Classic Car Magazine has a feature this month on the Full Size Chevrolets (first and the last) and among the categories it lists the "rarest" full-size, regular production Chevrolet as:
1977 Impala Landau Coupe
with only 2745 built. Has anyone ever seen such a car?
okay then, that is weird, that they'd start offering that nicer vinyl on the Caprice coupe/sedan for '73, but not the convertible. Incidentally, the price on the convertible went up considerably from '72 to '73. Everything did a little, because of inflation. But, in 1972 the Impala convertible was $3979, compared to $3720 for the Impala hardtop and $3787 for the Impala custom coupe. The Caprice coupe was $4026.
For 1973, the breakdown was: Impala hardtop coupe: $3769 Impala Custom coupe: $3836 Caprice hardtop coupe: $4082 Caprice convertible: $4345
Incidentally, for 1973, Pontiac got rid of the Catalina convertible. It had been $4080 in 1972, whereas a Grand Ville was $4840. For '73, the Catalina was gone and the Grand Ville actually dropped a bit, to $4766.
I had forgotten about some of those other trim levels for 1967. Seems like the only Ventura packages I've ever seen were on a 4-door sedan, and every Bonnevillle Brougham I've ever seen was on a 4-door hardtop. Wonder why Pontiac didn't just go all out that year and offer an Executive convertible, as well!
There was a '67 2+2 convertible at the car show out near Allentown I go to every August, either last year or the year before.
My theory on the '61 DeSoto was that they made it look a bit ugly on purpose, so that people would be more likely to just buy a Chrysler instead, and nobody would whine as much about the brand departing. And, when the Newport came out for 1961, it was actually a bit cheaper than the DeSotos.
The only feature I don't like about the '61 DeSoto is the upper grille with the mesh, where "D E S O T O" is spelled out. I think if you took that out, and rounded off the hood, it would've looked a lot better, albeit somewhat like a 1960 Lincoln. But, they probably did it that way so it could use the same hood as a Newport or Windsor.
I think the 1960 DeSoto is really sharp looking as well. I actually like them better than the Chryslers that year. It's just a minor detail, but I like the way the grille spreads out at the edges on the DeSotos, and blends in the turn signals under the headlights.
As for the 1959 DeSotos, I don't like them near as much as 1957-58, but I think they're still fairly attractive, for a 1959 design. One thing I like is that, finally, the Firesweep used a DeSoto front-end, rather than taking a Dodge front clip and trying to force the DeSoto grille onto it. Probably took a little extra effort, since they had to come up with Firesweep-specific fenders and a hood, as they had four inches less wheelbase than a "real" DeSoto, and the entire reduction was ahead of the cowl.
The interiors also seemed upgraded for 1959, at least compared to 1957. At least, the occasional '59 Firedome I've seen looks ritzier inside than my '57.
And while the '59 is clunkier and more heavy-handed than the '57-58, I sort of like that twin-nostril grille. IMO it has a muscular, aggressive stance to it. In contrast, the Chryslers that year seem a bit boring to me.
One little detail I don't like about the '55 DeSoto (and the '56 Firedome) is the headlights with the chrome bezels that stick out a bit, making it appear a bit bug-eyed. I liked the '56 Fireflite and Adventurer, which had body colored bezels with a bit of a forward thrust.
"Classic Car Magazine has a feature this month on the Full Size Chevrolets (first and the last) and among the categories it lists the "rarest" full-size, regular production Chevrolet as:
1977 Impala Landau Coupe
with only 2745 built. Has anyone ever seen such a car?"
Oh yes, I've seen them. Even though there were '76 Impala Landau and Caprice Classic models available, for '77 they didn't come out 'til mid-year. They are not shown in "The New Chevrolet" brochure that came out at introduction time. BTW, the photo they show as a '77 Impala Landau is a '78 Impala coupe, not a Landau.
I enjoy that mag greatly and a friend of mine has a column in it a few times a year, but they missed the boat on their comment that a perfect '77-79 Caprice could be had for $3k. The author clearly never looked at eBay for one!
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"I've always been partial to the 62 Cadillac for some reason I probably don't really understand. It just was such a clean looking design. Although I also liked the in your face 59!"
I also like the '62 Cadillac. A good friend bought a white Coupe deVille a few months back; very nice car. I love the Fleetwood Sixty-Special model, and find the short-deck models ("Town Sedan" and "Park Avenue") pretty interesting and incredibly rare, even for a Cadillac. Guess they were trying to field something that was shorter as the concurrent Lincolns were.
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Unlike the B-O-P luxury converts, no center armrest would be available even if Chevy offered to use this interior on the convertible. It's a 50/50 instead of a 55/45 or 60/40 available in the others, which provided a center armrest. I don't know that the passenger side seat back reclined in the B-O-P versions as this seat did in the Caprice though.
This seat trim would have pushed the Caprice convertible up IMHO.
BTW, my wife's grandparents had a new '75 Caprice Classic convertible. I've heard about it and seen a clip or two of it in photos..it was white with white vinyl interior. To me, the '75 Caprice convert interior trim, while still Impala, is a little more plush than the '73 and '74. My wife said when she was a kid that the seats reminded her of band-aids. I know what she means...the perforated vinyl used then.
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I can't recall when I've seen a perfect one, but I'd pay even more than that for a 350 which gets you the 350 trans, a coupe, and one without a cracked dash pad and armrests a different color than the door panel...but is there such a car? LOL
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"The interiors also seemed upgraded for 1959, at least compared to 1957"
I'd forgotten about that, but you are very correct. I remember there was some TV show my parents watched that was sponsored by Dodge. Speaking of that, the 59 Dodge, like the 58 Buick, always evokes a bi-polar response from me. I'm attracted to the excesses, but yet also disturbed by the overall result. Anyway, the ads featured a top of the line Lancer, maybe Royal Lancer? It was quite frenched up (in a good sense, not a cheap bordello one) with a very nice interior that featured those seats where the driver section had a higher back and swiveled out. It wasn't an earlier La Femme, but there was even a promotion in one ad where you would get car matching luggage and a women's purse and cosmetics bag. I think that might have been the year where they began to introduce the toilet bowl embossed trunk lid on upper models, although a guy down street from a friends house had a 60 or 61 Newport with that option. By the way, I never understood the sense of a rear view mirror mounted on the dashboard instead of at the top of the windshield. I'm presuming it was just a style affectation, or was there some benefit or rationale to it?
And andre, though I'm not typically a Mopar guy, I always liked the tall taillights with round lenses of late '50's DeSotos. The '60 did not have that right? Weren't they the same as '60 Chrysler taillights?
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-Jaguar E-Type 4.2, the best car I ever drove. -AC/Shelby Cobra small block, a 289 or 260 would do, hell so would an Ace-Bristol -Mercedes-Benz 280SL (W113) "Pagoda", perhaps the finest product of an era when Mercedes was without a doubt the best-built car in the world. -Any 3-liter Ferrari V12 (i.e. 250 Series) -1973-4 Porsche 911 Carrera RS.
Sorry to break up the parade of American classics from the 60s and 70s there's plenty of those I like (C2 Stingrays, 300B/C, mid 60s Pontiac GPs and GTOs, HiPo Mustangs, 401 Rivieras) but if limited to five on an unlimited budget I'd have to go w the above
Interestingly, one of the main reasons two-door wagons were offered is that some buyers considered them safer for children; they eliminated the risk that children could open the doors. Otherwise, why else, other than a small reduction in cost and what some may have considered sleeker styling, would a family car, in the days before minivans, have more limited access and functionality? Some parents purchased two-door sedans, instead of four-doors, for the same reason.
"I had forgotten about some of those other trim levels for 1967. Seems like the only Ventura packages I've ever seen were on a 4-door sedan, and every Bonnevillle Brougham I've ever seen was on a 4-door hardtop. Wonder why Pontiac didn't just go all out that year and offer an Executive convertible, as well!"
Yeah, really! The only visible differences between an Executive and a Ventura was that the Ventura was on the shorter wheelbase. Interior trim was identical...and I mean identical! In at least '66, the Ventura package got you fender skirts which remained optional on Executives; I'm not sure about later years.
I've seen a good number of Ventura 2-door hardtops, and an occasional Bonneville Brougham 2-door hardtop. I love the combination of sporty fastback roofline and luxury interior. A few years later and those two things seemed mutually exclusive.
At a cruise-in in my old hometown a decade or so ago, there was a cream-colored '66 Bonneville Brougham two-door, black vinyl top, eight-lug wheels, and the black brocade (?) bucket-back bench seat interior. It was drop-dead gorgeous IMHO. I typically don't like 'boats' but I love full-size Pontiacs of that era. It had eight-lug wheels. While I like the '65 dash better (round gauges in the center, and more woodgrain on the right half of the panel), I like the '66 Bonneville exterior trim better, and it lost that huge flying-saucer Bonneville emblem the '65 and earlier ones had on the side.
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"Mechanically fickle" is putting it mildly, "diabolical" would be more like it. You either need to be or retain atop-notch mechanic to enjoy one but they are just gorgeous and when sorted drive as good as they look, and that's saying something.
I drove two back in the day, one was an early convertible that a girl I knew inherited from her late father. The other, a '67 Coupe, was owned by a buddy who worked as an aircraft mechanic. Guess which was a near wreck and which was the best car I ever drove.
Nice list andys but the 280SL sort of sticks out like a sore thumb, since all your other cars are performance automobiles of excellent reputation. The 280SL was once described by the automotive press as "the kind of car a corrupted Senator buys for his Las Vegas girlfriend".
Thanks. I think the '60 Chrysler and DeSoto were good-looking cars. I had a model of one or the other when I was a kid. I had hundreds, most built by my Dad. As a doltish 13 or 14-year old, I decided to get rid of them--setting on fire, etc. Amazing my Dad still spoke to me after that.
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By the way, I never understood the sense of a rear view mirror mounted on the dashboard instead of at the top of the windshield. I'm presuming it was just a style affectation, or was there some benefit or rationale to it?
I've noticed that, in general, the lower the mirror, the better the view out the back. Unless you have someone sitting in the center spot of the seat, that is!
Also some Mopar models in 1957 had a rear window that was a bit low, so a high-mounted mirror may not have worked as well. For instance, on some models like my Firedome, the Windsor, and Saratoga, the hardtop coupe had a smaller, lower rear window than the likes of the Fireflite, New Yorker, 300, and Adventurer. And the Dodge/Plymouth had a different roofline/rear window, entirely, although I think it was a bit taller. The rear window on the 4-door hardtops, which I believe was shared across Plymouth/Dodge/DeSoto/Chrysler, also seems to be cut a bit low, as well.
Don't feel too bad. When I was 9 or 10, I decided to have a "demolition derby" with a bunch of my old model cars. The only models I have left at this point are, packed away somewhere, of a black Peterbilt cabover from around 1980 or so, and a green Kenworth conventional, similar to the one in that old Claude Akins series "Movin' On".
For some reason, I vaguely remember taking a 1/32 scale 1949 Ford, putting it in the doorjamb, and smashing the door closed on it, to see what it could do. By that time I was around 12 I guess. My Mom saw me do it and said "you know you could have gotten ten cents for that little car at a yard sale!" I think I replied along the lines of "But Mom, this was worth it...it was a Ford!" :-P
I doubt you'd be able to find one with the perfect storm of conditions you just described. Most of 'em were just 305's, and the sedan was much more common than the coupe. Non-cracked dashpad might be doable, but at this point, I'd say forget about the interior pieces all being the same color. Even if you keep them out of the sun, that stuff tends to fade, at different rates for whatever material, and it seems like old age gets to it eventually.
My '76 LeMans and '79 5th Ave spend most of their time in the garage, but even here, I've noticed a bit of discoloration in the time that I've had them. And the 5th Ave is getting to the point that some of the hard plastic, such as the trim on the B-pillars, is getting a bit chalky.
On the road today, saw a pastel green and white 57 Ford 2 door HT with wide whites, a red 61 Impala convertible, a 65 GTO, and a Spitfire.
I know I have mentioned my grandfather had a 65 Chrysler - I was visiting my mom, going through some old pics, and I found a couple shots of it:
And in color!
He was a very avid fisherman, I suspect a boat was on the roof a lot (but never saw a pic of one on the roof of the fuselage car that replaced the 65).
Some of those old kits can be worth decent money if mint in box. I am sure you remember the promotional models handed out by dealers - still a big market for those from cars of the late 50s-mid 60s.
Thanks Andre, I figured you'd know if there was some angle to it! I always liked that Chrysler in those days seemed to think ahead of GM and Ford frequently. Probably had to for survival.
Hey, if it was good enough for Speed Racer's Mach 5, it's good enough for a '57 Firedome!
Also, in my case at least, the mirror on the dash is mounted low enough that it doesn't hinder the view forward at all. Looking out, it blocks the view of the front part of the hood and the passenger-side fender, but not the view of the road ahead.
On the downside though, the driver's side tailfin does show up in the mirror, and at a quick glance makes me think there's a car cruising in my blind spot.
I remember some 350 coupes when new, even in our small hometown dealer. In fact, I tried hard to get my Dad to consider the firethorn Impala coupe in the showroom with 350, at only $200 more than the one he eventually bought, bright red with 305. He didn't want a four-barrel (although in Dec. '83 bought a new Monte Carlo with 305 4-barrel).
I'm guessing the dash pad may be being reproduced by now, since it was used for 14 model years ('77-90) and that the cars seem to be appreciated as 'donks' and 'glass house' cars, per eBay, anyway!
The mismatched hard plastic parts (faded) can be painted. Neither's a big deal, but it would be nice to find a car where that's not an issue. I have seen a few on eBay like that...very few though. Usually the cars with black interiors don't have the fading problem.
I don't even care for the Landau models. I'd take one with the plastic, scooped-out spoked wheelcovers, the G-series pinstripe whitewalls, and either a vinyl top or optional upper-body pinstriping, but not both. I must admit that I do like the french-bordello red velour interior with the chromed-plastic escutcheons around the interior door handles.
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I disliked the '63 and '64 Chryslers, but always liked the '65 and '66's. That red seemed very popular in my memory. I don't remember seeing one with no chrome trim around the door frames, but I am aware that the car in the photo is a Newport. Some were 'six-window'-style sedans; remember those ones?
I always liked how the New Yorkers that year had red bulbs with clear taillight lenses--ahead of their time in that small detail. Funny, I dislike that feature now as most vehicles today with that look like the taillight lenses have been broken out! LOL
A '65 300-L may be my favorite Chrysler of the sixties, overall, although I know it's not the powerhouse of previous letter-series 300's.
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Speaking of promotional models from dealers...when my grandfather bought his new '67 Impala Sport Coupe (dark plum color), he bought me a promo '67 Camaro SS Indy Pace Car model, white with blue interior. It didn't survive my early-teenage purge, sadly.
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I have some experience with a couple of those cars. I owned a '79 Park Avenue in those colors, dark blue body, light blue vinyl roof and interior, 403 under the hood. It was a great car that had been well taken car of by the original owner. By the time I got it, it was 22 years old and it had some problems with the wiper/washer system and auto-temp A/C that I could never fix unfortunately. It was so smooth and quiet, it was amazing. Very comfortable car.
In 1980 I got a call from a college buddy who was working at a Chevy dealer here in town. They had just taken in trade one of the civilian Nova police package cars and did I want a test drive? Sure did, so I beat it to the dealer and tried it out. I was underwhelmed. The performance was OK, probably good for the times, but it didn't knock my socks off. What really turned me off was the stark interior. No door armrests, ugly upholstery on an uncomfortable bench seat, it was really taxicab plain. Maybe they could be ordered differently, but this one was not very appealing.
I bought a 20 year old '78 Olds Delta 88 with a red interior and had the color mismatch issue on the plastic pieces. The armrests were the worst problem. Some SEM vinyl dye took care of it nicely and they were fine for the 5 years I owned it.
A friend bought a '79 Caprice sedan that was mint back in the late '90s. It was the two-tone silver and black outside with the bordello red interior. It was really a very bright red, quite vibrant. I liked it, for a Chevy, though I would rather have had another variant of that chassis.
I read that one of the best things that happened to the Mopar Aspen/Volare police package was when Chevy switched their "small" police car from the Nova to the Malibu in 1979. Even though the Malibu was more modern, for whatever reason it didn't do as well in police car guise as the Nova before it did. And while the Nova would run circles around the Aspen/Volare, the Malibu would not.
The Aspen/Volare did quite well...until the transverse torsion bars started pulling loose, cracking, etc. Supposedly one jurisdiction put in their criteria for a police car, in addition to being able to accelerate so fast, brake so fast, go through a closed course so fast, etc, it was not allowed to have transverse torsion bars. Pretty obvious who they were singling out there!
One other factor that might have been in play in 1978 versus 1979...engines. GM cut their power a bit in 1979, with the 305 2-bbl going from 145 hp to 130, although a new 4-bbl 305 with 160 hp was introduced. The 350-4bbl still had the same 170 hp, but perhaps GM did something to reduce the torque/power curves, while keeping peak hp the same? Meanwhile, the Mopar 360-4bbl only had something like 170-175 hp I believe, but in 1979 they got that sucker up to 195.
So it's possible that there was more at play than simply the transition from Nova to Malibu for the smaller police cars.
One thing that would be kinda cool would be to get an old Nova police car, and swap in the interior from something like an Omega Brougham, Nova LN, or something like that! Years ago, there was an Omega Brougham for sale locally. Just had a 260 V-8, so I'm sure it would've been a dog. But damn, that sucker had a nice interior!
Yep, it was a Newport with a 383. Probably no more than moderately equipped - after he drove Fords for years, he ended up liking cars that were a step above basic in image and size, but not luxurious.
I kinda like the '64 Chryslers, which seemed a bit more squared-off and cleaned up than the '63 models, which seemed a bit too heavily inspired by the 1960 Valiant and the prematurely-downsized '62 Plymouths and Dodges.
My biggest issue though, is the New Yorker in that timeframe. It was on a stubby 122" wheelbase, same as the Newport and 300...or a Dodge 880 for that matter. And to my way of thinking, something that's supposed to compete with an Olds 98 or Buick Electra should be bigger than that. The New Yorker just doesn't have the presence, IMO, that one of those cars, or even a Pontiac Bonneville from that era would have.
If it's any consolation though, that relatively compact size probably made them good performers, with the 413 Wedge.
Chrysler definitely made a comeback though, with the '65 models. However, I do think having the Newport and New Yorker on the same wheelbase (albeit a longer 124"), still hurt the NY'er prestige a bit, compared to an Olds 98 or Buick Electra, which were on longer wheelbases than the LeSabre and various 88's.
I like the roof and green house effect on the 63/64 Chrysler, as well as the dash. The rest of the body could maybe have used some work, but I didn't think there was anything really that bad about it.
I wonder what percentage of 65/66 Chrysler's were six window? I don't recall ever seeing very many of that version which actually surprised me a bit since GM had set the precedent back then that 6 windows was status in a Buick or Olds.
I remember seeing a 6 window Newport in a junkyard when I was a kid, maybe late 80s-early 90s. I had never seen one before, and I thought it might be some kind of rare model. I think I've seen one other one on the road since.
"One thing that would be kinda cool would be to get an old Nova police car, and swap in the interior from something like an Omega Brougham, Nova LN, or something like that!"
In the day (when I was old enough to be interested in cars but too young to buy one) I wanted to find a GTO ('65 or so) that had been rolled or something, so that the body was toast, and transplant a LeMans 4-door (preferably hardtop) body and interior onto the chassis. The 2- and 4-doors shared a chassis, and I figured the anchor points for the 4-door's seats were probably also there in the 2-door. It would have been a heck of a sleeper.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
I think my old car book breaks down production of the 6-window, versus the 4-window Mopars. I'm pretty sure the 4-window style was much more popular.
With the GM C-bodies, I think the 6-window style was more popular in 1961, because the 4-window had a wraparound rear window that seemed awkward on those luxury cars. For 1962, the 4-window C-pillar was thick and formal, and on Cadillacs at least, it outsold the 6-window. However, it didn't outsell it by an overwhelming margin. Dunno how it fared with 98 and Electra sales, though.
I don't think the 6-window look on the Chryslers, which was applied to a pillared sedan rather than a hardtop, was quite as graceful as GM's treatment.
I didn't need to destroy any of my model cars. My Mom managed to do it for me by cleaning them by putting them in the bathtub to wash the dust off! Water and Testor's model glue are not friends! I spent a lot of time reassembling my models after Mom did the dusting. After a couple baths, the models wouldn't hold together anymore at which point my brother and I simply burned them or blew them up with firecrackers.
Might not have even been any real bids on it, with a reserve like that. Sometimes the auction company will put in shill bids but of course, not up to the reserve--just to get the action going if the car stalls in the beginning.
My rule is to never spend a lot of money on a "classic" car that you need to spend 1/2 hour explaining to anyone about what it is and why you paid so much for it.
Basically you are paying $160,000 for an engine. Seems nuts to me.
I kinda like it, simply because it's an offbeat looking car, and the black makes it look a bit tougher. But yeah, no way in hell I'd pay $160K for it. I don't think there's ANY car out there that would get me excited enough to drop $160K on it.
From some angles, you can really see how similar that Comet is to a Falcon. Looks like they used the exact same roofline, but just moved the rear axle back. With the 4-door sedans, the similarity isn't nearly as obvious. And by that time the Falcon didn't offer hardtops or convertibles, while the Comet and Fairlane did, so there was no direct comparison there.
I'm curious, how can you tell the '85 Tempo from the '84? I think '86 was when it got flush headlights. Did they maybe change some badging or something else subtle between '84 and '85?
Sadly, to this day, I can always ID a 2000 Intrepid base model, almost immediately. 2000 was the first year they went to a 16" wheel with the "twisted star" hubcap design. For 2001 they used the same wheelcover, but that year they put an "SE" badge on the little blacked-out part of the rear door, just behind the window, whereas the 2000 model was just an Intrepid, with no suffix.
Oh, while out running errands at lunch, I saw a pretty nice looking '84-85 LeSabre. Two-tone green, dark over light, and no vinyl roof, which must have been a rarity. It was parked at a Bob Evans during lunchtime, so I'm going out on a limb and stereotype the driver as a blue-haired member of the Red Hats Society! ;-)
Comments
1977 Impala Landau Coupe
with only 2745 built. Has anyone ever seen such a car?
Second rarest? 1974 Caprice Classic convertible.
I can't picture what you're saying: Red top? White horizontal? Red Sides? But where's the other white?
http://www.cars-on-line.com/photo/63900/60ford63998-2.jpg
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For 1973, the breakdown was:
Impala hardtop coupe: $3769
Impala Custom coupe: $3836
Caprice hardtop coupe: $4082
Caprice convertible: $4345
Incidentally, for 1973, Pontiac got rid of the Catalina convertible. It had been $4080 in 1972, whereas a Grand Ville was $4840. For '73, the Catalina was gone and the Grand Ville actually dropped a bit, to $4766.
I had forgotten about some of those other trim levels for 1967. Seems like the only Ventura packages I've ever seen were on a 4-door sedan, and every Bonnevillle Brougham I've ever seen was on a 4-door hardtop. Wonder why Pontiac didn't just go all out that year and offer an Executive convertible, as well!
There was a '67 2+2 convertible at the car show out near Allentown I go to every August, either last year or the year before.
That two tone car pictured is not stock - the white would only be on the roof.
The only feature I don't like about the '61 DeSoto is the upper grille with the mesh, where "D E S O T O" is spelled out. I think if you took that out, and rounded off the hood, it would've looked a lot better, albeit somewhat like a 1960 Lincoln. But, they probably did it that way so it could use the same hood as a Newport or Windsor.
I think the 1960 DeSoto is really sharp looking as well. I actually like them better than the Chryslers that year. It's just a minor detail, but I like the way the grille spreads out at the edges on the DeSotos, and blends in the turn signals under the headlights.
As for the 1959 DeSotos, I don't like them near as much as 1957-58, but I think they're still fairly attractive, for a 1959 design. One thing I like is that, finally, the Firesweep used a DeSoto front-end, rather than taking a Dodge front clip and trying to force the DeSoto grille onto it. Probably took a little extra effort, since they had to come up with Firesweep-specific fenders and a hood, as they had four inches less wheelbase than a "real" DeSoto, and the entire reduction was ahead of the cowl.
The interiors also seemed upgraded for 1959, at least compared to 1957. At least, the occasional '59 Firedome I've seen looks ritzier inside than my '57.
And while the '59 is clunkier and more heavy-handed than the '57-58, I sort of like that twin-nostril grille. IMO it has a muscular, aggressive stance to it. In contrast, the Chryslers that year seem a bit boring to me.
One little detail I don't like about the '55 DeSoto (and the '56 Firedome) is the headlights with the chrome bezels that stick out a bit, making it appear a bit bug-eyed. I liked the '56 Fireflite and Adventurer, which had body colored bezels with a bit of a forward thrust.
1977 Impala Landau Coupe
with only 2745 built. Has anyone ever seen such a car?"
Oh yes, I've seen them. Even though there were '76 Impala Landau and Caprice Classic models available, for '77 they didn't come out 'til mid-year. They are not shown in "The New Chevrolet" brochure that came out at introduction time. BTW, the photo they show as a '77 Impala Landau is a '78 Impala coupe, not a Landau.
I enjoy that mag greatly and a friend of mine has a column in it a few times a year, but they missed the boat on their comment that a perfect '77-79 Caprice could be had for $3k. The author clearly never looked at eBay for one!
I also like the '62 Cadillac. A good friend bought a white Coupe deVille a few months back; very nice car. I love the Fleetwood Sixty-Special model, and find the short-deck models ("Town Sedan" and "Park Avenue") pretty interesting and incredibly rare, even for a Cadillac. Guess they were trying to field something that was shorter as the concurrent Lincolns were.
http://www.oldcarbrochures.com/static/NA/Chevrolet/1974_Chevrolet/1974_Chevrolet- _Full_Size/1974%20Chevrolet%20Full%20Size-05.html
Unlike the B-O-P luxury converts, no center armrest would be available even if Chevy offered to use this interior on the convertible. It's a 50/50 instead of a 55/45 or 60/40 available in the others, which provided a center armrest. I don't know that the passenger side seat back reclined in the B-O-P versions as this seat did in the Caprice though.
This seat trim would have pushed the Caprice convertible up IMHO.
BTW, my wife's grandparents had a new '75 Caprice Classic convertible. I've heard about it and seen a clip or two of it in photos..it was white with white vinyl interior. To me, the '75 Caprice convert interior trim, while still Impala, is a little more plush than the '73 and '74. My wife said when she was a kid that the seats reminded her of band-aids. I know what she means...the perforated vinyl used then.
I'd forgotten about that, but you are very correct. I remember there was some TV show my parents watched that was sponsored by Dodge. Speaking of that, the 59 Dodge, like the 58 Buick, always evokes a bi-polar response from me. I'm attracted to the excesses, but yet also disturbed by the overall result. Anyway, the ads featured a top of the line Lancer, maybe Royal Lancer? It was quite frenched up (in a good sense, not a cheap bordello one) with a very nice interior that featured those seats where the driver section had a higher back and swiveled out. It wasn't an earlier La Femme, but there was even a promotion in one ad where you would get car matching luggage and a women's purse and cosmetics bag. I think that might have been the year where they began to introduce the toilet bowl embossed trunk lid on upper models, although a guy down street from a friends house had a 60 or 61 Newport with that option. By the way, I never understood the sense of a rear view mirror mounted on the dashboard instead of at the top of the windshield. I'm presuming it was just a style affectation, or was there some benefit or rationale to it?
And andre, though I'm not typically a Mopar guy, I always liked the tall taillights with round lenses of late '50's DeSotos. The '60 did not have that right? Weren't they the same as '60 Chrysler taillights?
-Jaguar E-Type 4.2, the best car I ever drove.
-AC/Shelby Cobra small block, a 289 or 260 would do, hell so would an Ace-Bristol
-Mercedes-Benz 280SL (W113) "Pagoda", perhaps the finest product of an era when Mercedes was without a doubt the best-built car in the world.
-Any 3-liter Ferrari V12 (i.e. 250 Series)
-1973-4 Porsche 911 Carrera RS.
Sorry to break up the parade of American classics from the 60s and 70s there's plenty of those I like (C2 Stingrays, 300B/C, mid 60s Pontiac GPs and GTOs, HiPo Mustangs, 401 Rivieras) but if limited to five on an unlimited budget I'd have to go w the above
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Yeah, really! The only visible differences between an Executive and a Ventura was that the Ventura was on the shorter wheelbase. Interior trim was identical...and I mean identical! In at least '66, the Ventura package got you fender skirts which remained optional on Executives; I'm not sure about later years.
I've seen a good number of Ventura 2-door hardtops, and an occasional Bonneville Brougham 2-door hardtop. I love the combination of sporty fastback roofline and luxury interior. A few years later and those two things seemed mutually exclusive.
At a cruise-in in my old hometown a decade or so ago, there was a cream-colored '66 Bonneville Brougham two-door, black vinyl top, eight-lug wheels, and the black brocade (?) bucket-back bench seat interior. It was drop-dead gorgeous IMHO. I typically don't like 'boats' but I love full-size Pontiacs of that era. It had eight-lug wheels. While I like the '65 dash better (round gauges in the center, and more woodgrain on the right half of the panel), I like the '66 Bonneville exterior trim better, and it lost that huge flying-saucer Bonneville emblem the '65 and earlier ones had on the side.
I drove two back in the day, one was an early convertible that a girl I knew inherited from her late father. The other, a '67 Coupe, was owned by a buddy who worked as an aircraft mechanic. Guess which was a near wreck and which was the best car I ever drove.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
OUCH!
The Chrysler taillights were just a simple, generic lens.
I've noticed that, in general, the lower the mirror, the better the view out the back. Unless you have someone sitting in the center spot of the seat, that is!
Also some Mopar models in 1957 had a rear window that was a bit low, so a high-mounted mirror may not have worked as well. For instance, on some models like my Firedome, the Windsor, and Saratoga, the hardtop coupe had a smaller, lower rear window than the likes of the Fireflite, New Yorker, 300, and Adventurer. And the Dodge/Plymouth had a different roofline/rear window, entirely, although I think it was a bit taller. The rear window on the 4-door hardtops, which I believe was shared across Plymouth/Dodge/DeSoto/Chrysler, also seems to be cut a bit low, as well.
For some reason, I vaguely remember taking a 1/32 scale 1949 Ford, putting it in the doorjamb, and smashing the door closed on it, to see what it could do. By that time I was around 12 I guess. My Mom saw me do it and said "you know you could have gotten ten cents for that little car at a yard sale!" I think I replied along the lines of "But Mom, this was worth it...it was a Ford!" :-P
My '76 LeMans and '79 5th Ave spend most of their time in the garage, but even here, I've noticed a bit of discoloration in the time that I've had them. And the 5th Ave is getting to the point that some of the hard plastic, such as the trim on the B-pillars, is getting a bit chalky.
I know I have mentioned my grandfather had a 65 Chrysler - I was visiting my mom, going through some old pics, and I found a couple shots of it:
And in color!
He was a very avid fisherman, I suspect a boat was on the roof a lot (but never saw a pic of one on the roof of the fuselage car that replaced the 65).
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Also, in my case at least, the mirror on the dash is mounted low enough that it doesn't hinder the view forward at all. Looking out, it blocks the view of the front part of the hood and the passenger-side fender, but not the view of the road ahead.
On the downside though, the driver's side tailfin does show up in the mirror, and at a quick glance makes me think there's a car cruising in my blind spot.
I'm guessing the dash pad may be being reproduced by now, since it was used for 14 model years ('77-90) and that the cars seem to be appreciated as 'donks' and 'glass house' cars, per eBay, anyway!
The mismatched hard plastic parts (faded) can be painted. Neither's a big deal, but it would be nice to find a car where that's not an issue. I have seen a few on eBay like that...very few though. Usually the cars with black interiors don't have the fading problem.
I don't even care for the Landau models. I'd take one with the plastic, scooped-out spoked wheelcovers, the G-series pinstripe whitewalls, and either a vinyl top or optional upper-body pinstriping, but not both. I must admit that I do like the french-bordello red velour interior with the chromed-plastic escutcheons around the interior door handles.
I always liked how the New Yorkers that year had red bulbs with clear taillight lenses--ahead of their time in that small detail. Funny, I dislike that feature now as most vehicles today with that look like the taillight lenses have been broken out! LOL
A '65 300-L may be my favorite Chrysler of the sixties, overall, although I know it's not the powerhouse of previous letter-series 300's.
In 1980 I got a call from a college buddy who was working at a Chevy dealer here in town. They had just taken in trade one of the civilian Nova police package cars and did I want a test drive? Sure did, so I beat it to the dealer and tried it out. I was underwhelmed. The performance was OK, probably good for the times, but it didn't knock my socks off. What really turned me off was the stark interior. No door armrests, ugly upholstery on an uncomfortable bench seat, it was really taxicab plain. Maybe they could be ordered differently, but this one was not very appealing.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
A friend bought a '79 Caprice sedan that was mint back in the late '90s. It was the two-tone silver and black outside with the bordello red interior. It was really a very bright red, quite vibrant. I liked it, for a Chevy, though I would rather have had another variant of that chassis.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
The Aspen/Volare did quite well...until the transverse torsion bars started pulling loose, cracking, etc. Supposedly one jurisdiction put in their criteria for a police car, in addition to being able to accelerate so fast, brake so fast, go through a closed course so fast, etc, it was not allowed to have transverse torsion bars. Pretty obvious who they were singling out there!
One other factor that might have been in play in 1978 versus 1979...engines. GM cut their power a bit in 1979, with the 305 2-bbl going from 145 hp to 130, although a new 4-bbl 305 with 160 hp was introduced. The 350-4bbl still had the same 170 hp, but perhaps GM did something to reduce the torque/power curves, while keeping peak hp the same? Meanwhile, the Mopar 360-4bbl only had something like 170-175 hp I believe, but in 1979 they got that sucker up to 195.
So it's possible that there was more at play than simply the transition from Nova to Malibu for the smaller police cars.
One thing that would be kinda cool would be to get an old Nova police car, and swap in the interior from something like an Omega Brougham, Nova LN, or something like that! Years ago, there was an Omega Brougham for sale locally. Just had a 260 V-8, so I'm sure it would've been a dog. But damn, that sucker had a nice interior!
Here's a promo for you:
In box, worth a few hundred today anyway.
My biggest issue though, is the New Yorker in that timeframe. It was on a stubby 122" wheelbase, same as the Newport and 300...or a Dodge 880 for that matter. And to my way of thinking, something that's supposed to compete with an Olds 98 or Buick Electra should be bigger than that. The New Yorker just doesn't have the presence, IMO, that one of those cars, or even a Pontiac Bonneville from that era would have.
If it's any consolation though, that relatively compact size probably made them good performers, with the 413 Wedge.
Chrysler definitely made a comeback though, with the '65 models. However, I do think having the Newport and New Yorker on the same wheelbase (albeit a longer 124"), still hurt the NY'er prestige a bit, compared to an Olds 98 or Buick Electra, which were on longer wheelbases than the LeSabre and various 88's.
I wonder what percentage of 65/66 Chrysler's were six window? I don't recall ever seeing very many of that version which actually surprised me a bit since GM had set the precedent back then that 6 windows was status in a Buick or Olds.
In the day (when I was old enough to be interested in cars but too young to buy one) I wanted to find a GTO ('65 or so) that had been rolled or something, so that the body was toast, and transplant a LeMans 4-door (preferably hardtop) body and interior onto the chassis. The 2- and 4-doors shared a chassis, and I figured the anchor points for the 4-door's seats were probably also there in the 2-door. It would have been a heck of a sleeper.
2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv. (RIP 2001 Jaguar XK8 cnv and 1985 MB 380SE [the best of the lot])
http://lat.ms/1bJDZKB
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
With the GM C-bodies, I think the 6-window style was more popular in 1961, because the 4-window had a wraparound rear window that seemed awkward on those luxury cars. For 1962, the 4-window C-pillar was thick and formal, and on Cadillacs at least, it outsold the 6-window. However, it didn't outsell it by an overwhelming margin. Dunno how it fared with 98 and Electra sales, though.
I don't think the 6-window look on the Chryslers, which was applied to a pillared sedan rather than a hardtop, was quite as graceful as GM's treatment.
http://www.mecum.com/auctions/lot_detail.cfm?LOT_ID=CA0813-161559
I know, rare, big engine, loooow miles, but only the owner will know that, looks are beyond 'sleeper' status.
As for five collector cars I'd like to own?
1. 1969 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham.
2. 1958 Buick Limited four-door hardtop.
3. 1957 Cadillac Eldorado Brougham
4. 1970 Chevrolet Caprice two-door hardtop.
5. 1960 Imperial.
My rule is to never spend a lot of money on a "classic" car that you need to spend 1/2 hour explaining to anyone about what it is and why you paid so much for it.
Basically you are paying $160,000 for an engine. Seems nuts to me.
From some angles, you can really see how similar that Comet is to a Falcon. Looks like they used the exact same roofline, but just moved the rear axle back. With the 4-door sedans, the similarity isn't nearly as obvious. And by that time the Falcon didn't offer hardtops or convertibles, while the Comet and Fairlane did, so there was no direct comparison there.
Sadly, to this day, I can always ID a 2000 Intrepid base model, almost immediately. 2000 was the first year they went to a 16" wheel with the "twisted star" hubcap design. For 2001 they used the same wheelcover, but that year they put an "SE" badge on the little blacked-out part of the rear door, just behind the window, whereas the 2000 model was just an Intrepid, with no suffix.
Oh, while out running errands at lunch, I saw a pretty nice looking '84-85 LeSabre. Two-tone green, dark over light, and no vinyl roof, which must have been a rarity. It was parked at a Bob Evans during lunchtime, so I'm going out on a limb and stereotype the driver as a blue-haired member of the Red Hats Society! ;-)