Since you've actually seen an '02 CR-V: 1) From the pictures, the exterior view looks so much like that "Subaru thing." Does it in person or are the lines more similar to '01 CR-V body styling? 2) Does it have daytime running lights, auto-off headlights, &/or automatic doorlocks (i.e., the doors lock once car is engaged to drive)? 3) Do the doors in the back still have a cup holder each plus cup holders in the middle? Was glad to see that the drop-down tray finally can accommodate "real world" cups so they won't tumble out. Any other fine details would be appreciated. Thanks....
I agree the black door handles and bumper look cheap - they're going to sticker the EX around $23,000, right? They could paint the door handles, IMO.
Much more importantly to me - I hope I'm wrong but am pretty sure from what I've read there's no cold weather package on the EX like on Subarus, for ex. - heated front seats, mirrors, and wiper nozzles. Now, this is a car destined for the snow belt, in many cases, no? Are they not even offering an optional cold weather pack? I find that pretty dissapointing.
Subarus in this price range are, or can be, so equipped. I'm keeping an open mind until I get to drive one, but Honda has neglected a few things that Subaru has addressed. I don't know at this point which one I'll wind up with.
Carvoice - Sounds like you either got a defective part, or she ran over something tough enough to do what sounds like serious damage. This does not sound like anything I've ever read about before.
Bob & Mainmanx - Yup. My sense of geography stinks. It would be the Marysville, OH plant.
Getting back to the original point... It would be possible for Honda to use a variant of the CR-V's 2.4L in the new Accord. I'm mostly playing devils advocate to point out that it's not always that easy. Things like supply lines and plant capacities play a bigger role than we think.
Just as an off-topic example, the most important quality a door panel can posses is the ability to be stacked. No matter how inventive, stylish, lightweight, or dent resistant that panel is, if it cannot be stacked, it cannot be used. You have to think along those lines when you speculate about manufacturers or new products.
I believe that the choice of black plastic on the door handles and bumpers was not primarily a cost-cutting move. Keep in mind that one of Honda's objectives in the redesign was to move the styling a more towards the "macho" end to attract more male buyers. Well, like it or not, the use of more black plastic communicates that this is a utility vehicle and not (just) a car. Honda couldn't help but notice the hordes of buyers attracted to the Ford Escape.
You want a really good example of this phenomena at work? Look at the $37K Volvo XC which has oodles of black plastic on it.
No, the new CRV looks nothing like a Subaru of any kind (thank G-D), there is a familial HONDA appearance, more like a mini-MDX than the '01 CRV. The total styling look makes the car look a bit more upscale than the current version. The rear view looks much closer to the new Volvo AWD Wagon, and as a result, looks considerably more expensive. The answer is no on 1) Daytime Running Lights 2)Auto-Off Headlights & 3) Auto Door Locks. I didn't notice any cupholders on the rear doors (I might have missed them) but there are two cupholders in the pull down center armrest in the rear seat (ala MDX). The only other fine detail that I may have left out of my two previous posts would be the range of seat track motion in the rear seat, which is to say, substantial. Hope this helps.
Do 2001 CRVs have Door Ajar warning light on the instrument panel? If the any of the door of my wife's Crv is open there's no warning light even when the engine is running.
Second: our CRV's engine is so noisy when accelarating (around the streets), is this normal? I've heard that freeway noise is very obvious but driving around on a 25 -35 mph speed limit has almost the same noise... Any thoughts?
Hey, I find the function-over-form shape of my Subie kind of endearing. Honda looks to have borrowed a few styling cues in this redesign, especially the sturdy looking roof rails.
The S2000 engine would not be a good fit in the CR-V because it has less torque. 153 lb-ft peak at a lofty 7500 rpm, which means it makes less than that from 0 to 7499 rpm, where you are most of the time.
That's fine in a little roadster that is 500 lbs lighter and can reach those revs in a heartbeat, with 1 or 2 passengers. But in an SUV that'll often carry 5 adults?
But that doesn't mean that Honda can't incorporate some of the technology from that engine into the 2.4l design. I'm guessing they could improve the HP figure substantially, even if torque pretty much stayed at around 162 lb-ft.
I doubt the Accord will share an engine block with the CR-V. I would be very surprised if it did.
Are the door handles black metal or black plastic? Ford uses black plastic on the Escape and Focus (possibly others). It feels very cheap when opening the doors. I was under the assumption that the '02 CR-V has handles like the current LX model; black, but made of metal.
The rear cupholders are built into the center arm rest. There are no longer a set in the door panel. You may find a picture somewhere on this page.
Juice - Most of the new technology used in the S2K block is geared toward tolerating piston speeds that rival or surpass those found in F-1 engines. The tilt of the cylinders, the shallow apex of the cylinder "roof", heat distribution, and other bits or technology don't really apply to anything other than a high revver.
By comparison, the S2K block is actually a little dated now. The 220hp i-VTEC powertrain in the RSX-R, though less powerful, is equally noteworthy from a purely technological standpoint.
The S2000 engine actually produces more torque than the peak torque of current CR-V at less than 3000 rpm! But unlike other engines, the torque curve stays put at just over 140 lb.-ft until about 5500 rpm when it jumps up to 150 lb.-ft by 6000 rpm, and stays there until about 8500 rpm (with a peak of 153 lb.-ft from 7500 rpm to 8250 rpm). In fact, with Japanese specs, the peak is even higher (161 lb.-ft), and the output is up to 250 HP.
With the shorter gearing that S2000 has (except first gear of the manual transmission CRV which is the shortest of any vehicle I can think of, without a 'low gear'), lack of 10-15 lb.-ft wouldn't be an issue. The problem would be that most people would be uncomfortable with the engine speed that S2000 gearbox is capable of maintaining. But still, one could use 180-185 HP if they shifted at about 6500 rpm (2002 CRV's redline). But then, as varmit pointed out, even S2000 engine will be subsequently replaced with a new version (if S2000 continues to be S2000).
As for Accord sharing the engine with CRV, I'm almost certain, it will. May be Honda will give the 2.4 liter I-4 an improved intake, and some minor modifications (similar to those used in MDX, Odyssey, CL/TL Type-S, perhapsbase RSX) and extract more horses (190 HP would be easily possible, with a substantial bump in torque output), but only if the need be (competition) or perhaps on the EX/I-4 model.
I talked with my friend's bother, who has worked for Honda for over 20 years. I told him how everyone is disappointed that the USA version of the CRV doesn't come with leather, the hard plastic colored keyed wheel cover and colored keyed body side molding and dooor handles. He said shortly after the introduction in November, Honda will offer an SE version will all the above included. I'll give it a month or two before buying an EX.
I have a CRV that has developed a strange whining noise from the right front tire. The Honda dealer says that it is a characteristic of the car. I do not think this sound right -Does anyone else have or had this problem - How was it solved? Thanks - please post your response or email privately at brucenights@yahoo.com Thanks
2001 cr-v does not have the door adjar warning. i remeber my 87 accord had a little picture of the car under the tach, and it would show an open door, or burnt out bulb. the only way to tell if any door other than driver's is open, is to see if the dome light is on. with the engine off and key in ignition by opening driver's door you will activate the "key in ignition" warning chime.
I thought peak torque for the JDM Stook was 175 lb-ft (not an LEV, though). I remember reading that figure in the early reviews back in 99 when the first drive articles were based on test drives done in Japan.
Look Ma, no cuphoders. This is the door pic I was thinking of before. It's from Bing's review over at the CR-V IX.
Rsav1 - If the whining were coming from the rear, I'd say check your RT4WD fluids. But a noise coming from the front is new to me.
When I first got into the current CR-V's backseat, I thought it didn't have any cupholders in the back (like my Civic) either. It had to be pointed out to me that you had to flip the little thingy on the door for the cupholders to magically appear.
Looking at that pic from Bing's review- is it a preproduction model? The square at the bottom looks like it could be adjusted to fit a small drink, which is what the cupholder in the current CR-V could handle. Big Gulps, well you're just gonna have to hold onto those.
In my case, I remedied my Civic's lack of cupholders in the back by buying one of those dual-cupholder trays from Walmart that can adjust to accomodate Big Gulp.
Anyone have any idea what a 2002 CR-V EX will go for? A dealer in my area (Chicago suburbs) told me he will be selling them for MSRP. Is that typical or should I be able to find a dealer who will sell closer to invoice?
Finally, will they be launching any promotions in conjunction with the 2002 release? Any special financing? As far as I can tell the financing deals now only apply to 2001 CR-Vs.
Diploid - Reading back a few posts we were talking about how the cupholders were moved from the rear doors to the center armrests in the backseats. This is a pic of where the new cupholders landed.
How does $316 over invoice sound? This dealer sells for that every day and specializes in out of state sales will pick up at tulsa international and get you out of there in 15 minutes. Dealer is Mark Roberts Honda www.autoinvoice.com 1-800-375-less Ask for John Page. I have been a customer there for years, no surprises. INKY
....if the folks at Honda were serious about making the new CR-V more "macho" to attract a larger male audience, then what's with the "ballet slippers"....the 15" wheel and tire combo is completely overwhelmed by the new "pumped-up" styling...i've read many complaints about not only the look of these "space-saver spares" but also of their performance, both in cornering and the ability of transferring the CR-V's new found power to the ground. other inconsistencies....while the door handles are unpainted, the rear-door handle is body colour...what gives?......either make them all black or all body colour. hope reports of an SE are true.....would like to get the part-painted bumpers, all door handles painted of our EX/Leather version for a more reasonable pricedon't need leather or a sunroof).....and they could throw in some REAL wheels and tires (at least 16 inchers) too.
Robert: you're comparing the S2000's torque to the current CR-V, not the new one. And IMO the lack of 15 lb-ft would be an issue, especially if you're hauling lots of weight.
175 lb-ft from a 2.0l? That would be impressive without forced induction.
I agree that they could tweak the 190 horses out of that 2.4l, though I doubt torque would increase by more than 4-5 lb-ft. We'll see if that's what the Accord gets. If so, I'll owe you a cold one.
I bet those rectangular slots in the doors could hold a juice box! :-)
Hey, when you have kids silly stuff like that starts to matter more. Especially if a child seat is in the middle of the rear seat, covering the arm rest cup holders.
Saturn will have 16" wheels standard on the Vue. Subaru and Toyota offer them, too. I agree it's about time Honda at least offered them as a factory option, at least on SE models.
I have a 2000 Accord LX-V6 sedan and it also has the rear seat arm rest cup holders. This is a problem when you have only one child seat back there, as the safety people tell you to put the child seat in the center of the back seat. When you do this you render the cup holders useless for any additional rear seat passengers, such as the occasional Aunt or Uncle riding along to a family get together. It is not a catastrophe, just annoying. Why couldn't they keep the cupholders in the door and also provide the arm rest ones? That way you would be covered.
This is just a silly question, but are North Americans the only ones who like to eat and drink in their cars? It seems like the American manufacturers have clear superiority in cup holder engineering, with the Asian manufacturers second and the Europeans seriously lagging behind at #3. Cupholders are just an ergonomic extra, not a reason to buy or not buy a vehicle, but it would be nice if Honda would work on this area a bit. All of my Honda/Acura vehicles have had somewhat subpar cupholders. With a spouse addicted to Diet Coke (like my own), cupholders become a issue in car purchases.
Rav-4's, VUE's, Liberty's, Santa Fe's, Escape's & Tribute's, Grand Vitara's etc. all have 16 inchers.....most as standard equipment.....even the much lighter upcoming Vibe & Matrix have 16's with 17's an option, so wish Honda would get with the program as well....without 'em, the new CR-V looks very feeble, no matter how much black plastic you tack on. more nitpicking.....they managed to figure out how to hide one hinge on the rear door on the 2002 cr-v.....does that mean we have to wait until the 3rd generation for both hinges to be hidden? (even my '93 Sidekick's are both hidden). better yet, ditch the wrong-side-hinged-external spare-door entirely and give us a proper hatch. also hope the side mirrors are above-average, 'cause the view to the rear past those 3 giant head restraints looks almost nil.
The largest complaint about the current model has been that acceleration off the line is lacking. Adding larger tires would be the easiest way to negate any benefits of having a more powerful engine. It would also lower city mpg since the car would have to work harder to move from a stand still. I agree that the 15" tires look too small, but they serve well from a functional perspective. A number of current model owners have taken their tire up a size, then gone back to the stock size because of the performance deficit.
FWIW, the black-handled LX model is the highest selling model in the CR-V lineup. The SE, while very attractive, is the slowest seller.
artdecho - those comparisons are valid ones. It is too bad the new V has 15" tires, but that is somewhat in keeping with Honda tradition. The current Accord Sedan has 15" wheel/tires, while the mrore "performance" oriented Accord Coupe V6 gets 16". It would be at least $1000.00 to upgrade to larger tires and wheels and who knows how they will fit. On the brighter side, the 15" tires should be less expensive to replace when they wear out. I don't know how tire size effects fuel consumption or ride quality, but I am sure it has some effect, which may be a clue as to why Honda uses 15".
The other issues you brought up about the hinges and the headrests I agree are annoying. The head rests I forgive because they probably increase the safety factor for rear seat occupants, which is good IMO. I have no idea why the hinges are outside when so many other vehicles manage to hide them.
Overall I like the new V, though! I think it looks great (in pictures, I haven't seen one yet) and offers very usable size without looking too big or small. I can't wait to get one.
varmit: JDM S2000 has peak torque rating of 22.2 kgm (218 Nm) which translates to 161 lb.-ft. That is pretty good for a 1997 cc engine (among the highest specific torque output for a normally aspirated street legal engine). It still qualifies as an LEV, but not to the same level as the US/Euro spec does (JDM spec uses 11.7:1 compression compared to 11.3:1 for US/Euro spec).
juice: Even if we compared the 2.4 liter engine to S2000's 2.0 liter engine, the torque advantage of the larger engine can be negated by gearing. But like I pointed out, it won't be possible with the way first gear on the 2002 CRV (manual) is geared (16.78:1 first gear ODR), much shorter than the S2000 (14.90:1 first gear ODR).
I agree that they could tweak the 190 horses out of that 2.4l, though I doubt torque would increase by more than 4-5 lb-ft. With a choice of 2354 cc displacement, yes, it would be difficult to get more than 165 lb.-ft without increasing the compression (and use of premium gasoline). Most of the horsepower would come courtesy of further broadening of the torque curve though, like it is on the Type-S version of the 3.2/V6.
15" versus 16": Assuming that the overall wheels size doesn't change (i.e. adding an inch to the wheel, and taking an inch off the rubber), there would be no difference in performance. However, a vehicle equipped with smaller wheel would get an additional thrust at the wheel (by a small factor, ofcourse), effectively making the vehicle more powerful. The downside is that, the shorter the gearing goes, the higher the engine revs during cruising, and it affects gas mileage.
Joe: just bring juice boxes for the aunt and uncle. ;-)
You can always add some. Lots of auto suppliers sell ones you can bolt/hook/tape on.
artdecho: LOL! The hinge also bothered me a bit. I did notice the Suburban has them too, though. Not many other vehicles do, though.
The CR-V has 205/70R15s. You can go to 215/60R16 and actually gain a tad bit in terms of gearing. They key is to keep the diameter similar. So you could get more wheel/less tire, and that would give it a more substantial look. The new Altima 3.5SE has 17" wheels standard, and they look fantastic.
They may cost $1000 by themselves, but remember they would be replacing a set of wheels and tires that probably cost $6-800, and you would only pay the difference in cost.
Then again, put snows on the 15" rims and get a Plus One. Problem solved.
I was just browsing the Edmunds Tokyo show coverage, and you just have to love this stuff. Built-in karaoke and showers? Scooter built in to the doors? LOL!
Anyhow, I noticed the NSX-R got a wheel upgrade, so I checked the standard one. 16" front, 17" rear. The new V6 Altima comes with bigger standard wheels than that!
Acura TL/CL Type-S use 17" rims. Accord Type-R (Europe) has been using 17" wheels. The 2002 Civic Type-R and Integra Type-R use 17" wheels as well.
Just depends on the application. I've not looked at the NSX-R specs. Does it have 17" (front) and 18" (rear) wheels now?
BTW, juice, I remembered something about 'torque' after I had posted my previous message. Accord wagon in Japan was introduced with two engine choices in Japan. The base engine was the 2254 cc/I-4 SOHC (2.3 liter/150 HP) also found in the North American Accord. The other engine was a DOHC version, with manual transmission 200 HP and 168 lb.-ft (basically 97 cc larger version of Prelude's 2.2/I-4 but not tweaked for more power). So with 2354 cc, Honda could go past 170 lb.-ft, if the need be. The 2.3 DOHC has since been de-tuned to 190 HP/163 lb.-ft and tied to slushbox only! Perhaps a reason why Honda tries to stay away from manual gearboxes, they don't sell, even in Japan?
I don't know if going with a bigger rim and less rubber would do the trick, visually, for the CR-V. I think the OVERALL size (diameter) of the tire/wheel would still look dinky. The vehicle just needs bigger wheels, plain and simple. At least 16". Actually, since the smaller RAV4 has 16", 17" would look better on the CR-V. Even the Civic-based Acura EL has 15" wheels. If Honda has to limit the size of the wheel because engine power, and hence acceleration, is a consideration, then there is something very wrong with the basic design and execution of the vehicle. Power output cannot be that marginal.
Unlike the X-terra, which is a heavy, inefficient,part-time 4wd truck (although bang-on for it's intended market), the X-Trail is aimed directly at the CR-V......car-based, efficient, economical......this could get interesting!
Has anyone seen the 02 CRV television ad ? I caught the end of it last night, the guys sitting around the campfire, but haven't seen the full ad yet.....
Thanks for the link & info! I like both the new CR-V and Saturn VUE. However, the CR-V will not be offering leather for the forseeable future. The VUE won't offer it for the 1st model year.
My wife owned a Nissan Sentra and now we own a '93 Altima. They both lasted a long time but I HATE the cars: jiggly handling, TERRIBLE back support in front seats, buzz's and loose joints all over the place. The only Nissan I would ever consider is the Maxima (including the new Altima). The new altima (if equipped the same as an Accord V6) is about $3-4K more than the accord. Go figure! I would take the Honda no Q's asked. Better build quality and much better re-sell %.
.....we also have a '93 Altima....has a large displacement 4 with no balance shafts, so not as smooth as some others but gets the car down the road in a hurry. ours (a gxe) still seems tight and fairly well-planted....seats just average, actually i find them a bit low, but other than that, no complaints. will definitely consider an x-trail if its here before next spring but am keeping an open mind to everything at this point.
X-Trail is indeed the best seller in Japan, but it looks smaller than the CR-V. V6 availability is nice, along with a powerful 4.
People forget, Honda is only the 10th biggest manufacturer in the world. Here in the US they demand a lot of respect, but they are dwarfed by Toyota and Nissan in some other markets.
Very cool styling. Ads are creative and enthusiastic. But I've driven more than one and never really liked the obvious pickup truck interior and driving feel.
Pathfinder is too expensive for entry level buyers, so I think there is a gap in Nissan's lineup.
INKY, could you provide more details on your buying experience from that dealer? What fees do I need to pay for if I am not from OK? I am from TX, so at the min. I need to pay for TX title and registration.
Go that CR-V site (post #3391 by hayduke has the link) and look at the interior pictures.
Notice that the squarish box in the picture from Bing's review is replaced by a more rounded cubby hole. Place, it protudes outward a lot more in this picture than in Bing's picture, which leads me to believe that a 12oz soda can will be able to fit in it.
Can anyone confirm the V6 or 2.5L4 Xtrail coming to US ? I can only find some old news about 2L engine and even a turbo 2L. No word on Nissan bringing it over here.
Comments
Bob
Much more importantly to me - I hope I'm wrong but am pretty sure from what I've read there's no cold weather package on the EX like on Subarus, for ex. - heated front seats, mirrors, and wiper nozzles. Now, this is a car destined for the snow belt, in many cases, no? Are they not even offering an optional cold weather pack? I find that pretty dissapointing.
Subarus in this price range are, or can be, so equipped. I'm keeping an open mind until I get to drive one, but Honda has neglected a few things that Subaru has addressed. I don't know at this point which one I'll wind up with.
Bob & Mainmanx - Yup. My sense of geography stinks. It would be the Marysville, OH plant.
Getting back to the original point... It would be possible for Honda to use a variant of the CR-V's 2.4L in the new Accord. I'm mostly playing devils advocate to point out that it's not always that easy. Things like supply lines and plant capacities play a bigger role than we think.
Just as an off-topic example, the most important quality a door panel can posses is the ability to be stacked. No matter how inventive, stylish, lightweight, or dent resistant that panel is, if it cannot be stacked, it cannot be used. You have to think along those lines when you speculate about manufacturers or new products.
You want a really good example of this phenomena at work? Look at the $37K Volvo XC which has oodles of black plastic on it.
Do 2001 CRVs have Door Ajar warning light on the instrument panel? If the any of the door of my wife's Crv is open there's no warning light even when the engine is running.
Second: our CRV's engine is so noisy when accelarating (around the streets), is this normal? I've heard that freeway noise is very obvious but driving around on a 25 -35 mph speed limit has almost the same noise... Any thoughts?
Thanks.
The S2000 engine would not be a good fit in the CR-V because it has less torque. 153 lb-ft peak at a lofty 7500 rpm, which means it makes less than that from 0 to 7499 rpm, where you are most of the time.
That's fine in a little roadster that is 500 lbs lighter and can reach those revs in a heartbeat, with 1 or 2 passengers. But in an SUV that'll often carry 5 adults?
But that doesn't mean that Honda can't incorporate some of the technology from that engine into the 2.4l design. I'm guessing they could improve the HP figure substantially, even if torque pretty much stayed at around 162 lb-ft.
I doubt the Accord will share an engine block with the CR-V. I would be very surprised if it did.
-juice
The rear cupholders are built into the center arm rest. There are no longer a set in the door panel. You may find a picture somewhere on this page.
Juice - Most of the new technology used in the S2K block is geared toward tolerating piston speeds that rival or surpass those found in F-1 engines. The tilt of the cylinders, the shallow apex of the cylinder "roof", heat distribution, and other bits or technology don't really apply to anything other than a high revver.
By comparison, the S2K block is actually a little dated now. The 220hp i-VTEC powertrain in the RSX-R, though less powerful, is equally noteworthy from a purely technological standpoint.
With the shorter gearing that S2000 has (except first gear of the manual transmission CRV which is the shortest of any vehicle I can think of, without a 'low gear'), lack of 10-15 lb.-ft wouldn't be an issue. The problem would be that most people would be uncomfortable with the engine speed that S2000 gearbox is capable of maintaining. But still, one could use 180-185 HP if they shifted at about 6500 rpm (2002 CRV's redline). But then, as varmit pointed out, even S2000 engine will be subsequently replaced with a new version (if S2000 continues to be S2000).
As for Accord sharing the engine with CRV, I'm almost certain, it will. May be Honda will give the 2.4 liter I-4 an improved intake, and some minor modifications (similar to those used in MDX, Odyssey, CL/TL Type-S, perhapsbase RSX) and extract more horses (190 HP would be easily possible, with a substantial bump in torque output), but only if the need be (competition) or perhaps on the EX/I-4 model.
The Honda dealer says that it is a characteristic of the car.
I do not think this sound right -Does anyone else have or had this problem - How was it solved?
Thanks - please post your response or email privately at brucenights@yahoo.com
Thanks
Look Ma, no cuphoders. This is the door pic I was thinking of before. It's from Bing's review over at the CR-V IX.
Rsav1 - If the whining were coming from the rear, I'd say check your RT4WD fluids. But a noise coming from the front is new to me.
When I first got into the current CR-V's backseat, I thought it didn't have any cupholders in the back (like my Civic) either. It had to be pointed out to me that you had to flip the little thingy on the door for the cupholders to magically appear.
Looking at that pic from Bing's review- is it a preproduction model? The square at the bottom looks like it could be adjusted to fit a small drink, which is what the cupholder in the current CR-V could handle. Big Gulps, well you're just gonna have to hold onto those.
In my case, I remedied my Civic's lack of cupholders in the back by buying one of those dual-cupholder trays from Walmart that can adjust to accomodate Big Gulp.
Finally, will they be launching any promotions in conjunction with the 2002 release? Any special financing? As far as I can tell the financing deals now only apply to 2001 CR-Vs.
Thanks,
Tim
http://www.ptcruiserusa.com/hondasuv/crvix/library/2002review/library_02review_cupholdersrear.jpg
This dealer sells for that every day and specializes in out of state sales will pick up at tulsa international and get you out of there in 15 minutes.
Dealer is Mark Roberts Honda
www.autoinvoice.com
1-800-375-less
Ask for John Page.
I have been a customer there for years, no surprises.
INKY
other inconsistencies....while the door handles are unpainted, the rear-door handle is body colour...what gives?......either make them all black or all body colour.
hope reports of an SE are true.....would like to get the part-painted bumpers, all door handles painted of our EX/Leather version for a more reasonable pricedon't need leather or a sunroof).....and they could throw in some REAL wheels and tires (at least 16 inchers) too.
175 lb-ft from a 2.0l? That would be impressive without forced induction.
I agree that they could tweak the 190 horses out of that 2.4l, though I doubt torque would increase by more than 4-5 lb-ft. We'll see if that's what the Accord gets. If so, I'll owe you a cold one.
I bet those rectangular slots in the doors could hold a juice box! :-)
Hey, when you have kids silly stuff like that starts to matter more. Especially if a child seat is in the middle of the rear seat, covering the arm rest cup holders.
Saturn will have 16" wheels standard on the Vue. Subaru and Toyota offer them, too. I agree it's about time Honda at least offered them as a factory option, at least on SE models.
-juice
This is just a silly question, but are North Americans the only ones who like to eat and drink in their cars? It seems like the American manufacturers have clear superiority in cup holder engineering, with the Asian manufacturers second and the Europeans seriously lagging behind at #3. Cupholders are just an ergonomic extra, not a reason to buy or not buy a vehicle, but it would be nice if Honda would work on this area a bit. All of my Honda/Acura vehicles have had somewhat subpar cupholders. With a spouse addicted to Diet Coke (like my own), cupholders become a issue in car purchases.
more nitpicking.....they managed to figure out how to hide one hinge on the rear door on the 2002 cr-v.....does that mean we have to wait until the 3rd generation for both hinges to be hidden? (even my '93 Sidekick's are both hidden).
better yet, ditch the wrong-side-hinged-external
spare-door entirely and give us a proper hatch.
also hope the side mirrors are above-average, 'cause the view to the rear past those 3 giant head restraints looks almost nil.
FWIW, the black-handled LX model is the highest selling model in the CR-V lineup. The SE, while very attractive, is the slowest seller.
The other issues you brought up about the hinges and the headrests I agree are annoying. The head rests I forgive because they probably increase the safety factor for rear seat occupants, which is good IMO. I have no idea why the hinges are outside when so many other vehicles manage to hide them.
Overall I like the new V, though! I think it looks great (in pictures, I haven't seen one yet) and offers very usable size without looking too big or small. I can't wait to get one.
JDM S2000 has peak torque rating of 22.2 kgm (218 Nm) which translates to 161 lb.-ft. That is pretty good for a 1997 cc engine (among the highest specific torque output for a normally aspirated street legal engine). It still qualifies as an LEV, but not to the same level as the US/Euro spec does (JDM spec uses 11.7:1 compression compared to 11.3:1 for US/Euro spec).
juice:
Even if we compared the 2.4 liter engine to S2000's 2.0 liter engine, the torque advantage of the larger engine can be negated by gearing. But like I pointed out, it won't be possible with the way first gear on the 2002 CRV (manual) is geared (16.78:1 first gear ODR), much shorter than the S2000 (14.90:1 first gear ODR).
I agree that they could tweak the 190 horses out of that 2.4l, though I doubt torque would increase by more than 4-5 lb-ft.
With a choice of 2354 cc displacement, yes, it would be difficult to get more than 165 lb.-ft without increasing the compression (and use of premium gasoline). Most of the horsepower would come courtesy of further broadening of the torque curve though, like it is on the Type-S version of the 3.2/V6.
15" versus 16":
Assuming that the overall wheels size doesn't change (i.e. adding an inch to the wheel, and taking an inch off the rubber), there would be no difference in performance. However, a vehicle equipped with smaller wheel would get an additional thrust at the wheel (by a small factor, ofcourse), effectively making the vehicle more powerful. The downside is that, the shorter the gearing goes, the higher the engine revs during cruising, and it affects gas mileage.
You can always add some. Lots of auto suppliers sell ones you can bolt/hook/tape on.
artdecho: LOL! The hinge also bothered me a bit. I did notice the Suburban has them too, though. Not many other vehicles do, though.
The CR-V has 205/70R15s. You can go to 215/60R16 and actually gain a tad bit in terms of gearing. They key is to keep the diameter similar. So you could get more wheel/less tire, and that would give it a more substantial look. The new Altima 3.5SE has 17" wheels standard, and they look fantastic.
They may cost $1000 by themselves, but remember they would be replacing a set of wheels and tires that probably cost $6-800, and you would only pay the difference in cost.
Then again, put snows on the 15" rims and get a Plus One. Problem solved.
-juice
Anyhow, I noticed the NSX-R got a wheel upgrade, so I checked the standard one. 16" front, 17" rear. The new V6 Altima comes with bigger standard wheels than that!
So Honda does tend towards smallish wheels.
-juice
Just depends on the application. I've not looked at the NSX-R specs. Does it have 17" (front) and 18" (rear) wheels now?
BTW, juice, I remembered something about 'torque' after I had posted my previous message. Accord wagon in Japan was introduced with two engine choices in Japan. The base engine was the 2254 cc/I-4 SOHC (2.3 liter/150 HP) also found in the North American Accord. The other engine was a DOHC version, with manual transmission 200 HP and 168 lb.-ft (basically 97 cc larger version of Prelude's 2.2/I-4 but not tweaked for more power). So with 2354 cc, Honda could go past 170 lb.-ft, if the need be. The 2.3 DOHC has since been de-tuned to 190 HP/163 lb.-ft and tied to slushbox only! Perhaps a reason why Honda tries to stay away from manual gearboxes, they don't sell, even in Japan?
One thing I did notice when looking at that pic of the door is that there are no "puddle" lamps, like in the Honda Accord or the Hyundai Santa Fe.
Come on Honda...
http://forums.vmag.com/suvcrv0999/messages/3060.html
Unlike the X-terra, which is a heavy, inefficient,part-time 4wd truck (although bang-on for it's intended market), the X-Trail is aimed directly at the CR-V......car-based, efficient, economical......this could get interesting!
Thanks for the link & info! I like both the new CR-V and Saturn VUE. However, the CR-V will not be offering leather for the forseeable future. The VUE won't offer it for the 1st model year.
My wife owned a Nissan Sentra and now we own a '93 Altima. They both lasted a long time but I HATE the cars: jiggly handling, TERRIBLE back support in front seats, buzz's and loose joints all over the place. The only Nissan I would ever consider is the Maxima (including the new Altima). The new altima (if equipped the same as an Accord V6) is about $3-4K more than the accord. Go figure! I would take the Honda no Q's asked. Better build quality and much better re-sell %.
I'm not bashing.....just my measly two cents.
http://newcrv.honda.com/users/index.html?RURL=%2Findex.html
The site has links to the commercials, though I haven't watched them yet.
In other news, a local dealer (Colorado Springs) ran an ad saying they '02 would arrive November 17.
Currently I'm driving a '93 Civic VX, and am considering the CR-V.
People forget, Honda is only the 10th biggest manufacturer in the world. Here in the US they demand a lot of respect, but they are dwarfed by Toyota and Nissan in some other markets.
-juice
XTerra sort of suffered flavor-of-the-month syndrome, so they could use fresh product.
-juice
Pathfinder is too expensive for entry level buyers, so I think there is a gap in Nissan's lineup.
-juice
Thanks. tmanmiata
Notice that the squarish box in the picture from Bing's review is replaced by a more rounded cubby hole. Place, it protudes outward a lot more in this picture than in Bing's picture, which leads me to believe that a 12oz soda can will be able to fit in it.
I can only find some old news about 2L engine and even a turbo 2L. No word on Nissan bringing it over here.
I hope I'm wrong...
http://www.vtec.net/news/items/887.html