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Subaru Forester (up to 2005)
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Must-have for any garage.
-juice
-juice
John
I understand you can damage a torque wrench by using it to loosen heavily tightened fasteners. I've had mine "slip" when using it in this manner. Like Elissa, I also use an impact wrench to loosen mine, as well as to run them down. I do the final tighteneing with the torque wrench.
Len
Elissa
-juice
Seriously, my '05 XS is routinely getting 28+ on the highway. Might want to check your tire pressure. Calls for about 29psi.
If anything, mileage should improve with less AC use in colder weather.
BUT --> it has the aluminum engine click-click-click clatter noise at start-up. It's MUCH worse in colder weather, and takes a good 5-10 minutes to go away.
The cause is the different temperatures inside the engine... which means the clattering parts aren't fitting together just right until the engine is hot. Then they quiet down.
Subaru claims this is "normal" and says it's doing no harm. BUT this "normal" occurance happens in less than half of their cars.
This has been going on for over a year now, and I've had it at the dealer many times over this.
I am meeting with a Subaru Regional Service person at my dealer's service dept in the next few days.
At this point, I would like to sell the car - but CANNOT with that noise! (If I was shopping for a used Forester and heard that at start-up, I would RUN in the opposite direction! Wouldn't you?)
Soooooo, I will be asking them to fix it; or buy it back. I don't want the full retail that I paid two years ago... but I DON'T want to be penalized for their engine defect either!
Any thoughts?
Advice?
Experience with Regional Service Reps?
Similar Engine Problems?
Difficulties at Resale time with this engine noise?
Thank you!!
Martin
But first ask them to agree to cover any future problems that stemmed from whatever caused this symptom.
Subaru is offering a guaranteed trade-in value on cars if you really can't live with it.
-juice
How does this work?
I suppose it has to be on another Subaru...
Does anyone have experience with, or details about this program?
Thank you!!
Doesn't hurt to ask them to appraise your car as a trade, I guess.
-juice
Advice? - Get an oil analysis done and if it comes out okay, don't worry about it. If its chewing metal getting it fixed should be easily covered under warranty. If the noise is driving you nuts, get rid of the car. Its not worth the mental pain.
Experience with Regional Service Reps? - Not with Subaru's but not generally a fun time overall.
Similar Engine Problems? - See above. My wife's 03 OBW sounds like crap the first 5 minutes in the summer, the first 15 in the winter. Oil analysis says everything's fine, and she loves the car. She also doesn't know enough about engines to know good noises from bad noises. Ignorance can be bliss.
Difficulties at Resale time with this engine noise? - There was a posting a while back from someone who tried to trade their car in on another Subaru and the salesman tried to deduct several hundred dollars for the piston slap noise. The person then produced information about the number of times they'd complained about the problem at their dealers and to 1-800-Subaru. I seem to recall they gave them a better deal on the trade the next day or so.
Basically, people who know the brand won't be as concerned as those who don't.
HTH
Larry
Sounds like my situation with my wife's '99 OB. Engine sounds like a diesel for the first 10 minutes and it's annoying to my wife. I also did a UOA and it came back great.
I just switched to Castrol GTX Start Up, which contains ester basestocks that cling to the engine parts. The car seems a tad quieter and warms up quicker. Might all be in my head though. :-D
-Dennis
Steve, Host
Eric
Thanx
Rich
The $1200 dealer incentive is pretty solid, though, so now's a good time to buy IMO. Subaru doesn't do the $5000 rebate game, thankfully, because that would kill residuals.
Rich: see my response in the problems thread.
-juice
http://www.Autoweb.com/content/research/rebates/index.cfm/action/- rebatesByMake/make_vch/Subaru
Good Luck!
Elissa
Yet it cost maybe $6-8 grand more when new. Jeep owners take a bath when it's time to sell.
Resale does matter, even 7 years down the road.
-juice
http://www.Autoweb.com/content/research/rebates/index.cfm/action/- rebatesByMake/make_vch/Subaru
Good Luck!
The dealership had an XS on the lot in the color we want with 12 miles and the only option is the moonroof. I'm really not a fan of moonroofs since I had one leak in a Saturn I had about 8 years ago. Then again, it was a Saturn so... What can I expect from a moonroof in a Subaru? We keep our cars for about 10 years, so I want to be comfortable that it will hold up with no leaking problems. You definitely get your moneys' worth with this moonroof. The salesman said that he will sell it at invoice since I really couldn't care less about the moonroof.
Hopefully this weekend, we'll be new Forester owners.
The XS Premium has a moonroof, so that one probably has the Premium package.
-juice
Craig
I bought a new 2001 S Premium Automatic in 2000. It now has 70K miles. During that time, I have used a dealer (Subaru of Santa Cruz) for all scheduled maintenance.
Impressions so far:
It still feels like a new car. I was skeptical on how well the cheapish looking interior would hold up, but there have been no problems. Even the flimsy cupholders have not given me any problems with lots of use.
The engine is still as strong as when I bought it, although I do occasionally hear very mild knocking under hilly terrian, it's been doing that since I bought it.
Routine maintance at the dealer has proven to be a bit more expenisve that I expected, but I cannot complain, since I always use the dealer!
Outside of routine maintenance I have needed front brakes .. and I'm currently dealing with warped rotors again. Early on, I had to replace the axle boots (under warranty). Other than the brakes, there has been no need for unscheduled mainteance larger than burnt out lights.
I am mostly happy with how the car drives. I think it's quite peppy, and I see no need for a turbo for my puroses. It handles nice, and is fun to drive. It's quite noisy, and I have to turn up the stereo high to drown out the road and tire noise.
In the snow (I don't go often), the car is very surefooted and inspires confidence.
I plan to keep mine until 90K, and then replace it. It will be interesting to see the depreciation at that point.
As usual, thanks to everybody on this board for all the helpful insights I have gained along the way.
I get about 24 mpg average.
Would I buy one again? Yes .. I am happy with the car.
I'm curious, did your dealer ever say that you needed your fuel injectors cleaned?
I've had mine to the dealer once or twice, and they got me on that one, at about 38,000 miles. I bit the bullet, but will never know I got hosed for almost 300 bucks.
After living for several years in South Carolina and Hawaii in the Navy, I've moved to Kansas where I purchased my XT. Knowing the weather here gets a bit colder and with the more frequent opportunities to visit various family members back in Iowa, I decided to install a remote starter. The good news is that after following the manufacturer's wiring guide for the Forester, the remote starter works great and I can use the remote starter key fob to unlock and lock the doors. The bad news is I really wish I knew where to tap into to get the same unlock/lock combination of actions as the normal keychain (that is, door lock movement, horn "chirps", and the flashing hazard lights. Has anyone else installed a remote starter that uses the normal keyless unlock/lock actions or have any wiring diagrams that help (or have any suggestions on where to obtain such diagrams?)
Oh, and I'm now one of the few who probably appreciates HAL as the remote starter+HAL combo can now get my XT to a more pleasant interior temperature before I even get in.
-juice
Subaru in Australia recommend a dose of fuel injector cleaner in a full tank of petrol at each service. Depending on situations with fuel etc and experience of local conditions some dealers will leave a second bottle of cleaner in the car after service with recommendation to add it after about 3-4000 miles (half way between services).
I presume that this is a lot cheaper than an injector strip down and clean.
Cheers
Graham
Of course aftermarket leather is something you will have to price on your own.
Craig
It's been my experience that dealers seem to pay loan value (or less) and try to sell for retail. If you can get it in the middle of the two you should be doing all right (if the vehicle is in excellent shape). I recently bought a 2004 Forester XT new (manual trans, Non-premium) for 22,600. I really wanted the premium but just couldn't afford it. If there was an equivalent XT Premium on the lot it would have been a tough decision for me which to get given the price difference.
As for the sunroof/moonroof thing, I always thought moonroofs were glass and sunroofs were not. The premium has the big ol' glass moonroof.
Thanks
*$850 below factory invoice (unadvertised dealer cash) and 3.79% financing for 60 months (required $0 down) through Subaru financing (not a promotional rate)!
Knowing about Fitzmall made a big difference. I would have given them my business, but they didn't have a forester at their Clearwater, FL dealership that we liked. The pricing information from them gave me great leverage with a dealership about 30 miles from Fitzgerald.
Subaru uses 2 different AWD approaches:
Manual transmission: Power is distributed evenly between the front and rear. When slippage is detected, power is then applied in the direction of less slippage, more traction. All done via a sealed viscious coupling in the tailshaft section of the transmission.
Automatic Transmission: Has an electronically controlled coupling which without signal runs in 'open' mode. That means normally the Automatic is mostly a front wheel drive vehicle. Sensors are in place on both sides of the coupling to detect changes in speed between the front and rear. The Transmission control module does this task. When it detects a change in ratio, it applies a signal and 'locks' the coupling so front and rear are turning at the same rate during this time. They stay locked until the next time the vehicle slows below either 7 or 10 mph. (some older Legecy's suffer from a backup/parking bind when this center coupling no longer releases requiring it to be replaced).
True there are a few, very few , conditions under which the standard (no lsd) can have 1 front wheel spinning and 1 rear wheel also, but this is the exception. The add a LSD on the rear of the S models and both rear wheels can have traction together. Here you are almost assured that with both rear and 1 front powered, you will be covered under all conditions.
This is a simple overview, there is more to each of these systems depending on conditions.
That's a simple overview? ;-)
A simple overview would be all of the various Subaru All Wheel Drive systems have some power to the front and rear wheels at all times. The CR-V system is 100% FWD until after slippage occurs. :-) Some more info here: http://www.subaru.com/allwheeldrive/ver2005/index.jsp
Even though the Auto is mostly FWD it still has 10-20% of power to the rears in normal operating mode, as opposed 0% to the rears in the CR-V.
-Dennis
Of course the other thing is that the entire Subaru drivetrain is laid out for AWD from the get-go, with a longitudinal engine/transmission and the diffs and shafts lined up and balanced very nicely (ie, Subaru's "symmetrical" AWD). This is a far cry from the kludged FWD-based AWD systems most manufacturers offer (including Honda) where they tack on the AWD system to a transverse-engine FWD vehicle. The result, which we see in almost every Subaru, is very efficient packaging of the drivetrain, and lower CG when coupled with the Boxer engine's layout.
Craig
21.5k for that XT Premium is great, just check it out closely. Why'd they sell it so soon?
Nice thing about Subie AWD is they are engineered for full-time use, with a center differential that lets them work even on dry pavement.
-juice
The RX330 lets the traction and stability control systems apportion torque (meaning it uses the brakes to clamp slipping wheels and force torque to the other wheels).
In all cases, it's a FWD based platform (based off the Camry).
Craig