Stories from the Sales Frontlines

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Comments

  • mac24mac24 Member Posts: 3,910
    Define "wins".
  • coneheadssuckconeheadssuck Member Posts: 10
    Wrong sir...........YOU would be the one buying the vehicle and losing money from DAY ONE......I will be the one counting my profits.....no matter how small they are......THANK GOD FOR THE CAR BUSINESS!!
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    I suppose you walk to work since it seems you never bought a car.
  • drewbadrewba Member Posts: 154
    By your definition, the buyer would be a loser in every single transaction for every single product.

    I thought that I enjoyed the teriyaki chicken I had for lunch today. I guess I was wrong, I was actually a loser because the restaurant made a $2 profit. Trust me, that chicken depreciated far faster than a car. The residual is worth nothing.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,247
    A lot of hostility resurfacing. Can those of us who are purveyors quell it for awhile? Like I said, we host this topic because we're interested in the salesperson's perspective. But the whole "Dealers are Stealers" vs "Buyers are Liars" thing has been done & dusted. Both can lie. Both can try to "steal." Some buyers are desperate. So are some salespeople.

    But let's leave room for the possibility that both can win, OK? Buyer gets a product for which he paid a reasonable market price, seller makes money to feed & house family.

    We're here to be entertained by stories, not to get hostile & point fingers.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • steine13steine13 Member Posts: 2,828
    Please don't "YELL" by typing in caps all the time. It makes my head hurt.

    For many people, a car is indeed an investment. It gets them to their job, it gets their kids to school, it gets them to the beach... that last one isn't exactly a money maker, but it can sure feel worth it.

    So we customers are counting our "profits", too... but what does that matter to you..? It's not a competition.

    It's been a while since I've encountered hostility in the buying process. I don't like it, and I'd be going elsewhere. And I'm not a grinder; I pride myself of being able to get a deal -- or get complimented out -- in 15 minutes or so.

    There is no need to get worked up over everyday cars, and I don't have money for the others.

    (Now my '85 Chevy van, on the other hand .... ;-> )

    Cheers,
    -Mathias
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,617
    anyone DARE to comment?

    I'll comment. I agree a buyer just needs to go in and make an offer (or try to get a quote with a price in mind however you want to do it). The price is the important thing not how you got to it so I would leave any other number out of it.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    In addition to price, the product is important. That is why some cars are MSRP cars and others have to be rebated to sell. In high end (thank god) sometimes the driving experience outweighs the price.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,617
    ya but who ALWAYS wins?????? The buyer or the seller? answer me that..........

    Both, simply because the only way the sale will happen is if both sides feel they benefit from the deal. If either side thinks they are losing they wouldn't enter into the deal.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • joe131joe131 Member Posts: 998
    Hahaha!
    I expect you just laugh at them when they ask for free stuff after its too late. It's not your fault their timing is all wrong. If the buyer waits until after the deal is made to ask for the "free" stuff, he is not likely to get any and probably realizes he should not expect any either.
    Why would a dealer, particularly on a done deal which netted very little profit, be persuaded to give anything free to the customer after the money is paid and the papers signed? Any customer who asks after the deal has already been done is asking way too late and should not expect any free stuff at that point. But they may ask anyway, not really expecting to get any. Nothin' to lose, right?
    Usually those buyers who ask for stuff free after the sale are just a little bit unhappy with themselves for not asking for it before the deal was final, when they had at least a little chance of getting something thrown in to sweeten their side of the bargain. (Smacking themselves in the head and lamenting, "Man, I could have had a V-8!"
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,617
    I am going to say thats a poor assessment as me buying the car allows me to make more money and avoid other costs that would exceed the cost of the car.

    In other words at the end of the day I make and keep more money simply because I bought the car.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • joe131joe131 Member Posts: 998
    The dealership may consider it a win because it gets rid of a car in exchange for at least a little profit (or meeting some quota for some other benefit). The car salesperson though, judging from some posts on here, might feel he lost big time if he does not get the commission he was hoping for or feels is "fair" considering the amount of time he spent with the customer.
    My guess is that some time after the sale there is more often buyers' remorse than sellers' remorse.
    What do you all think?
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,617
    In addition to price, the product is important.

    This is so true, thats why a buyer has to do their research. I would never even think that I could get a super charged Land Rover Range Rover Sport for anywhere near invoice (FWIW I think I might be lucky getting it for a grand or less under sticker).

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • joe131joe131 Member Posts: 998
    Hahaha!

    Another salesguy admitting the government mentality?

    This is TOO funny!

    (If you don't like an offer, tell the sales manager to reject it. But that's probably not exactly how it works, eh?)
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,617
    My guess is that some time after the sale there is more often buyers' remorse than sellers' remorse.
    What do you all think?

    I have been in sales and can say that at times there was a sellers remorse but it went away quickly as I needed to work on that next sale. In short doing my job and working towards that next sale minimized any seller remorse if there was any.

    On the buyer side that is about it, they have their car and now has the time to think it over. Especially when you have all that time driving the car home and going over some stuff. Lots of time to think yourself into buyers remorse.

    In short as a seller one sale is just a small part of a bigger picture and you move on, for the buyer thats the entire big picture and there's nothing more except time. Thats why you will get buyers remorse and rarely any sellers remorse.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    No he doesn't mean after the papers are signed he means after a customer has agreed on a price but before papers are signed. This happens all the time when you can't spot a delivery. The next day they will call and try to get free stuff thrown in.

    If it is just something little like a bit of gear or extra floor mats or something then we usually say ok. The problem is that sometimes people think that since we gave them 25 buck worth of free stuff that we will give them 500 dollars worth of free stuff.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,727
    In the City yesterday, a 26 year old guy test drove a Nissan Murano. He forced the salesman out at an intersection and drove off with the car.

    About an hour later he showed up at the dealership and tried to walk off. The salesman identified him to the police and the guy was arrested.

    Why did he go back to the dealership? He realized they had a copy of his license.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra

  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    image

    Which is why you ALWAYS get a copy.

    Did you get my email?
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,727
    Sure did! Thanks again!

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra

  • suvshopper4suvshopper4 Member Posts: 1,110
    One more user name for my 'scroll by' list.
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Member Posts: 2,882
    Wrong sir...........YOU would be the one buying the vehicle and losing money from DAY ONE......I will be the one counting my profits.....no matter how small they are......THANK GOD FOR THE CAR BUSINESS!!

    I hope you are better at showing your disdain for us customers when you are negotiating with them. I see you just joined so I'll give you some advice. Most of the buyers that monitor these fora are quite educated. But you wouldn't enjoy doing business with them. You'd get a mini.

    So lighten up and tell us some sales stories without talking down to the very people that provide you with a living.
  • thenebeanthenebean Member Posts: 1,124
    it means, since there is no ignore options to block your posts, that he is just going to scroll past them. this is a forum for stories from the sales frontline - not who deserves what profit etc, etc. if i want to read about that, i'll visit any of the other 5693 forums on this website. i'd personally like to hear some sales stories on here...

    -thene :sick:
  • geffengeffen Member Posts: 278
    Are there any sales stories out there? This customer vs salespeople postings are getting a bit old in my opinion. :shades:
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Yes, I'll comment.

    Since this is your first day in TH, I think you really ought to go back into the archives and spend about a week reading old postings in order to bring yourself up to speed.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    When the RR Sport was first introduced, I had a couple with about a 3 month order that finally arrived. It was late when they arrived to take delivery. The paperwork and delivery went fine and they seemed pleased if not bubbling over with the purchase. After going through the car with them, I went inside to lock up. As I was leaving, they were still sitting in the car in the parking lot. I walked over and they assured me everything was OK. The next morning the car was still there. When I reached them by phone, they said the wife had second thought and they wondered if we would release them from the deal. Of course we did and that car sold the next day. That is the most dramatic case of remorse I have seen.
  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    Wow, I have had people freeze in my office before, sign everything until it is contract time and the they just freeze up, allot of times you have to start the sales process all over again.

    I would rather have that then a reader though. I hate readers. Not because I am hiding any thing, we are a fully disclosed office, but damn it takes along time to read every piece. Half the time they don't even know what they are reading.
    I have one customer who when I know he is buying something I print all the paper work before he gets here, then I sit him down by his self and tell him to find me when he is done.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    always read what you sign. always
  • thenebeanthenebean Member Posts: 1,124
    This is my 1000th post, and i wanted to share it with my good buddies here on the sales frontline :)

    so anyone got a good sales story to help celebrate?! ;)

    -thene :blush:
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    Hip HIP HOOZAY!

    Attagirl. Keep posting.

    -Moo

    P.S. I'll share something late today.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    For most of our banks, we use a standard "Rocky Mountain Bank note" contract. We are a simple interest state. I once had a customer who wanted to negotiate some clauses in the contract. I also showed him (in case we went that way) our captive's contract. Again, he wanted to negotiate the contract. I told him many times that these were state approved loan docs. Finally, I said have your lawyers call the bank lawyers. He signed. Since all the docs are Federal and/or state approved, Read the numbers (buyer's order and contract) to make sure they are correct, but if you read every word of every document front and back, do not complain about how long it took to do paperwork.
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,236
    for all you buyers out there. Don't be so quick to use the invoice ploy to get a car deal. Most dealerships will have you out on the street if you start off saying that you know what invoice is.

    LONG SIGH!!!!!!!!!

    For better or worse, invoice prices for cars are all over the place. You can even find them here at Edmunds.

    It's a good negotiating tool for the buyer....not so good for the seller.

    A buyer would be foolish not to do the research to find out invoice and incentives. Now, whether you want to sell for invoice is entirely up to the dealership. Just understand that some dealerships can and will do that, though.

    If you're willing to let your customer walk, that's entirely up to you. Knowing the market for any car, and what your competition will sell for, behooves both the buyer and the seller.
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • tazerelitazereli Member Posts: 241
    OOOooo...is that the story you've been promising for the last two weeks? I think the moratorium on that should be up.

    Regards,
    Kyle
  • thenebeanthenebean Member Posts: 1,124
    yeah moo, come on and share already! ;)

    moo - have you driven the new altima coupe yet? i am tempted to go to a dealer to take a peek at it. i'll let them know i am not buying, but i'm just a nissan nut. :blush:

    -thene :)
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,247
    Some posts into the Euro Delivery discussion. I've been kinda negligent as well, but we need to not just use this discussion for every conversation. We have tons of 'em.

    I'll try to be more diligent about moving posts to more appropriate discussions, but it would be nice if we didn't have to and could just say, "pretty please" to staying on topic :)

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    Knowing the market for any car, and what your competition will sell for, behooves both the buyer and the seller.

    (I see posts 12617 thru 12619 are gone, so maybe I missed something when I blinked.)

    I was going to ask, how much are you willing to bet that 'coneheadssuck' ain't gonna get that. ;)

    edit: now I see 'kirstie's' post about the missing posts.

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    I hate readers.

    If you are saying that most people do not read what they are signing then that is very scary!

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    Actually now that I think about it is is true. Most people don't read the contracts, at least not the intial bill of sale.

    I sold nearly 400 cars and I can maybe say that a maximum of 3 people actually read the contract they signed.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    We disclose all the terms and numbers, but most people will not read all the docs in depth. As we said, they are state and/or Federal approved and required. I once had an engineer read every word of every document. The closing took 2 1/2 hours.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    This article may have interest - also LR Chronical has new sale rumors.

    http://www.topgear.com/blogs/planettopgear/053-setting-the-record-straight/
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    The closing took 2 1/2 hours.

    That's a bit excessive. I read all the documents but it only takes a few minutes. You just have to focus in on the essential items and "skim" the rest. Either read them at the dealership or take them home and read them at your leisure. Boomchek's stats are scary and may partially explain why so many people end up in financial trouble!

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    really, then he was perhaps reading challenged. reading every word of a home contract and the associated paperwork...maybe...i could see that.

    but for a car? i honeslty doubt it.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    You said the key word with Skim - there is a big time difference between skim and read in depth. Most people skim and the paperwork takes 15-20 minutes with chit chat.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    but for a car? i honeslty doubt it.

    I wouldn't do that but it could be an option for someone hellbent on savoring each and every word.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    He had an advanced engineering degree, so I doubt he was reading challenged. He was inquisitive and asked a question about every other paragraph. The paperwork 9at least here) has gotten voluminous over the years. A trade with lien now adds about 7 documents. All the state and Fed disclosures, warranty contracts, etc. can take time. Just grab a manufacturer's extended warranty contract, a buyer's order front and back, and a loan contract front and back and read it in depth and ask numerous questions and time it.
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    Yes, it's the same story. It's pretty brutal, you all with have a wonderful laugh at my expense.

    I have driven the coupe. It looks very good in my opinion. Same engine as the sedan, so nothing real mindblowing there, but a very nice looking vehicle. Don't bug the salesguy too much. :P

    -Moo
  • british_roverbritish_rover Member Posts: 8,502
    That is a good article.

    One billion dollars a year is a lot of money to give up on just to get rid of Jag...

    But if all the sales projections say jag is going to continue losing a couple of billion dollars a year for the next several years then I guess the math is the math.
  • thenebeanthenebean Member Posts: 1,124
    i wont ;)

    i would have gone to the dealership i used to work at, but no one i worked with is still there, as it has been bought out by another company. oh well!

    and i'm chomping at the bit to read your story! I don't usually check this board on weekends, so i want to hear it before i shut down for the weekend!! ;)

    -thene
  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    If you are saying that most people do not read what they are signing then that is very scary!


    1% Read the paper work, 20% skim the paper work, the other 79% take my word for it.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    the other 79% take my word for it.

    You left yourself wide open on that one but I'll pass! ;)

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    One billion dollars a year is a lot of money to give up on just to get rid of Jag...

    But that one billion isn't quantified as gross profit, net profit, sales, et al.

    More than likely it's gross profit. Unless Ford breaks it out, we'll never know.
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