Totally agree on Honda's commitment to manual transmissions in well equipped cars.
Having the 6-speed option in a v6 with leather and all the bells & whistles keeps me in an Accord despite the current bland exterior. Keep that and give it the 2008 face?? I do not see any competition on the horizon for that!
For all the 'style' of the Camry or Fusion, neither put a stick shift in anything except the lesser optioned models.
and hopefully with the 3.2l v6 comes some type of awd, atts, or torque distributor to decrease torque steer.Thats what the tl suffers from the most unfortunatly. Yeah you can learn to live with it but why when you don't have to.
???????
Do you have a TL and drive a TL every day? If you did you'd see this blanket statement about the TL's torque steer is awry. Torque steer is evident in ANY high HP FWD vehicle. In the TL it is mitigated (at least in the 06 + versions) by new software. Its also mostly apparent in the manual transmission versions which make up probably only 5% of all TLs.
You only have to deal with torque steer when you're steering hard and accelerating hard simultaneously which isn't very often. Even then I'd hardly call it suffering.
I put 19000 miles on my TL in the last year and can count on 1 hand the number of times I was leery of torque steer. FWD comes with the territory when you buy Honda/Acura.
Never driven a TL. I'm just posting those sometimes vague reviews of different editors. C&D, MT, IL, ect. It is a sometimes concerning topic that is commonly brought up so i brought it up, again. But if i remember correctly, acura fixed the issue after the 2004 model run. This could explain why you don't notice it. But its just a guess.
Your last sentence, I add SAAB to that and subtract the RWD s2000 and NSX. -Cj
AWD & ATTS (or Honda's combination of the 2) would add weight & complexiety. Weight obviously hampers all types of performance including acceleration, braking, balance, & handling. It is another computer controlled system that might break down the road & be very expensive to fix. It could also lead to something else being expensive to fix. About a year and a half ago (52,000 miles) my 2001 Prelude Type SH's clutch had to be replaced. It cost me an insane amount of money (as far as clutch replacements go) because in order for the clutch to be replaced, the ATTS unit had to be taken out & then re-installed resulting in an extra 5 hours of labor.
A great device to help torque steer is a mechanical LSD which most companies are reluctant to put in their cars (save for the Civic Si, BMW M Cars...).
I'm anxiously awaiting the new '08 Accord. My wife drives a 2000 Mazda Protege ES with almost 80,000 miles. About 4 months ago she gave birth to our beautiful baby boy. He's go a lot of stuff for somebody who is only 25" long. Right noew the Protege is good for the 3 of us. But I feel like we may out grow it in a year or 2. I've had an '06 Accord as a Loaner car (when the Prelude goes in for service) and I've been impressed even with the pretty basic 4cyl LX they gave me. The new Accord will probably be at the top of my list along with the TSX, Legacy GT, & Mazda 6.
Since we had the baby. I drive my Prelude (Almost 78K miles) back and forth to work 6 days a week and that's it. We used to take it everywhere on the weekends, but it isn't the best thing to use as a family hauler. I've gone from driving 20K miles per year to 12K.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
Congrats and good luck with the baby!! Sorry about you prelude...
I guess adding LSD (What is LSD?)would be fine. No tugging at the wheel is ok for me. I guess a less complicated AWD system for honda would be ok for those in the snow belt. It'll also shut that AWD fusion up and out. IT ANNOYS ME!!
There's nothing to be sorry about. Except that I got caught this AM with a dusting of snow on the ground and my Z Rated Yokohama AVS ES100 Tires. That was scary. White knuckle 5mph driving until I got out to the main road. Had my snows mounted this PM! Prelude still runs great. It looks good (I only get it washed once every 2 months, maybe) I do get complimented on it a lot for a 5 year old car.
LSD = Limited Slip Differential
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
I meant sorry about the :"I've gone from driving 20K miles per year to 12K." bit.
I owned a 1996 blue honda prelude type-S in grand turismo 4 once and i kind of made it into a AWD! Yes I know it doesn't count but hey it was still INCREDIBLE and almost felt real at times!!
Honda could have made some big $$$ off the prelude if they would have added a soft top cabrio to the model! VW did that with the beetle and that sparked some interest. But the beetle was a "chick car" and stopped many sales on that alone. Honda, not so much. Maybe we'll get another prelude when nissan's skyline comes back! Hopefully with a coupe with rear passenger room and a drop top model!! If marketed with a a sporty model and an elegant model (Think mercedes C class)... I"M EXCITED ALREADY!!
that Honda could bring in a lot of sales just by offering a Civic Convertible. Nothing fancy, just a power folding soft top, a $22,000 base price for the LX model, and you'll see a lot of young women who want something more reliable than a VW New Beetle coming in and taking a look.
An Accord Convertible might work, but I doubt they'll do it before they build a new sub-$50K Acura convertible...
An accord or acura CL would make great convertibles. The accord for G6, anything toyota or nissan can cook up and EOS and CL for C70, 9-3, A4, clk, ect. A 4 seat convertible is what honda needs to bring small families into the showrooms.
Hopefully, one of the features of the '08 Accord will be an abundance of noise supression materials--something Honda is NOT known for, in my experience as a Honda driver since 1984.
Hopefully, one of the features of the '08 Accord will be an abundance of noise supression materials--something Honda is NOT known for, in my experience as a Honda driver since 1984.
Wow...someone on a Honda forum actually admits Hondas are noisy. I'm with you...I love Hondas but they severely lack soundproofing.
My only complaints about my old '03 Accord EXV6 was the road noise & choppy ride (besides a few mechanical failures). The car had the best interior ergonomics of any that I've owned + it was very quick & smooth engine.
I drove a '07 Hyundai Santa Fe last month and it was very quiet on the highway. You needed earplugs to drive our '06 Odyssey afterwards.
what you are used to. I usually get an Accord as a loaner car when I bring my Prelude in for service. The Accord feels like it rides on air compared to my car.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
I got some goodyear assurance comfort treads for my accord and they really smoothed the ride. Downsides are 1-2 mpg less and don't handle as well as the michelins.
you dont know any thing.i have test driven lexus,bmw,audi,nissan and infinity.every single car have some kind of road noise.Accords are the best and long lasting cars.I own a 94 accord with 250000k on it and it has less or no noise then alot of newer cars.i own 89 accord with 365000k on it and is super quite.so dont be wasting your breath on meaningless conversation.
Dear ahsanman99, Please share your extensive experience in your Accords and from your test-drives in other makes. BUT, please respect the opinions of others. Regards, The rest of the members on this board
Consumer Reports agrees with my "meaningless" conversation. Practically all of the Honda lineup had notes regarding above average levels of road noise.
This is public forum where we are entitled to post opinions, if you don't agree with them, write your argument in a polite manner.
have been known to have more road noise than other cars, and this is evident in my 2002 Odyssey and my 1999 Civic, which both can get pretty noisy on the highway.
have been known to have more road noise than other cars, and this is evident in my 2002 Odyssey and my 1999 Civic, which both can get pretty noisy on the highway."
Does it help to eliminate the road noise in your Civic and Odyessy by having the radio on in the car so you don;t hear the road noise as much?
I have an 02 Acura CL(Base) myself and I don't hear any noises except for the wind when the wind is really blowing. Maybe Acura's are quieter than Honda's.
Indeed. My friend from HS has a 2001 CL Base model and it more muted in the road-noise department than any Honda I've witnessed. Too bad about the rear-headroom in that one though
I must say, Hondas have gotten quieter in the last couple of years. My 2006 Accord is the quietest Honda I've ever been in, quieter than our 2003 and lightyears ahead of my 1996 Accord.
I havent test driven one but am interested if incentives are good on the outgoing model. Is it quieter than pre 06 models? Any info from Honda itself to indicate such? I agree that in general Hondas were much more noisy than Toyotas. This from my experience of 99 toyota and 00 honda. Things might have changed now. But flipside is that hondas gave a tad bit better gas mileage. Must be due to lack of 100 pounds of sound insulation.
"Is it quieter than pre 06 models?" The 2007 Accords are virtually identical to the 2003 through 2006 Accords except for minor trim and color variations. The big changes will come with the 2008 model year. No, Honda isn't about to tell you anything about minor sound level differences.
"Hondas were much more noisy than Toyotas" Not so. Accords are not designed with as much sound deadening and have sportier suspensions than do Camrys. But they are very far from being "noisy". That's a relative judgement, since in a comparison between Cadillac, Lincoln, Jaguar or Mercedes, one may be noisier than another. But the owners purchase cars for many reasons. Sound level (without the radio on) is just one.
I just hope that Honda keeps offering the 2007 six speed manual transmission with what ever six cylinder they offer for the 2008. Although I do find it amusing that the automatic is a $1200.00 CAN dollar option over the manual for the four cylinder models. The six speed manual transmission is $700.00 option over the automatic with the six cylinder. Thats a mystery as a manual tranny costs less to produce. I think we can thank Nissan with the Altima for starting this manual transmission trend.
I plan on waiting until the 08 Accord comes out before making a purchase
FYI The latest comparison test with an Accord and the updated competition, the Accord still took top honours with the Altima in second place. The Camry placed well back and had quality problems with interior trim pieces.
I think in the haste to be number one in sales world wide, Toyota's quality is slipping. This is coming from a Toyota fan. Honda is looking good. :shades:
The discounts seem to be pretty attractive right now, and "noisy" is a relative term. Almost any brand new car will be considered "quiet" if you're upgrading from a 10 or 12 year old car....
my 2006 Accord LX sedan is A LOT quieter than my 1996 Accord I traded in for....but yeah....has a little bit of road noise and damn...the ride is kinda stiff, but I'm actually getting used to it. Makes me feel like I'm driving a sports sedan.
The new Altima is a hot car, except the interior is a bit over-done and it's leaning toward the tacky side, like Hyundai. The new Camry is severly good looking too, compared to the Accord, on the outside. The accord has a nerdy outside presence, but the interior is awesome. As far as resale value and reliability, Honda always wins! My friend has a new Altima and I have an 06 Accord sedan and wouldn't trade him cars for 5 miutes, unless I was picking up some poon tang down the block
EXACTLY! I think our collective keesters are becoming BUICKFIED. God forbid a car manufacturer lets in alittle road noise and road feel. I hope Honda never takes that essence out of their cars or they will just be one of many, that have (Do you hear that Toyota and BMW). I won't even talk about G.M. It is what made the Datsun 510 such a great car. Darn I'm showing my age again.
Wow, just look over the internet about the 2007 Camry. I had considered switching to the Camry after MotorTrend, but after really looking a the internet complaints on the 2007 Camry, WHY would anyone even consider buying a Toyota Camry ever again??? I have high hopes that Honda will not let its customers down as badly as Toyota has. If it does, then there really is hope for the resurgence of the American automobile companies return to power.
I had considered switching to the Camry after MotorTrend, but after really looking a the internet complaints on the 2007 Camry, WHY would anyone even consider buying a Toyota Camry ever again???
Because the internet can do two things:
1.) Sensationalize an issue by magnifying it (if 3 posters are unhappy with their cars, we can easily fail to realize that there are 400k+ 2007 Camry owners out there, not reporting at all.
2.) You can't believe everything you read. There will always be naysayers of a car just because they had a bad experience long ago, who will lie to get people not to buy a Toyota or any other brand, etc...
The 2003 Accord had teething issues (rattles, Radio LCD Display problem, V6 transmissions) but they were worked out, and the Accord has been a great car for both me and for my family. I have had none of the issues that I read about, although my dad's 2003 had the LCD go out.
Remember, first year models are always more problematic than established model lines like the five-year old Accord platform.
By the way, I'm not making excuses for Toyota, I actually am in a three-Honda family. No Toyotas in our house.
My Accord is a 2002 and is the best Accord I have owned. I have become a believer that,if you have a choice,it is better to buy in the 3rd or 4th year of the model run. They seem to cure the defects and just screw them together better after a few years on the same model. Just my personal experience.
The best time to get a car is in the last month of the second MY. Most issues have been worked out and you should get a break on price. It will also stay that way for another 3 years.
Not necessarily. I have 1998 Accord, one of the first ones built in its generation. With over 169K miles, I've yet to hear anything rattle. It still drives (and for most part, looks) like a new car. Hard to tell its age by looking at it (although, worn leather on steering wheel where I put my hands are perhaps the only indicators).
Glad you got a good one! Maybe my 02 just happened to be a good one also. My other 2 Accords were purchased earlier in their model runs and were also very good. This one just seems better. I believe that consumer sampling tests indicate that there are more defects in at least the 1st year of any model's run.
Good idea... With Honda, that would mean buying right before the MMC though, and I typically can't resist holding out for the MMC and whatever new features it might bring. (in the case of my last Honda purchase, I couldn't resist going for the 2002 Odyssey instead of the 2001, to get the 240 horsepower engine, 5 speed automatic, and Side Airbags.)
Both you and thegraduate are correct. I also was looking hard at the '07 Camry, but decided against it after learning of recurring transmission defects in several, but by no means the vast majority, of its V6 models. Decided I didn't want to roll the dice and take a chance on getting a problem car. Chances are, you wouldn't have a problem. Each individual purchaser must make that decision for themselves. As to the resurgence of American automobile companies, I wouldn't hold my breath, but that discussion belongs in another thread, so enough said. I'm not a Honda-head, or a homer for any other make. I just want the best car for the money, and right now the '07 Accord is looking better and better, because I wouldn't be surprised to find the '08 will have first year issues as well, perhaps not as pronounced as the Toyo, but issues none the less.
I went for the early edition of the Mid-Cycle refresh. No issues of reliability/quality like some first-year models can show, and a new rear-end look that is very different from the 2003-2005 models.
The price wasn't a whole lot higher than a 2005 model would've been a year before, either.
It's just a matter of WHEN you need the car, WHAT you are willing to pay, and WHERE your priorities in vehicle quality and its "new-factor" lay.
MMC is the 4th MY in the 5 year cycle. Usually, the MMC is a mild makeover. This gen Accord had one of the most extensive MMCs due to the poor design of the rear end. It is very rare to change sheet metal during an MMC. Even with the much better rear end the Accord numbers have not returned anywhere near the 400K/yr mark. Making major drivetrain changes are also very rare during a model run in this category.
You wrote; "MMC is the 4th MY in the 5 year cycle." Actually the 2003 model was the first of the seventh generation Accords. The 2007 is the last, and is the 5th model year of its generation.
Comments
Having the 6-speed option in a v6 with leather and all the bells & whistles keeps me in an Accord despite the current bland exterior. Keep that and give it the 2008 face?? I do not see any competition on the horizon for that!
For all the 'style' of the Camry or Fusion, neither put a stick shift in anything except the lesser optioned models.
???????
Do you have a TL and drive a TL every day? If you did you'd see this blanket statement about the TL's torque steer is awry. Torque steer is evident in ANY high HP FWD vehicle. In the TL it is mitigated (at least in the 06 + versions) by new software. Its also mostly apparent in the manual transmission versions which make up probably only 5% of all TLs.
You only have to deal with torque steer when you're steering hard and accelerating hard simultaneously which isn't very often. Even then I'd hardly call it suffering.
I put 19000 miles on my TL in the last year and can count on 1 hand the number of times I was leery of torque steer. FWD comes with the territory when you buy Honda/Acura.
Your last sentence, I add SAAB to that and subtract the RWD s2000 and NSX.
-Cj
A great device to help torque steer is a mechanical LSD which most companies are reluctant to put in their cars (save for the Civic Si, BMW M Cars...).
I'm anxiously awaiting the new '08 Accord. My wife drives a 2000 Mazda Protege ES with almost 80,000 miles. About 4 months ago she gave birth to our beautiful baby boy. He's go a lot of stuff for somebody who is only 25" long. Right noew the Protege is good for the 3 of us. But I feel like we may out grow it in a year or 2. I've had an '06 Accord as a Loaner car (when the Prelude goes in for service) and I've been impressed even with the pretty basic 4cyl LX they gave me. The new Accord will probably be at the top of my list along with the TSX, Legacy GT, & Mazda 6.
Since we had the baby. I drive my Prelude (Almost 78K miles) back and forth to work 6 days a week and that's it. We used to take it everywhere on the weekends, but it isn't the best thing to use as a family hauler. I've gone from driving 20K miles per year to 12K.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
I guess adding LSD (What is LSD?)would be fine. No tugging at the wheel is ok for me. I guess a less complicated AWD system for honda would be ok for those in the snow belt. It'll also shut that AWD fusion up and out. IT ANNOYS ME!!
-Cj
LSD = Limited Slip Differential
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
I owned a 1996 blue honda prelude type-S in grand turismo 4 once and i kind of made it into a AWD! Yes I know it doesn't count but hey it was still INCREDIBLE and almost felt real at times!!
Honda could have made some big $$$ off the prelude if they would have added a soft top cabrio to the model! VW did that with the beetle and that sparked some interest. But the beetle was a "chick car" and stopped many sales on that alone. Honda, not so much. Maybe we'll get another prelude when nissan's skyline comes back! Hopefully with a coupe with rear passenger room and a drop top model!! If marketed with a a sporty model and an elegant model (Think mercedes C class)... I"M EXCITED ALREADY!!
-Cj
An Accord Convertible might work, but I doubt they'll do it before they build a new sub-$50K Acura convertible...
~Cj
A Limited-Slip Differential.
Wow...someone on a Honda forum actually admits Hondas are noisy. I'm with you...I love Hondas but they severely lack soundproofing.
My only complaints about my old '03 Accord EXV6 was the road noise & choppy ride (besides a few mechanical failures). The car had the best interior ergonomics of any that I've owned + it was very quick & smooth engine.
I drove a '07 Hyundai Santa Fe last month and it was very quiet on the highway. You needed earplugs to drive our '06 Odyssey afterwards.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD, 2025 Toyota Camry SE AWD
Please share your extensive experience in your Accords and from your test-drives in other makes.
BUT, please respect the opinions of others.
Regards,
The rest of the members on this board
This is public forum where we are entitled to post opinions, if you don't agree with them, write your argument in a polite manner.
Thanks.
Does it help to eliminate the road noise in your Civic and Odyessy by having the radio on in the car so you don;t hear the road noise as much?
I have an 02 Acura CL(Base) myself and I don't hear any noises except for the wind when the wind is really blowing. Maybe Acura's are quieter than Honda's.
Indeed. My friend from HS has a 2001 CL Base model and it more muted in the road-noise department than any Honda I've witnessed. Too bad about the rear-headroom in that one though
I must say, Hondas have gotten quieter in the last couple of years. My 2006 Accord is the quietest Honda I've ever been in, quieter than our 2003 and lightyears ahead of my 1996 Accord.
With the Odyssey, just turn the volume knob a little higher, and problem solved.
A friend's 03 MDX had less road noise though, so maybe Honda adds extra soundproofing material to Acuras.
I agree that in general Hondas were much more noisy than Toyotas. This from my experience of 99 toyota and 00 honda. Things might have changed now. But flipside is that hondas gave a tad bit better gas mileage. Must be due to lack of 100 pounds of sound insulation.
"am interested if incentives are good on the outgoing model"
http://automobiles.honda.com/tools/current_offers.asp?Function=new
"Is it quieter than pre 06 models?"
The 2007 Accords are virtually identical to the 2003 through 2006 Accords except for minor trim and color variations. The big changes will come with the 2008 model year. No, Honda isn't about to tell you anything about minor sound level differences.
"Hondas were much more noisy than Toyotas"
Not so. Accords are not designed with as much sound deadening and have sportier suspensions than do Camrys. But they are very far from being "noisy". That's a relative judgement, since in a comparison between Cadillac, Lincoln, Jaguar or Mercedes, one may be noisier than another. But the owners purchase cars for many reasons. Sound level (without the radio on) is just one.
I plan on waiting until the 08 Accord comes out before making a purchase
FYI The latest comparison test with an Accord and the updated competition, the Accord still took top honours with the Altima in second place. The Camry placed well back and had quality problems with interior trim pieces.
I think in the haste to be number one in sales world wide, Toyota's quality is slipping. This is coming from a Toyota fan. Honda is looking good. :shades:
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
http://www.hondacarindia.com/images/media_center/2_1024_768.jpg
In Canada we have the Acura CSX (based on the Civic) which has those same headlights as in the india picture, and is more upscale than the Civic.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Because the internet can do two things:
1.) Sensationalize an issue by magnifying it (if 3 posters are unhappy with their cars, we can easily fail to realize that there are 400k+ 2007 Camry owners out there, not reporting at all.
2.) You can't believe everything you read. There will always be naysayers of a car just because they had a bad experience long ago, who will lie to get people not to buy a Toyota or any other brand, etc...
The 2003 Accord had teething issues (rattles, Radio LCD Display problem, V6 transmissions) but they were worked out, and the Accord has been a great car for both me and for my family. I have had none of the issues that I read about, although my dad's 2003 had the LCD go out.
Remember, first year models are always more problematic than established model lines like the five-year old Accord platform.
By the way, I'm not making excuses for Toyota, I actually am in a three-Honda family. No Toyotas in our house.
As to the resurgence of American automobile companies, I wouldn't hold my breath, but that discussion belongs in another thread, so enough said.
I'm not a Honda-head, or a homer for any other make. I just want the best car for the money, and right now the '07 Accord is looking better and better, because I wouldn't be surprised to find the '08 will have first year issues as well, perhaps not as pronounced as the Toyo, but issues none the less.
The price wasn't a whole lot higher than a 2005 model would've been a year before, either.
It's just a matter of WHEN you need the car, WHAT you are willing to pay, and WHERE your priorities in vehicle quality and its "new-factor" lay.
You wrote; "MMC is the 4th MY in the 5 year cycle." Actually the 2003 model was the first of the seventh generation Accords. The 2007 is the last, and is the 5th model year of its generation.
MY 03, 04, 05 new design
MY 06, 07 MMC
MY 08 new design
rinse and repeat. :shades: