Truck didnt get fixed they didnt get to it. I was mad because it sat all day and they were supposed to call me to tell me they couldnt get to it.
About the bedrails one main reason i would say dont go over the rail is because if you are in an accident and they need to do body work the whole side of the truck needs to be painted. Its easier to remove the rail caps vs the over the rail. I learned this first hand i had that scracth i was so lucky i had the rail caps.
I guess it is time for me to pull out the old textbook, if I can find it, that is!
In your example you retard the timing 1 degree at 2600 rpm. Is that from TDC to 1 ATDC? Or from nominal timing for this engine (10-25 degrees BTDC to 9-24 BTDC). In either case I don't see why 1 degree retard would have much affect.
Every engine I've ever worked on has exhibited ping from too much advance and poor running from too little advance. The rule of thumb that has been universally accepted (until now) is:
- More advance until you get pinging, then retard 2-3 degrees.
And based on schooling and everything else I have learned about engines logically supports that is understandable.
You keep saying that retarding timing causes pinging, but why? What is the mechanism that causes autoignition? It takes a combination of pressure and temperature to cause autoignition. With excessive advance the mechanical compression and combustion pressure combine to cause the fuel mixture to ignite. In a diesel it is simply mechanical compression and operating temperature to cause the fuel to ignite.
When the ignition is retarded there is no cause for autoignition. Uncontrolled waves are not caused by retarded ignition. They are always present. Are you saying that if the spark is retarded enough that autoignition will always take place? Wouldn't that make it difficult to shut off an engine that has a carburetor? Turning off the key stops the ignition, or it retards the ignition infinitely.
Almost all engines shut off immediately when the ignition is stopped. No autoigniton, no burps, nothing, they just stop.
Why, because retarding the ignition timing does not cause autoignition. Advancing timing does.
My thoughts.
I'll find that textbook tonight (maybe not, it's my wife BD) or tomorrow night.
all, getting my line-x utr sprayed in on monday. will take and post as many pics as they will allow. hope to have them posted by tuesday afternoon or so. will let you all know.
pat, for the same reasons ryan explained, i'm doing the under the rail spray in with wade bed rail caps. cost turns out about the same. (otr vs. utr with rail caps) plus, i'm afraid i'll strangle any sob who screws up and drips the otr down the rear 1/4 panel.
Kinda forgot what we were arguing about, but I too pulled out my old I/C engines book from my GaTech days from the early 80's and did some reading.......
Gist of my original comments were: 1) my '99 4.8L has a propensity to ping on 87 octane at WOT above 3,000 rpm pulling a heavy load at 2,000' to 6,000' elevations. The knock sensor apparently doesn't retard enought or doesn't detect ping at higher RPM's. 2) previously had the software update, which was supposed to reduce ping. 3) the ping is severe, happening on all 8 cylinders. 4) premium fuel eliminates this problem 5) the shop manual recommends premium for best performance.
My main passion in life is racing off road motorcycles, and over the past 23 years of racing have learned how both 2 and 4 cycle small, high output engines respond to excessive timing advance, lean jetting, and insufficient octane. My '99 seems to need higher octane fuel when run near its GCWR, considering the preprogrammed nature of jetting and spark advance.....
Have to dig up the receipt, but I do recall that they were $75 cheaper at the local (less than two miles from work) 4x4 shop than the "dealer cost" pricing at the "local" (about one hour from work) Auto Trim Design franchise the dealer tried to steer me to.
Who has replaced the diff. fluid on their 4WD's? How many miles? How many quarts? What brand and where did you find it. Manual is silent on this issue. Thanks Dustyone
Did my front diff and M/T fluid. Put Mobil 1 in the front. Front had alot of moisture (milky fluid), probably from running disengaged most of the time, and not getting hot enough to drive off moisture/condensation.
Tranny fluid - used GM syncromesh, old fluid looked fine.
Rear locker Diff - came with GM synthetic. Had two pinion seals replaced under warranty. They refilled each time. Have not changed the rear, as the GM Locker fluid is/was on backorder.
Couple or more quarts in front..... Buy extra, return what you don't need (or spill).
I usually change out at a year, then every 60k miles after that unless I submurge the truck....
JEEP says change diff's fluid every 12k miles if offroading alot. Probably cuz of moisture.
I occasionally go "race truck" for 10 miles or so on forest service roads in 4wd so my front diff gets warmed up and the water is driven off....
changed my rear diff at 10k miles. i wanna say it was mobil 1 75/90...but i'm not positive on that one. have to check. tech at chevy service center said that he used it in his z71 and that though it would be good out to 100k, he changes his every 50k just for cheap peace of mind. if i remember right it was about 2.5 qts. not sure though. easy to drain, easy to refill. got it at advance auto. you can find it at lots of stores auto parts stores though...
haven't changed the front diff and i don't have a manual tranny...
hey ryan (or anyone else who's had a spray-in put in) what do they do about the three bolts that secure the tailgate handle mechanism? do i need to provide a piece of sheet metal or will they leave a 6" by 6" patch exposed or what??? thanks...
I changed at 6K miles - it takes 4 quarts - and it still is not totally full when cold. After it is hot it was a little over full, When I take the plug off it wanted to drain - but I thought a little over can't hurt anything so I put the plug back in. I have heard that you can over fill - if you do gear oil will come out the over flow tube at the top of the differential when it gets hot. The cost of GM Synthetic gear oil $25.00 per quart - what a screw. The Mobile 1 Synthetic at Pep Boys had a note on the bottle that said - not approved for GM limited slip differentials. I did not want to take a chance so I gave GM $100.
00 1500 LT Z71 ext cab,4800 miles,catback single in dual out magnaflow muffler,16 mpg on the hiway,dealer says not broke in yet,says they wont even look at it until 7500 miles,any comments.Also got edelbrocks and velvet rides finally,the shackles got lost the first time,having them installed saturday the 19th.The 16mpg was all 75 to 80 mph with ac.Found out the hard way the Tx troopers frown on 80mph at night,defensive driving hear I come,seems like about every 5 years this happens.Any comments or suggestions.thinking real hard about an 01 2500 HD crew cab 4WD SB,orange of course.
Pat i agree with kyle saying they could mess up and drip down the side. I seen one guy who had a dakota and they messed it up. Needless to say theey are fixing it too
Kyle on the bolts i think mine were removed then put back on? The tail gate is lined and the 3 bolts are exposed (be careful when you sit in the tailgate i put the palm of my hand on one and it left a very nice mark).
Had my '00 1500 EX 4DR shot with Line-x a week after picking up from dealer and they did a great job over the rail. Installer said they mask off and pull fishing line to get a clean edge. getting a Snug Top canopy this w-end, interested if anyone has otr w/ canopy- any leaks? Picked snug partly due to 4 tube gasket along bottom rail. I also have dash squeaks, goes away (temporarily) when I push on dash above steering column. Other than that no probs w/ 3600 miles-avg 16mpg mixed.
beautiful truck man. i tell ya, had i seen a pewter over black before i got my black over pewter...i'd a been thinkin' fer awhile!!! hindsight being 20/20, i bet the pewter on top would be a helluva lot cooler here in sc...
Kyle no i jumped up on the tailgate to sit down and i pushed with one of my hands and it happened to be over one of the bolts pretty much all of my weight was on this hand and it left an indentation of a bolt in my hand for a few hrs. No biggie just giving you a warning. Yes i have a rhino liner. Its soft but not that soft. Its perfect. The line x is harder though i will tell you that.
you got it all wrong...the indentation was on his hand...LOL Betcha was worried that the liner was so soft as to rub off when leaving your hand on it...sometimes there seems to be something wrong with our communication...
ryan...thanks...haven't opened the pics yet. more later...
dean...no sh*t, man! i was like, "what, you can put a HAND print in one of these things!?! damn, what am i thinkin'?"
i feel much better knowing that the mark was in ryan's hand. yes ryan, metal, when pressed against your skin will leave a mark. the harder/longer it's pressed, the longer the mark will stay. i kinda took this as common knowledge, which is why i wasn't sure if the mark was in your hand or not...anyways, thanks. leaving at 11:00 today to drive to n. augusta (64 miles away) to get the line-x sprayed in. wahoo!
Kyle the problem i was having is it uploaded but you know the percentage done thing at thbe bottom??? It didnt leave the 100% and go to the next screen like it got stuck
I need some advice,I want to put in a spray in liner and a fifth wheel hitch for a camper.My question is do I do the liner first and then the hitch or the hitch and then the liner.Is there a fit and/or function issue if I spray the mounting rails. I also need to know if anybody has any input about the slider fifth wheel hitch as that is what i'm being told I should use with my S/B.
And off the subject a little. Yesterday I saw a GMC Yukon XL but it was as long as a suburban and it looked to be a 2500 from the look of the wheels and it has the new roof lights on it as on the 2001 H/D trucks. Is GMC going away from the suburban name or what did I see.It was hard for me to tell as I was going 70mph in St.PAUL.
My rear diff bolt says not to fill rear diff to top, but to fill 15 to 40 mm below filler hole. Suspect yours should say the same thing. So, 4qts is an overfill....
Other question on 4wd use.... Only use on low traction surfaces, and once a month for a good 20 miles at speed will probably get the diff oil hot enough. Hope you have a good place to run 4wd. If not, change your front diff oil frequently. An advantage of the old manual locking hubs is that you could lock em in, spin the front diff, without putting it in 4wd. Wish all the manufacturers would go back to the old system.
My dad had his Line-X sprayed in before he had his 5th wheel hitch installed. He has a shortbed also so he got the Reese Quick Slide. It is really easy to use.
Any of you guys out there know if you can request a survey form from GM to rate these dealerships on there performance? or are they simply random? I have had my 2000 GMC truck in for repairs several times by different dealers and have yet to receive one.
the recommendation is normally to do the liner first and then install the hitch. When the hitch is installed apply some rubber undercoating spray around the bolt holes to seal them up.
However, check with your particular hitch manufacturer before you do anything. Some mfrs. recommend the hitch go in first to be sure the bolts are properly seated and torqued - there was apparently some concern that the hitch could "walk" its way loose if it was installed over the liner.
Your exact question showed up in Trailer Life magazine several months ago, and their recommendation was exactly what I just described above.
I know when I was looking at spray in liners, one applicator (Toff I think) described in their brochure where they could spray around a fifth wheel hitch that was already installed.
Ok, now you guys got me thinking. I was all set to go otr, cause my 94 f-150 was utr and my rails are all scratched up, cause you know everyone lifts stuff over the side. Now i'm thinkin maybe utr cause of your guys thoughts. However i recall you both said that your caps were coming up in the heat, and i live in san antonio were it aint exactly cool. Now on that note, why did u guys pick wade caps? Did you guys research others, and/or were wade the only ones you looked at? Ok another subject. For you Zaino users, did you use the clay bar, even though you had a new vechicle? If you did they recommend mixing Z-7 car wash with water to be used as a lubricant for the clay bar. Now i did not get the Z-7 car wash so is say Armor-all Car wash good enough for substitute, i am guessing probably yes. The Zaino sight does not give alternatives for the use of another soap. pat
Wait wait on the bedrail caps. I have no problems with one of them. The one that is popping up is because when i had the body work done and they had to remove it they half assed it back on. They had tape only in the middle and about 6 inches away from each end. I have since added some 3m tape to some spots and its holding down just fine now. As long as you put enough tape down itll be fine i wouldnt sweat it. I picked wade because i couldnt find any other bedrail caps other than DEEZEE or brands which were metal (black or chrome). Also GTS came out iwth some right before i got mine but i didnt get a chance to see them. I actually seen the WADE at a parts place and they looked very nice.
I went with over the rail on my 00' GMC Sierra and then added a topper. My thinking was I didn't want the rail all beat up in case I ever took the topper off. It works and looks great. I don't see why anyone should be worried about going over the rail. Incidently my 3 tailgate bolts were taken out before they sprayed it in and then replace afterward. I also Zaino'd my truck and yes I did clay it when it was new. It took alot of crud off that I didn't/couldn't see. I would recommend you do it. As for lubrication for claying any soapy based solution should work.
I dont think I'm crazy,several times I have gotten in my truck and the lumbar has been inflated,I never inflate it,also I'm pretty sure that the door was unlocked and I know for a fact I had locked it when getting out,anybody ever heard of this.
Yep - my seat drives me crazy as well. Happens still almost on a daily basis. Don't get me wrong - I love the seat and the options, but every few times getting in the truck the lumbars are right in the middle of my back. I made note of it here and to the dealer within the first week of having the truck. No solutions anywhere.
I tried everything to duplicate it and watch it happen - never could.
Then one night a few weeks after that I was out messing with the Hypertech and the truck. All of a sudden I could here it and it was expanding. I looked down and realized I was sitting about half way in the truck- about the same position as if getting in or out of the truck - and my leg was actually against the button causing the inflation.
I was happy at the time that I thought I knew why it was happening. But 4 months later it still happens on a daily basis almost and I've paid close attention - I know my leg does not hit that button when I get in and out of the truck. I think the wiring mechanism or circuit board or whatever is behind the switch is getting activated in some way when I get in and out and am on the edge of the seat, but I don't think it is randomly doing it on its own anymore just sitting there in the garage like I used to think.
Experiment with this and listen when you get in and out and see if you agree or disagree with the theory.
Greg
By the way guys - I've started a new project and actually have to work about 8 or 9 hours a day (plus driving an hour each way) so I'm not keeping up with you like I used to. You all can sure create a butt load of posts. Hard to keep up with everything.
I did not have time to complete post earlier. You answered my question on bed rail caps above, also are you satisfied with the mudflaps, what brand, and do they require drilling? Your flares look sharp!
on the picture trail...i have the same problem. if you only upload one file at a time it should work. that's what i've been doing. i know exactly what you're talking about though...it happened to me too. uploading my new bedliner pics as i type this...
I know I over filled the rear differential. It is hard to tell when you are 15-40 mm from the fill hole. When the differential is cold I can remove the plug and oil does not drain out - so it must no be "too" full. I would think 3.5-3.75 quarts would be about right. Some one posted 2.75 quarts - but that does not seem like enough to me.
i don't think it was the heat. i think it was me being and idiot and not removing the wax before installing. i picked the wades for the same reason ryan did...only plastic ones i could find that i liked. not to mention they were about $75. difference between over and under the rail spray-ins tends to be $50-$75. so...you come out about the same. difference? you can remove the caps if you ever need to. also, bottom line is this: 99% of rail caps you get are going to install using 3m molding tape (or something VERY similar) so it's not a bad brand of cap that pulls up. it's either the tape or proper preparation of the rails. i just finished uploading my new liner pics. as soon as i get the album prepped, i'll let you all know. should be about 30 mins or so...
On the first wash, it goes like this. Dawn, clay, dawn. Using Ultra Dawn dishwashing detergent. About a capful to a gallon of water. Wash the truck with the dawn solution as you normally would. Next, Z7 with water and clay. Wash car one more time with the dawn solution and rinse. You are now ready for the Z1. The dawn will remove any polish or wax that the dealer may have placed on your truck while prepping. To get the best Zaino look, Sal recommends removing all wax and polish prior to using his products as the old wax may detract from that Zaino gloss...
Comments
Truck didnt get fixed they didnt get to it. I was mad because it sat all day and they were supposed to call me to tell me they couldnt get to it.
About the bedrails one main reason i would say dont go over the rail is because if you are in an accident and they need to do body work the whole side of the truck needs to be painted. Its easier to remove the rail caps vs the over the rail. I learned this first hand i had that scracth i was so lucky i had the rail caps.
Theh are made by wade.
http://www.wadeauto.com/
RYan
In your example you retard the timing 1 degree at 2600 rpm. Is that from TDC to 1 ATDC? Or from nominal timing for this engine (10-25 degrees BTDC to 9-24 BTDC). In either case I don't see why 1 degree retard would have much affect.
Every engine I've ever worked on has exhibited ping from too much advance and poor running from too little advance. The rule of thumb that has been universally accepted (until now) is:
- More advance until you get pinging, then retard
2-3 degrees.
And based on schooling and everything else I have learned about engines logically supports that is understandable.
You keep saying that retarding timing causes pinging, but why? What is the mechanism that causes autoignition? It takes a combination of pressure and temperature to cause autoignition. With excessive advance the mechanical compression and combustion pressure combine to cause the fuel mixture to ignite. In a diesel it is simply mechanical compression and operating temperature to cause the fuel to ignite.
When the ignition is retarded there is no cause for autoignition. Uncontrolled waves are not caused by retarded ignition. They are always present. Are you saying that if the spark is retarded enough that autoignition will always take place? Wouldn't that make it difficult to shut off an engine that has a carburetor? Turning off the key stops the ignition, or it retards the ignition infinitely.
Almost all engines shut off immediately when the ignition is stopped. No autoigniton, no burps, nothing, they just stop.
Why, because retarding the ignition timing does not cause autoignition. Advancing timing does.
My thoughts.
I'll find that textbook tonight (maybe not, it's my wife BD) or tomorrow night.
Mike L
bco (kyle)
getting my line-x utr sprayed in on monday. will take and post as many pics as they will allow. hope to have them posted by tuesday afternoon or so. will let you all know.
pat,
for the same reasons ryan explained, i'm doing the under the rail spray in with wade bed rail caps. cost turns out about the same. (otr vs. utr with rail caps) plus, i'm afraid i'll strangle any sob who screws up and drips the otr down the rear 1/4 panel.
bco
Gist of my original comments were:
1) my '99 4.8L has a propensity to ping on 87 octane at WOT above 3,000 rpm pulling a heavy load at 2,000' to 6,000' elevations. The knock sensor apparently doesn't retard enought or doesn't detect ping at higher RPM's.
2) previously had the software update, which was supposed to reduce ping.
3) the ping is severe, happening on all 8 cylinders.
4) premium fuel eliminates this problem
5) the shop manual recommends premium for best performance.
My main passion in life is racing off road motorcycles, and over the past 23 years of racing have learned how both 2 and 4 cycle small, high output engines respond to excessive timing advance, lean jetting, and insufficient octane. My '99 seems to need higher octane fuel when run near its GCWR, considering the preprogrammed nature of jetting and spark advance.....
So what were we arguing about?
Dustyone
Tranny fluid - used GM syncromesh, old fluid looked fine.
Rear locker Diff - came with GM synthetic. Had two pinion seals replaced under warranty. They refilled each time. Have not changed the rear, as the GM Locker fluid is/was on backorder.
Couple or more quarts in front..... Buy extra, return what you don't need (or spill).
I usually change out at a year, then every 60k miles after that unless I submurge the truck....
JEEP says change diff's fluid every 12k miles if offroading alot. Probably cuz of moisture.
I occasionally go "race truck" for 10 miles or so on forest service roads in 4wd so my front diff gets warmed up and the water is driven off....
My position is and will be that too much advance will cause an engine to ping.
Phil keeps saying if and engine pings give it more advance. I say that can damage an engine.
We hope to resolve this before the end of the year.
Mike L
haven't changed the front diff and i don't have a manual tranny...
bco
Dean
hey ryan (or anyone else who's had a spray-in put in) what do they do about the three bolts that secure the tailgate handle mechanism? do i need to provide a piece of sheet metal or will they leave a 6" by 6" patch exposed or what??? thanks...
kyle
Kirk
If anyone would like to see the pic here it is:
www.gorancho.com
Jeff
Kyle on the bolts i think mine were removed then put back on? The tail gate is lined and the 3 bolts are exposed (be careful when you sit in the tailgate i put the palm of my hand on one and it left a very nice mark).
Hope this helps
Ryan
Mark
Picked snug partly due to 4 tube gasket along bottom rail. I also have dash squeaks, goes away (temporarily) when I push on dash above steering column. Other than that no probs w/ 3600 miles-avg 16mpg mixed.
kyle
Kyle no i jumped up on the tailgate to sit down and i pushed with one of my hands and it happened to be over one of the bolts pretty much all of my weight was on this hand and it left an indentation of a bolt in my hand for a few hrs. No biggie just giving you a warning.
Yes i have a rhino liner. Its soft but not that soft. Its perfect. The line x is harder though i will tell you that.
Ryan
Ryan
Dean
Ryan
dean...no sh*t, man! i was like, "what, you can put a HAND print in one of these things!?! damn, what am i thinkin'?"
i feel much better knowing that the mark was in ryan's hand. yes ryan, metal, when pressed against your skin will leave a mark. the harder/longer it's pressed, the longer the mark will stay. i kinda took this as common knowledge, which is why i wasn't sure if the mark was in your hand or not...anyways, thanks. leaving at 11:00 today to drive to n. augusta (64 miles away) to get the line-x sprayed in. wahoo!
kyle
Have fun
Ryan
bco
Ryan
And off the subject a little. Yesterday I saw a GMC Yukon XL but it was as long as a suburban and it looked to be a 2500 from the look of the wheels and it has the new roof lights on it as on the 2001 H/D trucks. Is GMC going away from the suburban name or what did I see.It was hard for me to tell as I was going 70mph in St.PAUL.
Thanks Andrew
I posted some brochure pics on my site...they are in a topic called HD brochure..or something like that?
www.teleweb.net/mgdvhman/index.htm
- Tim
Other question on 4wd use.... Only use on low traction surfaces, and once a month for a good 20 miles at speed will probably get the diff oil hot enough. Hope you have a good place to run 4wd. If not, change your front diff oil frequently. An advantage of the old manual locking hubs is that you could lock em in, spin the front diff, without putting it in 4wd. Wish all the manufacturers would go back to the old system.
The GMC Suburban is now the Yukon XL
Nick
Dean
Chevy = Suburban and Tahoe
GMC = Yukon XL (previously suburban) and Yukon
Yes they make a 2500 version of the suburban and Yukon XL
Ryan
However, check with your particular hitch manufacturer before you do anything. Some mfrs. recommend the hitch go in first to be sure the bolts are properly seated and torqued - there was apparently some concern that the hitch could "walk" its way loose if it was installed over the liner.
Your exact question showed up in Trailer Life magazine several months ago, and their recommendation was exactly what I just described above.
I know when I was looking at spray in liners, one applicator (Toff I think) described in their brochure where they could spray around a fifth wheel hitch that was already installed.
Thanks ill have more pics whenever i get my damn tail light guards too
Ryan
Ok another subject. For you Zaino users, did you use the clay bar, even though you had a new vechicle? If you did they recommend mixing Z-7 car wash with water to be used as a lubricant for the clay bar. Now i did not get the Z-7 car wash so is say Armor-all Car wash good enough for substitute, i am guessing probably yes. The Zaino sight does not give alternatives for the use of another soap.
pat
I picked wade because i couldnt find any other bedrail caps other than DEEZEE or brands which were metal (black or chrome). Also GTS came out iwth some right before i got mine but i didnt get a chance to see them. I actually seen the WADE at a parts place and they looked very nice.
Ryan
markings. then again, ford was never something
that i looked at anyway.
may buy the wife a '01 Tahoe soon.
...red
Scott
kirk
Yep - my seat drives me crazy as well. Happens still almost on a daily basis. Don't get me wrong - I love the seat and the options, but every few times getting in the truck the lumbars are right in the middle of my back. I made note of it here and to the dealer within the first week of having the truck. No solutions anywhere.
I tried everything to duplicate it and watch it happen - never could.
Then one night a few weeks after that I was out messing with the Hypertech and the truck. All of a sudden I could here it and it was expanding. I looked down and realized I was sitting about half way in the truck- about the same position as if getting in or out of the truck - and my leg was actually against the button causing the inflation.
I was happy at the time that I thought I knew why it was happening. But 4 months later it still happens on a daily basis almost and I've paid close attention - I know my leg does not hit that button when I get in and out of the truck. I think the wiring mechanism or circuit board or whatever is behind the switch is getting activated in some way when I get in and out and am on the edge of the seat, but I don't think it is randomly doing it on its own anymore just sitting there in the garage like I used to think.
Experiment with this and listen when you get in and out and see if you agree or disagree with the theory.
Greg
By the way guys - I've started a new project and actually have to work about 8 or 9 hours a day (plus driving an hour each way) so I'm not keeping up with you like I used to. You all can sure create a butt load of posts. Hard to keep up with everything.
kyle
kyle
Dean