I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

PF_Flyer · October 2004

Since you made it a riddle, I thought about it. Elderly couple, barely getting around. Would have difficulty climbing up into a Hummer or getting into some low-slung small car. They might also have a problem with doors once they got in. I was thinking open air as well, so why not this?

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

Hey, the Elder-Buggy! Brilliant and I'm sure the old folks would love it (except in the rain).

ghulet · October 2004

....was probably sitting on the lot for a year, the dealer probably hoodwinked them into buying it (-;

My neighbors have several SUVs, one of which they invariably trade in every year, and also a really nice red Volvo convertible (with the high-pressure turbo, naturally) that they almost never drive. It sits across the street in the garage of their rental house, I honestly don't think I saw it out more than once all summer. What a waste, probably a $40k car a few years ago when they bought it new (I think it's a first year model, so '99 or '00), now worth half that without them having driven it.

jrosasmc · October 2004

Spotted this afternoon- a '97 Porsche 911 Carrera 4S on the interstate as I was returning from New Hampshire. The 4S, one of the last of the air-cooled 911s, had the Turbo "wide-body," but without that model's engine. How many of those cars are around, anyway? This is the first time I've ever seen one, although I've heard about them...seeing that particular car made me drool. Black on black, really slick car.

ghulet · October 2004

...I saw a 4S the other day on the Kennedy, in red. Don't know what year it was, though.

fintail · October 2004

I saw an absolutely immaculate Fiat 128 sedan today. It was pretty cool. I remarked about it to the person in the car with me, and they asked "Is that a Russian car?"

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

It's a Lada car for the money (sorry).

fintail · October 2004

Having a Lada variant would be cool too.

Ebay time:

This is...unsual...needs to go to...England...I see a big dent on the door not mentioned in the ad

These are cute little things...but why are they being sent here? So rodders can ruin them?

You'd have to be brave

One of the nicer ones of these left. That's enough British iron for me today

I wonder about the history of this...how it got here...it should go back too

Shifty-mobile

Another oddball from the days of vanishing marques...and an unfortunate logo

Beautifully finished late Pierce-Arrow in horrible color combo

Elegance, expense

I really like this, as is. Nice patina. Good project

Can't be many of these left

Neat little wagon

Late DeSoto with interesting history theory

A "spring colors" car...expensive for what it is

Crazy

Nice fintail. I think this one or its twin was in Hemmings about 5 yrs ago for $5K. Euro lights with US signals - no.

If you're insane, here's your car

andys120 · October 2004

I think the 1969 Rover is mislabeled. It's a left hand-driver from the American Heartland so it's almost certainly a US-Spec Rover, most likely a 2000TC not an "SC". The little black box on the front bumper is a temp sensor that turns a dash light on when the temp goes near or below freezing (unheard of in the 60s).

It's an interesting car on a couple of levels. It was regarded as a good handling, well-equipped sports sedan by us "import car" freaks back in the day. It boasted a twin cam engine and lots of room
with good handling and brakes. The 2000TC was suceeded by the Buick-Rover V8 powered Rover 3500.

As usual with Rovers, execution did not live up to the conceptual promise of those cars.

andre1969 · October 2004

at a used car lot just up the road...

It's a 1974 Imperial LeBaron hardtop coupe. I have no idea how many miles are on it, or what all is wrong with it. It has a little rust coming through on the lower rear quarters and a bit on the passenger side rocker panel. Interior looks great, except for some wrinkled/warped vinyl on the interior C-pillar trim.

Any idea how much something like this should reasonably go for? I'm actually kinda tempted, and thought about offering them maybe $2500.

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

That's just about book value for one in "fair" condition, maybe a bit generous by $500.

RE: Rover 3500 was the car Grace Kelly drove over a cliff. I hate when that happens.

RE: Shifty-mobile....yes, the two lines of description of the car and the grainy black and white photos of a similar car from Spanish website were all very helpful--LOL! Ay, ay, ay, how NOT to sell a car!

DESOTO: His argument is VERY weak, and even if it were somehow true, who cares? It's the FIRST of something and maybe the second that everyone wants. Think about it. Repeat "I'm number One!" to yourself and then cry out "I'm number 3,155!".

FIAT: If it were in northern California (the sane half) I'd bid on it, but only after I drove it. The notion that this car is "restored" is very wobbly, just looking at the photos of a green car with a white dashboard and ripped up floor mats in the back.

andre1969 · October 2004

actually have the best survival rate for any year DeSoto, as a ratio of cars remaining compared to those built. I used to be a member of the National DeSoto Club years ago, and I remember them mentioning that in their roster issue. This was probably around 1991 or so. IIRC, there were 911 DeSoto hardtop coupes built that year, and 2123 hardtop sedans, for 3034 total. I want to say there were around 60 in the roster, which accounts for 2% of the total produced.

The most popular DeSoto of all in that roster was the 1956. I think there were about 200. The 1950 was also very common (I forget the total, but that was DeSoto's best year ever). Of my favorite design, the '57-59, 1959 was the most represented in the roster. I forget the totals for each year, but originally, they built about 117,500 for 1957, 49,000 for 1958, and 45,700 for 1959. I figured the '57 would be the most popular, because it was the cleanest design of the 3 years, and had the Hemi. But maybe by '59, they had some of the quality control issues fixed? I have noticed that, in junkyard examples, '59 DeSotos tend to be better preserved (less rusty) than '57-58's. I also heard it was real common to yank the Hemi out of the '57's, junk the body, and put the engine in a hotrod.

As for that Imperial, should I offer them $2500 then? Would this example be considered "fair"? It looks pretty in the pictures, but it does have the rust issues, which I think should keep it well out of top-dollar range. What would one of these go for in pristine condition? Maybe $5-6K?

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

Yeah, at most, that's all the money in the world $5K.

As for whether it's "fair" or not in condition, you'd have to inspect the rust and see how bad it is, If you can stick a pencil in it, that's not good. Also we'd have to presume no mechanical issues of any consequence, and a very decent interior.

If there's more problems than the blemishes to the body in a few spots, I'd pass and look for something nicer.

Personally I think $2,500 is very strong money for the car, but if it runs get and the rust is an easy fix, no great harm done. Just about any good used car costs $2,500 these days. And that's what you are buying here, a fun used car. So if you can't use it as a utilitarian used car, don't buy it would be my advice. It's not going to grow in value just sitting there waiting to be fixed.

murray53 · October 2004

I've recently seen a couple of 2 door Toyota Camrys in my area. They were only made in the 1992-96 body style. They looked kind of strange with only 2 doors.

murray53 · October 2004

A block away from my home I sometimes see a Suzuki 2 seater (X-90 I think). It has no back seat or rear side windows at all but it does have a trunk. Anyone know how many of these were made?

andre1969 · October 2004

...and hard, for doing this:

The 70's could be tacky in their own charming, endearing sort of way. But infusing some modern-day bling-bling definitely does NOT improve anything!

lemko · October 2004

An abominable Colannade-styled GM car with bling-bling wheels! The worst of two eras! Did you photoshop this to scare me for Halloween?

andre1969 · October 2004

that picture is real. I found it on the auto trader website. I think the owner wants $6,000 for it. I don't think it's possible for me to get drunk enough to actually make up something like that!

Something about the landau roof doesn't look right, either. IIRC, it should only come down to the beltline, not dipping below it to end at that curve on the rear quarter!

The real tragedy is that, for some twisted reason or other, the '76 LeMans is one of my favorite cars of the 70's. To see it abused and tortured like this makes me want to form some kind of society for the prevention of cruelty to seventies cars! ;-)

lemko · October 2004

I'd have to drink the whole Jack Daniel's distillery to consider paying $6K for that abomination! I thought the roof looked strange too. I don't remember any roof curving downward toward the door opening like that.

Per the SPC70sC, you should protest monster truck shows. More '70s American iron dies at these events than anywhere else.

andys120 · October 2004

or a GrandAM (first iteration)?

Pretty awful either way.

merckx · October 2004

..because I found myself thinking, "$6,000 for that 'Troon Ami8 sounds like a pretty sweet deal!!

ateixeira · October 2004

That car is worth about half what he paid for the wheels. That's about all you could get for the set, used.

-juice

andre1969 · October 2004

the advertisement didn't say what engine the car had in it. These cars had anything from a Chevy 250 inline six, on up through an Olds 260 V-8 (IIRC), a Chevy 305 (the Pontiac 301 wasn't out yet), Pontiac 350, 400, and 455.

I'm guessing this blinged up car is going to have one of the weakest engines available. Aren't those massive wheels heavy, too? I'm sure they'll do wonders for the car's performance!

debaser853 · October 2004

I've seen two interesting cars in the last two commutes to work.

Yesterday, a Mercury XR7 Turbo, ala mid 80's, landau roof, in good shape.

This morning, a perfect looking Volvo P1800ES (had to search for the model name since I only knew it was a Volvo), dark green.

jrosasmc · October 2004

Saw an early '80s Saab 900 Turbo sedan this morning...I'm surprised this thing was even running. It was obvious to me that it was a tired driver; it was smoking really badly, but it sure was moving.

I very rarely see any early-'80s Saab like that anymore...weren't the turbo engines from that time especially troublesome?

ateixeira · October 2004

The exception that proves the rule?

-juice

andys120 · October 2004

Actually I saw a perfect, brand new looking Saab 900SPG in a gas station the other day.

Saab Turbo engines (assuming regular oil chages aren't troublesome in fact they were sturdy and reliable as well as being the most powerful fours of their era. Don't forget Jros that early 80s cars are now 20 years old.

Recently seen at specialist used car dealership:

-Early XJ6 sedan in primer and missing grille trim pieces and headlights. Looks like a '79 Camaro from in front(!).

-A very fair looking Merkur XR7ti, white.

ghulet · October 2004

...my brother and I have owned four first-gen SAAB 900s (which clearly means we're sick, stupid or lacking short-term memory) only one turbo, an '85 SPG, the other three were 16v 900S. IMO the engines are really the LAST thing you have to worry about on those cars, turbo or not. Things like heater cores, ignition switches (don't use as a cupholder), AC systems, power sunroof motors, door handles, quirky brakes and suspension issues come to mind among the myriad list of things repaired on those cars. The earlier (pre-85) 8v turbos, IIRC, aren't intercooled, which means you have to let them cool off a bit before turning the car off. The turbo units themselves are renowned for being reliable.

Re the cars themselves: love the seats and driving position, the room, the handling and turning radius, their traction in snow and the turbo motor. Otherwise, not a whole lot to recommend them as daily drivers, especially since the newest are now twelve years old. OTOH, if you can find a well-maintained 16v turbo 5-speed (hopefully with a MANUAL sunroof), not the worst second car for not much $$. Just don't expect it to be as trouble free as your new Camry.

ghulet · October 2004

Just saw a nice but faded blue early MGB-GT.

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

Saab shed head gaskets like I'm shedding hair. (8% failure rate says Saabnet, which is pretty bad). Also chronic over-heaters. Must have been too cold in Sweden to notice.

But the BOTTOM END of a Saab engine is forever, that is very true.

I like MGB-GTs. Really the first mass production hatchback I believe. The taller windshield and better soundproofing and chassis rigidity makes the GT coupe a nicer car to drive than an MGB, except on a perfect, sunny day perhaps. And you can buy any part you need for it, UPS second day to your front door. Awesome aftermarket support for MGs.

jrosasmc · October 2004

Speaking of MGs, all you MG fans out there, guess what I found? The very last MGB (Limited Edition) ever exported to the USA from Abingdon! That's right, the last-ever American-spec MG. It has 1,326 original miles, and you can find it on Ebay- really. Type in "1980 MG" under search and you'll see it.

jrosasmc · October 2004

Oh yes, before I forget, I did see that very car (the MG) in person once- at the Gast Car Museum in Pennsylvania, right in or near Amish country.

Lemko, Grbeck, any Penn residents...do you remember that museum? They auctioned off the contents in 1997; I saw the MG in the summer of '96. Great location, though.

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

Yeah, but does anybody care that the last miserable example of a long run of sad sad emission-choked, rubber bumpered toad-cars still exists? Not me. MG died in 1974 in my book.

jrosasmc · October 2004

Yes, that was a sad, sorry state in MG's history...those abysmal years. Even the Midgets from '75-'79 were horrible.

grbeck · October 2004

Yes, I remember that musuem, and even visited it once. It wasn't very large. It was located right in the middle of Amish Country.

In the car corral at both last year's and this year's Hershey show, the Gast Museum had some very clean cars for sale. Two that stick in my mind from this year were a very clean 1978 Lincoln Continental Mark V Diamond Jubilee edition, along with a nice 1966 Chevrolet Impala convertible.

kyfdx · October 2004

Not sure why anyone would want that Mark V.. But, the Impala convertible.. There is a '65 SS convertible in the local paper. "Only" asking $22,500.. serious inquiries only, of course...

andre1969 · October 2004

who's in total lust over the Mark V. He finally bought one early this year, and unfortunately it's been in the shop since around June!

I think they're good looking cars, and very stylish (especially for the 70's!) but they're too danged big (never thought I'd hear myself say that!) take up too much room in the driveway/garage, not all that roomy inside, and even with a 460, they're not that fast. I think when it comes to pimpy barges like this, I'd be more fascinated with a '75-76 Caddy Eldorado convertible, or maybe a pre-downsized Riv or Toronado. But then with cars like this, I kinda like 'em a bit more conservative and understated, so gimme an Olds 98, Chrysler NYer, or especially a Buick Electra. I think the Electra was probably the most tasteful barge of the 70's.

I don't know if this is true or not, but my friend said my '79 NYer felt like it could easily take his Mark V in a drag race. If that's the case, I'd hate to imagine how slow one of these Marks would be with just a 400!

I guess I wouldn't mind having one, but wouldn't want one enough to over-pay on it, or to pay top dollar for the nicest example around.

kyfdx · October 2004

Mark IV or Mark VII are fine... V and VI are pretty much reflective of the years they were manufactured.. A lot of crappy cars from the late '70s and early '80s.

andre1969 · October 2004

I think it's a tossup between the Mark IV and the Mark V. The Mark IV, for the most part, had more powerful engines, seemed like it was built a bit better, and had a few niceties like being a "true" hardtop. The rear windows didn't roll down though...they retracted a few inches into the C-pillar. In the Mark V, they were stationary.

But when it comes to looks, I think the V has a lot going for it. Even though it's just a reskin of the Mark IV, I think it came out beautiful, with perfect lines and proportions.

Now the Mark VI is one car I'd rather forget! I think a lot of people would, too! I have heard though, that performance-wise, it was actually a bit quicker than the Mark V. Even though it went from a 400/460 down to a 302/351, it also lost about a thousand pounds, gained a 4-speed automatic tranny, and the rear-end went from something lame like a 2.4X:1 to a 3.08:1.

The Mark VII was probably the best thing they ever did for the series, though!

lemko · October 2004

...the abyssmal 1980-82 Thunderbird underneath? If so, it must've really been a dog. My Dad had one of those awful Birds.

Here's an obscure reference to the Mark IV. Does anybody remember a cartoon that was on the Disney Channel called "Goof Troop?" It featured Goofy and his son. Their neighbor Pete drove a car that looked a lot like a Mark IV. I once heard the Mark IV as being described as the perfect car for the steakhouse tycoon.

andre1969 · October 2004

was on the Panther platform, same as the Lincoln Town Car. Oddly enough though, in that time period they offered a Mark VI sedan, as well! The "regular" Continentals (I think Lincoln called EVERYTHING "Continental" around that time) rode a 117.3" wb, but with the Mark VI, the sedan was 117.3, while the coupe was 114.3, same as the LTD/Marquis. Another distinguishing feature was the Mark VI had the trademark oval opera windows.

There was a bad guy in "Beavis and Butthead Do America", who was driving an old Mark. It was drawn pretty poorly though, so I don't remember if it was a Mark III or Mark IV.

lemko · October 2004

...I recall seeing some of these with really goofy-looking round lights on the headlmap doors.

I think the bad guy's car in "Beavis and Butthead" was a Mark IV per the taillights.

Here's a ready oddity. I saw an Avanti convertible at the Neshaminy Mall in Bensalem, PA. I didn't think they still made Avantis. The car looked like it was based on a Camaro. The car looked pretty odd.

andys120 · October 2004

there's a very clean-looking late 70s example not far from my house. It never seems to move so I dunno if it runs.

It's dark green w matching vinyl roof, 2-doors and hidden headlights that have big T-Bird emblems on the flaps.

I found it surprisingly attractive for a Yank Tank of that era.

andys120 · October 2004

That sounds like the Avanti V convertible which was featured on the Avanti Motors website. It may still be in limited production.

lemko · October 2004

Are they still built in the same South Bend, Indiana plant Studebakers came from? Seems the Avanti has died and come back more times than the Smothers Brothers. Last I heard they stopped production in the early '90s.

andys120 · October 2004

Villa Rica Georgia!

Here is more on Avanti's current status...
http://www.prweb.com/releases/2004/8/prweb150534.htm

Doesn't that PR realease ask more questions than it answers? Though dated 10/20, it doesn't say if there were any bidders for Avanti on 10/01, let alone if it's been transferred to anyone.

Mr_Shiftright · October 2004

The car that will not die. I wish they let it RIP. It just looks worse and worse every time they pry it out of the grave.

stickguy · October 2004

theres a used car dealer near me (high-endish stuff) that seems to be a franchisee for Avanti. They have a few on the lot, coupes and converts. Certainly still looks like an Avanti, but it only takes one glance at the interior to know it's riding on a Vette chassis.

lemko · October 2004

...might've been forward looking in 1963 but looks pretty dated today. The side profile kind of reminds me a bit of an older Celica.

andre1969 · October 2004

they actually use Corvette chassis now? I heard that for awhile they were just using truncated Impala/Caprice platforms!

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

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