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Comments
You may well be right if I can get over the exterior styling (or lack of).
I can't recall hearing anything about the future of the Lucerne/Cadillac DTS platform, but it's days have to be limited, too.
Sorry, Mike, I have to disagree on this one. I have previously noted the delay in downshifting in my Azera, to which you advised that I should use the autoshift. If I want to shift manually, I'll drive my other car.
An auto trans is supposed to work automatically. BTW, I have owned lots of GM cars with the old 4-speed trans and they all downshifted when I wanted/needed them to.
When I looked at the Avalon, I seem to recall that cooled seats were close to $2K extra. I remember thinking that was a bit much to keep the wife's tail end cool. (I didn't tell her that.)
If offered on the Azera, probably would opt out of air condtioned seats due to additional cost.
Mike
Tell me about the HP snafu and Hyundai lengthening the powertrain warranty to 12 year 120,000 miles.
I have the 10/100 extended warranty.
I think the HP snafu relates to the 2002 Sonata with the 2.7L engine. The 2.7 was new that year (replaced a 2.5) and listed HP at 181. This was an overstatement. (My '05 2.7 engine is rated at 170.)
Because Hyundai overstated the HP, they extended the warranty as a form of compensation to the owners.
Personally I don't care what the HP rating is, just how the car performs when I drive it.
Plus, in the case of my wife's '02 Santa Fe, a debit card of as I recall $25-30.00. Shortly thereafter, their Fountain Valley CEO resigned and went to work for Mitsu.
I now take Hyundai's present HP claims with the grain of salt.
I am interested in a pre-owned car. Is anyone out there willing to help me to check the car's history via database such as carfax? Please kindly let me know if you can so that I can send you the VIN#. My email: john_ju_2000@yahoo.com.
Thanks a lot.
John
You can take the claims as you like, but in tests by Car and Driver of the Avalon, Maxima, and Azera, the 1/4 mile results speak for themselves:
Avalon, 280HP ( since downrated to 268? ) 14.6@99, LBS/HP.... 13.37
Maxima, 265HP.... 14.9@96, LBS/HP..... 13.29
Azera, 263HP....... 14.8@96, LBS/HP..... 14.00
I'd say if any of the above ratings are overrated, it would be the Maxima, which weighs over 100 pounds less than the Azera, but has identical trap speed.
That would be the best thing to do.
By most accounts, the Avalon's suspension is better sorted than the Azera's. It may be more biased toward ride comfort at the expense of responsive handling (except the Avalon Touring model), but the Azera reputedly does not handle small pavement imperfections as well.
As for noise, most objective testing seems to show the Azera has lower absolute noise levels than the Avalon, although this does not speak to the subjective quality of the sound that is heard. The Azera's sounds certainly have not drawn any generalized complants, however.
Hope this helps.
If you weren't satisfied with your '02 Santa Fe, why did you buy an Azera?
It's my observation that Hyundai tends to intoduce new models years on a 12 month cycle, not the traditional October 1 cycle. Present generation Sonatas hit the street around May or June of '05, as an "06." Each year since, this is about the time they introduce the "new" model year. Same thing for when the current Santa Fe or Elantra were brought out. The '06 Azera first hit the market (depending on locality) around December of '05 or January of '06. Same with the '07 Azera, (check other Azera topics to confirm this).
So, if a new model or new generation of that model is introduced in X month, we should expect that the new model year will be introduced 12 months later.
If you weren't satisfied with your '02 Santa Fe, why did you buy an Azera?
My '07 Azera has a noisy rear suspension, period. I leased my '07 Azera in October '06, so in my market the '08 is now a 14-month "cycle". I don't buy other posts that the '08's are "still at the Port", or otherwise in storage. 750 + US dealers have only sold 20,351 units in 11 months resulting in a monthly average of 2-1/2 Azera's per month per dealer. Hyundai knows their US monthly rate of sale, so where is the "glut of remaining '07 inventory" that is delaying the distribution of the '08?
Regarding my '02 Santa Fe, that post had nothing to do with product satisfaction. Read it again, I added it to a post regarding HP misrepresentation by Hyundai in certain '02 models.
I enjoy both Huyndai's in my garage and I have no serious complaints with either. My concerns are with Hyundai's third world marketing efforts and uninformed dealer service departments.
Hey Alexstore, you see the YouTube clipe with the '99 Max going up against an Azera w/the 3.3 V-6?
Maxima = 13.45 lb/hp
Azera= 13.8 lb/HP
Avalon=13.23 lb/hp
Does the extention of the powertrain warranty to 12/120000 carry over to the Azera?
If so, how does one confirm it with Hyundai US?
MT road tests
Azera 6.5
Maxima 6.4
funny Avalon 6.5
Azera 0-60 6.8 1/4 mile 15.2@93.6 263HP
Avalon 0-60 6.2 1/4 mile 14.8@96.2 268HP
Passat 0-60 6.2 1/mile 14.6@97.6 280HP
On message 3608 it shows Edmunds road test which shows the Azera 0-60 7.2 1/4 mile 15.5.To me Edmunds seems to be true numbers compared to the other tests.Either way all these cars are quick,but the Azera comes up short with the Avalon.
I know for a fact that Avalon is faster than my Max 0-60 but these 2 cars beat Azera.
I saw once somewhere( I forgot the place) Avy 0-60 6.0 and Maxima 6.1. Azera was 6.5 by same magazine.
Just because Azera has no limiter, it does not make it faster. It is very easy to remove limiter.
And, you're welcome
It was only for the '02 model year.
An auto tranny does not shift when you want it to, that's why it's an auto...it shifts when it needs to. As I said in a previous post, maybe you should take it in to the dealer and ask them to re-flash the tranny programming, reset it and take it out and re-teach it. You are aware that the tranny is adaptive, right?
Don't worry, your Max still won't blow the doors off an Azera...unless it's a GLS model! LMAO
Re-teach it, how? By driving agressively for a few weeks, just so it will downshift properly for a maybe once a week situation. I don't think so. I'm aware that it's adaptive and if it were reflashed and then re-taught, it would learn exactly what my driving has already taught it.
I know you think the Azera is perfect, and I agree that except for the downshifting hesitation under rare situations and the cheap suspension giving a somewhat harsh ride at low speeds - its a darn good car, and the best family car I've ever had.
C&D, whenever possible, test at the same track, with the same driver and correct for temperature, wind, etc. I do agree that there can be and are variables, probably the biggest is getting a car with very little miles and a tight engine. We're only talking tenths of a second here, which are probably not statistically significant.
Any car in this category with at least 250HP and weighing less than 3700 lbs will move out quite well.
You know, instead of getting smart about the situation, why don't you give the re-flash a chance! The worst case scenario...it stays the same right? I mean, you said it's only an issue that comes up maybe once a week, so is it really that bad?
I had a shifting issue when I first bought the car (from 1st to 2nd) and it did seem to down shift hard too. I took it in for the re-flash and after that...no problems with the shifting at all. I certainly have no problems with down shifts (auto or manual mode) when a big truck gets behind me. As a matter of fact, I think I may surprise them when they see a Hyundai pulling away from them with ease!
When I inquired about "re flashing" the computer for the shift pattern for the transmission, the Service Manager stated that it could only be performed when the transmission was replaced. Do you know how the procedure was performed? Was it accomplished with the same plug in computer used for checking and setting codes?
I say it on the Avalon board all the time. A few full throttle downshifts will usually cure the situation. You don't need to beat the sh** out of your car to "teach" to shift a little sooner. Like it or not.... these adaptive trannys are here to stay and the programming does help to acheive the FE we all love along with the power.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
Sounds like your service department is pretty clueless or just plain lazy. It doesn't take that much effort. I mean...mine was done DURING an oil change, so that should tell you how simple it is and how little time it actually takes.
BTW, C&D always seems to be able to extract better times that anybody else - again more of a function of 'car abuse' than likely anything else, whereas CR and Edmund's come up with perhaps the slowest (but also the most realistic) numbers, but to compare one publication's numbers with another, done at a different times etc.,don't necessarily provide any real basis for comparisons.
I think the bottom line is that folks can't stomach the fact that a Hyundai product can hang with the Japanese counterparts. In some folks' minds...that's blasphemy! LOL
All of these cars (except the V6 offerings from GM and the 2.7L Chrysler/Dodge) have more than ample power and are downright quick by most standards.
To be honest, the only thing that really holds the Azera back is it's cushy suspension. The funny thing is...that's it's deemed cushy by most and yet...most complain of it's harshness over imperfect pavement, that's an oxymoron for you. However...I think a stiffer suspension would lead to 0-60 times equal to it's competitors as time is lost when the car "squats" down on the suspension before taking off.
Anyone that has driven an Azera and really stepped on the gas pedal, can certainly appreciate the power that the engine has. Heck, even watching the Azera @ VIR on YouTube the other day...really showed that the car is quite capable.
unclear whether you are talking about 'holding back' in terms of acceleration in which case I would tell you that the Azera would be every bit as quick as an Avalon/Azera once it loses about 150 lbs. or so - not a lot- on a 3600+ lb. vehicle- this having nothing to do with soft suspensions etc. One of the things that the Koreans do need to improve on is building things lighter - historically a condition of Korean vehicles - some extra pork! And yes, you can cetianly spin that to mean that some extra weight = built better= good.
As far as 'cushy' goes, I agree that it may be just a little soft for some - my impression was that it is very much like Buicks used to be ( the Lacrosse/Lucernes are not nearly as 'sloppy' as their nameplate traditionally implies. Personally, I think a 'sports' model Azera with a tightened up suspension (and maybe another 10-15 hp) , wheel/tire package etc. , different interior treatment , is overdue.
The Azera is actually light when compared to the 02-05 Sonata. The Sonata weighed in at 3069 lbs. and is much smaller compared to the Azera. The Azera only weighs 560 lbs.more than the older Sonata did. That says a lot considering the Azera is a much bigger car with a much bigger engine as well. The Koreans used a lot more aluminum with the Azera than they did with the older Sonata.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm...an Azera coupe maybe? Can't add a cool-air intake, how about a supercharged model? That would be good for another 15-20 hp, maybe with a freeer flowing exhaust as well. More agressive wheel and tire package...I can see it!!!! :shades:
a little far fetched don't you think -handling/braking/road feel -yes - acceleration?
has to do with HP/lb. and gearing - never heard anybody or anything claim that a 'soft' car was necessarily slower than the same car tightened up a bit.
The softer suspension won't necessarily affect acceleration once the car is moving, I'm talking about getting off the line. If you took two Azeras and gave one a tighter suspension similar to that of say, the Maxima...that one would most likely get off the line quicker. While the regular Azera is squating down before take off, the one with the Maxima type suspension wouldn't have to squat as much, therefore...leave the line quicker.
Same thing with a tighter suspension aiding accelerating through a slalom. The softer suspension is going to roll more which effectively will slow you down because you can't navigate a slalom with pronounced roll at higher speeds. Tighted up the suspension and now you can navigate the same slalom at a higher speed. Trust me...it's all relative, it's called physics.