Stories from the Sales Frontlines

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Comments

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...81% of GMAC loans were for terms greater than 60 months!!"

    Heaven help us all! I can remember when 36 months seemed like forever.

    Richard
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I have a friend from Jr. High who owns a home in Ventura CA. Nice neighborhood two blocks from the ocean.

    She said two years ago, it would have sold quickly for 800,000. Now she said they would be lucky to get 300,000.

    Worse yet, she said there are a lot of foreclosures in their neighborhood and the houses ae sitting empty. Those yards have goe to weeds and the whole area is looking trashy now.

    Lucky our area hasn't been hit that hard. Probably 10% off here.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    When I was a kid, I remember my parents were just appalled that some frioends of theirs had just bought a car on a 48 month contract.

    " THAT'S FOUR YEARS!!"

    Of course, my parents always bought Buicks, paid cash and kept them ten years.

    Now, the usual car loan is for 60 months.
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    The norm at my dealership (chrysler) is 84 months financing on new. Especially now that leases are gone, and people still crave that low payment with a new car, the only way to do it is to stretch the term.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    Does the BMW use ceramic pads?

    Yes, ceramic replaced asbestos.

    Here is some information about BMW brakes from garageboy, (a bmw expert along with our in house expert roadrunner)

    If you asked me what I like most about the BMWs I drive, there is no doubt that I would answer "the brakes". The brakes are the main reason I own my cars, one of the reasons I won't sell the cars, and the most important safety system in my car. BMW brakes have helped me stay alive. That's not bad for a system that was designed some time in the late 1970's!

    Important information on why rotors warp a lot sooner and 25k is normal

    Due to changes in the laws regarding what materials may be used in brake pads, brake technology has advanced. Nonetheless, BMW owners (and owners of every other make and model) have discovered that today's advanced brakes can be considered analogous to a double-edged sword. They perform beautifully. However, the rotors can warp and cause the steering wheel to shake.

    Garageboy says:

    Replace all four rotors and pads with stock pads. From a dealer. They're relatively inexpensive (cheaper than American and Japanese cars!!). So do all four.

    For more see;
    garageboy

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    The norm at my dealership (chrysler) is 84 months financing on new.

    That is incredible, but it is the only way to get the payments equal to a lease. The payments are going to go on longer than the car, and it will be hard to get any equity in the car to make it worth something on a trade in. Something's wrong with this picture, but I guess the auto companies will worry about it in 5 or 6 years.

    Meantime, it must be my lucky day, I got a check in the mail for $300 that can be used for a new Toyota. Well, I'll just drop what I am doing and get down there and see what I can buy...................

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • verdugoverdugo Member Posts: 2,288
    $300,000. homes that are now worth $90,000? Or $1,000,000. homes now worth $300,000? Any of you guys seeing home prices going down by this much where you live? If they were down this much there would be a stampede of people wanting to buy them.

    I'm a bit late to the party, but here's the story in Sacramento, CA.

    Houses that sold for $300k~$350k 2 1/2 years ago are now selling for $140k~$160k. Houses are on the market for only days, and they get multiple offers. :sick: :lemon:

    We bought at the end of May 2006, which shall forever be known as the top of the market. We were "conservative." We bought a house that we could pay with only one salary. Our mortgage is half of what we were pre-approved for, and we put down almost 30%.

    Now our house is worth around 60% of what we paid ... and we haven't too many foreclosures in my neighborhood.
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,402
    "...and 25K is normal..."

    When I had my Eclipse in for a free brake inspection at about 8K miles they said the pads were still like brand new. The road-tests estimate 100K life-span.

    On the other hand, the best I've gotten out of my Chrysler is 40K and recently a lot less.

    Maybe I'm just a very careful driver compared to BMW drivers. :blush:

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,402
    "...Here's the story is Sacramento..."

    Here in upstate NY my local area has been spared much of the turmoil. Prices are steady but volume is off (no more 0 down payment buyers). The little two bedroom house across the street was listed for $239K and sold for $249K (yeah, 10K more than they were asking). A developer wants to buy my little farm for many times what I paid for it and I may just do it.

    Other parts of upstate are like something out of a Stinebeck novel, but they were like that before the bust.

    To drift back on topic: if I sell my farm I will buy a new car for my wife. She doesn't care what it is as long as it's white...or blue...or red.... :sick:

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,727
    >it'd then start with a capital "I".

    Depends on which part of Indianapolis... as a former Hoosier I can say that.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • lls57lls57 Member Posts: 57
    I signed for a new house in June 2003, price $232,000. Construction was finished November 2003, and by 2005-06 similar houses were selling for $325-350k. Now, with all of the foreclosures in the area, my floor plan sells for $185-190k. This is in Peoria, AZ (Phoenix)
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    Maybe I'm just a very careful driver compared to BMW drivers.

    Personally, most of my brake jobs take place at 60k and I have gone 80k with origional brakes.

    It was JMs car, an Infinity I think that needed brakes at 25k, but even that was probably an over enthusiastic mechanic.

    I am just warning people and giving myself a heads up - not to be surprised if you are told you might need brakes done at 25k.

    I actually try not to speed, I don't want to jinx myself but my last ticket for speeding was in 1994 and it wasn't that much over the limit.......and the only reason I was speeding was while on the entrance ramp to a highway...and to get on before the big trucks got there, but it was snapped by photo radar and it doesn't listen to reason. :(

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    signed for a new house in June 2003, price $232,000....my floor plan sells for $185-190k

    It is really upsetting that the people who tried to live their lives responsibly end losing. The guys who created the problem get a baleout and get million dollar bonus's.

    They showed on the news a guy who gives boat tours of homes in Florida, formerly $1,000,000 homes for $300,000. What they did say was people in Florida don't pay state taxes. That money comes from all the tourists. And with fewer tourists, and fewer people moving into all these new homes, there will be a massive money crunch coming.
    Prices have dropped 30 and 40% already, but they expect it to get much worse.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "I got a check in the mail for $300 that can be used for a new Toyota."

    Well, my check from them the other day was for $500. Maybe they think that older people have more money. ;)

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...the only way to do it is to stretch the term."

    There are three other ways: Pay cash, put down some cash, or do without. ;)

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    So when was asbestos banned on all cars? My '06 Chrysler still had asbestos. I wonder if my '08 does?

    Richard
  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    are now selling for $140k~$160k. Houses are on the market for only days, and they get multiple offers

    Then that means that people are not asking enough and the houses are worth more. The GD media has every one scared into a panicking frenzy right now. If the houses are selling in days with multiple offeres they need to raise there prices $50K more dollars and seewhat happens. Though they may not be worth the $300K right now they are obviously worth more then what they are bringing
  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    You sure about that Richard. The asbestos brake bads on Fords went away in the late 90's
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "Now our house is worth around 60% of what we paid..."

    That is a real shame. You were very smart to purchase with 30% down, half of the approved amount, and a mortgage based on one salary. It will pay off for you down the road. After reading all of these posts, the geographic area really does have a great deal to do with it.

    Where I live is considered to be the Golf Capital of the World---#2 at Pinehurst. I remain amazed at the daily comings and goings of the corporate jets (I'm only 2 miles from the airport.) and the busy hotels. No matter how bad the economy gets, there will always be people who have plenty of money. That was true even during The Great Depression.

    Richard
  • joel0622joel0622 Member Posts: 3,299
    I stand corrected.

    In January 1986, our own Environmental Protection Agency proposed a ban on the production of nearly all products containing asbestos in this country. There would also be a ban on importing asbestos-containing products that would gradually phase down over a 10 year period, ending in a total ban by 1996.
    For awhile, it seemed that asbestos was headed for extinction. Friction material and gasket suppliers worked hard to develop nonasbestos substitutes and gradually made the transition to these new materials. Nobody wanted the liability associated with asbestos. But the EPA proposed ban was eventually overturned in the courts. One reason was that the ban would have put a lot of brake rebuilders as well as others out of business.
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    I was surprised myself. I kept getting all of this brake dust on the '06 Chrysler about three days after washing the tires. I complained to my service guy. He said that it was the asbestos. Another guy in the village told me that he had the same problem with his Chrysler. My '03 Explorer has never had that problem at all. I haven't noticed it yet on my '08 Chrysler. I sure hope that they fixed that problem.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...would have put a lot of brake rebuilders as well as others out of business."

    So much for the health and safety of the environment, right? :sick:

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    You're absolutely right about that issue. If the houses are in bidding wars now, then people need to ask more.

    It was different when we bought here two years ago. We looked at over 100 houses for nearly a year and made offers on about 20 of them. We lost the bidding war each time. Finally, we came to this house and liked it. I was determined not to lose it. I sat down with the owner and the agent in the Florida room. I told them that I wasn't leaving the house until we reached an agreement. My wife was having a stroke. There were two lookers waiting their turns in the driveway. I told the owner that I would have no contingencies, would not ask for an inspection, that he could take his time moving out, and that I would write him a check for one third the price of the house then and there. There was a long silence. The owner finally looked at the agent and told her to go tell the two lookers that his house had been sold. Why was I so brave? I had a full price offer in my briefcase for our former home. As for the inspection, I could tell that the home had experienced loving care. I did an inspection later. The house was fine. Those bidding wars can be brutal.

    Richard
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,477
    They are also troublesome as they age and they are very expensive to fix.

    My wife's 2004 X3 has 73,000 miles on it and it's only needed tires(at 50,000 miles), brakes(at 60,000) and a passenger seat SRS sensor(a warranty fix). It will be the truck my son takes to college in four years. Over 14 years and 114,000 miles my 1995 318ti track rat has needed one set of pads/rotors, a brake light switch, a thermostat, a battery, a couple of ip bulbs, and new serpentine belts and idler pulleys. Oh yeah- and four sets of tires. :P It has averaged about $50/month to operate over those 14 years. What a money pit!!! ;)

    Any they are worthless in the snow!

    We fitted my wife's 3 and 5 Series cars with winter tires and they performed great in the slick stuff. Tires are a major factor in your ability to drive any car in inclement weather.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "A developer wants to buy my little farm for many times what I paid for it and I may just do it."

    It makes me sad to see you sell it to a developer. So many beautiful, well run farms have gone to the way side during the last 30 years. The big corporate farms grow the food now, and it just doesn't seem the same. In addition, the little farms are replaced by more rows of look-alike houses. Still, you have to do what is best for you and your wife. You've worked hard and taken pride in your farm. You deserve the big profit. Upstate New York always had some of the prettiest farms in the country.

    Richard
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,477
    I actually try not to speed, I don't want to jinx myself but my last ticket for speeding was in 1994 and it wasn't that much over the limit.......and the only reason I was speeding was while on the entrance ramp to a highway...and to get on before the big trucks got there, but it was snapped by photo radar and it doesn't listen to reason.

    My last one was in 1996, my mother-in-law had suffered a heart attack and I was flying up I-71in my Arrest-Me-Red Club Sport. I had my Valentine One up and running but I wasn't using my eyes and brain to interpret all the data. Long story short, I got nabbed for 92 in a 65. Mr. Trooper was NOT happy, as it took him almost ten miles to catch up with me. And the "BMW CCA Club Racing" sticker on the rear window didn't improve his mood one bit... :P

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    Considering the circumstances, did he let you go? Also, what is a Valentine One?

    I had my last ticket a year ago. I usually get one or two a year. I keep my attorney busy. :D

    Richard
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,943
    i will just comment on the new car shopping.
    unbeknownst to my wife, i sent away for a brochure in HER NAME, for the vehicle she wants.
    so she opens it up. there are lots of shiny pictures and a coupon for $750 (thanks joel for the idea).
    i was kind of embarrassed after setting up a test drive for a certain vehicle, then all of a sudden, she didn't want to consider it. :sick:
    after looking at the brochure with the shiny pictures, as we all have been multiple times, she is willing to consider some additional colors.
    the closest dealer is open sunday afternoon, so i am hoping we can go for a test drive.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jwilliams2jwilliams2 Member Posts: 910
    My first speeding ticket was in 1960, and my next (and last) was in 1983. I had just gotten a brand new Escort Radar Detector, and was cruising along at about 85. It went off so I slowed down, and sure enough about a mile down the road a Trooper sat in the median. I was surprised when he pulled out behind me and lit me up. I asked innocently "what seems to be the problem, officer".

    He informed me I had been clocked at 87 mph about two miles back by an airplane. I had just bought the car I was driving, and thought with the Escort I could really burn up the highway. Learned my lesson.
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    So when was asbestos banned on all cars? My '06 Chrysler still had asbestos. I wonder if my '08 does?

    As I believe Joel said asbestos was to be banned over a 10 year period ending in a total ban by 1996. However, the car manufacturers and asbestos industry protested so much it has not been banned. Some manufacturers act responsibly and are using alternatives, others have not. Asbestos is extremely dangerous and they even tell you how to wash it off your wheels...wet it first so there won't be dust particles. It is dangerous in tiny amounts and is very dangerous for mechanics, working on it constantly in enclosed spaces.

    So to make a long story short, asbestos is still with us. Since there is no way to know if a vehicle has asbestos brake linings or not, it is wise to treat every vehicle as though it might have asbestos linings. And even if a vehicle does not have asbestos linings, there are still concerns that other fibers used in NAO linings may pose the same long term health risks as asbestos!
    That is why OSHA recommends using some type of wet cleaning (aerosol or a brake washer) or enclosed high efficiency vacuuming to keep brake dust to an absolute minimum. Wetting down the fibers with a liquid prior to wiping or washing them off prevents them from becoming airborne. The maximum permissible exposure limit (PEL) is now only 0.1 fibers per cubic centimeter of shop air over an 8-hour period.
    For EPA guidelines on how to minimize your exposure to brake dust,

    To see more go to:
    asbestos-ban

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    Just announced that GM will be recalling 1.5 million cars to replace spark plug holders that could set the whole car on fire. One guy had his Impala burned to a crisp and GM said it wasn't their fault. Seems they tried to use cheaper plastic instead of metal to hold the spark plugs. An item worth less than $1 will make even more people lose confidence.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    Now go back and polish up your car for today.

    That’s not as far fetched as you might think.

    One of the reasons I let the inspection garage do the brake job was because if I would have done the brakes myself it would have taken time away from doing another wax job on the Genny… that week. :D

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    Thanks for that very thorough report on asbestos. It is truly a dangerous substance. Back in the '80s, active asbestos was discovered coming from air conditioner vents in one wing of our school. My room was one of four in that wing. We were removed from the wing for a week. The EPA in lab suits and protectors had to scrub everything in the room---desks, walls, windows, chalk boards, maps, cabinets, closets, etc. All of my wonderful books had to be burned---asbestos detected on individual book pages! Students had to bring in their notebooks, textbooks, etc. It was all burned. On Sunday evening, we were to move back into the room. The EPA took a reading---no good. Everything had to be washed again. Tuesday evening we finally got a good reading. It was the nightmare from hell! We had no computers then. My lecture notes, transparencies, pictures, etc. all went to the incinerator. I went home and cried. Then I got busy working. Ten years later our school was burned down by some students. That's another story. I lost everything again. What a career it was.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    If you keep this up, you'll finally rub the paint off of the car! :P

    Richard
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 18,477
    Considering the circumstances, did he let you go?

    Well, he let me go. But I still got a ticket... :cry:

    Also, what is a Valentine One?

    See for yourself: Valentine One

    image

    Mike Valentine is a really neat guy. A car nut to the core.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
    Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
    Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,593
    The dealership uses fluids and parts specific to the car.

    So my mechanic shouldn't have put the carbirator from a 56 Chevy onto my fuel injected 2000 Hyundai?

    BTW that was sarcasm.

    Just that modern cars especially the imports are more electronic,complex and more computerized with very specific fluid and part needs which the indy guy does not know about.

    A good independent Mechanic will do what they need to do to keep up.

    Just because a mechanic is independent doesn't mean they stop learning what cars are like. Conversely just because a mechanic works at a dealership doesn't make him infalibel with that car.

    if the indy guy messes up the electronic or engine stuff big time-- he has no recourse-- he will ultimately ask u to take it to the dealer.

    Since my mechanic has his masters degree in this stuff I don't think he would get into that spot. He only once told me to take my car to the dealer and that was for something that was a TSB issue and that dealers were fixing under warranty.

    As for warranty work, my mechanic does stand behind his work.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel Member Posts: 19,593
    We have some smart people here so someone please explain this to me.

    Here is the problem. Many people bought homes they could barely afford with adjustable loans. As long as home prices remain steady or rising one can always refinance before rates adjust. However if home values go down to the point that the home value is or would be lower than the new loan amount it becomes very hard to refinance the home. If the owner cannot refinance and their mortgage adjusts then you are looking at mortgage payments increasing buy hundreds of dollars every 3-6 months. All of a sudden these people are in homes they cannot afford the payments on and cannot refinance.

    In many instances people just give up and let their homes go into foreclosure. When this happens the bank gets the home which is sometimes worth tens of thousands less than what is owed to them. They sell the home and a discount and write off a big loss.

    2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    That's a neat device and an interesting web site. Thanks for sharing.

    Richard
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,630
    . That's another story. I lost everything again. What a career it was.

    Got to give you a lot of credit, starting over again is very difficult. Asbestos is very dangerous.

    And to think we used to make stuff out of it in public school!

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    Hope you finished up your taxes.

    Finally, all my taxes (federal, state and local) are done. I know you won’t believe this but it happened again but not nearly as bad as last year with the local taxes. They didn’t withhold taxes for the first $11K + of my income because the company changed their name. :confuse:

    It took me a while to build up enough courage to ask you know who for the check book so I could write a check for 1.5% of that amount. She said, “why do you want the checkbook, I thought you said we are getting a refund this year”. I said, “we are, from the Federal guys but we owe the borough a little money this year”. “AGAIN”, she says. “When are you going to get this straightened out”? :(

    I’m just not cut out for this tax stuff. :cry:

    I better stick to giving the Genny wax jobs and don’t worry yourself about the paint being rubbed off. I use a high quality wax and rub gently. :)

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,299
    "I got a check in the mail for $300 that can be used for a new Toyota."

    Well, my check from them the other day was for $500

    Third world country checks. I got a check from Kia for 20 grand the other day! Then in small print it says I may be a winner. Other possible prizes in which I am guaranteed to win one are: 1) 52" HD T.V 2) $2,000 cash 3) $1,000 cash or 4) Grab Bag Prize .grab bag prize value ranges from $49 - $249. I can only imagine, in horror, what's inside these "grab bags".

    On the opposite side of the mailer I get to test my putting skills for 2 grand. If I sink a 10 foot putt I win. An equivalent prize may be substituted for cash. Probably a blind date with their 80 year old book keeper. The Kia dealerships around here are pretty slippery. :sick:
    2021 Honda Passport EX-L, 2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere.
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,299
    I saw that on the news this morning. My 1999 Buick Regal is covered. I've got 90k miles, runs fine, though probably about due for some new plugs, maybe they will throw in a new set of plugs for free. The least they can do for putting me at risk for being burned to a crisp.
    2021 Honda Passport EX-L, 2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere.
  • golicgolic Member Posts: 714
    You should be happy---Tell Ms. jmonroe that you beat the system..since effectively you have held onto the Burroughs money interest free!!! Were else can you borrow money for free???

    I will start in about one hour trying to figure out what MY extension payments need to be
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    You should be happy---Tell Ms. jmonroe that you beat the system..since effectively you have held onto the Burroughs money interest free!!! Were else can you borrow money for free???

    I tried that last year when I owed 1.5% on my entire gross wages. If it didn't work with that huge free loan it ain't gonna work with something less. :sick:

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    84 months is nuts!

    You aren't doing your customers a favor by doing this.
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    Oh, no! You didn't do it again! Well, it isn't your fault the company changed its name. I know you dreaded telling you know who. Sounds like you escaped with minimal damage.

    Like you, I'm not cut out for the tax bit. Last year I paid pre-estimated taxes and still owed money. This year I got pissed off at the IRS and refused to do pre-estimated. Now I'm getting a refund. Go figure. I just organize the stuff, keep folders, and hand it all to my accountant. Any one my age should be allowed to earn any amount and not have to file tax returns. Allowing Social Security to keep 10% of my earnings is a real crock of s---! On top of that, they get a chunk of my pension. They repeat the process with my wife. Oh well, I do get to live in America. That's a very big plus.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...and a coupon for $750."

    That Joel had a good idea, didn't he? Good luck this time. Let us know all of the details.

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    Good gosh. Those Kia people are a real piece of work, aren't they?

    Richard
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "I got a BMW for my wife. Best trade I've ever made!"

    LOL!! That was good!

    Richard
  • ventureventure Member Posts: 3,180
    You must be driving too fast in the city...and making lots of fast stops.

    It's a BMW. There's no such thing. ;)

    2025 Forester Limited, 2024 Subaru Legacy Sport

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