however you like - telephone, the internet, or by carrier pigeon - and you might be able to nail down an exact out-the-door price as I have done in the past. The dealer might actually honor that price when you appear in person, as Rosenthal Honda did with us, or they might not.
My advice is to determine the price you want to pay and go to your local dealer and see if they will accept it.
If the dealere accepts our OTD offer, we give them a check for exactly that amount and drive the new car home.
Due to their great experience, they will be more likely to even remember my name after 90 days and send a refferal my way before they buy again
2 years after buying my daughters civic I am still referring people who are looking for a Honda to the Internet Sales Manager I dealt with. His honesty and professionalism are the reason why.
As to dealers I have dealt with who tried to play games, I do my best to warn others to stay away.
Keep up the good work!
Here's one more.
You have gotten some very good advice here from guys who aren’t in the biz and there is nothing wrong with that. However, it would be nice if some of the guys in the biz chimed in here.
The only sticky wicket appears to be what the dealer will give you for your trade-in since they haven’t seen it yet. So beware and ready for a price you don’t like. Just remember, before you let them steal it from you, drive it home. Don’t let hot pants for a car cloud your judgment by using the false reasoning of, “what can I do I’m already here, I will have spent more than 4 hours traveling and negotiating for this beauty, just get it and take it home already”. DON’T DO THAT. :sick:
It’s OK to fall in love just as long as it isn’t with inanimate objects like cars.
Slow down and think it through and let us know how it goes.
Hey, when are you guys in the biz going to provide input for this buyer?
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
heavensoldier: I've heard a very good argument for keeping the two deals, buying the new car and selling the used car, separate and I'll cut to the chase. Focus on buying the new car at the lowest price then add tax, title and documentation (deal #1 done); then sell your used car to the dealer for the highest price (deal #2 done).
Use Edmunds.com and kbb.com to get an estimated trade-in value; The estimated trade-in value is the amount the dealer will buy your used car for. Deal #2. (deal 1 - deal 2 = done deal).
You should be able to get two pieces of paper faxed to you without any drama, 1) a basic worksheet which has your name, address, phone number, stock number, vin number, miles on the car your buying and all the optional equipment on the car your buying listed on the worksheet. And finally the selling price of the car you are buying. This important piece of paper must be signed buy the *manager*. 2) Purchase Agreement, this is the contract and it has everything on it that the worksheet does less the optional equipment on the car. It's probably all typed out nice and neat. The selling price and all fees are legable.
They'll be more paper work to do in the f&i (finance and insurance/ business office) office, just go with the flow and keep an arms length distance. Don't buy anything more than you need.
tally ho, topchef repeats are on... Cheers
If you really had all of this knowledge you would know that.
Hi again Socal4
Another good source would be a Carmax store as they'll give you a real world price, which in my experience has been on the low end. Remember to account for the sales tax differences when paying for the new vehicle if selling your trade-in to Carmax.
Do you really think he's back and we're going to go through this again? :sick:
YOI,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
If a person wants to make an offer based on dealer cost + $XXX, then they can expect to see a lot of "costs" included in that amount..
Okay, but one also does not go to Von's and pay the $0.99 list price for their beans and then have the next person in line say "what is your best price on these beans" and the cashier says "$0.79, would you like to buy them at that price?".
> no. they haven't seen the used car and they quoted you a price on the new car and you're happy with that, so buy the new car.
Also if they have to get my car from another dealer...
> how are you getting home if you trade in your car and they do a dealer trade? You want to do this deal in ONE trip.
can they still ship me the retail buyers order or is that the same as the worksheet and purchase agreement?
> yes
heavensoldier - you have a few things going here :-) so i advise slowing down and talking everything over with the dealer. bring a friend with you to the dealership in case there are any surprises. your friend could drive the used car back (as long as they're insured, double check on that); and you'll drive the new car back.
what gave you the idea they have to do a dealer trade? try for no dealer trade...
did you run the used car through the edmunds.com and kbb.com trade-in estimator? are you fine with the amount? be honest with the numbers, no kinks.
go over everything ((as much as you can) get it in writing)with the rep on the phone tomorrow, only drive down if it passes your sniff test... ciao
It's critical to actually go to the dealership because viewing and driving the trade is critical. If you are not in the business you may not have an appreciation of the, let us say, 'creative appreciation' some have for their trades.
To be more direct many many trades are damaged with CarFax accident notations and the statement of the trader is 'Nope never been in an accident'. The appraiser has a small tool to check if a vehicle has been repainted ' Oh yeah, a small meteorite did hit it in the parking lot but it was nothing'
Smoker? You don't know until the appraisal and the cloud rushes out of the vehicle. BTW, it never oomes out of the fabric.
Tuner? Cool. You've just cut the potential market by 95%.
Modded truck? Hayylll yassss. Yup your brother is the only other person on the planet earth who might buy it.
Your dream is a commercial nightmare.
It's almost impossible to put a number on a trade without seeing it first and doing an appraisal.
So for those that are doing internet shopping with a trade, the OTD numbers on a new car is only half the challenge.
We might be $500 higher on a OTD price than another dealer, but might be able to put $1000 more into a trade for whatever reason.
No two used cars/trade-ins are alike, ever!!!! They might be same models, same years, but the mileage won't be the same, they might have different accessories, and they were probably driven differently, different wear and tear.
That's why when someone asks me on the lot or over the phone what their trade is worth, and they "just want a ballpark" I usually give them a $5 to $10k spread: "It's worth between $5k and $15k. I have to see it."
On some models you can narrow it down, but if we give out a "ballpark" number without seeing the car then one of two things will happen:
a: "oh no it's worth more" and we will never see that customer again as that to him/her will be a number in stone
b: they come back and get a full appraisal and if it's worth less for whatever reason, they will hold you to the ballpark that you gave them or call yuo a liar
Cheers
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I have a car in my fleet - a 2003 Chrysler Concorde, 38k miles, used mostly on long trips. I thought that it would be a cream puff and thought about purchasing it because it was spotless.
I always drive a "turn in" to see in what kind of shape it is in. Despite being told that it was in "showroom" shape, when I test drove it, I could not keep it on the road. The driver must have hit something as the cradle underneath was seriously bent up and the car could not be aligned - $1500 repair. WOW!
No two USED cars are ever alike.
Never forget, everything sells by the numbers! Dealers want to convert to the "people" crap but it needs not be that way!
Most simply feed you #'s to get you there to sell you.
Yes, some do, but there is no good reason to go there. You are forgetting that you can get a vehicle delivered to your door and never having to step foot at the dealership.
Honda tried to take me to the cleaners on my 04 Pilot
That is the problem with your whole approach! You are NOT trying to buy a car, you are actually doing 2 transactions: a sale and a purchase.
If you are serious about online transactions you have to make sure that you dealing with a pure commodity so that one can be substituted by many others. That is how competition works for you! Your trade is the problem because it is unique. If you are serious about keeping most of your money in your pocket you would unbundle the buy and sell parts! Sell your car at one dealership (Carmax?)or privately and buy another one anywhere else! If you show up to most dealerships and do a trade, finance and warranty, the will make money on EVERY sub-transaction if they can... :sick: Heh, and they will also be happy to charge you for the convenience of doing the whole thing at one place!
Here at our dealership, unless I have proof through our phone software that I actually held a 2 minute conversation with you over the phone or we set an appointment in an e-mail communication, I have no way of claiming partial credit for that deal. It happens here a lot. The 22 year old does all the surfing and gathers all the info on the car, but since dad is the co-x he wants to go the old fashioned way and beat it out downstairs. I spend a little time structuring numbers, sending a few e-mails and the 22 year old shows up with dad and I have nothing to show for it. We're told that it doesn't really matter because it did not take that much effort to gather the info and put it in an e-mail, but the way I see it...I send 100 e-mails and make 100 calls for every one show and closed prospect, so when this happens...it's like I work twice as hard to get the next deal out. It's just a time management thing but I know the customer would have had a better, no nonsense experience with me, but some people are just eager to pick a fight and work the traditional way I guess, or they are just not informed enough to know that the internet sales person actually sells the car too...and I give a very good walk around
-just food for thought
Since it happens a lot you should have a long convincing talk with the boss.
If your store can't come up with a better arrangement than they now have, I know it's easy for me to say, but, maybe you have to find a better store to work for.
Nobody should be taken advantage of like that.
Good luck,
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
My initial contact was via email and everything flowed smoothly from there to the ultimate personal meeting to formalize deal and sign papers.
I did not get into pressuring and playing off dealers to any great extent, nor try to get well below invoice, cutting into the dealer holdback as some get lucky with at certain dealers. But you should find an excellent buying experience and find them willing to work with dealer invoice pricing to you. If you are from MA, they will register in MA for you as well.
That statement would have been entirely correct if you had not used the word, "Maybe".
As a guy in the biz, would you take this kind of treatment?
Just curious.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
For us we have to have the customer logged in the system with a phone number to get credit for half a deal, but most of us here are reasonable and even if we don't have the customer logged, we will split the deal.
If the management is acting in a such a manner I would change dealerhsips (at least if it happens often).
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I was in no real hurry to buy and had already decided the best I was likely to do would be around the price I ended up paying...this was based estimates of future rebates and dealer cash from my extensive research.
Because of something that had happend with our oldest car, even though it did not seem like I would be able to get to my target yet, I checked (via email) with about 4 or so dealers that I had asked for pricing at one time or another in the last 6 months or so.
I then told all of them thanks but I was hoping to hit my target price eventually (they were about $900 above) and I was just going to wait an see if there was a special auto show rebate or something next month.
Now one place, where I really did not want to buy had happened to advertise a base model at a discount from MSRP which if applied the car I actually wanted came to my target price. So I asked the internet guy from that particular place if this could be done. He could only come within about $800 of it. Told him the same thing, price seems good but I'll wait.
Then yesterday morning, he asked me if I would buy if he could actually meet that price, which he said he wasn't sure he could do.
It worked out that he was able to and I bought the car from him...even though I tried very hard to get two other sales people that I had really liked working with to at least come close. With one place we had agreed that I would pay $200 more, but then we realized that he was talking about a cheaper trim level and they actually could not come any closer than about $900.
I think I was just lucky and the timing worked out for me. The closing guy said they needed to "move a unit" and I "won the lottery".
I never met or spoke with the internet guy that I bought from before I met him to buy the car today.
wow, this is big news ... this is like actuary stuff, huh? care to share your formula or calculations?
We hear this quite a bit from the guys in the biz that post here. This shouldn't be such a surprise to anybody that does his research.
I'll never know for sure but I feel this happened to me when I bought on April 29 in 2005. A little luck in finding the place that has to almost give one away never hurts.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
i've also heard the beginning of the month is another good time to buy because the store needs to kick off the month in high gear. everybody's catching their breath from the end of the month push and bang their off to the races again. a good sales manager knows that and puts various incentives out there, i've heard; of course i've also heard that new car dealers want to sell cars every day, could be a rumor...
jeffyscott did a great job - he had a well thought out plan and he executing it step by step, he seemed confident and didn't act disparate ... remember the dealerships have a plan, so the buyers should too...
Good deal jeffyscott.