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Comments
Do you know for a fact that Hyundai does not charge dealers for advertising? I am picking up my Santa Fe on Monday. The invoice I was shown has a charge of $622.00 for advertising. The dealer said they have to pay it, so I do. If you are correct, how can I show the dealer I have proof?
Some of us housewives just want a fun ride that our husbands will enjoy. (My husband dislikes my car because after driving his truck he feels like he is sitting on the road in my car.) Personally, when I drove my van I felt like I was driving a bus.
I'm sorry to vent but the van vs. SUV argument is getting very old!
On your second question, it's not possible to prove a negative.
If someone claims something exists, the burden of proof is on the person making that claim.
the MSRP and invoice price are readily available free information on the internet.
the MSRP on the Santa Fe amounts to (as I recall) about a $1100 to 1400 markup. A smaller markup than other comparable products, but still a markup. In my area MSRP for the Santa Fe was still less than a "deal" on a comparably equipped Tribute. (The Mazda dealer around here, by the way, hasn't had a trib on the lot for more than 2 months, and won't for several more. I think they are still taking orders for MSRP! Why not? If you can sell a car you haven't bought yet, might as well ask for top dollar. but my guess is that demand is falling.)
I have seen no standard "advertising fee." Some dealers apply it for negotiating purposes, some don't. Mine didn't. But for all I know, they might with somebody else.
dealers receive holdback dollars on quick sales.
what is "a fair" price depends upon perception. What's fair for me, may not be for another.
you can only negotiate with someone if you are prepared to leave the table. If you gotta have it, you will pay what the seller wants you to.
these new SUV's are selling quickly right now, so it will be hard to negotiate a price (whatever that price is) that is less than the seller knows he can get from somebody else. Some dealers seem to be capitalizing on that market.
things may change as inventory builds, or if demand slips. I think the price will fall later in the year, but nobody really knows.
If you can wait, and a price is more than you want to pay, you might as well keep looking. Why argue?
there is always someone who gets a better deal than you.
Why is 4wd so much safer?? Except for taking off, or driving thru deep snow, 4wd does little. After snow snorms, a majority of vehicles in the ditch are 4 wd. Why?? - overconfidence! If you do no spin when taking off, you often do not realize how slick it is. Back wheels having power to them do not eliminate slidng, or help at all when stopping. I recently was driving on ice when a 4wd Suburban passed me going way to fast. 10 minutes later, his vehicle was 100 yds off the road, rolled several times, and he was dead. 4wd was the cause of this. He had no clue how slick it was and his vehicle slid just as easy as any fwd vehicle on the road. Once he started sliding, he could not stop any easier either!
I am not knocking 4wd! It has its place. However, don't be fooled into thinking you are safer. If you believe that, you are driving too fast for the conditions and you are a danger to everyone else!!
leigh8: Of course you are right..and YOU ARE probably fun at the annual x-mas party - not to mention you look way-more cool in your Santa Fe than the housewives in their minivans! Enjoy your new car!
1postle: Naw, I'm not a car salesman. Like everyone else, I just did a bunch of research and drove everything a couple of times because, regardless of price, buying a car is very subjective and you have to feel the car is right for you or what's the point? However, I did get the dealer to show me their invoice which had the fee's I mentioned earlier - (yep, even the advertising fee). I don't have the figures with me now but I believe Edmunds had the invoice price at 19,187 for the LX FWD but the final dealer cost after adding the dest. fee/Advertising fee/& options for my car was around 20,499. So that's where I started my bargaining.
khj: I'm sure you are a smart shopper just like most of us on this chain probably are. I'm not sure what you mean by "they quoted me one price & offered me another"..say what?? Also, what do you mean "they can put anything in that advertising fee section & they did"..?? Who's 'they'? Hyundai or the dealer? The invoice I saw was the real deal from Hyundai that had the fee's I stated above. The bottom line is that we all want the best deal we can get but I only pin the 'greedy' tag on those that add a 'dealer markup' to the MSRP.
jcgso: I think andes11 is mistaken. Dealers do get charged for advertising by the manufacturer (even Edmunds says as much - but not HOW much) so this should be considered when you start negotiating. Bottom line - have the dealer show you their hard-copy invoice!
camacle: I couldn't agree more about being prepared to walk away if you don't like their deal (this is probably rule #1) and most of what you said. However, whether a customer knows it or not, the dealer is taking into consideration the advertising fee they are charged.
harlek: I love mine too! I'm surprise at the complimentary remarks I get on it because I figured most people wouldn't like the styling. You are also right-on about 4wd. It reminds me of the short time I lived in Colorado when many of the local snow-driving experts found themselves in the ditch and us dummies from the sunshine states stayed on the road! Obviously, the local folks that had it together stayed on the road too but it's more a 'driver thing' than a '4wd/2wd' thing!
To those of you that have a trade-in - try NOT to have one! First of all, you can get much more selling it yourself (yeah, it's a hassle but I made $2,000 more than the dealer was willing to pay me for mine). Also, the dealers play with what they give you for your old car to make it look like they're really giving you a deal on the new one. So, you really never know just how much you paid for it (most likely more than MSRP!).
By the way, I don't claim to be an expert on awd's but I've owned two 4x4 FJ40 LandCruisers (the old style looking ones) which are about as rugged a vehicle as there is and a 4x4 Toyota PU that I used for some hardcore off-roading in the states and Baja so I know a little bit. Maybe that's why it amuses me when someone thinks they're cool because they actually take their AWD CRV on dirt roads!! Hang on to your hat Tilly, we're going off-roadin!! (just watch out for that old geezer up ahead in his Caddy..).
HUNTER36: Meaning - I was quoted on the phone $350 over invoice until I walked into the dealership & they added $579 adv. fee which was never stated to me on the phone. I went through all the numbers previously with this same dealer on the Mazda Tribute before I saw the Santa Fe. They added up to the penny on the Tribute. But when it came to the Hyundai - the adv. fee appeared.
This forum is to educate each other - all I'm saying is not to take any dealer at his word. Do your homework.
Best of luck to all you Santa Fe'rs & soon to be Santa Fe'rs!
HUNTER36: Meaning - I was quoted on the phone $350 over invoice until I walked into the dealership & they added $579 adv. fee which was never stated to me on the phone. I went through all the numbers previously with this same dealer on the Mazda Tribute before I saw the Santa Fe. They added up to the penny on the Tribute. But when it came to the Hyundai - the adv. fee appeared.
This forum is to educate each other - all I'm saying is not to take any dealer at his word. Do your homework.
Best of luck to all you Santa Fe'rs & soon to be Santa Fe'rs!
Reminds me of the time the steering gearbox on a 67 Chevelle SS went out on me driving down the road.
Would like to hear more on the advertising cost, does Hyundai pass on a similar fee on their other cars in the lineup?
With regard to the advertising fee, I offered to pay $500 over invoice when bargaining at my "no haggle" dealership. He instantly said "yes" but then showed me an "invoice" with the advertising fee, saying he paid it so I would as well. The overall price was about $450 under MSRP and I was tired of looking so I said okay. My conclusion is that with regards to the Santa Fe, your main concern should NOT be invoice plus, but MSRP minus. Find the lowest price and don't worry how the dealer calculates his own cost. Use your lowest cited price as your starting point: this is not very hard since there are so few options on the Santa Fe that it is easy to compare apples with apples.
Finally, I do have a last bit of advice for potential buyers. Hyundai really has not gotten its quality control down on Santa Fe. I have driven over a half dozen, and each rides a bit differently. Some are noisier (growl upon acceleration), some (many) have more or less serious vibration problems, some have weird brake pedal pressure problems (like mine). On the other hand, all the features that are pluses that have you looking at the vehicle remain there and do lead to a decent driving experience, especially given the competition. I would therefore suggest that you do consider the Santa Fe but extensively test drive the specific vehicle you might buy PRIOR to purchase. Decide whether the flaws are so serious that even if they were NEVER fixed, they on balance are not so bad that they would dissuade you for buying altogether. On the other hand, since Hyundai's history of building cars of questionnaire quality and reliability is a buying consideration (which obviously led to the long warranty - which is great as long as the car doesn't remain permanently in the shop, there are parts to fix the cars, and the cars do get fixed!), it would certainly be better for Hyundai to look more closely at their quality control processes and not allow questionnable vehicles to be put on dealer lots, even if that does lessen supply and profits.
Has anyone had similar experiences?
I think Edmunds should make it a little clearer that the Adv. Fee is added on top of the Invoice Price that they are giving us. Afterall, they make it clear there is the $435. destination fee so, even if the Adv. Fee isn't always the same, they should at least make it clear this fee is should be added to the Invoice Price to get their true cost (again, forgetting about the holdback).
I just look at this buying process as a game and don't take it personal. The dealer is out to make as much as they can and I'm trying to pay them as little as possible. Once I saw the invoice and became aware of the Adv. Fee then I had to put that in the equation. I ended up paying about $500 under MSRP so feel that I did ok. Whether someone pays a little less/more isn't really a big deal if you plan on having the car for a while.
The bottom line is that we (buyers) are the ones with the money and they know that once we walk out we aren't likely to come back. I didn't have to use that tactic this time but have in the past to let them know it wasn't a big deal whether or not I bought from them or someone else...or, even bought that kind of car. I think they have a sixth sense that sniff's out impulse buyers so if you are one, try and not act too giddy because you look like raw meat to a lion if you do!
Another hint to you guys/gals that haven't bought many cars before, let the salesman know that you are also considering brand xxx (in this case, the Tribute or RAV4 etc.) so they don't think you're already sold on THEIR brand.
IncrediBill: I had a 2002 (76) too! I always wished I had a Tii though!
However, I don't think you bought an Santa Fe LX. In Calif., I know you paid at least 7% ($1400 or so) sales tax and a little over $300 vehicle registration plus probably $40 bucks doc. fee. So, if you subtract that $1740 or so from your out-the-door price of $20,128 it means you got it for about $18,400 which is unlikely because that's quite a bit less than dealer cost! If you actually DID get it for that price then you definitely got the deal of the century!
Bill: Just saw your correction! You still got a great deal!!
Good luck to all of you present & future Santa Fe owners! I think it's the best deal around.
the Hyundai dealership you got your SF from
and ask this question tomorrow morning:
Does Hyundai Motor America/Hyundai Motor Company charge/bill your dealership
for their advertising cost?
If the manager answers yes, then get his/her
FULL name and post the names of the dealership and manager here.
Can you do that for us?
Legacy assuming I only drive on paved roads.
Regarding your question to convince you to buy the Santa Fe, I would like to say that we are not car salesmen here. We are expressing our opinions about the Santa Fe and not convincing people to buy or not to buy. What I like in a car may not be what you like or want. It is a subjective decision. Whether you are convinced or not is not our concern nor our job. You need to make your decision. If you think the Subaru is better, go for it. You can read opinions to see if the Santa Fe is what you want or dont want. So talk to a Santa Fe salesman to convince you and come back to read owners' opinions here.
BTW, I'm going to install my medium burlwood wooddash today! I got it from www.exoticwooddash.com for $200! I'll try and post pictures at a later date.
1.Better view is safer
2.Higher roof mean less head banging and back strain putting out two year old into the car seat in the middle of the back seat (now have Mazda 626)
3 If hit by another SUV at least your not at eye level with the bumper.
4. No need for the bulk/size/extra seats of a van
5.In case you do get in that snow or more likely heavy rain the AWD or even FWD may help.
6 Weight and height of Santa fe make make for more safety than the light, low Mazda 626
7.Privacy glass is great to keep sun out of child's eyes.
8 Lots of storage compartments
real air vents.
9 Vans to us are just ugly boxes but to each his own
to tomsr- Subaru? I won't denigrate them.But, my local Honda dealer also is the local SUbe dealer, and one of the mechanics told me that subes are good, but not excellent. For example, my CRV was one of only 8-10 CRV sold in the past three years that has been in for warranty work! He called the CRV the most trouble free car ever made by Honda. On the otherhand, he said SUbe can't compare. They get lots of them in for work, and often, there is a wait for parts and customers blame the dealer. he said that they are no worse than domestics, probably a little better, but they can and do have problems.He also said that even if he, a mechanic, were to get the Sube I6 VDC, he would buy a service warranty because the system is complex with expensive parts. I have questioned the quality of Santa Fe. In quality, the SUbe is closer to the SF than the CRV. My point is... at the level, the SF would be a better buy.At my work, one person has had two Subes and loves them, another had one that was a lemon and hates them.In the low 20's, I think the two best choices are the SF, for size and features, and the CRV for quality and reliability. Compared to those two, Subaru gives the least of both.
I have not had any problems and I have an hour compute to and from work. In regard to the person who has vibration - were is it located? I thought my SF was doing it to then what I figured out is that it was my cd jewel cases rattling in the slot below the CD/Radio.
I'll keep everyone posted on how I'm doing with it.
Has anyone seen the new Saturn SUV it may be worth waiting for.
Thanx
peace of mind and that is priceless.I paid $995
for 7 years 100K miles waranty covering everything
except cosmetics when I bought a new 98 Acura but
I don't expect to use it.Of course the other option is to have the cash set aside in case
something does break.It's an insurance policy!
Purchased a Black GLS which now has 600 miles on it. (Our 1st SUV). My girlfriend had no desire for an SUV; we had a Toyota Celica GT. Now I can't get her out of it. We went for the Hyundai 10/100,000 extended warranty ($1000) because of the 1st year syndrome. We figured the price per year was worth it.
So far we have no complaints. Its not as fast as the Celica but I'm actually impressed with its pickup, especially if you keep the revs up. We have had several people stop and do a doubletake when they see the Hyundai Badge. One friend saw it and said "You must be doing pretty good to afford a new Lexus" I pointed out the Hyundai nameplate, much to his amazement.
I read an epinion by Bobmazda regarding the tinny(sp) sound of the door closing. I don't know what vehicle he was looking at but I'm impressed by the "thunk" it makes and am pleased with the fit and finish.
Well I post notes as to how it goes.
http://www.t-h-c.org/cgi-bin/iviewer/imageFolio.cgi?action=view&link=SantaFe-Images&image=1770_3.jpg&img=36&tt=