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BMW 5-Series Wagon 2004 Redesign
What's new in 2004 for the long-lived 5-Series?
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Read that, and decide for yourself if the new 5 will be good or not. Has Chris Bangle and his group of designers created a bad car?? I hope when the car comes out it won't suck, if BMW screws up this car, bangle will for sure get fired. The 5 series is the money maker for BMW and one of its best cars. Maybe the E39 will be the last best 5 series, maybe. Read the article and judge it.
Was going to get a 2003 530i, now I'm wondering if it's better to just wait the 6 months or so for the new re-designed 2004, or is the pre-launch date just a guesstimate?
I wonder if getting the 2003 will make my car "old" already. I would've gotten a 2002 but finding a 530i that is NOT black, white, or silver is difficult in SoCal. I plan on keeping my car for a long
time.
It's expected the new 5-series will debut in Europe in late summer/early fall next year, and in the US later in the fall/early winter (hence more than the six months you indicate). That said, given all the new technology (especially with unproven things like iDrive), I'd recommend against buying the '04 5-series. 7-series boards are full of people who've had major electronics problems with the new 745i.
http://www.imakenews.com/autospies/e_article000077788.cfm
2004 BMW 5 series to arrive early
Our spies tell us that the next generation 5-series (2004 Model) is coming sooner than later...we were originally told the new car would appear next September (2003) in Frankfurt and roll in to the US in January of 2004.
We are now told to look for the car in the spring of 2003 with availablity in the US at dealers in the June timeframe...
The current five series will only be produced for a half a year in 2003 with production of the last vehicles ending in December/January 2002/2003 timeframe...
The 2003 540 sport will get the same front and rear bumper treatments as the M5.
I'm already disappointed with the E60 design. Frankly, I think i-Drive is a good intention gone awry, and I hate this "opening" of the traditional cockpit design.
www.bmw2002.co.uk/news.htm
I cannot believe it would be possible to ruin my favorite car. Good thing I picked up a 2002 540i.
Please tell me you did not say that. I honestly think Lexus makes the ugliest looking cars. The gs300 and 430 are repulsive! They have more lights then a semi truck and the angles are obscure and wrong. The car does not look good from any angle and I don't even think it comes in a manual transmission (the one i drove was automatic). If you have ever driven a 540i 6-speed or m5, you will see there is no contest againts the lexus. The bmw is more fun to drive then any Lexus I've ever driven. I'm not sure if I like the 2004 style of the BMW, but it's not bad. Its still a whole better then that gs300.
I was about to take delivery of a new 2003 540iA Sport but the more I read about the new one, the more I think I may want to wait for that and from the photos in this site, they didn't make the same mistake on the rear end like on the 745(cut off the classic BMW tail lights and added that ugly reflector strip in the trunk lid - they should spend whatever it takes to redo that 745 trunk now - I hate it and all these other critics can't be wrong).
But I buy BMWs for what I believe really counts: acceleration, braking, handling, ride, balance, etc. Audi is a great marque. But their design philosophies leave me cold. I'd rather have RWD (BMW) than FWD or AWD (Audi). I'd rather have smoother I6 engine (BMW) than inherently less smooth I4 or V6 (Audi). I want lots of choices. Does Audi have an X5? Z4? Z8? Look at all the permutations of the 3 Series. M, coupe, convertible, wagon, roadster (former Z3), AWD, auto/manual, two engines, sport/nonsport, etc.
I want my cars to have good manual transmissions. I prefer normally aspirated engines over turbo-charged or supercharged engines. I want a marque with great general history, great racing history, and a great club system.
When I add it all up, Audi is a fine marque with some great cars, but Audi just can't compare to BMW.
New M5 out in 2005 with 500 hp 5.5L V-10.
There is an interesting size comparison chart. Shows the new E60 will have a 113.7 inch wheelbase (vs 111.4 for E39), be 190.6 inches long overall (vs 188.0), be 57.8 inches tall (vs 56.5), be 72.7 inches wide (vs 70.9), have a 61.3 inch front track (vs 59.5) and a 62.1 inch rear track (vs 60.2).
Thought it most interesting that weight was not mentioned. Since it is getting bigger in all dimensions and filled with more stuff (e.g., ARS, EDC, variable-ratio active steering), weight likely to rise. Even with the use of aluminum suspension components and thinner glass.
They report that "mid-term, the 5-series also will be available with four-wheel drive and electrohydraulic brakes".
To use a simplified and improved iDrive.
Will the assumed increase in weight adversely affect handling and acceleration even with the improved suspension and higher horsepower ratings (compared to the current 530i). Also will they improve the base radio, the center arm rest and the cup holders? Will there be increased back seat room (our infant car seat barely fits - fits only when wedged in against back of front seat). Hopefully the i-drive will be an option (which I will not take). Will manual transmissions be available with all engines? And what about the price points. How much more upscale on the price will they go? And finally, will the new design grow on me?
For one, I'm not sure if the weight will increase much--if at all--on the E60. BMW is said to be investing heavily on greater use of aluminum alloys in the suspension and subframe components to counter the inevitable weight of additional computers and features, safety equipment, etc. Handling should be improved--although honestly it's hard to imagine how much better it could be--as should steering. I read an interesting piece in Roundel last month about the new Active Steering, which sounds like a real boon. I have no clue about the cupholders, armrest, or radio. Rear seatroom will almost definitely increase; reportedly, the wheelbase will be about 2 inches longer. I-Drive is unfortunately an integral part of the dash and electrical systems design, so it will almost certainly NOT be an option, but rumors say it will be a simpler and more intuitive system than the 7's system. Pricing is obviously unanounced, but I'm sure they'll try to keep it competitive. I'd give it a 3-5% increase at most. As for the new design, that's the $64k question. We'll see.
iDrive actually makes things easier. All switches on the dash are the most commonly used. iDrive does the rest. Using it is just a matter of habit, and in not even 10 minutes at a dead stop I could program in all my preferences plus a guidance to my destination on the nav system. The only trap which one should not fall in is to manipulate it while driving. Anyway you don't need to.
Use it and then judge.
I keep hoping BMW pulls a "Jag" weight loss diet. Future XJ is reportedly going to be 400 pounds lighter. Can BMW beat its recent history and actually put the 5 Series on a decent diet? Z4 does bode well. BMW kept its weight at about 3,000 pounds (2,932-3,042, depending upon model).
idletask... I drove a 745i during the Drive for the Cure Tour. iDrive was a mess. Took way to long to do simple things like fiddle with radio. I hated it. Thought most of the controls (e.g., seats) were too complex and not intuitive. But it drove flawlessly. Praying BMW realizes the 5 Series is meant to be a driver's car.
I don't know, what are your thoughts? Do you think they will discount the current 530i anytime soon?
As an IT consultant and software engineer, I consider myself fairly comfortable and adaptable with computer interfaces and systems. iDrive blows. I think it's tied to BMW's obsession with a single input key; The navigation systems on the rest of their models also feature a one-knob input for navigation, text entry and input, and they're unintuitive as well.
More buttons is not necessarily a bad thing. The ubiquitous keyboards we all use have many, many keys, yet most are able to use them efficiently and without looking. Do you think we could do so if we had only a single rotatry knob? The comparison isn't perfect, but my point is that BMW should have invested effort in simplifying the application itself, not only the in simplifying the dash design. Sure, you can add more and more functions to fewer controls. But doing so requries additional attention paid to a monitor, which is contrary to safe driving.
Would spending a lot of time with iDrive breed greater familiarity with the system? Probably. But every report about the new Audi A8's "MultiTronic" unit hails it as what iDrive should have been. Its menu navigation is reportedly far better designed, and a central knob--complemented by eight surrounding buttons on the console--are reportedly a much more intuitive and quicker manner in which to input and obtain information.
Maybe it's the fact that I'm a long time Linux user and used to difficulties but I wouldn't call iDrive a mess at all. To me, it was fairly intuitive.
If iDrive was reserved only for those "set it and forget it" configurations (e.g. making the seat back warmer proportionally than the seat bottom--yes, you can do this), that would be one thing. But, even though some dash controls don't require going through iDrive, many--as you point out, the radio controls--still do.
Have you ever used the Lexus or Acura Nav/Stereo systems? Far better than the BMW system. Just because you were finally able to get comfortable with iDrive, doesn't mean it's necessarily a good system.
I can't even tell you how disappointed I am. I've never even consider a Mercedes because they don't offer a stick. But if I'm going to look at a "stick-less" M5, I would have to consider the E55 AMG. It's lots less expensive and it rocks pretty good.
I guess the last great manufacturer of driver's cars is going the way of the dodo.
The system's only real disadvantages are that: 1) the slow acceptance by performance traditionalists who prefer a stick, and 2) the (very small number of) electronic bugs in the shifting logic, but I'm sure they'll be resolved by the third generation that will appear in the next M5.
Hey, there's a reason F1 cars have these systems as well.
M
As for a 6-speed, it's possible but not yet heard in the rumor mill. The Z4 3.0 offers a 6-speed, as will a special edition of the 330i to be released this Spring (along with some electronics and hardware upgrades to bump the engine up to 235 hp). However, of all the improvements I could come up with for the next 530, a sixth speed wouldn't be anywhere near the top of the (short) list. The 540 needs it only because it's such a guzzler. It would be nice, sure, but hardly necessary in my opinion.