A hatchback would be cool. The amount of hauling I do with my Tercel winter beater hatchback is impressive. The Mazda 6 has a hatch back version, and is in contention to replace our family car. We have been looking at the Altima, V-6, 270HP with a 6sp manual and cloth interior for $31,500 CAN MSRP. The Altima comes reasonably loaded without all the fluff. Honda hopefully will bring a V-6 manual without all fluff and gadgets for a reasonable price to be a contender.
I hate fluff and gadgets.
leather- cold in the winter( even with seat heaters), hot in the summer. Seat warmers- Fire starters Stability control- If you need it, your driving to fast for road conditions ABS- See above line and add - also too close to the car in front. You can also stop in snow and gravel faster without ABS. Traction control- Your foot comes as standard equipment and doesn't cost you anything more. Sunroof-Price a new one for when the seal gives out and water comes in. Navigation system- I already know how to get to work and play. Mapquest on your printer is a hell'av'lot cheaper. Bluetooth- could be useful as long as the standard doesn't change. Homelink- I don't have a garage door to open up. Compass in mirror and auto dimming- you got to be kidding right.
The real concern I have with all these gidgets and gadgets is maintainence and cost of repair. I would imagine that some of these systems are ganged with others, so if one system packs up it will take others out with it. Adding to the cost of repair as the mechanic has to check all to find fault. Have you checked on the price of a ABS pump with Traction and Stability control lately? How much does a rear view mirror with a compass and outside temp cost if your kid wacks it? :confuse:
I keep my cars for longer than the average. :shades:
I would agree with your comments on fluff and gadgets except Stability control and ABS. Where I live 95% of the town freaks out on there way to walmart you would think that the store was gonna walk off on them;} Watch out on a friday afternoon or a sunday. You will either get cut off, rear ended. I would rather drive in chicago any day. I would really like to see the gas mileage improve as well as an I-4 hybrid.
Do you live under a rock or something? I mean seriously, in this day and age. You really have some backward thinking, there have not been any incidences of heated seats starting fires and there are a lot of cars with them, ABS/Stability Control/Traction Control, not likely to cause any problems and can actually help you out a lot. Moonroof seals leaking? Maybe in the 70s and early 80s, not likely in 2007.
Why not add to your list a few other items.... Disc Brakes, why stop better when drums will get the job done! Multi-reflector Halogen Headlights- Just cost more than sealedbeam old fashion type Air Conditioning- It's cold up here in Canada, I have no use for it. Front and Rear Defrosters- People can just get out and wipe em down themselves Power windows- people are soo lazy 6speed transmission- I can drive with a 3 speed manual, a 6 speed will cost a ton to replace Tachometer- another waste of money, I can shift w/o it Cloth Seats- Bring back the nice cheap vinyl seats, easy cleanup too Safety Glass- It's so expensive, I want the non-safety glass back, would make the car much cheaper Airbags- again, why do I need safety equipment, I am the best driver out there Seatbelts- Jeez, see above line Remote Controls and power door locks- People are so lazy!
Well I agree with [poorcruzer] , when looking for cost cutting or easy to care for cars, as my previous cars were equipment much as he described. I have never been in an accident, and this is a decade and a half of driving. I now have all the safety stuff, and would assume Honda is better off putting it on their cars, but too am in no need of fluff. I owned a base PT before the Honda Accord SE V6 and while the two are no comparable cars as one to one, they both got the job done. Sure remote control door locks come in handy , but I got by with a lot of cars without them I chose to avoid the moon-roof, as it can be trouble down the road, takes away 2.3" of head room, and serves no real purpose.
This time around I got a car with the important to me extras, like 4 wheel disk brakes, and the automatic transmissions due to countless stop lights and traffic leading to shifts of only a couple gears. But, I can see if a person wanted a basic car, with no fluff at all, how it could be right for that person. Don't know why you unloaded on this person for just stating an opinion on what is important in a car.
I think we all could live without power windows. And in some cases be better off while doing so.
As I start buying a little more expensive cars, as years roll by, perhaps I will be getting more and more fluff along the way. So far no leather seats though. Loren
I used a web site a few months ago that gave price comparisons within a geography. When model and trim/color etc was selected it showed what features had price premiums. Not sure how accurate the prices were - but was good for relative valuations.
Don't remember the site address - getting ready to buy another car and if anyone knows of the site - I'd be interested.
Might be useful for some of the posters asking geography price questions also.
Don't know why you unloaded on this person for just stating an opinion on what is important in a car.
Not sure what you mean, I was just pointing out how it's a little odd in this day and age... I guess we should go back to carb engines too? It's just progress
"I have never been in an accident, and this is a decade and a half of driving. I now have all the safety stuff, and would assume Honda is better off putting it on their cars, but too am in no need of fluff"
I agree about the fluff part, but there is a number of convenience items I wouldn't live without. But I realize my definition of convenience might be your definition of fluff. Power windows? Haven't bought a car without power windows since 1990. Fluff to me might be a ML stereo on the Lexus, or the backup monitoring systems now available on a number of cars. But other people might consider them necessities. Depends on your point of view.
Disk brakes are not fluff as they perform better than drum, but drums are in some situations (gravel,mud and salt corrosion) are better to have on the rear than disk brakes. Look at any Ford and Chrysler product and you will see why my OLD sealed GLASS beam head lamps produce the same light over their entire life than peering through a gravel, dust pitted yellowed lense. How much does it cost to replace an old seal beam? Twenty bucks? How much is your dulled and pitted multi reflector? My nineties Bonneville had the best of both worlds with a multi reflector that had a glass lense. The clutch and slave cylinder in a three speed tranny would probably be the same to replace as a six speed, if they still made them. How many people even know what a tachometer is? If your a half decent driver, you do shift with out looking at the tach, but people so use to automatics wouldn't know that.
How many kids last year died with wind up windows?
You didn't hear me rant about safety items or performance items as I could get by with a four cylinder if that were the case. It is the electronic fluff and electronic nannies out there that make people believe that they can drive like Mario Andretti and that their cars electronic nannies will bail them out if they do something insanely stupid.
Not everthing that is new and "IMPROVED", is. It is often the case that it is cheaper to produce and install and their are people that will pay for it wether they need it or not.
I am just hoping that Honda will make a V-6 with a manual tranny stripper with safety in mind for a resonable price. If I could get wind up windows all the better. :shades:
Well the current SE-V6 accord does not have leather, seat warmers, sunroof, navigation system, bluetooth, homelink or mirror compass. That's most of your requirements right there. To get rid of the stability and traction control, you'd have to go down to the 4 cylinder. And the ABS is standard on all accords, so you'll just have to get used to that or keep driving the older cars.
Read the specs carefully. To get the manual you have to get the EX-L V-6 6MT, which has everything the EX-L V-6 has, which is leather and seat warmers and home-link and traction contol and stability control etc etc.
I got the SEV6. Too bad they don't make that model with the stick, like ya want. As for the Stability Control, it seems to be a good safety device, and soon to be mandated for all cars sold in USA, so having it adds to the value of the car down the road, and it does work. I don't see the value of moon roof, with 2.3" less head room, and I too did not need leather seats. As for cell phone use, it is only for occasional use for me, and mostly while parked. I certainly could care less about Bluetooth. Don't even like the name What is that condition? Does Bluetooth occur after eating blueberries?
While I love the V6, the i4 tested Accord, was pretty impressive. Ever consider the i4 with a stick? Loren
Ah ha, well you see, I don't drive poorly built cars, so for me multireflector headlights work well and it costs me a fraction of what a sealed beam costs to replace and the light is significantly better!
Welcome to 2007, you might as well give in because it's only going to get more and more feature packed as time goes on.
Heck I used to ridicule the Escalade guys who had backup sensors, they came std on my Armada and guess what? I can parallel park 100x better with them than I could without them, and I park daily in Manhattan.
Let me get this straight. The host of the Honda Accord site- the most fuel efficient manufacturers of vehicles in the world, drives a gas guzzling massive SUV in a city whose only chance of going off-road is through Central Park or over a curb.
I have deleted what I wanted to say in order to remain civil.
I don't think Edmunds assigns forums to its hosts based on what vehicle each host drives home after work.. The hosts on these forums all seem to be well-rounded and open-minded car enthusiasts. And remember, if an SUV driver often has 2-4 passengers, he/she is getting better mileage (per person) than 1 person in a 4cyl Accord........
I was initially excited about the Accord diesel (for 2008 or 2009). But realistically, I'd settle for a bit more power and economy from the trusty 2.4L.
The 2008 Accord took a lot of styling cues from Volvo. I like it.
Yup look up on the top it'll tell you what host is for this particular discussion, I'm actually for Motorsports and Tuning. Also I'll justify to you why I have an SUV....
6000lb Race Car Trailer 9000lb Cigarette Boat
Both of which can't be towed by a Prius Also I only move my truck for Alternate Side of the Street parking, I take the train to work from Harlem to Wall Street each day. Oh I also drive a 1990 Nissan 240sx 5MT with 200k miles, when I'm not driving the truck.
I didn't realize I had to justify it to you guys here on Edmunds, but there it is!
Wrong . . . Price your multi-reflector headlight assemblies, not the replacement halogen or xenon bulbs, and you will find a sealed beam headlight is substantially cheaper (by at least a factor of 10). And, what does a sealed beam headlight have to do with a poorly-built car?
For pity sakes, folks - to each his own! If someone wants to drive a large SUV and they can afford it, that's their business. If someone is so exasperated with new technology, there are plenty of bare bones cars out there to buy - and always will be as long as there is a market for them.
We're all different. Different needs, different mind-sets. Thankfully we live in a country that can supply us with automobiles that satisfy any particular need OR desire. If you can afford it and want to drive a Silver Spur, who am I to find fault.
Paisan is correct. The safety items that are becoming more and more standard are here to stay. Personally, I don't think that's a bad thing. Remember back when airbags were first being introduced and some vehicles only came equipped with a drivers side airbag? How incredible was that? You're driving along and have a head-on collision with a drunk driver and you survive because of the airbag but your wife dies in the crash because she didn't have one!
The 2008 accord must have the 6spd Automatic Shiftronic transmission. Having that would make it so much fun, and add a whole new sportiness to it. I don't know how to drive a manual, and I have driven cars with this, and its alot of fun. I hope they offer this feature. Even the new Sonata has this feature, and I didn't realize it did, til I turned it back in for a test drive. It was awesome, makes any 4cyl that much more fun. Imagine a honda 4cyl or 6cyl with the shiftronic. Does the new 07 camry have this feature?? This is a must for honda!!! I know I could learn the manual, but I like the automatic. Do you think there will be a wait list on the new accord?
The 07 Camry does have the 6AT; however, interestingly enough it has the same MPG numbers as the larger Avalon which is equipped with a 5AT. Go figure.
Yes, exactly, but the shiftronic would be nice for me, I do not know how to drive a manual, so this would be the closest option. I hope honda offers this, Most cars out there do have this option, except honda
Can't you manually choose the gear you are in? I am not familiar with current ATs on Hondas, but in the day there was D4, D3, D2, 1 and you could choose any of them. On my Armada there is no sport-shift but it's a 5AT and I can do 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 with the gear selector.
yes, you can choose the gear you want with a shiftronic transmission only, it is similar to the manual, but if you happen to red line, it will automatically move the gear up. If you do not have a shiftronic and have it in 3rd gear, that would not be good to keep in that gear. Most cars have at lease 2 gears, that you make drop down to in an automatic, the purpose would be for when you are going up a steep hill or need lower gear power. My 06 has an option on the gear that says D3, assuming 3rd gear. Most cars have couple gears to go down to. Shiftronic or Triptonic, lets you just tap the shifter, and it will shift it up or down to the next gear. Your Armada has the gears available, but not in a sense that you can just tap it into the next gear, like a sport shift. Shiftronic is seemlesslly integreted into the automatic transmission acting liking a manual, when its really not. Hondas, do not have this sport mode available, they just have the basic 5spd automatic with options of like you said, D1,D2,D3 gears, thats all.
Both the '07 Altima and the higher end '07 Camrys have shiftronic transmissions, so I would be shocked if Honda didn't offer it in the higer end '08 Accords.
Although it's an extreme long shot, here's one other convenience feature I'd love to see in the '08 Accord: a hard drive for music storage. I'm getting tired of always switching CDs!
And we still have to keep our fingers crossed for AWD.
That tapping stuff is just a "cute" way of doing the same as D5, D4, D3, D2, D1 As long as you move the shifter when you are supposed to as you would by "tapping" it accomplishes the same thing. They are all electronic anyway. I used to RACE an Automatic 1996 Subaru Impreza on the road course. Same thing on that no funky "sport shift" but I still shifted it manually when needed.
Hi all...so are the pics of the new Accord coupe concept we see now coming out as an 2008 vehicle that will get released in the fall of this year, or an 09 vehicle that comes out in 2008? Edmunds seesm to suggest it's an 09, although most stories I can find seem to say we will see the new coupe redesign this fall...
I'll have to agree with you there. I have a "shiftronic" trans on my 2000 300M, and I use it pretty infrequently. It's just not the same as a real stick. I get bored with it pretty fast, and often forget I've put it into manual mode, until I pull away from a stop light and wonder "why is this engine running so fast?". It's then I remember I'm in manual mode and upshift (or just put it back into fully automatic).
My Accord is a real 5 speed, and it makes it so much more fun to drive. If you don't know how to drive a stick, it only takes a half hour to learn. It's really easy. Heck, it only took my 16 year old daughter two lessons before she was a champ at rowing through the gears. Now if a 16 year old girl can learn how to shift, surely you can, bvdj84 ;-)
I had a single lesson on a stick when I was 16 in high school. I drove my first new car I ever bought (a 1984 5-speed Z-28) off the lot 7 years later. This was the first time I had touched a stick shift since that one & only lesson at 16. It's like riding a bike.
It really ain't that difficult. Pretty much the entire rest of the world has learned how to drive a stick.
It really ain't that difficult. Pretty much the entire rest of the world has learned how to drive a stick.
In some countries you actually get 2 different lisc. designations, if you tested in an AT you get a restricted lisc. whereas with an MT you get a full one.
Three reasons I like the automatic with "manual" mode.
1. I think it looks better than having P-R-N-D-4-3-2-1 or in the case of my wifes VW w/6 speeds P-R-N-D-5-4-3-2-1.
2. Might be useful to downshift 1 or 2 gears, in advance, when preparing to pass on a 2 lane road.
3. Marginally easier to down shift when descending a long grade.
Based on the price of 5 speed automatics in Mazda6 vs. Fusion, this feature only adds about $50 to the cost of the automatic.
Prior to my most recent car I have had manuals. To me the down side of the automatic is all about the torque converter not losing the requirement to move a lever around to choose gears (or lack of a clutch pedal). If it were available for a reasonable cost, in car I wanted, I'd probably have taken a DSG or CVT to get the automatic gear selection without the slushbox.
What's with all this fascination with wannabe "I want to shift my self with an AT" people? If you want to shift it yourself get an MT -learn if you have to. The % of people that actually use the "shift it myself feature" of an AT is just as low as in cars with the SMG/DSG trannies - probably in the low single digits. A former boss has an BMW M3 with SMG - he admitted to me that other than show it off when someone is in the car - he never shifts it himself. :surprise:
I agree, if you want to shift get the manual. Added bonus is better mpg, better acceleration, better balance (less weight in nose of car), and lower purchase price.
Also people will be less likely to borrow your car.
Actually real world numbers favor the manuals even when the EPA numbers do not (CR tests show this). Also manuals are often at a dissadvantage gearing wise (shorter gearing) for the highway to prevent a need for downshifting. Hence the sometime advantage for automatics. If the gearing were equivalent the manual would do better.
Thanks for the links. Best part for me (besides a fall 2007 release) was the inference that the coupe was derived from the sedan - hope the sedan captures some of the coupe's good looks!
One possible reason is there may be some folks like me who would like to drive a stick but there's no way my wife will learn how to drive one (her own personal preference). Personally I could care less about it. I agree, get the the real thing or forget it altogether. But for someone who wants a stick but can't get one (for the above reason), I can see where someone might settle for it as a compromise.
Actually real world numbers favor the manuals even when the EPA numbers do not (CR tests show this).
They test very few manuals. In the short list from April 2006, one automatic did beat the manual (Chevy Aveo). There were only 6 others where they listed results for both manual and automatic and manual was 1-3 mpg better.
But there is more to the story...in the test of Honda Civic from Feb. 2006 the automatic got better highway mpg and the manual better city. The CR version of city driving does not seem to match driving I typically do...never get mpg as low as they measure.
Also manuals are often at a dissadvantage gearing wise (shorter gearing) for the highway to prevent a need for downshifting. Hence the sometime advantage for automatics. If the gearing were equivalent the manual would do better.
The, imo, dumb gearing of manuals today is one reason I switched. If I had gotten a manual in my mazda6, the engine would be running 25% faster when cruising in the top gear.
Comments
http://automobiles.honda.com/future-cars/index.asp
I hate fluff and gadgets.
leather- cold in the winter( even with seat heaters), hot in the summer.
Seat warmers- Fire starters
Stability control- If you need it, your driving to fast for road conditions
ABS- See above line and add - also too close to the car in front. You can also stop in snow and gravel faster without ABS.
Traction control- Your foot comes as standard equipment and doesn't cost you anything more.
Sunroof-Price a new one for when the seal gives out and water comes in.
Navigation system- I already know how to get to work and play. Mapquest on your printer is a hell'av'lot cheaper.
Bluetooth- could be useful as long as the standard doesn't change.
Homelink- I don't have a garage door to open up.
Compass in mirror and auto dimming- you got to be kidding right.
The real concern I have with all these gidgets and gadgets is maintainence and cost of repair. I would imagine that some of these systems are ganged with others, so if one system packs up it will take others out with it. Adding to the cost of repair as the mechanic has to check all to find fault. Have you checked on the price of a ABS pump with Traction and Stability control lately? How much does a rear view mirror with a compass and outside temp cost if your kid wacks it? :confuse:
I keep my cars for longer than the average. :shades:
Do you live under a rock or something? I mean seriously, in this day and age. You really have some backward thinking, there have not been any incidences of heated seats starting fires and there are a lot of cars with them, ABS/Stability Control/Traction Control, not likely to cause any problems and can actually help you out a lot. Moonroof seals leaking? Maybe in the 70s and early 80s, not likely in 2007.
Why not add to your list a few other items....
Disc Brakes, why stop better when drums will get the job done!
Multi-reflector Halogen Headlights- Just cost more than sealedbeam old fashion type
Air Conditioning- It's cold up here in Canada, I have no use for it.
Front and Rear Defrosters- People can just get out and wipe em down themselves
Power windows- people are soo lazy
6speed transmission- I can drive with a 3 speed manual, a 6 speed will cost a ton to replace
Tachometer- another waste of money, I can shift w/o it
Cloth Seats- Bring back the nice cheap vinyl seats, easy cleanup too
Safety Glass- It's so expensive, I want the non-safety glass back, would make the car much cheaper
Airbags- again, why do I need safety equipment, I am the best driver out there
Seatbelts- Jeez, see above line
Remote Controls and power door locks- People are so lazy!
-mike
Rocky
This time around I got a car with the important to me extras, like 4 wheel disk brakes, and the automatic transmissions due to countless stop lights and traffic leading to shifts of only a couple gears. But, I can see if a person wanted a basic car, with no fluff at all, how it could be right for that person. Don't know why you unloaded on this person for just stating an opinion on what is important in a car.
I think we all could live without power windows. And in some cases be better off while doing so.
As I start buying a little more expensive cars, as years roll by, perhaps I will be getting more and more fluff along the way. So far no leather seats though.
Loren
Don't remember the site address - getting ready to buy another car and if anyone knows of the site - I'd be interested.
Might be useful for some of the posters asking geography price questions also.
rj
Not sure what you mean, I was just pointing out how it's a little odd in this day and age... I guess we should go back to carb engines too? It's just progress
-mike
I agree about the fluff part, but there is a number of convenience items I wouldn't live without. But I realize my definition of convenience might be your definition of fluff. Power windows? Haven't bought a car without power windows since 1990. Fluff to me might be a ML stereo on the Lexus, or the backup monitoring systems now available on a number of cars. But other people might consider them necessities. Depends on your point of view.
Look at any Ford and Chrysler product and you will see why my OLD sealed GLASS beam head lamps produce the same light over their entire life than peering through a gravel, dust pitted yellowed lense. How much does it cost to replace an old seal beam? Twenty bucks? How much is your dulled and pitted multi reflector? My nineties Bonneville had the best of both worlds with a multi reflector that had a glass lense.
The clutch and slave cylinder in a three speed tranny would probably be the same to replace as a six speed, if they still made them.
How many people even know what a tachometer is? If your a half decent driver, you do shift with out looking at the tach, but people so use to automatics wouldn't know that.
How many kids last year died with wind up windows?
You didn't hear me rant about safety items or performance items as I could get by with a four cylinder if that were the case. It is the electronic fluff and electronic nannies out there that make people believe that they can drive like Mario Andretti and that their cars electronic nannies will bail them out if they do something insanely stupid.
Not everthing that is new and "IMPROVED", is. It is often the case that it is cheaper to produce and install and their are people that will pay for it wether they need it or not.
I am just hoping that Honda will make a V-6 with a manual tranny stripper with safety in mind for a resonable price. If I could get wind up windows all the better. :shades:
http://automobiles.honda.com/models/specifications_descriptions.asp?ModelName=Ac- cord+Sedan
While I love the V6, the i4 tested Accord, was pretty impressive. Ever consider the i4 with a stick?
Loren
Welcome to 2007, you might as well give in because it's only going to get more and more feature packed as time goes on.
Heck I used to ridicule the Escalade guys who had backup sensors, they came std on my Armada and guess what? I can parallel park 100x better with them than I could without them, and I park daily in Manhattan.
-mike
I have deleted what I wanted to say in order to remain civil.
I was initially excited about the Accord diesel (for 2008 or 2009). But realistically, I'd settle for a bit more power and economy from the trusty 2.4L.
The 2008 Accord took a lot of styling cues from Volvo. I like it.
6000lb Race Car Trailer
9000lb Cigarette Boat
Both of which can't be towed by a Prius
I didn't realize I had to justify it to you guys here on Edmunds, but there it is!
-mike
Has nothing to do with a poorly built car, has to do with progress in technology, the lighting is better on a multireflector than a sealed beam.
-mike
We're all different. Different needs, different mind-sets.
Thankfully we live in a country that can supply us with automobiles that satisfy any particular need OR desire.
If you can afford it and want to drive a Silver Spur, who am I to find fault.
Paisan is correct. The safety items that are becoming more and more standard are here to stay. Personally, I don't think that's a bad thing. Remember back when airbags were first being introduced and some vehicles only came equipped with a drivers side airbag? How incredible was that? You're driving along and have a head-on collision with a drunk driver and you survive because of the airbag but your wife dies in the crash because she didn't have one!
-mike
-mike
-mike
Honda needs this option
Although it's an extreme long shot, here's one other convenience feature I'd love to see in the '08 Accord: a hard drive for music storage. I'm getting tired of always switching CDs!
And we still have to keep our fingers crossed for AWD.
-mike
You are mistaken. Edmunds has not contradicted that.
My Accord is a real 5 speed, and it makes it so much more fun to drive. If you don't know how to drive a stick, it only takes a half hour to learn. It's really easy. Heck, it only took my 16 year old daughter two lessons before she was a champ at rowing through the gears. Now if a 16 year old girl can learn how to shift, surely you can, bvdj84 ;-)
I had a single lesson on a stick when I was 16 in high school. I drove my first new car I ever bought (a 1984 5-speed Z-28) off the lot 7 years later. This was the first time I had touched a stick shift since that one & only lesson at 16. It's like riding a bike.
It really ain't that difficult. Pretty much the entire rest of the world has learned how to drive a stick.
>>You are mistaken. Edmunds has not contradicted that.
No, you are mistaken. Edmunds says:
2009 Honda Accord Midsize Coupe
Available: 2008
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/FVDP/Preview/styleId=100849243
Loren
I have a "manumatic" tranny on my Benz, and if you're accelerating, you might as well leave it in full auto mode instead of shifting up.
The only times I use mine is when cornering when I need to downshift, otherwise it's pretty pointless.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
In some countries you actually get 2 different lisc. designations, if you tested in an AT you get a restricted lisc. whereas with an MT you get a full one.
-mike
1. I think it looks better than having P-R-N-D-4-3-2-1 or in the case of my wifes VW w/6 speeds P-R-N-D-5-4-3-2-1.
2. Might be useful to downshift 1 or 2 gears, in advance, when preparing to pass on a 2 lane road.
3. Marginally easier to down shift when descending a long grade.
Based on the price of 5 speed automatics in Mazda6 vs. Fusion, this feature only adds about $50 to the cost of the automatic.
Prior to my most recent car I have had manuals. To me the down side of the automatic is all about the torque converter not losing the requirement to move a lever around to choose gears (or lack of a clutch pedal). If it were available for a reasonable cost, in car I wanted, I'd probably have taken a DSG or CVT to get the automatic gear selection without the slushbox.
Also people will be less likely to borrow your car.
-mike
Actually real world numbers favor the manuals even when the EPA numbers do not (CR tests show this). Also manuals are often at a dissadvantage gearing wise (shorter gearing) for the highway to prevent a need for downshifting. Hence the sometime advantage for automatics. If the gearing were equivalent the manual would do better.
The Edmunds link is probably a misprint., Here's what Gary Robinson, Honda's Senior Product Planner, says about the 2008 Accord due out this Fall:
http://vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=651899
There are two videos there, a long and a shorter one.
They test very few manuals. In the short list from April 2006, one automatic did beat the manual (Chevy Aveo). There were only 6 others where they listed results for both manual and automatic and manual was 1-3 mpg better.
But there is more to the story...in the test of Honda Civic from Feb. 2006 the automatic got better highway mpg and the manual better city. The CR version of city driving does not seem to match driving I typically do...never get mpg as low as they measure.
Also manuals are often at a dissadvantage gearing wise (shorter gearing) for the highway to prevent a need for downshifting. Hence the sometime advantage for automatics. If the gearing were equivalent the manual would do better.
The, imo, dumb gearing of manuals today is one reason I switched. If I had gotten a manual in my mazda6, the engine would be running 25% faster when cruising in the top gear.