Audi A3

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

Looking forward to my C&D issue...will be fun reading. But geeze, C&D complains about vehicle weight in nearly every car they test. What did C&D expect Audi to do? Make the chassis out of Aluminum or Carbon Fiber to save weight(and blow cost through the roof)?

Another review (of 12 I read yesterday on A3) remarked how good in the Snow the A3 3.2 was. Would enjoy hearing how the A3's do in snow.

As for RAVE4, Toyota's no stranger to racing.

shipo · April 2006

What does Toyota's racing experience have to do with anything? The Rav4 is a mini SUV, high CG and all, and like or don't, even the V6 engined, 18" wheel/tire shod version will wallow like a stuck pig on a tight closed course race track.

Posting absurd comparisons between the A3 and the Rav4 (or any other SUV for that matter) regardless of how relatively sporting it might be is simply not what this discussion is for. If you really want to discuss such things, please create your own A3 vs. Rav4 discussion and post to your hearts content.

Best Regards,
Shipo

esf · April 2006

I just realized something. Mitsubishi seems to be getting into the copying game that the Japanese pioneered:

http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/il/features/future/- - - 08.audi.r8/08.audi.r8.f34.500.jpg

This is the Audi R8.

Here's the Mitsubishi Evo X (10) concept:

http://www.autoweek.nl/images/800/13404.jpg

Notice how both the R8 and Evo X concept feature Audi's signature grille* and stepped headlights. Mitsubishi even added the subtle sliver-grilles under the prominent single-frame, which most A4 models have.

*Mitsubishi's iteration of the D'Silva (Audi's designer) grille is wider and lower-swept.

bmx43 · April 2006

i guess i will see. i just bought a 3.2 from a dealer in NorCal and am having it trucked down to SoCal where i live. will be here on tuesday. the dealers in the north have 10-12 of the 3.2s on the lot and are willing to deal. in socal, they have 1 or 2 and are reluctant to even discount $500. i got $2600 off sticker from the dealer i bought from.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

Other posters bring other cars in here for comparison, but at this point I won't - found a good parallel topic discussing hatch comparisons.

I got that 3.2 C&D review. They thought the 3.2 driving was top notch, but __really__ wanted summer tires and complained about its weight. Their 3.2's performance measurements also showed little improvement over the 2.0 T.
Their final word was to stick with the 2.0 T.

Has a mag/site tested 3.2 with summer rubber like Goodyear F1 or Potenzias?

imagine168 · April 2006

I just brought my A3 3.2 fully loaded from NorCal which was shipped from SoCal. My price was $500 over invoice. If you use Costco or AAA purchase, it's $700 over invoice. Also, 3.2 are not as hot as 2.0 just because most A3 buyer are expecting to walk out paying around $28k for an A3. 3.2 is $5k more then the base model. You need to remember that west coast Audis are shipped to SD and truck to there respected dealerships. If your dealer is friendly, they can do a search on up coming (in-transit) vehicles that are not taken. Then request it to ship to your dealership and you will have the car you want. If the car you want is not available, they can order to your liking. That's if you don't mind waiting 90 days.

shipo · April 2006

"You need to remember that west coast Audis are shipped to SD and truck..."

Gee, I don't remember there being an ocean terminal anywhere in South Dakota, maybe it's hiding in the Badlands or maybe over on the Pine Ridge reservation. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

imagine168 · April 2006

Shipo,

Well, I did not know South Datota was in west coast? But I guess it's my fault not to be clear what SD stands for (San Diego) in California.

-Thanks

wale_bate1 · April 2006

Shipo's thinking post-earthquake, of course, when Rapid City becomes beach-front property on the Pacific.

It's one of his "faults".

Tee hee.

shipo · April 2006

Given that I'm a former resident of San Diego (and MCRD-San Diego as well), I was just messing with you. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

shipo · April 2006

I'm kind of hoping I could buy my sun screen for the beach at Wall Drug. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

San Diego CA has a ton of freeways and some nice roads for driving pleasure. Unfortunately the 5 has become a parking lot every weekend between San Diego and LA.

Meanwhile, if one wants true A3 driving thrills up here, take Route 23 from the Ocean up to Piru.

imagine168 · April 2006

They should but a warning message informing user during break-in period user should not run DSG in sports mode. This thing revs your engine to 4500rpm - 5500rpm pending on how heavy you foot is. And it does this down shifting till the car stops. It feels good and 'YES' it does give you the feeling of a sports car. But your engines revs all over the place as you're driving a stick but hard.
Just my 2cent.

tslbmw · April 2006

I have to agree...I think the "sport" setting is redundant anyway. I'm either gonna be lazy and leave it in "D" or I'm gonna use the paddles and rev & change at my disgrestion.

esf · April 2006

That's the whole reason 'S' mode is there- to be redundant.

Does it not make it all the more fun if you're in sport mode and use Tiptronic?

That's what I do, and the car drags its [non-permissible content removed] out and goes full speed ahead on turns (I have FronTrak, not a 3.2)

:shades:

blueguydotcom · April 2006

Okey dokey.

Anyway, I just drove from Munich through Austria, Switzerland, Italy and into France yesterday (southern France) and the A3 is everywhere. The car's freaking ubiquitous in Europe. With the tiny roads in the cities and the super tight parking I can see why the A3s got a following over here.

I'm beginning to appreciate our modern cities more and more.

Oh and driving through the backroads of Switzerland in my e90 was A-okay.

wco81 · April 2006

Hitting the cybercafes, are you?

Sounds like you're doing a grand tour rather than pickup and drop off.

esf · April 2006

I'm glad that the A3 is doing so well in Europe...

But if only it would take off in America! I've seen about six!

blueguydotcom · April 2006

Not the grand tour, just spending my time doing what I love most: driving on twisty roads at speeds that would make my dad's hair turn white.

Today, from Nice, I'm driving down the coast a bit more to Cannes and Marseille. Looking forward to the drive.

You guys should see how many S3s are out here! My god, it's like THE car for younger folks. Lots of VWs too. I can see how VW has such a following out here - small size, good packaging, nice power.

la4mead · April 2006

We need some road trip photos, OK?

Cars, roads, people, countryside... It sounds really cool!

shipo · April 2006

I read a report last night written by an individual who works for an Audi store that claims that AoA has informed his store that the A3 2.0T (both 6MT and DSG) will be available with AWD for the 2007 model year. In addition, the S3 2.0T (with two turbochargers putting out > 300HP) will debut in North America during the 2007 model year as well.

Is this really going to come to pass? I have no idea, however, the individual who wrote the report is usually reliable when it comes to this type of information.

Best Regards,
Shipo

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

Fingers x'ed Audi USA will offer a better selection of A3's!

blueguydotcom · April 2006

AWD, 300 hp...That'd be some little car!

la4mead, can't help much on the picture front - I'm a really bad tourist. my girlfriend keeps bugging me for pics so I sent her one I shot up my nose. she was not amused. do you want that pic? I spent 3 weeks in Paris last year and took maybe 25 pictures.

la4mead · April 2006

Audi is having a "Streets of Tomorrow" event I will attend next month. In addition to introducing the Q7, they promise to have engineers and product experts to meet and talk with. These are great questions I will ask.

la4mead · April 2006

That's a different kind of "pic"... She's right in checking up on you.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

If you visit the audi web site you can sign up for "The Streets of Tomorrow" near your area, assuming you have a drivers license.

dino001 · April 2006

No show in Tampa Bay

:mad:

shipo · April 2006

No show in Boston either. :-(

imagine168 · April 2006

I have a question regarding standard features that are listed on audiusa website but missing in the car. On Audiusa site, there is a feature call "alarm with tilt sensor" listed as standard feature for the A3 vehicles. This feature have been removed on all post 06 build vehicles. Is there anyone else aware of this? I've had an A4 and TT and found this feature great. Now, after taken delivery of my A3. I've notice the button to disable tilt sensor was not where the manual have indicated. I've pointed out this issue to my service and sale manager and they were surprised of this. I then called Audi customer relation and after a week of what they called research on this issue. They called and told me that Audi reserve the rights to make changes to there vehicles to improve the quality of there cars, bla, bla, bla... So, now all A3 do not come with alarm and tilt sensor as listed on there current website. I understand this feature is not so big of a deal but what are the rights for the customers? When customers expected something as standard feature then later finds out that it's not installed.
I've been driving Audis most of my life and this little thing is going to make me buy other brand.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

..is many auto websites are not kept properly updated, and are lagging wrt what their current vehicles offer.

Mfr websites are very good for getting generalities. But I guess the only way to be sure about what you get is, after getting general details from the site, to visit your friendly, __reputable__ dealer and discuss what's actually available in the car you can buy.

Would be interesting to learn why Audi discontinued the feature you wanted (cost? reliability? Nobody else wanted it?).

esf · April 2006

I understand this feature is not so big of a deal...

And then you say:

I've been driving Audis most of my life and this little thing is going to make me buy other brand.

That's a bit dramatic! By the way, it seems as if you downgraded; TT to A3? I love my A3, but after a $40,000+ coupe/roadster I wouldn't go to a $30,000 hatch. Mine is a "spare". I have an S4 Cabriolet as I have told almost everyone here (haha not to brag), and the A3 is a nifty little car. I use it all the time in the winter, and my son and daughter do when they come home from college/law school.

I don't think a missing tilt-sensor would turn me off so completely that I'd stop buying from the company I've trusted for 7 years, let alone my whole life. Audis are quality products, and much better in the bang-for-your-buck department than BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

When I was looking for my A3, I also looked to my local BMW dealer to check out a used 325xi, or 330xi. I talked to a young man, he said he would get a salesman, and I waited tweny minutes while my son was boring himself silly sitting in an X5. Eventually, when they didn't come back, I left. They were all laughing and having a good time (holiday season); no one seemed to notice. I'm treated like a king at my Audi dealer.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

commented recently on how much Audi remains in BMW's shadow, and what it's doing to get out of it (includes new edgier models, overhauling dealerships, etc). They commented Audi quality has improved as well.

The Audi '07 Ride and Drive experience harks back to GM's AUTOSHOW IN MOTION, the latter proving a great way to drive a whole bunch of cars in a short time.

esf · April 2006

There's only one thing I don't want Audi to do...

...stoop low enough to start producing niche cars (CLS, R-Class, X7 rumor, etc).

Otherwise, the new models from 2007-2010:
Q7, RS4, S6, S8, R8 sports car, A4, A6 refresh, S4, A5, Q5, A3

Really looks like they're ready to kick some BMW butt!

dl7265 · April 2006

GGgrrr Im so tired of waiting for tease's for good stuff comming from Audi/VW.... :mad:

DL

esf · April 2006

I know and Audi is even slower than Volkswagen to announce new models! (Let alone bring them to market)

The RS6 should've come this year, not next year! The A6 model line should be one year behind the 5 Series's- it came out a year later. Of course, Audi always has to perfect their cars in every possible way.

The RS6 should rock the midsize ultra sedan world! A rumored 550+hp FSI V10, part-alluminum spaceframe, gorgeous bodykit and possible 20" rims. Of course, 19s will most likely be standard.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

..liked it, but felt it didn't offer enough performance for the extra bucks, and suggested getting the 2.0 T instead.
C&D said the same. Both bitched about the A3 weight (as they did about the new GTI weight).

Sheeeeesh..... The extra #'s one reason Audi's do so well in crash tests (strong body!)!

blueguydotcom · April 2006

The weight of the car has little to do with the vehicle's ability to survive a crash. Weight = safety is 1950's engineering. A Ferrari Enzo weighs under 3000 lbs and I'd rather be in one of those in a crash than an Audi A3.

spektre · April 2006

Agreed - look at the Smart crash results.

dino001 · April 2006

All true provided you're not just run over by a distracted soccer mom in a Ford Excursion.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

Weight is a factor with car safety - many studies prove that in accidents heavier cars come out ahead. Fortunately, Audi and a few other makers put the weight to good use with beefed up structures for safety and a solid feel.

And Isn't it also true that Audi is one of the few mfrs that use continuous seam welding rather than spot welding.

blueguydotcom · April 2006

Weight is the enemy of fun. Fat cars - like the audi S4 cab for instance - are too heavy to be really fun.

A good structure needn't be heavy to be sound. Again, you're confusing 1950's myths and engineering with the facts of today. You can make far more structurally sound and fun cars with lighter polymers/aluminum/etc than old school metals.

dino001 · April 2006

I would say that extra 100 pounds is not likely make you safer, but extra 3000 may, at least during certain types of accidents. It may or may not mean greater overall safety of large vehicles, though, as there are other important safety factors, ofter simply ignored by public, such as much greater accident avoidance ability due to much better handling (active safety) and better crashworthiness performance in other types of crashes (e.g. rollover).

If I had to pick safest types of cars overall, it would be:
1. midsize and full-size sedans/wagons (best balance of "active" and "passive" safety, longest record of applications, best recognized in safety R&D),
2. car-based SUV crossovers (a bit worse rideability but offset by weight and sitting position allowing for better road view; also relatively new to the market, which may result in safety aspects that we are yet to discover - one thing comes in mind is structural rigidity, as those vehicles are developed from smaller vehicle platforms, which may adversely impact their structural performance),
3. exotic sports cars (I have yet to hear about a elebrity killed in their Porsche, even though there were plenty of accidents reported),
4. Truck-based SUVs and minivans (terrible driving but better road view and more mass help in head-ons, awful in rollovers),
5. Small econo-cars (not so many safety features on board)
6. The award for worst vehicles on the road goes to pickup trucks, especially those "compact" ones, for awkward driving characteristics and often subpar safety equipment.

This is not adjusted for driver's personality, which may drastically reduce certain car safety - insurance guys hate sports cars, as they see them being driven by risk-prone people, thus they are deemed "unsafe" regardless of their actual safety performance (laws of physics cannot be overcome at 120 mph regardless of any ABS, ESP, VSC, SC, CIA or FBI installed).

esf · April 2006

Fat cars - like the audi S4 cab for instance - are too heavy to be really fun.

You couldn't have offended me more if you tried. I happen to have an S4 Cabriolet- and you don't seem to know the definition of "fun".

The car's my baby, and it blows away about 95% of the others on the street. I love it- it has beauty, luxury, smooth performance, acceleration- all in one trouble-free package. It's a luxo sports car without the drama, or the price tag stigma (CLK55!).

Could you please make sure no one in here has an S4 Cabriolet before you put it down? The car is too much fun. It's addictive!

dl7265 · April 2006

james Dean??

dl7265 · April 2006

Ha, I don't think he meant that personal. Don't be offended. It is a bit of a porker. Funnier story when my friends and I many many moon's ago were going off to college, I had made a comment about how retarded is a mascot called a horned frog ? Little did I know one of the Guy's had signed with TCU .. ooops

DL

dino001 · April 2006

James Dean, indeed. But that was way before car safety was even a concept.

esf · April 2006

Thanks- funny story!

I'd still like to hear from him, though...

That hurt!

Saw a black S4 Cab with amazing 19" rims the other day... and the next day, I saw another black one with BBS wheels! Makes me want to get aftermarket rims, but the standard Avus wheels are beautiful.

kurtamaxxxguy · April 2006

Put big rims on a car and unless they are forged alloy you're adding unsprung weight to every wheel - the spoiler for that bumpy washboard road you want your wheels to stick fast to!

I wonder how much light weight alloy Audi uses in their mainstream models' frames and body structures?

Anyway, May 7 is when the Audi show rolls into town and I'm looking forward to driving some Audis w/o the dealer hassle.

blueguydotcom · April 2006

S4 cab is pretty and that v8 is nice but like the M3 cab (even the cooper convertible is pudgy vis-a-vis the normal car) it's seriously overweight.

Nearly 4100 lbs in a sporting car is too much for my tastes. Sorry if I offended. Drop the weight by 1000 lbs and I wouldn't be saying it.

dhamilton · April 2006

The S4 is flat out fun. You can sort of make the argument of overweight, but that's gonna come out in almost every car with the exception of exotics. [and even them sometimes] I'm not a convertible guy at all but speaking to the sedan it's a freaking blast. Most advanced cars are being made out of hi-tech low weight materials but the safety and luxury options put the weight back on. Name a car in the same class as the S4 that doesn't have this weight problem you speak of.
If you want something 1000 lbs lighter with the same power you are looking in a completely different category. Lotus perhaps [not even sure about that] but try a roadie in that thing and you'll be praying for the S4. Ridiculous :confuse:

Audi A3

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