Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Options
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
But for snow, you absolutely need mud terrain tires as a minimum. And 4x4 engaged. Also, look for a tread pattern that has lots of sipes in it. The older BFG mud terrains were very bad in rain for this reason(zero sipes anywhere), though good otherwise.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
The new S60 looks promising. I think its T6 engine power output -- 300 horsepower and 325 pound-feet of torque -- is among the top of this group, especially the torque. IMO, Volvo did a fine job in both exterior styling and interior layout. As to handling, we will have to wait until the car hits the showroom and do a proper test drive.
While this car may be a legitimate contender, the biggest problem for Volvo may be the lack of convincing reason for potential buyers to choose it over the competition. For performance, the 3-series and G37 still lead the pack. For luxurious feels, TL and A4 may have the edge. For dependability reputation, the Japanese brands are always safer bets. For badge shoppers, MB certainly sounds more prestigious. Safety is Volvo's strong suite, but others are not far behind. A Volvo is just so easy to lost in this crowded segment. And its new Chinese ownership doesn't help, either.
here is an article reviewing the acura TL -- maybe we need to expand this chat to include buick and nissan maxima.. they are mentioned as comps to this rig..
HOST,
If this continues, I will submit my "resignation". Why the hell does anyone need to know my household income to offer opinions on BMWs?
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
I didn't much care for the Lacrosse. Came down to the TL and Maxima. I liked them pretty much equally. The fact that the Maxima could be had for about 2k less than the TL, had more features, and that I liked the interior/exterior styling better than the TL sold me.
I think the Maxima should be included here.
http://www.motortrend.com/features/consumer/1004_10_cars_you_didnt_know_you_coul- d_get_with_a_stick/index.html
The FWD TL may be less sporty than a RWD G37, but it is definitely sportier than a Maxima.
I personally agree that the CVT completely eliminates any hope for the Maxima being included in this category. It's seems more like a sportier Toyota Avalon to me...
The new Maxima has virtually no torque steer during brisk acceleration and I've been able to keep up with higher powered V6's with both A/T and MT so the power and performance of the Maxima is not hindered by the CVT in the least.
Saying the Maxima is a sportier version of an Avalon is a little bit ridiculous to me. Drive both cars back to back and they are totally different. The Maxima's handling is much more crisp and precise then just about anything else in the FWD market, except for say Mazda maybe. I would go as far as to say, that the Maxima is about as sporty as you can go in performance, driving dynamics, handling, etc for a FWD sedan without having to spend more money and go into a RWD luxury division vehicle. It is a four door sports sedan, no, the CVT and FWD layout prevent it becoming that, but its a sporty four door sedan.
Except for one or two things, the CVT is not as bad as people make it out to be. It takes a few months, but you get used to and then when you get back into a vehicle with a regular A/T and feel shift shock, you think something is wrong
In regards to fitting into this thread category its tuff to say. The Maxima is an oddity and hard to classify. Its not from a luxury division and some people have difficulty using the word luxury and Nissan in the same sentence and I can understand that. On the other hand, the power/performance, price, luxury sedan features, etc that you can get in this car would suggest and warrant at least a entry-level luxury classification. Everyone will tell you something different b/c there are no books stating what car classes there are and what goes into what.
I've heard people classify the Maxima has followed over the years, "entry-level luxury sedan," "premium full-size sedan," "near luxury sedan." Pick anyone you want and use it or whatever floats your boat. It really, in the grand scheme of things doesn't mean jack squat!
I drove the base FWD TL and Maxima back to back and dont think the TL is any more "sporty" than the Maxima.
Now, once you move up to the AWD 6 M/T version of the 4G TL, that the TL becomes sportier than the new Maxima, but the base version is definitely tamer then the new Maxima.
Remember, a lot of people have valid critisms and hatred of the CVT b/c of what happened with the 1G version of it from 2003-2008. Since 2009, all the Nissan products have the updated 2G CVT which is much more efficient, less troubles, and far fewer problems then the 1G had. Nissan extended the transmission warranty so the CVT for them is here to stay! So far I overall really like the CVT and the fuel econ for 290HP is absolutely fabulous.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
My 2004 V70 now has 110,000 trouble free miles. Installed a set of Bilsteins recently and it's like a new car again.
My M3 is going strong with 215,000 miles and no significant services in almost 2 years. No plans to replace either one any time soon - in this economy, I like having no monthly car payment.
How about you? Going to replace the X3 with something bigger to fit your growing family?
The TSX is our family hauler for the forseeable future. We just bought a house and don't want to take on any more monthly payments.
Truthfully I'd like to get a repalcement (Note I didn't say I want to replace) for the Prelude maybe next year if it is in the budget. It doesn't have LATCHes for the car seats & truthfully I don't feel if I have to take my kids somewhere that buckling the car seats in with the seat belt is anywhere nearly as strong as the LATCHes.
I'm probably going to want the next X3, but I'm sure the Turbo version with only a few options is going to push $50K & the 240 hp NA motor isn't going to cut it for my needs. I live in CT now and to say the on ramps are short is an understatement. Plus there are stop signs before you merge onto the parkway, not yield signs. Both my Prelude and TSX NEED a running start due to their lack of low end torque.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
No need for you to go down the "new car every 3 years" road. It's a trap. $21,000 for a low mileage X3 with known history sounds like a bargain to me...
Now in the summer with the A/C on and the high humidity/temps each of those figures I've given you have gone down about 2mpg. I've been avg since the middle of June about 23-24 mpg avgs with 22mpg city and 28-31mpg on highway.
Exactly. I've had my Club Sport for 15 years, the Wrangler for 8 years, and the X3 for five- with no plans to replace them anytime soon(never in the case of the Club Sport). My 1975 2002A is going to be my son's first car. He eventually wants a 944/924S, so I told him to drive the '02 for a year; if he keeps his grades up and doesn't collect any accidents or tickets we'll sell the '02 and he can get a P car- although he'll have to pay the difference between the selling price of the '02 and the purchase price of the Porsche.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive
I'm thinking e30 325i convertible for my daughter. I've got 2 years to find the right one...
I'm sure you know this, but really nice E30s do turn up from time to time. I still have a soft spot for the 325is. It's a timeless and elegant design- from both an aesthetic and an engineering standpoint.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I mean, I think I would rather look at survey results about steak vs lamb vs chicken from people who were meat eaters rather than folks who, for whatever reason, chose not to eat meat.
I guess income is a data point -- folks who make 6 figures may not buy BMW's, but perhaps folks who make low 5 figures can not buy them. I, for one, would be interested in someones opinion who actually participated in buying, owning and driving "X" rather than someone who, for wahtever reason, did not buy, own or drive "X"!
I don't participate in Bently forums and now with the price of the new A8, for instance, I won't participate there either. I can't afford a Bently and at $95,000 for a new A8, the sacrifices in other parts of my life make it, as a practical matter, unaffordable too.
I say, market away -- just don't MAKE me pony up information. :confuse:
transmission in the acura line needs to change along with its face (and possibly move the drive wheels to the rear), the ES and IS are old forms, the CTS continues to evolve, the Benz has great looks but no guts in non-amg form, The G has pumped up the HP once again (but whats next for them, o yeah a lower v6 version), A4 just redone (only a 4cyl hello), the S60 has entered with 300hp but its a volvo.. i wonder who makes the next step.. is 350 hp the new standard??
I think you mean "bimmer". "Beemer" has always referred to the BMW motorcycle.
I'm sure you knew what I was meaning to say
Acura did the same thing to their flagship right now (the RL) with the current TL in the regards you pointed out.
Automobile mag just did comparo between 2010 6sp TL SH-AWD and 2010 S4. (The mag) said it's pretty much a wash. The S4 best lap was less than 0.5 sec. faster than the TL. IMO, that's pretty impressive for acura.
I also remember a few months ago Car and Driver gave the nod to the S4 vs 335i.
http://www.insideline.com/infiniti/g37/2009/comparison-test-2009-acura-tl-sh-awd- -vs-2009-infiniti-g37-journey.html
here it just on par with the VWCC
http://www.roadandtrack.com/tests/comparison/2009-acura-tl-sh-awd-vs.-2009-volks- wagen-cc-3.6l-4motion/page_4_-_2009_acura_tl_sh-awd_vs._2009_volkswagen_cc_3.6l_- 4motion_page_4
and here it gets beat by 2 cars with 70 less hp
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparisons/09q2/2009_infiniti_g37_vs._bmw_3- 28i_audi_a4_and_acura_tl-comparison_te
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparisons/09q2/2009_infiniti_g37_vs._bmw_3- 28i_audi_a4_and_acura_tl-comparison_tests
So which car with 70 hp less than the Acura out ran it?
I too am quite pleased (understatement) with my TL.
I think its great that the TL is roomy but so is a buick, In comparison tests the TL always ranks lower then cars in its price class-(as noted in the 3 links i posted)-the class acura put this car in from the beginning --as an entry level lux sedan -- this is the class that makes it possible for other cars under the lux line to exist because they sell alot of them.. if your driving an automatic TLAWD and think it will outperform a S4, then you never drove an S4,-- TL is a good middle of the road sedan, in manual form its comes closer to S4 but no one here on these chats ownes a 6speed (infact one in 6k comes in manual....ronn knows this stat).. edmunds reviewed the 6speed-- its a different animal.
http://www.edmunds.com/acura/tl/2010/testdrive.html
Regarding the RL, that is a dated design that needs a change. I assume the next gneration RL will be a step up in size and maybe power from the current TL to differentiate it. But who knows. Again, the TL does compare well to the other sedans. It is a tremendous value in this very competitive segment.
Secondly, did they test the 328I manual 6spd and the Audi manual against the TLAWD? I am guessing they did. They need to test a 328xi automatic and audi automatic AWD against the TL AWD.