I tend to back off from first-year engines for a few reasons:
- lack of manufacturing experience: the plant workers are new to buildiong it, and problems will occur.
- lack of maintenance experience: despite any suggestions or requirements by the manufacturer, no one will know how the Duramax will perform after a few months, let alone years. The Cummins 24-valve had plenty of "growing pains" after uit was introduced in January of 1998, which required several TSBs and a recall. Also, there will be no aftermarket parts/fluids/accessories that could improve the performance for your specific application.
The Dodge will be better with the 4.10 axle. The 3.54 with the new larger tires for 2000 will keep the rpms too low for most driving, and the 6 speed will keep you in the best powerband under all conditions. The Ford Powerstroke might lose 1-2 mpg simply because of its larger displacement an 2 extra cylinders, but with its 6 speed, will also do the job. The Duramax has not annouced its manual trans, just that it will come with the Allison 1000 automatic, whjich actually wouldn't be a bad choice if the engine does live up to its billing.
I would recommend the Dodge and Ford 6 speeds. As for the little things, you of course need the trailer/camper packages, heavy duty radiator, and as many upgraded suspension parts as are offered. Creature comforts are entirely up to you (interior, seats, stereo, etc.)
This is good points but, i have heard and keep hearing that GM Has been testing the duramax in the "old body style" chevys for a while now, and apparently they have been doing pretty good, at least from what ive heard
I am new to this site and love the helpful info I've just seen scrolling through the posted comments. I own a Ford Ranger XLT and want to trade up for a bigger truck. No major complaints about the Ranger, but it is just too small for two adults and two children + gear. Have owned SUVs in the past, but love having a pickup bed for light duty hauling of gear ... camping, hiking, kids bikes and sports equip, firewood, yard equip and tools, etc. We use our truck for around town driving as well as a good bit of off road recreational driving, but do not need to tow anything. I am focusing on Ford F150 or Dodge 1500 after other research, but would like some feedback from some of you who seem to know a lot more about trucks than I do! I saw a few postings about the Dakota as a midsize option and would welcome any advice on this as well. Thanks in advance!
It sounds as though you are looking for cab space rather than anything else. In that case your beset bet may be one of the new trucks that are coming out with four proper doors. From your posting it sounds as though bed size is less of an issue for you, and you may find that a bigger truck is a little harder to maneuvre around town.
Dodge is bringing out a Dakota Quad Cab in the next month or so that you might want to look at, and I believe Ford are doing something similar based on the F150 platform for sometime in the first half of next year.
Have a look at the Dodge site for details on the quad cab dakota to see if the cab size suits your need, you should be able to test drive fairly soon - latest official release date I heard was November 15th.
The Ford F-150 full size four door crew cab will be out in 2000, as will the Dodge Dakota four door. Although the F-150 bed will be a little shorter, I think it will still be about 5 1/2 feet. The normal short bed is 6 1/2 feet. I think Nissan is making a four door pickup next year also.
Ford will also be introducing a Ford Explorer Sport Trac. Basically, envision a four door Explorer that gets chopped off after the back seat. That cargo area becomes the bed. I believe the bed is four feet. The picture I've seen looks pretty sharp. You can get some info on new Ford vehicles at www.blueovalnews.com.
You have a 2000. The year referred to is the model year - reflecting the design changes that are intoduced. New model years usually start (officially) on October 1st but they are usually manufactured straight after the two week close down in mid-July.
The build date will of course be 99, because that is the year we are in.
Just a little thought for anyone - lets be careful about putting VIN numbers in posts - not everyone is as honest as us and anybody has access to this site. viperle if you now feel nervous about the VIN you can remove your post or Edmunds can do it for you.
If anyone from Edmunds reads this - do you have a view on VINs in posts?
exercise caution. It is true that the VIN is on the dashboard and readily visible thru the windshield. The law requires this.
It is also true that, in the hands of the unscrupulous with a minimal technical bent, one item of public information may be used to access multiple items of private information via public sources - the Department of Motor Vehicles, IRS, etc.
As one who has had a credit card number hijacked by a "local yout'," and has had to go the police inquiry, call the credit card company, report the card stolen and change anything associated with that card route, I can tell you that your "privacy" is largely an illusion in today's online world where the barriers between the public and the private blur.
Your only security is an intelligent awareness of where and how your privacy may be compromised, and an intelligent and ongoing assessment of risks. Posting a VIN does creates the possibility of trouble, and eliminates the physical necessity of tracking your vehicle to acquire that first piece of information.
If your are uncomfortable with leaving that gate open - don't!
Front Porch Philosopher SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
Have you TD owners checked out the TDR Website? It is all new and redesigned with an active discussion forum and lot's of new pages. There are both member areas and nonmember areas, but everyone gets to read the forum. It is a great site and growing rapidly. The TDR has over 15000 members so the expertise in the discussions is second to none when it comes to knowledgeable people helping other diesel owners. The site is at http://www.turbodieselregister.com/
Have Fords really gotten any better . I have an '86 F-150 supercab that I am still limping along 'cause it's cost me so much to repair . Lost the rear end at 32000 mi. and the 302 engine at 91000 mi. At 5 years all the paint fell off and the rep only allowed $250 towards it . Have replaced all but transmission . All this with regular preventive maint. Try to tell me they are worth a hoot !!!
Last year, I sold my 92 F-250 4x4 with the 351 with 86,000 miles on it. No rearend or engine problems. I doubt the engine was halfway through it's useful life before significant repairs would have been required. Owned the truck for close to seven years. No paint problems. I lived in Anchorage Alaska for the first year I owned the truck, so it was exposed to occasional subzero temps and it was never garaged. I lived in Southern CA and Dallas Texas for the remainder of the time, so it was exposed to 100+ degree temps and had lots of exposure to sunlight. I only had a garage space for one of those years.
I don't know what to say about your experience, but it doesn't coincide with mine. There is an occasional lemon from all manufacturers. Maybe you got unlucky. If it was the norm, there wouldn't be as many repeat buyers. If I had your experience and the problems weren't addressed to my satisfaction by Ford (not a dealer, but a Ford rep from the factory), I'd probably be looking really hard at Chevy and Dodge for my next purchase.
As it is, I bought another Ford last October. I've already put 25,000 miles on it. I bought it when I lived in Dallas, but have now moved back to Anchorage. The 4wd, shift-on-the-fly, and block heater have all had quite the workout already. I also use it to haul a 4000+ pound slide-in truck camper.
What to say here? You have a 86. Hmmmm, that means its a least 13 years old and you're still limping? The rear-end sounds like it was a lemon. The 302 at 90 thousand?!!?? Wow. I never heard of a 302 going so early. They were great engines. Paint? Yeah, well let me tell you that my Chevys at those model years were no better. The paint flaked off all cars and trucks then due to new EPA standards that forced Auto companies to try new tech without much research.
FYI... Had a 79' f-250 2WD with 460ci Auto. Towed a 6000# trailer all summer and drove it when it snowed in the winter. Never garaged a single day. Probably only waxed 6 times it's entire life. No paint problems except for fading. Never any mechanical problems except for replacing a distributor and normal wear and tear (brakes, etc). Traded in the truck back in 95 for a full size Bronco. It had 140K miles and still going strong. The dealer gave me $3,900 for it!
Considering I paid $5,100 for it in 85 with 42K miles, it was the best auto purchase I ever made! You must have just had a lemon. All of the big three have them.
That must be what I got . I just have a hard time swallowing it since Ford wouldn't stand behind it . Thanks for the info though .By the way - ever notice no matter what you pay , they all rust at the same speed ?
kcram: I need to order a truck soon and would like your opinion. I will be pulling a 10,000# loaded fifth wheel. I have narrowed my choices down to the Ford 2500SD SC V10 SB and the Dodge 2500 V10 SB QC but can't decide which differential in each. I would like the tallest gears possible that would still do the job. Mileage is a concern as well as a reasonable amount of leg room in the back. If it was your choice, which vehicle and differential would you pick. Thanks
kcram: I've searched the comments here for info on the Dodge Cummins 24V causing problems with the tranny's in the new Y2000 3500 units. Can't seem to find anything about this rumor. Do you have any comments?
Muzzy, Before I bought my Y2K Ram 5spd Cummins I did some research with my local Mopar service manager and Mopar TSB's. The problem was with 5th gear retaining nut backing off, it was due to the 24V being run below 1600 RPM, and the vibration of the engine backing off 5th gear retaining nut, the Service Manager said that he has rarely seen this happen, and the Service Bulletin stated not to run your 24V below 1600 RPM in 5th gear. I understand they fixed it with a Nylock type retaining nut, I don't even hit 5th in mine till around 50 MPH, most problems have been with the old Getrag 5spd Trannies in the older Rams, and not the newer NV4500 (5 spd)and NV5500 (6 spd).
I have a 1997 Ford Lariet extended cab f150 now and I am going to trade it for a Dodge 2500 quad v10. My motivation is a travel trailer that I have bought. The f150 will not pull the trailer well. The f150 has been a good truck. The only problem I have had is the leather seats are trash. And Ford will not stand behind the problem. Let me shout this to everyone(DO NOT GET LEATHER SEATS)as it does not last and in my case the manufacturer will not stand behind the problem. Its not worth the extra money you have to pay for the option. The main reason I will not go back to the Ford is the lack of service with my problem with the leather seats. It has cost them the profit they would have made off new f250 I might have bought. I think I will like the dodge. It is the first dodge I have had in several years. The only thing that concerns me is the rear end ratio. Sense I don`t pull the trailer that often. I went with the lower ratio thinking that it would help with the mpg. The other reasons for deciding on the dodge was the style (sport) and the interior (less the leather seats). Also the torque of the big v10.
Miracle, If you were concerned about mileage and torque, you should have bought the Cummins, 16+ MPG's and 460 Ft. Lbs. of torque (10 more than the V-10) with a 5 spd. You say "Lower Ratio", Lower means lower gears 4.10, or do you mean lower numerically? 3.54's? you would receive better mileage from the 3.54's and better low end pulling from the 4.10's. I am running the 3.54's in my 2500 Sport Cummins 4x4 QC, I am averaging about 16 MPG.
Miracle1 & bmckenzie, I realize you (miracle1) may have had a bad outing with your F150 dealer,etc. but, if you are going to worry about your V10 pulling a travel trailer then I suggest you should buy the Ford PowerStroke. I have an "F350 CrewCab PSD" and approximately 90K miles on it and haven't had a bit of trouble. F.Y.I. (bmckenzie) I'm running 3:73 rear gears and pull down a solid 20mpg at 72-73mph. As far as pulling, I recently pulled a 29 foot Prowler on conventional hitch from Victoria, Texas to Bracketville, Texas (about 240 miles)which is varying terrain and hills. Granted not mountains, but respectable hills and the powerstroke performed flawlessly. I'm involved in the Offshore Oil & Gas industry in the Gulf of Mexico and my company hires many "hotshot" trucks to pick up items and take them to the docks for offshore delivery. Early on the Dodge Cummins became popular amoung these drivers. They usually clock around 100K miles per year on these trucks and when the PowerStroke came out the Dodge owners began buying the PSD and now it is the dominant truck/engine combo. They're reporting more power, better fuel consumption, and longer lasting trucks. These guys make their living with the trucks they drive and if it costs them less to drive it the same mileage then that is what they buy. I would recommend to anyone, including current Dodge Cummins owners to seriously consider the PowerStroke.
Cmelder, My current mileage is 16+ MPG because my engine is still tight at 2000 miles. I would not recommend the PowerStroke (Navistar) over the Cummins because likr you I have been around Diesels alot (over 18 years), I operate heavy Equipment for a living to include over the road applications, Caterpillar, Cummins, Navistar and Detroit, just to name a few. I have noticed by far the Cat and Cummins dominate the roads, the International (Navistar) we run are plagued with short life spans and mutiple breakdowns, there are over 50% less moving parts in a Cummins, that is why V-8 Diesels are not a preferred application in large rigs (V-8 Detroit Diesel was junk). Cummins life expectacy exceeds the Navistar because of design, Forged I-Beam connecting Rods and a Cast Iron Skirted Block, 300,000+ miles between rebuilds, the Powestroke because of design will be typically less miles between rebuilds and a rebuild will not last quite as long, it is common sense, simplify the design with less moving parts. If the Navistar engine is so great then why are most Ford Aeromax (80,000 GVW)trucks ordered with the Cummins engine, and I do not think the International engine is even an option. It comes down to what people prefer, I prefer the Cummins and if you are happy your PowerStroke then that is what matters, because I do not make your Truck payment. I wish someone sold a Cat engine in a Pickup. That Hot Shot buisness is getting pretty large around here also (Midwest), no truck scales no worries, I also punch Wells once in a while around the world, but mine are for Water. Thanks for the opnion.
Thanks for the info on the tranny question. I just went and bit the bullet. I traded my 99'4x4 quad 5.9L gas for a Y2K 3500 4x4 quad with every option available with the Cummins with automatic. God must have built this truck its beautiful. It's my third Dodge since the 1994's came out. My wife and I travel a lot pulling a 95K 5iver. I just took delivery and haven't hooked it yet but I'm definitely impressed by the torque. It should be the last truck I purchase as we are retiring. I've owned Ford's and Chevy's but none of them pleased me as much as the Dodge.
Muzzyd, It must be the season to trade in 5.9 Gas, I did the same for my Y2K Cummins, traded my 1998 Quad 4x4, it was a great truck but it can't come close to my Cummins for pulling. My Dad is retired and pulls around a 26 ft. Fifth Wheel with a Gas ridden Chevy, wait till he gets a load of this truck, him and I are both Heavy Equipment Operators by trade, so Diesel to us is like Cologne. I hope your retirement goes well, I wish to be there soon. Did you get Leather with yours? that is the only Option I did not get with my Sport. The latest issue of Motor Trends, Truck Trend, did an issue on the 2500 Sport 4x4 SB, QC, Cummins, 6spd, similiar to mine except I have a 5spd. They hooked it to Sea Breeze Fifth Wheel, pulling well over it's rated limit, if you get time check out the article.............Bill
My wife wanted and got leather seats in her '95 cougar. The Lariat leather looks the same. We have children ages 1 & 4. The only blemish on them is a scratch I put in because I had a screwdriver in my pocket one day.
I never would have spent the money myself, but I look at my '91 Ranger and see stains in the cloth. The Portafino blue shows no stains. Every mess usually wipes right up. I have had vinyl seats before and will never do that again. They are the most unforgiving of all.
You didn't say what the problem was. People would probably like to know, I certainly would. I hope to purchase a new truck.If the seats were the ones in the back the word is that they are IMITATION LEATHER. Thus, they will not take the punishment.
Both trucks have the physical capability to handle the trailer you want to pull. On both trucks, I would recommend the LT265/75R16E tire with 4.10 axles (Dodge)/3.73 axles (Ford). I hesitate to recommend the 3.73s on the Ford because they're not limited slip, and you should probably get that when you can, but the 4.30s on the Ford would kill your already low fuel economy.
muzzyd,
There have been problems with the manuals regarding durability, but not because of tghe engine overpowering them. The 5 speed had an issue with losing the gate to 5th gear, and the 6 speed has had quite a few problems in the plant causing extremely limited availability before an engine is even hooked to it. The 5-speed problem has been corrected, but the 6 speed is still iffy - GM, the co-owner of New Venture Gear with DC, has even opted not to use the NVG5600 in its new HD pickups; instead, they will use the same ZF 6 speed Ford bolts to the Poweerstroke.
Got it all! Leather, heated seats,which the wife loves. I checked everthing in the option list. I figured this will be my last truck for a few years so we went and did it. The MSRP was 40K but the dealer and I are good friends and he cut me a very good deal. Hooken up the trailer in three weeks and heading for warm weather. We live in Connecticut and it's just begining to get miserable. Good luck with your new ride...........Don
The maiden voyage out was impressive Aaron neville cd never sounded so good...still breaking her in but trip comp.average indicated 18mpg. FYI This vehicle was assembled in Mexico.
Imagine if Dodge lost the Cummins contract. There would really no reason to ever buy a Dodge. The V-10 doesn't have enough history behind it to prove anything. History has proved Dodge trucks to be junk. Look around at the older Dodge trucks on the road. They for the most part look like they are falling apart! Friends have also only one Dodge and learned the lesson. Ford trucks have always been superior. I guess of your emotions lead to buy for looks only, go for it. These people with horor stories Im sure for the most part a re self induced. Most people don't maintain the vehicle properly. Look at your manual at the service intervals and see if the proper service really has been performed. I drove a Dodge Cummins a few weeks ago and while entering a freeway onramp on level ground from a roll of 55mph could not outpace a VW bus. The throttle was more like a volume control...lots of noise ....no acceleration. What a joke! If you are ever in So cal and pull up next to a Black Y2k F350 Super Duty Diesel 4X Qc and your in a Dodge Diesel...Prepare yourself for a lickin!
I own a 1989 F250 4wd supercab diesel (7.3l - non turbo) which I bought new. Up until this past summer, for the most part, I have been happy with the power and fuel economy. We took a camping trip to Colorado with a 3000lb pickup camper loaded on, and I found out that non-turbos will not run well in high altitudes. To say it was a gutless wonder is being kind! I noticed while in Colorado, that 99% of the trucks were diesel powered, and most were Dodges. In fact, I dare say that the Dodges outnumbered the Fords 2:1. Since we plan to do more camping out west, I'm in the market to buy a new diesel pickup. I've never been a Dodge truck fan, but I can get my brother-in-law's employee discount if I buy Dodge, but will have to negotiate my own deal on a Ford. In my heart I fell that the Ford is probably the better truck, and I wouldn't mind paying more for it, if I knew without a doubt that it truly is. It seems that the Dodge boys love their Cummins, and the Ford boys love their power strokes. Any thoughts on this?
Don, Did you get the Cummins and the 6spd? I had to trailer a friends Ford yesterday, (Tranny went out)from Springfield, somewhat Hilly terrain and I never once dropped below 70 MPH on hills and stayed in 5th the whole time, averaged about 13MPG. The funny thing is he traded his 1998 1500 QC 4x4 for the Ford and we had to tow it back to the Dodge Dealer used car lot for Tranny work......Bill
Rich, You are right about the rivalry between Dodge and Ford Diesel people, especially on hills pulling trailers. I prefer the Cummins because I have spent over 18 years around Navistar's, Caterpillar's, Detroit's and Cummins (Heavy Equipment Operator). I have found that the Cat and Cummins are the most maintenance free, longest running, and most abused Diesels on the market, look at what most Long Haul drivers are running in their Rigs. The Powerstroke is the old 6.9 punched out, so rebuilding is not as advantageous as other Diesels, if you keep your Diesel that long. I understand that the 2001 Ram w/6spd will put out 505 ft.lbs. and Cummins has an ECM upgrade for the Ram, sold buy Mopar that will crank up 24v's w/5,6spd's to over 505 ft.lbs. I am sure whatever Turbo Diesel you buy you will be very happy with, I hope I could provide you some useful input for your underpowered dilemma.......Bill
My husband and I own a 95 ram diesel which now has 82,000 miles. We tow a 11,000 lbs 5th wheel. We only have a 3.54 because we had a different trailer when we bought the ram. We are now in the process of buying a new truck. We have opted for the Ford because it delivers more torque than the ram. But, a friend who is a diesel mechanic just gave me a article about the new chevy diesel that will be on the market in 2001. The prototype has out run and out trailed both the ford and dodge. One has to wonder, should we wait? The chevy will also have a allison trans.
Bill, I went with the 4spd. automatic and the 24V ISB diesel. Where I live there would be to much shifting. My first test was pulling my 9.5K 5'ver around the local area and I did it in cruise most of the way. The truck is every bit what I expected. The motor is strong and smooth and I was pulling at about 65mph steady. The mileage is realy hard to nail down yet I've only put 400 miles on it. I'm getting 13mpg right now but not enough miles to tell what it will be..........Don
Don, Let me know your mileage when you get a few more miles on your Cummins, I would like to compare it to mine. That thing sure is a beast isn't it? I am waiting for the new 505 ft. lbs. Cummins to come out in 2001 can't wait to read the tests on that.
i owned a 77 dodge ramcharger with a 360, and a 79 dodge power wagon with a 318. coolest looking vehicles i have ever seen. suspension wise, they were built like tanks. you could beat the snot out of them and nothing happened. the 360 was a screamer, i could smoke most autos off the line. the 318 was a dog... but thats what ya got back in '79. the problem was everything else on the trucks. both of them had gremlins! i can't remember how many fusible links i blew. headlights come on by themselves. radio works some days and not the other. constantly replacing some kind of stupid resistor module because the things wouldn't start.the starter would constantly over heat during the summer on the power wagon. i would have to take a garden hose and cool it off. shorted out (2) brand new batteries. after the ramcharger creatored, i gave dodge another chance with the power wagon and got bit again. i am starting to research the purchase of a new truck. i love the dodge 3500 with the V10 but i just can't bring myself to put down $35k with the troubles i had before.i would beat myself with the radio antenna if the thing turned out to be a lemon. i know (in the 70s) manufacturing or chrysler wasn't what it is today, but i really hesitate to get the dodge. like "stangdude" said, i can't buy a vehicle on looks alone. so it looks like the F350 dually with the V10 will be my target. (i don't know about the GMs... all GM products are so expensive)i have had 2 ford products without a problem (just maintenance them and drive them), and my brother has a 90 F150 without a single thing wrong with it.
PS - i saw a completely restored 79 power wagon the other day. it had the special paint job with the words "power wagon" verticly on the side of the bed. looked awesome. it was parked in front of an auto repair shop..... should've known.
The problem with waiting is deciding when to stop waiting. Something new is always on the horizon. However, it does sound like the new generation of diesels will be a different animal than is what is currently out there. The new Chevy diesel will be built by Isuzu and is expected to hit the market late next year in the redesigned heavy duty trucks. The new Chevy diesel is rumored to have 300hp and 525 torque. The hp increase is the biggest difference over what is currently on the market. The Ford 7.3L PSD has 235hp and 500 torque.
Ford has plans to introduce their next generation Powerstroke diesel about a year or so after the new Chevy comes out. The Ford is rumored to be a 6.0L with 305hp and 550 torque. It's also suppose to be several pounds lighter than the current PSD, which will increase the tow rating for the truck.
Isuzu, Cummins and Navistar have all been making diesel engines for a long time. All three make monster diesels with much more torque and hp. However, the trick is matching it with a tranny, drivetrain, and suspension that will fit in a pickup truck and provide a reasonably smooth ride. With hp that is starting to be equal to or better than what is being offered in the gas engines, I think it will be harder to justify buying a gas pickup over a diesel, at least for me. I've currently got about 26,000 miles on my 99 truck, so by the time I'm shopping again in 4-6 years, Ford, Dodge and Chevy will have a few years of production under their belts with the new engines.
Dodge Cummins owners like lickin's from Ford herders, of course, it won't happen until the Dodge stops and lets the Ford catch-up. You might be careful, some older Dodge (late 80s- early 90s)Cummins owners that pull 14,000 pound+ trailers, might just come along and remove your doors for you. You may be proud of your new ford, but before you make rash statements, be careful what say, as it may come back to haunt you, and embarrass you. Your PS is not all that great a powerhouse, there ARE Real diesels out there.
leathal O2, it IS "rumored" until it is released to the public, just as the Ford PSD G2 is "rumored" to have 305/550. Pre-production test vehicles (as with any pre-production item, in any industry) may have been assembled on the line, but nearly every engineer and executive in the company pays attention to every detail. Until the first set of vehicles has been released without being under constant scrutiny from engineers and management, I would wait until claiming that 300/520 is "fact." Don't get me wrong, I hope the Duramax has those numbers, I may be in the market for a Diesel in a few years, but, as an engineer, I have to say that pre-production numbers generally should be observed, not worshipped.
I believe that the actual numbers where released from GM of the hp and torque..If you would like, I could go and get the actual numbers and at what rpms they occur.. They have released the numbers already
I only use the word "rumor" because Chevy won't release the official figures until sometime next year. I'd be pretty confident that the "rumored" figures are very close, if not right on.
wildmanbaker, my dad is retired and has an 11,000 pound 5th wheel. He pulls it with a 97 f-350 PSD with the 4.10. Over the past few years, he has had the opportunity to chat with quite a few other RVers. The consensus amongst Cummins and PSD owners is that they are all satisfied with their rigs. It's also USUALLY agreed that the PSD will outpull the Cummins in the hills but the Cummins gets a little better mpg. None of the owners of the Dodge or Fords feel they are underpowered. He hasn't had the opportunity to talk with many 6.5L Chevy owners, since very few people with big fivers use the 6.5L.
As a side note, I did have to take my Ford over to the neighbor's house this morning to jump start his Chevy, but I can't claim any brand superiority with that one. The temp dropped down close to -10 last night. Neither he nor I plugged our trucks in, but I have the V-10 gas engine and he has the 6.5L diesel. Those diesels don't like being left in the cold for extended periods without being started or plugged in.
I know that GM has released some numbers, but I don't imagine those numbers have come off an assembly line assembled engine. If I am wrong, then I am wrong, but (even in my young career as a Mechanical Engineer I have seen this several times) there is a difference between pre-production models and production models. I am not saying the numbers will be incorrect, but I would wait until a few tests have been done on actual vehicles sold to the public before I believe anything from a marketing department. I wouldn't suggest getting one right when they are released either. Wait and see if there are any surprises on the first few models, the engine isn't the only new component in the truck. I DO hope the new Duramax is a good engine. I also hope PSD G2 is good. I just don't believe whatever I hear until it has been tested outside the factory (at least in respect to vehicles). Everyone knows how badly Marketing departments can manipulate data to make it sound better.
Gee, that's nice... Did I happen to mention that I don't like to believe manufacturers data pertaining to things like engines until after the engines have proved themselves through use in the general population? Strange, I could have sworn I did.
Maybe you haven't looked at the spec's lately but you dont know your stuff. Why did the new Dodge I drove with my foot to the floor not pull the VW bus? The neck snapping, instant response of the PS diesel speaks for itself. We haul horses and have two friends with the same Featherlite trailers. Both trucks 1996 circa and both of them are on the same show circuit. Both go the same places in a caravan. One truck arrives first at the top of the grade every time....The Ford. As a matter of fact the Ford was loaded with 4 horses the dodge was loaded loaded with 3. Explain that. And don't duck the question...why on earth would you buy a Dodge if it didn't have the Cummins motor?
Comments
I tend to back off from first-year engines for a few reasons:
- lack of manufacturing experience: the plant workers are new to buildiong it, and problems will occur.
- lack of maintenance experience: despite any suggestions or requirements by the manufacturer, no one will know how the Duramax will perform after a few months, let alone years. The Cummins 24-valve had plenty of "growing pains" after uit was introduced in January of 1998, which required several TSBs and a recall. Also, there will be no aftermarket parts/fluids/accessories that could improve the performance for your specific application.
The Dodge will be better with the 4.10 axle. The 3.54 with the new larger tires for 2000 will keep the rpms too low for most driving, and the 6 speed will keep you in the best powerband under all conditions. The Ford Powerstroke might lose 1-2 mpg simply because of its larger displacement an 2 extra cylinders, but with its 6 speed, will also do the job. The Duramax has not annouced its manual trans, just that it will come with the Allison 1000 automatic, whjich actually wouldn't be a bad choice if the engine does live up to its billing.
I would recommend the Dodge and Ford 6 speeds. As for the little things, you of course need the trailer/camper packages, heavy duty radiator, and as many upgraded suspension parts as are offered. Creature comforts are entirely up to you (interior, seats, stereo, etc.)
kcram
Community Leader/Smart Shopper Conference
120k All highway Looks like showroom condition
Dodge is bringing out a Dakota Quad Cab in the next month or so that you might want to look at, and I believe Ford are doing something similar based on the F150 platform for sometime in the first half of next year.
Have a look at the Dodge site for details on the quad cab dakota to see if the cab size suits your need, you should be able to test drive fairly soon - latest official release date I heard was November 15th.
Ford will also be introducing a Ford Explorer Sport Trac. Basically, envision a four door Explorer that gets chopped off after the back seat. That cargo area becomes the bed. I believe the bed is four feet. The picture I've seen looks pretty sharp. You can get some info on new Ford vehicles at www.blueovalnews.com.
The build date will of course be 99, because that is the year we are in.
Just a little thought for anyone - lets be careful about putting VIN numbers in posts - not everyone is as honest as us and anybody has access to this site. viperle if you now feel nervous about the VIN you can remove your post or Edmunds can do it for you.
If anyone from Edmunds reads this - do you have a view on VINs in posts?
exercise caution. It is true that the VIN is on the dashboard and readily visible thru the windshield. The law requires this.
It is also true that, in the hands of the unscrupulous with a minimal technical bent, one item of public information may be used to access multiple items of private information via public sources - the Department of Motor Vehicles, IRS, etc.
As one who has had a credit card number hijacked by a "local yout'," and has had to go the police inquiry, call the credit card company, report the card stolen and change anything associated with that card route, I can tell you that your "privacy" is largely an illusion in today's online world where the barriers between the public and the private blur.
Your only security is an intelligent awareness of where and how your privacy may be compromised, and an intelligent and ongoing assessment of risks. Posting a VIN does creates the possibility of trouble, and eliminates the physical necessity of tracking your vehicle to acquire that first piece of information.
If your are uncomfortable with leaving that gate open - don't!
Front Porch Philosopher
SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
with 86,000 miles on it. No rearend or engine problems. I doubt the engine was halfway through it's useful life before significant repairs would have been required. Owned the truck for close to seven years. No paint problems. I lived in Anchorage Alaska for the first year I owned the truck, so it was exposed to occasional subzero temps and it was never garaged. I lived in Southern CA and Dallas Texas for the remainder of the time, so it was exposed to 100+ degree temps and had lots of exposure to sunlight. I only had a garage space for one of those years.
I don't know what to say about your experience, but it doesn't coincide with mine. There is an occasional lemon from all manufacturers. Maybe you got unlucky. If it was the norm, there wouldn't be as many repeat buyers. If I had your experience and the problems weren't addressed to my satisfaction by Ford (not a dealer, but a Ford rep from the factory), I'd probably be looking really hard at Chevy and Dodge for my next purchase.
As it is, I bought another Ford last October. I've already put 25,000 miles on it. I bought it when I lived in Dallas, but have now moved back to Anchorage. The 4wd, shift-on-the-fly, and block heater have all had quite the workout already. I also use it to haul a 4000+ pound slide-in truck camper.
Good luck on whatever you decide to buy next...
What to say here? You have a 86. Hmmmm, that means its a least 13 years old and you're still limping? The rear-end sounds like it was a lemon. The 302 at 90 thousand?!!?? Wow. I never heard of a 302 going so early. They were great engines. Paint? Yeah, well let me tell you that my Chevys at those model years were no better. The paint flaked off all cars and trucks then due to new EPA standards that forced Auto companies to try new tech without much research.
Roc
FYI... Had a 79' f-250 2WD with 460ci Auto. Towed a 6000# trailer all summer and drove it when it snowed in the winter. Never garaged a single day. Probably only waxed 6 times it's entire life. No paint problems except for fading. Never any mechanical problems except for replacing a distributor and normal wear and tear (brakes, etc). Traded in the truck back in 95 for a full size Bronco. It had 140K miles and still going strong. The dealer gave me $3,900 for it!
Considering I paid $5,100 for it in 85 with 42K miles, it was the best auto purchase I ever made! You must have just had a lemon. All of the big three have them.
Brett
I need to order a truck soon and would like your opinion. I will be pulling a 10,000# loaded fifth wheel. I have narrowed my choices down to the Ford 2500SD SC V10 SB and the Dodge 2500 V10 SB QC but can't decide which differential in each. I would like the tallest gears possible that would still do the job. Mileage is a concern as well as a reasonable amount of leg room in the back. If it was your choice, which vehicle and differential would you pick.
Thanks
I've searched the comments here for info on the Dodge Cummins 24V causing problems with the tranny's in the new Y2000 3500 units. Can't seem to find anything about this rumor. Do you have any comments?
Muzzy
Before I bought my Y2K Ram 5spd Cummins I did some research with my local Mopar service manager and Mopar TSB's. The problem was with 5th gear retaining nut backing off, it was due to the 24V being run below 1600 RPM, and the vibration of the engine backing off 5th gear retaining nut, the Service Manager said that he has rarely seen this happen, and the Service Bulletin stated not to run your 24V below 1600 RPM in 5th gear. I understand they fixed it with a Nylock type retaining nut, I don't even hit 5th in mine till around 50 MPH, most problems have been with the old Getrag 5spd Trannies in the older Rams, and not the newer NV4500 (5 spd)and NV5500 (6 spd).
The f150 has been a good truck. The only problem I have had is the leather seats are trash. And Ford will not stand behind the problem. Let me shout this to everyone(DO NOT GET LEATHER SEATS)as it does not last and in my case the manufacturer will not stand behind the problem. Its not worth the extra money you have to pay for the option.
The main reason I will not go back to the Ford is the lack of service with my problem with the leather seats. It has cost them the profit they would have made off new f250 I might have bought.
I think I will like the dodge. It is the first dodge I have had in several years. The only thing that concerns me is the rear end ratio. Sense I don`t pull the trailer that often. I went with the lower ratio thinking that it would help with the mpg. The other reasons for deciding on the dodge was the style (sport) and the interior (less the leather seats). Also the torque of the big v10.
If you were concerned about mileage and torque, you should have bought the Cummins, 16+ MPG's and
460 Ft. Lbs. of torque (10 more than the V-10) with a 5 spd. You say "Lower Ratio", Lower means lower gears 4.10, or do you mean lower numerically? 3.54's? you would receive better mileage from the 3.54's and better low end pulling from the 4.10's. I am running the 3.54's in my 2500 Sport Cummins 4x4 QC, I am averaging about
16 MPG.
I realize you (miracle1) may have had a bad outing with your F150 dealer,etc. but, if you are going to worry about your V10 pulling a travel trailer then I suggest you should buy the Ford PowerStroke. I have an "F350 CrewCab PSD" and approximately 90K miles on it and haven't had a bit of trouble. F.Y.I. (bmckenzie) I'm running 3:73 rear gears and pull down a solid 20mpg at 72-73mph. As far as pulling, I recently pulled a 29 foot Prowler on conventional hitch from Victoria, Texas to Bracketville, Texas (about 240 miles)which is varying terrain and hills. Granted not mountains, but respectable hills and the powerstroke performed flawlessly.
I'm involved in the Offshore Oil & Gas industry in the Gulf of Mexico and my company hires many "hotshot" trucks to pick up items and take them to the docks for offshore delivery. Early on the Dodge Cummins became popular amoung these drivers. They usually clock around 100K miles per year on these trucks and when the PowerStroke came out the Dodge owners began buying the PSD and now it is the dominant truck/engine combo. They're reporting more power, better fuel consumption, and longer lasting trucks. These guys make their living with the trucks they drive and if it costs them less to drive it the same mileage then that is what they buy.
I would recommend to anyone, including current Dodge Cummins owners to seriously consider the PowerStroke.
My current mileage is 16+ MPG because my engine is still tight at 2000 miles. I would not recommend the PowerStroke (Navistar) over the Cummins because likr you I have been around Diesels alot (over 18 years), I operate heavy Equipment for a living to include over the road applications, Caterpillar, Cummins, Navistar and Detroit, just to name a few. I have noticed by far the Cat and Cummins dominate the roads, the International (Navistar) we run are plagued with short life spans and mutiple breakdowns, there are
over 50% less moving parts in a Cummins, that is why V-8 Diesels are not a preferred application in large rigs (V-8 Detroit Diesel was junk). Cummins life expectacy exceeds the Navistar because of design, Forged I-Beam connecting Rods and a Cast Iron Skirted Block, 300,000+ miles between rebuilds, the Powestroke because of design will be typically less miles between rebuilds and a rebuild will not last quite as long, it is common sense, simplify the design with less moving parts.
If the Navistar engine is so great then why are most Ford Aeromax (80,000 GVW)trucks ordered with the Cummins engine, and I do not think the International engine is even an option. It comes down to what people prefer, I prefer the Cummins and if you are happy your PowerStroke then that is what matters, because I do not make your Truck payment. I wish someone sold a Cat engine in a Pickup. That Hot Shot buisness is getting pretty large around here also (Midwest), no truck scales no worries, I also punch Wells once in a while around the world, but mine are for Water. Thanks for the opnion.
It must be the season to trade in 5.9 Gas, I did the same for my Y2K Cummins, traded my 1998 Quad 4x4, it was a great truck but it can't come close to my Cummins for pulling. My Dad is retired and pulls around a 26 ft. Fifth Wheel with a Gas ridden Chevy, wait till he gets a load of this truck, him and I are both Heavy Equipment Operators by trade, so Diesel to us is like Cologne. I hope your retirement goes well, I wish to be there soon. Did you get Leather with yours?
that is the only Option I did not get with my Sport. The latest issue of Motor Trends, Truck Trend, did an issue on the 2500 Sport 4x4 SB, QC, Cummins, 6spd, similiar to mine except I have a 5spd. They hooked it to Sea Breeze Fifth Wheel, pulling well over it's rated limit, if you get time check out the article.............Bill
I never would have spent the money myself, but I look at my '91 Ranger and see stains in the cloth. The Portafino blue shows no stains. Every mess usually wipes right up. I have had vinyl seats before and will never do that again. They are the most unforgiving of all.
You didn't say what the problem was. People would probably like to know, I certainly would. I hope to purchase a new truck.If the seats were the ones in the back the word is that they are IMITATION LEATHER. Thus, they will not take the punishment.
So, what was the problem?
jerryg,
Both trucks have the physical capability to handle the trailer you want to pull. On both trucks, I would recommend the LT265/75R16E tire with 4.10 axles (Dodge)/3.73 axles (Ford). I hesitate to recommend the 3.73s on the Ford because they're not limited slip, and you should probably get that when you can, but the 4.30s on the Ford would kill your already low fuel economy.
muzzyd,
There have been problems with the manuals regarding durability, but not because of tghe engine overpowering them. The 5 speed had an issue with losing the gate to 5th gear, and the 6 speed has had quite a few problems in the plant causing extremely limited availability before an engine is even hooked to it. The 5-speed problem has been corrected, but the 6 speed is still iffy - GM, the co-owner of New Venture Gear with DC, has even opted not to use the NVG5600 in its new HD pickups; instead, they will use the same ZF 6 speed Ford bolts to the Poweerstroke.
kcram
Community Leader/Smart Shopper Conference
Good luck with your new ride...........Don
FYI This vehicle was assembled in Mexico.
I guess of your emotions lead to buy for looks only, go for it.
These people with horor stories Im sure for the most part a re self induced. Most people don't maintain the vehicle properly. Look at your manual at the service intervals and see if the proper service really has been performed.
I drove a Dodge Cummins a few weeks ago and while entering a freeway onramp on level ground from a roll of 55mph could not outpace a VW bus. The throttle was more like a volume control...lots of noise ....no acceleration. What a joke!
If you are ever in So cal and pull up next to a
Black Y2k F350 Super Duty Diesel 4X Qc and your in a Dodge Diesel...Prepare yourself for a lickin!
Since we plan to do more camping out west, I'm in the market to buy a new diesel pickup. I've never been a Dodge truck fan, but I can get my brother-in-law's employee discount if I buy Dodge, but will have to negotiate my own deal on a Ford. In my heart I fell that the Ford is probably the better truck, and I wouldn't mind paying more for it, if I knew without a doubt that it truly is. It seems that the Dodge boys love their Cummins, and the Ford boys love their power strokes. Any thoughts on this?
Did you get the Cummins and the 6spd? I had to trailer a friends Ford yesterday, (Tranny went out)from Springfield, somewhat Hilly terrain and I never once dropped below 70 MPH on hills and stayed in 5th the whole time, averaged about 13MPG. The funny thing is he traded his 1998 1500 QC 4x4 for the Ford and we had to tow it back to the Dodge Dealer used car lot for Tranny work......Bill
You are right about the rivalry between Dodge and Ford Diesel people, especially on hills pulling trailers. I prefer the Cummins because I have spent over 18 years around Navistar's, Caterpillar's, Detroit's and Cummins (Heavy Equipment Operator). I have found that the Cat and Cummins are the most maintenance free, longest running, and most abused Diesels on the market, look at what most Long Haul drivers are running in their Rigs. The Powerstroke is the old 6.9 punched out, so rebuilding is not as advantageous as other Diesels, if you keep your Diesel that long. I understand that the 2001 Ram w/6spd will put out 505 ft.lbs. and Cummins has an ECM upgrade for the Ram, sold buy Mopar that will crank up 24v's w/5,6spd's to over 505 ft.lbs. I am sure whatever Turbo Diesel you buy you will be very happy with, I hope I could provide you some useful input for your underpowered dilemma.......Bill
I went with the 4spd. automatic and the 24V ISB diesel. Where I live there would be to much shifting. My first test was pulling my 9.5K 5'ver around the local area and I did it in cruise most of the way. The truck is every bit what I expected. The motor is strong and smooth and I was pulling at about 65mph steady. The mileage is realy hard to nail down yet I've only put 400 miles on it. I'm getting 13mpg right now but not enough miles to tell what it will be..........Don
Let me know your mileage when you get a few more miles on your Cummins, I would like to compare it to mine. That thing sure is a beast isn't it? I am waiting for the new 505 ft. lbs. Cummins to come out in 2001 can't wait to read the tests on that.
i am starting to research the purchase of a new truck. i love the dodge 3500 with the V10 but i just can't bring myself to put down $35k with the troubles i had before.i would beat myself with the radio antenna if the thing turned out to be a lemon.
i know (in the 70s) manufacturing or chrysler wasn't what it is today, but i really hesitate to get the dodge. like "stangdude" said, i can't buy a vehicle on looks alone. so it looks like the F350 dually with the V10 will be my target. (i don't know about the GMs... all GM products are so expensive)i have had 2 ford products without a problem (just maintenance them and drive them), and my brother has a 90 F150 without a single thing wrong with it.
PS - i saw a completely restored 79 power wagon the other day. it had the special paint job with the words "power wagon" verticly on the side of the bed. looked awesome. it was parked in front of an auto repair shop..... should've known.
oscar a wiggy.
The problem with waiting is deciding when to stop waiting. Something new is always on the horizon. However, it does sound like the new generation of diesels will be a different animal than is what is currently out there. The new Chevy diesel will be built by Isuzu and is expected to hit the market late next year in the redesigned heavy duty trucks. The new Chevy diesel is rumored to have 300hp and 525 torque. The hp increase is the biggest difference over what is currently on the market. The Ford 7.3L PSD has 235hp and 500 torque.
Ford has plans to introduce their next generation Powerstroke diesel about a year or so after the new Chevy comes out. The Ford is rumored to be a 6.0L with 305hp and 550 torque. It's also suppose to be several pounds lighter than the current PSD, which will increase the tow rating for the truck.
Isuzu, Cummins and Navistar have all been making diesel engines for a long time. All three make monster diesels with much more torque and hp. However, the trick is matching it with a tranny, drivetrain, and suspension that will fit in a pickup truck and provide a reasonably smooth ride. With hp that is starting to be equal to or better than what is being offered in the gas engines, I think it will be harder to justify buying a gas pickup over a diesel, at least for me. I've currently got about 26,000 miles on my 99 truck, so by the time I'm shopping again in 4-6 years, Ford, Dodge and Chevy will have a few years of production under their belts with the new engines.
Wildman
wildmanbaker, my dad is retired and has an 11,000 pound 5th wheel. He pulls it with a 97 f-350 PSD with the 4.10. Over the past few years, he has had the opportunity to chat with quite a few other RVers. The consensus amongst Cummins and PSD owners is that they are all satisfied with their rigs. It's also USUALLY agreed that the PSD will outpull the Cummins in the hills but the Cummins gets a little better mpg. None of the owners of the Dodge or Fords feel they are underpowered. He hasn't had the opportunity to talk with many 6.5L Chevy owners, since very few people with big fivers use the 6.5L.
As a side note, I did have to take my Ford over to the neighbor's house this morning to jump start his Chevy, but I can't claim any brand superiority with that one. The temp dropped down close to -10 last night. Neither he nor I plugged our trucks in, but I have the V-10 gas engine and he has the 6.5L diesel. Those diesels don't like being left in the cold for extended periods without being started or plugged in.
Engine Description: 90-degree V-8
Displacement: 6.6L
Bore and Stroke: 103 mm x 99 mm
Compression Ratio: 17.5:1
Dry Weight, less clutch: 835 lb
SAE Net Horsepower: 300 HP @ 3,100 rpm
SAE Net Torque: 520 lb-ft @ 1,800 rpm
Induction system: Turbocharged & Charge air cooled
Boost Pressure: 18 psi @ 1,800 rpm
Cylinder Block Material: Induction hardened Gray Iron Cast
Cylinder Head Material: Aluminum w/ 6 bolts per cylinder
Valve Arrangement: 4-valves per cylinder
Valve timing: Gear driven timing set, single cam
Fuel Injection: Bosch High Pressure Common Rail Direct Unit Injection
Oil Capacity: 9.8L w/filter
Oil Cooler: Internal, Unitized plate construction
Exhaust System: 3.5" mandrel bent, no catalytic converter
http://www.62-65-dieselpage.com/chart.gif
And don't duck the question...why on earth would you buy a Dodge if it didn't have the Cummins motor?