Cabover Campers & Camper Trailers (pickups)

oltroll · February 2002

I have these on my 02 GMC and love them. I had to change the way my front drivers side one connects to the camper so I could open the gas tank door but it was no big deal. You don't even see them with the camper off. I will be glad to send pictures of mine if you would like.

lauriet1 · February 2002

Do you think they'd be overkill for a 1200 lb camper? I'm thinking of putting them on the front and going with the bumper ties for the rear. Still considering them if I can get a decent price.

Steve - Where'd you get them at that cost? Did you install yourself? Is it difficult to put them on?

oltroll - How bout you? Did you install them? Do you know how much drilling into the frame is involved in the GMC Model? The Web site only had info on the Ford Applications available. I have a 01 GMC 2500 HD ExCab LB. If you have a moment to e-mail the pics, I'd love to see them, Especially the one by the gas tank door. merhow89@yahoo.com

I requested information from Tork Lift via e-mail asking for pricing and a brochure but haven't received a reply from them as of today.

steveheywood · February 2002

Yes, they probably are overkill for a 1200 lb. camper. I originally was going to use them on the rear and the Happi Jacs on the front until I priced them. I like the fact that I didn't have to drill a single hole in my truck and that there is nothing sticking out when the camper is off the truck.

At first I attempted to buy them through a local dealer. When the dealer wouldn't come through I ordered them direct from Central Welding.

My rears literally took 10 minutes to install, they slide into the square cross-tube of my Ford factory receiver and are secured with a simple clamp that prevents them from sliding out, no holes to drill. The fronts took about 15 minutes per side and most of that time was spent using the bolt fish to get the bolts inside my frame rails. On my Ford I have to pull the chain near the fuel filler door slightly to get it open, no big deal.

As for information, if you call Central Welding and ask for Robin she will answer any questions you have.

Steve Heywood
2001 F350 4X4 Supercab
2002 Lance 1010

lauriet1 · February 2002

Thanks for the info...appreciate it!

oltroll · February 2002

oltroll · February 2002

I will find the info. on mine this weekend. I did have to drill holes for the front set but not for the rear. I have a Sun-Lite pop up (about the same weight as yours). I felt that my rear bumper was too thin for the Happy Jack system. I had Happy Jacks on my Dodge and they worked fine(except they rusted very quickly). Ill try and send pictures this weekend also

vince4 · February 2002

The Tork Lift system is not an overkill. It's important to have a strong, well made hold down system. Either brand would be fine.

Don't skip the second battery. It's easy to run a battery down to the point that it can't turn over an engine. Without a dedicated battery you will be nervous and guilty every time you turn on a light or the heater kicks on. Get the battery, relax, and enjoy being warm.

If you want to convert to a power water pump later it's pretty easy. The cheaper method is to use a little hobby-type pump with a switch. My old camper was that way. The other is to install an on-demand system like most campers have. The pump is around $100. Either takes a little plumbing and wiring but isn't tough if you are handy.

I looked at a brochure for a Northstar popup today. It's pretty nice and has options like toilet, shower etc. The dry weight is 1800 lbs, wow. Almost as much as my Lance. They say their campers are a little heavier because of the quality construction.

Talk about heavy, is anyone familiar with S&S campers? Made in Montana. Their largest model, with a full side slide-out, is about 4000lbs wet! And they don't even show them on dually trucks.

I'm reading my camper brochures from the RV show I went to a month or two ago. Lance has the fanciest and largest brochure but they don't give any specs at all. How crappy. The extent of the specs are statements like "large holding tanks..."

vince4 · February 2002

Well I finally got my new cushions from the upholstery shop. They came out pretty good and do liven the place up a little. Here's a picture

I installed an accumulator tank in the water system today. It did stop the pump cycling as advertised. Now the pump stays off longer, then stays on longer, but the water flow is steady. I also wanted it to reduce the hammering in the water lines to reduce the pump noise. A lot of the noise is caused by the rigid water lines vibrating the structures they touch. I used a flex hose out of the pump to the accumulator, then attached the camper semi-rigid line to the other side. This combined with the pump isolation and insulation I did previously really worked great. The pump is just a small background noise now, a world of difference from the stock mounting. I tried to put a link to the accumulator but Edmunds says it's too long. Go here and search for "accumulator" at the bottom of the page, then pick the first one on the list.

https://www.rvpartsoutlet.com

I'll let you know how I like it after I take the camper out next weekend.

freeman2c · February 2002

Hello all. I wonder if any of you might know the lance model designations for the years 1990 thru 1998 for a 9' - 10' camper. I know they had several "brands", i.e. squire, lance lite, and some others. It would be very helpful knowing this. It is frustrating to look thru the classifieds and not know what the camper length is when it isn't stated. I am considering buying a camper in the range of years noted above. Any recommendations as to what to look for to help determine its mech. and structural integrity? I know the roof is a major concern. Just not sure how to tell if it is in good shape or not. Thanks for the reply in advance.

cory

docsilva · February 2002

What model Lance is that. It looks the same as mine, except cushions and table. Mine is a Lance 6000. Bought new in '91.

docsilva · February 2002

Early '90 models for 10' 9" are Lance LC 680, and Lance Squire LS 6000.
The roof should be re sealed about every 2-3 years. If the caulk is yellow and flaking it this needs to be done. Look (inside) at the overhead bed area in the corners by the window for leaks, also around the window. If there are stains in the corner this indicates that the roof needs re sealing, and the front window if the stains are around the window. Check around the toilet mounting bolts for cracks in the plastic. There were problems with some of the early '90 models. Vent caps may need replacing also. Get on the roof to see if the caps are chalky, or cracking. Look through all cabinets for water leaks from the fresh water system, especially around the hot water heater. Check all appliances for operation. Look at the corners where the jacks attach for any deformation, and that the jacks are mounted with the correct number of screws (12 I think but not sure). The tie downs should also be solid with no evidence of being pulled out or over stressed.
I've had mine (Lance 6000) for 10 years and very happy within it. If you have more questions just ask.
Good luck

vince4 · February 2002

docsilva, mine is a '91 also, a Squire 4000 9.4. I bought it in '96 and am the third owner. It looked almost like new when I bought it. It still looks good but has some signs of use. I didn't want the low-end Squire series but since I bought used I couldn't be too picky. Other than that it was exactly what I wanted and I even bought the truck underneath it! Here's a picture I took just after I installed the electric jacks.

cory, you may be able to get some help from www.lancecamper.com if you send an email. Or you could try more owner forums like http://www.lanceowners.com. I have some older brochures, if I get a chance I'll take a look.

The advice docsilva gave is good. My camper has cracks around the toilet mounting holes but it hasn't caused any problems. I resealed the roof a year or so ago and it was the first time since new. The old seal was very yellow and cracked but the camper didn't leak. I'm sure this is an area often neglected, you know, out of sight out of mind. Don't expect to find many campers that have been resealed. As long as there is no evidence of leakage then it's okay, you can always seal it yourself. Most campers (and RVs) aren't used much so you shouldn't have trouble finding one in good shape. What I found is that Lances really move fast on the used market so you need to ready to respond when an add comes out. Good luck!

mledtje · February 2002

You still looking for a pop-up? I noticed two in the RV trader this week.

Napa RV Sales has new Starcraft Starblazer fully equipped popups for $6995

Bonessa Bros. has a 4Wheel camper for $7850. No mention of equipment.

http://www.rvtraderonline.com/adbrowseprocess1.html

Mike L

freeman2c · February 2002

Docsilva, thanks for the advice, that is very practical and helpful advice. Vince, I have talked to my local Lance dealer and unfortunately they weren't very helpful with the older models. Maybe it was just the particular person I talked with. I will email Lance directly and hopefully they can be of some help. A question for you or anyone else. Was the Squire series created to be the lighter series during its production years; just like the current Lite series? Vince, how much did the electric jacks cost, if you don't mind me asking. Were they dificult to wire up and install? When you go camping and stay in a spot for any length of time do you take the camper off the truck? I like your setup and I will probably wind up with doing something very similar. Oh, one more question, What is your camper weight fully loaded for a trip, and what is your total truck and camper weight when ready to leave? Sorry for all the questions and the long post. You guys are a great source of information and as always I appreciate it.

Have a good day.
cory

vince4 · March 2002

Thanks for the heads up Mike but those are too rich for my blood. For something I'll probably use a few times a year it just isn't worth it. If something good came along at $3-4k I'd be tempted.

vince4 · March 2002

The Squire line was created to be lower cost. They are probably lighter too since they have some things removed. The differences I'm aware of are: less insulation (at least no foamcore option), no TV cabinet, friction latches, no bumper, no big drawer under the dinette seat, curtains rather than blinds, manual start water heater, foam bed, different exterior color scheme, probably less fancy fabric etc. They really are very similar, just some nice finishing touches removed.

The Squire morphed into the Lite series later. They may have removed even more stuff to get the weight down. Mine is stickered at 2223 lbs wet. That doesn't include "options" what ever those are, probably the jacks. I've never weighed it but I assume it's around 2500 lbs loaded which would put the whole rig around 8000 lbs. I do need to get out and weigh it.

The jacks cost around $1500 total. I bought the wireless remote version so that added a few hundred. I think the jacks are $1100 or so, and the mounting kit is $200 and remote $200, rounding a bit. That is big money for a convenience item but I'm happy I did it. It makes the camper more useable so I get more out of it. It also makes the load/unload process so much more enjoyable and safe. I just got back from a trip and I used them to level the camper. I may not have bothered with the old jacks in favor of wheel chocks. In this case I pushed a button and it was done. Yea! Installing the jacks was a medium-big job. It took me a few weekends plus many weeknights after work. Mostly it's just slow running wires nicely and being careful when drilling to not create a bigger problem. It's not a job for a novice but if you've done house wiring then it's similar.

I don't take the camper off when camping very often. I usually want it with me when I go somewhere anyway, that is a nice thing about having a camper. The main reason I'd drop it is to go off-road and play. The problem is that you have to come back to the same spot at the end of the day and more often than not I'm wanting to travel and stay each night somewhere new. I hear (mostly here) that RV parks often don't allow dropping a camper. I've done it, and it doesn't take long, but usually I find it impractical for the reasons mentioned.

drof01 · March 2002

I'm lookin at a 1992 Four Winds 9.5' hardside slide-in camper. It looks like Thor/Four Winds no longer makes slide-in campers. I'd like to hear from anyone with a Four Winds slide-in. How is the quality? Did you like it, etc.?

Thanks.

Ron

vince4 · March 2002

Sorry I don't know anything about them, but here is a web site I found. Looks like they are just into the big rigs now.

http://www.thorindustries.com/scripts/wdb.exe/pgget?st=th_fwork&pg=th_frame&cmp=6&year=2002

vince4 · March 2002

What are you all doing about your old LP tanks now that they are almost obsolete? I've been told the horizontal tanks are exempt from the new rules, does anyone know about that?

stabbur · March 2002

The last issue of Highways, the Good Sam magazine, featured the LP changeover. The horizontal tanks, as on motorhomes, don't need to be replaced. It may be in that article that I learned that Walmart will trade new tank for the old one and a very reasonable charge. I haven't checked with my local Walmart yet to see if they offer the deal though. I'm wondering whether my reducing valve will adapt to the new 20 lb tank in the very tight space in my Sunlight. I found a tank in the local hardware store that has a dial type gauge on the top and it would be great if I could get it all into the compartment - using a mirror to read the gauge would be easier than lifting the tank out to check how full it is.

vince4 · March 2002

I have a dial gauge on mine and it is very handy. You don't need to lift the tank out otherwise though, there are other choices. On my old camper I put a stick-on strip on the tank which turned color when hot water was poured on it. The LP would absorb more heat than just the metal so the color boundary was the level. I've seen similar products recently which didn't mention anything about hot water but I don't know if they need it or not.

Thanks for the confirmation on the horizontal tanks. I'll poke around the web and see if I can find something official.

volkej · March 2002

What's this about LP tanks? What kind are becoming obsolete? I haven't heard anything about this.
I guess I'll have to come out of my cave more often.

Jim

mledtje · March 2002

New Federal regulations require a tank to have an OPD (overfill protection device?) before it can be refilled. It's some sort of a float that shut off the gas into the tank before the liquid shoots out of the vent.

Most tanks in the last 4 years or so are OK. I think the new tanks have a triangular shutoff handle on them.

Mike L

satch121 · March 2002

I am going to have to replace my Firestone load range E tires before summer.I've been thinking of staying with the Firestones but my buddy says go with Michelin LTX AT's. I checked and the michelins are about 40 dollars more per tire than the Firestones. Would like to know if the extra 160llars per set is worth it. I carry a Lance 1010 in the bed so I've got some serious weight and I need a good tread for the snows I get from Lake Superior.

If you have any experience with the Michelins or any suggestions I would appreciate your comments.
Thanks
Ronnie

mullins87 · March 2002

I am assuming you have the Steeletex tire now. Whatever tire you choose, just make sure they have enough capacity to handle all that weight, with some left over.

jdtopper · March 2002

I'm new to this forum, and glad I ran across it. I see a few familiar names from other forums.

I do a lot of camping now, but don't have a camper. It's all been tents and open air stuff so far. I'm well into the 50+ crowd now, and find myself becoming a tad less enthusiastic about making and breaking camp. I've been going to Hunting/Fishing/RV/Outdoor shows for a number of years and have always found the time to look at campers. Lots of choices out there.

I have a box-stock '00 F350 CC LWB PSD 4x4. I have a Class IV hitch, though I'm not necessarily leaning towards towing.

If you have a moment, would you mind sharing a few thoughts about what works well and what doesn't? And maybe why, in either case?

Thanks...

docsilva · March 2002

I have had 2 Steeltex blow outs. Both times while carrying a camper. I would suggest the Michelin brand. Just bought a new F350 and will replace the factory Firestones with Michelin LTX M/S. The lowest price I have found is at Discount Tires. $129 for 265/75/16 load range E. Here is a link. http://www.americastire.com/

volkej · March 2002

I have 265/75/16 Michelin LTX M/S on my 1500 Silverado. I'm happy with them so far. They performed well in the limited amount of snow I've had them in.
The Michelin web site lists performance attributes of their various tires and those lists show that the LTX M/S is better for snow than the ATs.
They are pricier than other brands - I paid around $120 a tire at America's Tire Co.

mullins87 · March 2002

Do you know what the load ratings are on your Michelins? I know range E, but I am at work right now and can't get outside to look at mine to see what the actual lb. rating is.

mledtje · March 2002

If they are the same size and same load rating, they have the same load capacity. Something like the feds standardized the ratings so if you change brands of tires you will have the same capacity.

Now if they are differenst sizes, or load ratings, you better double check.

Mike L

satch121 · March 2002

I'm still in the air conditioner dilemma for my Lance. The local RV shop pushes Coleman and my Lance dealer (150 mile trip) pushes the Duotherm Briskaire and Penguin. If there isn't any complaints or problems with the Coleman I'd be tempted to go with it. However the Duotherm has a 3 speed fan Vs. the Colemans 2 speed. Anyone out there have any advise.

Thanks in advance
Ronnie

vince4 · March 2002

Michelin LTX AT's only go up to a C load rating, you have to go with the M/S tire which has a less aggressive all terrain tread to get E. If that's okay with you I'd suggest going for the Michelins. I've never been sorry I spent a few extra dollars for good tires. If you think about it, what other item do you buy for your truck that can have so much affect on ride, handling, noise, and safety?

vince4 · March 2002

Beware! If you have the old style tanks they can't be refilled as of April 1st.

vince4 · March 2002

Even though your truck is a 1 ton, I think it may not have a very high load capacity because of the extra doors and heavy engine. Does it have a sticker in the glove box or elsewhere listing the maximum camper weight? I don't know about Ford but 3/4 and up GM have such a sticker. You could probably handle an 8-9 foot hardside even if it was a little over the limit, and certainly any popup.

What type of camping do you like to do? Do you go off road? Do you stay in campgrounds only or is primitive camping okay? Is convenience really the motivation for a change or are you looking for more, like warmth, comfort etc.?

I'll give you an abbreviated version of my standard speech. Your choice comes down to towing or not. The obvious advantage of towing is that you can drop the trailer and use the truck for local use when camping. In a way that's not so great. I find it very nice to have my stuff with me, and to have a safe haven to retreat to when I'm out all day sight seeing or at the beach or whatever. Also I have a dog and with the camper I can leave the dog inside and go see attractions etc. And of course you can drop the camper and use the truck for excursions. It's not as easy as a trailer but it's not hard.

The other advantage of towing is that you can have a much larger rig. Truck campers can't compete there if that's what you want.

The best thing about a camper is mobility. You get the most important attributes of an RV (shelter, heat, food support) yet you can still go almost anywhere. You don't need to worry about pulling in some unknown little road or campground that you may not be able to turn around as with a full size towable. If you like primitive camping, the camper actually gives you more freedom than tent camping in a way. You have a large water supply and aren't dependent on ice for refrigeration. Plus the weather doesn't matter much. Now, you can't do serious off-road driving with a hardside camper, nor can you squeeze in forested areas that don't have much vertical clearance. But short of that you can go pretty much where ever you want. With a popup camper the off-road limitations almost go away.

Enough rambling for one day. What do you think?

vince4 · March 2002

I finally purchased a set of Rancho 9000s for my truck. I haven't put them on yet but hope to tomorrow. What settings do you use? I'm guessing maybe front 2, rear 1 empty and front 3, rear 4 loaded?

lauriet1 · March 2002

Ok Forum Folks - What brand of brake controller do you all prefer?

The only one I have experience with is the Tekonsha Voyager. I found that it needed to be adjusted constantly, depending on load (empty trailer vs. loaded trailer, road conditions, etc).

I'm looking at a Tekonsha Prodigy instead. Any opinions out there?

Can someone explain the difference between Inertia Activated Braking(Voyager) and Proportional Braking (Prodigy) in "true layman's terms"?

I'll be towing approximatly 4000 of loaded horse trailer with a 1250 lb truck camper on the box (plus gear weight in the camper). Thanks for any info.

markbuck · March 2002

If vertical, they must be the new triangle handle with the big external threads. We just bought two new valves and replaced the ones on the two tanks. Pretty easy two man job, one guy hugs tank, other guy turns valve with big adj wrench. Also replace the hoses to use the new type big outside connector. Buddy's that didn't replace the hoses are tearing up the new valves and haveing trouble with proper flow.

Valves were ~$20 each, plus $10 for two new hoses that feed into the reserve valve.

Have had both filled several times, no problems.
We did the switch over real quick, no air introduced.....

Get the valve with the right sized dipstick/bleed for your sized tanks.

PS. Went to LT255/85-16 Coopers on the 2500HD, love em.

fordtuf · March 2002

If you have a Class 4 receiver then your truck should most certainly tow a travel trailer up to 30' and posibly more. My Mom's 00 F250 4x4 SC V10 towed a 34' with a twin slide out. Loaded it tipped the scales around 11,200. Empty around 9700 lbs.

You can also get a fifth wheel unit of the medium variety, again almost without question up to 30'. If you go 5th wheel you loose cargo area in the bed, otherwise it is a very good way to consider.

My two cents about what you should do.... go to a campground and start talking and asking how people like their campers and I'll bet you get invited in to look around. The camping community are some of the nicest people in the country, that is my opinion anyway.

I would strongly advise getting a slide out unit, no matter what type of camper you go with.

Good Luck

P.S. I tow a 27' Terry Resort with my F250 4x4 SC V10 and it is sooooo easy for the truck to habdle it.

djpstman · March 2002

Anyone find out anything official on the horizontal LP tank exemption from the new valve rules? I have a Lance and it has one tank with a gauge, plus they both have hooks on the bottom to keep them in place. I would hate to try and replace these.

I wonder if the propane fill places will know the exemption? Ya right, that is a different problem !!!

mledtje · March 2002

I don't think it would be difficult to find someone to refill the old style tanks. I could be wrong, but I'll bet you can find someone. I know I could.

Markbuck, where do you buy the new valves? Never thought about replacing the valve - and I have one valve that has gotten difficult to open sometimes.

Mike L

vince4 · March 2002

I did a little web searching, here is what I found.

--------------------------------------------

http://www.amistadpropane.com/opd.html#1

I have a horizontal cylinder on my recreational vehicle. Are OPD's available for that kind of service?

Presently, the Code does not explicitly address the issue of OPD valves on horizontal cylinders. This has presented some difficulty as horizontally oriented cylinders that were manufactured prior to October 1, 1998, are unable to be retrofitted with the OPD's that are available at this time. There is currently a proposal in the Code process that would exempt this style of a cylinder from needing an OPD if visibly marked that it has no OPD and was manufactured prior to October 1, 1998, and if none of these safety devices are available for this style of cylinder. While the foregoing is a proposal for the 2001 edition of the Code, it is not now known if this suggested amendment will be approved. Without question, OPD's are still required for these cylinders that have been manufactured after September 30, 1998. An attempt is regularly made to make propane marketers aware of changes in the Code. We would be happy to answer any further questions you may have.

----------------------------------------------

HERE IT IS, DIRECT FROM THE NATIONAL PROPANE GAS ASSOCIATION

http://www.npga.org/

Q: I have a horizontal cylinder on my recreational vehicle. Are OPD's available for that kind of service? :

A: The 2001 edition of NFPA 58 (the LP-Gas Code) recognizes that horizontally oriented cylinders that were manufactured prior to October 1, 1998, are unable to be retrofitted with the OPD's. As a result of this fact, the Code now exempts these cylinders from having to be retrofit with OPD valves. Any such cylinder must have a label affixed to it to inform the user and the refiller that an OPD valve is not installed.

-----------------------------------------------

HERE IS MORE

http://damouth.home.attbi.com/Tips/OPD.htm#Recent

Recent Exclusion of horizontal DOT tanks: Owners of older RV's that use horizontal rather than vertical propane cylinders should read the following information:

The new OPD (Overfilling Prevention Device) valves will be required on 4 lb. to 40 lb. propane cylinders from 1 April 2002. However, the currently available new valves are designed only for vertical cylinders and cannot be used with horizontal cylinders. Therefore, horizontal cylinders manufactured prior to 1 October 1998 have been exempted from having OPD valves, provided they are so labeled. (Such cylinders manufactured after 1 October 1998 do already have OPD valves).

This information is on the website of the National Propane Gas Association. See A pamphlet addressing commonly asked questions from propane consumers..

Since propane dealers do not seem always well-informed, it is suggested that RV owners with pre-1998 horizontal DOT tanks should print this article and carry it with them, in case a dealer balks at filling a cylinder without an OPD valve.

The relevant part of the document is on the second page:

Q: I have a horizontal cylinder on my recreational vehicle. Are OPD's available for that kind of service?

A: The 2001 edition of NFPA [National Fire Protection Association] 58 (the LP-Gas Code) recognizes that horizontally oriented cylinders that were manufactured prior to October 1, 1998, are unable to be retrofitted with the OPD's. As a result of this fact, the Code now exempts these cylinders from having to be retrofit with OPD valves. Any such cylinder must have a label affixed to it to inform the user and the refiller that an OPD valve is not installed."

For more information on this general subject, see the following documents from the National Propane Gas Association:

----------------------------------------------

HERE IS A HORIZONTAL TANK FOR SALE, $79

http://www.betterpropaneshop.com/mall/dot_5-20lbs.asp

----------------------------------------------

AND ONE FOR A LITTLE MORE

http://www.rvpartsoutlet.com

MANCHESTER 20 Lb (5 Gal) LP Tank/Horizontal

$93.06

5 gallon capacity propane tank designed for horizontal use in LP compartment. Comes with built-in sight gauge for accurate tank-level monitoring. 17-3/4" OL X 13-5/8" H X 12-1/4" D X 8" B.

vince4 · March 2002

Here is a state by state enforcement list

http://www.npga.org/public/articles/NFPA_58_State_Adoptions.pdf

--------------------------------------------------

Here is a page with a link to another official fact sheet to print

http://www.nfpa.org/Codes/Interpretations/FAQ58/FAQ58.asp

nasviking · March 2002

My wife desided my truck camper was to small for us. Sold it to friends, now I'm going the 5th wheel route. Anybody out there installed a 5th wheel hitch on a Silverado. Any hints bolting to the frame. Seems like every things in the way(including my hellig sway bar). Where I want to attach plates to frame, it is enclosed or gas tank close. Thanks, Steve

treadltly · March 2002

Looking to buy myself my first big pickup truck to haul a travel trailer suitable for 5 of us. I've looked at various lightweight trailers, weight would be 3500-5000 # GVW. Since my husband commutes and won't let me get the truck for him (bad mpg), I'll have to make it my daily vehicle & give up the new minivan option (never owned one yet). I'd be looking at the crew/quad cab designs for fitting the whole family. I have been looking at the Dakota small 8 cyl. which could have sold me, except the headrests are fixed, and unfortunately would leave my husband (6'-4") with too much whiplash potential for my liking. He hates shopping, so said get whatever I like. I'd love his input, but he doesn't want to go to any dealers & deal with them. Of the big ones, it looks like Edmund's gives the Ford series the best thumbs up. I also really like the concept of the new Ford Explorer Sport Trac, supposed to be a combo midsize SUV (part explorer) & crew type midsize truck. It only has a 4' bed, but the biggest 4-dr. cab of them all. Backseat room is important to me as my 13 year old is likely to be over 6' in 4 years, and we'll likely keep this 10 years. I guess the benefit of the sport trac is that we could throw all 5 of our bikes in it and go hit the trails easily, and still get pretty good daily mpg. Only drawback there, I was told by my dealer is that it doesn't come in an 8 cyl., so probably won't tow enough trailer. Any personal experiances out there towing a 24' trailer with a small 8 (4.7L or so)? Mountains terrains are definite for us, so brakes are just as important as torque & HP. Thanks for any suggestions.

mullins87 · March 2002

you need the SuperCrew. I would imagine a 24' travel trailer will gross out around 6,000 lbs. That is too much for anything less than a full size truck. Others on this chat board will tell you otherwise, but, IMHO, when selecting a tow vehicle, don't get what is rated to just "handle" your anticipated load. I don't know what your daily driving situation is but my advice is get slightly more truck than what you need. That way, in three years when you decide the 24' is too small, you can buy that 30' you really want. If you haven't already, look at the F-250 CrewCab short beds. They are only approximately 1.5 feet longer than an extended cab long bed 1/2 ton truck and are not much more expensive than a 1/2 ton. You mentioned towing in the mountains, you'll appreciate the added safety of larger brakes with an F-250 and it will be infinitely more stable in crosswinds or with passing trucks.

I don't know how comfortable you are driving a full size truck, but you won't regret it when you have the trailer behind you.

mullins87 · March 2002

Someone delicately pointed out a mistake I made in that last post, too many things going on at one time while I was typing. I intended to compare 3/4 ton crew cabs and 1/2 ton extended cabs, both short bed versions. I do not have exact measurements in front of me, I am "eye-balling" them.

vince4 · April 2002

Don't try to pull that size trailer behind a small truck. The Dakota may be rated for the weight, barely, but the trailer will push the truck around. The Ford Sport Trac is out for sure, it's a light duty vehicle.

You won't get any better mileage with a Dakota V8 than a full size Chevy. While the smaller truck may be more convenient to drive, the large truck is safer. All three manufacturers have 4 door trucks now if that what you want. Go try them out.

jdtopper · April 2002

but aren't all of the propane cylinders referered to in previous posts subjet to hydrostatic testing requirements, and don't the hydro dates render them obsolete at some point anyway? I'm not a camper/trailer person yet, so please bear with me...

mledtje · April 2002

It looks like the cylinders have 10 years from the certification date, then need to be recertified.

But, I've never had anyone check the certification date on a cylinder before they refilled it.

Mike L

vince4 · April 2002

Yes, the age of the cylinder is still relevant. All cylinders of this size class have a 12 year "life" from date of manufacture. You can have a tank recertified at a LP dealer and then it's good for another 5 years. As far as I know there is no maximum lifetime.

My horizontal tanks will be 12 years old soon so I'll go ahead and buy new ones at that time because of age and the OPD issue. Unlike Mike, I have been refused at a fill station due to the tank age in my old camper. I'm sure if you kept trying places it wouldn't be hard to find one that doesn't look but it's not worth the grief for the money in my opinion.

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