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Subaru Forester (up to 2005)
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Good luck, I bet if they are a one-price dealer they are laid back and will work with you.
-juice
Ken
I see the one you're in all probability talking about at the local dealer there in Fayetteville. Here's the page describing it at the Subaru USA sponsored web site for Adventure Subaru: clickhere for the description
Here's the results of my search:
Roper Subaru in Joplin, MO --75 miles from Fayetteville: no 5-speed Cayenne Red Xs
Ferguson Advantage Imports, Broken Arrow, OK --93 miles from Fayetteville: no 5-speed Cayenne Red Xs
Reliable Subaru in Springfield, MO --96 miles from Fayetteville: they do have one Click here for description
Riverside Subaru in Little Rock, AR --129 miles from Fayetteville: they do have one Clickhere for descriptionSo, a dealer trade is a definite possibility especially since I notice all three individual Foresters mentioned are similarly equipped and are quite close in MSRP. If one has a desired option which the other one doesn't, you can always have your local dealer add that after the trade has taken place.
Good luck!
--'rocco
Steve
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I crack the rear windows slightly when driving at the speeds you mention. It seems to get rid of any vibration. Also, obviously you never want to open the roof to the "fully open" position when driving at those speeds or above.
--'rocco
Thanks!
Since one out of 4 posters mention this as an issue has Patty or anyone else for that matter from Subaru even suggested there is a problem?
Yea, I can slip the clutch when it's cold, damp, chilly, too hot or rainy to make it work but that's not an answer....I just would like some ammo when I go back to the dealer with this problem.
Thanks in advance
Ron Weiss
98 Forester
Now that I've got your attention:
1. Any way of getting some kind of window shield so that the windows can be cracked in rain? No aftermarket products like for most other makes.
2. Some solution for that silly oil pan shield that takes some swearing to change the oil?
Some one suggested cutting a hole to avoid those plastic "holders" ! Not.
Petty things, but when you're almost perfect......
98 Forester L
-mike
sfdriver - To answer your question about seat height, yes, you CAN sit higher than in previous Foresters but you don't have to. The height adjustment simply lets you jack up the seat an extra inch or so (which is more substantial than it sounds). I like being up as high as possible, and if you get the Forester Premium with the sunroof, you can jack it up so far that your head rubs against the sunroof intrusion!
I can't make a fair judgment if the seats are more or less comfortable because I went from a '99 L with cloth seats to an '03 prem with leather; so the feel, texture, and firmness are totally different. However, I have no complaints about the comfort of the '03 seats and have read that Subaru improved the bolstering.
I am not sure if the bumpers are much different in height. It may be an optical illusion as Subaru made the bumpers look beefier and truckier, including making it taller in the rear and then notching it down where the hatch closes. But functionally, I think they are still at the same height and remain car-height compatible.
ateixeira Oct 10, 2002 10:29am
ateixeira -
Yes, I knew about the change in steering ratio from reading about it, but if I hadn't found out, I never would have noticed. The overall steering feel seems very similar to the older Foresters, IMHO.
As far as the Deulers, let me clarify. I had no serious complaints about the OEM Deuler H/T's, but after they wore out, I upgraded to the [#1 top rated in Consumer Reports] Dueler H/L's. They were modestly improved all around for noise, handling, and road feel. I definitely recommend them for 15" wheel Forester L owners. (Note that they were rated poorer than average for winter traction, but Subaru's AWD makes up for that!)
Elliot
bearings -- I have a 98 Forester with 76K miles and my bearings have been fine (knock on wood).
Ken
-mike
"It wasn't a problem with the bearings themselves. The problem was with the installation, they were over torqued and this caused them to fail."
Would this indicate that if the bearing is going to fail, it will fail early? Say, at 20k verses 80k. In other words, the longer you go without a problem the better the chances your bearings were not over torqued?
98 Forester L
-mike
BTW, I would much rather do oil changes on my Forester than on my wife's Outback. On the OB you have to remove three two-piece fasteners, then slide out the center section of the shield,
exposing the drain plug and filter. The problem here is that the piece of the shield that remains gets splashed with oil when you open the drain plug. It makes a mess, and you have to reach into all the crevices on the top side of the shield to clean it up. Also, there isn't as much clearance underneath as on the Forester, though I can still do both cars without using ramps. I just pull the front of the car into the garage and slide underneath. Minor gripes to be sure, but these are things that drive an OCD guy crazy.
Len
Ken
How about the window visors or window "vents" ? None of the aftermarket people (Weathertech, etc..)make them for the Forester (no door frame to attach they say). Nice tool for highway driving. On our Honda for over 6 years.
I took my wife's 02 Forester to the dealer today to have them look at the pinging between 2-3000 RPM, rotten egg exhaust smell, poor highway acceleration and poor gas mileage (avg= 18-19 mpg).
The service advisor calls me to the desk and says that the tech test drove the car and said he could not detect a problem. She furthermore checked with Sube to see if there were any recalls on the O2 and MAF sensors and they said there were no outstanding recalls on my vehicle.
I politely asked if the tech was available to go for a ride with me. After driving two blocks I replicated the pinging and he pronounced that it was 'spark knock' and due to poor gas. He recommended two things; first that I only get gas from Amoco, Shell or Mobil and try 87 octane. If it still persists, he suggested trying 89 octane to see if it solves the problem.
He did not specifically mention the O2 sensor and quite frankly, I forgot to ask. He did say that the computer didn't throw a code (I suspected this since the CEL never came on).
So, what do you think? It sounds plausible. I can understand how this pinging could be caused by gas with lower than 87 octane, but since we tend to use 3-4 different gas stations, this implies that alot of the gas out there is "bad". I guess using the higher priced suppliers (Amoco, Shell, Mobil) is a relatively cheap fix IF it works (other than the increased cents per gallon compared to the independents).
Has anyone 'solved' their pinging/poor mileage problems by going with the upscale gas brands?
Thanks,
Ron
bit
I didn't notice any difference in mileage when I changed brands. I seem to be getting 20-22 mpg around town with stop-and-go driving.
I'm sure brands of gasoline will differ from location to location but the only brand that's not considered "upscale" around here is Arco (Atlantic Richfield) which is always 5-10 cents cheaper than any of the other major brands. When I used to experiment with that brand, I always suffered from lower gas mileage and more pinging ...it just felt like the gas was somehow "watered down." So yes, IMHO, it might be right when they're telling you to use a major brand fuel which may cost a few pennies more a gallon in your Forester.
Also, another thing I tried as an alternative to pumping 89 octane is to top-off with some 92-93 octane (premium) when you're around a 1/4 tank down. I did this in another car I had where the manufacturer recommended 87 and it pinged slightly (even when the dealer told me everything checked out ok). Using this method was slightly cheaper than pumping a full tank of 89 octane but accomplished the same results ...eliminating the ping.
And be vigilent when pumping gas ...*man* it's sure scary to hear what's going on in the D.C. area.
--'rocco
30+ mpg with an auto? That's amazing.
I agree with the suggestion to open the rear window when the moonroof is open. FWIW, my moonroof is just 15"x30", and even with a deflector, when I remove it completely I still need to open the rear windows. It may just be the squarish shape of the Forester.
2003 bearings: the Impreza got them for sure, so I'm pretty sure the Forester did, too. They changed the design to be more fault-tolerant at install time. Mine are all original with 47k miles, and yeah I'd venture to guess that if they're going to fail, it would likely happen early on. So if you buy a used Subie and it is quiet, I doubt the issue would creep up.
I put a hole in the plastic cover for oil changes with tin snips - it's given me easier access, and still keeps the engine bay clean.
I've seen those visors on heavily modified Foresters in Japan, but never here in the US. Rumor was they were a little too noisy for american standards and Subaru decided not to import those.
-juice
If the problem was due to excessive torque at the factory, what would be the chances that the dealership would repeat the error at replacement time?
It seems that those who have early bearing problems continue to have bearing problems, whereas, those who do not have early bearing problems (the vast majority I would say) continue to avoid problems. (Unfortunately I fall into the first category. 4 bearings replaced to date. Dealer is great. SOA is unresponsive - nearly a month ago I was told that a Team Leader would call within 24-48 hours - thus far - NO CALL!
If it were in fact a torque issue, why wouldn't all of the bearings fail simultaneously? Wouldn't all bearings on the vehicle be equally over torqued?
-mike
Shell 87 octane for my 2K2 Forester (14,000+ miles). I have never experienced any pinging problems. Really hate the rotten eggs smell tho...
It's VERY hard for me to believe that 3 different gas stations over a period of 2 months have "bad gas" (as the tech claims). I have an '00 Outback (same engine) and my wife and I patronize the same gas stations (with only one exception). She's averaging 18-19 mpg and I'm averaging 22-24 mpg ('00 Outback) with NONE of the problems that the Forester is exhibiting.
I'm a bit skeptical. Bottom line, the vehicle is designed to run on 87 octane fuel. I should not have to run higher octane. I can understand an occasional tank of "bad gas" but over 2 months worth from 3 different sources??
Ron
mi_forester-- Yeah, but that sulfurish smell seems to be less detectable as time goes on. I don't know if it's just my car breaking in or if the formulation of Shell gas is changing. Here in the Seattle area, all of our Texaco gas stations have been converted over to Shell recently ...so over 300 new Shell stations now! And their new advertising --both on TV and their signs at the pumps-- seems to suggest that they've changed their formula recently as the changeover is taking place. I've noticed on my last tankful the acceleration seems smoother and the rotten egg smell seems less noticeable. *thumbs up*
Do you use the Shell Chase Mastercard? If you don't, they will be starting to accept new applications next year again ...they've suspended processing applications right now for some reason. I've had one for little over a year now and it's great in that you get a 5% rebate on Shell gas towards future Shell purchases and a 1% rebate on anything else you charge on the card ...one of the better rebate credit cards around. If you use a credit card for a lot of purchases, this adds up to lots of free gasoline! If you or anyone would like to see the details click here.
--'rocco
p.s. I meant to say "vigilant" in my last post ...I gassed up last night and found myself looking around at buildings, rooftops, between trees, and any white vans parked or driving down the street ...and I'm thousands of miles from D.C. *shakes head*
I expereinced some problems with my 99 OB when new, related to fueling. A change in fuel dramatically altered behaviour. Even with a mass produced product carefully tuned you can get some variations from car to car so it is feasible that similar engines may behave slightly differently. Try different fuel and run through a couple of tanks. Also try changing your driving habits a little such as accellerating hard to see if the alters the adaptive bits of your ECU mapping
Cheers
Graham
What you say makes perfect sense... But...
Wouldn't the problem be more widespread - wouldn't everyone have bearing problems, and not just the unlucky few?
Why would Subaru start using a tapered bearing saa a replacement?
Why is SOA in denial if "It's a common known problem on the SVX and Early foresters" ?
On the other hand, I'll start fueling with "brand name" gas (Shell, BP, Chevron, Mobil) but ONLY 87 octane. I still feel strongly that the vehicle is designed to operate on 87. If I still have pinging/knocking problems, I feel it is some type of engine problem that the service department/Sube should look at.
Ron
Why did only a few fail, while most seem to last forever? Hard to say. Different person on the assembly line? Or maybe the owners tend to haul a bigger payload, which stresses the bearings more?
Oddly, I carry more than anyone, I think. I've hauled two sections of 6'x8' fence, tons of luggage multiple times, lumber, double dressers, a clothes washer, you name it. 22 bags of 3 cubic feet of wood chips, even towed about 1500 lbs a few times. 3 bikes and a rooftop carrier on several trips.
And my bearings, at almost 48k, are all fine. This despite my using aftermarket wheels with a different offset, again stressing the bearings more than usual.
Mostly I'd say it's just bad luck on the part of those owners. Maybe the guy on the assembly line was angry one day and overtorqued a batch of them?
I wouldn't say SoA is in denial - bearings are a fix they tend to cover under warranty, at their expense. If they are making you pay, I'd call 800-SUBARU3 and then get in touch with Patti to follow up.
-juice
The problem may have been only in the re-installation instructions, in which case it would only effect people who have had them go bad (a small #) but then it would hound those same people because of the over-toque instructions. There is a TSB IIRC on the proper procedure for re-installing new ones that should have fixed the problem.
-mike
SoA only wants to warranty the replacement part for 12 months. This after 3 replacements on a single wheel!! They seem to think that this is adequate, I don't.
As I said in an earlier post, I am still waiting for a promised call back from a Team Leader for almost a month.
SoA is no help at all. Were it not for the service department at Flemington Subaru I would be really stuck.
Our camper, fully loaded, tips the scales at 1800 lbs. I've hauled drywall (topside), lumber, landscaping rock (650 lbs at a time), cement, topsoil, furniture, mattresses, you name it.
I always watch the payload weight (including myself), and distribute it across the suspension (e.g. cement bags on front passenger floor as well as across the folded back seat and in the back).
For the really big jobs, I now rent a utility trailer for the day. Less wear and tear on the interior...
-brianV
x2852
Regarding gas, I had been using either Sunoco, Exxon or Mobil regular (87 octane). A few months ago, I started using Gulf regular (87) and the car felt noticeably stronger on acceleration. Plus, my fuel economy went from an average of 22-23 MPG to 26-27 MPG, on the same daily commute. The gas was the only thing I changed, so I attribute it to that. Plus, the Gulf is $.04-.08 per gallon cheaper than the other brands I was using. Good deal all around.
Len
Patti has a bad back (quite painful) and is currently meeting with doctors to possibly go through back surgery. I'm in contact with her every couple of days to follow her condition and to alert her of any pressing emergencies here in the Town Hall, but she cannot sit long enough to follow these threads without suffering serious pains.
My personal opinion is that the bearings should at least be covered by the B2B warranty, and maybe even under the powertrain. I'd fight it.
Brian: oh yeah, I've hauled concrete, too, plus a big sand box for the kids and several bags of sand. Baby furniture, too.
I've probably exceeded my payload a couple of time, even though it's quite high at 1020 lbs. Still, I too have borrowed Bob's trailer when ever the load got excessive, and I agree it really saves on the interior wear and tear.
We have a Yamaha electric organ - OK, this "mine is bigger than yours" has gotta stop! ;-)
-juice
-juice
8~)
-Frank P.
Inquiring minds want to know! ;-)
-juice
-Frank P.
Got my 60k service yesterday. I checked to make sure everything was done. They even cleaned the battery terminals. I also got new front brakes. They were worn and since the closest dealer is 45 mile away, I had them install new brakes. Got the 60k service, new brakes and a car wash for around $600.00. Took about 5 hours.
98 Forester L
Well, I've hauled a clothes washer (oversize capacity), so now we know either will fit!
-juice