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Caravan/Voyager Brake Issues

cotero1000cotero1000 Member Posts: 1
in Dodge
I have a problem and not sure how to fix it. I am trying to change my front disc pads on my fan and my top bolt on the caliber is stuck. I can not break it loose. I have tried wd-40 and motor oil and left both sit on for a couple of hours and tried again still nothing. Does anyone have any other suggestions on how to break it loose? I would greatly appreciate any help.

Thank you

cotero1000
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Comments

  • mfahey1mfahey1 Member Posts: 419
    WD40 really isn't a rust penetrant. Try PB Blaster or something similar. Also, as long as there isn't a rubber sleeve over the bolt, try heating it with a propane torch and then spraying it with the rust penetrant. Let it cool and go through the whole cycle again. You can also try hitting your rachet with a hammer to provide a shock that might just begin to break it loose.
  • vanpovanpo Member Posts: 3
    I have '92 T&C, in very good condition despite showing 208,000 miles. The ABS has failed shutting down the power brakes. I am afraid Chrysler would charge more to repair it than the van is worth. I plan to remove the ABS components and replace them with non-ABS parts from a local salvage yard.
    Has anyone done this procedure? If so, please provide
    some details.
    TYVM, Vanpo
  • vchengvcheng Member Posts: 1,284
    I think, but am not sure, that the Bendix 10 ABS pump and other parts are covered by a lifetime warranty, no matter how old the vehicle. Of course, the fine print may mean that other parts required to complete the work may cost you, but the pump itself would be covered by the warranty.
  • vanpovanpo Member Posts: 3
    Thanks for your information, I will check it out.
    However, I do not wish to spend over $200 on a fix and
    regardless, I doubt if Chrysler will settle for that.
    Therefore I still want more information on converting
    the ABS system to non-ABS. The salvage yards are full
    of non-ABS wrecks ('91-'93)and I can get the main components for less than $100. I just need some guidance on how to install these parts so that the hookup is proper. I would like to get a brakeline diagram showing the line routing and hookup to the "combination valve".
    Thank you for any advise/information you can supply.
    Vanpo.
  • vchengvcheng Member Posts: 1,284
    ... salvage parts is certainly feasible. Most of the components should bolt right in. Although a good source for the brakeline diagram would be the factory service manual, you may have to get lucky to get one off eBay. However, proper routing is not a big issue. You may have to get a tubing bender and a flare tool in addition to generic brake line lengths, but that is not expensive.

    Remember, the brakes are critical. Please put in the time and effort to do it right.
  • vanpovanpo Member Posts: 3
    I have picked up a master cylinder (with a vacuum booster)
    and the associated switch block. I already have the tools. At 75 years age, I am not as ambitous to use them as I once was. Hopefully, I can finish the job for $150 total(parts). My experience with complex items of this nature is that they don't get better as the car ages. For that reason I want to simplify the system. I did locate a diagragm in an online subscription of a service manual for the '92 T&C (ALLDATA/AutoZone). Vanpo
  • djugglerdjuggler Member Posts: 1
    The Haynes manual for the 2005 Grand Caravan does not release until February 2007. Chilton doesn't have one either. The dealship suggests I order a shop manual for $50 (which would be nice but I need to finish the brake job before the manual would arrive).

    Obviously brakes are not rocket science. However, caliper torque settings would be nice. Does anyone have a link to an online reference for changing brake shoes and discs for a 2005 Dodge Caravan? Or even just the torque settings and words of advice?
  • diydiy Member Posts: 1
    The rear brake lines from the ABS to the back need to be replaced because they have rusted through. I discussed this with the two dealers. One says the brake line are special order. The other says the line is roll steel and must be fabricated. Estimates are $400 and $600 respectively.

    At first it appears to be an easy job of unbolting the lines at the ABS unit to the back axle. But after a second look,the ABS support bracket is in the way.

    What is involved in removing this bracket?
  • bobconstancebobconstance Member Posts: 2
    What is the proper way to remove rear drums on a 2001 caravan? What size bolts are used to remove the drum?
  • pmarypmary Member Posts: 14
    Hi ,
    I believe the (2) bolt holes in the drum face will accomodate a M8x1" (metric fine)in use with a flat bar puller where a large centre bolt pushes the drum away from the centre hub. The centre of the drum may be seized so high heat and penetrating fluid may be required (drill holes through the drum around the centre hub if disposing)to break the grip.On the backside of the drum plate remove the oval rubber seal and access the star wheel with a slot screwdriver turning the adjuster down to pull in the brake shoes to create a clearance between the shoes and inside drum. The inside parking brake cable may be slightly in the way so use a flashlight to manipulate the adjuster.
    When replacing make sure the drum is clean and spread high heat anti-corrosion compound to ease any future drum removal
  • bobconstancebobconstance Member Posts: 2
    Yes the bolts are M8 X 1.25 threads and I would use at least 2" bolts. Thanks for your help. With these bolts you can get away without releasing the brake cable.
  • pmarypmary Member Posts: 14
    The 2 threaded holes on the face of the drum can accomodate a puller being secured by 2 bolts. The depth of the holes or the thickness of the drum (face)is about 1/8"(4 threads)deep. Make sure the length of the bolts will at least exceed the thickness of the drum (face)and the thickness of the puller's arm itself. Attaching the bolts too short into the drum could easily stip the thread holes - rendering it un-pullable.
  • gjestep45gjestep45 Member Posts: 2
    Hi All -

    I have a 2000 Grand Caravan with a pesky ABS light that keeps coming on.. It is only after you drive the car a little and seems to reset itself after turning the car off... It has only 85,000 miles on it and to be honest I am not happy with it... I had it in to put in a new transmission (YES IT JUST DIED ON THE HIGHWAY 200 miles from home) In the dang thing and at that time they told me that it would need a new ABS pump.... At a cost of an other 1000 dollars... I have since been driving the Van with no reall braking issues other than no ABS... But would like to get it fixed as we will be holding on to it for a while longer...

    First question is Being a motor head of sorts, Is it possible to do the work my self? If so are there any manuals out there to make it easier?

    By looking at it it seems rather point blank easy bolt on... And then Bleed... Of couse it would need a change of break fluid... :D

    Any body done this out there???
  • casey60casey60 Member Posts: 7
    My 2006 Chryler minivan had to have its disc brakes turned at 12500km. I thinkits way too early to have this done already. Symptoms were shaking/pulsating brakes.
    Is there any recall on this or is there an issue chrysler knows about? Thanks
  • taffyh33taffyh33 Member Posts: 1
    My parking hand brake on my voyager will not hold. All cables are in good order and so are the brakes themselves. The brake lever will ride all the way up and cables do tension however I can nott find any way of adjusting them so they tension enough to hold the car. Help please!!!
  • geppetto425geppetto425 Member Posts: 3
    I have a '92 Grand Caravan LE, 171,000 miles. Need to keep it running for another 6 months if possible.

    For several months now the antilock and Brake Warning lights have been coming on, then going off after driving . I was told by my regular mechanic that he thinks there is a small leak in the ABS system. Now both warning lights are on all the time and more frequently the brakes are really stiff and hard to apply. Les Schaub says they can't fix it, thinks the Power Booster isn't pressurizing the system. (Pre-'95, models have ABS and Power Boost tied into each other so I can't just shut down the ABS system)

    I know it is probably not worth fixing if it comes to over $1000, car is not worth that much. I would like to have an extensive diagnostic test done on it that I can trust. I'm hoping that if it is just the Booster or one component of the system (a pressure switch, transducer, proportioning valve, etc....) it would be a lot cheaper to fix. I'm afraid that if I take it to the dealer they will just replace the whole thing and charge me $3,000.

    My repair manual seems to indicate it might be just the hydraulic bladder accumulator (is that the same as the booster?)

    I live near Vancouver, WA so if you know any brake guys you can trust I would be eternally grateful.

    Any thoughts would be appreciated, thanks!
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    The first thing you need to check is if you have the Bendix ABS system (I think but am not certain that your model year falls within the Bendix era). If you do it is my understanding that it is lifetime warranted via some sort of a recall or a TSB or some such. That said, the parts are extremely rare and most dealerships will refuse to work on them due to lack of parts.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • rockinputnamrockinputnam Member Posts: 1
    As crazy as it might seem,I cant seem to get the old pads out.They have little springs that hold them in place.Ive took the springs out, but still cant getem out.There is a third bolt,much smaller than the two main ones.My question is Do I have to take this third bolt out to open the caliber wider,allowing me to pull the pads out?
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    While I've never even seen the calipers of a Gen 2 Caravan, it sounds like you haven't separated the caliper from the bracket. Once the caliper (and their attached pads) are separated from the mounting bracket and rotor, the pads should slide out fairly easily (although you may need a medium to large screwdriver to help pry them off if they've been on there for a LOOOOONG time).

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • keystone2k9keystone2k9 Member Posts: 25
    Today i'm getting my van serviced. '98 Plymouth Grand Voyager with 67,450 miles.

    My mechanic told me that my brake pads are brittle and need replacement and so do the rotors. He's installing new ceramic brake pads and new rotors. Not to mention cylinders in the back needing replacement (he said a broken back cylinder caused the brakes to overheat causing the pads to become brittle).

    All in all, he told me the cost of new parts and labor would hit me at $490.00. We've been going to this guy for years and never suspected being over estimated.

    Did I get good value on all the work done?

    What has everyone paid for similar work?
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    If you've never had your brakes done, then everything that he has suggested MUST be done. Have him put new (as opposed to rebuilt) rear wheel cylinders, the drums are probably still good to go, however, while he's in there, you might as well have him replace the shoes. Another thing that is an absolute must at this stage is to have the entire brake fluid system flushed.

    As far as cost, I do my own with top quality parts (usually NAPA) and can buy all of the parts for about $175 (front pads, front rotors, rear shoes and rear wheel cylinders). I have no idea what your guy is charging you for labor and the markup on parts.

    Keep us posted.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • keystone2k9keystone2k9 Member Posts: 25
    Well I live in San Francisco, so that correlates into a lot of "brake riding" down all these hills here. The last time I got work done were the brake pads in March but those got stuck and overheated. He's installed ceramic brake pads, new rear wheel cylinders today as part of the job, and the installation of new rotors because it seems as if mine have been reshaped due to the overheating.

    I have yet to pick it up later in the afternoon when he's done and I'll be sure to ask him what else was done. (Shoes, drums, and brake fluid)

    Thanks for the insight Shipo, I'll be back on later tonight to see the final job
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    If you've gone through a set of pads since March, then you might want to consider new or rebuilt calipers as well as they might be sticking.

    If you are finding that brakes don't last very long on your van before the pedal starts pulsing while you're braking, you may be overtaxing the rotors, especially if you have the 14" wheels on your van. We have the sixteen inch wheels on ours and have the larger disks that came with the 15" and 16" wheeled vans, and even still, I was not getting anything more than twenty to thirty thousand miles per set (and as little as eight thousand on one set) before the pulsing in the brake pedal got so bad I couldn't stand it anymore. In desperation I bought a set of cross-drilled rotors (a little pricy but apparently worth it) and married them up with a set of ceramic pads. The good news here is that I now have 36,000 miles on that set and they're still nice and smooth.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • keystone2k9keystone2k9 Member Posts: 25
    Shipo

    Here's what went down:

    1. Brake Inspection
    2. Found front brake pads and rotors overheated
    3. Found right rear wheel cylinder rusted (piston stuck)
    4. Replaced front brake pads with ceramic premium pads
    5. Lube caliper sliders
    6. Replaced front brake rotors
    7. Adjusted rear brakes and parking brake
    T: $190.00 (2 hours)

    1. Replaced rear wheel cylinders
    2. Bleed complete system from master cylinder to calipers and wheel cylinders
    3. Fill system with new brake fluid DOT 3
    4. 1 Year warranty
    T: $95.00

    1. Replaced rear brake drums
    2. Adjusted rear brakes and parking brake
    T: No Charge

    -Ceramic Front Brake Pads, $105 (1)
    -Front Brake Rotors, $196 (2, 98 each)
    -Synthetic Brake Caliper Lube, NC (1)
    -Brake Fluid, NC (1)
    -Wheel Cylinders, 69.96 (2, 34.98 each)
    -Rear Brake Drums, $102 (2, 51 each)
    PARTS : $472.96
    LABOR : $295.00
    TAX : $39.02
    TOTAL: $796.98

    ?

    The van feels and drives brand new. Better safe than sorry? I feel bad for my pockets.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Well..., that's a pretty expensive brake job. Thorough but expensive. While the labor charges aren't out of line, especially for the Bay area, he stuck it to you on the parts.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • lenwicklenwick Member Posts: 23
    how can a brake control be installed
  • lenwicklenwick Member Posts: 23
  • jp4000jp4000 Member Posts: 1
    Hi, I was replacing my old brake pads this morning but encountered a problem. I changed the pads but now the van won't slow down. Everytime I press the pedal it will go in all the way yet it won't slow down the car. I think it's a problem with the brake fluid system.

    I'd appreciate all the help,

    Thanks.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Sorry, there's waaaaay too many variables that could cause your problem to be able to diagnose what's wrong with your van without seeing it. I'm thinking that you need to take your car to a professional to have the problem uncovered.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,483
    Yes, VERY tough to call from that description. Is there any resistance at all on the pedal? Did you need to disconnect any lines when you replaced the pads? Which did you replace? Front disc? Rear drum?
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • troyantroyan Member Posts: 9
    The Bendix ABS pump is all that is covered under a lifetime warranty by Chrysler... my mother-in-laws van had the same problem.But.. the thins is.. the only warranty the pump... not the bladder... Advance auto can get the part.. but it's attached to the master cylinder... and it retails for around $714. Without a new accumulator.. the pump will go bad in about 4-5 days. So... does anyone have any idea on HOW to replace just the accumlator? The local dealer said he could replace it at a cost of $330. for the part... and about $120 in labor.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Many folks with the ABS vans have decided that it is cheaper and less aggravation to simply junk the van and buy something else. Other folks have bought the parts (either from the dealer or from bone yards) to convert their vans to non-ABS. You seem to have the formula for effecting any necessary repairs.

    As for what your next step is, geez, I don't know. I suppose a lot depends upon the condition of the rest of your van and how much you want to spend.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • troyantroyan Member Posts: 9
    Welllll... i can get an accumulator for abour $50 from a local boneyard.... but the question is.... HOW do you R and R it?
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Sorry, can't tell you, I've never even seen one. I suggest that you buy a Shop Manual (you can usually find them on E-Bay for about $100). That will give you the EXACT R&R procedure.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • digangidigangi Member Posts: 2
    What size socket do I need to loosen the caliper bolts?
  • mcokermcoker Member Posts: 1
    I replaced the brake pads on the front. Think I may have missing anti raddle clips?
    can you tell me how many clips, and where they should go for each side
  • fire2827fire2827 Member Posts: 2
    I bought a 93 dodge grand caravan. i replaced front pads n rear shoes with a new lft rear wheel cylinder. brake pedal still is not acting rite. replaced lft front caliper after taking van for test drive. no help to brake pedal. the brake pedal is hard n u have to use all ur leg muscles to push brake pedal down. the reason for replacing lft side caliper n wheel cylinder was cause rear shoes where down to the rivets n front pads where down to 1/32 to 0/32. bleed entire brake system starting from right rear n final :mad: ly ending up on the front left. the brake pedal is still hard n wont stop the van. if any1 knows wht my problem is please contact me at firemen28270@yahoo.com. my head is spinning from trying to figure this out. ive talked to other mecs n 3 have said the acumulater n brake pump is bad n 3 have said the porpartionary valve is bad. PLEASE HELP
  • tkirk1tkirk1 Member Posts: 2
    Replace your front hydraulic flex lines to the calipers. They get old and collapse internally without any visible problem.
  • troyantroyan Member Posts: 9
    Check with Doge... the Bendix pump is covered with a lifetime warrenty.... that they really don't tell you about.... it retails for around $700.... the master cylinder retails for around $700 also... but THAT is NOT covered under warrenty.... you can find the pump right above the tranny.. drivers side... trace the plug to its source and dissconnect.. apply 12 volts across it... if it doesn't work... then it's shot... and doge will replace it for free.... they may also tell you that the accumlator is bad... i'd try to find one in a bone yard IF you can... I went thru 40 vans before i discovered one that had that particular braking system in it... Good Luck
  • fire2827fire2827 Member Posts: 2
    which pump are u talking bout is it the brake pump or the bendix pump? n is the plug in tht ur talking bout the bendix pump or brake pump? if io could id like to chat over the phone n when ur on the phone with me id like to try tht out so i know tht im doing it rite. please email me at firemen28270@yahoo.com. ty for the help
  • diydodgediydodge Member Posts: 3
    Hi
    I am having a problem with the ABS system on my 97 GC with 3.8 engine with 179K miles. Problem the ABS system will not activate on dry pavement. It will activate on gravel road. I have had the car to several dodge dealers. First dealer replaced master cylinder, power boost unit, new rotors, calipers and pads, rear brake work. Bleed brakes many times. Dealer did not fix problem refunded all of my money. Second dealer checked brakes system and stated "system works as designed".. So my problem is when I make a had stop the brake pedal is VERY spongy and goes very close to the floor. The brakes have been like this for at least 100K miles.. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks
    diydodge
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    While our 1998 doesn't have a spongy brake pedal, I seriously doubt that I can get the ABS to engage on dry pavement. I've heard other folks say the same thing, and I don't think I've ever heard anybody say they've ever gotten a Gen 3 van to engage the ABS on dry pavement either.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 17,483
    Well, if the van's wheels are not locking up, there is no reason for the ABS to engage.

    I am impressed so far with the '98 AWD van this Spring as our winter snow pack slowly decomposes. I have crawled it through 4-6" of heavy slush up my rather steep driveway and it pulled though every time. I expected to be stuck a few times by this point. No problems with the ABS either, and I have thoroughly tested it. :D
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Agreed. I'm thinking that it would take a no-holes barred, drop the freaking anchor kind of stop to get these vans to engage the ABS on dry pavement. ;)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • diydodgediydodge Member Posts: 3
    Hi Shipo and xwesx

    Did you miss the part of my original message about the spongy pedal??? When I do a "no-holes barred, drop the freaking anchor kind of stop" this van glides to a stop and the pedal is very close to the floor. I can also sit in my driveway and continuously press on the pedal and it goes to the floor very spongy.. I do a lot of highway driving and I must always keep a good distance from the car in front of me. I cannot find a dealer who will tell me what is wrong. I have taken a service manager to vans in his lot (in for repair) had him start the vans up and these vans DO NOT have a spongy pedal like my van. This is the manager who gave me back all of my repair cost because he did not know how to fix my van. I found this web site and figured I would give it a try here.. The ABS system does work on gravel roads. I think there is air in the ABS system but no one know how to bleed it.

    Thanks for your replys
    diydodge
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    Yup, that's why I said that mine doesn't have a spongy pedal.

    As for what on Earth could be wrong with your van, geez, there are lots of things. I'll list a few (starting with the easiest and most obvious first), many of which were hopefully covered by the shop that was working on it for you:

    1) Old brake fluid with lots of water (a brake system flush should cure this)
    2) Air in the brake lines (the above flush should have cured this too)
    3) Corroded rear wheel cylinders (assuming you have rear drum brakes)
    4) Poorly adjusted rear brake shoes (again assuming you have rear drum brakes)
    5) Corroded brake caliper pistons
    6) Old/weak brake hoses (i.e. the link between the metal brake lines and the wheels)
    7) Old or badly rebuilt master cylinder (you should never use rebuilt in this case)
    8) Brake fluid leak only under high pressure (near the braided seams by the firewall)
    9) Bad ABS controller/proportioning valve (I think it's the same unit on these vans)
    10) A cracked weld on the brake pedal mount (has the van ever been in an accident?)

    If all of these areas have been covered, let me know and I'll try to think of a few more. ;)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • leemc1leemc1 Member Posts: 1
    Hi
    I am having a problem with my brake system. I got this vehicle used and when I got it it had a brake light on and the pedal had excessive travel but the brakes worked. Then I had a friend help me bleed the system and the light went out and the brakes were fine for a couple of days then the pedal started to travel again and the light came back.
    So I changed the rear shoes and cylinders. The rear passenger cylinder seemed to have a tiny leak. And it appeared as though the side hadn't been working properly for some time. I thought I had nailed the problem down, so I bled the system and found a couple of oddities. First air continues to get into the system, and second I can't seem to bleed the rear right side properly, sometimes I get large amounts of air and other times there is a very slow flow and the pedal will not drop to the floor when I release the bleeder. All the other 3 wheels bleed proper but it seems like there is a plug in the right rear line sometimes. And lastly, I can hear a drag of the shoes on the right rear drum when I apply the brakes. so I don't believe they are engaging when applied.
    I don,t have a repair manual for this particular vehicle so I don't know if it is equipped with abs or not.
    The front pads were almost new and calipers in good shape up front.

    thanks for any help.
    Lee
    PS there appears to be no fluid loss.
  • dibbybdibbyb Member Posts: 1
    This may not help and you probably already got rid of the van, but I have had the very same problem you did except the brake boost went away (hard pedal) and didn't come back. I took it to a shop I always use and they replaced the whole brake module unit ($300 used). That didn't fix it so the replaced the boost pump ($250 used). So $900 later it worked - for two days. Now the brake warning lights are back on and the pedal is hard. When the brakes were working you could hear the pump work occasionally to pump up the air bladder bottle. So I take it back tomorrow but I don't know if they will fix it. If your's is still working, my advise to you is to peddle it fast.
    On the chance that you DID get yours fixed, could you tell me what fixed it?

    Thanks,
    Ed Flaherty
    ed at myself.com
  • troyantroyan Member Posts: 9
    Firstof all... the boost pump is covered under a lifetime warrenty for the van... no matter how many times it has been replaced.. or how many owners it has... second it it sounds like it may be the accumulator is bad... or going bad..(leaking). Chrysler doesn't warrenty that... but they also don't tell you that they warrenty the pump either.if you can find a "good" acumulator in a yard.... it just screws out... but you have to use a strap wrench so as to not crush the casing. This shuld be done at a dealer... because there are steps they have to perform to bled the system. good luck with your van
  • alan38alan38 Member Posts: 2
    1999 Plymouth Gr Voyager 3.0L

    I have changed rotors and brake pad in April this year. Starting last week, there is sqeaky noise coming from the left front brake whenever I step on the brake. It last for a while and its gone. The brake pads and rotors are new and running less than 1,000 KM only.

    Any idea what is the problem? Any experience pls?

    Many thanks in advance.
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