Appointment for a test drive set for next Wednesday at 6PM -- will be able to drive both the 2.0T and the 3.2. At this point, our interest for our first of two new cars (to replace my wife's TT coupe) is the 2.0T with all options and 6speed manual. We can order the car in April or May and "possibly" get in the queue for an '06 (so I guess that means S-Line instead of "sport package").
The sound of the slamming of the bits of hardware struck me first -- the hood, the trunk the front and back doors, even the glove box -- this is a major move up the silky smooth and authoritative thud meter, for the hinged pieces when they were closed were virtually silent, it was more that you felt the door close rather than hear it.
I don't know the "form and substance" of quality from an objective perspective -- perhaps no one does -- but, to me, the build/fit-finish of this new A4 was equivalent to the A8L and the new A6 -- there was nothing about the vehicle that seemed "entry level" (until the A3 comes along the A4 remains entry level).
The seats -- sport seats -- were perfect, and with the driver's seat situated for my driving pleasure, I could get into the back seat and my knees did NOT touch the back of the front seat (I am exactly 6 feet tall.) The interior, even in black, seemed somewhat larger than our last A4 loaner (a 2004 1.8T avant) when one of our cars was in for service.
Furthermore, as nice as the current A4 1.8T quattro is, the doors sound just an tiny bit tinny when slammed -- not so this new A4.
Since we did not drive it, these stationary impressions will have to do.
I liked this interior better than the top o the line Chrysler 300C AWD that I was able to sit in.
Still on my wife's short list: new A4, new G35x (Infiniti) and so new it isn't here yet BMW 325xi.
Still on my short list: Audi A4 or A6 (if the lease price doesn't strain my credulity), Chrysler 300C AWD, Acura RL and Infiniti M35x. The Acura, that I have at least sat in (passenger, back seat and behind the wheel) is fading when placed against the Infiniti M35x (that I have driven, at least). All things being even close to parity and with a level lease playing field, Audi is still the fave -- but the value proposition for those of us who "believe in leasing" still looms as one Audi negative; as does the A6 3.2's somewhat lackluster low end grunt (IMHO, the 3.2 should equal or beat the outgoing A6 2.7T S-Line and it doesn't even come close).
The number of cylinders is not necessarily an issue with me either, as the new 2.0T is probably the better of many manufacturer's 6 cylinder offerings -- and probably even the better of some guys V8's.
I don't get it, if the dealers have the new a4, why is there not a peep on the audi website. furthermore, there's been no ads and no publicity that it's been displayed in detroit, chicago, or geneva. how bizarre.
Perhaps they are hoping to sell their entire current stock before they go on a sales blitz to sell next year's model? Maybe they figured that if they publicized it on a large-scale, as they are doing with the 2005 A6, the 2005 A4's on the lots now will never get any attention, or the dealers (and by extension AOA) will not make as much money from them if they just kept it quiet. Or it could be they are still trying to focus everyone's attention on the new A6.
In the market for a 2005.5 A4 in manual transmission. Actually took the 2005.5 2.0T automatic trans. out for a test drive today because it was the only one my dealer had setup -they hadn't gotten around to setting up the 2.0T manual yet. Nice ride, tight turns, good acceleration but still a 4 cylinder. I currently have an A4 2.8 manual, and I don't think going from a 6 cylinder to a 4 cylinder is going to cut it. Nonetheless, I'm gonna test drive the 2.0T manual next week.
However, here's the big question: My dealer tells me the A4 3.2 is not available in manual, only tiptronic. He gave me a brochure for the new A4 and within the Specifications pages for A4 (and even A4 Avant), listed under 3.2 are all the transmission options. Under six speed manual, it says "n/a."
Yet, I thought I've read people post on this message board that the 3.2 would be offered in manual.
If my dealer says no and the brochure says no, yet some people think yes, can anyone tell me definitively who's right?
I think the 3.2 will eventually be offered in manual (late fall 05/ early 06?), maybe perhaps when the s line is available but currently the first release of the B7s the 3.2 will only be available in auto.
I believe Giovanni1 is right. I am also getting a 2.0 manual because the 3.2 available this spring comes only with an auto. It's not yet sure if down the road, the '06 will have a 3.2 manual, although the S (available early 2006) would most likely offer one. But then, it's for a lot more money than the non-S. Considering the fact that I need a replacement for my '02 2.7T now, I believe the 2.0T with a 6-speed stick would do nicely, thank you very much. Enjoy the ride. Mario
The speculation is a manual would be available for the 2006 version which comes out in the summer of this year. Not the 2005.5 version which is coming out now. In addition, they will over the S-Line and other Nav packages etc. that is not offered now.
I am waiting for the 2006 version to compare to the 2006 BMW 330i.
Same here, I'm waiting for the new 330 as well as the new Benz c350 to compare as possible replacements for my TT when the lease is up in Nov.
My BMW dealer told me that the sport package (w/SMG) for the new 3 won't be available until late fall. Although I've been a loyal Audi customer for years I am really leaning towards the 3 as I like the idea of the voice control (ala the TL) and the keyless access.
However I may just bite the bullet and get the B7 S4 but who knows. All in all though there are some really great choices out there that make the decision process even tougher.
I'm also waiting for the new BMW 3 series myself, but not as a replacement car. I'm getting the A4 2.0T stick in April and when the 330xi comes in the Fall, I'll get that too for my wife. She will only drive a stick.
This way, I'll have a chance to see for myself which one I'll like better as they are both 4WD, stick and about the same size engine and car. This will be my 4th Audi and my first bimmer, so I am a bit partial to Audi. Enjoy!
The A4 3.2 will be offered in a manual. All the buzz sites claim it is certain NOT to be in the 2005.5 model "year." One can only assume this will mean sometime during the 2006 model run.
With only the "certainty" that lots of speculation, rumors and some facts can produce: the 6speed manual will be offered conicidentally with the availability of the S-Line.
We are a dying breed -- those of us who want manuals -- just ask the dealers what gets sold. Ask the dealers to tell you who votes for what with their dollars -- all the "woulda, coulda, shoulda, oughta" stuff that is written here there and everywhere, would lead me to believe that a significant minority of buyers would opt for the manual "if only twer available." This impression must be because the money comes from folks who don't, won't or can't participate in these forums -- we are a statistical anomoly. We are flapping our gums, so to speak, for our own entertainment.
Even if that is true, I, for one, don't care -- participating in these forums IS ENTERTAINING and informative -- which, I believe, despite our statistical insignificance (if that really is true) makes us more powerful consumers, and therefore more influential, or at the very least, potentially so.
The fact is, cars and almost everyting about cars is -- even for the buyer of "just transportation" -- at least a minor cause for strong opinions and passion.
The main problem as I see it is: despite the proliferation of car models available to purchase at almost every price point (not just the ones in the stratosphere), we just don't yet have mass customization -- promised for years, partially realized, but far from the "promises" made by marketing types.
I just spent the weekend, 600 miles worth, driving a 2005 Cadillac CTS (enterprise rental, three days, unlimited milage, $100) -- I really like this car (and it was an absolute "strippie" in terms of features -- only the driver's seat was power operated in fact). Yet, as I drove along roundtrip from Pittsburgh to Cincinnati thinking, "I'd be mostly happy with this car, but I wouldn't buy one, unless it came in AWD." But to get a CTS in AWD, you pretty much have to jump the price from $36+K to $53+K (assuming you stay with the 6 cylinder and will accept it as an SRX, no longer a CTS). It seems to me that a CTS, as I drove, with a $1900 AWD option, bigger wheels and tires, sat nav, heated seats and both front seats power actuated, for around $41+K would be a strong alternative to an Audi A6, Acura RL and the Infiniti M35x.
But, you can't buy the CTS, nowaynohow with AWD. It seems like this car, with its European-inspired handling, features, feel, power, etc, would be competition for the ever growing crowd of people who want the advatages of AWD, don't really need or want a or another SUV, want a sedan and want one that handles well. This RWD Caddy with AWD @ $1900 would price out close to a new A4 2.0T Quattro -- and, for some folks (perhaps including my wife and me) increase our options and probably overall improve the breed (of cars).
So, full circle, sure there will be a 3.2 Audi A4 with a manual transmission, but you will most likely have to order one to get it the way you want it (customized to YOU, that is)!
Caddy says $1900 for AWD. Oh, yes, but only if you buy $11,000 worth of packaged stuff.
This may be what I want -- but I have no choice.
With Audi, oddly, quattro can be had on the whole line (practically) without buying everything.
Chrysler's 300C (on my list) should be a viable alternative.
The CTS screams to be offered in AWD. Seems they have already done it with the SRX. Why limit this option to the SUV/crossover?
Audi, despite the competition, can truly be said to have been visionary.
Funny thing, the first US broad appeal Audi, the 1984 4000S with quattro was really never marketed as an AWD car -- indeed Audi let Subaru be the company that has become equated with AWD.
I agree. I also think Audi was not smart enough to use the AWD feature as a major selling point, as Subaru had done. It may true that AWD is best suited in states where snow is a frequent occurence, but it also rains everywhere, and in inclement weather, an AWD car handles much better than a FWD or RWD. Anyway, ...
I am more amused by the fact that in commercials for cars which have models with manual, they always show the driver shifting gears in a manual and revving their engines like race car drivers would. And in print ads for those cars, they almost always show a model with a stick shift. Then, the consumer buys an auto. Duh!!
About the Subaru, I seriously considered a WRX as a replacement for my '02 A6, because it offered AWD, a blown engine, sports package, and a 6-speed stick. What turned me off though was the styling and the cost. I thought they were asking too much money for a smallish, homely car. Not much style, panache or flair there, IMO. If I'm paying nearly 40K for a car, it had better look (both inside and out) like it's worth it. The same thing goes for the AWD Passat, and the stick shifter goes up to 5-speed only. The redesigned 06' Passat which looks better will have a 6-speed manual, but won't be available until late Fall and won't initially have AWD.
I also looked at Volvo's S40 2.5T but when similarly equipped, the price is about the same as, if not more than, the new Audi. Every little thing in the Volvo costs extra, unlike the Audi which comes with a lot of standard features that you pay for elsewhere. And the exterior design is a bit dated and worn, apparently being just an afterthought on the part of Volvo to capture Audi's market. The interior is something else, though, but not enough for me to bite.
Oh, well.
I love these discussions. I feel like I have so many friends from all over who share some of my opinions, and we can have a chat about cars, and we may sometimes disagree, but we all learn something. Cheers to all.
I was told by AOA that the web roll out will be 2/28. They claim that they thought that the new models were to be arriving late March but are now arriving at the dealerships. So much for good launch planning. There is more information about the A3 which won't be out until spring.
All retail: 2005.5 A4 2.0T Avant 6-speed manual quattro $30,450 6-speed Auto. Tip. quattro $31,650
Paint/pearl effect 450 PAW cold weather pak 750 PPS Sport pak 750 PPT Sport Pak all-season 750 WPX Premium pak 2100 PX3 Lighting Pak 1425 PSR audio pak (sirius) 1000 PXM audio pak (XM) 1000 PND Nav. plus 1950 PRV 17" alloy wheels 500 7K7 tire monitoring 250 4x4 side rearbags 350 8X1 headlight washers 150 3Y4 M. side shades 150 5MG Dark walnut wood 400 7TC vavona wood 400 AWB wheel locks 85
Dest. Charge 720
2005.5 A4 3.2 Avant 6-spd Automatic Tip quattro $36,400
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I have just one question? Does everybody think that every AWD system is the same and they are all just as effective as one another. Last time I knew quattro was the first AWD on the market and the leader. They only AWD system to be banned from the rallies car seris. So remember that when you are considering cost of cars.
For those of you who have lusted after the S4 V8, the 05.5 w/ the 3.2 V6 will really surprise you. While it's not an S4, the V6 has 255hp and it's really a thrilling ride. The V8 is obviuosly faster, but it's heavier as well.
The 05.5's have suspension upgrades as share some parts from the S4. The 3.2 gives you a 10-12k cheaper alternantive to the V8 w/ about 85-90% of the performance
You'll have to live with the tippy for now, but manual 3.2's are expected in the fall.
I'm getting a new A4 2005.5 this week - lease is up on a 2001.5 Passat GLX/6sp and I couldn't wait for the new Passats. Specs = 2.0ltr, 6 speed, Quattro. Quartz Grey with Platinum leather interior. Cold weather package, Premium package, Audio/Bose/XM package, Lighting package, 17" alloys, headlight washers. I have the numbers sheet on this vehicle. Here goes: invoice MSRP Base car = 27,344 29,450 paint = 410 450 premium pack= 1,911 2,100 audio pack = 910 1,000 cold pack = 683 750 Light pack = 1,297 1,425 wheels = 455 500 headlight wash = 137 150 destination 720 720 emission 150 150 local DAA 200 000 prep/inspec 195 000 34,402 36,695 Other A4 2.0T sedan models: Front Drive 6 spd = 27,350 MSRP Front Drive CVT = 28,550 " Quattro 6sp Tip = 30,650 " figure the same markup over invoice on all base models and options are the same for all A4s 2.0 in US no matter.
Where did you get the price from? I posted above and this is from the dealer? Is the price you posted an avant?
Falcon
I will past it here to compaire
All retail: 2005.5 A4 2.0T Avant 6-speed manual quattro $30,450 6-speed Auto. Tip. quattro $31,650
Paint/pearl effect 450 PAW cold weather pak 750 PPS Sport pak 750 PPT Sport Pak all-season 750 WPX Premium pak 2100 PX3 Lighting Pak 1425 PSR audio pak (sirius) 1000 PXM audio pak (XM) 1000 PND Nav. plus 1950 PRV 17" alloy wheels 500 7K7 tire monitoring 250 4x4 side rearbags 350 8X1 headlight washers 150 3Y4 M. side shades 150 5MG Dark walnut wood 400 7TC vavona wood 400 AWB wheel locks 85
Dest. Charge 720
2005.5 A4 3.2 Avant 6-spd Automatic Tip quattro $36,400
I have no idea what "everybody" thinks about AWD systems. quattro, until recently a Torsen system is perhaps the best (I think it is). Yet, Audi is putting the quattro label on any car they bring to market with AWD -- even if it is NOT Torsen. The TT, for one, is a Haldex system. The VW's that have been Torsen were NOT called quattro, of course, but I am certain there will be plenty of folks who might take exception to our proclamation of quattro as the king or Torsen as the king of AWD systems.
Indeed, I have been in countless arguments attempting to substantiate and defend Audi's leadership in this area. Yet, many with equal eloquence (some better even) are able to argue convincingly that Audi is a "poser" in that its AWD systems are NOT RWD biased.
Now before you think I am one of these Audi apologists, I remain convinced that Audi's system is equal to the best and better than most.
Yet, Audi is just now attempting to better balance its cars -- by moving the engines back somewhat, putting the battery in the trunk in some cars (or under the back seat), etc.
Audi HAS -- and that is past tense -- led in so many areas. But they have done little to foster their market's perception of leadership in AWD systems (for pity's sake, Subaru is the synonym to AWD car). In the late 80's the Ford Taurus had the temerity to claim the style of their car was "the innovator (heck they probably claimed inventor)" of the aerodynamic body style (the Taurus was a Ford take on the then low CD leader, the Audi 5000.)
Audi has done an awful job of blowing their own horn, now "everyone" wants an AWD vehicle -- Audi has had them forever, yet does not have a real SUV -- and even the two RWD stalwarts, BMW and Mercedes have them for Pete's sake!
Audi sometimes is so exasperating -- they create these marvelous cars and have been the leader in AWD -- heck they have been the virtual pioneer in the area. Yet my ex-yuppie friends do NOT think of Audi as "the AWD" sports sedan company.
They pant heavily when there are whispers of a new BMW with AWD, or when Infiniti comes out with "intelligent" AWD or Acura -- Acura!!! -- comes out with SH-AWD (which is still FWD biased). And don't get me started on Volvo -- read the product brochures from Volvo -- the S60 Type R -- THE HOT ROD VOLVO is 95% a FWD car, they don't even try to obfuscate this.
Oh sorry, I just get so ticked that Audi seems to have a death wish, or if not a DEATH wish at least a "bruise me" wish -- what a company!
Hey all just getting into an 05 SE A4 by weeks end. First time in this forum and it looks very active.
As far as the intro of the 2005.5 A4, it was set for the stated 2/28 which coincides with the last day of the 05 SE program. The problem, Audi has is that the Special Edition program was a huge success, and they cleared most of the remaining inventory, thus burning threw their safety stock/days supply for dealers. They shipped the 05.5 to allow the dealers to present this ahead of schedule to potential customers. As in all companies marketing, manufacturing and logistics are often times not in synch. They have to build up days supply in order to properly market and sell the unit.
The new-body A4 was in the showroom and I had the chance to get inside although one was not set up to test drive. Astectics are always subjective although I enjoy when cars evolve as opposed to a total redesign (Shows they had it right the first time) while many improvements abound, the interior has a more luxury oriented feel as opposed to the understated sportiness of the 05. The 2.0T is priced about 1.5k-2k more then the 1.8T loaded per the SE. She raved about the "rear heated" seats. Hey I'm driving I could care less about burning the bottoms of my back seat drivers!!! The manager I spoke with raved about the 2.0T. How the ride was more powerful and responsive (they all say that).
As far as pricing to compare, the dealer actually complained that similar to the intro of the new A6 leasing wasn't a good option at the time of intro for the 05.5 A4. And they would have problems convincing people to lease under the current terms provided by Audi/VW finance. Granted the dealer will not discount the new car at this time (none do on new models simple supply/demand). A lease with only inception fees would run mid-$500s. This from a dealer who sold me a car around 500 over invoice well below what I was quoted in my area (I spoke/email/went to five different dealers)
How do you have cars on the ground and sold for a week and theres not even a mention of he new A4. How embarassing.But, there is slight info about a A3 thats not out yet. BMW is having month to month teasing information for about 6 months before the new 3er is released. Get a clue.
It's not embarassing. It's what makes sense for Audi right now. Dealers still have 05's on the lot and you don't want to have a huge push the 05.5's until you clear the others off the lot.
Hello there, im very interested in the new 2005.5 Audi A4..and i was wondering if someone can help me out and tell me the invoice price in the that i want...this is exactly what i want
so if anyone really knows about this car and tell me what the msrp will be with these options and also what the invoice price is... thankyou and i really appreciate it
well there you are wrong. It says 4wd not all awd. There is a huge difference. I have a 2004 pick up with 4wd I dont tell my friends I have awd pick up.
Well.... there's not even a spot for "future vehicles" on their web site. If they have to work that hard to "dump" about 5 remaining A4's on a un suspecting sole shame on them. BMW dealers still have hundreds of E46 on hand ,but don't mind unveiling the E90.They have a good product but allways seem to have some marketing issues..IE the current disccusion about "Quattro".
Why must everything be a marketing blitz? People aren't stupid and there are plenty of places to look @ future vehicles.
The 05.5 is a low key mid-year replacement. Go to your local dealer. The new body style cars still have 2005 on the window sticker. So Audi has (2) totally different 2005 A4's on the lot right now.
Maybe you can criticize Audi for not making these cars 2006's instead of 2005's so people will know the difference. But it's hard to do a marketing Blitz on 2 different cars that are both 2005 models.
For those that have seen the new body style IN PERSON, what are your thoughts? I haven't had a chance to get to the dealer to see them for myself but haven't exactly been crazy about the pictures. Just curious as to what everyone else thought.
Why so down on Audi for a two week delay in promotion of the 05.5 A4???
Kinda has me puzzled. Like I said in an earlier post it's in line with days supply, not what each independent dealer has on their lot. Audi is shipping and making sure all the dealers are set up before th official launch. Actually makes better sense then going all out and not having enough 05.5s or having dealership personell not being familiar enough with the car due to shortages.
When I was at the dealership just yesterday their was a buzz in the showroom. Their actually were people getting in and out of the car. Almost reminded me of the NY Auto Show. My father who knows very little about cars was sitting along side one and commented on it before any other model.
As far as my thoughts about seeing it in person. Looks are subjective and often times harder to explain how it affects an individuals senses but here goes. I like you did, not like what i saw from the pics on the web. It's more of an evolution IMHO. For some aspects of styling I prefer the version its replacing. The interior is more luxurious as opposed to being sporty. I did not like the "new" front grille or the rear (civic like) from the pics I've seen. In person it's pleasing to the eye. It's a slightly larger car, Audi is pushing a little more up market to separate it from the upcoming A3.
Most people who post on these forums such as Edmunds are aware and the serious 05.5 buyer will have already contacted the dealership via email, set up a test drive and talked pricing.
As far as MSRP/Invoice, just in my own experience up in the North East. I don't believe they will be discounting at all for at least the first few months.
...this weekend.. The exterior looks very nice. Grille does not seem as large. Dolphin Grey is the best color. Interior, black leather looks very nice. Didn't want to sit in the car cause I woulda wanted to buy it on the spot. Color Display is cool as well. Heard from 2 dealers...PA and NC that the lease pricing will start at $369/mo...yes, got that exact number from both without hinting to the other dealer.. The car looks very nice though.. Couldn't imagine getting an 05 model at this point...
". The 3.2 gives you a 10-12k cheaper alternantive to the V8 w/ about 85-90% of the performance " - rjlaero
I drove an A4 3.2 (6-speed Tip., obviously) at lunch today.
I drove an S4 in December. Also a 6-speed Tip.
And I drove the A6 4.2 V8 “demo” when it first arrived, last fall.
The brochure for the new A4 claims 6.6 sec. to 100 KM/HR ( = approx. 62 mph).
My current vehicle’s (2003 Lincoln LS V8) published numbers for 0 – 60 are almost identical to the A4 3.2.
My impression is that the new A4 does provide some (potentially) significant upgrades in several areas, and additional availability of NAV, etc., but the acceleration does not nearly feel as strong as the S4. I do find it very easy to believe that the 3.2 is a real step up over both the 3.0 and the 2.8 V6s.
Audi claims 6.0 sec. for the A6 4.2, but C+D (the only published test I am aware of) reported: 6.3 / SS Quarter in 14.8 at 97.
I am looking (this time around) for a significant incremental increase in acceleration over what I am used to.
The 2005 S4 specs on audiusa.com claim 5.6 sec. for 0 – 60 w/Tip.
I can easily believe that difference between the A4 3.2 and the S4. And the 3.2 also lacks the sort of addictive torque that I enjoy in the lower RPM ranges, where I spend a substantial (too substantial, due to Atlanta area traffic) amount of my driving time. The V6 still seems to be working harder (clearly just my perception) all the time, to maintain any pace. The V8 seems almost to loafing – except at WOT.
And the V8 sounds soooo sweet.
So – although admittedly heavier, I’m going to wait a while and see if my dealer is motivated as new A4-s arrive to “move” the S4-s remaining on their lot.
Just my taste.
(Lusting.) - Ray Admitted acceleration junkie . . .
As you can see by my handle I am fan of VW. I have worked for VW for 5 years and just made the change to AUDI sales. LOTS to learn! We just recieved the new A4, I am thrilled with the 2.0 and think that 3.2 is a great alternative to the S4. What I havent seen feedback on in this forum, is the Navigation Plus. That is an awesome awesome system, especially its ease to use and the fun factor of the MP3 memory stick capability.My experience is kind of biased because the only Navigation and Infotainment systems I have experience with is the antiquated systems VW uses in their Phaeton and Touareg. Also how does everyone like the new grill of the A4?
I have driven my new 2005.5 A4 2.O Turbo, about 500 miles in the last five days and have really liked the navigation system. Not only do the directions display on the monitor, but the next maneuver shows on the Driver Information Display. I didn't have to constantly glance over at the Navigation monitor, I just had to glance down. Pretty slick.
When you quote the $369 per month figure what other info is this based on? i.e. term, milage, Cap cost, cap cost reduction, and money factor. You can lease an A8 for $369 per month with the proper cap cost reduction applied.
I have stopped assuming, so I agree with you, we need details -- or we need a common shorthand.
Essentially, leases: NO money down; term 36, 39, 48 months, miles 12K or 15K and closed ended. Unless otherwise specified, we should share this info as a general course.
I remember not long ago an impossible lease for some 6 figure Euro lux barge -- $599 mo. Turns out the miles were 10K, the term was 48, and the "cap cost reduction" was a medium sized 5 figure number. Some deal huh?
Question..I was told by a different dealer these prices were correct, but they are inception prices... So, do you think the price will go down once the lease programs start in March. I suspect they will start once the 2005 A4 program is over on 2/28. What are your thoughts??
the prices I'm showing are for 4 door sedans not avants. That's why I labeled the post "more pricing" and I thought the itemization was pretty clear. I did not expect the list to appear so compressed - I spaced it out when I was writing it. The options pricing should be close as re. invoice and msrp regardless.
The new A4 lease program will likely follow the 2005 A6's lead; i.e. they will not come down to a reasonable payment for 3-4 months. For reasons that I do not fully understand, Audi finds it necessary to gouge people with very high finance rate (money factors > .002) on their newly released vehicles. I understand supply and demand, but most of the "buzz" from a new release takes place within the first few months. Why lose potential buyers? I guess they still want to unload the old model at that point.
I test drove the new A4 2.0T at the same Cary, NC dealership that was mentioned above. The salesman were handing out sheets with all the options and pricing information. The car I drove was fully loaded and stickered for (gulp...) 41 K! I currently own a 1.8 T, and I love the car. However, the cheapest car on the lot was 36K.
The car was very similar on the interior, but with some nice added touches compared to my 2000 A4. The salesman did try to say that it was a larger vehicle compared to the old model, but I heard from another dealer that the overall length has been increased only 1". The interior did not look any different in regard to size or rear seat room, which was non-existent. I loved it when he said the the rear seat room was increased, but it only looked small due to the larger seat pads! Classic.
I felt that the car on a whole was more familiar, inside and out, than different. The new engine has significantly more power, but the driving dynamics were thankfully unchanged. The 2.0, although powerful, is still as 4 cylinder, and there is significantly more engine noise than you'll find in most cars at this price range. Also, the normal Audi wind noise was evident.
In all, a very nice upgrade, but not a significant redesign. I can't imagine Audi capturing more market share with this car. A 4 cylinder engine for 35-40 K? The 1.8T was a zippy, fun, affordable car. Buyers in this price range tend to lean towards luxury WITH their performance. The A4 3.2 should do this, but were talking the same price range as a M35. Also, it starts to compete with the A6.
I was pleasantly suprised that the A4 was named as recommended by Consumer Reports. Certainly hats off to Audi.
Event #1: test drive of 2005.5 A4 2.0T with 17" wheels, standard suspension -- Premium, Lighting and Cold packages. MSRP $36,000+.
Event #2: test drive of 2005.5 A4 3.2 with sport suspension -- Premium, Lighting, Cold, Navi, Sat Radio, several other options: MSRP $44,000+.
Overall impressions -- improvement in every way over outgoing models.
The 2.0T feels darn close to the outgoing 3.0 V6. And, that should be enough, one would think, to force the US A4 line to be on "everyone's" short list for a big compact sporting sedan. Yet, add just a few more options (sport and sat nav leap to mind) and this 4 cylinder A4 tickles the underbelly of $40,000. Now, in a vacuum, this is a good thing -- driving the 2.0T one is impressed with its power and poise. Yet, those of us car mavens know this is but a 4 banger; and, as good as it is -- which is to say very good -- we also know that the BMW 3's (coming soon to a dealer near you) are both sixes, the Infiniti G35 is a six and (at this price range) the Cadillac CTS is a six and the upcoming Passat is likewise and even the Chrysler 300C's (same price range) have 50% more "cylinderage."
I comment so on this one feature because the automotive journalists and pundits seem keen to do likewise about the Acura RL's under hood "perception problem" of having but only a six cylinder motivator.
I loved the A4 2.0T with its crisp and smooth 6 speed manual transmission, its Servotronic steering and its tight as a drum chassis. Driving the two new A4's literally back to back and literally over the EXACT same route -- I can but implore you to not even consider the standard suspension (which, without the experience of the sport suspension seemed altogether very competent; but, with the 20-20 hindsight of having driven one with a sport set up, the standard system seemed no more comfortable and more than just a smidge less precise) because the sport suspension is THAT much better in every way, including ride quality.
I want to retest a 2.0T with a sport suspension. And, the primary reason? The automatic transmission in the 3.2 was "distracting." I finally settled in and started to get comfortable with "its decisions" when I flicked the lever into "S" mode, which, I am happy to report, ALMOST mimics exactly my shifting preferences when I took the same route with the manual. The six was more powerful -- but perhaps moreso in form than in substance (this car -- the 3.2 -- screams to be driven with a manual transmission; I imagine it would rival the B5 S4 would it be so available). The fact that BMW is bringing both its 3's (or better said, all four of its 3's) to market with manual transmissions, seems to indicate that the A4 3.2's launch is aimed at a less sporting - minded customer. More's the pity.
Now, to the navi-plus -- what a wonderful upgrade to the "avionics" of this personal aircraft. And, how cool is it to push the button and have the screen articulate out of the way to reveal the "secret slots" for chip insertion -- Instant Tang!
Fit and finish -- Audi has again outdone itself -- no matter what you think about Audi, love 'em or hate 'em and everything in between, can there be anyone left who does not recognize this is the one area where Audi keeps knocking them out of the park?
So, color us impressed -- very impressed. Value proposition? Based on our own observations, Audi has produced another potential winner and when compared with THE CURRENT CROP of cars in this price range (including the BMW and the Cadillac and Volvo and some other notable European makes) Audi is right up there near or at the top of the heap. Lingering doubts persist, however, from the school of "Perception Is Reality." Doubts? You bet. More cylinders are NOT NECESSARILY better, I know that, perhaps you know that. But at nearly $40,000 for the 2.0T jewel, it would seem that 4 cylinders may make some potential buyers long for a +2 under the hood (and for no good reason, other than "$10,000 a cylinder, in this class, just seems, somehow, perhaps, maybe, sorta, well -- a bit much"). Why? Well, when for similar money some American cars offer Hemi-V8's, premium Japanese cars offer 40% more powerful sixes and even the other Europeans offer (in the case of Volvo for instance) at least five cylinders; and that nagging little company just south (Munich) offers awfully sweet sounding sixes for pretty much the same money (and in either AWD or RWD).
This is a marketing, not a driving or engineering or quality issue. As the saying goes, "I wouldn't kick this 2.0T out of bed for eating crackers -- heck, I'd BRING the crackers to this little guy's pajama party." But the market can be ignorant and foolish sometimes. And, finally, the 2.0T with the 6 speed manual when compared with the automatic "transmissioned" 3.2, gives up very little in the performance arena making me wonder if the slight increase in urge that the 3.2 affords is actually worth some $5,000 over its little sibling.
Putting the super slick 6 speed manual in the 3.2 would cure several potential problems, if you ask me.
But no one ever does (ask me).
The Infiniti G35x fully optioned is thousands less and has 280HP and has an aggressive lease program. Even we Audi bigots are not immune, blind and deaf, all the time.
Audi has crafted another super car, of that there can be no doubt. The marketing machine, despite this conclusion, needs a tune-up, however.
Comments
northern VA, still no 05.5 in sight
The base price for the 2.0 TFSI quattro (not your father's 4-cylinder...) is $30K. It outperformes quite a number of smallish or older 6-cylinders.
The sound of the slamming of the bits of hardware struck me first -- the hood, the trunk the front and back doors, even the glove box -- this is a major move up the silky smooth and authoritative thud meter, for the hinged pieces when they were closed were virtually silent, it was more that you felt the door close rather than hear it.
I don't know the "form and substance" of quality from an objective perspective -- perhaps no one does -- but, to me, the build/fit-finish of this new A4 was equivalent to the A8L and the new A6 -- there was nothing about the vehicle that seemed "entry level" (until the A3 comes along the A4 remains entry level).
The seats -- sport seats -- were perfect, and with the driver's seat situated for my driving pleasure, I could get into the back seat and my knees did NOT touch the back of the front seat (I am exactly 6 feet tall.) The interior, even in black, seemed somewhat larger than our last A4 loaner (a 2004 1.8T avant) when one of our cars was in for service.
Furthermore, as nice as the current A4 1.8T quattro is, the doors sound just an tiny bit tinny when slammed -- not so this new A4.
Since we did not drive it, these stationary impressions will have to do.
I liked this interior better than the top o the line Chrysler 300C AWD that I was able to sit in.
Still on my wife's short list: new A4, new G35x (Infiniti) and so new it isn't here yet BMW 325xi.
Still on my short list: Audi A4 or A6 (if the lease price doesn't strain my credulity), Chrysler 300C AWD, Acura RL and Infiniti M35x. The Acura, that I have at least sat in (passenger, back seat and behind the wheel) is fading when placed against the Infiniti M35x (that I have driven, at least). All things being even close to parity and with a level lease playing field, Audi is still the fave -- but the value proposition for those of us who "believe in leasing" still looms as one Audi negative; as does the A6 3.2's somewhat lackluster low end grunt (IMHO, the 3.2 should equal or beat the outgoing A6 2.7T S-Line and it doesn't even come close).
The number of cylinders is not necessarily an issue with me either, as the new 2.0T is probably the better of many manufacturer's 6 cylinder offerings -- and probably even the better of some guys V8's.
However, here's the big question: My dealer tells me the A4 3.2 is not available in manual, only tiptronic. He gave me a brochure for the new A4 and within the Specifications pages for A4 (and even A4 Avant), listed under 3.2 are all the transmission options. Under six speed manual, it says "n/a."
Yet, I thought I've read people post on this message board that the 3.2 would be offered in manual.
If my dealer says no and the brochure says no, yet some people think yes, can anyone tell me definitively who's right?
Thanks.
The speculation is a manual would be available for the 2006 version which comes out in the summer of this year. Not the 2005.5 version which is coming out now. In addition, they will over the S-Line and other Nav packages etc. that is not offered now.
I am waiting for the 2006 version to compare to the 2006 BMW 330i.
My BMW dealer told me that the sport package (w/SMG) for the new 3 won't be available until late fall. Although I've been a loyal Audi customer for years I am really leaning towards the 3 as I like the idea of the voice control (ala the TL) and the keyless access.
However I may just bite the bullet and get the B7 S4 but who knows. All in all though there are some really great choices out there that make the decision process even tougher.
This way, I'll have a chance to see for myself which one I'll like better as they are both 4WD, stick and about the same size engine and car. This will be my 4th Audi and my first bimmer, so I am a bit partial to Audi. Enjoy!
With only the "certainty" that lots of speculation, rumors and some facts can produce: the 6speed manual will be offered conicidentally with the availability of the S-Line.
We are a dying breed -- those of us who want manuals -- just ask the dealers what gets sold. Ask the dealers to tell you who votes for what with their dollars -- all the "woulda, coulda, shoulda, oughta" stuff that is written here there and everywhere, would lead me to believe that a significant minority of buyers would opt for the manual "if only twer available." This impression must be because the money comes from folks who don't, won't or can't participate in these forums -- we are a statistical anomoly. We are flapping our gums, so to speak, for our own entertainment.
Even if that is true, I, for one, don't care -- participating in these forums IS ENTERTAINING and informative -- which, I believe, despite our statistical insignificance (if that really is true) makes us more powerful consumers, and therefore more influential, or at the very least, potentially so.
The fact is, cars and almost everyting about cars is -- even for the buyer of "just transportation" -- at least a minor cause for strong opinions and passion.
The main problem as I see it is: despite the proliferation of car models available to purchase at almost every price point (not just the ones in the stratosphere), we just don't yet have mass customization -- promised for years, partially realized, but far from the "promises" made by marketing types.
I just spent the weekend, 600 miles worth, driving a 2005 Cadillac CTS (enterprise rental, three days, unlimited milage, $100) -- I really like this car (and it was an absolute "strippie" in terms of features -- only the driver's seat was power operated in fact). Yet, as I drove along roundtrip from Pittsburgh to Cincinnati thinking, "I'd be mostly happy with this car, but I wouldn't buy one, unless it came in AWD." But to get a CTS in AWD, you pretty much have to jump the price from $36+K to $53+K (assuming you stay with the 6 cylinder and will accept it as an SRX, no longer a CTS). It seems to me that a CTS, as I drove, with a $1900 AWD option, bigger wheels and tires, sat nav, heated seats and both front seats power actuated, for around $41+K would be a strong alternative to an Audi A6, Acura RL and the Infiniti M35x.
But, you can't buy the CTS, nowaynohow with AWD. It seems like this car, with its European-inspired handling, features, feel, power, etc, would be competition for the ever growing crowd of people who want the advatages of AWD, don't really need or want a or another SUV, want a sedan and want one that handles well. This RWD Caddy with AWD @ $1900 would price out close to a new A4 2.0T Quattro -- and, for some folks (perhaps including my wife and me) increase our options and probably overall improve the breed (of cars).
So, full circle, sure there will be a 3.2 Audi A4 with a manual transmission, but you will most likely have to order one to get it the way you want it (customized to YOU, that is)!
True. Today.
But Caddy has announced availability (2006 model year) of a V6 AWD STS.
- Ray
Hoping this may mean Caddy is re-examining option / package availability across the board . . .
This may be what I want -- but I have no choice.
With Audi, oddly, quattro can be had on the whole line (practically) without buying everything.
Chrysler's 300C (on my list) should be a viable alternative.
The CTS screams to be offered in AWD. Seems they have already done it with the SRX. Why limit this option to the SUV/crossover?
Audi, despite the competition, can truly be said to have been visionary.
Funny thing, the first US broad appeal Audi, the 1984 4000S with quattro was really never marketed as an AWD car -- indeed Audi let Subaru be the company that has become equated with AWD.
Still blows my mind.
I agree. I also think Audi was not smart enough to use the AWD feature as a major selling point, as Subaru had done. It may true that AWD is best suited in states where snow is a frequent occurence, but it also rains everywhere, and in inclement weather, an AWD car handles much better than a FWD or RWD. Anyway, ...
I am more amused by the fact that in commercials for cars which have models with manual, they always show the driver shifting gears in a manual and revving their engines like race car drivers would. And in print ads for those cars, they almost always show a model with a stick shift. Then, the consumer buys an auto. Duh!!
About the Subaru, I seriously considered a WRX as a replacement for my '02 A6, because it offered AWD, a blown engine, sports package, and a 6-speed stick. What turned me off though was the styling and the cost. I thought they were asking too much money for a smallish, homely car. Not much style, panache or flair there, IMO. If I'm paying nearly 40K for a car, it had better look (both inside and out) like it's worth it. The same thing goes for the AWD Passat, and the stick shifter goes up to 5-speed only. The redesigned 06' Passat which looks better will have a 6-speed manual, but won't be available until late Fall and won't initially have AWD.
I also looked at Volvo's S40 2.5T but when similarly equipped, the price is about the same as, if not more than, the new Audi. Every little thing in the Volvo costs extra, unlike the Audi which comes with a lot of standard features that you pay for elsewhere. And the exterior design is a bit dated and worn, apparently being just an afterthought on the part of Volvo to capture Audi's market. The interior is something else, though, but not enough for me to bite.
Oh, well.
I love these discussions. I feel like I have so many friends from all over who share some of my opinions, and we can have a chat about cars, and we may sometimes disagree, but we all learn something. Cheers to all.
2005.5 A4 2.0T Avant 6-speed manual quattro $30,450
6-speed Auto. Tip. quattro $31,650
Paint/pearl effect 450
PAW cold weather pak 750
PPS Sport pak 750
PPT Sport Pak all-season 750
WPX Premium pak 2100
PX3 Lighting Pak 1425
PSR audio pak (sirius) 1000
PXM audio pak (XM) 1000
PND Nav. plus 1950
PRV 17" alloy wheels 500
7K7 tire monitoring 250
4x4 side rearbags 350
8X1 headlight washers 150
3Y4 M. side shades 150
5MG Dark walnut wood 400
7TC vavona wood 400
AWB wheel locks 85
Dest. Charge 720
2005.5 A4 3.2 Avant 6-spd Automatic Tip quattro
$36,400
Paint 450
PAW 900
PPS 600
PPT 600
WPX 2050
PX3 800
PSR 1000
PXM 1000
PND 1950
7K7 250
4X4 350
NOK Premium leather 1000
3Y4 150
5MG 400
7TC 400
AWB 85
Dest. Charge 720
These I got from the dealer in North Carolina.
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2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
The 05.5's have suspension upgrades as share some parts from the S4. The 3.2 gives you a 10-12k cheaper alternantive to the V8 w/ about 85-90% of the performance
You'll have to live with the tippy for now, but manual 3.2's are expected in the fall.
http://www.subaru-global.com/about/history/1971-001.html
Specs = 2.0ltr, 6 speed, Quattro. Quartz Grey with Platinum leather interior. Cold weather package, Premium package, Audio/Bose/XM package, Lighting package, 17" alloys, headlight washers.
I have the numbers sheet on this vehicle. Here goes:
invoice MSRP
Base car = 27,344 29,450
paint = 410 450
premium pack= 1,911 2,100
audio pack = 910 1,000
cold pack = 683 750
Light pack = 1,297 1,425
wheels = 455 500
headlight wash = 137 150
destination 720 720
emission 150 150
local DAA 200 000
prep/inspec 195 000
34,402 36,695
Other A4 2.0T sedan models:
Front Drive 6 spd = 27,350 MSRP
Front Drive CVT = 28,550 "
Quattro 6sp Tip = 30,650 "
figure the same markup over invoice on all base models and options are the same for all A4s 2.0 in US no matter.
Falcon
I will past it here to compaire
All retail:
2005.5 A4 2.0T Avant 6-speed manual quattro $30,450
6-speed Auto. Tip. quattro $31,650
Paint/pearl effect 450
PAW cold weather pak 750
PPS Sport pak 750
PPT Sport Pak all-season 750
WPX Premium pak 2100
PX3 Lighting Pak 1425
PSR audio pak (sirius) 1000
PXM audio pak (XM) 1000
PND Nav. plus 1950
PRV 17" alloy wheels 500
7K7 tire monitoring 250
4x4 side rearbags 350
8X1 headlight washers 150
3Y4 M. side shades 150
5MG Dark walnut wood 400
7TC vavona wood 400
AWB wheel locks 85
Dest. Charge 720
2005.5 A4 3.2 Avant 6-spd Automatic Tip quattro
$36,400
Paint 450
PAW 900
PPS 600
PPT 600
WPX 2050
PX3 800
PSR 1000
PXM 1000
PND 1950
7K7 250
4X4 350
NOK Premium leather 1000
3Y4 150
5MG 400
7TC 400
AWB 85
Dest. Charge 720
These I got from the dealer in North Carolina
Indeed, I have been in countless arguments attempting to substantiate and defend Audi's leadership in this area. Yet, many with equal eloquence (some better even) are able to argue convincingly that Audi is a "poser" in that its AWD systems are NOT RWD biased.
Now before you think I am one of these Audi apologists, I remain convinced that Audi's system is equal to the best and better than most.
Yet, Audi is just now attempting to better balance its cars -- by moving the engines back somewhat, putting the battery in the trunk in some cars (or under the back seat), etc.
Audi HAS -- and that is past tense -- led in so many areas. But they have done little to foster their market's perception of leadership in AWD systems (for pity's sake, Subaru is the synonym to AWD car). In the late 80's the Ford Taurus had the temerity to claim the style of their car was "the innovator (heck they probably claimed inventor)" of the aerodynamic body style (the Taurus was a Ford take on the then low CD leader, the Audi 5000.)
Audi has done an awful job of blowing their own horn, now "everyone" wants an AWD vehicle -- Audi has had them forever, yet does not have a real SUV -- and even the two RWD stalwarts, BMW and Mercedes have them for Pete's sake!
Audi sometimes is so exasperating -- they create these marvelous cars and have been the leader in AWD -- heck they have been the virtual pioneer in the area. Yet my ex-yuppie friends do NOT think of Audi as "the AWD" sports sedan company.
They pant heavily when there are whispers of a new BMW with AWD, or when Infiniti comes out with "intelligent" AWD or Acura -- Acura!!! -- comes out with SH-AWD (which is still FWD biased). And don't get me started on Volvo -- read the product brochures from Volvo -- the S60 Type R -- THE HOT ROD VOLVO is 95% a FWD car, they don't even try to obfuscate this.
Oh sorry, I just get so ticked that Audi seems to have a death wish, or if not a DEATH wish at least a "bruise me" wish -- what a company!
As far as the intro of the 2005.5 A4, it was set for the stated 2/28 which coincides with the last day of the 05 SE program. The problem, Audi has is that the Special Edition program was a huge success, and they cleared most of the remaining inventory, thus burning threw their safety stock/days supply for dealers. They shipped the 05.5 to allow the dealers to present this ahead of schedule to potential customers. As in all companies marketing, manufacturing and logistics are often times not in synch. They have to build up days supply in order to properly market and sell the unit.
The new-body A4 was in the showroom and I had the chance to get inside although one was not set up to test drive. Astectics are always subjective although I enjoy when cars evolve as opposed to a total redesign (Shows they had it right the first time) while many improvements abound, the interior has a more luxury oriented feel as opposed to the understated sportiness of the 05. The 2.0T is priced about 1.5k-2k more then the 1.8T loaded per the SE. She raved about the "rear heated" seats. Hey I'm driving I could care less about burning the bottoms of my back seat drivers!!! The manager I spoke with raved about the 2.0T. How the ride was more powerful and responsive (they all say that).
As far as pricing to compare, the dealer actually complained that similar to the intro of the new A6 leasing wasn't a good option at the time of intro for the 05.5 A4. And they would have problems convincing people to lease under the current terms provided by Audi/VW finance. Granted the dealer will not discount the new car at this time (none do on new models simple supply/demand). A lease with only inception fees would run mid-$500s. This from a dealer who sold me a car around 500 over invoice well below what I was quoted in my area (I spoke/email/went to five different dealers)
DL
A4 2.0T
CVT (7 speed): $28,550
-Sport package; $750
-premium Package: $2,100
-Lighting package $1,425
-Destination Charge: $720
so if anyone really knows about this car and tell me what the msrp will be with these options and also what the invoice price is...
thankyou and i really appreciate it
DL
The 05.5 is a low key mid-year replacement. Go to your local dealer. The new body style cars still have 2005 on the window sticker. So Audi has (2) totally different 2005 A4's on the lot right now.
Maybe you can criticize Audi for not making these cars 2006's instead of 2005's so people will know the difference. But it's hard to do a marketing Blitz on 2 different cars that are both 2005 models.
Kinda has me puzzled. Like I said in an earlier post it's in line with days supply, not what each independent dealer has on their lot. Audi is shipping and making sure all the dealers are set up before th official launch. Actually makes better sense then going all out and not having enough 05.5s or having dealership personell not being familiar enough with the car due to shortages.
When I was at the dealership just yesterday their was a buzz in the showroom. Their actually were people getting in and out of the car. Almost reminded me of the NY Auto Show. My father who knows very little about cars was sitting along side one and commented on it before any other model.
As far as my thoughts about seeing it in person. Looks are subjective and often times harder to explain how it affects an individuals senses but here goes. I like you did, not like what i saw from the pics on the web. It's more of an evolution IMHO. For some aspects of styling I prefer the version its replacing. The interior is more luxurious as opposed to being sporty. I did not like the "new" front grille or the rear (civic like) from the pics I've seen. In person it's pleasing to the eye. It's a slightly larger car, Audi is pushing a little more up market to separate it from the upcoming A3.
Most people who post on these forums such as Edmunds are aware and the serious 05.5 buyer will have already contacted the dealership via email, set up a test drive and talked pricing.
As far as MSRP/Invoice, just in my own experience up in the North East. I don't believe they will be discounting at all for at least the first few months.
I drove an A4 3.2 (6-speed Tip., obviously) at lunch today.
I drove an S4 in December. Also a 6-speed Tip.
And I drove the A6 4.2 V8 “demo” when it first arrived, last fall.
The brochure for the new A4 claims 6.6 sec. to 100 KM/HR ( = approx. 62 mph).
My current vehicle’s (2003 Lincoln LS V8) published numbers for 0 – 60 are almost identical to the A4 3.2.
My impression is that the new A4 does provide some (potentially) significant upgrades in several areas, and additional availability of NAV, etc., but the acceleration does not nearly feel as strong as the S4. I do find it very easy to believe that the 3.2 is a real step up over both the 3.0 and the 2.8 V6s.
Audi claims 6.0 sec. for the A6 4.2, but C+D (the only published test I am aware of) reported: 6.3 / SS Quarter in 14.8 at 97.
I am looking (this time around) for a significant incremental increase in acceleration over what I am used to.
The 2005 S4 specs on audiusa.com claim 5.6 sec. for 0 – 60 w/Tip.
I can easily believe that difference between the A4 3.2 and the S4. And the 3.2 also lacks the sort of addictive torque that I enjoy in the lower RPM ranges, where I spend a substantial (too substantial, due to Atlanta area traffic) amount of my driving time. The V6 still seems to be working harder (clearly just my perception) all the time, to maintain any pace. The V8 seems almost to loafing – except at WOT.
And the V8 sounds soooo sweet.
So – although admittedly heavier, I’m going to wait a while and see if my dealer is motivated as new A4-s arrive to “move” the S4-s remaining on their lot.
Just my taste.
(Lusting.)
- Ray
Admitted acceleration junkie . . .
DL
Essentially, leases: NO money down; term 36, 39, 48 months, miles 12K or 15K and closed ended. Unless otherwise specified, we should share this info as a general course.
I remember not long ago an impossible lease for some 6 figure Euro lux barge -- $599 mo. Turns out the miles were 10K, the term was 48, and the "cap cost reduction" was a medium sized 5 figure number. Some deal huh?
A4 2.0TQ Tip
Dolphin Gray
Ebony interior
Premium Package
17" Rims
15K miles/yr..$2500 down
Quoted Lease...$550/mo
Question..I was told by a different dealer these prices were correct, but they are inception prices... So, do you think the price will go down once the lease programs start in March. I suspect they will start once the 2005 A4 program is over on 2/28. What are your thoughts??
I test drove the new A4 2.0T at the same Cary, NC dealership that was mentioned above. The salesman were handing out sheets with all the options and pricing information. The car I drove was fully loaded and stickered for (gulp...) 41 K! I currently own a 1.8 T, and I love the car. However, the cheapest car on the lot was 36K.
The car was very similar on the interior, but with some nice added touches compared to my 2000 A4. The salesman did try to say that it was a larger vehicle compared to the old model, but I heard from another dealer that the overall length has been increased only 1". The interior did not look any different in regard to size or rear seat room, which was non-existent. I loved it when he said the the rear seat room was increased, but it only looked small due to the larger seat pads! Classic.
I felt that the car on a whole was more familiar, inside and out, than different. The new engine has significantly more power, but the driving dynamics were thankfully unchanged. The 2.0, although powerful, is still as 4 cylinder, and there is significantly more engine noise than you'll find in most cars at this price range. Also, the normal Audi wind noise was evident.
In all, a very nice upgrade, but not a significant redesign. I can't imagine Audi capturing more market share with this car. A 4 cylinder engine for 35-40 K? The 1.8T was a zippy, fun, affordable car. Buyers in this price range tend to lean towards luxury WITH their performance. The A4 3.2 should do this, but were talking the same price range as a M35. Also, it starts to compete with the A6.
I was pleasantly suprised that the A4 was named as recommended by Consumer Reports. Certainly hats off to Audi.
Event #1: test drive of 2005.5 A4 2.0T with 17" wheels, standard suspension -- Premium, Lighting and Cold packages. MSRP $36,000+.
Event #2: test drive of 2005.5 A4 3.2 with sport suspension -- Premium, Lighting, Cold, Navi, Sat Radio, several other options: MSRP $44,000+.
Overall impressions -- improvement in every way over outgoing models.
The 2.0T feels darn close to the outgoing 3.0 V6. And, that should be enough, one would think, to force the US A4 line to be on "everyone's" short list for a big compact sporting sedan. Yet, add just a few more options (sport and sat nav leap to mind) and this 4 cylinder A4 tickles the underbelly of $40,000. Now, in a vacuum, this is a good thing -- driving the 2.0T one is impressed with its power and poise. Yet, those of us car mavens know this is but a 4 banger; and, as good as it is -- which is to say very good -- we also know that the BMW 3's (coming soon to a dealer near you) are both sixes, the Infiniti G35 is a six and (at this price range) the Cadillac CTS is a six and the upcoming Passat is likewise and even the Chrysler 300C's (same price range) have 50% more "cylinderage."
I comment so on this one feature because the automotive journalists and pundits seem keen to do likewise about the Acura RL's under hood "perception problem" of having but only a six cylinder motivator.
I loved the A4 2.0T with its crisp and smooth 6 speed manual transmission, its Servotronic steering and its tight as a drum chassis. Driving the two new A4's literally back to back and literally over the EXACT same route -- I can but implore you to not even consider the standard suspension (which, without the experience of the sport suspension seemed altogether very competent; but, with the 20-20 hindsight of having driven one with a sport set up, the standard system seemed no more comfortable and more than just a smidge less precise) because the sport suspension is THAT much better in every way, including ride quality.
I want to retest a 2.0T with a sport suspension. And, the primary reason? The automatic transmission in the 3.2 was "distracting." I finally settled in and started to get comfortable with "its decisions" when I flicked the lever into "S" mode, which, I am happy to report, ALMOST mimics exactly my shifting preferences when I took the same route with the manual. The six was more powerful -- but perhaps moreso in form than in substance (this car -- the 3.2 -- screams to be driven with a manual transmission; I imagine it would rival the B5 S4 would it be so available). The fact that BMW is bringing both its 3's (or better said, all four of its 3's) to market with manual transmissions, seems to indicate that the A4 3.2's launch is aimed at a less sporting - minded customer. More's the pity.
Now, to the navi-plus -- what a wonderful upgrade to the "avionics" of this personal aircraft. And, how cool is it to push the button and have the screen articulate out of the way to reveal the "secret slots" for chip insertion -- Instant Tang!
Fit and finish -- Audi has again outdone itself -- no matter what you think about Audi, love 'em or hate 'em and everything in between, can there be anyone left who does not recognize this is the one area where Audi keeps knocking them out of the park?
So, color us impressed -- very impressed. Value proposition? Based on our own observations, Audi has produced another potential winner and when compared with THE CURRENT CROP of cars in this price range (including the BMW and the Cadillac and Volvo and some other notable European makes) Audi is right up there near or at the top of the heap. Lingering doubts persist, however, from the school of "Perception Is Reality." Doubts? You bet. More cylinders are NOT NECESSARILY better, I know that, perhaps you know that. But at nearly $40,000 for the 2.0T jewel, it would seem that 4 cylinders may make some potential buyers long for a +2 under the hood (and for no good reason, other than "$10,000 a cylinder, in this class, just seems, somehow, perhaps, maybe, sorta, well -- a bit much"). Why? Well, when for similar money some American cars offer Hemi-V8's, premium Japanese cars offer 40% more powerful sixes and even the other Europeans offer (in the case of Volvo for instance) at least five cylinders; and that nagging little company just south (Munich) offers awfully sweet sounding sixes for pretty much the same money (and in either AWD or RWD).
This is a marketing, not a driving or engineering or quality issue. As the saying goes, "I wouldn't kick this 2.0T out of bed for eating crackers -- heck, I'd BRING the crackers to this little guy's pajama party." But the market can be ignorant and foolish sometimes. And, finally, the 2.0T with the 6 speed manual when compared with the automatic "transmissioned" 3.2, gives up very little in the performance arena making me wonder if the slight increase in urge that the 3.2 affords is actually worth some $5,000 over its little sibling.
Putting the super slick 6 speed manual in the 3.2 would cure several potential problems, if you ask me.
But no one ever does (ask me).
The Infiniti G35x fully optioned is thousands less and has 280HP and has an aggressive lease program. Even we Audi bigots are not immune, blind and deaf, all the time.
Audi has crafted another super car, of that there can be no doubt. The marketing machine, despite this conclusion, needs a tune-up, however.